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WorldView

Forbes Campaign Manager Talks About Upcoming Iowa Caucuses

Aired January 22, 2000 - 6:11 p.m. ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ANDRIA HALL, CNN ANCHOR: The Iowa caucuses are just two days away, and the candidates are criss-crossing that state, doing all they can to round up a few more supporters.

CNN's Wolf Blitzer is in Des Moines, with the very latest on campaign 2000 -- Wolf.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Thank you, Andria.

George W. Bush declared today he has a good feeling about Iowa, but will have to work, in his words, "until the votes come home." With the Iowa campaign in its final weekend, the Republican front-runner finds himself under attack from opponents who say his stance against abortion isn't quite strong enough. The Texas governor discussed the issue today on CNN's "EVANS, NOVAK, HUNT & SHIELDS."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "EVANS, NOVAK, HUNT & SHIELDS")

GOV. GEORGE W. BUSH (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think the goal of our society ought to be to value life. This is a lofty goal, it's an important goal and the Republicans must decide which of us can best lead toward an understanding of a culture that respects life, which of the candidates has got the capacity to convince people that life is precious?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Bush's top opponent in the national polls, John McCain, is not campaigning in Iowa, so Steve Forbes is expected to take the second spot in Monday's caucuses. Bush says he likes Forbes, but he doesn't like the negative television commercials Forbes has been running.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "EVANS, NOVAK, HUNT & SHIELDS")

BUSH: I've been a little disappointed at the kind of attacks that have been taking place. I've been worried about him doing to me what he did to Bob Dole in 1996. The good news is the Republican Party is going to reject that kind of campaigning. I think he has some good ideas, I do, and I think he is a very smart fellow. I just happen to disagree with him on who ought to be the Republican Party nominee. I think it ought to be me.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BLITZER: After Republican Bob Dole lost the 1996 presidential election, Dole said Forbes' negative ads in the primary campaign were partially to blame. Could this year's ads have a similar effect on George W. Bush?

Joining us here in Des Moines is Forbes campaign manager, Bill Dal Col.

Mr. Dal Col, thank you so much for joining us.

BILL DAL COL, FORBES CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Thanks for having me on, Wolf.

BLITZER: Well, the ads have been sort of shrill, sort of tough, albeit perhaps not at tough as they were four years ago. Here's a sample of the kind of television commercial your candidate, Steve Forbes, has been running.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, FORBES CAMPAIGN AD)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There's something you need to know about George W. Bush. In 1994, he signed a pledge with my organization that he would not support sales tax or business tax increases. In 1997, unfortunately he broke this pledge.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: He broke the pledge. Those are strong words from Steve Forbes against George W. Bush.

DAL COL: Well, if you look at the ad, it's Mary Williams, a constituent from Texas who runs a non-profit organization, non- partisan, who asks candidates to sign a pledge that they will not increase the states sales tax or business taxes. George Bush signed the pledge, then broke it, and in addition he brags that he signed a tax cut. Well, his own government agencies in Texas point out six out of 10 school districts never got the tax cut. He broke the pledge and he didn't pass the tax cuts, so what do we believe?

BLITZER: Well, he says that the overall taxes went down, even though some specific individual taxes may have gone up a little.

DAL COL: Wolf, even that's inaccurate. If you look at it, six out of 10 school districts didn't get a tax cut, so it was mysterious, it disappeared. Beyond that, the pledge was broken. The pledge was broken, the pledge is straight forward.

BLITZER: And the overall, though, thrust of his complaint, Bush's complaint is that you're doing now to him what you did to Dole and that could undermine the Republicans come November.

DAL COL: I think that's just a cry of somebody that doesn't want to have an open honest debate and that's what Iowa is about, that's what Iowans want is an open honest debate. But more importantly, it's a bit hypocritical. The same candidate in New Hampshire is running an attack ad against John McCain after he pledged to John McCain that they wouldn't run attacks. What did George Bush do 48 hours later? Break his pledge. That pledge lasted shorter than his tax pledge, which he broke. So what does it come down to? George W. Bush will say and do whatever he thinks he has to, to win, but in the end he won't keep his commitments to the voters.

BLITZER: You heard George W. Bush say on "EVANS, NOVAK, HUNT & SHIELDS" earlier today just now that he could support the 1984 Republican Party platform against abortion, which was very tough language.

DAL COL: Well, if you look at what he actually said, Wolf, it was kind of moving in that direction, but for three days here in Iowa, he's tripped, stumbled and fumbled, so I'm sure his aides got to him and said you have to be a little clear on the language to just get us through Iowa.

What the people in the Republican Party, particularly in Iowa want to hear, is does George Bush pledge to support the Ronald Reagan plank for life in the platform, does he pledge to have pro-life running mate and does he pledge to appoint pro-life judges. What he's done is ducked and hedged, which is what he's been known for in Texas and now he's doing it nationally.

BLITZER: Although, you would agree he went further today than he has in the past?

DAL COL: Yes, and I think that's due to the fact that the Iowa caucus is Monday night, he's feeling the heat, his advisers watched three days of news coverage where at best he could trip, duck and dodge, and now they said, well, we're getting beat up too much, now, governor, maybe you better answer this way.

BLITZER: How well do you think Steve Forbes will do Monday Night?

DAL COL: We'll do a very solid second.

BLITZER: How solid? Give me a number.

DAL COL: How solid? I'd look in the mid-20s. We'll come out of here with a bump in New Hampshire, and I'll predict now that George Bush in very strong likelihood will be third in New Hampshire.

BLITZER: George -- why do you say he will be third?

DAL COL: Because he is going to slip and fall as we come out of here with a bump. The voters in New Hampshire, the conservative base unites behind Steve Forbes, it's John McCain or Steve Forbes, will be first or second, George Bush will be third and the wheels will have come off invincibility.

BLITZER: Who is your the biggest threat among social conservatives here in Iowa, Alan Keyes or Gary Bauer?

DAL COL: There is really not a threat. I think the person that will come in third right now, if I had to predict, would be Alan Keyes. He is popped up in the last couple weeks, he's run a strong race. People respect him, they like what he has to say, and I think he will be third.

BLITZER: OK. Bill Dal Col, always good to have you on CNN, thank you so much for joining us.

DAL COL: Thank you, Wolf.

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