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PIERS MORGAN TONIGHT
Interview With Donald Trump; Interview With Senator Schumer; One-on-One with Whoopi Goldberg
Aired April 13, 2011 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PIERS MORGAN, HOST: Tonight, Donald Trump, no holds barred. What does he think about this?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: What do you think of Donald Trump banging on about this every day at the moment?
MAYA SOETORO-NG, PRESIDENT OBAMA'S SISTER: Well, I think it's a shame. I think that my brother should definitely be president for a second term.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: Everybody is talking about him and tonight I want to give Donald Trump the chance to respond.
And speaking of no holds barred, we've also got Whoopi Goldberg.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WHOOPI GOLDBERG, ACTRESS/HOST: I don't generally talk about the trapeze in my room but that's a whole other thing.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: Oscar winner, comedian, talk show host, Broadway producer, most importantly, never short of a word or two.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: You've become really quite squeaky clean, haven't you?
GOLDBERG: Well, I still smoke cigarettes. And I don't have a boyfriend.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: Tonight one on one with Whoopi Goldberg.
This is PIERS MORGAN TONIGHT.
Donald Trump has been a harsh critic of President Obama and perhaps not coincidentally is tied for the lead in the crowded field of Republican presidential contenders.
Donald Trump joins me on the phone now.
Donald, you must be hating this, you're the center of attention.
DONALD TRUMP, REAL ESTATE BILLIONAIRE/REALITY TV STAR (via phone): Well, I really find it to be interesting, because as you know I've done a great job as a businessman but I'm not a politician, and maybe that's what's resonating with people. I don't know.
But I was happy to see your CNN poll. And frankly there are other polls that are coming out even more so. So I'm very honored by it, Piers.
MORGAN: I mean it's interesting. I mean I've been following this for a few months now, your slow progression in the -- in the poll ratings. Do you get a sense that Washington, D.C. hasn't really taken you seriously? And do you think we're now at the tipping point where they have to?
TRUMP: Well, I always felt that the people took me seriously. And very seriously. And if I'd make a speech or if I'd do a show, I could see that it was really -- it was really hitting home.
And whether I talk about China, whether I talk about OPEC and how they're just absolutely ripping us like nobody's ever ripped us before, how they're -- in the case of China and so many other countries, how they are just taking our jobs, taking our money, making our product, manipulating their currency so it makes it almost impossible for our companies to compete.
When I say these things, people really get it. You know, the public is very smart. And they do get it.
MORGAN: People have been saying in the last few days as these ratings have come out showing you, you know, basically the equal front-runner at the moment of the Republicans with Mike Huckabee. They've been saying, ah, yes, but when Donald Trump gets properly scrutinized, when people will rake over, you know, his personal life, over his finances, then it will all come unstuck.
What's your answer to that?
TRUMP: Well, you know, I've been very public for many years. And again, I'm not a professional politician. I don't do this for a living. I understand politics. I've dealt with politicians all of my life. But dealt with foreign countries all my life.
I've made a lot of money with China as an example. And I understand China. I understand the whole mentality. And I understand what they're doing and how they're doing it to us. And I know how -- I know the solution, perhaps more importantly.
MORGAN: And some -- if you do not get the Republican nomination, you have flirted with the idea of possibly running as an independent. Is that a serious option for you? TRUMP: Well, I don't like the concept because they've done polls and I get huge numbers as an independent and I'm a very conservative Republican. So unlike other people that would be, let's say, much more liberal in terms of a tag, where you take votes away from Obama. I would be taking votes away from the Republican candidate and I don't want to do that.
So it's something I really don't want to do. And, you know, the problem is, I get very, very high independent votes. In fact, CNN did a poll where my numbers are even better than they are in the Republican primary as independent. I think you saw that, Piers, where I'm substantially in the lead by many, many points.
MORGAN: Who would you see as potentially your main rivals in the current field?
TRUMP: Everybody. Everybody. They're all rivals. Everybody. And I really like some of them. Some of them I know. I really like some of them. And it's always a little bit difficult for me to go against people that I like because I can't be the real Donald Trump. It's a little bit difficult.
And I will say this, I actually think, and I said it before, that I actually think it's tougher to win the Republican primary than it is to beat Obama. At least for me.
MORGAN: I want to come now to probably the most contentious issue that involves you at the moment. This whole thing about President Obama, where he was born. The birther scandal as it's now been dubbed.
I want to play you a clip from my interview with the president's sister which was quite contentious when it came to your involvement in this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: Does this whole, I think, ridiculous debate about whether he was born in America -- what do you think of that?
SOETERO-NG: I think it's unfortunate. He was born in Hawaii. There is a tremendous amount of proof that has already been presented. The then Republican governor and head of the Department of, you know, Health in Hawaii even attested to the fact that the birth certificate that they inspected was, in fact, valid.
It's in the newspaper. It's on the day of his birth. So I think that it is time for people to put that to bed, put it to rest completely.
MORGAN: What do you think of Donald Trump banging on about this every day at the moment?
SOETERO-NG: Well, I think it's a shame. And I think that my brother should definitely be president for a second term. And that's really all I have to say about it. (END OF VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: I mean, Donald, I'll put my cards on the table here. I kind of think you run a pretty -- as far up this flag pole as you can. I mean, doesn't there come a point where you have to accept that nothing else is going to emerge on this story and you have to let it go?
TRUMP: Well, I think you're totally wrong. And I was surprised at your statement that frankly you don't agree with it. Because you're supposed to be a great reporter. And if I were a reporter, I'd be all over this.
I think that his sister's lovely. I have to tell you. I watched the interview last night. I thought she was a beautiful woman with a beautiful voice. And I just thought she was a lovely person. And I watched it. I thought it was an excellent interview. And I'm sure he's very proud of her.
The fact is, he doesn't show his birth certificate. He shows a certificate of live birth which is a much lower standard. He's not showing his birth certificate.
MORGAN: Donald, let me ask you -- let me ask you directly here, because I don't agree with you on this issue and I have huge respect for you, as you know. But on this issue, do you actually believe that President Obama wasn't born in Hawaii? Do you personally believe that?
TRUMP: I think there's a substantial chance. And I will tell you, when I first started on this about a month and a half ago, I had heard this issue for years. By the way, 70 percent of the Republican Party thinks that maybe -- in fact, it's actually higher, could be 75 percent, that maybe, maybe, he wasn't, and about 30 percent think that he was not born here.
MORGAN: Finally, Donald, I mean, today President Obama came out with this huge new fiscal plan involving cutting trillions of dollars off the deficit. What was your take on it when you read the detail?
TRUMP: Well, think it's terrible for a lot of reasons. Including the fact that you're talking about big tax increases. You're talking about the interest deduction on real estate and people's homes, where they're losing a big chunk of it.
What's that going to do to the home market, which is devastated already? And, you know, when it goes good there's nothing that creates more jobs like the home market with the real estate. And you're taking away a big chunk of the deduction.
The automatic trigger is brutal. And charitable giving is going to be hurt very badly because you're taking away the incentives at least from a financial standpoint to do charitable giving. So there are a lot of negatives. And also, the number -- with all of that said, the number is so small that it won't make enough of a dent in the deficit. MORGAN: Well, Donald Trump, I certainly think it would be most entertaining at the very least if you entered this campaign. And I think a lot of people are waiting with bated breath. And they're watching your poll numbers going up all the time.
And I would imagine, as you have said, there is mounting fascination at the White House as to whether you will run or not. So thank you for joining me tonight. And we'll watch this race.
TRUMP: Thank you very much, Piers.
MORGAN: Today, President Obama laid out his plan to cut the nation's $14 trillion debt. His goal, slashing $4 trillion over 12 years. The goal has got Republicans complaining too little, too late. And some of his own party fearing the cuts will go simply too deep.
Listen to the president.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: To those in my own party, I say that if we truly believe in a progressive vision of our society, we have an obligation to prove that we can afford our commitments.
If we believe the government can make a difference in people lives, we have the obligation to prove that it works. By making government smarter and leaner and more effective.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: So who will win this latest budget battle?
Joining me now is Senator Chuck Schumer.
SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D), NEW YORK: Hi.
MORGAN: Chairman of the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee.
Senator, thank you very much for joining me. The reaction has been pretty intense today to the president's speech. What was your view?
SCHUMER: I thought he hit it out of the park. The president laid out a vision for America that just about every American can accept. We know we have to cut the deficit. The deficit is a real problem. But at the same time, we know we have to grow the economy and increase jobs and increase middle class lives.
And the president has put his money on both. There's significant deficit reduction. $4.4 trillion over 12 years. But at the same time the president has said that we are not going to do certain things that some on the radical right would like be done.
And let me name three major differences between the president's proposal and, say, the Ryan proposal.
First, we don't believe in ending Medicare, or making Medicare so fragile that a senior citizen can't exist on it. Second, we believe that there are certain programs that have to grow. For instance, we have to continue helping kids go to college. We have to make our schools better. We have to build modern infrastructure. And we have to continue scientific research.
And third, the president believed in shared sacrifice. The Republican proposal actually lowers taxes on the multimillionaires who really don't need these government programs. They can afford college pretty easily for themselves. We say no, there should be shared sacrifice. Everyone is going to have to give a little. And you don't lower taxes on multimillionaires to 25 percent -- the lowest level since Herbert Hoover -- if you want to get the deficit down and help the middle class gain jobs and gain better lives.
MORGAN: I mean, it's quite clear that, as we saw from the near shutdown last week, the economy is going to be the central plank of the next presidential campaign. Do you see an ideological split beginning to form itself now between the Republicans and Democrats?
SCHUMER: Well, I think there's a split between what the president said and some in the Republican Party who are on the far right who say, you know, that all the sacrifice should be from the middle class. I think the president put it well.
He didn't want to see 36 senior citizens each increase their Medicare payments by $6,000, a huge jump, to help fund a tax break for a single millionaire. And so that's what you're finding. But you are finding some Republicans -- Tom Coburn, Saxby Chambliss, Dan Coats -- saying yes, revenue should be part of it. There should be shared sacrifice.
And I think Democrats are willing to stand by that argument and make it. It would be next to impossible to get the deficit down in a very significant way and not do certain kinds of revenues. And as soon as the Republican leadership comes to that realization, we can then sit down as equals and negotiate a good deficit reduction package.
MORGAN: Just a little earlier in the show, I was talking to Donald Trump who is emerging to many people's surprise as a front- runner in the Republican nominee -- candidates.
What's your take on that?
SCHUMER: Well, I can't say anything bad about Donald Trump because he's from Brooklyn. But to me, in the Republican primary, the more, the merrier.
MORGAN: I mean do you take him seriously as a candidate if he decides to --
SCHUMER: Well, look --
MORGAN: Actually officially declare?
SCHUMER: I'm going to leave the Republican primary to the Republican voters, the Republican office holders, and the many candidates who are battling it out. I think we'll beat every single one of those who are -- who are talking about running.
Let's hope it comes down to the substantive issues. Because when it comes down to the substantive issues, I think the proposals that we're making and the president made today are a lot closer to where the average American is than the Republican proposals so I hope this is a substantive election.
And by the way, when American people are not happy and things aren't going so well or hurting a little bit, I think the substance matters more. So I think that will actually be an advantage for us.
MORGAN: Senator Schumer, thank you very much indeed.
SCHUMER: Thanks, Piers.
MORGAN: Coming up, a woman who's not afraid to speak her mind about politics or anything else. The one and only Whoopi Goldberg.
MORGAN: Whoopi Goldberg.
MORGAN: How are you?
GOLDBERG: I'm good. I'm fascinated by my own image.
MORGAN: What is it -- is your wall of shame we have here or hall of fame, whatever you want to call it.
GOLDBERG: Yes. I think it's fame. I'm never ashamed.
MORGAN: You've never been ashamed about anything you've ever done?
GOLDBERG: No. I don't think I've ever done anything shameful.
MORGAN: But that in itself is shameful.
MORGAN: Isn't it?
GOLDBERG: I don't think so.
MORGAN: Shouldn't you done some things in your life which are utterly shameful?
GOLDBERG: You mean publicly or privately?
MORGAN: I don't -- well, let's go private. Stuff we don't know about.
GOLDBERG: Well, I'm sure something would have been shameful, or ways that I did things.
MORGAN: Feel free to share.
GOLDBERG: Well, no, just, you know, I don't generally talk about the trapeze in my room but that's a whole other thing.
MORGAN: You've had three marriages.
MORGAN: First one lasted six years.
MORGAN: Second one lasted two years.
MORGAN: And the last one lasted a year. So I think I know why you haven't gotten remarried. You wouldn't have enough time to actually get divorced.
GOLDBERG: No. Oh, I see.
MORGAN: They're lasting shorter periods.
GOLDBERG: Well, I suppose that, you know, you have to actually be in love with the person that you marry. You have to really be committed to them. And I just -- I don't have that commitment. I'm committed to my family. You know. And so for that relationship has lasted, you know, the longest.
MORGAN: Do you think you were in love with all your husbands?
MORGAN: Any of them?
GOLDBERG: No, I don't think so.
MORGAN: It's an amazing thing to say, isn't it?
GOLDBERG: But it's the truth.
MORGAN: It's sort of amazing.
GOLDBERG: Oh, well all right.
MORGAN: You won't -- you have church weddings?
GOLDBERG: No. Let me see. I think there's a Vegas. And maybe one was a church. And one was a house wedding.
MORGAN: Why did you do it if you weren't in love with them?
GOLDBERG: Because I wanted to feel normal. And it seemed to me that if I was married, I'd have a much more normal life. But clearly, that's not the case. That's not a good reason to get married. You have to actually want a life with someone. Through ups and downs. And I just discovered that wasn't for me.
MORGAN: How my times have you been in love?
MORGAN: Who with?
GOLDBERG: A man.
MORGAN: Go on.
GOLDBERG: I've gone as far as I'm going.
MORGAN: Can I chuck a name in?
GOLDBERG: You would chuck a name.
GOLDBERG: You're asking me if I was in love with Ted? Is that the man I'm talking about?
MORGAN: Would we know who the person is?
GOLDBERG: No. And that's the beauty of it.
MORGAN: Wow, that's amazing.
GOLDBERG: Yes, I know.
MORGAN: This is bombshell time. GOLDBERG: Well, it's not a real bombshell but I snuck a couple in on you all and nobody knew.
MORGAN: You did. Do you -- the one person you probably loved is someone we don't know about.
GOLDBERG: Yes. And that's OK.
MORGAN: Is this a recent thing?
GOLDBERG: No, no, no. It's a long time ago.
MORGAN: You wish you'd married that person?
GOLDBERG: Because what I know now is I don't want to live with -- I don't want to live with anyone.
MORGAN: I mean you --
GOLDBERG: I was --
MORGAN: You tried it with the wrong guys.
GOLDBERG: No, no. I think I've tried it with probably the right guys for other people. But it's not -- it wasn't them. It was me. Because I actually like living on my own. I like being able to go up and down my stairs farting like a queen and not having to explain.
I like being able to smoke all over my house and not have someone go -- you know, I like my privacy. I like it.
MORGAN: Didn't you like being in love?
GOLDBERG: I don't know if I did. Because it's -- the hardest thing. If you -- if you already have a family, being in love with someone is very difficult. Because you want them to know that you also love them, and you want your family to know that you love them, and it's a very difficult choice to have to make.
You know, it's a difficult choice to have to make. And once you realize that it's one or the other, you say, oh, OK.
MORGAN: Do you think that guy knows he's the only man you've ever loved?
GOLDBERG: Yes, yes.
MORGAN: You still talk to him?
GOLDBERG: Yes, we talk all the time. He's got two great kids and a great wife.
MORGAN: So he's married and --
GOLDBERG: Oh, yes. Oh, yes.
MORGAN: I feel quite sad for you.
MORGAN: I don't know. I just feel like --
GOLDBERG: You know, people say that all the time. People always say, you know, I'm going to fix you up with someone. I go, no, no.
MORGAN: Don't be mad, I just feel sad that this guy that you loved ended up with somebody else and it didn't work out for you.
GOLDBERG: Well, but, you know, lots of other things did so I didn't do too badly. Not too badly at all.
MORGAN: Are you -- are you on the dating scene?
GOLDBERG: No. Please, honey, oh, my god. Could you imagine?
MORGAN: Not really.
GOLDBERG: Me sitting -- hey, in the bar? No, no. I'm -- I never was much of a dater. I'm not a real go-out kind of person. Though in the last couple of months, I've -- lots of my friends are on stage now so I'm getting to go see lots of shows. But I was never a real dater. I either meet somebody and then we hang out and whatever happens happens. But I'm really a singular person.
MORGAN: Do you get lonely?
GOLDBERG: I don't think so. I keep trying to.
GOLDBERG: You know, I keep trying to go -- boy, I really want someone in my life. But I don't. You know, because the greatest thing is that there are people in my life that I love and adore. Some of them are married. Some of them are not. But I don't have to -- I don't have to do any more than love them. I don't have to do any more than that.
And I actually like that. Because I love some of these folks that I know. I mean, with all my heart. But, boy, do I want them coming to live with me? Hell no. Hell no.
MORGAN: What's been good about you? One of the many good things about you, but your big campaign on behalf of gay marriage, I think, won you a lot of support from a lot of people in America. Contentious things to do. Are you disappointed that President Obama, who I know you're a massive fan of and supported, hasn't really done that much for gay marriage?
GOLDBERG: Well, you know, I'm not surprised by it because, you know, very few presidents can go on and make the change they want to make. And he was very clear that he was conflicted about it. And once he made his decision, he talked to everybody, said, look, I'm going to go for it.
And I -- you know, the guy's got cojones. I have to say. You know? He said, we're going to the generals and we're going to do this. We're going to pass the law getting rid of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell." We're doing it. Because it's hurtful to our citizens.
Now what does he feel in his heart? He has no problem with gay folks. He has a problem with gay marriage. I suggest he never marry a gay person. Then he'll always know that his heart is good. But he's looking out for gay people in the way that he can. And in this country, it's huge that anything got done. At all. At all.
MORGAN: Do you think we're getting there perhaps?
GOLDBERG: Well, listen, we didn't tip over the edge, in spite of the fact that, you know, everybody is saying, oh, he hasn't done anything. You know, we didn't go over the edge. He pulled us back. And has he spent a lot of money? Probably. But there was a lot of money spent before.
I'm sick of it. I'm sick of, you know, endless taxes by telephone companies and, you know, people telling me that I can't have a hamburger from McDonald's because I should know that it's going to make me obese. No. No, no, no. Get off my back. Get off my -- you want me to stop smoking cigarettes? Stop selling them. Right?
GOLDBERG: I mean, because they're making money from the taxes. They don't mind that. But we're concerned about your health. Cigarettes cost in some states $13. A pack. See? And until they stop selling them, I'm going to -- I'm going to smoke.
MORGAN: Good for you.
GOLDBERG: Yes, I think so.
MORGAN: You should do whatever you want to do.
GOLDBERG: Well, not whatever I want to do. Because I would not smoke without saying to you, does this bother you? If it does, I won't do it. Because I'm very -- I'm aware that other people may not feel the same way. But I do think that I was raised well. You were raised well by intelligent people for the most part, both of us, and that we know how to say to someone, would this bother you if I did that?
MORGAN: Going to take a little break now you're nicely fired up.
GOLDBERG: I'm not fired up.
MORGAN: And when we come back, I want to know what you really think of the ladies of "The View."
GOLDBERG: If anything was going to put me back in my shell, you just did.
MORGAN: "Newsweek" magazine recently said you're the most popular host of "The View" and that you're even more liked than your friend Oprah. What do you say to that?
GOLDBERG: I don't know, I don't know. You know? I don't know.
MORGAN: No denial, I noticed.
GOLDBERG: Well, I -- you know, I mean, I'm thankful, I'm grateful, but I don't know really what it means. I don't know what it means.
MORGAN: Do you actually -- are you friends with the other co- stars of "The View"?
MORGAN: Or are they co-workers that you have to get on with?
GOLDBERG: No, no, no. You know I don't have the patience for it. I don't have the patience just to sort of seem --
MORGAN: Often you looked like you haven't got the patience when you're out there with them?
GOLDBERG: Not with them. Sometimes when we're talking about -- there are things I really don't care about and I'm supposed to. You know I have to try a little harder. But there are just things I'm never going to understand the fascination.
MORGAN: Like what?
GOLDBERG: Like "Dancing With the Stars." you know? Or Charlie Sheen's thing. Or, you know, any of it.
MORGAN: You had a problem with drugs, didn't you?
MORGAN: When you see him, do you feel sorry for him? What do you think? Whatever you want to do?
GOLDBERG: No, you know what, these are such personal issues. They are such personal choices. That if he can do it and do, you know, ten years of working and not being called out -- because he's always been on time and he knows his lines and he does what he's supposed to -- well, who am I, you know? Who am I?
I know how it is to, you know, know what you're doing when you're, you know, sort of a little off.
MORGAN: Isn't it true that when you won your Oscar, you were actually high as a kite?
MORGAN: Oh, pleas tell me the truth.
GOLDBERG: Well, no. I mean, it could be. I could have smoked a joint. I don't know.
MORGAN: You can't remember if you smoked a joint before you won an Oscar?
GOLDBERG: How long ago do you think that was? That was in 1990. I probably did smoke a joint. But, you know, again, to explain what you did -- you know, 1990 was how long -- I'm straight as arrow now and I can't even tell you how long ago that was.
But, you know, what you did 10 years or 15 years or 20 years -- you grow up. Would I smoke a joint now before I went to work? No.
MORGAN: Have you ever?
GOLDBERG: No, God no.
GOLDBERG: Yeah. Number one, you can smell it on people, OK. So why put myself in that position?
MORGAN: You've become really quite squeaky clean, haven't you?
GOLDBERG: I still smoke cigarettes. So I'm not that squeaky clean. And I don't have a boyfriend.
MORGAN: I want to play you a little clip of some of the men you've gone after on "the View."
GOLDBERG: That I've gone after?
MORGAN: Yeah, I think you'll enjoy this. GOLDBERG: All right.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GLENN BECK, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: You're accusing me of lying. Let me tell you --
GOLDBERG: What do you mean I'm accusing you? You're a lying sack of dog mess.
You lie. I think that's the biggest pile of dog mess I've heard in ages.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLDBERG: I do like the word. I love the word dog mess.
MORGAN: -- called me dog mess for half an hour.
GOLDBERG: Well, they won't let me say the real word, you know.
MORGAN: What do you want to say?
GOLDBERG: I say that's bull (EXPLETIVE DELETED). But you can't say bull (EXPLETIVE DELETED) on network television.
GOLDBERG: At 11:00 in the morning, no, apparently not. You cannot say bull (EXPLETIVE DELETED)
MORGAN: Is that ridiculous?
GOLDBERG: Yes, I do.
MORGAN: I think it's kind of absurd, those fake morality plays --
GOLDBERG: Well, we have to adhere to them.
MORGAN: Tell me about what "the View" does for you. You obviously have this stunning career in many different fields. And you've ended up as this kind of voice of America in the morning.
GOLDBERG: Did you say ended up? Is this it? Am I done?
MORGAN: I didn't mean in a bad way.
GOLDBERG: Oh, all right.
MORGAN: I meant -- by the way, voice of America is a very important role. And it's a role that you seem incredibly perfectly capable of filling. But did you ever think you'd be this? Did you ever think you'd be on TV every day giving opinion? GOLDBERG: No, I never did. You know, this is the -- I still do one woman show, one person shows, where I talk about all kinds of different issues. But no, I don't think of myself as the voice of America. But I do think that sometimes I see things from a different perspective.
Sometimes because of my race, sometimes because of my gender, sometime because of experiences. But -- and so I don't -- I'm in a safe place where I can say, no, here's what I know. Here's my experience with something like this. And it feels OK.
MORGAN: When you hear Donald Trump go after Barack Obama for where he was born, what do you think of that?
GOLDBERG: It makes me really, really angry. It makes me angry because the facts are there. And you're refusing -- you're pissing in the face of facts.
Facts are facts. You know? There are a whole line of people whose job it is to make sure that the president of the United States is an American citizen. So if all of those people are in on some conspiracy to get some black terrorist in the White House --
It's, like, really? Really? Really? And, you know, he's on his thing about it. And it just makes me sad. Because it means facts don't mean anything. No one has to check. No one has to prove anything. And this to me is a terrible disservice to the American people and to the Internet, man.
MORGAN: How do you think you would have fared as a young celebrity when you first hit the big time if the Internet had been around?
GOLDBERG: Oh, my gosh. No. No. No, no, no. I don't think I would have fared as well. But, you know, it took everybody a little while to get used to me. It took everybody a little while to get used to how I looked and, you know, how I was. Because I wasn't like femme-girl, you know.
I wasn't considered, you know, beautiful. So people had to get over the hair. And they had to -- so, you know, anything I was doing back then would have been compounded by "and look at her." "Look at her."
MORGAN: I've always thought you were pretty sexy.
GOLDBERG: Thank you, Piers. You are in a minority, honey.
MORGAN: I don't think I am.
GOLDBERG: Oh, yeah.
MORGAN: I think you'd be surprised.
GOLDBERG: I don't think I would be.
MORGAN: You clearly would be because you're surprised.
GOLDBERG: It's because you're a younger man.
MORGAN: We're going to take another little break. When we come back, I want to talk to you about your defense of many celebrities who fall by the wayside. It's interesting.
MORGAN: One of the more surprising things about you, Whoopi, is that you're quite happy to slap a politician around for bad behavior. But when it comes to celebrities --
GOLDBERG: Who have I slapped around?
MORGAN: Well, if a politician is behaving in your view wrongly --
MORGAN: Or if a right wing cable host, someone like a Bill O'Reilly or Glenn Beck -- whack, whack, whack. But if it's somebody like -- well, let's play a clip. Give you a little idea of what I'm talking about.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: See that picture? Well, that picture -- certainly looks like a racist to me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He said he was joking.
GOLDBERG: He doesn't look like a racist. He looks like an idiot.
I know Mel and I know he's not a racist. Drunks say stupid stuff to people all the time, all the time, because they're drunk. They're out of control. They're not thinking. They're idiotic.
That's why I don't like alcohol. I can't say anything about that because I know what people are like when they're drunk. This rant -- I don't think he's drunk on this rant.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: You also defended Michael Phelps for smoking pot.
GOLDBERG: No, I didn't. I said he had the right to smoke pot. He had the right to smoke pot.
MORGAN: That's defending him.
GOLDBERG: No, that's just saying if you're going to condemn somebody for smoking weed, it seems kind of crazy if they're in their home and someone's taking a picture of them.
MORGAN: You also believe that people -- and I've met Mel Gibson a few times. And I kind of share your view about him. But as a rule of thumb for this kind of thing, do you think that people when they're drunk always say different things to what they really think?
Or do you think the drink loosens tongues perhaps?
GOLDBERG: I think that drunks say whatever comes into their head. Drunks are not smart enough to think. If they were smart enough to think, they probably wouldn't say half the stuff they say and get their behinds kicked. The thing about drunks is they just -- they don't know any better.
MORGAN: Do you ever get drunk?
MORGAN: Properly, you know, seeing stars?
GOLDBERG: Yes, oh, yeah. I did, once. That's why I don't drink anymore.
GOLDBERG: Yeah, once.
MORGAN: You've been drunk once in your life?
GOLDBERG: Once in my life. And I was in public.
MORGAN: Where was it?
GOLDBERG: In New Orleans.
MORGAN: Go on, tell me more.
GOLDBERG: I've told you everything you asked me.
MORGAN: I want to hear all about it.
GOLDBERG: I know you do. But I don't want to tell it now.
MORGAN: How drunk were you?
GOLDBERG: Very drunk. And, you know, if you -- my belief is when you're at home, you're entitled to do whatever you want. You're in the privacy of your home. Now, homes are no longer private because if you have a party people have cameras. So snap, you're at home, it doesn't mean anything.
I'm saying Michael Phelps, if he was at home and he wanted to smoke a bong, he should have had the right to smoke a bong.
MORGAN: You don't think he had any responsibility as a role model -- GOLDBERG: He's not smoking weed out in the street. At home, no, I don't.
GOLDBERG: Yes, man, yes. Because those ties are too hard for anybody to live up to. People say, you are a role model for these kids and you shouldn't be doing this and you shouldn't be saying that you did this.
But the truth of the matter is I should not be your kid's role model. You should be your kid's role model. But you don't want to be your kid's role model because even you can't live up to it. So back off me.
MORGAN: So no famous people should ever consider themselves to be role models?
GOLDBERG: People -- famous people should consider themselves whatever they want to consider themselves. But know that the consequence of saying I am a role model is X, Y, Z. I'm saying that no one should be held to your idea of what their life should be, because your dream of what they should be doing, that's not -- that's not right. It's not fair.
And it says that you can't have bad periods. Not periods, but bad swing. You know what I mean.
MORGAN: They sell their wedding for a million dollars. Are they entitled to privacy?
GOLDBERG: I don't know. If you sell it to a magazine, I wouldn't think so. I don't know.
MORGAN: You can't be --
MORGAN: You can't be.
GOLDBERG: I've never done that, so I can't speak to I. But you can't be surprised. I'm telling you.
My attitude is you can't be surprised that, you know, people are following you around. If you call them and tell them where you are, you cannot bitch that they're there.
MORGAN: I agree.
We're going to -- we've actually reached a point of agreement. What did you want to say?
GOLDBERG: I wanted to say to those of you out there who disagree with me in terms of being a role model, save your e-mails. I know you don't agree. It's OK. Save the e-mails. I get it. I get it. But I have a different opinion. That's what I want to say.
MORGAN: You're perfectly entitled to your opinion.
GOLDBERG: Thank you.
MORGAN: When we come back, I want to talk to you about your work on Broadway.
GOLDBERG: Thank you, Piers.
MORGAN: Your contract for "the View" is coming up for renewal.
MORGAN: You're going to be there for two more years?
GOLDBERG: Yeah, as far as I know. I mean, unless I really step in it.
MORGAN: Would you like to extend it further? Do you love it so much you want to carry on? Or is there a natural shelf life?
GOLDBERG: I don't know. I'll know in a year or two. I mean, I can't really tell. I mean, I don't know. I don't know. I'm having a good time so far.
MORGAN: What do you like doing most? You can do one thing for the rest of your life.
GOLDBERG: I'd like to sit on my porch with my cigarettes, my potato chips and my water, a great couple of thousand of books and my cat.
MORGAN: For the next 20 years you'd do that?
GOLDBERG: I could do that.
MORGAN: No, you couldn't.
GOLDBERG: I could.
MORGAN: I don't believe you. GOLDBERG: I know. That's all right. You think I need a boyfriend too.
MORGAN: No, I don't think you need a boyfriend. I don't think you need a boyfriend. I regretted the fact that the one guy you loved got away. That's different.
GOLDBERG: Well, right. I didn't say what I pushed him away.
MORGAN: Did you?
GOLDBERG: I'm not telling you.
MORGAN: Why not?
GOLDBERG: You should have asked me.
MORGAN: But you just raised it.
GOLDBERG: Too late.
MORGAN: You can't take a camel to an oasis and say you can't have a drink.
GOLDBERG: Watch. A camel to -- OK, can we just talk about that? A camel to the oasis?
MORGAN: You can't take a camel to an oasis and then say you can't have a drink. You've led me now to this --
GOLDBERG: The camel clearly had enough water to get there.
MORGAN: You clearly wouldn't have raised the spectra of driving him away if you hadn't.
GOLDBERG: Or maybe, Piers, I'm just that good. Maybe you'll never know.
MORGAN: What's on the horizon for you?
GOLDBERG: You know, I've got musicals opening. I have "Sister Act," which is opening on Broadway on the 20th of April. And we just opened another piece called "White Noise" in Chicago, another musical again.
MORGAN: That's about white supremacists?
GOLDBERG: Yes. To me it's less about white supremacist than the choices we make when we chip away at integrity. The things you say I would never do that, and then you make a little ching. And then suddenly you've made a little bit of inroads into doing something you didn't think you wanted to do, but it's OK, because you've justified it.
And then another little tweak happens. So it's about when fame and fortune are being dangled, do you give up your core beliefs, whether the people agree with them or not? Do you give them up?
And we have two sets of singing -- two singing groups that have to deal with this dilemma. So it's very interesting and edgy. And we use all the words that have been buried and burned.
MORGAN: Is America more racist or less racist than say 20 years ago, from your experience?
GOLDBERG: Well, I don't know. You know, I thought it was slightly less racist, but now I'm not positive anymore.
GOLDBERG: Because it just feels -- to me, I have to put in my head when you question this president, the first president we've ever had of color, and you're not sure where he was born, and it continues, what is that about really?
MORGAN: In Donald Trump's defense, I know him quite well. I don't think he's a racist at all. I don't think he means it in a racist context.
GOLDBERG: Why didn't he ask that about George Bush or Bill Clinton?
MORGAN: I suspect it's about votes, because his poll ratings, the more he hammers this point -- it's probably an anti-Obama vote catching mechanism.
GOLDBERG: Why not say he's a -- a crappy president.
MORGAN: I like the fact that you don't like to be seen as a successful African-American. You would rather be seen an American.
GOLDBERG: Too many people died for that for me to have to hyphenate my race. I'm just an American. I'm entitled to everything an American is entitled to.
If that gives people pause, both black and white -- people are not sure where I'm coming from. I'm coming from a place where my mother worked her behind off -- she worked her behind off to educate me, to make me know that this was my country. Good or bad, this is my country.
MORGAN: Your next movie is called "A Little Bit of Heaven." When we come back after the short break, I'm going to ask you what your idea of heaven is.
MORGAN: Your new movie is called "A Little Bit of Heaven." What's your idea of "A Little Bit of Heaven?"
GOLDBERG: Being here with you, Piers. This is my little bit of heaven, damn it. Sunny days with my family.
MORGAN: Ever thought what heaven might be like when you get up there?
GOLDBERG: I just assume it's going to be good times with the family, people that you didn't get to meet because they were gone.
MORGAN: Do you believe in an after life?
GOLDBERG: Yeah. I like the idea of it.
MORGAN: Do you pray a lot?
MORGAN: You either do or you don't.
GOLDBERG: Well, no, it depends -- how do you describe praying?
MORGAN: I suppose --
GOLDBERG: Going to church and stuff?
MORGAN: Not necessarily going to church, but talking to an entity that is not physically there and asking for help. talking through issues. Do you do that kind of thing?
GOLDBERG: No, no.
MORGAN: What's your idea of prayer?
GOLDBERG: I could use some backup. I guess that's it.
MORGAN: Do you go to any church?
GOLDBERG: No, no. I don't like being inside, you see.
MORGAN: At all?
GOLDBERG: Very rarely. If it's nice weather, then I don't want ever to see the inside of a house. I just want to be in the sun, soaking up the rays.
MORGAN: In "Sister Act," obviously you play a Catholic. I am a Catholic.
GOLDBERG: I recognized you.
MORGAN: Exactly. What I want to know is I want you to imagine you're a Catholic for a moment and confess to me your greatest sins.
GOLDBERG: Are you mad? You're not suckering me that way, Piers. I was not born yesterday, fool. That is not going to happen.
MORGAN: Got to give a dog a bone. GOLDBERG: I know. That was sweet, though.
MORGAN: Give me a little juicy bone.
GOLDBERG: A little juicy bone.
MORGAN: If you were in the confessional now, what would you --
GOLDBERG: I would say, have you seen "Sister Act" yet? Listen, father, come on over. Yes, I'll give you two tickets. Bring some of the sisters with you, tell me what you think.
MORGAN: Let me put it more positively. If you had five minutes to relive the greatest moment of your life -- it could be anything -- what would it be? Can't be the birth of your daughter. We've already established it won't be any of your marriages.
GOLDBERG: Right. And it can't be the birth of my kid, or my grand kids?
GOLDBERG: OK. In that case, I don't know the answer to that. Because I don't know if I've already had it yet, the greatest moment of my life. I don't know. If you come find -- my God, there are hundreds of times I've been the happiest. There's no one time.
But again, I don't know. If you come see me just half an hour before I die, I could probably answer that.
MORGAN: I look forward to seeing "Sister Act". When does it open?
GOLDBERG: April 20th.
MORGAN: Best of luck.
GOLDBERG: Thank you.
MORGAN: It's been a real pressure.
GOLDBERG: Thank you. For me as well.
MORGAN: Thank you, Whoopi. That's all for tonight. Now here's my colleague Anderson Cooper with "AC 360."