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CNN LIVE SATURDAY

Colombian Marxist Rebels Allegedly Plotted To Assasinate President Bush; Interview with Michael Fremer; Panel Discusses Peterson's Sentencing Phase

Aired November 27, 2004 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN ANCHOR: It's 2:00 p.m. on the East Coast, 11:00 a.m. in the west.
Welcome to CNN LIVE SATURDAY. I'm Andrea Koppel in Washington.

Ahead this hour, new information about an alleged assassination plot against President Bush. Also, terrorism and security at one of the biggest entry points into the U.S., why trucks are not inspected until after arriving in America.

Also, a big oil spill near Philadelphia. Live with the latest on what's being done to contain and clean up the damage.

Those stories in a moment, but first, here's stories now in the news.

(NEWSBREAK)

KOPPEL: We begin in a political hot spot in Eastern Europe, Ukraine. The country's political crisis sparked by last weekends disputed presidential runoff election drags on this weekend. But some new developments offer hope that the crisis can soon be resolved. CNN's Jill Dougherty is with us now from Ukraine's capital of Kiev.

So Jill, I guess we're into the sixth evening of demonstrations there?

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We are. But you can still hear the sounds. There is still demonstrating going on. A big rally continuing -- yes, I can. If you can hear me, I hope. Can you hear me, Atlanta?

KOPPEL: Go ahead, Jill, we can hear you.

DOUGHERTY: Looks like we may -- we have some problems there. Yes, the demonstrations are continuing. In fact, OK, Andrea -- downtown Kiev still the center of all of these demonstrations, still thousands of people on the streets. But the most important thing that happened today was a political development, and that took place inside the parliament. The parliament taking two votes crucial ones that were very symbolically helpful to the opposition. One was they voted to annul the results of that runoff election last week saying it did not represent the wishes of the Ukrainian people. Then also they voted to dissolve The Central Commission that ratified and said that the government-backed candidate had won that election. Now, there's no legal (UNINTELLIGIBLE) for those two decisions but symbolically and politically they are really very important. Here's what the speaker said during that...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYE LYTVYN, UKRAINIAN PARLIAMENT SPEAKER: The most logical political decision taking into account the mutual claims of massive violations is to pronounce the elections invalid in the sense of trying to determine the real will of the people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DOUGHERTY: So these demonstrators, as we've been saying, we are here in Kiev, which is a real center of the opposition. They support Victor Yushchenko, who is the opposition canidate. But there are other people who support the government backed candidate and that's Viktor Yanukovych. And today there were demonstrations in another part of the country, Dunyesk (ph) in the east of Ukraine, where a mining area, a heavily industrialized mining area. They definitely feel that the candidate who was officially announced the president should be the president, that there was an election and that the opposition should accept it.

So they have been rallying, too. But at this point, we have to say that politically, the movement seems to be toward the opposition with no final guarantee that they will be able to get what they want, which is another vote.

KOPPEL: Jill Dougherty, reporting for us there in Kiev, Ukraine, where it looks like it's more of a rock concert than a demonstration. But so far things are peaceful.

President Bush's stop over in Colombia was brief, but a senior Colombian official now says that the president's life was in danger. The official says Marxist rebels had targeted Mr. Bush for assassination during his brief visit this week to Cartagena. No incidents happened and the U.S. Secret Service is declining to comment. The president stopped their Monday on his return trip from the APEC summit in Chile.

Toby Muse is a journalist in Colombia and joins me now by phone with more about this surprising revelation.

So Tony, who was it that broke the news about this plot and what can you tell us about it?

TOBY MUSE, JOURNALIST: Good afternoon. This was the Colombian defense minister Jorge Alberto Uribe. And details remain very sketchy. But he says that Colombian authorities were warned by informants that the FARC supreme command had ordered their unit to assassination President Bush. It should be noted that there was a huge security system when Bush was in Cartagena for about four with some 15,000 Colombia troops patrolling the city, aerial overflights. And the city essentially locked down, all to prevent anything from occurring. I think, the plots -- the plots against the president's life don't seem to have advanced very far given that there has been no arrests and, as you said, there were no incidents.

KOPPEL: We should let our viewers, who may not be as familiar with the Colombian civil war, know that the FARC or the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia. And they've been fighting a 30-year civil war against the government.

Toby, can you explain to our viewers perhaps why the FARC would want to target President Bush.

MUSE: The FARC, as you said, the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia is Latin America's largest Marxist guerrilla group. It's thought to have 20,000 members in uniform and in urban militias. The FARC hates the government of President Alvaro Uribe. And he hate any government that backs it, which in this case is the U.S. Government. The U.S. Government has given, we're fast approaching, $4 billion in aid to the Colombian government over the past four years. This money has been used to go after Marxist rebels and to go after the country's drug trafficking industry. Colombia is responsible for the vast majority of cocaine and the vast majority of heroin on the streets of the U.S.

So the FARC attacks anyone who attacks -- supports the Colombian government. So this would be the motivation for an assassination attempt against President George W. Bush.

KOPPEL: Believe, we're seeing pictures right now in Cartagena of the site where this alleged plot was supposed to have taken place. Toby, can you tell us, perhaps, how and why the Colombian government decided to go public about this?

MUSE: Well, the Colombian government is involved -- the Colombian government and the rebels are involved in a long running civil war and also a long running propaganda war. The Colombian government feels that while it's received absolute 100 percent from the U.S. government for its policies, it worries about some European politicians. Frequently criticizes European politicians are criticized for portraying the Marxist rebels as some latter-day Robin Hood. And the bringing to light of this plot against the president's life, it is one-third the step in this propaganda war that the two sides are fighting just as fiercely as the civil war is raging in the country here.

KOPPEL: Toby Muse, a journalist in Colombia, joining us there by phone. Thank you so much.

Turning now to Iraq where the violence continues and talk of an election delay is building. In Baghdad, an improvised explosive device blew up this morning in the southern part of the city. Eyewitnesses say U.S. military convoy was passing by at the time, but no casualties are reported.

Meantime, the U.S. Military says 17 bodies have been discovered in the northern city of Mosul. No information yet about identities. In the last eight days, 57 bodies have been found in that region.

As the violence continues, talk of a delay in elections is also building. More than a dozen major parties want the January 30th elections pushed back for up to six months. The interim Iraqi government and the U.S. are adamant that elections must go forward in January.

We get the latest from CNN's Karl Penhaul in Baghdad.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): My details are correct and I'm ready for the election, says the man in the TV ad telling Iraqis how to register for January 30th elections. Campaign posters are popping up around Baghdad. A reminder this will be the first free vote in more than 50 years. But not everybody has election fever.

Adnan Pachachi, a former coalition ally and ex-president of the Iraqi Governing Council wants to postpone the ballot.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: First of all, it's to insure a wider participation possible so that no part of Iraq, no area of Iraq, would be left out from the political process. And the second one is to give a chance for an improvement in the security situation.

PENHAUL (on camera): At a meeting Friday 15 major religious and secular political organizations backed his stance including the two main Kurdish parties. Any delay could prove tricky. The United Nations Security Council resolution set the deadline for a vote no later than January 31st. And leaders of Iraq's Shia Muslim majority has been pushing for elections at the earliest opportunity. At a weekend press conference officials seemed determined to proceed as planned.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't want to get involved with this issue because it's not my field. But up until now there are discussions going on and the prime minister, he want to have the election at the same time. He doesn't want to postpone it.

PENHAUL (voice-over): Violence has spiked in parts of Iraq since the start of November. But the Independent Electoral Commission believes the January timetable is still realistic.

"There are some areas in the country with security problems, " he says, "but there are 72 days left until the elections. And with the continuing effort to improve security, most of the country should be able to take part."

Aside calls for a postponement, some Sunni Muslim parties and clerics are urging their supporters to boycott the poll, together, until coalition armies leave Iraq for good.

Insurgent gunmen seem to be backing that demand with firepower. Karl Penhaul, CNN, Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOPPEL: So far the latest efforts to break a deadlock between Iran and its nuclear plans aren't meeting with much success. Iran's foreign minister says a new draft resolution put forward by Great Britain, France and Germany is still unacceptable despite some recent changes. Negotiators from the three European counties in Iran are meeting this weekend in Vienna. The United States and its European allies are concerned that Iran has the desire and the intention to develop nuclear weapons. The government in Tehran says its nuclear program is strictly for peaceful purposes.

Protecting a key training link between the U.S. and Canada, why efforts to improve security along the ambassador bridge are running into some roadblocks.

Plus this...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are still stuck on this concept that I don't support homosexuality, therefore, I'm not addressing HIV. Who cares? Who cares whether you support homosexuality or not? The fact is that we have a major crisis in our community.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KOPPEL: How the African-American community is attacking prejudice and stigmas in the fight against AIDS.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KOPPEL: For years the U.S. and Canada had been hoping to tighten security at the border by inspecting big trucks and their cargo, but so far good intentions have yet to translate into action.

As CNN's Jeanne Meserve reports.

JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A herd of tractor trailers thunders across the Ambassador Bridge, more than 12,000 every day. And none are inspected until after they cross.

THOMAS "SKIP" MCMAHON, AMBASSADOR BRIDGE: We compare it to having your luggage inspected after you get off the airplane.

MESERVE: The Ambassador Bridge is about as critical a piece of infrastructure as exist anywhere. This one bridge spanning the U.S./Canadian border between Detroit, Michigan and Windsor, Ontario, carries one quarter of the trade between the two countries. It was constructed to last and has for 75 years. Bringing it down would be difficult. But just making it impassable could be economically devastating. The auto industry relies on the bridge to transport parts just in time for use on the production line. And even the heightened security after 9/11 had a profound effect.

MARGARET IRVIN, AMERICAN TRUCKING ASSOCIATION: Post September 11th, the economy was almost shut down at the northern border. I know some of the big five auto manufacturers had to shut down lines. Cost them millions of dollars, because trucks couldn't make it over the bridges. MESERVE: Given the economic stakes and the limited options for rerouting truck traffic, there is widespread agreement that the bridge would be more secure if customs inspections were reversed. The U.S. would check out trucks on the Canadian side before cross the bridge and vice versa.

(on camera): The idea of swapping the customs stations around has been discussed since 9/11, but more than three years later, nothing has been done.

(voice-over): There has been and continues to be a lot of talk between U.S. and Canadian officials.

ROY CULLEN, PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY: This is not, you know, all straight head stuff. There are some complex issues there.

MESERVE: U.S. custom officers have greater powers to search, inspect, and arrest than their Canadian counter parts and the Americans carry gun. If they were to operate on Canadian soil, they would have adhere to Canadian law, potentially weakening their authority.

One example.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you had someone who you identified as a suspicious terrorist, that would come into the reverse inspection area and you identified them for arrest and they say, we change our mind and we want to turn around and leave, U.S. authorities would not have the capability to hold them at that point.

MESERVE: Officials of the U.S. and Canada say they are in serious negotiations with synchronizing laws or even swapping small pieces of territory on either side of the bridge. But supporters of reverse inspections point to the tunnel where the French and British currently perform reverse inspections and to some Canadian airports where U.S. customs already pre-clears passengers. And they suggest if there was a truly political will, a way already would have been found.

SHELBY SLATER, DETROIT HOMELAND SECURITY: It hasn't happened. And that's the bottom line. It just hasn't happened.

MESERVE: And no one on the U.S. or Canadian side can say when or if it will. So the trucks keep rolling across the bridge uninspected.

Jeanne Meserve, CNN, on the U.S./Canadian border.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOPPEL: HIV does not discriminate. So why are infection rates disproportionately impacting African-Americans?

We'll explore that issue, plus show you what that community is doing to fight back. That's up next.

And still ahead, determining the punishment for convicted double murderer Scott Peterson. We'll get a legal preview from both sides of the courtroom.

And stay tuned to find out why paying for your Christmas goodies with debit cards could get you into trouble if you're not careful.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KOPPEL: Today in the African-American community, AIDS does not discriminate. HIV can be found in every segment of the population and the numbers are staggering. Blacks more than any other ethnic group, are feeling the impact.

We get more now from CNN's senior medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's hear what your opinion is on that.

GUPTA: Like the young men he now counsels, Adolph St. Arabiya knows the pressure of being young, black, and gay.

ADOLPH ST. ARROMAND, HIV POSITIVE: I confessed to having those feelings and being a homosexual male. And all went berserk in my family.

GUPTA: By his 20th birthday, Adolph was diagnosed with AIDS.

ARROMAND: I began to personally in my mind and in my heart prepare for my death.

RASHAD BURGESS, CDC: AIDS rates amongst African-Americans are ten times higher than that of whites.

GUPTA: Experts say the reasons are many, AIDS was originally thought of as a gay white man's disease, and was not even on the radar screen in the black community. Add to that poverty, IV drug use, and the fact that blacks don't have the same access to primary healthcare.

But black activists are fighting back.

PERMESSA SEELE, THE BALM IN GILEAD: We are in a bad place. And we look at our numbers.

GUPTA: Permessa Seele and her organization, the Balm in Gilead, work with 10,000 black churches. Their goal? Start AIDS ministries and finally let go of the stigma that plagues the black community.

SEELE: We are still stuck on this concept that I don't support homosexuality, therefore, I'm not addressing HIV. Who cares? Who cares whether you support homosexuality or not? The fact is that we have a major crisis in our community.

GUPTA: The project is starting to gain traction. Churches like Bethel AME in Wilmington, Delaware are starting AIDS ministries for the first time. SILVESTER BEAMAN, REV., BETHEL AME CHURCH: Ministers need to -- we need to stop being judgmental and realize that this is not God's curse upon a segment or a population.

GUPTA: Phill Wilson of the Black AIDS Institute agrees. He says in the end, silence may be doing the most damage of all.

PHILL WILSON, THE BLACK AIDS INSTITUTE: The day will come when all of us are going to be asked the question, what did you do? What did you do? People are dying. People are getting sick. It didn't have to happen. What did you do?

GUPTA: Both Beaman and Wilson are optimistic the community will one day get beyond stigma. Because in the end, they say, it's more important to save lives. Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOPPEL: Think you know everything about AIDS? Are you positive?

CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta is joined by Richard Gere, Ashley Judd and Magic Johnson to explain how the contemporary environment of HIV and AIDS defies the stereotype that it's a disease of gay men in poor and distant nations. The reemergence of HIV and AIDS in unexpected places, coming up tomorrow at 10:00 p.m. Eastern, right here on CNN.

Unrest in Iraq, uncertainty over intelligence reform and a cabinet reshuffle. The Bush administration faces many challenges in the new year. Coming up, I'll talk with political analyst Ron Brownstein about what it can all mean for the nation's political future.

Will it be a high tech holiday season for you and your loved ones?

Stick around and find out what's new when it comes to digital entertainment.

Plus spending thousands to honor your favorite TV show. Why some "Star Trek" fans feel compelled to add their own voice to the cult classic.

(NEWSBREAK)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KOPPEL: Now in the news, the coast guard says assessment teams are trying to determine the extent of environmental damage from an oil spill on the Delaware River near Philadelphia. An estimated 30,000 gallons of crude oil leaked into the waterway from a docking tanker on Friday.

Ukraine's parliament has voted to denounce the country's presidential runoff vote. And it expressed a no confidence in the Central Election Commission. The non-binding resolution gives a boost to thousands of opposition supporters complaining the runoff was rigged and have been demanding a new ballot.

And Colombian defense secretary says President Bush was targeted for assassination by Marxist rebels while he was visiting Cartagena this past week. However, the official says no maps or other evidence of a plot have been found. The revolutionary armed forces of Colombia is the military wing of the Colombian communist party. It is classified by the U.S. State Department as a terrorist group.

After the holidays, President Bush begins his second term with some fresh faces in his administration. What's in store for America and are more changes on the way in coming weeks? CNN political analyst Ron Brownstein with "The Los Angeles Times" is in Washington with a political preview.

So Ron, what are all -- by the way Happy Thanksgiving.

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Happy Thanksgiving to you.

KOPPEL: What are the implications of so many Bush loyalists now in the capital?

BROWNSTEIN: Well you know this was always the administration where power was centralized in the White House and the White House exerted a great deal of influence over the agencies and departments. Now we're taking it a step further with the president dispatching some of his long-term advisers and closest allies to run these departments. Alberto Gonzalez his counsel going all the way back to Texas to be the new attorney general. Margaret Spellings who advised him on education all the way back to Texas now running the education department. And most important Conde Rice his national security advisor and certainly his foreign policy guru during the presidential campaign back in 2000 going to the state department where the White House and many conservatives outside the government, as you well know has not been fully in tune with the president. All this in an effort to sort of consolidate his control, the same thing I think you see with Port Aguas (ph) at the CIA.

KOPPEL: So everyone will be singing from the same sheet of music?

BROWNSTEIN: Well we'll see. One of the long-term issues in Washington is the degree to which people when they are sent from the administration out to run one of the departments become an advocate for the department back against the administration. There is historical memory in all of these departments, the bureaucracy often has a way of doing things that differs from whoever is president at the time. But clearly this is one of the most aggressive efforts we've seen a long time for a president to put his stamp not only on the broad policy but on the implementation of that policy down to the department level.

KOPPEL: OK looking at some of the policies on the presidents agenda, why can we expect to see Social Security come ahead of tax reform? BROWNSTEIN: Well you know those are the two big domestic issues that he laid out in this campaign. Reforming Social Security to allow workers to invest part of their payroll tax in the stock market or individual accounts and some kind of fundamental tax reform. The answer is that on Social Security they have a much clearer idea of what they want to do on tax reform. Tax reform really is still a concept in search of an agenda at this point.

The administration is looking at appointing a commission to flesh out some ideas. Social Security, he ran on in 2000 as well as 2004. Republicans are in the strongest position to make changes in this program perhaps than they have ever been with wider margins in the house and wider margins in the Senate. When you talk to some of the key advocates people like Lindsey Graham the Republican from South Carolina who has been pushing this idea for years, he says we'll know very quickly, possibly within six months whether there are the 60 votes it will take to break a senate filibuster.

So I think there are a lot of advocates expecting this to come out very quickly in 2005 and see if there's the appetite for really fundamentally changing a program that 40 million Americans rely on.

KOPPEL: Speaking of 40 million Americans relying on something, what about healthcare reform?

BROWNSTEIN: Well healthcare I think is the issue that's most likely to force itself on the president. It really isn't at the top of their list. When you look at what is going on in healthcare right now we have 45 million Americans without health insurance. We've had four straight years of double digit premium increases putting enormous pressure on businesses which are important issues to the president.

And we see states facing increasing budget pressure like Tennessee is going through for example a crisis on its plan for covering those without insurance. When you look at it all, it looks an awful like the conditions of the early '90s, a cycle of rising costs and declining access that propelled Bill Clinton's effort to provide national health insurance. Now George Bush isn't going to do anything that dramatic. But it is hard to imagine the existing conditions could go on for four years without Congress having to take more serious action than they have over the last four years.

KOPPEL: Very quickly in our remaining seconds, what do you see as being the top international issues that the president will be focusing on?

BROWNSTEIN: Well sounds like Iran and Iraq. And the two seem to be interrelated. I think that the president and the administration and probably you know better than I, has been skeptical of the European effort to negotiate a deal with the Iranians to freeze their nuclear program. But they've been reluctant I think to have an open breach with the Europeans while there's still so much tension over Iraq.

We'll see in the next few days whether they can stay on the same page as these efforts to keep Iran in this agreement go forward. But there's no doubt that from all the signals that this is something that we'll be hearing a lot more about in the months ahead.

KOPPEL: Ron Brownstein, "The Los Angeles Times." Nice to see you. Thank you.

BROWNSTEIN: Thank you.

KOPPEL: And these programming notes. John Podesta, chief of staff under former President Bill Clinton is the guest today on CNN's "The Capital Gang." that's coming at 7:00 p.m. Eastern. And coming up tomorrow on CNN's "Late Edition with Wolf Blitzer" guests will talk about the future of the Republican party. That begins at noon Eastern.

Santa's not the only one making a list and checking it twice. Why Americans looking to stay within a budget this holiday season should follow the big guy's lead. That story after the break.

Plus, are you looking to get someone a high-tech toy? From iPods to cell phones, we will tell you what's hot this year.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KOPPEL: The 2004 hurricane season was one of the costliest on record. That's especially true for small businesses across Florida. Government loans to small business owners in the region are expected to hit $1.5 billion. That's more than the past 15 years combined.

Tomorrow night be sure to tune in to CNN at 7:00 p.m. Eastern for a special edition of "Anderson Cooper 360," as he revisits the major hurricanes of 2004.

The holiday shopping frenzy is still under way as many of you tally up what you've already spent. CNN's Julie Vallese has some tips for keeping that buying urge under control.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JULIE VALLESE, CNN CORREPSPONDENT (voice over): More Americans plan on saying debit it rather than charge it for holiday gift purchases this year. That's a good way, experts say, to avoid running up holiday debt.

ANNE SCHELLER, CONSUMBER CREDIT COUNSELING: Just make sure you're tracking and recording your spending. So as you swipe your card, you go ahead and take out your note card along with it and write down how much money you spend.

VALLESE: And that's important just because it's debit doesn't mean you can't get into debt.

STEVEN BROWNBECK, CONSUMER FEDERATION OF AMERICA: The problem is that some debit cards now have taken on the characteristic of credit cards. That is you can overdraw your balance and essentially you're taking out a loan that is very expensive.

VALLESE: According to the National Retail Federation, Americans will spend about $220 billion for the holiday season, up about 4.5 percent over last year. Statistics show holiday spending usually takes about five to six months pay off. By that time you're sitting by the pool not thinking at all about sugar plums.

ELLEN TOLLEY, NATIONAL RETAIL FEDERATION: Consumers will do a better job spending and will be able to stretch their money further if they shop throughout the holiday season and take advantage of sales along the way.

VALLESE: To avoid that and other shopping misstates experts say start the season off with a list. And, yes, check it twice. Include who you are shopping for what you plan to buy and how much you'd like to spend. Also know your overall budget. Make adjustments on individual purchases along the way.

VALLESE (on camera): About 30 percent of Americans still do plan on using credit. So keep in mind, if you plan on charging it, research shows that people spend more with a credit card than they do with a check and more with a check than they do with cash. In Arlington, Virginia I'm Julie Vallese.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOPPEL: High-tech items are expected to be a big hit with consumers this holiday season. Michael Fremer is with me now from New York to talk about what is hot. He is contributing editor of the Stereofile Ultimate A.V. Nice to see you Michael.

MICHAEL FREMER, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, STEREOFILE ULTIMATE A.V: Nice to see you. Let's throw all that good advice out the window right now, OK?

KOPPEL: All right. So what would you like to tell our viewers? What are the hot techy gifts this year?

FREMER: Well, this was in "The New York Times" and a few other newspapers the past few days. Plasma television is going to be the big hot item this year absolutely. So that's one thing to look at. If you're looking at a plasma television, remember that if you go for cheap, it's not going to be as good. Buy a really good plasma television. Do the research, find out -

KOPPEL: Why?

FREMER: Why what?

KOPPEL: Why buy plasma?

FREMER: Well, if you have to hang a television on a wall, it's really the format to get. It's got the best, brightest picture. They've really made big improvements in the black levels. There were certain problems with plasma early on as far as getting good deep black levels, good contrast levels. They would start buzzing at high altitudes. And they didn't last that long. All these things were said about them, most of them were true. The latest generation of the good plasma -- there are different tears of plasma TVs. It's not like there's plasma and that is it and they're all the same. Some people think it's plasma, they're going to draw blood from my neck and put it in my television. Doesn't happen that way.

KOPPEL: Gotcha. What about high tech, the digital music players?

FREMER: Well, of course, Apple's iPod is really preeminent in that field although there are other brands. Now there's a fourth generation of iPod and there is and iPod with video and there are other brands competing and other companies like Creative Labs and I- river (ph) that are trying to compete against the iPod. But if the gift person that you're giving to already has an iPod and you want to enhance their experience, you should consider upgrading to a pair of much higher quality headphones.

These sure E5C's cost $500. There's a separate woofer and tweeter in each earpiece. It really sounds much, much better than the ear buds that come with the iPod. Also this is the big head amplifier. It adds a little bulk, but if you're on a plane or something, you put this next to your iPod and this makes the sound much better. This is about $200.

KOPPEL: What about digital cameras?

FREMER: Digital cameras, well talking about digital cameras you have two things happening. Pixel count is way up. And prices are coming way down. So this Christmas, a lot of people are going to get very high quality digital cameras. But at the same time what is happening is at the top end of the market companies like Nikon and Canon are coming out with SLR type digital cameras really high quality cameras through the lens that look like what cameras used to look like before digital. People are going upscale from their point and shoot to a camera that can really take high quality pictures.

KOPPEL: And when you say they're going up in pixels, how many pixels do they have?

FREMER: Five mega pixels, 8 mega pixels. It is getting to a point where a really good one looks as good as film.

KOPPEL: In our remaining minute Michael, why don't you give our viewers an idea of some of the good bargains that are out there.

FREMER: Well the best stocking stuffer I can think of is one of these little USB memory flash things that you just take this and put it in your computer. You can move files from computer to computer and store things. It looks like a floppy disk replacement. That's a great stocking stuffer for not that much money. Of course satellite radio is going to be really big this year. After the mullahs at the FCC are done with regular radio people are going to want to switch over to satellite so they can hear what they want to hear.

This is the Sirius module and there is also one from XM which is this one. You got to look at the programming to decide which one you want. Also I would like to make a point that many people still play records. Remember these things vinyl records?

KOPPEL: I've seen them before.

FREMER: Well, they're still around. Here's a new one. Is it Rolling, Bob? This is a band called Converge. A very heavy duty punk kind of hard core band, Willie Nelson. So you know for the people that have turn tables there is still records you should consider that.

KOPPLE: So go retro. You can pick them up at a flea market.

FREMER: Well those old records, but new ones you got to look for to buy. You can now get cell phones that take pictures like this Samsung that I have. There is also the harmony remote which people don't like having 30 remotes lying around. This one you go online and you download all the codes automatically and it is a function based. So you push a button to watch a DVD. All the controls will go where it has to go.

KOPPEL: Michael Fremer with Stereo style guy to home theater joining us from New York. Thank you Michael.

FREMER: Thank you.

KOPPEL: Entering a new phase in the Scott Peterson murder trial. As his lawyers prepare to save their client's life. Up next I'll talk with our own legal eagles about what we can expect from the penalty phase scheduled to begin in just days.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KOPPEL: Unless the California Supreme Court intervenes, the penalty phase of Scott Peterson's murder trial begins next week in Redwood City. Before the same jury that convicted him two weeks ago. But the trial judge and an appeals court have rejected defense motions to move the penalty phase out of Redwood City and to pick a new jury to decide Peterson's sentence.

Now the defense wants the state Supreme Court to hear those motions. The Peterson case is the focus of today's legal discussion. Joining us from Cleveland to discuss the case is civil rights attorney and law professor Avery Friedman. Mr. Friedman, what will the prosecution and the defense strategy be going into the sentencing phase?

AVERY FRIEDMAN, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Well, that assumes, of course Andrea that the Supreme Court will deny Mark Geragos relief and I think that's likely. So what we're looking to see starting on Tuesday will be the prosecution introducing evidence of the effect of the crime, the effect of the murder on family and others.

Among the evidence or part of the evidence, Andrea, will be forensic scientists who will testify about, among other things, the pain that Laci Peterson experienced in the death as well as the pain of the fetus. So this is going to be very, very dramatic, heart wrenching testimony. And what we're going to see from the defense will be efforts to minimize or mitigate that evidence by introducing, for example, testimony of Scott's parents who will say, in so many words, he's a good boy. He shouldn't be executed. KOPPEL: Now, Scott Peterson won't go and speak before the jury, isn't that correct?

FRIEDMAN: No.

KOPPEL: And explain why he can't do that.

FRIEDMAN: Well, he's not going to testify. The purpose of this penalty phase is for the jury to consider mitigation factors. The difficulty here is Scott has taken the position that he is innocent of the crimes. His appeal will essentially deal with his innocence and the error by Judge Al Dellucci at the trial level. As a result of it, there's no way that the jury is going to hear from Scott Peterson on the question of remorse. Scott can't say that he's remorseful because of course Andrea he's saying I didn't commit the crime.

KOPPEL: What about the type of sentence that the prosecution is likely to push for? Do we have any sense as to whether it's going to be life in prison or the death sentence?

FRIEDMAN: Well, I think the reality is that the district attorney here, Andrea, is looking for death penalty. The prosecution is trying to show is that this is a heinous crime. There are not factors that would warrant a life sentence and that death is appropriate here. On the other hand, Mark Geragos will advance factors which the jury will consider and whether or not death penalty will be appropriate.

But he's got a very, very tough task here, Andrea, because there is really very little evidence he can put in other than family who loves Scott and basically says he shouldn't die.

KOPPEL: Mr. Friedman, we've got our next guest who we thought might not make it, but I understand that Richard Herman, who is a criminal defense attorney --

RICHARD HERMAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Has finally shown up.

KOPPEL: Has finally shown up so we are going to give you a couple of minutes.

HERMAN: Holy smokes.

KOPPEL: I'm sure the traffic was terrible. Mr. Herman what do you want to tell us about the strategy that Scott Peterson's attorney is likely to take.

HERMAN: Well, Andrea, I'm sure Geragos has hired a mitigation team. These are teams composed of various experts in this particular area who he's working with to try to somehow help him persuade this jury not to give him the death penalty. But the bottom line is this, they will have a prison expert get up and testify for the defense. This person will tell this jury what prison life is like for Scott and what he has to look forward to and the fact that he's never getting out of prison. Now you know the Lee Boyd Malvo, the sniper case and the Terry Nichols Oklahoma bombing case. In all those cases the juries did not vote for the death penalty. That's all that Peterson can hope for, is that one juror, one juror holds out and, therefore, he does not get the death penalty.

FRIEDMAN: Not going to happen.

KOPPEL: But even if he were to get it Mr. Herman, isn't it true that in California people will be on death row perhaps for the rest of their lives, that the chances of there actually being executed are slim to none.

HERMAN: Andrea, that's 100 percent accurate. I think of the 600- some-odd cases in California where the juries came back to kill the particular defendants, I think only six or seven actually received execution. So I don't think that even if he gets the death penalty, there will be 20, 30 years of appeals. We probably won't ever see the day that Scott actually gets killed by the state.

KOPPEL: Mr. Friedman, because you showed up on time, I'll give you the last word.

HERMAN: He did this to me. He did this to me again.

FREIDMAN: It was difficult to create the roadblock, Andrea. Go ahead.

KOPPEL: I was just going to ask you if you have a closing thought or you know why trials have separate sentencing phases from the rest of the case.

FRIEDMAN: Here it is in a nutshell. The jury recoiled from some of the evidence. Watch what happens starting on Tuesday. They don't know what they're going to be experiencing. This will tear their hearts out. It will be heart rendering for the jury. My prediction is that they're going to render a death penalty verdict. It's not going to be life if prison. That's what's going to happen here in the Scott Peterson case.

HERMAN: Andrea, the rules of evidence don't apply. Hearsay is admissible. It is going to be devastating testimony next week.

FRIEDMAN: That's right.

KOPPEL: Richard Herman, criminal defense attorney, I understand it was a studio problem. I unfairly maligned you.

FRIEDMAN: No, it wasn't unfair. It was very appropriate.

HERMAN: It was sabotaged by Mr. Friedman again.

FRIEDMAN: That's exactly why. Wait till next week.

KOPPEL: Avery Friedman, thank you both.

HERMAN: Nice to see you, Andrea. Take care.

KOPPEL: A trekie takes his dedication to a cult classic to a whole new level. How one man's labor of love is getting "Star Trek" fans a whole new way to enjoy Captain Kirk and Spock.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KOPPEL: Boldly going where no actor has gone before? Well, no. But some "Star Trek" fans and fans of other films are taking their love of the show to another dimension. CNN's Sean Callebs explains now the latest craze known as fan films.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEAN CALLEBS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): For even the casual fan, it all looks familiar. The bridge, the star fleet uniforms.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Spock to enterprise.

CALLEBS: The ears. And it's coming to a Web site near you. Part of a growing phenomenon called Fan Films. The director and producer of "Star Trek New Voyagers" is Jack Marshall.

JACK MARSHALL, PRODUCER AND DIRECTOR: For some people that are involved in this, it is about their love for "Star Trek" and what it has meant for them since the '70s. For another part of the production team it is about the actual work of producing a film.

CALLEBS (on camera): Paramount owns the rights to the real "Star Trek." as long as the fan film doesn't try to make money off the effort the company says live long and prosper. Try and cash in and Paramount would level phasers set to kill.

CALLEBS (voice over): Marshall employs dozens of crew and actors. This second episode called "In Harm's Way" cost about $15,000 to make. James Collie portrays Captain Kirk. Marshall says you can look beyond the prominent pompadour because the actor brings something else to the table.

MARSHALL: James is a professional Elvis impersonator. And that's how we get the money to make the great sets and all the costumes and all that kind of stuff.

CALLEBS: It takes about 30 minutes or so to download the episode from the newvoyages.com Web site. Most of these folks have real jobs. Except Marshall, his wife Pearl is the family breadwinner. But they hope this obsession blossoms.

PEARL MARSHALL, CO-PRODUCER: He's getting experience, he's getting an education, he's getting exposure and hopefully that will lead to the next thing.

CALLEBS: In case you're wondering, the Marshall's say more than 10 million people have downloaded episode two. For 21-year-old Jeff Quinn, that's a lot of eyes watching his stoic Spock. JEFF QUINN, PLAYS MR. SPOCK CHARACTER: My families loving it. I have a few trekkie family members. So they're, of course, going nuts about it.

CALLEBS: Other fan films include a drama surrounding Robin, "Batman's Foil." "Star Wars," "Indiana Jones," the list goes on and on. All agree it's a ton of work. While Marshall waits for Hollywood to call he and his team are deep in production for their next "Star Trek" installment.

Sean Callebs, CNN, Denver.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOPPEL: There is much more ahead on CNN SATURDAY at the top of the hour it is "Next @ CNN" then at 4:00 Eastern "CNN Live Saturday."

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