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ISSUES WITH JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL
Jaycee`s Rescue Botched?; Li-Lo in Hiding?; Step-Mom Involved in Boy`s Disappearance?; Kidnapping Suspect Kills Himself
Aired July 8, 2010 - 19:00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST (voice-over): Tonight, horrifying suspicions circle over Kyron Horman`s step-mom. She was the last person to see this adorable little boy. Now, new reports say a botched police sting targeted that step-mom, but officers failed to arrest her. Did she turn the tables when she called the cops on the cops?
And disgusting new details in the twisted history of a dangerous sex offender. The man suspected of kidnapping beautiful little Alisa Maier shot himself in the face as cops closed in. Why did he let this little girl go? And are there more victims?
Also blood-boiling new details in Jaycee Dugard`s living hell. Police say she was kidnapped, raped and held captive for 18 horrifying years. Tonight, we now know parole officers actually spoke to Jaycee and her daughter during their captivity, but those parole officers never bothered to follow up. Could this nightmare have ended years earlier?
Plus, the party`s over for Lindsay Lohan. The Hollywood starlet is crying out, calling her sentence torture, inhumane. I can`t make this stuff up! Tonight I`ll talk one-on-one with Lindsay`s father, Michael Lohan. Does he agree with the jail time? And what does he think of shocking new reports on Lindsay`s use of prescription drugs?
ISSUES starts now.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight an explosive development in the Kyron Horman case. The missing boy`s father believes Kyron`s step-mom, Terri Horman, his wife, is, quote, "involved" -- that`s how he put it -- in his son`s disappearance. He says so in a court document. The judge just unsealed the restraining order. The contents are mind-blowing.
Plus, we`ve got the lowdown on that bungled police sting that targeted Terri Horman two weeks ago. Did it backfire when she calls the cops on the cops?
It`s now been five torturous weeks since little Kyron vanished from his school. His step-mom, Terri Horman, told investigators she saw him walking down the hallway and waved good-bye and left him there headed to class. At first, the family appeared to buy that explanation. Listen to Kyron`s biological mom back then.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DESIREE YOUNG, KYRON`S MOM: We know for sure that Terri dropped him off. That`s what we know for sure.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But now, with claims that Terri tried to hire a landscaper to murder her own husband, Kyron`s dad, everything has changed. Kaine`s parents do not believe Terri Horman`s explanation of what happened to Kyron and say she is no longer even cooperating with police.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TONY YOUNG, KYRON`S STEPFATHER: Since her last statement Thursday requesting that she cooperate with investigators, she has not contacted investigators and provided any information to assist in bringing Kyron home.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, stunning new reports the police tried to trap Terri in a sting operation by recruiting the landscaper she allegedly tried to hire to kill her husband. But that sting backfired. Whose fault is that? You be the judge.
And I`m taking your calls on this one: 1-877-JVM-SAYS. That`s 1- 877-586-7297.
Straight out to my fantastic expert panel. But we begin with investigative reporter Michelle Sigona who has got breaking news on the just-released restraining order.
Michelle, what`s in there? What`s the very latest?
MICHELLE SIGONA, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: There`s a lot in here, Jane. And a little bit of the information coming out from it is that Kaine, in his own words and in his own handwriting, states that police gave him probable cause to believe that, No. 1, Terri may have attempted to hire someone to kill him. And, No. 2, that Terri may have some sort of involvement with the disappearance of Kyron Horman.
And that is why he was granted this particular restraining order. There`s a lot of pages here. It goes on and on about a few of the places that she is not allowed to come into contact with them. It lists them out: the gym, Skyline Elementary School, things of that nature. We are learning a little bit more about this and exactly where Kaine stands tonight.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Midwin Charles, you see it right there. That`s his handwriting. That`s the handwriting of Kyron`s father. He is not mincing words. He is pointing the finger directly at his estranged wife.
MIDWIN CHARLES, LEGAL CONTRIBUTOR, TRUTV`S "IN SESSION": I think it`s very interesting how, you know, the minute this child goes missing he`s automatically pointing the finger at her. It really begs the question of what kind of relationship they had. I mean, to jump to such an accusation, he clearly must never have respected her or never have loved her. I mean, to think that the woman he married would have something to do with the disappearance of his child is mind boggling.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, wait a second. I have to bring Mike Brooks in on this. If cops call you and said, "Hello, I`d like to inform you, sir, that it`s our belief that your wife tried to hire a landscaper to rub you out," I think that might change the equation. That`s a game- changer, isn`t it, Mike?
MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: It really is, Jane. And you know, it was interesting because in the report, too, in the -- in the order, it says about firearms basically, he says, "I don`t know, but" circle -- he underlined that part. Because he was really in fear of his life. Otherwise, why would he take their little infant and get out of there? Because he felt there was imminent danger of something happening to him because law enforcement told him this.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, this brings me to my big issue tonight. And hang in there. This is complicated. We ask the question were cops stung by their own sting?
They warned Kaine Horman that his wife allegedly tried to hire a landscaper to murder him. Kaine moves out right away, taking their baby daughter.
The very same day that he leaves, June 26, undercover cops reportedly arrive at the Horman house for a sting operation with the very landscaper she allegedly tried to hire to murder her husband wearing a wire.
Now, isn`t that bad timing, Brenda Wade? I mean, Terri Horman, the step-mom, has to know something is fishy here. You know, she ends up calling the cops on this guy. And so she`s basically calling the cops. They show up, and they confront the undercover cops who were there with the landscaper on this sting operation. What horrible timing!
BRENDA WADE, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, the whole thing seems very confusing, Jane. But one thing is clear, that this is a family with a history of instability.
I took a little time and looked at their histories. And you know, we`ve got Terri, who`s had other relationships, has a child elsewhere. We have the father, who has little Kyron, who was from his first marriage. With all this instability, one of the things I always look at as a psychologist is how much glue is there?
So when we say, "Gee, isn`t it odd he would just jump up and leave," No. 1, yes, there`s a very serious threat here. The man is afraid for his life. But the No. 2 thing is in a stable, healthy marriage, does your wife really want to kill you?
There`s a deeper issue. And I think we do need to look more deeply, because in families that are stable we don`t usually find kids disappearing in the hands of their stepmother and -- let`s put two and two together -- the stepmother was the last person to see this little boy.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to bring in Jaime Wilson, a reporter with KPTV on the ground.
Jaime, there is this convoluted sting operation. We`re trying to explain it to our viewers. All of this went down apparently about two weeks ago on June 26th. Tell us what happened that day.
JAIME WILSON, REPORTER, KPTV: Well, the frustrating part of all of this, Jane, is that police won`t confirm any of those details with us. Earlier this week, my colleagues and I were able to confirm with a source close to the investigation, an anonymous source that we`re not naming, that that sting actually did happen.
But when we ask investigators directly about these things, they will not confirm them with us. But what we`re hearing...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tell us about the sting.
WILSON: What we`re hearing is that police sent an undercover officer to Terri Horman`s property with this landscaper, who she allegedly asked to kill her husband, that she may pay him for that. And apparently, they went to the house and tried to get Terri to talk about this offer that she made him. But she shut it down. She was having no part of it. And that is the day that she apparently called 911 saying that someone on her property was making threats.
So we`re hearing that she did not mention anything about that offer that day.
BROOKS: It`s called cold feet. It`s called cold feet, Jane. They went there wired up to try to get her to talk about this. This is how murder for hire plots go down. She approached the landscaper. The landscaper goes, OK. He goes to the cops. They get an undercover officer to go, "Hey, I`m going to be the hit man. How do you want it done?"
They try to get her to talk about how she wants it done. Wait a second. And then all of a sudden she gets cold feet and says -- maybe she said, "I don`t want to do this anymore." Then she most likely called 911 to cover her own butt.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But it gives her...
WILSON: Keep in mind, though, if I can...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold on.
WILSON: If I can interject, though.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK, go ahead.
WILSON: keep in mind, though, that this landscaper apparently was approached with this offer about seven or eight months ago.
WILSON: So the question is why didn`t he go police then? Again, none of this is being confirmed so we don`t know. But if a layman in the community, anyone is approached with an offer like this, you would hope that they go to police immediately and not wait for this family to be cast in the spotlight.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jaime, I agree -- I agree with that. But what I`ve got to get in here is why choose that particular day to launch the sting operation? The guy you`re looking at right there is just leaving the woman you`re looking at right there that very day. He has just learned about this plot. He is terrified for his life. He`s packing up. Saying, "Bye, I`m out of here. I`m taking the kid."
That`s the day that you decide to launch a sting operation? And "Hello, ma`am. I`d like to discuss that alleged plot that you were concocting several months ago." It doesn`t -- somebody help me out here. It sounds like horrible timing to me. Midwin Charles.
CHARLES: It does sound like horrible timing, but Jane, this is the thing that I`m wondering about myself. Maybe the landscaper didn`t come forward until he saw her photograph and then he said to the police, "Hey, that woman contacted me" or he saw the name, something like that. They may not have had the info. I don`t know. Call me crazy but that`s my theory.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Mike Brooks, on the other side -- think about this. On the other side we`ll take callers and also ask you. Why let the husband know? Why not do the sting while there`s still the appearance that everything is normal? Because once the husband leaves, that`s a signal to her that...
BROOKS: Well, maybe they didn`t think he was going to leave all of a sudden. Maybe they told him to stay and he goes, no, I`m getting out of there. Because in the report it said about when did this all start. And it says end of 2009. So I don`t know.
Everyone, stay right where you are. Did police complicate the desperate search for this little boy? We`re taking your calls on this. They`re stacking up: 1-877-JVM-SAYS.
Plus a sex offender suspected of kidnapping kills himself as cops close in. We`ll go inside his sick and twisted past.
But first stunning new details in little Kyron`s disappearance. The father now pointing the finger directly at his estranged wife, Kyron`s step-mom.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAINE HORMAN, KYRON`S FATHER: I saw him the day of the science fair that morning and was just really proud of him for his -- all the work he put into his project and gave each other a couple big hugs and just told him to have a great day at the fair.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
D. YOUNG: You need to do what is right, not for me, not for Tony, not for Kaine and not even for Kyron. You need to do it for Kiara, because she needs to see that you did the right thing to help bring her brother home.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Kyron`s biological mother, Desiree Young, and his father, Kaine Horman, plan to hold another news conference in just a few minutes. Kyron`s mom made this tearful plea on Tuesday. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
D. YOUNG: Kyron, we love you and we miss you. We remain here working hard every day to get you home. Please do not be afraid, because the police are going to find you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Reporter Jaime Wilson from KAPTV waiting for the news conference to begin. She joins us on the ground where this is all going down.
Jaime, do we know what the parents are going to talk about in a few minutes?
WILSON: We don`t. But for the last couple of weeks, as I`m sure you`ve seen, they`ve kind of shied away from the media. But in the last few days and as we`ve gotten more in touch with them, they`re opening up more. They understand how this works, that the more they get their faces out there, the more they keep talking about Kyron and the case, the more interest there is going to be in this story.
But we don`t know what they`re going to say today. They have definitely said "no comment" when it comes to a lot of questions related specifically to the investigation, specifically to Terri.
But as you just played in that clip, they have started making very public pleas to her directly. Kyron`s mom looked right in the camera last week and said, "Terri, we implore you to cooperate with this investigation."
So you can see that Kaine, Desiree and Desiree`s husband, Tony, they have formed a united front, standing very far away from Terri now. They have distanced themselves from her, and they are asking her to please cooperate with police.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Gail, South Carolina, your question or thought, ma`am.
CALLER: Hi, Jane.
CALLER: What could be the connection between Kyron`s disappearance and the murder-for-hire plot? What does or did she have to gain?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Mike Brooks, it`s an excellent question. Does one translate to the other? Is there a connect the dots here?
BROOKS: You know, that`s a great question. And I think that`s one that investigators are still trying to figure out, Jane, because why would she want her husband dead but then why get rid of little Kyron? To have a fresh start with her new little baby? That`s a great question. And I don`t know if law enforcement has actually figured that out yet.
WADE: There is an old Greek myth, Jane, where the mother gets back at the father by killing the children. And I`m not saying Terri did it, because I don`t have any evidence. But this is an old story. If she`s angry enough with her husband to try to kill him or allegedly get a plot going to try to kill him, why wouldn`t she want to get rid of his son? This is his son, not hers, remember.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Well, many people said the same thing about Andrea Yates. Remember the mother who drowned their five children. And they said she was resentful of her husband, because he was constantly keeping her pregnant, and she was in a very restricted kind of lifestyle with him. And she ended up drowning her five children. Of course, she was also found not guilty by reason of insanity.
WADE: She was also severely depressed. She was severely depressed.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s interesting to note, as well, Midwin Charles, that on this very day that little Kyron disappeared, the step-mom, Terri Horman, was supposed to drive him 110 miles to the halfway point to give him to Desiree, the biological mother, because there was this sort of handoff back and forth of the child, even though the step-mom, with his biological father, had the boy most of the time.
I would think there could be some resentment surrounding that kind of a drive.
CHARLES: Well, there might be resentment going all around. I mean, for all intents and purposes, perhaps they didn`t have the best relationship. But I have yet to see the evidence, I mean solid evidence, that this woman had anything to do with Kyron`s disappearance. I know that everyone is just conjecturing and just assuming that this woman is guilty of kidnapping, but where is the evidence? This woman is innocent until proven guilty. And let`s not forget that.
SIGONA: She is innocent until proven guilty, but we also do have to look at the new order that came out, which Kaine says in his own writing that police had presented him with probable cause that Terri may have some sort of involvement with Kyron`s disappearance. So this again -- and then the judge, of course, did, in fact, grant this particular order. So that`s just something else to consider.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Paulette, Ontario, your question or thought, ma`am?
CALLER: Yes, ma`am. I think that she might have been on the phone, trying to hire another hit man or something, thinking the gardener wasn`t going to do it. And the little boy might have overheard her and said, "I`m going to tell my dad," and then she had to figure a way right quick to stop him from doing that.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Brilliant, brilliant idea. Jaime Wilson, what were your thoughts?
WILSON: Well, I was just about to say, as one of your guests mentioned, Terri has not been called a person of interest or a suspect yet. In the five weeks that I have been covering the case, they haven`t mentioned any suspects at all, and today is literally the first day that we have seen something in print.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Got to leave it right there. Thank you, fantastic panel.
Lindsay Lohan`s dad, Michael Lohan, joins me next to talk about her problems.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight astonishing developments in the Alisa Maier case. The 4-year-old little girl, who is now home following that horrifying abduction ordeal. And her suspected kidnapper? He is dead. Killed himself.
Just hours ago Alisa arrived to a round of applause from family and friends gathered at her home in Missouri. Alisa`s hair was dramatically different. You can see it right there. It was chopped off at some point during her day in captivity.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Identified the guy last night when she seen him on TV, said, "That`s the man that cut my hair."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: The suspect, 38-year-old Paul Smith, died last night. He shot himself when cops stormed his home as he was painting over his car. That`s the vehicle right there. It was used to snatch this child, it`s believed. Cops went back to that same property within the past hour searching for something. We don`t know what.
You know Smith. OK, the suspect that killed himself, he was a registered sex offender. You`re looking at him right there. He had sodomized a 10-year-old boy in 1995. Are cops looking for more evidence of abuse, perhaps other victims?
Brenda Wade, psychologist, let`s talk about the psychological impact this abduction will have on this precious child. You saw her there a second ago. She seems fine, but is that the whole story?
WADE: No, it`s not the whole story, Jane. And we know that what happens when there`s any kind of childhood trauma, a child`s brain is not complete. So what happens is whatever go on outside goes right in. There`s no filter. That child internalizes it at a deep level.
She is definitely going to have feelings of not being safe around people. There`s going to probably be a post traumatic stress syndrome. She is going to need therapy. She needs it now. The main thing you have to remember about children is they are not miniature adults. Their brains are different. She needs stability. She needs a routine. She needs to be made to feel safe and therapy right away.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s so nice, though, to see her smiling like that.
WADE: Isn`t it great?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s just heart warming. We cover so many horrific stories.
WADE: I`m glad we get to cover a story about a child being recovered, Jane.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. It makes us all very, very happy. Why was little Alisa`s hair chopped off? Clearly...
WADE: Clearly, he was trying -- yes, he was trying to disguise her, trying to disguise the car. This is a guy with a history. And if we want to understand why somebody is the way they`re doing, what they`re doing, look at the history. This is a sex offender. And this is the problem with sex offenders, Jane. We know this is a crime that will be repeated over and over.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me ask you this question. I want to jump in and ask you a specific question.
WADE: Go right ahead.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK. He attacked a 10-year-old little boy in 1995. Now he apparently went after a girl. Some people, that couldn`t compute. But is that something predators do? The gender doesn`t matter?
WADE: Absolutely. It doesn`t matter. For many predators the gender does not matter. Some predators, God forbid, have a preference. But we know that often it doesn`t matter. It`s just availability of the child. And I`m willing to bet that between 1995 and 2010 there are other victims. The problem with sex offending is that it is an addictive illness. That predator is a person with a terrible illness, and no child who gets near a predator is safe.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, once again, we can only hope this child emerged completely unscathed. She has no visible signs of injury, and she is smiling. That makes us all very, very...
WADE: All the injuries invisible in a case like this.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Brenda, don`t go away. Outrage in the Jaycee Dugard case. Did parole officers talk to Jaycee during her captivity and do absolutely nothing?
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HLN HOST: Blood-boiling new details in Jaycee Dugard`s living hell. Police say she was kidnapped, raped and held captive for 18 horrifying years. Tonight we now know parole officers actually spoke to Jaycee and her daughter during their captivity but those parole officers never bothered to follow up. Could this nightmare have ended years earlier?
Plus the party`s over for Lindsay Lohan. The Hollywood starlet is crying out, calling her sentence torture, inhumane. I can`t make this stuff up.
Tonight I`ll talk one-on-one with Lindsay`s father Michael Lohan. Does he agree with the jail time? And what does he think of shocking new reports on Lindsay`s use of prescription drugs?
Jaw-dropping developments in the case of kidnapping victim Jaycee Dugard: a shocking new report prepared by the state attorney general`s office details the colossal failure by authorities to supervise her alleged captor Phillip Garrido and rescue Jaycee.
Are you sitting down, people? It says parole agents actually spoke face to face with Jaycee and one of her daughters during her 18-year- long ordeal but they didn`t investigate at all, asked no questions, did no follow-up, did no background check. Really.
So they talked to two young women, one of them a minor, staying with a convicted sex offender and the bells just don`t go off. These are parole officers.
What in the name -- I want to hear your thoughts on this. Call me 1-877-JVM-SAYS, 1-877-586-7297.
Back with me to talk about these appalling revelations: Dr. Brenda Wade; also joining me attorney, Anita Kay; and we are very honored to have one of my heroes Katie Callaway-Hall. She was kidnapped and raped by Phillip Garrido way back in 1976. She has become an advocate for victims` rights turning her pain into something very important to make this world a safer place.
Katie, as a victim of Phillip Garrido, what do you think about these stunning revelations that they talked to Jaycee and her daughter and did nothing?
KATIE CALLAWAY-HALL, VICTIM OF PHILLIP GARRIDO: Well, given what we know now about all of the errors that were committed by the parole boards, both California state and federal. Let`s not forget that the first ten years he was under federal supervision and it was during that time that he got Jaycee and had her in his backyard for like seven years. So let`s not leave the feds out of this equation.
But I think it`s just unbelievable -- it`s just one more astonishing fact in a long line of errors that we`re finding out.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Does it make you mad personally inside? Does it retrigger your rage or your fear?
CALLAWAY-HALL: It does. It retriggers my anger about the fact that I went to the parole board -- the federal parole board and told them that I felt that he had broken his parole -- he had violated his parole and approached me when he first got paroled and I told them he was dangerous. They acted like I was bothering them, that I was, you know, lying to them. They never -- I don`t think they believed me.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m going to give the slew of -- here`s my big issue tonight. Incredible incompetence. Incredible incompetence. In fact, you can take off the question mark on that one.
There are a slew of problems in this case. The report charges the state parole board misclassified Garrido as a low risk offender despite the fact that he had kidnapped and raped you, Katie. He was sentenced to 50 years for attacking you; he served only 11. Then when they let him out as you just mentioned he went and visited you --
CALLAWAY-HALL: Yes he did.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: -- and terrorized you and they did nothing about it. They never even told you he was getting out.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Then in more than one instance 911 calls were made claiming that children were living in tents behind Phillip Garrido`s home. Those were not properly investigated or reported to his parole officer. Not only did officers see and speak to Jaycee who he raped over 18 years, but they also met with the oldest daughter that she had as a result of those encounters, and they accepted that she was his niece, just accepted it.
Anita Kay, what the heck is going on with our parole system?
ANITA KAY, ATTORNEY: Well, Jane, while it is shocking, unfortunately, I am not surprised. It`s -- you know, the parole board - - not that I`m going to make excuses for parole officers. But they have too many cases. They`re not out there on a regular basis supervising the people that they need to be supervising because as a parolee, Phillip Garrido -- he has no privacy rights. So the parole officers can come to his house and say we`re searching every part of your house, every part of your backyard, and we`re going to see what we find. Maybe we find something. Maybe we don`t.
But he`s a registered sex offender. There is a child on the property. That alone should have hauled him back off to prison. He shouldn`t be around children absolutely.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: There`s a pattern here.
KAY: Right. Right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: There`s another case that put a spotlight on California`s parole system and that was this year`s conviction of John Gardner. We covered this case a lot here on ISSUES.
This monster admitted to raping and killing two precious children, Amber Dubois and Chelsea King. Well, it turns out way before that happened back in 2000 Gardner pleaded guilty to molesting and pummeling a 13-year-old girl. They only gave him five years behind bars.
After that, when he got out, he had numerous parole violations, one just a few days before he was released from parole supervision. They let him get off parole. They took off his GPS bracelet and he went on to rape and kill Amber Dubois and Chelsea King.
Katie Callaway-Hall, I have to put it back to you. This is criminal. It`s criminal on the part of the powers that be.
CALLAWAY-HALL: It is. And they should not let these people out of prison. If they had left Garrido in prison where I put him in the first place, then Jaycee Lee Dugard would have never happened. But if they had in fact listened to me when he was paroled and my fears of how dangerous he was -- he had shown me personally, you know -- then possibly she would have at least been found sooner and I wouldn`t have had to live in fear for 22 years as well.
KAY: And Jane, part of the issue here --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me go to Bob for a second.
KAY: The issue here is we`re not looking at the history. Garrido`s first victim was actually his first wife, whom he also kidnapped, gouged her eyes, beat her. I mean, there`s a history here. We do not look at people`s history and put one and one together and get two. That is always a predictor of violence and acting out. If you see it over here, you`re going to see it over here.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Bob in California, your question or thoughts, sir.
BOB, CALIFORNIA (via telephone): I was just wondering what kind of qualifications do you have to have to be a parole officer? I mean obviously these people are not doing their jobs and still collecting a paycheck. I pay taxes. Not just parole officers but everybody in general in the government.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I totally agree with you. I`ve never called the government once in my life where they ever picked up a phone. These self-perpetuating bureaucracies that have very little oversight are really morally corrupt.
The spokesman for the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation said, in connection with the John Gardner case, quote, "Frankly, if we were to blanket the system of parolees with minor offenses we would overwhelm the system. We would close down the system," end quote.
Guess what. They ended up having to p $20 million to Jaycee Dugard and her two kids because of their screw-ups -- $20 million.
Now, Katie Callaway-Hall, if they had taken that $20 million and put it into maybe training these parole agents or getting more of them or whatever the heck they have to do so that they do their job, wouldn`t that be smarter than ruining a whole bunch of lives including yours and Jaycee`s and then just throwing money at the situation?
CALLAWAY-HALL: Absolutely. Or even in prison costs. You know, they`re going to end up paying a lot more in settlements than it would cost them to keep these repeat offenders or just sex offenders in prison because it`s proven they can`t be rehabilitated. Just keep them there. Save us all a lot of headache.
BRENDA WADE, PSYCHIATRIST: The other side of this is since the system is broken, I want every parent to be aware that we have to be vigilant and we have to know where sex offenders are. We have to track them. We have to keep our children close, keep our children safe, because we can`t count on government to protect us.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: You know what? Kids can`t walk to the school bus anymore. Because a lot of these cases, Chelsea King was jogging, Amber was walking to school. I mean it`s pathetic. The criminal justice system is reactive.
You can`t take credit for a crime that doesn`t occur. That`s the big problem. And nobody is going to be proactive to do the prevention that will stop the crime from happening because that`s not where the glory is. The glory is catching the person after they kill. We have to undo that reactive system.
Thank you, wonderful panel.
Up next, Lindsay Lohan is being put behind bars. That`s what they say, anyway. We`re going to talk to her dad Michael Lohan about the starlet`s downward spiral and prescription drugs.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LINDSAY LOHAN, ACTRESS: I don`t want you to think that I don`t respect you and your terms because I really did think I was doing what I was supposed to do. And I mean that with all my heart.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Lindsay Lohan`s party girl lifestyle implodes on her. Has the starlet finally hit rock bottom? Lindsay breaks down about lockdown and goes into hiding posting delusional rants on Twitter about the injustice of it all. As her dad worries about her drug abuse and her high-powered celebrity attorney allegedly quits on her. That`s right, walks out.
Lindsay reportedly vows, "I`m not going to jail." Is she planning on appealing? Lohan tearfully pleaded with the judge, spare me from the big house, please.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LOHAN: I know that I was ordered to go once a week. And it wasn`t -- you know, I wasn`t missing the classes just to hang out or do anything like that. I was working mostly. In morocco the trip I was working with children. It wasn`t a vacation. It wasn`t some sort of a joke. And I respect you and I`ve been taking you seriously.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But the judge just didn`t buy it. Lindsay couldn`t manage to make it to her alcohol ed classes once a week but she did manage to hit the town almost every single night with a scram bracelet strapped to her ankle. That scram bracelet went off triggering another batch of excuses.
The judge had sentenced her to 90 days in jail plus three months in rehab. Lindsay`s reaction: well, you can read it on her manicure. She has "F-U" written right there on her middle fingernail.
Plus, is Lindsay on a dangerous downward spiral, is she feeding her addiction by popping this little powerful mood altering prescription pills. We`re going to go inside the shocking probation report I am holding in my hand, what is she now? What is she on?
Right now, I am talking one-on-one with Lindsay`s dad.
Michael Lohan, thank you for joining us, sir. I know you think Lindsay needs rehab, not jail. I know you`re hunting for the doctors you believe are enabling your addict daughter.
How did you feel -- let me start by asking you this -- how did you feel when your daughter was weeping in court and do you think she was high on prescription pills during her plea to the judge right there?
MICHAEL LOHAN, LINDSAY LOHAN`S FATHER: There is absolutely no doubt that she was on prescription medication. And I thank you, Jane, because this needs to be discussed not only with Lindsay but with other -- other kids or adults that are -- have succumbed to prescription medication. And that`s so easily written by these Dr. Feel-Goods. It`s -- it`s pathetic. Something has to be done.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, let me make sure I understand it. You`re telling me at the video we`re looking at right there, she is in court, she`s making her plea. You`re saying that you believe she was high on prescription drugs?
M. LOHAN: Jane, this is my daughter. I raised her up until she was 18 years old and Dina and I got divorced. I know when my daughter is straight, when she`s high, I can tell when she`s drinking or high on the phone. And she knows it.
I`ve been saying for a long time that she is a vacant body. She`s just a vessel right now. Her spirit is gone. She`s glossed over and she`ll never be the same unless she gets off prescription drugs. Or I just -- I just fear the worst.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But you -- you saw her eyes in court?
M. LOHAN: Oh, yes. Jane, when she was robbed, when she was robbed at her apartment and I had to move her into --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But I`m talking about court.
M. LOHAN: Yes, yes, absolutely.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: What did you see?
M. LOHAN: I was -- I was terrified. I said, I even said to my lawyer, to Lisa Bloom. I said, Lisa, look at how high she is. I said, I can`t believe this and -- and her lawyer is sitting there and Dina is sitting at home knowing what`s going on and no one is doing anything.
And that`s why -- you know, Shawn is a nice lady. I like her. I respect her for her ethical obligations toward representing Lindsay. But there was a moral obligation too. And for almost a year we`ve been asking Shawn -- not quite a year. We`ve been asking Shawn to help us get Lindsay into a rehab and off prescription meds.
And she says even though I know she needs to be in a rehab I have to represent her. And I have to do my best, I have to do whatever she wants to do. I said so Shawn, if Lindsay --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Are you glad she quit?
M. LOHAN: Yes, I am. Because if Lindsay dies on her watch, is she going to take responsibility because she wants to represent her the right way instead of represent her as a human being?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let`s get to the details of the drugs. Lindsay`s probation report -- I`m holding in my hands shows the actress tested positive for opiates and amphetamines.
M. LOHAN: Right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Why is that ok with her parole officer? Let me go to the list first.
M. LOHAN: Right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Lindsay`s prescribed Ambien, the stimulant Adderall, two antidepressants and the powerful painkiller Dilaudid.
M. LOHAN: Yes.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: That`s a painkiller likened to morphine and heroin. Now, she got that after her wisdom teeth were pulled out more than a month ago.
I`ve got to go to Howard Samuels. Why on earth are they saying it`s ok for her to take these powerful drugs now a month after she had dental work? Who -- who dropped the ball in the probation officer`s office?
HOWARD SAMUELS, ADDICTION SPECIALIST: I`ve got to tell you, Jane, it`s an absolute joke to have this report of her taking Dilaudid. I mean, it`s -- it`s a crime. I mean, the doctors who are prescribing the Dilaudid, the Ambien, I mean, -- the Adderall. I mean it`s a joke and this is what is a joke about a lot of these feel-good doctors; I mean, we -- something has to be done.
M. LOHAN: Thank you, thank you.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Michael, you want Lindsay to check into rehab instead of jail.
M. LOHAN: Thank you, yes. Right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: But your daughter has already been to rehab three times already. Check this out.
M. LOHAN: Right.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARSHA N. REVEL, JUDGE: She said, "I`m sober. I just left two weeks ago from promises in Malibu. I completed my stay and I will continue to be drug free. I don`t do drugs." And then the urine sample came out positive for cocaine. So she lied then. She lied prior to that and after that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Addicts lie. We all know that.
Jennifer Giminez, you run "Sober House". If she is going to allowed to remain on these prescription pills isn`t all this effort to get her sober pointless? You can`t get sober when you`re high.
M. LOHAN: Right.
JENNIFER GIMINEZ, STAR OF VH1`S "SOBER HOUSE": Yes, I know -- you definitely can`t get sober when you`re high.
M. LOHAN: Thank you.
JIMENEZ: It`s really useless at this point if she`s going to continue being on the pills. Basically it sounds like a suicide cocktail mix.
M. LOHAN: Yes it is.
GIMINEZ: And that`s the sad thing is she`s 23 years old on all these medications, shame on the doctors for giving her all of this and allowing that. And shame on everyone else who keeps co-signing everything that she`s doing.
M. LOHAN: Thank you.
GIMINEZ: And it`s so sad to hear Michael say like if she dies. Like my parents were going through that but my mom threw me in rehab. I think this is definitely the consequences of her behavior, her disease. And she`s so knee deep and so thick deep into her disease, she doesn`t know right from wrong, you know.
And like shame on the mom and people who are saying it`s ok to --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well -- let me jump in here. I say shame on the system that is so clueless about addiction that in this probation report I`m holding in my hands, they just blithely mention, oh, she`s taking all these drugs.
That`s what I don`t understand, Michael. Thank God I know that -- that these are mood-altering drugs.
M. LOHAN: They are and -- and I have to -- I want to thank you Howard for stepping to the plate and saying that -- you too Jennifer, for backing me up on this plea.
But also I want to just make one other point. I`m not saying Lindsay should go to a traditional rehab because a lot of rehabs put Lindsay on medication when she went in. I was astounded to see how many different kinds of medications Lindsay was put on when she went to Cirque Lodge. When she came out she came out on more prescriptions than she was on when she went into the place.
So I think that any rehab should take people off all medication that they`re on and get them completely sober and start organically from the beginning.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Listen, everybody, stay right there. I`m reeling from the fact that the probation officer says, oh yes, she is on all these drugs. That`s ok because she went to the dentist a month ago.
We`re back with Lindsay`s dad after the break.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
L. LOHAN: I wanted to make sure that I would come back here making you happy and the court system and show that I meant everything I told you. And going more than once a week, I would try to do that only because I knew I had to work the next week. I figured -- and as far as I knew they were ok with this and it was still in compliance.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: A downward spiral for Lindsay Lohan. Is the actress abusing prescription pills? We are talking to her father, Michael, about her 90-day sentence which, by the way, she`s probably only going to serve 10 percent of it which is going to be 23 days.
Michael, are you worried in between now and the time she has to hand herself in, she could go on some kind of prescription pill binge because she is so upset and that is the only thing she can do without her SCRAM going off.
M. LOHAN: Absolutely. But Jane, understand and I think Howard will tell and so will Jennifer that when you are on these medications you can`t just stop them. You have to be weaned off or you`ll seizure. It is not like getting off, stopping cocaine, a psychological addiction where you can just stop and not party anymore.
This is a physical addiction that gets into her system and it becomes part of her life. When she is pleading like this, this poor kid is lying through her teeth. But that is not her. Those are the drugs talking. Like you said before, drug addicts are liars. She has a disease. She needs help.
And I want to know and I`m not pointing the finger at Dina but why isn`t Dina taking these bottles getting the names of the doctors` offices and turning them over to the authorities to investigate why she is on these pills and to get her off?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Dina was very upset about her being sentenced to jail. I mean Dina seems to feel pretty much the way Lindsay feels that this is a huge injustice.
M. LOHAN: Dina is in denial. She is more interested in about ripping off Fudgy the Whale (ph) from Carvelle than she is taking care of her own kid. And I have an issue with that.
They are out there shooting a documentary on Lindsay`s life now instead of trying to get her with -- this guy from Hollywood.tv this Sharaj Hasan (ph) who is more interested in money than my daughter`s life.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: We have to leave it right but. But we`re going to stay on top of this. Michael please come back. We are concerned about your daughter. We want her to get really sober, not fake sober.
M. LOHAN: Jane, thank you. Thank you everybody.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Thanks, panel.
Guess what somebody sent me this ginormous, ginormous gavel and I`m going to use it for my issue tonight.
For 80 days, millions of gallons of oil have been pumping Black Death in the Gulf Coast. BP has ruined an entire way of life and they have given us zero reason to believe there is any end in sight.
But get this, a BP top executive is now fully predicting that in a perfect world the oil spill could be contained by the end of July. Why in the hell would you expect us to believe that? Absolutely nothing you had done, BP, has worked very well so far.
And now you are dealing with hurricanes and tropical storms. Trust me, when their prediction falls through BP is going to blame it all on Mother Nature. But this isn`t about Mother Nature. This is about money. Every time BP announces they`re getting a little closer to fixing the well, the company stock inches up. I`m no financial genius but wouldn`t you keep feeding stockholders that BS to help out your company?
This isn`t about saving the gulf. This is about saving BP and that is really BS. And that`s my issue.
But guess what? I`m not the only one who`s fired up. Here is one of our viewers with his on ISSUES video rant.
Good night, everyone.