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CNN SATURDAY MORNING NEWS

Death Toll Rising in Iraq After Car Bombing in Popular Shiite Market; Discovery Set To Liftoff Today; Cleaning Up After Northeast Floods; Mortgage Rates Going Up; Study Shows Drunk Test Subjects Did Better Than Drivers on Cell Phones

Aired July 1, 2006 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PIERS SELLERS, MISSION SPECIALIST: I'm looking forward to those few minutes off where I get to remember where I am or will be, which is floating in space around the planet. Just beautiful. But those are flashes. Those are flashes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Nice.

BETTY NGUYEN, CNN ANCHOR: Yes.

HARRIS: Nice.

NGUYEN: For those of us here on Earth, we just get to imagine it. He actually gets to see it and experience it.

HARRIS: Hey, Betty, look at that!

NGUYEN: Oh, yes.

HARRIS: A live picture there of the launch pad at the Kennedy Space Center. It looks pretty good.

NGUYEN: Oh, yes.

HARRIS: Huh? A nice little sunrise.

NGUYEN: The skies look pretty good so far.

HARRIS: Really.

NGUYEN: But we'll see how it goes today with the weather.

HARRIS: So here we are, less than nine hours to liftoff for Space Shuttle Discovery.

From the CNN Center in Atlanta, this is CNN SATURDAY MORNING.

And good morning, everyone.

NGUYEN: Yes!

HARRIS: I'm ...

(CROSSTALK)

NGUYEN: You were off for a little while, too. I mean it's not just me. You've got to take that vacation time.

HARRIS: Good to see you, lady.

NGUYEN: It was nice. I got a little rest and relaxation in.

Good morning, everybody.

I'm Betty Nguyen.

It is 7:00 a.m. at the Kennedy Space Center in Florida, where we are joined by our space guru himself...

HARRIS: Hey!

NGUYEN: ... Miles O'Brien.

HARRIS: Very nice.

NGUYEN: Good morning, Miles.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Well, thank you very much.

Guru -- I've been elevated to guru status.

HARRIS: That's good.

NGUYEN: You're the man.

O'BRIEN: Betty and Tony, good to see you.

Welcome back, Betty.

Hey, the weather is looking better here. Of course, would that they could launch right now. This would be 100 percent go. But now we're told it's only 40 percent no go. In other words, if you want to go half full. Sixty percent go for launch on the weather front.

We're going to tell you a lot more about that and we have a special guest all throughout the day here on CNN, Eileen Collins, commander of the last shuttle mission, the first female shuttle commander. She'll be here to take us through every step of the way as this crew of seven straps in, suits up, and we hope, at 3:49 p.m. Eastern time, heads to the International Space Station -- back to you guys.

HARRIS: Beautiful.

OK, Miles.

NGUYEN: We're watching.

HARRIS: We can't wait.

We can't wait.

Talk to you soon.

But first, let's get to some other headlines now in the news.

A terrible scene in Baghdad. Smoke, fire and carnage following a car bombing in a popular Shiite market. The death toll just keeps rising. It's at more than 60 now. More than 100 others are wounded.

Also today, gunmen kidnapped a Sunni member of Iraq's parliament, along with her guards.

NGUYEN: Another bin Laden audio message could be posted on the Internet very soon, the second in a matter of days. An Islamic Web site says bin Laden will address insurgents in Iraq and Somalia.

Now, on an audio message that surfaced yesterday, bin Laden praised slain Iraqi insurgent Abu Musab al-Zarqawi.

HARRIS: A rocket attack in Afghanistan has wounded seven coalition soldiers, five Americans and two Canadians. A military spokesman says insurgents fired two rockets at a base in Kandahar on Friday, wounding the soldiers and three contract workers.

NGUYEN: Following Israeli air strikes on Gaza this week, Egypt is sending a diplomat to try to end the latest deadlock between Israel and the Palestinians. Israel is refusing, though, militant demands to release 1,000 Arab prisoners. Those demands come from groups holding an Israeli soldier. Here's a picture of him. He was kidnapped on Sunday. And Israel is demanding his unconditional release.

HARRIS: It is off to the doctor today for Vice President Dick Cheney. Time for his annual physical. Doctors will check on aneurysms that were repaired on the backs of his knees and on the pacemaker Cheney received five years ago. After the tests, Cheney heads to Florida to join Miles -- to watch the shuttle launch.

NGUYEN: Take a look at these pictures. Billowing smoke, burned out cars, bodies just scattered everywhere. It has been another deadly day in Iraq. In Baghdad alone, a car bomb attack has killed more than 60 people.

CNN's Nic Robertson joining us from Baghdad with the latest -- Nic, what do you know?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Betty, the death toll now stands at 62 killed, 114 wounded. The police here say a car bomb went off in a crowded market. They say the car bomb was targeting a police patrol that was passing through the market.

At 10:00 in the morning, the market would have been incredibly crowded. It is almost inconceivable that this police patrol would not have been a sheer -- would not have been anything but a sheer police patrol. The market the bomb went off in the middle of a massive Shia suburb on the northeast side of Baghdad.

This was a bomb clearly targeting Shias. This has all the hallmarks of more sectarian killing. This is the biggest single death toll in a single attack in almost three months now and it comes right at a time when the government here is trying to build national reconciliation.

And, interestingly, within just a couple of hours of this attack on the Shia market, a Sunni politician was kidnapped, just a few miles away, as she made her way to a parliament session, a parliament meeting here in the center of Baghdad. She was traveling with eight guards in two vehicles. Gunmen came in from several different directions and kidnapped all of them -- Betty.

NGUYEN: Well, tell us a little more about that kidnapped Sunni member of the Iraqi parliament.

What kind of a role does she play?

ROBERTSON: Well, she is a member of what's widely seen as one of the more moderate Shia parties, the Iraqi Islamic Party. She is relatively young. She was born in 1973. She is a member of the Reconstruction Committee. She is not known for being particularly outspoken. She comes from Diyala Province, just northeast of Baghdad, which is a fairly mixed community.

Her party has been influential over the past year getting Sunnis to come out and vote. Very little more is known about why she was kidnapped. But her colleagues say that she had literally, quite literally just passed through about 500 yards beyond a police checkpoint. So the police would have just let her through and they very close to that police checkpoint, her colleagues are saying, that's when she was abducted by these armed gunmen.

It's not unusual to have high profile kidnappings, but it's an indication of how organized these gangs are becoming that they can operate in such numbers to cut off two vehicles with eight armed gunmen in them trying to protect this member of parliament -- Betty.

NGUYEN: What a day, with the kidnapping and the car bombings.

Nic Robertson, thank you for that report.

We will be checking in with you.

Also in Iraq, the U.S. military is Iraqi government yet another allegation American soldiers were involved in atrocities against Iraqi civilians. At least two soldiers are accused in the rape of an Iraqi woman. One of the soldiers is also accused of killing the woman and three family members, including a child.

The alleged incident happened last March in Mahmoudiya, which is south of Baghdad.

HARRIS: As you probably know, this is a big, big day for NASA. The crew of the Space Shuttle Discovery has already been up for almost two hours now. Fueling got underway about 90 minutes ago. If all goes well, the launch will take place less than nine hours from right now. And, of course, you can with it here live on CNN.

No journalist knows more about the shuttle program than our own Betty -- oh, I'm sorry.

NGUYEN: No. That would not be me.

HARRIS: You know a lot.

You know a lot. But of course...

NGUYEN: Nothing nearly as close to what Miles O'Brien knows.

HARRIS: Of course, I'm referring to Miles O'Brien.

He joins us this morning from the Kennedy Space Center to set the stage -- Miles, good morning to you.

O'BRIEN: Good morning to you.

It is a beautiful morning here at the Kennedy Space Center. But I should caution, it is Florida. It is the summertime. And by the time it is an optimal time to launch, which is to say, when the International Space Station is roughly overhead of where we sit right now, it will be 3:49 in the afternoon, which means, summertime Florida, thunderstorms. That is the big concern.

However, the revised forecast for this morning is much improved. Now saying a 60 percent chance the weather will permit a launch, as opposed to the opposite, 60 percent no go.

As you can hear in the background, there's a helicopter there circling the area. Security involved in this, of course. Any time in the post-9/11 world you have astronauts headed to a fueled up space shuttle, security is kind of tight.

I'm joined here by Eileen Collins, who is now a retired shuttle commander. She flew one year ago, the same space shuttle, Discovery. It was the return to flight mission.

She joins us now.

And, first of all, Eileen, I've got to get a sense from u. The crew is up. It's game day. You've been training for years, anticipating this moment.

Have they had a good night's sleep?

EILEEN COLLINS, FORMER SHUTTLE COMMANDER: Well, I can tell you, from my first point of view, we had a great night's sleep the night before. And the crew has got to be ready for either a launch or a scrub. You've got to have the mentality for both of those.

And I always woke up thinking, well, today we'll just plan for the worst case, the weather will be bad, we're probably going to scrub. But you're always still ready to go.

O'BRIEN: one of the things that they may or may not be thinking about this morning is foam. And I want to ask you about whether that's uppermost in people's minds.

But first, let's walk people through the foam issue.

Let's go back three-and-a-half years ago to Columbia, 80 some odd seconds after launch, a piece of foam about a pound-and-a-half in size falls off that external fuel tank, strikes the leading edge of the wing, causes that fatal breach in Columbia, leading to the loss of the crew and -- 16 days later.

You -- NASA spent two-and-a-half years trying to fix those problems and then you flew last summer on Discovery and lo and behold, another big piece of foam falls off.

First of all, that must have been a huge surprise to the to the crew when you found that out.

COLLINS: Well, you know, the crew can't see the foam during the launch. What happened was mission control sent us a message before we went to bed on flight day one that this foam event had happened, which was a huge surprise to us.

But really the crew, we're not thinking about the foam. We're thinking about the mission. You know, we're geared up for open the payload bay doors, get the inspection started, get the cockpit set up for the mission. So we're very focused on what we're doing.

Of course, the foam is very important to the program. It's important to our safety. So it is there and it's something that I would have to say when we did our media events on orbit, it was pretty much all that the media wanted to talk about.

O'BRIEN: Well, it seems like we are focusing a lot on that. But there has been a raging debate inside the engineering community inside NASA about some pieces of foam that remain on the fuel tank, which are considered susceptible to fall off. And some engineers, the chief engineer, the chief safety officer for the program said we're no go for launch because we could lose the vehicle, not the crew, the vehicle.

The administrator has said let's go ahead.

Is it surprising to you that there is that huge kind of debate and, really, in a way, it's become very public?

COLLINS: Well, we need to keep in mind that there's very much that is unknown. We're flying this mission as a test mission because that will give us more information on how this foam actually -- it works. And we've made a huge change to -- we've removed part of the external tank.

So do we want to go ahead and make another major change? Let's fly with this one major change of removing the PAL ramp and all the PAL foam and let's see how that works.

We are concerned about the ice-frost ramps. So this is something that we're going to be looking at today. In fact, it's probably the, I would say, the biggest change we've ever made to the external tank in the history of the program.

O'BRIEN: Thirty-two pounds of foam taken off, the piece of foam that actually fell off on your flight. I guess the question that a lot of people have on their minds is it has the sense of being a make or break mission.

If, in fact, something big falls off that tank, what does that mean for the program?

COLLINS: Well, it really depends on what -- where it comes from, does it hit anything? If the foam falls off and does not hit the orbiter, then we're in great shape to continue the mission. But the program itself is going to have to fix whatever happens. We're not going to keep flying if we're having large pieces of foam.

Now, keep in mind, small pieces of foam will fall off. We've got cameras stationed at various places on the boosters, on the external tank and on the shuttle to look for these kinds of events. So we're going to know if they happen.

O'BRIEN: Eileen Collins.

You're going to be with us all day.

We're privileged to have you with us, have your insight and your commentary for us.

This will be the most photographed shuttle mission ever, even beyond what happened a year ago with Eileen. They've added high definition cameras, .35 millimeter cameras.

And on top of everything else, Tony and Betty, they have a concern here about birds. Eileen's space shuttle struck a six pound turkey buzzard, a vulture, right at the top of the external fuel tank. They have a special radar system in place. They'll hold the launch if they see a flock of birds approaching Discovery.

They've got worries, don't they?

HARRIS: Yes, they really do.

Wow! Miles, that's great. That's great information.

And our thanks to Eileen, as well.

Man, great stuff.

All right, we want to remind you of a couple of things.

First of all, you see the clock there, the lower right hand portion of your screen. Can we throw it back up there for a sec?

All right, we will in a second.

It's our countdown to launch clock. You can take a look at that and watch it right along with us, as we get ready to launch Discovery.

We also have an e-mail question, as you can see there, that we want u to consider. And then do more than consider it, give us some responses -- do you think NASA is rushing to launch the shuttle?

Send us your thoughts, weekends@CNN.com, and we will read some of your responses throughout the morning.

And stay with CNN all day long for coverage of the space shuttle launch.

There's the clock.

NGUYEN: There's the countdown.

HARRIS: Yes.

NGUYEN: 8:35:52 and counting.

HARRIS: Thank you, D.

The space shuttle launch -- it's leading up to a 3:00 p.m. special, all of our coverage is today -- hosted by our space correspondent, Miles O'Brien.

NGUYEN: Well, you know, Miles said something that was really interesting to me, and we noted this yesterday. They were saying a 60 percent chance that it's not going to happen.

HARRIS: Yes.

NGUYEN: But Miles just said now it's a 60 percent chance that the shuttle launch will happen.

Reynolds Wolf joins us to sort this out -- what's happened in the past 24 hours?

It totally flipped on us -- Reynolds.

(WEATHER REPORT)

NGUYEN: Well, cleaning up after the storm -- Northeast residents, they began to pick up the pieces after a week of just major flooding. Up next, we are live in Trenton, New Jersey.

HARRIS: And as Reynolds just mentioned, weather may -- may cause a problem for the launch of Discovery today. But they also think it's not just clouds looming over this mission. Ahead, we will speak -- man, Miles has got this covered today, doesn't he?

NGUYEN: He's got the good stuff.

HARRIS: Miles will talk to NASA's administrator, Michael Griffin, about this controversial launch.

We'll be right back.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK KELLY, DISCOVERY ASTRONAUT: I knew it was a risk on my first flight. You know, I knew who -- you know, I know there are risks involved now. The difference for me personally is, you know, seven of my friends, you know, died on Columbia not too long ago. So it's a little bit more -- a little bit more real, I think.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NGUYEN: Well, water levels, they are receding in the Northeast this morning, which is good news, following a widespread issue of flooding in those areas. Three days of heavy rain triggered floods blamed in at least 18 deaths.

Cleanup is underway in Trenton, New Jersey, one of several cities just swamped by these high waters.

And Jason Carroll has the latest from Trenton.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Jeffrey McKeen (ph) hasn't slept for days.

JEFFREY MCKEEN: I'm exhausted. I was up until 12:00 o'clock last night trying to stay ahead of it and it just kept coming up in the basement.

CARROLL (on camera): So this is your pump here, right?

MCKEEN: Yes.

CARROLL: Your ...

MCKEEN: But it was all the way up to the wall in the back.

CARROLL (voice-over): For the past 30 years, McKeen has lived in a section of Trenton, New Jersey called Glenafton, a section where dozens of homes are still waterlogged from the swollen Delaware River. More than 1,000 people were told to evacuate the area. McKeen stayed.

MCKEEN: Yes, I've been pumping steady for about three hours.

CARROLL: This isn't the first flood McKeen has been through. So this time he knew where the water would go and what it would do.

MCKEEN: It was up to the top step. You see where the gray step is right here?

CARROLL (on camera): Um-hmm.

MCKEEN: And then it was all the way up to the ceiling.

I'm a teacher and I'm moving into a new school. And I had to put, you know, all my stuff. These are all my tools from the basement.

Well, it's devastating. It's emotionally wrenching. I collapsed twice yesterday. I couldn't go any farther. I just had to lay down and breathe.

CARROLL (voice-over): McKeen is one of a handful of people who didn't leave. Emergency crews say those who did evacuate are now anxious for any word on how their homes fared.

STEVEN BARYLA, CEDAR BRIDGE MILITARY ACADEMY: I guess the toughest part about this is when you get out of the area and the residents want to know from you what does my home look like? And they're giving you house numbers. Are my cats alive? You know, and you have to be compassionate.

CARROLL: Steven Baryla took us on a tour of the neighborhood. He's an instructor at a military academy who volunteered when the floodwaters started rising.

(on camera): How high is the water here at this point?

BARYLA: We're probably at about three-and-a-half feet.

CARROLL (voice-over): Baryla helped emergency crews by offering the use of his military vehicle, an M35-A2. It can be driven submerged in water.

BARYLA: Every 15 minutes or so, we're bringing officers in with the officials to see how the water is going down. We're measuring levels on the vehicle.

CARROLL: Baryla helped not only emergency crews, but wary homeowners like Jeffrey McKeen.

MCKEEN: You have a nice day, sir.

BARYLA: All right. Stay well.

CARROLL: For McKeen, staying well could be challenging. He's only been working on the cleanup for a few days, but says it will easily take months to get the job done.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CARROLL: But with each passing hour, things are looking better and better. For example, this area that I'm standing in was flooded yesterday. Today, it is mostly dry. And we're also told that this morning that area in Glenafton that we were showing you in that story there, Betty, the water has receded there, as well.

So the folks who live there are now going to be able to get the opportunity to be able to get in, to be able to get in and begin the process of cleaning up -- Betty.

NGUYEN: Yes, they're probably not going to like what they see, though, Jason.

HARRIS: Ew, yes.

NGUYEN: But thanks so much for bringing it to us.

We appreciate your report this morning.

Thank you.

HARRIS: Still ahead, the clock is ticking as we await the return to space. But some critics say it's too soon.

Well, in about 13 minutes, we'll speak to NASA's administrator about the risks involved.

NGUYEN: Plus, the housing market -- hot or not? Which cities are doing well and which ones are just cooling off?

We have some tips if you are trying to sell.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: Well, we've heard the question over and over again -- has the housing market bubble burst?

Well, we're seeing signs of stagnant home sales in some cities. And now, the 17th consecutive increase in the key interest rate in two years.

It's not like anyone was surprised. The hike was expected. But here's what might shock and awe u. In 2003, you could get a 30-year fixed mortgage at five-and-a-half, maybe six percent. Right now, the same term will cost you no less than six-and-a-half percent. Also, in 2003, a $30,000 hell was about six percent. Now you're looking at paying that back at eight percent or more.

Clyde Anderson is here, a mortgage consultant and the author of "What Happened Was..."

Clyde, good to see you.

CLYDE ANDERSON, MORTGAGE CONSULTANT: Good to see you, too.

HARRIS: Hey, what is your -- wait a minute. What is going on here? Why so many rate increases? What, 17 in a row over the past two years? What is going on here?

ANDERSON: It's been a correction that needed to take place in that time. HARRIS: That needed to take...

ANDERSON: I think it needed...

HARRIS: What are you talking about that needed to take...

ANDERSON: It needed -- the economy was at a point where we had to kind of slow it. And they were doing good things. Now, I think 17 may be a little excessive.

HARRIS: Yes.

ANDERSON: But I think it's kind of steady now. And hopefully in August we won't see another increase.

HARRIS: Well, what are you predicting?

ANDERSON: I'm predicting it's going to kind of steady. Our rates are going to continue to rise. But it is going to be a little bit, you know, it's a little steadier. It's not going to rise as rapidly.

HARRIS: OK.

So what's your advice now? Look, I'm trying to -- I've got a young family here, my wife. We're just starting out. We're going to get into the housing market, first time buyers.

What's your advice right now?

ANDERSON: Right now? I mean it's still a good time to buy. You know, rates are still good comparatively speaking, you know? I never...

HARRIS: Compared to what?

ANDERSON: If you compare it to...

HARRIS: All time highs? Of course.

ANDERSON: Well, yes.

HARRIS: Yes.

ANDERSON: Or, say even maybe 10 years ago, five years ago even. You know, rates are still pretty good. You think about it, I never thought I'd be excited to see gas for $2.70.

HARRIS: Yes. Yes, yes, yes.

ANDERSON: You know, I'm looking for that now, you know?

HARRIS: Right, right, right.

ANDERSON: So it's a mind set, too. Rates are still pretty good. They're on the rise. So it's still a good time to buy and it really depends on the market that you're in, too.

HARRIS: Well, we're not seeing -- I guess the framework for that is that we're not seeing double digit numbers.

ANDERSON: Exactly. Exactly.

HARRIS: So compared to that, that's...

ANDERSON: Exactly. Correct.

HARRIS: ... maybe that's the way we should think about it.

ANDERSON: Exactly.

HARRIS: You know what? Quickly, I want to see some of these markets.

Deirdre, let's put up markets that are -- I guess we don't want to talk about it in terms of hot markets and cool markets.

ANDERSON: Correct.

HARRIS: But maybe appreciating markets. And here is what we have in terms of appreciating markets where you can still get some money on your house if you're trying to sell right now.

ANDERSON: Yes.

HARRIS: We're talking about Phoenix, Orlando, Fort Lauderdale and Miami.

And why -- what's the reason behind this?

Why are these markets still performing well, in your opinion?

ANDERSON: I think these markets have been strong for a long time. It's a lot of things that are attracting people to these areas. You know, in Phoenix, for example, the housing market has been hot for a while. Houses have appreciated rapidly there, but they're still selling. The difference is that, you know, when you look at it, houses were selling or sitting on the market for seven days at one point in Phoenix.

HARRIS: Wow!

ANDERSON: Now it's taking 60 days, which in a lot of markets they wish they could sell in 60 days, you know...

HARRIS: Yes, yes.

ANDERSON: ... when they're sitting on the market a lot longer.

HARRIS: OK.

Well, now, let me ask you something. If we're looking at these rates, 17 rate increases over the last two years, as we mentioned just a moment ago.

ANDERSON: Right.

HARRIS: If I have one of these, what we were calling sort of gimmicky loans at the time and you got 100 percent financing and we're going throw in a variable rate, an adjustable rate thing on it.

ANDERSON: Yes?

HARRIS: What am I looking at now down the road if I'm looking to refinance that?

ANDERSON: It's going to be a problem if you're looking to refinance down the road, because what you're going to see happening soon in some of these markets, sellers are going to have to kind of wake up a little bit and come down on their prices. If they're really looking to sell, you want to put a house on the market, you're going to have to come down.

So a lot of people are going to depreciate in their property.

HARRIS: Yes.

ANDERSON: So they're going to experience this. And when the houses start to depreciate, that's something we haven't seen in a while.

HARRIS: Right.

ANDERSON: When they start to depreciate, you are now almost upside down in your home, because you financed it, you know, to the hilt, where you're 100 percent.

HARRIS: Yes. Which gets us -- this whole notion of depreciation gets us to the markets where there is some depreciation going on. We're looking at San Diego -- take a look at that -- San Diego, Boston, Providence and Cambridge.

And what is happening here? These homes are just sitting on the market longer. And what's behind that in these markets, do you think?

ANDERSON: Well, I think that's something you kind of begin to look toward at the beginning was the rates. Rates, for one. Rates are going up. But incomes are not increasing at the same level that I think the rates are going up.

HARRIS: Yes.

ANDERSON: So it's almost pricing some people out of the market in the way that the housing have appreciated over the last five years.

HARRIS: Yes.

ANDERSON: You know, it's pricing some people totally out of the market. You're seeing a lot of first time buyers still going into it, but you're not seeing as many move up buyers. HARRIS: How about this? If you're going into the market right now, higher interest rates actually help you a bit because it makes you make a more responsible decision about what you can afford.

ANDERSON: That's true.

HARRIS: Does that make sense?

ANDERSON: That's true. That's true. I mean I think it's so smart right now to go in and get a 30-year fixed, lock it in and get it secured so you know...

HARRIS: Some money down?

ANDERSON: Some money down, build some equity in there. And so...

HARRIS: 80-20?

ANDERSON: I'm not really fond of the 80-20 right now. And it depends on how you use it, you know? In the past five years, yes, I thought 80-20 was great, you know?

HARRIS: Right.

ANDERSON: But now I think, you know, there's other options. If you can put some money down, put some money down.

HARRIS: Right.

ANDERSON: But if you are going to go the 80-20 route, be smart about it. Know how long you're going to be in the house and know that you have some time to build equity into the house.

HARRIS: That's great.

ANDERSON: So it's not just hoping that we have some appreciation.

HARRIS: I'm done.

I'm done.

That's good stuff.

Clyde, appreciate it.

Thanks for coming in.

ANDERSON: Oh, it's a pleasure.

HARRIS: We appreciate it -- Betty.

NGUYEN: That is good stuff.

Here's a question for you, though. Safe to fly? Some say it isn't, but Space Shuttle Discovery is less -- here's the countdown, you see it on your screen -- less than nine hours away from launching. Ahead, our space correspondent, Miles O'Brien, speaks to NASA's administrator about the controversial launch.

HARRIS: And which would you guess is worse -- driving while intoxicated or driving while talking on the phone?

You may be shocked to hear what some researchers found.

We'll be right back.

(WEATHER REPORT)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NGUYEN: Well, no need to tell you the stakes are high as we watch as the countdown continues to the shuttle launching. 8:14 and counting. Space Shuttle Discovery prepares for liftoff in a little more than eight hours, as I just mentioned.

This mission carries not only the weight of crew and cargo, but possibly the program's future. Now, that's a lot of weight.

Last month, NASA's top safety and engineering officers recommended against a launch until further changes were made to the external fuel tank.

Well, they were overruled the NASA Administrator Michael Griffin and he joins us live with our very own Miles O'Brien at the Kennedy Space Center in Florida.

This is so interesting -- Miles, break it down for us.

O'BRIEN: You know what, Betty, this is a fascinating scenario to watch.

First of all, if you look at that live picture of Launch Pad 39B, it's a beautiful morning here. Unfortunately, the Discovery has to wait until the Space Station is right overhead in order to launch. And at that time, the afternoon buildup of clouds might be a problem.

But as we are told, the weather forecast is on the improving side. Shuttle -- excuse me -- NASA Administrator Michael Griffin has a job that is a lonely job, at times. Signing on the dotted line, so to speak, to launch space shuttles is never an easy job. This one has been a particularly difficult period of time with the debate that has occurred over that falling foam.

Here's our boss -- he's joining us now and -- the boss is, this morning.

How nervous are you this morning?

MICHAEL GRIFFIN, NASA ADMINISTRATOR: Not nervous at all, Miles.

I think we made the right technical decision. Flying the shuttle is risky and will always be so. But we weighed the -- weighed the odds, weighed the risks on this mission due to foam and other issues, and frankly we think it's going to be a very clean vehicle.

O'BRIEN: Your chief engineer, your chief safety officer saying they're no go, concerned about the potential loss of the vehicle and the so-called programmatic risks. We're not talking about risks to the crew here. We're talking about the possibility that you might lose a vehicle.

Why not wait, if there is that kind of concern?

GRIFFIN: Well, because if we wait, then we're -- however long it takes to redesign the ice-frost ramps, it will put us out of business for this year because we need some daylight launch opportunities in order to verify how well the fixes we've already done to the tank are doing or any new fixes that we would do.

We can't daylight -- we can't get daylight through main engine cutoff and tank jettison except in the spring, summer and early fall. So if we delay past that, we lose our optimum time and we are down for the better part of a year.

That imposes quite a measure of programmatic risk.

So in my mind, I'm weighing one kind of programmatic risk versus another.

Then when I look at the fact that I think the modeling on the foam debris is very conservative, as it should be, I think our actual odds of sustaining any damage to the orbiter are very minimal.

O'BRIEN: Last Sunday, the "New York Times" had an editorial that was critical of the agency and its decision right now. Let's -- I want to share with people just a little bit of it.

They said: "Mr. Griffin has fallen into the old trap of sacrificing safety to meet his launching schedule, precisely the kind of tradeoff that has been blamed for the loss of two shuttles in the past," referring, of course, to Challenger and Columbia.

Are you in a schedule trap? Are you trying to meet a manifest and thus, perhaps, cutting corners?

GRIFFIN: I would profoundly disagree with that. The "New York Times" does not have it right. We have not fallen into a trap. Every single space flight that this country or any country has ever done has to weigh performance risk against safety risk against cost risk. And that's what we're doing here.

Schedule matters. It can't -- it can't dominate, it can't rule the roost, but schedule matters. And we're paying appropriate attention to that, as well as we are to the hazards to our crew.

O'BRIEN: All right, the rock meets the hard place, though, when NASA is instructed to retire the shuttle by the end of 2010 and still, to some degree finish the International Space Station, some 16 flights.

Wouldn't it be better if you picked one or the other there -- either forget about the Space Station or, say, fly the 16 flights when they're safe to fly?

GRIFFIN: Well, we have a national commitment to finish the Space Station, not all costs, but if we can finish it, we want to do that. And in order to plan and budget our program properly, we need to know in what year we're going to finish flying the shuttle. Otherwise, we are talking about plus or minus $4.5 billion or $5 billion on a decision as to whether or not to fly the shuttle system that year. That's a pretty big planning bump.

So I think it was entirely reasonable and entirely prepare for the administration to pick a date, in this case 2010, that we would retire the shuttle. And that's what we'll do.

All we have to do to finish the Space Station within that amount of time is to fly at our normal, average, customary flight rate over 25 years. To do that, we need to get back started flying and that's what we're here today to do.

O'BRIEN: Is this make or break today, in many respects?

GRIFFIN: Every single shuttle flight we do from now until the end of the program will be make or break. No difference today, no difference next year, no difference the year after that. Every flight has got to go well.

O'BRIEN: Mike Griffin, NASA administrator, thank you for your time.

The countdown continues. So far, no huge technical concerns. The weather is actually looking better. We hope to see a launch, 3:49 p.m. Eastern time -- Betty.

NGUYEN: But it's make or break.

HARRIS: Yes.

NGUYEN: All right, Miles, we will be watching.

Thank you for that.

HARRIS: And let's go to Reynolds Wolf now upstairs in the CNN Weather Center.

And let's look at that beautiful shot again.

(WEATHER REPORT)

NGUYEN: And the countdown will continue, folks. If you're watching at home, we've got a little over eight hours to go before Discovery heads off into space, if all goes well.

You want to stay with us all morning long as we do continue our coverage of the Space Shuttle Discovery's launch.

At 9:00 a.m. we're going to speak with former astronaut Mike Mullane.

And at 3:00 p.m. Eastern, a special live show hosted by space correspondent Miles O'Brien. Who else?

And we want to talk about, actually, talking and driving. Is it bad or as bad as drinking and driving?

HARRIS: That's a good question.

NGUYEN: Ahead, a new study offers disturbing findings about using a cell phone while behind the wheel.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(WEATHER REPORT)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NGUYEN: All right, we want to check other top stories.

A car bomb went off in a crowded market in Baghdad almost six hours ago this morning. Here are some pictures from that. Iraqi police say more than 60 people are dead, dozens wounded. The attack took place in a Shia neighborhood in Sadr City.

An Arab language Internet site says it will soon post a new audio message from al Qaeda Osama bin Laden. The last such announcement was made Wednesday and bin Laden's message was posted about 29 hours later. When it happens, we will definitely bring it to you live.

And all systems are still go for today's scheduled launch of Shuttle Discovery. As always, the weather in Florida at liftoff, well, it remains uncertain, but not as bad as it was yesterday.

HARRIS: Yes.

NGUYEN: Now, it's looking like a 40 percent chance that this shuttle will head off into space. CNN will bring you live coverage of the launch, beginning at 3:00 Eastern.

HARRIS: Betty, now pay attention here.

NGUYEN: OK. I know. You just scolded me about driving while typing on the Blackberry. I know.

HARRIS: This one...

NGUYEN: I know.

HARRIS: This one here is insane here, because you...

NGUYEN: It's the CrackBerry. That's why they call it the CrackBerry. HARRIS: Did you just hear that? She drives...

NGUYEN: I'm addicted. I know. Stop -- OK, I'm going to stop.

HARRIS: All right. Thank you.

Researchers are trying to prove that driving while yapping on the cell phone is really a dangerous, even fatal, distraction. It seems to make common sense.

The people in this piece you are about to see were put through a driving simulator -- some legally drunk, others on the phone. You'll be surprised by the results.

CNN's Tom Foreman has more in a report filed for "THE SITUATION ROOM."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In their study of 40 drivers taking 160 trips in a driving simulator, researchers at the University of Utah expected a few fender benders. What they did not expect was that legally drunk -- yes, drunk -- test subjects would do better than drivers on cell phones.

FRANK DREWS, UNIVERSITY OF UTAH: I think that is a fair statement. I mean what we found is a significant increase in accident rates when driving and conversing on a cell phone. And we didn't find this increase in our study when people were legally drunk.

FOREMAN: Professor Drews demonstrated what he found. We conducted half our interview by cell phone while he was in the simulator.

DREWS: Hello?

FOREMAN: And just like his...

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: Oh!

NGUYEN: Oh, see? You can't even play a tape.

HARRIS: Well, here's the thing -- stop doing what you're doing.

NGUYEN: I know. I know. And stop talking on the phone while you're driving. Apparently it's a problem. We can't even get the tape to roll on it. I don't know if they're -- they're talking on the phone back there in the control room...

HARRIS: But there is a connection.

NGUYEN: Apparently something's going on.

But we'll try to get that story a little bit later today. HARRIS: Oh, yes.

NGUYEN: just ahead on CNN SATURDAY MORNING, John and George are gone, but Paul McCartney and Yoko Ono are feeling the love.

HARRIS: It's The Beatles Vegas style coming up in "The Water Cooler."

Don't move.

You're watching CNN SATURDAY MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: That's the...

NGUYEN: That's Tony's favorite sound.

You hate that, don't you?

HARRIS: Just -- it just sounds wrong.

NGUYEN: Blup, blup.

All right, time for "The Water Cooler," when we take a little break to tell you about some of the more unusual stories in the news.

HARRIS: Should we get started?

NGUYEN: let's do it.

HARRIS: First up, don't mess with Texas. Oh, boy.

NGUYEN: Well, we know that, right? Hello?

HARRIS: Especially the librarian in Baytown. You see her back here? Seriously, a young mother in Baytown was recently arrested for failing to return a library book.

NGUYEN: Arrested?

HARRIS: Arrested. Well, it's a library book and those things have to be returned...

NGUYEN: But, yes, but...

HARRIS: ... in a timely fashion.

NGUYEN: But arrested?

HARRIS: The overdue fine was already up to $118, Betty.

That's an outrage.

NGUYEN: Ah.

HARRIS: So...

NGUYEN: Yes, I wonder how long she had that book.

HARRIS: That's how large the fine was by the time she was booked.

NGUYEN: Oh, you guys are so witty. All right.

Check out this video, would you? It was shot recently in Iran and supposedly it shows the petrified remains of a large ancient ship. The guy who found it is a biblical archeologist who went to Iran to search for Noah's Ark.

HARRIS: Hmmm.

NGUYEN: And some people think, well, this could be it. Though skeptics aren't convinced. For one thing, it takes millions of years for wood...

HARRIS: There you go.

NGUYEN: ... to turn to stone.

HARRIS: There you go.

NGUYEN: So -- you think if he's an archeologist, he would know this, right?

HARRIS: You would think so.

NGUYEN: Right.

HARRIS: Shopping for new appliances, are you? Clean freaks now have a silver bullet to kill germs, literally. The precious metal silver is emerging as the next big thing in appliances such as washing machines, refrigerators.

NGUYEN: Really? Why?

HARRIS: Well, that's -- thank you for the question, Betty.

That's because silver is awesome, apparently, at killing bacteria.

Who knew?

NGUYEN: Ah!

HARRIS: The problem is it may actually be too good. Environmentalists fear the silver ions may eventually get into the ground water and wipe out fishes and other aquatic creatures.

NGUYEN: So much for that silver lining.

HARRIS: Well, there you go.

NGUYEN: Ah, ha, ha.

HARRIS: Nice.

NGUYEN: We're so full of them.

And, finally, Sir Paul McCartney and Yoko Ono were among the celebrities on hand for last night's premier of "Love," the new Cirque du Soleil show, in Las Vegas, of all places. It's billed as a fantasy extravaganza set to the music of The Beatles. See, if you were asking why were they there, that's why.

The show takes over the theater formerly used by Siegfried and Roy.

HARRIS: OK, if you'd like to learn more about these stories, go to CNN.com. Join us each and every week at this time for more strange...

NGUYEN: Right here.

No coffee, as usual.

HARRIS: ... news from "The Water Cooler."

Let's get you upstairs now.

Reynolds Wolf is checking the travel forecast if you're trying to get out of town...

NGUYEN: And a lot of people are.

HARRIS: ... get to your families on this Independence Day weekend.

NGUYEN: Unlike us...

WOLF: Absolutely.

HARRIS: Yes, yes. We're not...

NGUYEN: ... who are stuck here -- but, Reynolds, for those who get to go home and visit their families, how is it going out there?

(WEATHER REPORT)

NGUYEN: Something that you don't want to wait for the DVD of is the shuttle launch today. This is something you've got to watch live. There's the countdown right there at the bottom of your screen, seven hours and 53 minutes until blastoff.

HARRIS: Very good.

NGUYEN: Of course, we're going to be watching it every step of the way.

We've got our Miles O'Brien out there and we'll be talking to... HARRIS: Are we going to talk to him next hour?

NGUYEN: We're going to talk to him next -- actually, throughout the morning.

HARRIS: Good.

NGUYEN: Here's a look -- isn't that just an awesome picture?

HARRIS: That's a great picture. It really is.

NGUYEN: It is always just one of those that you want to step back and take a good look at. And today that launch is scheduled in less than eight hours from now. And we'll be watching.

HARRIS: True.

NGUYEN: The next hour of CNN SATURDAY MORNING begins in just a moment.

HARRIS: But first, Gerri Willis has your Tip of the Day.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GERRI WILLIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Folks across America are celebrating the 4th of July this weekend. That means plenty of outdoor activities and an increased risk of sunburn.

Most sun-damage is done before the age of 18 and the risk of cancer grows with every burn. Your best defense is to follow the ABCs of the American Academy of Dermatology. Stay away or indoors between 10:00 a.m. and 3:00 p.m. Block the sun's rays using an SPF 15 or higher sunscreen. Use one ounce over your entire body -- that's about a shot glass worth -- every two hours. And remember, cover up using protective clothing. The average T-shirt only gives you the protective equivalent of SPF 5 sunscreen.

(on camera): And that's your Tip of the Day.

Make sure you join us for "OPEN HOUSE" every Saturday morning, 9:30 a.m. Eastern, right here on CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

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