CNN LIVE EVENT/SPECIAL
Bush, Putin Get Along Well at Summit
Aired June 16, 2001 - 11:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DONNA KELLEY, CNN ANCHOR: You're looking at a live picture now in Slovenia, where President Bush and Russian President Putin have been meeting for about two hours in Brdo Castle. And they're coming out for a news conference.
We expect to hear a little bit of what they discussed. It's been described as a get-acquainted meeting, and no specific proposals that they were going to be talking about. They were scheduled to visit, and certainly a lot of issues to come up, and just kind of get on the table, including missile defense, NATO expansion, military technology sales to Iran that they were going to try and talk about. But as you why can imagine, this is get-acquainted session.
We have a reporters, our Moscow bureau chief Jill Dougherty is there, and a host of our White House reporters, John King, Major Garrett, they're all their covering this meeting in Ljubljana, Slovenia.
This castle where they were meeting, initially constructed in 1510, underwent major renovation 1935. A bit of history: It was one of the summer residences of former Yugoslav leader Marshall Tito.
And we did hear that President Putin had been studying English, and that the conversation that the two would have would be informal and they were going to try to do a lot of it in English.
You probably know the president is on a five-nation, five-day European tour. And this is last stop for him, in Slovenia, meeting with President Putin. He said earlier on this trip that the Cold War was over.
And here they go.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: President Putin and I have just concluded two hours of straightforward and productive meetings. We had a good discussion of our views of Russian-American relations and of the changing world at the beginnings of this new century. Our countries have common interests, and we share great responsibilities.
My meeting with President Putin today is an important step in building a constructive, respectful relationship with Russia, a relationship that has the potential to benefit not only our two countries, but also the world. Russia is an important country with vast potential. When Russia and the United States work together in a constructive way, we can make the world a safer and more prosperous place.
I enjoyed the opportunity to meet President Putin in person for the first time. I am convinced that he and I can build a relationship of mutual respect and candor, and I am convinced that it is important for the world that we do so.
More than a decade after the Cold War ended, it is time to move beyond suspicion and toward straight talk, beyond mutually assured destruction and toward mutually earned respect. As we work together to address the world as it is, not as it used to be, it is important that we not only talk differently, we also must act differently.
We have great opportunities to cooperate on economic, commercial, regional and security issues. President Putin and I have agreed to launch an extensive dialogue about a wide range of issues that we can constructively address together.
We also discussed the importance of a sound investment climate to improve Russia's future economic prosperity. I was so impressed that he was able to simplify his tax code in Russia with a flat tax. I'm not so sure I'll have the same success with our Congress.
We must continue a dialogue, so I am prepared to send both Secretary O'Neill and Secretary Evans to Moscow soon to further our discussions. I want to encourage Russian and American businesses to become more involved in our discussions so that together we can foster meaningful investments. President Putin agrees with this approach.
And we've agreed to launch regular, detailed and serious consultations on the nature of our security relationship.
I said to President Putin that we need a new approach for a new era, an approach that protects both our peoples and strengthens deterrence by exploring and developing a new attitude towards defenses in missile defenses. I directed the Secretary of State Powell and Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld to work with their Russian counterparts to begin discussing a new security framework. I have invited President Putin to Washington this fall; he accepted. He invited me to Russia, and I accepted, and I look forward to the visit.
We also agreed to continue our cooperation and work toward common solutions on important regional issues, from the Balkans to Nagorno- Karabakh to Afghanistan. And we discussed our common interests in developing the energy resources of the Caspian Basin in a way that benefits all the countries of the region.
Respectful relations require honesty, and we did discuss areas where my country has differences with Russia: over Chechyna, over media relations. I also expressed my hope that Russia will develop constructive relations with its neighbors, like Georgia, that are trying to find their own way in a challenging but hopeful world.
This was a very good meeting, and I look forward to my next meeting with President Putin in July. I very much enjoyed our time together. He's an honest, straightforward man who loves his country. He loves his family. We share a lot of values. I view him as a remarkable leader. I believe his leadership will serve Russia well. Russia and America have the opportunity to accomplish much together. We should seize it, and today we have begun.
And finally, I'm especially pleased we were able to have this meeting in Slovenia, one of the success stories of southeast Europe.
In my meetings today with the president and the prime minister, I reaffirmed America's support for Slovenia's integration with Europe and the Euro-Atlantic community.
I especially thank the people of Slovenia, and I want to thank the leadership for such warm hospitality and congratulate the people on the 10th anniversary of its independence on June 25. I only regret not staying long enough to see Lake Bled or to climb Mount Triglav. Who knows, maybe I will have the opportunity down the road.
VLADIMIR PUTIN, PRESIDENT OF RUSSIA (through translator): First of all, I want to confirm everything that's been said by President Bush when he characterized our meeting. I would even add that I was counting on an open, frank dialogue, confidential dialogue. In this regard, as they say in cases like this, reality was a lot bigger than expectations, because this was not only a confidential discussion, but extremely and all the way to more than what you could expect from frankness, because President Bush, as a person who has studied history, proposed a very global, wide-scale approach and view to history.
And it is very interesting and positive. We sat and talked about the past, about the present, about the future of our countries and about the development in the situation in the world for many years into the future. This was really a very interesting discussion.
I think that we found a good basis to start building on our cooperation.
We are counting on a pragmatic relationship between Russia and the United States. We compared our approaches in key areas, and once again we established our common ground.
I want to return now to what the president said very recently, that Russia and the United States are not enemies. They do not threaten each other. And they could be fully good allies.
And taking into account the fact that the United States and the Russian Federation, as no one else, as no other country of the world, have accumulated huge amounts of nuclear weapons, weapons of mass destruction, we bear a special responsibility for maintaining common peace and security in the world -- for building a new architecture of security in the world.
All of this presupposes a very close cooperation for strengthening security in the 21st century. I'm saying this, any unilateral actions can only make more complicated various problems and issues.
One of the central topics of our discussion was the strengthening of strategic stability. We exchanged our views on our approaches. It was very important for me to hear how and what the president of the United States thinks and to hear directly from him.
In turn, naturally, I expressed the approaches of Russia in this sphere. The differences in approaches do exist, and naturally in one short moment, it's impossible to overcome all of them. But I am convinced that ahead of us we have a constructive dialogue and the will to talk about these topics, to discuss, to hear each other. And to my mind, this is very important.
The president and I have agreed that we're going to tell our ministers of defense, secretaries of defense, foreign ministers, to continue in this vein, to continue this discussion without any pauses.
Of course, we discussed some very difficult regional issues in the Near East and Afghanistan and the Balkans. I have to say that this discussion showed that the differences in our approaches in the very fundamental areas are much less than that which unites us.
The differences in our positions, of the two countries really are not of a fundamental nature, a global nature, something which cannot be solved, not at all. I think that it would be very incorrect for us to start forcing on issues and arguments and not take into account the very fundamental, main concepts and issues in our relationships, which are the basis in the whole foundation of the relationship between the Russian Federation and the United States of America.
The president and I are united in saying that the economic ties between our two countries do not correspond to the potential of our two countries. The government of the Russian Federation, businessmen of both countries and the U.S. administration, of course, can do a lot more to support the effectiveness of our economic ties. And the president expressed that we need an additional impulse (sic) for our businessmen, and we will do everything possible to receive a very high-level business delegation of the United States to Russia.
Moreover, especially if it is headed by one of the senior officials of the U.S. administration.
Here there are a lot of very specific issues. We talked about energy resources. We talked about using the Caspian Basin. You know, very soon the new pipeline system is going to go into effect, which is going to be transporting energy resources from the Caspian Region through Novorossiisk. And this is a joint project of two companies -- Russian and American companies. I am sure that this will not be the last such project.
I want to stress here that the issues that were discussed in Ljubljana are going to be the subject of our continuing dialogue. And we really in fact did agree that we're going to talk in Genoa. We're going to talk in Shanghai at the APEC conference. And I'm very grateful to the President of the United States for inviting me to the United States. I would do it with great pleasure, especially because he invited to have me over at his ranch.
PUTIN: And I'm going to receive him in my own home, not just in Russia, but in my own home.
And the last, in the last few months, at the very threshold of our meeting, there was a lot of discussion about the fact that U.S.- Russian relations are overburdened by problems and issues that are somehow reaching a critical stage. I think the very nature and the result of our discussion today between myself and the president of the United States will put an end to all of these rumors.
We see very clearly, very positive prospect of our relationship in the future, and we are all geared up to work in the future constructively, pragmatically and to establish very good, predictable relationship.
And of course, I cannot but say the very highest about the hospitality of our hosts, who provided us with all the conditions necessary for holding this very good meeting -- good, moral atmosphere.
Thank you, thank you ever so much.
BUSH: Good job.
QUESTION: Will Slovenia get an invitation to NATO at the next summit in Prague, where, according to Lord Robertson, enlargement will happen?
And what is the Russian position on enlargement?
BUSH: I went to my first NATO summit, and there appears to be a uniform desire to expand NATO. That is certainly the position of my country.
But as I reminded the leaders today, there is a process, and the countries must work toward that process. I am impressed by the progress being made in this country, and we will take that under consideration when we meet in Prague a year from this fall.
QUESTION: Mr. Putin, you are leaving from Slovenia straight to Belgrade. Do you have any concrete solutions for the Balkan crisis?
PUTIN (through translator): As I understand you, what you have in mind is the situation in the region.
Yes, it's working. It's working. It's good to have dealings with the effective people that make things work.
As I understand it, what you have in mind is the overall situation in the Balkans, right? Macedonia, Kosovo, et cetera, right? Well, we do have our own idea a vision of what's happening here and how we should act.
Today we did discuss with the president of the United States, Mr. Bush, the most important things that we have to really pay attention to, is to put aN effective block, an end, to any kind of extremism and feelings of intolerance, religious intolerance, people who are trying to solve -- no matter how complex an issue of national or ethnic or religious conflict, weapons simply are not those kinds of things which can solve these problems.
In some of the countries of the former Soviet Union, for instance, you probably know -- we talk about this very often -- in the Balkan states, for instance, we feel that human rights are damaged, especially of the ethnic Russian populations. In Latvia, for instance, 40 percent of the population is Russian-speaking. A huge number of non-citizens, in other words, people who can't even get citizenship. We don't send weapons there. We don't support those people. We don't call it terrorism. We don't try to get people to rise up on the basis of national or ethnic origin or religious feelings.
We don't encourage people to take up arms to fight against that.
I stress again, and I insist, the people who try to do this do not deserve the support of the international community. But on the contrary, the international community must say once and for all, everybody who does this will receive a due answer.
These things can only be solved through negotiations. It's a very difficult process. It requires patience, but there is no other way.
QUESTION: A question to both of you, if I may.
President Putin, President Bush has said that he is going to go forward with missile defense plans, basically with or without your blessing. Are you unyielding in your opposition to his missile defense plans, and is there anything you could do to stop it?
And to President Bush, did President Putin ease your concern at all about the spread of nuclear technologies by Russia? And is this a man that Americans can trust?
Do you want to go first?
PUTIN (through translator): As far as the issue of anti-missile defense, the official position of the Russian government is known. I don't think we need to spend time to yet again declare it.
We proceed from the idea that the 1972 ABM Treaty is the cornerstone of the modern architecture of international security. We proceed from the premise that there are elements which unite us with our partners in the United States.
When we hear about things like concerns of the future and about threats in the future, we do agree that together we have to sit down and have a good think about this.
But we proceed from the idea that these concerns and threats are different kinds of things. Threats have to be defined. We have to look at where they come from and then make some decisions as to how we have to counter them.
We feel that we can do it best together. Based upon today's dialogue, I have come to the conclusion and the impression that we might have a very constructive development here in this arena. At least the president of the United States has listened carefully, listens to our arguments very carefully. But I think the specialists, as I have said before, have to sit down, have contact to identify the overall platform that we're going to work from and try to find a way together to solve these problems.
Now as far as the issue of proliferation and non-proliferation, I have to say that, in our opinion, this is a topic that is very, very closely tied to the ABM Treaty, because many other things are hooked on to this same string. And many threshold states, when it comes to the destruction of the previous accord, can only be happy and say, "Look, fantastic. Yesterday we were threshold; nobody agreed to took any account of us, now today recognizes us." This is a problem we're going to have to really think very hard about.
Can we trust Russia? I'm not going to answer to that. I could ask the very same question.
BUSH: I will answer the question. I looked the man in the eye. I found him to be very straightforward and trustworthy.
We had a very good dialogue. I was able to get a sense of his soul, a man deeply committed to his country and the best interests of his country. And I appreciated so very much the frank dialogue. There was no kind of diplomatic chit chat, trying to throw each other off balance.
There was a straightforward dialogue, and that's the beginning of a very constructive relationship. I wouldn't have invited him to my ranch if I didn't trust him.
BUSH: Secondly, I appreciate the opportunity to be able to talk about a new relationship, and we will continue these dialogues. The basis for my discussion began with this simple premise, that Russia and the United States must establish a new relationship beyond that of the old Cold War mentality.
The Cold War said loud and clear that we're opponents and that we bring the peace through the ability for each of us to destroy each other. Friends don't destroy each other. People who cooperate do not have a basis of peace on destruction.
Our nations are confronted with new threats in the 21st century. Terror in the hands of what we call rogue nations is a threat. I've expressed my concern and so did the president, very openly, about nations on his border and nations that can't stand America's freedoms developing the capacity to hold each of us hostage, and he agreed.
I brought up concerns about Iran, and I'm hesitant to put words in the president's mouth, but he said he's concerned as well.
And I think that's accurately categorized as your position.
And we'll work together to stop the spread of weapons of mass destruction. And I believe as we go down the road that we'll be able to develop a constructive relationship as to how to use our technologies and research and willingness to keep the peace in a way that makes the world more peaceful.
I was so pleased that we were able to begin constructive, real dialogue between our Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld and Mr. Andrei Ivanov (ph). These will be fruitful discussions, and I believe what people will see is a joint strategy.
The president is a history major, and so am I. And we remember the old history. It's time to write new history in a positive and constructive way.
QUESTION: This is a question to both presidents, if you'll allow.
Mr. Bush, you partially answered -- you talked about issues of strategic security and talked about the future. In this connection, could you tell us anything about what you talked about the expansion of NATO? Thank you.
BUSH: I did. I said I thought that it was a wise thing for NATO to expand so long as nations met their obligations and met what's called the MAP process.
I said yesterday in Poland, I felt like a secure border for Russia, a border with safe and friendly nations, is a positive. And I expressed my government's position very plainly. And the president, of course, had a reaction which I'm sure he'll give you right now.
I thought he was going to give it to you right now.
PUTIN (through translator): Yes, I'm going to lay it out for you.
PUTIN (through translator): I'm going to lay it out for you.
I'm going to read to you something which was recently declassified. Speaking for myself -- look, this was printed a while back, but there are attached addendum documents which were secret. The copy declassified was top secret. Look, here it is.
This is a note of the Soviet government from 1954 sent to the countries of NATO. Here is what it says: "The leadership, holding to its inalienable policy and taking into account all the tensions, this Soviet government announces its intention to enter into discussions with NATO countries about its participation in NATO with the North Atlantic Treaty Organization."
And this was the answer. Look, here is the answer. All right, here we go. The Soviet government proposed -- they were talking about the widening of the NATO pact and what they're going to do about bringing Soviet Union in: "There is no need to stress the completely unrealistic nature of such a proposal from the Soviet Union." That's the answer that NATO gave.
So what we're talking about here -- you remember, about a year ago I think somebody asked the question about, what's your attitude? Is it possible that Russia is going to join the NATO or not? I said, "Why not?" And right away Mrs. Albright, former secretary of state, she was someplace on a trip to Europe, said, "Look, we're not talking about this right now."
Look, you understand that our attitude toward NATO was not as one towards an enemy organization, of course not. And I'm very grateful to the president of the United States that finally, from the territory of the United States, these words were heard. This is very important for us. We value this. When the president of a great power says he wants to see Russia as a partner and maybe even as an ally, this is worth so much to us.
But if that's the case, then, look, we ask ourselves a question. Look, this is a military organization. Yes, it's military. They don't want us there. They don't want us there. It's moving towards our border. Yes, it's moving towards our border. Why?
So this is the foundation of all of our concerns, not just to bring it in or not bring it in or accept NATO or not accept NATO.
Look, the positive feeling that we now have developed today with President Bush could be a separate subject of discussion, becausen you know, Russia is cooperating with NATO. We have agreement. We have association. We have various accords and treaties, JPC. And there is no need to fire up this whole situation.
QUESTION: Mr. President, did you offer President Putin any inducements in this conversation to ease his opposition to a U.S. missile defense plan?
And, President Putin, to follow up on your comments just now, does the simple fact of President Bush saying that Russia is not an enemy actually change your strategic or military planning?
BUSH: I offered something: logic and a hopeful tomorrow. I offer the opportunity, which the president is going to seize, for us as leaders of great powers to work together. We have a unique opportunity to address the true threats of the 21st century together. We have a great moment during our tenures to cast aside the suspicions and doubts that used to plague our nations, and I am committed to do so.
I said in Poland and I'll say it again, Russia is not the enemy of the United States. As a matter of fact, after our meeting today, I am convinced it can be a strong partner and friend, more so than people could imagine.
The leader of Russia is working hard on behalf of his people to promote prosperity and peace, and I believe our nations can work together to achieve prosperity and peace not only within our respective countries, but around the world. I believe that.
And so, we didn't have a bargaining session. We had a session of two men who've come to office for the right purpose, not only to represent our countries, but giving our respective standings to work together to deal with the threats of the 21st century. A threat of the 21st century is energy. A threat of the 21st century is poverty. A threat of the 21st century is the spread of weapons of mass destruction. And as the president said to me, clearly, he said that you're not the only nation that cares about weapons of mass destruction; we care.
And we have an opportunity to do that. We have an opportunity to reject extremists that could threaten our respective nations and threaten our alliances. And we will do so. We will do so.
And today has been a very constructive day. Everybody is trying to read body language. Mark me down as very pleased with the progress and the frank discussion.
We'll meet again in July, then later in the fall. We're going to have the great Crawford, Texas, summit. And I believe that the people who watch carefully our relationship will see that it grows and emerges. It starts with trust. Ron asked a great question: Can I trust him? And I can. And from that basis, we can begin a very fruitful relationship.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE) you offered in this meeting?
BUSH: We did not. I mean, first of all, our relationship is larger than just security relationships. It's bigger than figuring out how to deal with the ABM Treaty. It's much bigger than that. It deals with two leaders who share values.
The president told me something very interesting. He said, I read where you named your daughters after your mother and your mother- in-law. And I said, Yes, I'm a great diplomat, aren't I?
BUSH: And he said, I did the same thing.
BUSH: I said, Mr. President, you're a fine diplomat, as well.
We share our love for our families. We've got common interests. And from that basis, we will seize the moment to make a difference in the world.
That's why he ran for the presidency, and that's why I ran for the presidency.
And this is not a bargaining session. The president didn't say, "Well, if you do this, I'll do that." It's bigger than that. It's a bigger relationship than that, and it's important to understand that.
QUESTION: President Putin, you will reply my question on whether the simple fact of President Bush saying the United States is not your enemy actually changes your military thinking or your strategic thinking and planning?
PUTIN (through translator): This is not a question. I think this has become an interview.
PUTIN (through translator): But look, nonetheless, I will respond.
It's not by accident that I said that it's important for us. And it seems to me that if you start with a mutual understanding that we are partners, that's the way we're going to move to try to solve this very important issue.
Look, we didn't just sit down and say that our specialists are going to meet and they're going to have an exchange of views. But we agreed that they're going to discuss very specific questions which cause concern to both sides, very specific items. I'm not prepared right now to get into this publicly, but we're talking about specifics.
Moreover, I have to say that between Russia and the United States, we have two protocols that we signed on non-strategic ABM systems, in New York and I think it was in Helsinki. And this, too, is the subject of very special review.
I think the specialists should define all these things. Again, I repeat, define the threats and those things which just stand in the way, to look at the power that both countries have to neutralize these threats. I think we can work out a common approach.
QUESTION: To both presidents, if you allow.
Getting back to trade and economic issues, ties between our two countries, how soon do you think we can expect a delegation of American businessmen to Moscow?
And do you have any plans on creating an intergovernmental commission of various agencies which could stimulate economic ties between the United States and Russia? Thank you.
BUSH: Well, I intend to talk to the secretary of commerce as soon as I get back, and tell him of our agreement and get him moving. Sometimes I worry a little bit about commissions. If commissions exist just to exist, then I don't think it's fruitful. If commissions exist in order to stimulate action, then perhaps.
Let me say one other area where the United States is in agreement with Russia: We think Russia ought to be admitted into the World Trade Organization, and we will work toward that end. The Russian president has expressed a desire to join the WTO, and I think it makes sense. I think that will help a lot.
And there are a lot of areas in our business relationships. I reminded the president that oftentimes people speak in terms of, you know, they say Russia is a country of great resources, only referring to the energy resources, the mining resources, the timber resources, and that is true.
But Russia has got a resource that's invaluable in this new era, and that's brain power. Russia has got great mathematicians and engineers who can just as easily participate in the high-tech world as American engineers and American mathematicians.
And that's an area of great interest to me, and that's an area of great interest to the president. It's an area where we can begin a fruitful dialogue.
The deployment of capital is something that's very important to Russia. It's important to our businessmen. The president understands it's important to have a rule of law, a reasonable tax system, transparency in the economy. He's working toward that. And I'm grateful that our businessmen and our secretary of commerce will hear that when they travel to Russia.
PUTIN (through translator): You know, I agree with the president in that, to overload our relationship by a variety of bureaucratic structures and organizations, that's not always justified. The most important thing is to create favorable conditions for effective work by the business community.
We know the plans of President Bush, with respect to his taxation policy and with respect to other measures which he is planning, with respect to the economy of the United Stats.
From our part, we still have to do so much that would make Russia attractive for the foreign investors. Although, among international investors, the Americans are in first place.
Naturally, first and foremost, we have to take care of the issues of the energy problem in the world at large. American business is showing a great interest in this sphere, but we also know that President Bush has plans in the atomic energy field. Here, too, we think we have a couple of things we could talk about. We have the very fruitful area of cooperation we could work in. We have a number of various structures that are working very appropriately now in reprocessing uranium. We've got pretty good cooperation in space now.
It seems to me that, to a significant extent, that which exists now is functioning very successfully now -- the international space station and the participation of the United States and Russia. We have so many other areas we'd like to work in.
But when the businessmen come -- that depends, of course, on the U.S. side -- but we will receive them at any appropriate time, any time that's appropriate to them.
BUSH: Thank you. Very good job.
KELLEY: And so a handshake after a couple of hours of meetings between Russian President Vladimir Putin and U.S. President George W. Bush. They met for couple hours at Brdo Castle. And they had quite a time, it sound like. They talked about a straightforward, productive meeting, is what President Bush said. They talked about the economy and security, the world as it is, not as it used to be, is what President Bush said.
And President Putin made -- did address missile defense. He said that President Bush listened carefully. And what they want to do is define where the threats are coming from, make a decision. He said they can do that best together. And they will try to solve the problems. They'll put their specialists together.
And they talked about trust. Something you probably heard between the U.S. and Russian relationship in the former Soviet Union. Relationship before, President Bush said, I trust him, I can. I looked the man in the eye, straightforward, trustworthy, got sense of his soul. Deeply committed to his country and had very little, he said, no diplomatic chitchat.
And he said, I wouldn't have invited to my ranch if I didn't trust him. He has invited President Putin to the ranch in the fall, invited him to Washington, to the ranch, both. And he said he accepted. And Putin invited Bush to Russia and he accepted. So, we're going to follow this a little bit more with our John King after we take a quick break.
KELLEY: Welcome back as we continue here on CNN SATURDAY, just brought you that news conference live from Slovenia between the presidents of the United States and Russia, President Bush and President Vladimir Putin. And our Senior White House Correspondent John King was there as well. John King, President Bush said it was very constructive. And he said, mark me down very pleased.
JOHN KING, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Donna, certainly grade this A for atmospherics. These two leaders showing that they get along pretty well. Mr. Bush saying he looked Mr. Putin in the eye and he feels he can trust him, joking he would not have invited him to the ranch in Crawford, Texas if he didn't feel at that way.
Mr. Putin bringing laughter throughout the audience on several occasions, especially on a question about NATO expansion. Russia obviously opposes that. And that's one of the key policy differences, despite all this good body language here today, but he fiddled through his papers and found a declassified document in which he said the Soviet Union had once explored joining NATO and was told no. He thinks that should be NATO's position now, no new members.
But Mr. Putin, conveying that difference with the U.S. President and that difference with the West in very comical way. So the U.S. delegation will certainly come away impressed with communication between these two leaders, but let's look at the substance. Mr. Putin once again said the ABM treaty was the cornerstone of arms control. The United States want Russia to negotiate some amendments to that, so it can go ahead with the missile defense plan.
But Mr. Putin not indicating he was ready to do just yet, although he did say he was convinced if the experts got together that perhaps they could develop a common approach. So differences on NATO, still differences on missile defense. But these were two hours of meetings. No one expected any breakthroughs. And I think people will be surprised by what appeared to be a very genuine give and take, back and forth camaraderie, if you will, between these two leaders -- Donna.
KELLEY: John, that's the sense that I got, too, watching them. Even though the differences are there, and this is something that President Bush has stressed during this five-nation tour, that even if the differences are there, they can sit down and still work together. And I got the indication from these two that they have started off on a very positive foot together.
KING: Well, they certainly want to. And let's not forget, not only do they want to get off on a good footing together, both of these men playing to domestic political back home. Mr. Putin wants to go home and say, "Hey, I didn't give any ground on NATO. I didn't give any ground on missile defense. The United States is sending in the Commerce Secretary and others to talk about more business investment in Russia.
Mr. Bush needs to go home and say he drew a hard line on these issues. He raised concerns about press freedoms and about Chechnya. Mr. Bush having an uncertain fate for his international agenda now that the Democrats run the Senate. So both men not only trying to develop relationships among and between themselves, but also playing a bit to the audience back home. The tough part will come as they meet again next month here in Europe, later in the year in Asia and perhaps at the Texas ranch as well, actually getting down to the details.
President Clinton and President Yeltsin had what, by all accounts, was a very good personal relationship, but in the latter years of that relationship, not much substantive progress. The test for this relationship in the months ahead is whether they can turn the great atmospherics here in Slovenia into actual substantive progress. And the issues are very difficult.
KELLEY: John, have you heard any more about whether they'll have a separate meeting when they go to Italy? I guess that's July 20, around there, to the 22 when they have that group of 7 and Russia meeting. And that's in Italy. And they talked about a meeting that they might have then as well. KING: Yes, the tradition at those meetings, and we are told it is almost certain, the tradition is that Mr. Bush meets one-on-one with most of the major leaders and almost always the U.S. President has a pull aside or a quick bilateral meeting with the Russian President. We're told plans are in works for that.
Again, that only just a little more a month away. Then the APEC Summit, the Asian Pacific Economic Conference is in Shanghai later this year. And you heard the presidents, each invited the other to visit his country. It looks like President Putin will come to Crawford, Texas first, but Mr. Bush saying he would go to Moscow as well. He didn't say just when.
KELLEY: OK, John King there in Slovenia. Thanks very much and we'll talk to you again soon as the afternoon progresses here. And now we're joined by Anthony Blinken. He is the former U.S. National Security Council official. And he was here listening with us as well to part of that speech at least.
Mr. Blinken, thanks for coming into to talk with us. Appreciate it.
ANTHONY BLINKEN, FMR. NATL. SECUTITY COUNCIL OFFICIAL: Good to be here.
DONNA KELLEY: What's your assessment? We were talking about that with John King and he said, you know, it looks good and they are off on a good foot, but it's going to get tougher when you start hammering on out on issues.
BLINKEN: I think John has it just right. This was not a negotiating session, it was a get-to-know-you meeting. And on that level, it is seems to have been a success. Both presidents looked very comfortable with each other. Clearly they've had a good meeting. The atmospherics looked good, but the hard work's ahead.
Still, I think what's important today is that this is a turning point. The first couple months of the administration -- the Bush administration -- the administration was downplaying Russia, disregarding Russia and some said even disdaining Russia. Putin had trouble getting a meeting with President Bush.
The tone, the rhetoric was harsh. This is a much different approach that the President's taking today and very good one. It sets the relationship off on much sounder footing. As John said, they've got a number of meetings in the months ahead. The devil will be in the details. When they start to get into negotiations about missile defense, when NATO enlargement becomes much more real heading into Prague next year, in the summit there, it'll get tougher. But this is a good foundation. And I think the administration did the right thing in changing the tone of the relationship with Russia.
KELLEY: I noticed that, Anthony, when they started out because President Bush said at least three times that I counted at the very top part when he was speaking about mutual, respectful and respect and going beyond the old relationship into the new, but respect was mentioned about three times.
Let's talk about some of the trouble spots when they start to get into this and then trying to get things accomplished. Missile defense, that was addressed as well. And Mr. Putin said we'll sit down with our specialists and we'll look at where the threats come from and we'll decide what needs to be done, but I think we can do it together. How do you see that happening?
BLINKEN: Well, it's going to be long process. And of course, the Russians have a certain interest in dragging it out as long as possible. They'd like to prevent the administration from actually beginning to deploy anything. And if they can drag it out, so much the better. The tension's going to come in the administration's desire to move this forward more quickly. Yes, they want to talk to the Russians, they want to see if they can find common ground. They want to see if they can agree that there is common threat.
But the incentive for the Russians is to drag it out, especially with the Democrats back in the Senate. The incentive for the administration is going to be to push it forward. At some point, these two interests are going to collide and there's going have to be a decision about whether the administration really does throw away the ABM treaty or whether they can get the Russians to agree to modify the treaty to allow testing of some of these missile defense systems.
KELLEY: Talking about more defense as well, the military technology sales that apparently it happened that Russia's selling to Iran. That was one issue that President Bush was going to bring up to President Putin. He talked a little bit and he said, you know, you're only nation who cares --Mr. Putin said -- you're not the only nation that cares about weapons of mass destruction. We care too. Now what happens? How do they address that issue?
BLINKEN: Well, President Putin's right. And ironically, Russia is more likely to be the short-term victim of some of this proliferation than the United States. A lot of the countries of concern that are getting these weapons are much closer to Russia than they are to the United States.
A lot of the problem here seems to be that even if the Russian government and the Russian administration is not behind some of the spread of this technology, its companies are, some of its citizens are. The Russian government needs to get a grip on this problem and show some real willingness to stop the proliferation of these dangerous weapons and dangerous technologies. That's the real test, to see if the Russian government will step up to the plate and do something about a problem that is there.
DONNA KELLEY: President Bush said that would try and work for Russia to join the WTO, the World Trade Organization, said that that made sense. And Vladimir Putin said we will welcome U.S. businessmen who want to come, realizing he said, that we have lot of work to do. What work needs to be done and how will that relationship develop and how soon do you think that can happen where there can be more business ties together between the two countries? BLINKEN: Both presidents put their finger on a critical problem. The '90s in many ways was a period of, especially at the beginning, of excessive optimism. A lot money flooded into Russia, but the structures weren't there to deal with it. There wasn't transparency. There wasn't accountability. There wasn't rule of law. There's tremendous corruption.
Until these basics are in place, it's really hard for a lot of investment to go forward. If you're an American or European investor, you want to make sure that your investment is secure. You want to make sure that you can trust the people you're doing business with.
These basics still have long way to go and President Putin acknowledged that. Bringing Russia into the WTO would do just that. It would compel Russia to create greater transparency, greater accountability in its economy. And that in turn, would create a better investment climate. So that's the right direction to take it in. A lot of hard work has to be done and mostly it's Mr. Putin's work.
KELLEY: Real quickly, can you just kind of summarize what kind of feeling you got between the relationship that you think that they've started to establish from what we saw today?
BLINKEN: Today was a turning point. It looked like the personal chemistry was very good. The administration's gotten away from talking down Russia. It's talking up Russia. That's a good basis to move forward. As you said, respect is the key word. There seems to be mutual respect. Now the hard work begins of negotiating some of these tough issues.
KELLEY: Former U.S. National Security Council official, Anthony Blinken. A pleasure to have you join us and visit with us. Thank you very much.
BLINKEN: Thank you.
KELLEY: Take quick break here. More of CNN SATURDAY when we come back.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com