Return to Transcripts main page
ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES
Skin Cancer Removed from First Lady; Remembering Kelly James; Missing American Climbers in China; War in Iraq: A Living Hell; Exodus of Flock; Gay and Christian; Serial Killer Suspect
Aired December 18, 2006 - 23:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT: ...surgical procedure, that it was no big deal, that she discovered it early and had it treated early.
Now the reason that this is coming to light this evening is because the first lady was attending a Hanukkah party this evening and another reporter noticed that bandage on her leg, the right leg of her shin, and again, asked about this.
This was something that had developed and that is when the first lady's office decided they would disclose this information, that she had this procedure that they were not concerned about any reoccurring episodes of this, but they decided that they would share this information with the press this evening.
And as you know, of course, Anderson, this is not the first time that the Bush family has been confronted with these type of episodes of skin cancer.
It was President Bush who had four lesions that were removed from his face, precancerous, that ended up being just fine. And the president's father as well, skin cancer removed.
But all is well at the first lady's office and the White House saying that they are not concerned about any reoccurring episodes of this, that it was handled very quickly and that they disclosed it this evening -- Anderson.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Obviously any time any time any member of the first family has some sort of a medical problem, it's an opportunity to learn about medical conditions. People pay attention to things they don't otherwise pay attention to.
Joining us on the phone is 360 M.D. Dr. Sanjay Gupta.
Sanjay, what is this? How common is it?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (on the phone): There are three types of skin cancer. Skin cancer is a very common form of cancer. That's because the skin is actually the largest organ in the body.
Three types are the basal cell carcinoma, which is the type that President Bush's father, President H.W. Bush had removed in late '86. The president, himself, had four lesions. As Suzanne mentioned, none of them were any type of skin cancer. But basal cell is the most common.
Squamous cell is the next most common. And then after that, Melanoma. Squamous cell sort of falls right in the middle in lots of different ways. It's the second most common, but it's also the second most dangerous.
Melanoma is by far and away the most dangerous. Squamous cell after that, and then the basal cell. Most times, the squamous cell carcinoma, which is commonly the biggest risk factor of sun exposure, can just be removed as Suzanne just described, and it is done. Nothing else to really worry about that much.
In very rare situations, three or four times out of 100, it can actually spread to some extent, spread to some of the lymph nodes in the area.
It oftentimes is just a sore that doesn't seem to go away, it's sort of an ulcer on the skin. Sometimes people get it looked at because it is unsightly, but ultimately it is found out to be this type of skin cancer.
But again, besides getting skin checked and being at a higher risk for developing skin cancer in the future, usually this is all she'll really have to deal with as far as this goes.
COOPER: Sanjay, Suzanne was saying a malignant tumor was removed through surgery. You know, when I think of a tumor, I think of sort of this big object. Obviously, if it's on the shin, it can't be that large?
GUPTA: Yes, and sometimes it can just almost be patchy, sort of scaly skin. It can be just something that's a little bit of a bump on the skin. It doesn't actually have to be a -- I guess what most people think, and as far as a tumor goes, it is -- all a tumor means is an unusual growth of cells. Because the skin overturns cells so quickly, we are constantly losing and regenerating skin cells, it's sort of a setup for cancer.
One of those cell's productions goes wrong, you can develop a cancer. And sometimes, as you know, Anderson, sunlight can actually cause one of those little changes in the machinery of the cells. And that's what happened specifically.
Squamous cell is about one in 10,000, but it's one of those things where if it is treated early, it is taken care of.
COOPER: Basal cell cancer can go quite deep. My mom had some on her face, and I mean, it can cut quite deep. Can squamous cell go as deep or it deeper?
GUPTA: Well, you know, it's interesting so -- these are all names, squamous cell, basal cell and melanoma, based on where they are located in the epidermis, which is the outer layer of the skin.
Squamous cell is the outermost layer. They're the sort of cells that you can just feel by touching your skin right now are squamous cells. And those are the ones that went awry in the first lady's case.
Below that, as it sounds like in your mom's case, basal cell carcinoma can arise. And below that is where you get the melanocytes that give your skin color or not color. And those are -- can cause the melanoma.
And so, you're right, as the basal cells would be deeper, this is very much -- the squamous cell, as in the case of the first lady -- is very much on the surface of the skin and is very noticeable. You know, these are how most people sort of present. They just see something that doesn't look quite right, looks a little unusual and they decide to get it looked at. And squamous cell might be the diagnosis and basal cell could be the diagnosis as well.
COOPER: You get it taken off and then what? Just recheck it every now and then or check other parts of your body for anything that might have spread?
GUPTA: Yes. You -- exactly. You have to check that area for sure. Basal cell, if it's going to recur, typically recurs in the exact same place.
Squamous cell can be a little bit more dangerous because not only (UNINTELLIGIBLE) in the same place again, it could actually spread. They call it metastasize in other places in the body. Very rare, but it can happen, which puts it in a slightly more dangerous category.
Melanoma, as most people know, certainly can spread and it can invade quite deep through the skin as well.
In her case, she needs to get the skin checked for sure, both because she had the skin cancer, and also because anybody who has ever had any kind of skin cancer, any of the three, are about 40 percent more likely to develop future skin cancers as well. They really just need to be a little bit more vigilant as far as that goes.
COOPER: And Suzanne, just to remind our viewers, this was something that the first lady and her physicians and family obviously knew about back in November. That's when the surgery actually took place, is that correct?
MALVEAUX: And that's right. And the press secretary of the first lady says it's something that she kept private because it was a private matter, and that she was feeling fine. I wanted to add as well, the melanoma, the patch that Sanjay Gupta was talking about, her press secretary saying that it was about the size of a nickel or so that was on the back of her right shin. It was removed under a local anesthetic. And that this is something where she said she recovered fine and that she was able to continue with her schedule.
They even bring up the fact that she was traveling with her husband during that month to Singapore, to Vietnam, that this was something they felt that was a legitimate, private matter of the first lady. And that she had recovered well, and that there was not a need to disclose it, but because reporters did notice something that was somewhat suspicious and asked about it this evening, following up from what they saw about a month ago, that band-aid, they decided to disclose it this evening.
(END BREAKING NEWS)
COOPER: All right. People, get checked. If you have something you think looks suspicious, get it checked.
Suzanne Malveaux, thanks very much.
Dr. Gupta, thanks as well.
Our other top story tonight, the sheriff in charge of the mission to find three missing climbers on Mt. Hood said it is like looking for a needle in a haystack. That becomes clear when you see this.
From a distance, the mountain is just massive. More than 11,000 feet high. A white volcano towering over the landscape. But as you move closer, you can see searchers near a ridge, focusing on just one small area. It's believed to be near this location where the body of one of the climbers was found yesterday.
We're also learning new information tonight about the other two men.
CNN's Dan Simon has the latest.
DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Today, rescuers on Mt. Hood recovered the body of 48-year-old Kelly James, and stepped up their search for Jerry Cooke and Brian Hall, still missing after more than a week.
FRANK JAMES, KELLY JAMES' BROTHER: They identified a ring with my brother's initials on it, which has led me and our family to conclude that the climber found in the cave yesterday was my brother -- my brother, Kelly.
SIMON: Just a few hours ago, an early examination of James' body showed what was described as quote, "an obvious arm injury," perhaps explaining why he was left behind while the others looked for help.
SHERIFF JOE WAMPLER, HOOD RIVER COUNTY, OREGON: Yes, we are real sad about one of our results, but we still have two missing climbers. We're going to keep looking for them.
Our search has narrowed from totality around Mt. Hood to basically the area in which they found the cave.
SIMON: Rescuers finally made it to the summit of Mt. Hood yesterday, where they found signs of the missing men and used those clues to concentrate their search today, focusing on the area where the men left evidence of their journey.
Authorities think the men could be trapped under the snow, perhaps in another cave they could have carved out to stay alive. WAMPLER: We want to find them in a snow cave that they built someplace else on the mountain. If we don't find them there, I think we're going to have to start poking in the snow. We're going to have to do an avalanche-type search. There's as much as 10 feet of new snow that these guys, if there was an accident situation, could be under.
SIMON: Searchers are looking in an area just 300 feet from the summit of Mt. Hood, where over the weekend rescuers found two snow caves, footprints and a rope anchor. One of rescuers' fears that the two men may have fallen from a steep slope near the summit.
WAMPLER: Historically, we have had a lot of problems in this area if there is an event of a fall. And that's really what we are looking at today.
SIMON: Earlier, the families of the missing men gathered to mourn one life lost and pray that two others will come home alive.
MICHAELA COOKE, WIFE OF JERRY "NIKKO" COOKE: Kelly, Brian and Nikko shared a passion and reverence for climbing. And the bond forged between them will last throughout eternity. We hold out hope today for Brian and Nikko's safe return.
SIMON: Rescuers searching hard and quickly, hoping to find the climbers before the next storm rolls in on Wednesday.
COOPER: Dan, you were saying that some rescuers are worried that if the two missing climbers are hurt, it might be because they fell. Tell us more about that. What do you know?
SIMON (on camera): Well, those two caves that were discovered yesterday, they're in an area that's considered extremely dangerous because it is so steep. And one of those caves, the one that was empty, had an anchor next to it, which suggests that at some point there was some rope tied to that anchor. So one of the things authorities believe is that these two climbers may have tried to scale down the mountain, and when they did that, they may have fallen a great distance into the snow.
If that happened, certainly, there is no chance they could stay alive.
And Anderson, I should tell you that resources devoted to this search, they're scaling back significantly tomorrow. Privately I am told that optimism for finding these two climbers alive is fading fast. Back to you.
COOPER: Dan, thanks for that. It was Kelly James who made that cell phone call from a snow cave near the summit.
Gary Brandenburg was his pastor. I spoke to him earlier tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) COOPER: Pastor Brandenburg, I know you spoke to Kelly's wife, Karen, over the weekend. How is the family holding up?
PASTOR GARY BRANDENBURG, KELLY JAMES' PASTOR: Well, I think their feelings are like the feelings of anyone who loses someone they love. They are going through the grief process and making arrangements now, and yet still very concerned about two friends. So, I think they are still in that state of confusion and disbelief. But still very hopeful and still very optimistic.
COOPER: Kelly's brother, Frank, spoke today. I just want to play a little bit of what he said. Let's play that.
F. JAMES: As Christians, we find peace that Kelly is with God. Kelly always told us that he felt closest to God when he was on the mountain. That is what drove him to climb.
COOPER: Certainly, the fact that he died doing something he loved, I would imagine would be of some comfort to the family?
BRANDENBURG: I think so. And you know, to know Kelly, is to know that this is a guy that squeezed every ounce he could get out of life. And he had to be on that mountain. So he loved what God created and he loved the God who created it. And so, he lived his life prepared for this moment. And so it is a comfort.
COOPER: What kind of guy was he? A man of faith?
BRANDENBURG: Yes. Kelly had great faith in God. And he's the kind of guy that didn't accept life as it was. He always wanted to make things better, a very creative guy. You can see that in his business and in his home. And so he enjoyed, had a passion for climbing, talked about how he just loved to be up there on the mountain, and just the sense of accomplishment when he would reach a summit. And so he is a guy that had to be there.
COOPER: He left behind a wife, four children -- how do you counsel someone, a family or friends in a situation like this? I mean, what does one say?
BRANDENBURG: Well, it is difficult. I mean, first of all, you just have to acknowledge their grief. And being a person of faith does not mean you deny reality. These are difficult circumstances. This isn't the answer we were looking for.
But I think you try to put it in a broader perspective. As a matter of fact, in our congregation, we have a number of people that are facing life and death situations. And so we are all going to come to that place eventually. We're going to face death one way or another, whether it's on the side of a mountain or in a hospital bed. And the only question then that remains is, are we prepared for that? And Kelly believed that through faith in Christ, that one day, he would fall asleep and he would wake up in the presence of his God. And it appears that that's what -- that's exactly what happened.
COOPER: Well, Pastor Brandenburg, we appreciate your time. I know it's a busy time for you. Appreciate you speaking under these difficult circumstances. Thank you.
BRANDENBURG: Thank you. Thank you, Anderson, for having me.
COOPER: Well, incredibly, there are two other American climbers missing tonight. A couple who found a call in scaling some of the highest peaks in the world. That's what they set out to do just a few weeks ago. And they have not been heard from since.
COOPER: Christine Boskoff is known among the world's top mountain climbers as a star, even though she didn't start until her late 20s.
DAVID C. JONES, FRIEND OF LOST CLIMBERS: Christine was unique in that she got started in climbing pretty late in life. But she picked it up with an extraordinary passion and started climbing peaks that few people ever make it to.
COOPER: She made it up Mt. Everest not once, but twice. She's tackled six of the 14 highest peaks in the world, peaks over 20,000 feet high, making her one of the top female mountaineers in the world.
SHANNON CALLIES, FRIEND AND FELLOW CLIMBER: Christine is just a phenomenal climber. She's so strong. She's got a lot of passion for the sport.
COOPER: So no one was surprised or worried when Boskoff announced her next adventure, a trip this fall to the peaks of China's Sichuan Province. She planned the trip with boyfriend, Charlie Fowler, a top mountaineer in his own right, with long experience climbing in China.
GINNY HICKS, SISTER OF CHARLIE FOWLER: Charlie's always had a fascination and love of big mountains and climbing and he's pursued his passion throughout his life.
COOPER: Friends say it was the challenge of climbing sensational peaks that no one in the world had tried that drew them to southwest China.
MARK GUNLOGSON, CLIMBED WITH BOSKOFF: And the peaks there, often you'd look on a map, they'd have no names, no elevations. And you can walk into these remote areas and pick a peak and climb it.
COOPER: On November 7, Boskoff sent an upbeat e-mail to other climbers. "I'm having a great time," she wrote, "and love the country and mountains and people here."
On November 8, she sent another e-mail, outlining their next climb. "Anyway, we have one last 2-week peak bagging excursion to the Genyen area," she wrote, "I'll be in Internet contact after that and headed back to the U.S." But no emails came two weeks later on the eve of Thanksgiving. And friends and family began to worry when the couple missed their December 4 flight home.
JONES: The area is remote enough that it could be avalanche, it could be injury, it could be crevasse.
COOPER: Whatever happened, David Jones, a fellow climber and colleague of Boskoff's is determined to find out. He set up a makeshift search and rescue center at his office, filled with maps of the region, lists of contacts and Tibetan prayer flags for good luck.
He's reached out to the American embassy and the Chinese authorities for help, and joint rescue teams have been searching for about a week. But these are some of the toughest climbs in the world. And so far, no sign of the American couple.
The biggest obstacle, no one knows where the couple even began their climb.
JONES: We've got conflicting information. We're trying to reconcile those differences.
COOPER: Unlike Christine's last e-mail, pointing to the Genyen Massif, Charlie's last e-mail said, "Now off to one more different area to try a 6,000 peak." That area may be south of the Genyen Massif, in Nuyen (ph) Province.
As the search continues, friends and family stay hopeful.
JONES: I am hopeful with all my heart and prayers that she is still alive.
HICKS: If anybody can make it out of there, Christine and Charlie can.
COOPER: And we're joined now by Ginny Hicks, the sister of Charlie Fowler. She joins me from Portland, Oregon.
Ginny, thanks for being with us. I'm sorry it's under these circumstances.
HICKS: Thank you.
COOPER: Where do you think they went? Do you know?
HICKS: When Charlie took off, he said he was going off to climb unnamed peaks and go exploring, and so I don't really know. Probably other climbers in Colorado have a better idea, but he just went off to explore something that nobody else had climbed, because that's what he liked to do.
COOPER: You know, so many people are following what is happening in Mt. Hood, it has got to be a whole other level of horror for you to have your brother and his girlfriend on -- literally, around the world, missing in a place that you can't necessarily just go up and search for them.
HICKS: Right. Even if I could go there, I really couldn't do anything. So I have to rely on the ground crews that are there. And there are a lot of people there searching for them. And so that brings me comfort. And I do get updates daily from the people in China, so that helps a lot.
COOPER: How much -- how long has this been going on for? I mean, when did you first get an inkling that something might be wrong?
HICKS: I have known for about a week. So, it has been...
COOPER: When -- is that when they didn't make their flight?
HICKS: Yes. It was a few days after that. When Charlie left, he, you know, he always gives us a general timeframe like, I'll be back in December. But I am never able to really pin him down. And he does live in Colorado, and I'm in Oregon. So, I got a call from one of his good friends, Damon Johnston, from Colorado, letting me know that he hadn't made his flight back.
COOPER: Tell me about your brother and his passion for climbing. How long has he been doing this?
HICKS: Well, Charlie started climbing at a very early age. He learned how to climb in the Boy Scouts. And then when he was 16, he went out to Mt. Rainier in the state of Washington, and learned how to do ice climbing. And that's when he fell in love with big mountains. And ever since age 16, he's been in pursuit of climbing as many big mountains and different mountains all over the world.
COOPER: That's got to be something that's always worried you, I guess?
HICKS: Yes, we -- my mother and I have had a lifetime of worrying about him.
COOPER: Well, Ginny, I hope things work out and I hope you can come back on this program with good news, maybe even with your brother. So, we wish you the best.
HICKS: That would be great. Thank you.
COOPER: All right. Well, take care.
We'll continue to follow that story. Fowler and Boskoff's friends have set up two Web sites where people can find information on search and also donate money. You go to mountainmadness.com and mountainfilm.org. Those Web sites there. Mountainmadness.com, mountainfilm.org.
As we've seen in these past few days, climbing mountains comes with risk, even if you are experienced. Here is the raw data. In 2004, there were 160 reported climbing accidents in the U.S., and 35 deaths. That was up from 118 accidents and just 18 deaths in 2003.
To Iraq now. Up next, how everyday life is becoming more difficult for everyone. Women in danger, more danger than ever before. A living hell.
Plus, a real life bad Santa. Police say a man dressed as old Saint Nick kidnapped a young girl. We'll tell you how she got away.
And a split in the Episcopal Church. Several parishes going their own way. Will more soon follow? And what led to the defection when 360 continues.
COOPER: Well, the deadly violence in Iraq escalates everyday. Support for the war continues to drop in the U.S. A new CNN poll finds only 31 percent of Americans approve of the war. That is down from 33 percent last month and 40 percent in September.
The president is dealing with his own falling numbers. Now, just 28 percent of Americans support his handling of the war. Poll results come on Robert Gates' first day as secretary of defense, replacing the very unpopular, of course, Donald Rumsfeld. No one knows if the bad feedback is going to impact the tactics in the battle zone, but there is no question that each day life grows more difficult and dangerous in Iraq.
Here is CNN's Nic Robertson.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Turn on the TV in Iraq, and this is what you can see. Insurgent videos showing in minute detail mortar attacks, rockets and roadside bombs, even sniper fire aimed at U.S. soldiers.
The station that shows them was banned by the Iraqi government last month, but within days, it was back on air. Violence is life here. No one escapes, not even the children. Just ask these youngsters at school in Fallujah.
There is no security, he says. When we go home to sleep, we don't know what is going to happen.
They know kids outside Iraq are having better lives.
I envy their peaceful life. We have no peace here, he says. They have no Americans. We have killing here.
The hope of a better future amid the chaos of Saddam Hussein's overthrow three years ago is long gone. In the Baghdad of today, religious identity, Sunni or Shia, divides communities. Militias control neighborhoods by day, gun-toting vigilantes patrol streets at night.
(On camera): For an outsider like me, to visit many of Baghdad's neighborhoods requires permission from whichever armed gang controls it. And even then there are no guarantees a rival faction won't grab you. Kidnapping is big business for Sunni insurgents and Shia militias alike.
(Voice-over): For Iraqis living in these increasingly divided and isolated communities, life is far worse. Religious extremists on both sides are in the ascendancy. And women suffer twice over.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I cannot take my kids to visit friends or to visit my family. I cannot go. I cannot go. Even if there is private cars, even in my car I cannot. Because nowadays, even the free, the women who are driving.
ROBERTSON: Walking in Baghdad is almost too dangerous for many women. They fear kidnapping and rape. The only way to minimize the risk is to wear the all shrouding black shadore (ph), a symbol of subservience to religious edicts.
Hundreds of thousands of better off, better educated, more progressive Iraqis are leaving. Iraq's creaking health care system strains under the twin burdens of sectarian bloodshed and the flight of its doctors.
Iraq is hemorrhaging its wealth and talent. And when you turn on the TV, the insurgents parade their latest exploits on the TV channel no one seems able to close down.
Nic Robertson, CNN, Baghdad.
COOPER: well, here in the states, a split in the Episcopal Church. Some parishes decided to break their affiliation. The question is, will more follow? That's coming up.
But first Randi Kaye has a 360 news and business bulletin -- Randi.
RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi Anderson.
President Bush has signed a landmark deal that allows the U.S. to ship nuclear fuel to India. Mr. Bush says the bill will help India meet its energy and security challenges. But Democratic Congressman Ed Markey of Massachusetts, calls the deal a historic mistake. He says it will increase India's capability to make nuclear weapons.
Near Columbia, South Carolina, a really bad Santa. Police say a man dressed in a Santa Clause outfit coaxed an 8-year-old girl into his motorcycle sidecar and sped off from a convenience store. The girl's father chased the cycle down in his car and got his daughter back. Deputies later caught up with the guy at a local bar.
These next pictures make a good argument for sending people into space. That's for sure. A pair of space walking astronauts today managed to correctly fold up a huge solar panel on the International Space Station. And in the future, you will actually be able to watch this all on Google. The folks behind the leading search engine are teaming up with NASA to deliver photos, video and other high-tech features.
Back on earth now, health officials in Indiana have figured out what made about 400 people sick at an Olive Garden restaurant near Indianapolis. It was the rare, but highly contagious norovirus, which usually shows up on the cruise ships. The restaurant, which closed on Friday, has been scrubbed down and now they say is clear to reopen -- Anderson.
COOPER: Good news. Randi, thanks.
More than a year after Hurricane Katrina, New Orleans has yet to close the book on the police shooting of an unarmed man. Coming up, and for the first time someone who says he saw it happen, tells us his story.
Plus, they are on fire for Jesus. But they aren't like other evangelical Christians. They're gay. And their numbers are greater than you think. You're watching 360.
COOPER: It is a divorce three years in the making. A split in the Episcopal Church. It happened with a historic vote yesterday in Virginia. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) and traditionalists and the most centrist members of the denomination, couldn't come together on several issues. The biggest, homosexuality in the church. With that, CNN's Brian Todd.
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A few words....
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A new day has begun.
TODD: Then hymns. And hugs.
(On camera): With those simple gestures, two churches that date back to the 1700s, including this one where George Washington prayed, announced that they are breaking away from the Episcopal Church of the U.S.
(Voice-over): Falls Church and Truro Church, which serve two of the most elite communities in the Washington, D.C., area are taking along at least six other Parishes in the largest state Episcopal diocese in the country.
Parishioners and church officials talk about longstanding differences over theology, but the director rector of Falls Church boils it down to what he calls the tipping point three years ago.
REV. JOHN YATES, THE FALLS CHURCH: The election of a person in our church to the highest office who is a person who is living in a sexual sort of relationship that has always been condemned by our church really got the attention of many, many more people.
TODD: Reverend John Yates is talking about Gene Robinson of New Hampshire, the first openly gay man elected bishop of a state diocese. Reverend Yates says it's not just about lifestyle, but observers say the Episcopal Church has been struggling with these issues.
DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN FAITH AND VALUES CORRESPONDENT: There have been a lot of talk in the last few years over some issues of women priests, over issues of gay bishops, that people were disgruntled within the Episcopal Church, and the Episcopal Church is a particular kind of church because they try to straddle the fine line between keeping conservatives and liberals happy.
TODD: In a statement, presiding Bishop Katherine Jefferts Schori, head of the entire U.S. Episcopal Church, said quote, "We are saddened when individuals decide they must leave the Episcopal Church." But she also said, "the quick fix embraced in drawing lines or in departing is not going to be an ultimate solution for our discomfort."
Something that also may not be quite comfortable for the church leadership -- these two conservative congregations are linking up with another offshoot of the Anglican Church, one in Nigeria that supports a proposed law in that country that would put homosexuals in jail.
But Reverend Yates is clear, he does not favor putting people in jail for their lifestyle.
Brian Todd, CNN, Falls Church, Virginia.
COOPER: Well, a growing number of gay Evangelicals are out to show that they can be part of the Christian community even if there are members that still will not welcome them.
With that, here is CNN's Sean Callebs.
SEAN CALLEBS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Young, studious, deeply religious. Justin Lee could be a poster boy for the Evangelical movement except for one factor, he is gay.
JUSTIN LEE, GAY CHRISTIAN NETWORK: I kept thinking, well, you know, it's going to go away. If I, you know, I've just got to keep focusing on God and study my scriptures and, you know, keep praying and eventually, it's going to change. I'm going to just grow out of it. God's going to, you know, change my feelings.
CALLEBS: But God didn't. Lee went through years of torment and depression before making peace with himself and deciding there is a place in church for gay Evangelicals.
He started the Gay Christian Network, which now has more than 5,000 members.
LEE: We're just trying to get people together who experience attraction to the same sex, however they have handled that, and who love Jesus and say, OK, you are welcome here, and then let's pry together and figure out where God wants us to take it.
CALLEBS: Lee's sexual orientation puts him squarely at odds with conservative evangelicals who say there is no room for compromise.
JOHN MCARTHUR, PASTOR: And the bible is crystal clear, homosexuality is a sin and anybody who lives that kind of lifestyle will not enter the kingdom of God.
CALLEBS: Since Evangelical Minister Ted Haggard announced he was guilty of sexual immorality, and leading Denver Evangelical Pastor Paul Barnes resigned after telling his congregation he was gay, conservative Christians have been forced to talk about the issue.
TONY CAMPOLO, AUTHOR: I would say there's a significant proportion of the evangelical community that, for lack of a better word, is homophobic, that is nasty and mean.
CALLEBS: Tony Campolo, author and prominent evangelical minister, and his wife, Peggy, encourage the faithful to support gay rights. But even they have sharp differences. He believes gay sex is a sin.
T. CAMPOLO: I can't tell you how many times people have said, I love your attitude. You've got tears in your eyes when you speak to me, you have compassion in your heart, but you're breaking my heart when you tell me that I am called to celibacy.
PEGGY CAMPOLO, WIFE OF TONY CAMPOLO: I don't see anything in the bible that supports what Tony says, and I feel that marriage is very important to intimacy and being fulfilled as a person for a lot of people.
CALLEBS: People like Justin Lee.
LEE: What it boils down to is, a lot of people, as soon as they hear gay Christian, they have a whole bunch of assumptions about what we believe, what we're trying to accomplish. And I just -- I wish that people would come and listen to what we have to say before they just jump to a conclusion.
CALLEBS: But many conservative evangelicals have already made up their minds that gay evangelicals are welcome to visit their churches, but not to be members and certainly not in positions of leadership.
Sean Callebs, CNN, Raleigh, North Carolina.
In England, police say they have a suspect in murders of five prostitutes. What he told police about his relationship with the women and what it could mean for the investigation, when 360 continues.
COOPER: Pretty creepy picture. It gets weirder. You're going to see in a minute. Millions of people post profiles of themselves on the Internet. One of the most popular sites, of course, is myspace.com. And you can find all walks of life on it, including, it seems, that of a suspected serial killer.
CNN's Paula Hancocks has details.
PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is the man believed to be in custody, showing pictures of himself he posted on myspace.com.
STEWART GULL, DETECTIVE CHIEF SUPERINTENDENT: A 37-year-old man was arrested at his home address in Trembly (ph) near Felixsto (ph) at approximately 7:20 a.m. this morning. He has been arrested on the suspicion of murdering all five women.
HANCOCKS: Supermarket Worker Tom Stephens claims he knew the murdered women. Police will not confirm his identity.
Stephens has not been shy with the British media, telling one Sunday newspaper he was concerned that he had no alibis at the time the girls were killed. But he did insist he was innocent, saying he had already been questioned by police four times.
He told BBC radio he was a friend as well as a client to the girls, and spoke to some of them after the first two bodies were found.
VOICE OF TOM STEPHENS, SPEAKING ON BBC RADIO: I would like to say, if you know anything, please talk to the police. And if you won't talk to the police, please talk to me and I will talk to police and also trying to say, are you OK?
HANCOCKS: Police will continue a meticulous forensic search of his home. One neighbor says this is not the first search at Stephens' house.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From what I remember, from when it was first reported, between then and when they found the first bodies, they did actually do some searching of that property.
HANCOCKS: The body of the first girl was discovered on December 2. Four more bodies were then discovered within 11 days. All five were prostitutes, all five found naked.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But then the murders are unique. I mean, to get five murders in such a short space of time in what is really a quiet remote area is very unusual.
HANCOCKS: This case has sparked calls for better protection for prostitutes in Britain, or the legalization of brothels so that women do not have to solicit for business on the street. Paula Hancocks, CNN, London.
Well, in the chaotic days after the Hurricane Katrina, New Orleans police shot and killed an unarmed man. Tonight, a CNN exclusive, a man who has been silent comes forward with a shocking story of what he says he saw. We're keeping them honest, next on 360.
COOPER: Well, tonight, an unsolved mystery from Hurricane Katrina. Days after the storm hit, there was chaos in New Orleans. We all know that. The city was on edge. In broad daylight police shot a man who they said was armed with a gun. But that wasn't the case.
Now in a CNN exclusive, a witness to the shooting is sharing what he says he saw that day. The question is, did police kill an innocent man?
CNN's Drew Griffin, tonight, keeping them honest.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It was the sixth day after Katrina. New Orleans was underwater, its police force under fire. Rumors of snipers everywhere. The city looted, evacuated and on the brink of anarchy. It was under these stress-filled conditions that police shot and killed an unarmed man near this New Orleans bridge. Kasimir Gaston saw that shooting and has been silent until now. He is coming forward to CNN he says, because he is still troubled by what happened in front of New Orleans' friendly inn.
KASIMIR GASTON, WITNESS: The minute he turned in, he fell.
GRIFFIN (on camera): Kasimir Gaston was living on the second floor by now, the door open. It was so hot, there was no power. When he woke up, he says he came out onto this balcony and witnessed right out on the street a firing squad of police gunning down an unarmed running man.
GASTON: With all motion, moving and just...
GRIFFIN: And then how did he fall?
GASTON: He just fell like -- like -- like he was collapsing. Like -- like he was collapsing. Like something had just like wiped him out.
GRIFFIN: You didn't see any gun on him?
GASTON: I didn't see any on him. GRIFFIN (voice-over): The family says Ronald Madison and his brother were running away from a police shootout with other people on the nearby bridge.
This autopsy report, verified by the New Orleans coroner, shows Ronald Madison was hit seven times, two wounds in his shoulder, five in the back. No weapon was found on the body of the mentally retarded man.
A police sergeant did testify in a preliminary hearing that Ronald Madison, quote, "turned, reached in his waistband and turned on the officers before they opened fire." Not so says Gaston.
GASTON: Hands out, full speed.
GRIFFIN (on camera): Did you see anything in his hands?
GRIFFIN (voice-over): The only guns he saw were in the hands of the police.
GASTON: They were all like in formation, in line, you know, in a row. And, you know, like at a firing range.
GRIFFIN: The New Orleans police have refused to discuss details of the shooting with CNN.
WARREN RILEY, NEW ORLEANS POLICE SUPERINTENDENT: It was a very tense time for the police department.
GRIFFIN: Earlier this year New Orleans Police Superintendent Warren Riley told us the case remains under investigation.
(On camera): What has taken so long?
RILEY: What has taken so long? A thorough investigation. A very thorough investigation.
MARY HOWELL, ATTORNEY: It needs a thorough investigation. I don't know that I can say that the police department has done that.
GRIFFIN: Attorney Mary Howell is representing the family of Ronald Madison in a lawsuit against the police. She says a number of people saw what happened. Each, she said, told her what Kasimir Gaston is about to say.
Did any of the police officers at the time, at the scene, ask what you saw?
GRIFFIN: Did they take a statement from you?
GASTON: Not from me.
GRIFFIN: Did they take your name or phone number down?
HOWELL: It probably raises more questions than we have answers at this point.
GRIFFIN: Will you get answers? Will there be answers? Or will this be washed away with the hurricane?
HOWELL: Well, you know, there's a lot of things that have been washed away with this hurricane, and we are doing everything we can to make sure that this is not one of them.
GASTON: And he just dropped right here.
GRIFFIN: The only thing police told Gaston, he says, was not to touch the body lying behind his truck.
GASTON: He was laying like, probably, his body was stretched out about that, about this close to bumper.
GRIFFIN: This photo was taken by a newspaper photographer that day. On the right you can see a damaged red taillight. It matches up perfectly with Gaston's pickup truck a full year later. On the truck, you can also see the marks of what Gaston says police told him were gunshots.
GASTON: They notified me that I had two bullet holes to the passenger side.
GRIFFIN (on camera): The investigation into Ronald Madison's death is now in the hands of a New Orleans grand jury. Gaston, now living in Dallas, says he is willing to come forward and finally tell what he saw that day if anyone in this city is now willing to listen.
Drew Griffin, CNN, New Orleans.
COOPER: Well, in other news, one of the entertainment legends passed away today. He was probably in your house every day, creating the characters you grew up with. Who was he? We'll tell you more when 360 continues.
COOPER: Well, a man whose name you've seen a million times, but his face you'd never recognize, has died tonight. He is Animator Joe Barbera. You know, as in Hanna-Barbera, akin Yogi Bear, Fred Flinstone and countless other cartoons.
CNN's Sibila Vargas has more on the man who got generations of us saying yabba dabba doo. And after 95 years, left us laughing.
SIBILA VARGAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The theme songs were catchy.
VARGAS: So were the characters.
YOGI BEAR: Don't worry, Boo, for the sake of warm tooties, some things just have to be done.
VARGAS: The sarcastic Yogi Bear.
FRED FLINSTONE: Ooh, is he going to get a fist full of fingers.
VARGAS: The bombastic Fred Flintstone.
SHAGGY: Like, what is it, Scoob?
VARGAS: Scooby Doo, the cowardly dog who behaved more like a frady cat.
Generations of American kids grew up on those cartoons. Well into adulthood, many of us can still sing the songs and mimic Scooby's "rero." And while we might know Papa Smurf, most of us never knew what the cartoons' papas looked like.
Hanna and Barbera. What Joe Barbera, who died Monday at age 95, brought to the partnership was writing and drawing skills. Bill Hanna did the directing. Barbera and Hanna, who died in 2001, scored their first big success with "Tom and Jerry" more than 60 years ago.
TOM: I'm Tom.
JERRY: I'm Jerry.
TOM/JERRY: You talked.
VARGAS: Short film starring the cat and mouse combo earned Hanna-Barbera seven academy awards.
JERRY: Look at me. I'm dancing.
VARGAS: Jerry was even inserted into the 1945 Gene Kelly film, "Anchors Away."
They created the first primetime animated show, "The Flintstones," in the early 60s. A sly, prehistoric parody of the honeymooners. The shows borrowed from popular culture and they became part of popular culture.
Huckleberry Hound, and the Jetsons.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Don't look now, but we are being followed.
VARGAS: Johnny Quest, Space Ghosts, Josie and the Pussycats. SMURFETTE: These smurfs, Daddy, sure are sweet.
VARGAS: The smurfs. Few people may be able to put a face to the name Joe Barbera, but they can put a name and a catch phrase to all of the characters he helped create.
SHAGGY: Scooby Doo, where are you?
VARGAS: Sibila Vargas, CNN, Hollywood.
We will have more of 360 in a moment. Stay with us.
COOPER: Well, "LARRY KING" is coming up next. His guest, Angelina Jolie, Matt Damon and Robert DeNiro.
We'll see you tomorrow night.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.voxant.com