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Clinton Wins Pennsylvania Primary

Aired April 22, 2008 - 22:00   ET


WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Let's go back to Campbell Brown. She's got some good analysis with our team -- Campbell.

And -- and, as Wolf was saying, we're all waiting to see what the margin of victory is. But, regardless -- I think David made the point earlier -- a win is a win. And she's going ahead. She's moving ahead.

Look -- kind of preview for us Indiana, North Carolina, Gloria.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think what we're -- what Hillary Clinton is now doing is really playing for time, Campbell.

This victory would have been a lot better for her if it had come earlier on, if, somehow, Pennsylvania had been earlier in the mix, but it -- but it wasn't. And, so, now she's kind of got this game to hang in there and maybe win a state like Indiana, win Kentucky, win West Virginia. Barack Obama is favored in North Carolina.

So, it's really not about the math, because everybody has made it clear the math is very difficult, if not almost impossible, for her. But it's about making your legal brief to those superdelegates, saying, I'm more electable. I can win. And you want to win, and raising questions about Obama as an electable candidate.

So, she's going to continue on. And I think Indiana is going to be very important, because he's got to prove that he can win in that kind of a Rust Belt state.

ROLAND MARTIN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: He has an advantage with Indiana, in that he's not going in down 16, 20 points. So, it's very tight there. Also, it's a neighbor state to Illinois.

I think one of the things that he's going to have to do is, he's got two major issues. And that is return to the Obama of old, in terms of that particular message that people were buying really into, that was resonating.

The other issue is -- and we have seen this consistently, is that she has closed better than him. I thought he did a better job with Pennsylvania closing in the final 72 hours. But you look at how voters broke in the final week of the campaign, they were breaking more for her.

BROWN: For her.

MARTIN: And, so, his campaign...

BROWN: Why do you think that is?


BROWN: Was it his debate performance or was it the bitter comments? Or what do you think it was?

MARTIN: You know what? I don't think necessarily think it was the debate performance.

What typically happens is, the closer they get to Election Day, she becomes more a policy wonk. The closer his campaign gets to Election Day, they stick with the rhetorical sort of messages. She did very well in New Hampshire with that, in Ohio as well.

They have to -- that's where Professor Obama has to return and say, you know what? I'm going to go one on one with policy. I'm going to focus on that, because, sure, having a -- having rally with 35,000 people, that's great. That's wonderful. But the question is, how can you get people to break for you the day of the election, the day before, or 48 hours out?

That's a fundamental issue that they have to fix.

BROWN: David?

DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: I think that both Indiana and North Carolina are important. There's a test for her, whether she can do well in a state like North Carolina, which could be in play in the fall.

BROWN: Which he's favored there because there -- the heavily African-American population in North Carolina.


BROWN: And he's doing well with the white population, too. He's got about a 15-point lead there. He's held it pretty steadily. She's got to see if she can bring that down under double digits. He's got to go win Indiana.

I think that Gloria was absolutely right about that. He's got to show he can take a Rust Belt state. And it's symbolically important. Tonight, on the night he knows he's going to get a lot of television, he's in Indiana, not North Carolina. I think there's a reason for that.

But let me come back to one other thing about the superdelegates. This is not just a question any longer of who can win in the fall. They have to also make sure they hold their party together. If, at the end of this -- and the math is against her -- she winds up with fewer delegates, fewer votes, and fewer states, if they turn it over to her, they run the very real risk they will drive African-Americans out of the party for a generation.

MARTIN: And young voters.

GERGEN: And they will drive away young voters.

There's things worse than losing an election in trying to build a party. And, so, they have got to consider that seriously. And that's why I think the superdelegates will tend to vote for Barack Obama, because they need to hold the party together. And, if you look at the national polls, both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama right now are running ahead of John McCain.


BROWN: But not by much.


GERGEN: Not by much.


MARTIN: But, Campbell, and keep in mind, Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi plays a large role in this as well. She wants to expand her majority in the House.

Harry Reid wants to expand his majority in the Senate. The last thing they want is to tick off a significant number of voters who could impact the Democratic Party down ballot. Howard Dean has been talking about a 50-state strategy. That completely throws it off.

I know it's two years away, but you cannot forget that the districts will all be changed in 2010. They want more Democrats in charge of statehouses. You tick those voters out, you risk hurting Democrats down the line.

BORGER: You know, in the send, she has to make a case to superdelegates that they should take this away from Barack Obama, who is beating her in the math.

And that's -- that's a very tough case to make, which is to say, it's his, but give it to me; it's mine.


GERGEN: Yes, let me make one other point.

The longer this goes on, the more -- and the anger rises on both sides, the more it makes it more likely that one of them will be forced to take the other one as a vice presidential candidate.

BROWN: All right, let me -- let me go to some of our other panelists on that one, and again mention that we're waiting to hear from Hillary Clinton, who we are expecting to speak shortly.

Governor Rendell on stage, I'm being told, right now. Let me ask you, Donna Brazile -- I know I keep coming back here to you, but you are our superdelegate. You're representing superdelegates everywhere. And we just heard this argument being made that -- that she has a tough sell to superdelegates. Do you think that's the case, or does a win like tonight, you know, a crucial battleground state, make a difference?

DONNA BRAZILE, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: It's tough, but it's also doable.

Look, superdelegates would like to win. Yes, we want to expand the congressional majorities in both the House and the Senate, but we also want to win back the White House.

And, clearly, this conversation -- sometimes, I don't like it, because it's a little bit too sharp elbow -- this conversation in terms of who would make the best president, who's tough, who can stand the pressure, who can stay in the kitchen, although, in my kitchen, by the way...


BRAZILE: ... I can tell you this much. Not only should you know how to stir, but you better know how to fry and bake, too...


BRAZILE: ... I have been through a couple of these kitchens with these Republicans, and it's not just who can stand the heat, but who also can stir up something.

So, I hope that the Democrats can come together after this long, protracted, exciting battle.

And let me just say this. And we keep talking about black people. And I love black people, clearly. But we have a lot of white voters out there who are supporting Barack Obama. And, yes, we still have black voters and Hispanics who are supporting Hillary Clinton. We have a very unusual coalition in the Democratic Party. It actually looks like America.

So, let's talk about the coalition, not just some of the parts, but the whole coalition. It is a very strong party that can withstand some of this, if we come back on a positive note.

BROWN: Let me ask Paul and Jamal to comment on what David Gergen mentioned a moment ago, that the only way to heal these wounds possibly could be putting them together on a ticket.

I mean, we talked about that. You heard a lot of talk about that some time ago, but certainly not in the last few weeks. Is there any chance of that happening at this stage?


PAUL BEGALA, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: I'm sorry to interrupt. There's always a chance, Campbell, yes.

And, you know, right now, they're circling each other. I really dissent from the majority view that, somehow, this has been so bitter, so personal. You know, malarkey. It's been...


BROWN: It's politics.

BEGALA: Yes, exactly. There have been moments when I haven't liked things Hillary's campaign has said. There have been moments I haven't liked things Barack's campaign has said. But, in the main, these are very dignified, classified individuals. I think they're running a pretty interesting and high-level campaign.

The other thing is, people need to remember, it's April 22. I know I have got a Ph.D. in the obvious. And that means there's plenty of time to put this back together. You know, we in the media always, well, wind it up, wind it up. What's the next thing?

BROWN: But it sounds like she's going regardless. They're both going to June 3. So, it -- then we're talking about the middle of summer.

BEGALA: But that's plenty of time. Bill Clinton locked up the nomination on June 2 in 1992.

And, by the way, on the day he locked it up, he was a distant third, both behind President Bush and Ross Perot. But the great 1600s poet, Andrew Marvell, has this great poem, "To His Coy Mistress."

And it begins, "If we had world enough and time." Well, guess what? Hillary and Barack have world enough and time. They will put this back together. And I'm -- I'm troubled by some of the analysis that suggests that Democrats are infants, that they're all just juvenile and petty and puerile.

I think that they're grownups and they very much want to win. And I don't have a great worry that they will not unite around either Barack or Hillary. I'm much more sanguine than most.

BROWN: Jamal?

JAMAL SIMMONS, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I tend to agree that we're going to pull this party back together.

The tough part is, though, how you win. How you win is important. And there are a whole host of Democrats -- some of them are African-Americans -- some of them are young people -- some of them are other -- are whites and Hispanics -- who are behind Barack Obama, who feel like he's winning on every measure that he's been asked to win on. He's won on votes. He's won on states won. He's winning in the amount of money he has raised.

And he's winning in the number -- the crowds. He's winning in the national polls. At some point, you have got to declare a winner. And if -- and if you get to the end of this process, and he's ahead -- and let's not forget -- they said themselves -- Howard Wolfson said it in January of this year. This is a delegate fight. And if he's ahead in delegates come the end of this process in June, and, all of a sudden, there's something that happens, and he's no longer going to be the nominee, there's going to be a little period of some people being upset here before we get around to November.

So, I think we have got to be a little careful how you win. But I do agree with Paul. We will patch most of this back up together and we're going to fight a good fight against John McCain.

BROWN: Leslie?

LESLIE SANCHEZ, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I think what is so interesting is, if you listen to this thing coming out of the Clinton folks, it's about -- they're framing the debate around expectations. Already, they're talking about -- they're still talking about seating the Michigan and Florida delegates. They're talking about taking it all the way, let everybody be counted.

She has every intention of going to the convention. This is not going to be resolved, I believe, until Denver. I think that's a problem.


SANCHEZ: You guys can disagree.


SANCHEZ: Let them disagree. But I think the advantage for her campaign comes when they get back to the smoke-filled rooms, when you're not out on the campaign anymore and the cameras aren't in there, and they're cutting the deals, the way politics are cut.

Ultimately, they're going to say, it's our turn. She sat aside in 2004. She waited. She worked hard. She's the establishment candidate. And, basically, those undecided superdelegates are the establishment folks. They want to win. He's untested. He's young, and he can come back. That's a fair argument.

BEGALA: It will not go to the convention.


BEGALA: We're not going to stand there in Denver and watch Hillary and Barack do rock, paper, scissors, you know, with Howard Dean presiding over it. They will resolve...


BRAZILE: And she will not -- she will not...

BEGALA: They're going to wind this up.

I mean, I just -- because -- first off, though, they need to run out all this string. It's good for the party. See, one great indicator that it's not too negative is that turnout is up, up, up. Everywhere they go, more people become Democrats. So, they're not -- I don't think voters say, gee, look at all the viciousness. I want to be part of that.

Everywhere they go, Democrats win. This is going to help up and down the ballot, as Roland pointed out. So, Democrats, Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, they should be celebrating this, because, wherever they go, whether Hillary or Barack wins, Democrats win.


BROWN: Amy...


BROWN: Amy -- I got to get Amy in here.

AMY HOLMES, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: As someone who is new to this dinner party...


HOLMES: ... all you guys were off talking...



HOLMES: ... I was comparing exit polling data from previous primaries.

And one of the surprising findings here -- and it might not make Obama supporters feel very good -- is that Hillary supporters are really hardening for Hillary. You see this number creeping up of people who will be satisfied only if Hillary wins, where Barack Obama supporters are still rather...


BROWN: But is that a heat-of-the-moment number? Do you see that changing?

HOLMES: It could be that you look at Ohio, you look at Texas, and that number is creeping up.

If you look at Barack Obama's numbers, even in Alabama and Louisiana, where it was a blowout for Barack Obama, his supporters were still pretty flexible. They would be satisfied with Hillary. They would be satisfied with Barack Obama, not so much for Hillary Clinton supporters.

So, if, say, Barack Obama wins this, after a really, really tough primary battle, he actually may have more work to do -- this is anti- conventional wisdom -- but more work to do with Hillary Clinton supporters than vice versa. (CROSSTALK)

BROWN: Yes, let me go up here.


BROWN: Sorry.


BROWN: I -- too many people at one time.

OK, Roland, you get the next one.

MARTIN: I understand Paul keeps making...


MARTIN: ... the point about Bill Clinton locking the nomination up in June.

But here's the difference. The Democratic Convention ended in 1992 on July 16. The Democratic Convention this year ends August 28. Republicans don't end until September the 4th. So, you don't have that month, month-and-a-half to be able to continue this whole campaign. It's an eight-week window from the end of the GOP convention to the general election.

So, if you move this thing on to July 1 or even go to the convention, that's the concern, the amount of time to frame John McCain. That's the issue.


BROWN: And you can note how little that we have talked about John McCain tonight, because the race, all of the heat is on the Democratic side.

GERGEN: That's right.

BROWN: How much is he enjoying this?


GERGEN: He just has to hold their coats and watch.

But I do think Paul Begala made the point that it is going to end in June. It's not going to go to convention. They're not going to allow it to go to the convention. I think that's right. I think there's going to be enormous pressure on them to get this resolved, because when they -- if they go to the convention, it really does invite defeat.


MARTIN: Who says she's going to follow that? (CROSSTALK)

BROWN: But Howard Dean has made it pretty clear to all the superdelegates -- whether they follow along with his advice here or not -- "I want to hear from you by June 3," once the primaries are over.


GERGEN: She doesn't control the superdelegates. The superdelegates control the superdelegates.


BORGER: And she wants to have a political future. I mean, she's going to -- she wants to have a political future in the party. She doesn't want to destroy the party.

BROWN: So, this is over by June 3?

BORGER: Well, and this plays to your scenario of the...


BORGER: ... of the -- what David was hinting at before, which -- which we have all talked about, which is the arranged marriage between -- between Obama and Clinton as kind of the easy way out, even though a lot of people believe that that would be a total nightmare.

MARTIN: If Clinton has got a shot, I think she's going to stick with it, because, look, we can keep talking about, well, her political future.


MARTIN: Look at the numbers. She's 60 years old. He's 46. Even if you assume Obama beats McCain, look, this is her shot to run for the White House. She's going to exhaust every opportunity. And, so, I'm just not buying that, hey, it will be all over. I'm just not buying it.


GERGEN: If the superdelegates all declare, she can stay in until...


MARTIN: If they all declare. If he doesn't get 2,025, they hold back -- and, again, the bottom line is, we simply don't know. I just think she's going to go after every possible opportunity, so she could go there.


BORGER: And she has to make the argument that he is... (CROSSTALK)

BORGER: And she has to make the argument that he is fatally damaged.

BROWN: OK. All right.


BROWN: Let me interrupt you for a second, because I think that we have Hillary Clinton coming into the room. We're looking at the rally. These are the live pictures of her rally now, the crowd getting pretty excited there. And we are waiting for her to take the stage to give her victory speech for the evening.

We were hearing around 10:00. There she is now. You can see her now. She's coming in with her husband, who made some news of his own today, we should mention.


BROWN: Hillary Clinton taking the stage to be introduced.


BROWN: Yes, we were just discussing the relationship of Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton together out on the campaign trail.

And they have been very careful -- I know you guys have noticed this -- we have talked about it -- about sort of keeping them apart and separate and not on stage together. There they are on stage together tonight, which is a little bit unusual. He had always sort of made the point of introducing her and then dodging stage right or stage left to give her the podium and give her...

MARTIN: But, Campbell...


MARTIN: ... he played a critical role in terms of those rural parts of Pennsylvania. And she's going to need him in Indiana as well.

GERGEN: The guy up there that counts tonight right now is Ed Rendell.

He's got the guy who really helped deliver.

BROWN: You think...


GERGEN: Absolutely. That was a major, major difference...

(CROSSTALK) MARTIN: But -- and if Obama did not score huge in Philadelphia, I would say look at the mayor, Nutter, extremely popular. So, he also played a critical role, if Obama's numbers are not huge in the city.

BORGER: This is one of those cases where an endorsement mattered.


BORGER: ... Ed Rendell having organization.


BROWN: Yes. But we were all saying that about Bob Casey as well on Obama's side.

MARTIN: But the governor controls the purse strings.



GERGEN: Casey symbolically was very, very important for Obama.


BROWN: All right, guys.


BROWN: She's starting right now. Let's listen in, everybody.

CROWD: Hillary! Hillary! Hillary! Hillary!

SEN. HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON (D-NY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you all. Thank you.


CLINTON: Thank you. Thank you very, very much. Oh, thank you.


CLINTON: It's a long road to 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, and it runs right through the heart of Pennsylvania.


CLINTON: You know, for six weeks, Senator Obama and I have crisscrossed this state, meeting people up close, being judged side- by-side, making our best case. You listened, and today you chose.


CLINTON: With two wars abroad and an economic crisis here at home, you know the stakes are high and the challenges are great, but you also know the possibilities. Those possibilities are endless, if we roll up our sleeves and get to work with a president who's ready to lead on day one.


CLINTON: You know, that means ready to take charge as commander- in-chief and make this economy work for middle-class families.


CLINTON: And I thank you. I thank you, Pennsylvania, for deciding I can be that president.


CLINTON: You know, for me, the victory we share tonight is deeply personal. It was here in Pennsylvania where my grandfather started work as a boy in the lace mills and ended up as a supervisor five decades later. It was here where my father attended college and played football for Penn State.


CLINTON: And I am back here tonight because of their hard work and sacrifice. And I only wish they could have lived to see this moment, because in this election I carry with me not just their dreams, but the dreams of people like them and like you all across our country, people...


CLINTON: ... people who embrace hard work and opportunity, who never waiver in the face of adversity, who stand for what you believe and never stop believing in the promise of America.


CLINTON: I'm in this race to fight for you, to fight...


CLINTON: ... to fight for everyone who's ever been counted out, for everyone fighting to pay the grocery bills or the medical bills, the credit card and mortgage payments, and the outrageous price of gas at the pump today.


CLINTON: You know, the pundits questioned whether Pennsylvanians would trust me with this charge. And tonight you showed you do.


CLINTON: You know you can count on me to stand up strong for you every single day in the White House.


CLINTON: This is a historic race. And I commend Senator Obama and his supporters tonight. We are, in many ways, all on this journey together to create an America that embraces every last one of us, the women in their 90s who tell me they were born before women could vote. And they're hopeful of seeing a woman in the White House.


CLINTON: The mothers and fathers at my events who lift their little girls on their shoulders and whisper in their ears, "See, you can be anything you want."


CLINTON: Tonight, more than ever, I need your help to continue this journey. This is your campaign, and this is your victory tonight.


CLINTON: Your support has meant the difference between winning and losing. Now, we can only keep winning if we can keep competing with an opponent who outspends us so massively, so I hope you will go to HillaryClinton. com...


CLINTON: ... and show your support tonight, because the future of this campaign is in your hands.

CLINTON: You know, some people counted me out and said to drop out. But the American people...


CLINTON: Well, the American people don't quit, and they deserve a president who doesn't quit, either.


CLINTON: You know, tonight, all across Pennsylvania and America, teachers are grading papers and doctors and nurses are caring for the sick, and you deserve a leader who listens to you. Waitresses are pouring coffee, and police officers are standing guard, and small businesses are working to meet that payroll. And you deserve a champion who stands with you.

And, of course, all across the world, our men and women in uniform, some on your second, third, or fourth tour of duty, you deserve a commander-in-chief who will finally bring you home...


CLINTON: ... and who will rebuild our strained military, do whatever it takes to care for our veterans, wounded in both body and spirit. Today, here in Pennsylvania, you made your voices heard. And, because of you, the tide is turning.


CLINTON: We were up against a formidable opponent who outspent us 3-to-1. He broke every spending record in this state trying to knock us out of the race. Well, the people of Pennsylvania had other ideas today.


CLINTON: You know, the presidency is the toughest job in the world, but the pressures of a campaign are nothing compared to the pressures of the White House. And today, Pennsylvanians looked through all the heat and saw the light of a brighter tomorrow, a tomorrow of shared prosperity and restored world leadership for peace, security and cooperation.

After seven long years of President Bush, we have got our work cut out for us, and we don't have a minute to waste. So it's high time we stop talking about our problems and start solving them, and that is what my campaign is all about.


CLINTON: You know, all through this campaign, I have offered solutions, solutions for good jobs you can raise a family on, jobs that can't be shipped overseas, and, on Earth Day, clean, renewable green jobs that can put us on the right track to the future...


CLINTON: ... solutions for independence from foreign oil and exploding gas prices, quality, affordable health care, not just for many Americans or most Americans, but for every single American, no exceptions and no excuses...


CLINTON: ... affordable college, and real improvements in public schools, not the failure that is No Child Left Behind.


CLINTON: We're going to end the war on science and have a renewed commitment to science and research.


CLINTON: We will tackle everything from autism to Alzheimer's, cancer to diabetes, and make a real difference.


CLINTON: I look forward to discussing all of these issues with the people of Indiana and North Carolina and the states that I will be visiting in the coming weeks. Not long ago -- not long ago, a woman handed me a photograph of her father as a young soldier. He was receiving the Medal of Honor from President Truman at the White House. During World War II, he had risked his life on a daring mission to drive back the enemy and protect his fellow soldiers.

In the corner of that photo, in shaking handwriting, this American hero had simply written, "To Hillary Clinton, keep fighting for us." And that is what...


CLINTON: That is what I'm going to do, because America is worth fighting for. You are worth fighting for.

It was in this city that our founders declared America's independence and are permanent mission to form a more perfect union. Now, neither Senator Obama nor I, nor many of you, were fully included in that vision, but we have been blessed by men and women in each generation who saw America not as it is, but as it could and should be, the abolitionists and the suffragists, the progressives and the union members, the civil rights leaders...


CLINTON: ... all those who marched, protested, and risked their lives, because they looked into their children's eyes and saw the promise of a better future.

Because of them, I grew up taking for granted that women could vote. Because of them, my daughter grew up taking for granted that children of all colors could attend school together. And because of them, and because of you, this next generation will grow up taking for granted that a woman or an African-American can be the president of the United States of America.


CLINTON: I am so honored by the support and the hospitality of all of the people of Pennsylvania. And I want to especially thank Governor Rendell and Mayor Nutter...


CLINTON: ... Lieutenant Governor Catherine Baker Knoll, and State Treasurer Robin Wiessmann, and State Party Chair T. J. Rooney. These are great leaders and dear friends, as are my friends from the Congress, Representatives Murtha, Sestak, Schwartz, and Kanjorski.


CLINTON: Their support means the world to me, and the support of 100 mayors across this commonwealth and so many other state and local leaders who worked hard for this victory tonight.

I want to thank my friends in our labor unions for standing with us every step of the way.


CLINTON: And my outstanding staff, volunteers and supporters here in Pennsylvania and across America.


CLINTON: And I especially want to thank my family for their incredible love and support.


CLINTON: Bill and Chelsea have crisscrossed Pennsylvania from one end to the other.


CLINTON: My brothers, Hugh and Tony, who love Pennsylvania with all their hearts, from our childhood summers in Lake Winola, and my mother, who is with us tonight.


CLINTON: We still have a lot of work ahead of us. But if you're ready, I'm ready.

Now, I might stumble, and I might get knocked down. But as long as you'll stand with me, I will always get right back up. Because for me, in the end, the question isn't whether we can keep America's promise; it's whether we will keep America's promise.

So let me ask you -- let me ask you tonight, will we, will we once again be the can-do nation, the nation that defies the odds and does the impossible, will we break the barriers and open the doors and lift up all of our people?




CLINTON: Will we reach out to the world and lead by the power of our ideals again?




CLINTON: Will we take back the White House and take back our country?



CLINTON: I believe with all of my heart that together, we will turn promises into action, words will become solutions. Hope will become reality. So my answer to any who doubt is, yes, we will!

Thank you and God bless you!

COOPER: Clearly energized, Hillary Clinton now kissing her daughter, Chelsea, whom she thanked earlier in the speech, along with husband Bill Clinton, who's now getting up on the stage. As you listened to the speech, John King, what jumped out at you?

KING: Tenacity, as she's going on. She understands the math. She knows the math. She doesn't mention it in her speech.

The other thing that jumped out at me in about the first minute of the speech, she said, "Send money." She's winning tonight, but guess what? She knows that Obama has more money in the bank. She is low on money. Two weeks now to two critical contests. Striking to hear a candidate, as she says, "Thank you, I win," but almost in her very next breath say, "Send money."

COOPER: Early, she thought maybe that the money wasn't so important. Clearly, it is front and center to her on this night.

BORGER: Yes. I mean, she's got a campaign that's in debt. I was speaking with a Democrat online who's working with her campaign, and he said to me they need every penny in the next day that they can raise online to remain viable. So...

COOPER: She started off this month with some $8.5 million to use in this primary. Barack Obama...

BORGER: Forty-two million.

COOPER: ... $40 some-odd million dollars. We don't know how much cash she has on hand right now, but clearly, she needs every dime.

BORGER: Right. She's also loaned her campaign fund money.

MARTIN: And she needs the money even more so. It's more pronounced because, in Pennsylvania, she walked into that state 16, 20-point lead due to name recognition. A blue-collar state that appealed to her.

COOPER: You know...

MARTIN: He's leading North Carolina, but Indiana, she's only up two. That's where the money also makes a difference.

COOPER: The victory tonight, 8 percent is what we're looking at right now. It's like a Rorschach test how you want to read that. Some will say that is, you know, more than enough. Some will say it's not all that impressive. How do you see it, David Gergen?

GERGEN: If it stands up. Eight percent, by the way, is much higher than the exit polls suggested the final numbers would be. So we've got to wait out the rest of the night. But if it comes in at 8 percent, that's a very solid victory, not a spectacular one. Not the knockout she wanted, that people thought she needed but a very solid victory.

There was something else, though, about this speech tonight, Anderson, beyond the money. And that is how positive she went. She never went after Barack Obama in that speech. She did not eviscerate him. She didn't go negative.

I think there was a sense about her, she knows at the end of the day -- I do not think -- we've been talking about this. Is she going to go highly destructive for the rest of the campaign after Pennsylvania? I don't think the victory tonight was big enough for her to do that. I think that she...

COOPER: She did allude in her speech to Barack Obama, without saying him by name, when she said, "We were up against a formidable opponent, who outspent us 3 to 1, broke every spending record in the state, trying to knock us out of the race. Well, the people of Pennsylvania had other ideas."

And she also went on to say the presidency is the toughest job in the world, but the pressures of the campaign are nothing compared to the pressures of the White House. Obviously, a reference to some of the themes we heard a lot on the campaign trail.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her argument is not just with the voters -- or case is not just to the voters of Indiana and North Carolina, the next two contests of Kentucky and West Virginia still ahead on the calendar. Her argument, more and more and more, is to the super delegates.

And she needs to make the electability case. She needs to make the "I am the stronger candidate at the end. I may be behind him in pledged delegates. I may even end up behind him in the popular vote, but I'm winning the states, and I'm winning the voters that matter."

It's a very tough argument to make, but that is the best argument she has right now. And so she's going to make it as loud and as passionately as she can.

BORGER: And...

GERGEN: She didn't make it tonight. She didn't make the electability argument tonight. She said, "I'll fight for you." She didn't say, "I can win and he won't." That is what was interesting about it.

BORGER: Well, and instead of going negative now, Hillary Clinton has to go gracious, because she's hurt her own likeability. And talking to the super delegates, you have to say, "I can get voters to like me and to trust me again." And those are her two big problems. So she's already defined Barack Obama the way she wants to define him, in the negative way. Now she can afford to step back and act a little bit more gracious, which is I think what you saw tonight.

MARTIN: I think one of the big issues is, again, we know what she's going to do, but how is Obama going to, in essence, reverse this trend? How is he going to connect with key voters in North Carolina, and more importantly, Indiana? He has a significant test this campaign has to confront.

GERGEN: What we didn't hear tonight was a woman who thought -- or a candidate who thought, "I've really got him on the ropes now. I'm going to go for the jugular."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because she doesn't.

GERGEN: Because she doesn't.


GERGEN: That's right. And so she had, I think, Gloria, as a result of that, a more gracious speech. But it was interesting she chose to go that way, because the negativity of the campaign was disturbing to a lot of the voters who went to the polls. A whole lot of the voters tonight are saying, "If the other person wins this, I'm not voting for him or her. I'm going to vote for McCain or sit at home."

COOPER: Let's go to some of our other analysts. Jeffrey Toobin, I think earlier in the evening, I heard you say that the money you didn't think was so important. Clearly, though, for her right now, it seems very important.

TOOBIN: It's very important, but regardless of how much money she raises, she's going to Indiana. She's going to North Carolina. And on to Montana, Oregon. So obviously, the more money she has, the better. But there is no question any more that she is going forward.

I mean, if she had done poorly here, there was really some doubt whether this campaign would continue at all. But that, with an eight- point victory, it's clear she's here all the way.

COOPER: As we await Barack Obama's speech and as we still watch Hillary Clinton in the crowd, let's go to Amy Holmes. What stood out in the speech to you?

HOLMES: That she was positive right at the very top, which I think is actually an implicit rebuke of Barack Obama and the "bitter" comment, bitterly clinging to guns and religion, that she said the possibilities are endless.

I also thought it was interesting that she said that America is not a land of quitters and they need a president who won't quit, which I think underscores Jeffrey's point that she's going to stay all the way. I talked with a top Democratic fundraiser for Hillary Clinton tonight. He said I could call him a fat cat in Los Angeles. He's in close contact with the war room, and he was looking at we think it's going to be nine, possibly ten points tonight, and watch the money roll in. That this would really be a real boost to Hillary Clinton and her fundraising efforts.

And he also said, sort of for the, you know, inside political junkies, that he reminded me that fundraiser morale is way up because Mark Penn is out. And he thinks that -- he said that he thinks that her success tonight was because he's out that she got to be herself, go back to her roots and really connect with those blue-collar workers on economic issues.

COOPER: And if you were a super delegate, as you are, and you are -- hypothetically, well, just speaking for the super delegates, what do the super delegates take away from an eight-point victory, eight-percentage-point victory, if that's what it is?

BRAZILE: First of all, I thought Senator Clinton tonight in her speech really didn't speak to super delegates and try to address some of the process questions about electability. Rather, she talked to the voters. She talked to the American people.

She talked about her experiences -- experiences campaigning throughout that state over the last couple of weeks. She talked about their struggles and said, basically, "I will fight for you." She was talking to the voters in Indiana and North Carolina and the upcoming states. Because she knows that, in order to win or to have a chance of winning, she must win another big state.

COOPER: Paul Begala, is that what you heard?

BEGALA: Yes, and I liked that she didn't talk to insiders and talk to insiders. I love Donna, but she can call her about it on the phone and talk about it privately. She had a chance to talk to the country.

And, you know, very often with her speeches, and I love her, but she is a wonk. She gets up there, she's got more solutions than the country has problems. She's got a 17-point plan on the bee pollen issue. She didn't do that this time.

Usually, you know, there's about two feet of bullet-proof glass between her heart and that TV camera. This time, she whittled (ph) all that down. She talked about her family. This is hard for her to do. Talked about her grandfather, her mom, her daughter, her husband.

And then she closed with a really, for her, emotional story about a Medal of Honor winner who had encouraged her to campaign on and to fight on the way that he had fought and served for our country.

She'll never be Barack Obama, but I was really struck at not only the positive tone but at the personal and emotional quality of that speech, which is a difficult thing for her to do. COOPER: Jamal Simmons, as a Barack Obama supporter, do you expect that positive tone to continue on in Indiana, in North Carolina?

SIMMONS: We'll see. In the past, what's happened in Hillary Clinton has had these moments where she's been incredibly personal, incredibly positive. And everyone has responded very well.

But this election, I think people want to see that genuineness: what is it inside of you that makes you want to lead us? And what can we trust? And I think the more she does that, the better off that she is. And the Obama camp should be a little bit nervous that she learned the lesson this time and will keep it going.

But what's typically happened is she does that for a couple of days, and then it kind of drifts back into the Hillary Clinton that everybody, you know, is not so personally connected to.

So she's a strong politician. I think she can have a really good last run. But I'm just not sure that we're going to see this level of sort of personal interaction last beyond the next couple of days.

BEGALA: A quick update on the money. The Clinton campaign just e-mailed me. They are saying they raised $500,000 in the first hour after the polls closed. So you know, we were laughing when Terry McAuliffe, her campaign chairman, was on and saying "" And we were laughing when Hillary did it in her own speech. Hillary Clinton...


BEGALA: I'm not trying to...


BEGALA: ... in the campaign. Learn from each other. This is a really good thing. I like these primaries, and I don't think they're too bitter. Senator Obama has gotten more substantive, which he needed to be. Senator Clinton is becoming more personal, as she needs to be. She's now not raising money not off her fat cats but now trying to raise money off the Internet, like Obama.

COOPER: So is the lesson of Pennsylvania that -- that the kitchen sink works against Barack Obama, that I mean -- that hitting him on these issues he does not respond well to them?

BEGALA: I think going forward for her, her clear path to success is in humanizing Hillary rather than demonizing Barack. There are doubts that people had about Senator Obama.

COOPER: But don't you have to -- I mean, in order to change the math -- in order the change the math aggressively, doesn't -- don't you have to make him a train wreck?

BEGALA: I think there are -- look, there's a lot of banana peels between here and 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. She doesn't need to throw any more out there. He may stumble; he may not. But she's got to go and win, and that's what she did today. You know, she...

TOOBIN: Today she may have been positive, but this was a mostly negative campaign in Pennsylvania. And I think the message will be, all right, but...

COOPER: In "The New York Times" editorial tomorrow, I think it's called the "The Low Road to Victory." The Obama folks are already passing out copies of it. It's very critical.

TOOBIN: And really, it blames her for the low road.

COOPER: Right.

TOOBIN: Not him.

The irony of this margin, this 8-percent margin, if that's where it holds up, it's almost the perfectly status quo number. It's the worst -- exactly. It's the worst of all possible worlds, because much less people would have said, "Look, it's over. You can't -- it's a 5 percent margin."

If it were 12 percent margin, the super delegates might have been in a panic and really gone to Hillary. This, I think, freezes the situation precisely where it was going into this race.

HOLMES: Right. And I think that the really telling quote here is when Hillary said, "A win is a win." So we knew tonight that she was ahead. I think that she's in it to spin it, because she needs to spin it to the super delegates.

And she makes a pretty good argument. This was a bad six weeks for both candidates, and she was still able to make, I think, a pretty healthy lead here.

COOPER: We are going to take a short break. We are anticipating Barack Obama to step up to the mike any moment now. We will, of course, bring that to you live. We're going to take a short break.

Also, you can continue to follow along at We'll be right back.


COOPER: And we're actually just coming back, as we are anticipating Barack Obama any moment now. Wolf Blitzer is also standing by. Before Barack Obama begins his speech, we want to give you a sense of where the numbers are right now, where the percentages are right now in terms of the votes -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Thanks very much, Anderson.

Right now, 76 percent of the precincts have reported. And Hillary Clinton is maintaining that 8-point advantage. Fifty-four percent for Hillary Clinton, to Barack Obama's 46 percent.

If we take a look at the actual numbers that have come in, almost 1 million for Hillary Clinton, 901,562; 757,328 for Barack Obama. Seventy-six percent of the precincts reporting. An 8-percent advantage for Hillary Clinton right now.

Anderson Cooper, this is a race she had -- a lot of her supporters hoped she would win by ten points. But eight points is obviously not too bad.

COOPER: Not too bad. I'm sure they'll certainly take it.

Barack Obama is entering the stage. Let's take a look at the event. Barack there, Barack Obama with his wife Michelle, greeting some of their supporters.

You can hear John Mellencamp singing in the background. He actually was entertaining the crowd earlier this evening, just a short time ago while Hillary Clinton was speaking.

Let's listen in.

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, everybody. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you, Evansville. Thank you. Thank you, Evansville, thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Obama! Obama! Obama!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Obama! Obama! Obama!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Obama! Obama! Obama!

OBAMA: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, everybody.

Listen, there are a couple of thank-yous I've got to say. First of all, first of all, it's good -- it's good to be back in the Midwest. I am glad to see everybody here in Evansville.

I want to thank -- I want to thank -- I love you back. I want to thank John Mellencamp and his wonderful wife, Elaine, for taking the time to be here today, driving up from Bloomington. Give them a big round of applause.

And I want to thank your wonderful mayor, Jonathan Weinzapfel, and his lovely wife, Patricia, who have been just so gracious to both Michelle and myself.

I have repeatedly said, upon first meeting the mayor, that this guy's going somewhere. And mainly because, like me, he married up, and his wife is such an asset. But I'm so grateful for his support. It means so much. And Evansville, obviously, is going to be so important to this upcoming election.

Well, I want to thank all of you who are here tonight. But I want to start tonight by congratulating Senator Clinton on her victory this evening. And I want to thank -- I want to thank -- no, no, she ran a terrific race. I want to thank the hundreds of thousands of Pennsylvanians who stood with our campaign today. You know, there were a lot of folks who didn't think we could make this a race when it started. They thought we were going to be blown out. But we worked hard, and we traveled across the state to big cities and small towns, to factories and VFW halls. And now, six weeks later, we closed the gap. We rallied people of every age and race and background to the cause.

And whether they were -- whether they were inspired for the first time or for the first time in a long time, we registered a record number of voters. And it is those new voters who will lead our party to victory in November.

These Americans cast their ballots for the same reason you came here tonight. For the same reason that millions of Americans have gone door to door and given whatever small amounts they can to this campaign. For the same reason that we began this journey, just a few hundred miles from this spot, on a cold February morning in Springfield. Because we believe that the challenges we face are bigger than the smallness of our politics. And we know that this election is our chance to change it.

Fourteen long months, it's easy to forget -- after 14 long months, it's easy to forget what this campaign's about from time to time, to lose sight of the fierce urgency of this moment. It's easy to get caught up in the distractions and the silliness and the tit- for-tat that consumes our politics, the bickering that none of us are entirely immune to. And it trivializes the profound issues -- two wars, an economy in recession, a planet in peril -- issues that confront our nation.

But that kind of politics is not why we are here tonight. It's not why I'm here, and it's not why you're here.

We are here because of the more than 100 workers in Logansport, Indiana, who just found out that their company has decided to move its entire factory to Taiwan.

We're here -- we're here because the young man I met in Youngsville, North Carolina, who almost lost his home because he has three children with cystic fibrosis and couldn't pay their medical bills, who still doesn't have health insurance for himself or his wife and lives in fear that a single illness could cost him everything.

We're here because there are families all across this country who are sitting around the kitchen table right now, trying to figure out how they're going to pay their insurance premiums and their kid's tuition and still make the mortgage so that they're not the next ones in the neighborhood to put a "for sale" sign in their front yard. People will lay awake tonight, wondering if next week's paycheck will cover next month's bills.

We're not here to talk about change for change's sake. But because our families and our communities and our country desperately need it.

We're here -- we are here because we can't afford to keep doing what we've been doing for another four years. We can't -- we can't afford to play the same Washington games with the same Washington players and expect a different result. Not this time. Not now.

We already know what we're getting out of the other party's nominee. John McCain has offered this country a lifetime of service, and we respect that. But what he's not offering is any meaningful change from the policies of George W. Bush.

John McCain believes that George Bush's Iraq policy is a success, so he's offering four more years of a war with no exit strategy. A war that's sending our troops on their third tour, and their fourth tour and their fifth tour of duty. A war that's cost us billions of dollars and thousands of lives, thousands more grievously injured. A war that has not made us more safe but has distracted us from the task at hand in Afghanistan. A war that should have never been authorized and should have never been waged.

John McCain said that -- John McCain said that George Bush's economic policies have led to, and I quote, great progress over the last seven years. And so he's promising four more years of tax cuts for CEOs and corporations who didn't need them and weren't asking for them. Tax cuts that he once voted against because he said they offended his conscience.

Well, they may have stopped offending John McCain's conscience somewhere along the road to the White House. But George Bush's economic policies offend my conscience, and they still offend yours.

Because I don't think that the 232,000 Americans who have lost their jobs this year are seeing great progress the way John McCain has seen it. I don't think the millions of Americans losing their homes have seen that progress. I don't think the families without health care and the workers without their pensions have seen that progress.

And if we continue down the same reckless path, I don't think the future generations who will be saddled with debt will see these years of progress. We already know John McCain offers more of the same, so the question is not whether the other party will bring about change to Washington. We know they won't. The question is, will we? That's the question we face in this election. Because, because...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we can! Yes, we can!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we can! Yes, we can!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we can! Yes, we can!

OBAMA: Because, because the truth is, the challenges we face are not just the fault of one man or one party. I mean, think about it. How many years, how many decades have we been talking about solving our health-care crisis? How many presidents have promised to end our dependence on foreign oil? How many jobs have gone overseas in the '70s, and the '80s and the '90s, and we still haven't done anything about it? And we know why.

In every election, politicians come to your cities and your towns, and they tell you what you want to hear. And they make big promises. And they lay out all these plans and policies.

But then they go back to Washington when the campaign's over. Lobbyists spend millions of dollars to get their way. The status quo sets them, and instead of fighting for health care or jobs, Washington ends up fighting over the latest distraction of the week. It happens year after year after year after year, and this is our chance to say not this year! This is our chance to say not this time.

We have a choice in this election. We can be a party that says there's no problem with taking money from Washington lobbyists, from oil lobbyists, and drug lobbyists, and insurance lobbyists. We can pretend they represent real Americans and look the other way when they use their money and influence to stop us from reforming health care or investing in renewable energy for yet another four years.

Or this time, we can recognize that you can't be the champion of working Americans if you're funded by lobbyists who drown out their voices.

We can do what we've done in this campaign and say we won't take a dime of their money. We can do what I did in Illinois and in Washington and bring both parties together to reign in their power, so we can take our government back. That's the choice we have in this election.

We can be a party that thinks the only way to look tough on national security is to talk and act and vote like George Bush and John McCain. We can use fear as a tactic, the threat of terrorism to scare up votes.

Or we can decide that real strength is asking the tough questions before we send our troops in to fight. We can see -- we can see the threats we face for what they are. A call to rally all Americans and all the world against the common challenges of the 21st century. Terrorism and nuclear weapons. Climate change and poverty. Genocide and disease.

That's what it takes to keep us safe in this world. That's the real legacy of Roosevelt and Kennedy and Truman. That's why I'm running for president of the United States of America, to restore that legacy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Obama! Obama! Obama!


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Obama! Obama! Obama!

OBAMA: We can be a party that says and does whatever it takes to win the next election. We can calculate and poll test our positions, tell everyone exactly what they want to hear. Or we can be the party that doesn't just focus on how to win but why we should.

We can tell everyone -- we can tell everyone what they need to hear about the challenges we face. We can seek to regain not just an office but the trust of the American people, that their leaders in Washington will tell them the truth. That's the choice in this election.

We can be a party of those who only think like we do and only agree with all our positions. We can continue to slice and dice this country into red states and blue states. We can exploit the divisions that exist in our country for pure political gain.

Or this time we can build on the movement we started in this campaign, a movement that's united Democrats, independents, Republicans, young, old, rich, poor, white, black, Hispanic, Asian, Native American, gay, straight, because one thing I know, from traveling 46 states this campaign season, is that we are not as divided as our politics suggest.

We may have different stories, we may have different backgrounds, but we hold common hopes for the future of this country that we love.

In the end, this election is still our best chance to solve the problems we've been talking about for decades, as one nation, as one people. Fourteen months later, that is still what this election is about: millions of Americans who believe we can do better, that we must do better, that that is what's put us in the position to bring about real change.

And now it's up to you, Evansville. Now it's up to you, Indiana. You can decide...


You can decide whether we're going to travel the same worn path or whether we will chart a new course that offers real hope for the future. During the course of this campaign, we've all learned what my wife reminds me all the time, that I'm not a perfect man. I will not be a perfect president.

And so, while I will always listen to you and be honest with you and fight for you every single day for the next four or eight years...


... I will also...


I will also, should I have the opportunity to serve as your president, ask you to be a part of the change that we need, because in my two decades of public service in this country, I have seen time and time again that real change doesn't begin in the halls of Washington, but on the streets of America.


It doesn't happen from the top down, but it happens from the bottom up.

(APPLAUSE) I also know that real change has never been easy, and it won't be easy this time either. The status quo in Washington will fight. They will fight harder than ever to divide us and distract us with ads and attacks from now until November.

But don't ever forget that you have the power to change this country.


You can make this election about how we're going to help. You can make this election about how we're going to help those workers in Logansport, how we're going to retrain them and educate them, and make our workforce competitive in a global economy.

You can make this election about how we're going to make health care affordable for that family in North Carolina, how we're going to help those families sitting around the kitchen table tonight pay their bills and stay in their homes.

You can make this election about how we plan to leave our children, all our children, a planet that's safer and a world that still sees America the same way my father saw it from across the ocean, as a beacon of all that is good and all that is possible for all of mankind.


Now is our turn to follow in the footsteps of all those generations who sacrificed and struggled and faced down the greatest odds to perfect our improbable union.

And if we're willing to do what they did, if we're willing to shed our cynicism and our doubts and our fears, if we're willing to believe in what's possible again, then I believe we won't just win this primary election, we won't just win here in Indiana, we won't just win this election in November, we will change this country, we will change the world, we will keep this country's promise alive in the 21st century.


That's our task; that's our job. Let's get to work.

Thank you. May God bless you. God bless the United States of America.