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Judge Grants Motion to Delay Casey Anthony Probation Hearing; Neighbor of Murdered Law Student Arrested

Aired August 3, 2011 - 19:00:00   ET



JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST (voice-over): Tonight, where in the world is Casey Anthony? For the very first time since her release from jail, tabloid photographers capture pictures of a woman they claim is Casey, walking the streets of Ohio. Meanwhile, the battle over her probation escalates.

Then the Warren Jeffs trial turns XXX-rated as the jury hears graphic audiotapes of the polygamist leader allegedly having sex with a 12-year-old girl as other women hold her down and men watch. It`s being called the most disgusting audiotape some have ever heard. We`ll tell you the horrifying details of his alleged pornographic commands to young girls.

And terrifying new details in this case of a missing Louisiana woman. Now, we`re hearing her husband bought concrete and buckets before fleeing the country with their young daughter. I`ll talk exclusively to this missing teacher`s frantic best friend and the principal at her school. And we`ll take your calls.

ISSUES starts now.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Casey Anthony has to report to probation.

GRETL PLESSINGER, FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF CORRECTIONS: We have told her attorneys that she needs to be here by no later than 10 a.m. tomorrow morning.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everybody will be watching.

CASEY ANTHONY, ACQUITTED OF MURDER: I just want to let everyone know I`m sorry for what I did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She has to be here, this facility here in downtown Orlando.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: She has been ordered back to the city where she is public enemy No. 1.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The court system in this case had her serving probation while she was in jail. So the defense lawyers are going to argue, how do -- how can you serve twice for the same thing?

PLESSINGER: We`re going to be treating her just like any other offender.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People are curious about this. People want to hear what she has to say.

ANTHONY: I take complete and full responsibility for my actions.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The whole thing about the rehab is a ruse either to try to raise her value or to try to make it look like she`s got more important things to do.

PLESSINGER: If she does not check in by 10 a.m. tomorrow, we will notify the court.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: But yet, here is another order that changes everything. Tonight, breaking news in the Casey Anthony case. She once again avoids trouble at the 11th hour. A judge late today ruled Casey does not -- does not have to be back in Orlando tomorrow morning to report for probation.

We`ve been following all the confusion, the court mix-ups, the legal maneuverings, all week long. Frankly, my head is spinning.

This past Monday, Casey was ordered to start serving one year of probation for her check fraud conviction. Casey`s attorneys were furious. Listen to Cheney Mason.


CHENEY MASON, CASEY`S ATTORNEY: Right now, we`re going to set aside and vacate that stupid order.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Stupid order. That`s what the defense attorney called it. How does Cheney Mason really feel? Wow.

Late today, a judge granted the defense request for a hearing on this issue. It will happen on Friday morning. A court official told us Casey will not be there.

Jose Baez insists Casey already served her probation behind bars. Here he is on "The Today Show."


JOSE BAEZ, CASEY`S ATTORNEY: A probation officer actually came out and met with her, and they continued to monitor her. She`s completed her probation. In the state of Florida, a judge has 60 days to make a correction to the order. That day has long gone.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: He does make a good point there.

Now, new photos have emerged that could be the first images of Casey since her release. TMZ says the snapshots show Casey in Ohio. She`s shopping at an Old Navy and walking through a neighborhood. HLN is trying to confirm if it is really Casey. I can just tell you, it`s a girl with short dark hair with a cap over her head and sunglasses who looks quite like her.

One thing I know: if Casey is forced back to Orlando, Florida, you better believe the media swarm will be all over her. What do you think? Do you think she should serve probation? Do you think it`s fair? Do you think she already did it? Call me: 1-877-JVM-SAYS, 1-877-586-7297.

Straight out to "In Session" field producer Michael Christian, who is live back in Orlando. You thought you got out, but they brought you right back, because the drama-rama continues. It`s another crazy day. I have to tell you, Michael, the powers that be seemed very confused today. Tell us all about it.

MICHAEL CHRISTIAN, FIELD PRODUCER, TRUTV`S "IN SESSION": Yes. There`s a lot of confusion. You know, the question here may not be should she serve probation but should she serve probation again? The defense says she has already served her probation. That`s why they filed this emergency motion to stop her having to come back and report for probation.

For a long time today we didn`t know what was going on. There were rumors maybe Judge Belvin Perry would stop this and, yet, the Department of Corrections had not one but two press conferences and said, she`s coming, she`s coming.

Well, finally, as you say, within the last couple of hours, we have heard from Judge Belvin Perry. He has issued an order staying the order that she needs to turn herself in tomorrow.

Now, the important thing everybody needs to remember is that this does not necessarily mean that Casey Anthony is off the hook. We just don`t know. There will be a hearing on Friday at which point Judge Perry will hear from the defense why he should quash this order that she needs to come back that Judge Stan Strickland ordered earlier this week.

If he agrees with the defense and quashes the motion, then that`s it. It quashes the order. That`s it. She`s off the hook. But if it turns out he doesn`t agree with the defense, he could then easily reinstate the order and order her to report for probation at a later time. So it`s just a stay at this point.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: As you said, to me, it seemed like the left hand didn`t know what the right hand was doing.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Until very late today, the court officials were insisting that she was going to be back in court tomorrow, even though a local news station was reporting, no, the judge is going to issue a stay, which ultimately he did. So listen to this lady who`s saying that, oh, no, she`s going to be there.


PLESSINGER: They have been very cooperative with us. And they -- they have assured us she will be here by tomorrow 10 a.m., which is the deadline, unless there is a stay issued.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, the problem with that, Joe Episcopo -- you`re a criminal defense attorney down there in Tampa -- is that the local news was saying, "Yes, there`s going to be a stay. We`ve already heard it from the judge`s office." I mean, this has gotten to be a bit of an embarrassment.

JOE EPISCOPO, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, this could easily be resolved by getting the transcript of what was said at the time of the sentencing, to see if that`s what the judge really intended. There`s other twists in this.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We already did that. We already did that. We played the audiotape. The judge said that she was supposed to serve it after she got out. The trouble is that the person who transcribed that, issued the order, didn`t put "after she got out." So then the probation department...

EPISCOPO: All right.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: ... Department of Corrections, though, "Oh, it`s while she`s still in jail" and apparently, they did do whatever they do on probation, because she got a letter, saying, "Miss Casey Anthony, you have completed probation. Have a nice life."

But what I`m saying is even today the left hand didn`t know what the right hand was doing. While WESH-TV is saying, "Oh, she`s not going to show up tomorrow. The judge is staying it," this lady, lovely lady, but she`s saying no, she`s going to be here. It -- this is an embarrassment.

I`ll throw it to Joey Jackson. Let me give Joey Jackson a crack at that one.

JOEY JACKSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, let me ask you this, Jane. You say the left hand doesn`t know what the right hand is doing. And you sound surprised by that. Listen, this happens in a court of law. And particularly, we see it here.

The fact is that there has to be some consistency here. There should have been a consistency in the order, a consistency in the manner in which it was transcribed. And more importantly, consistency in the manner in which it was carried out.

I think there are merits to the defense`s argument. I think the emergency motion, obviously, there was a stay put in place. And I think they will prevail on Friday, quite frankly.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Sonya, Florida, your question or thought, Sonya.

CALLER: My comment is that this appears to be a retaliation to get Casey somehow. The sad thing about this is that the courts, who people rely on to administer the law fairly without any bias appearance, this hasn`t been done. How could this motion even get to the judge and he sign off on it for her to be appearing back in Florida within a certain time period without reviewing the case law?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, I agree with you. Sonya, you make an excellent point. And that`s exactly what Jose Baez said on "The Today Show." Let`s listen to his argument, very similar to this caller.


BAEZ: I live in the United States of America, where if someone`s accused of a crime, you have your day in court. And if a jury finds you not guilty, that should be the end of it.

But unfortunately, in this e-lynching type day that we live in, that`s not possible.

So, yes, we`re very concerned. It`s not something we`re taking lightly. And Orange County should also be concerned. If they`re going to require her to come back, that`s going to require additional security.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, we all remember what happened. This is back in September of 2008, where the poor Anthonys, Cindy and George, had to fight off demonstrators who actually went on their front lawn. And so we know what could happen out there if she just shows up, now that she`s been acquitted. We all saw the protests.

And I`ve got to go back to Joey Episcopo on this. Is this a wise thing to do? To me, it does kind of -- I`ve been critical of the defense. I`ve been critical of Casey Anthony. But I have to say in this case, to try to force her to do probation after they give her a letter that says, "Hey" -- I got it right here -- "Miss Anthony, we`d like to extend you the best wishes for a successful future," it strikes me as sour grapes. And it strikes me that the powers that be are trying to stick it to her, because they think she got away with something.

EPISCOPO: Well, yes. It`s obvious that`s what it is. And I don`t quite understand the judge recusing himself. That doesn`t sound right either, unless he already had recused himself, and then he didn`t even have jurisdiction.

And you know, that judge made a public comment, apparently, about this case while it was still going on. And that`s a big no-no. Judges are not supposed to comment on these kinds of cases. That could lead to a problem for the judge.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. In fact, we have the comment that he made. And we`re going to play it on the other side of the break, because you`re right. What judge goes on television and then issues an order on the case that they went on television to talk about?

We`re taking your calls on this: 1-877-JVM-SAYS. Give me a holler.

Warren Jeffs` alleged child sex tape stuns the courtroom. It`s disgusting! In fact, somebody said it was the most disgusting thing they`ve heard in 25 years of covering criminal trials.

More on Casey Anthony`s probation issue. The drama, the circus continues.


PLESSINGER: We`re going to be treating her just like any other offender. What happens to offenders when they come in, they give us an address, and it is public record entered into the database.




UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: As to the charge of first degree murder, the verdict as to count one, we, the jury, find the defendant not guilty. Aggravated child abuse, not guilty. Aggravated manslaughter, not guilty.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Wow. Just more drama. It doesn`t end in the Casey Anthony case.

Now, I don`t know if you remember, but it`s hard to forget. A few days after Casey`s release, there was this video, which is very bizarre. A local station, video of a woman wearing the same pink shirt or a similar- looking pink top to the one that Casey was released in running across the tarmac at an Orlando airport.

And when asked about it, the defense said, "Oh, we this is a former member of the defense team just having fun."

Now, guess what? If you`re pulling stunts like this, you can`t point the finger at somebody else and say, "Oh, you`re turning this case into a circus."

But I want to go now to Al Taylor, who`s a TV producer who has purportedly offered Casey a million dollars for her first interview. We`ve been talking to him back and forth. And I have to mention now that Jose Baez says you`re a fraud, even though you say you actually met with Casey Anthony in person and you have an agreement and that you have an e-mail chain.

Now, we saw that video of this person, this unidentified woman, who was obviously done up to look like Casey, running across the tarmac. Now, there are photos that have surfaced that TMZ says is of Casey Anthony in Ohio, 25 photos, and about a minute and 40 seconds of video of a woman. I`ve seen the photos. We`re trying to confirm. We have no independent knowledge that it is Casey.

And her civil attorney said be very suspicious. He wouldn`t confirm or deny it. But he said be very skeptical of anything, given the media storm around this case. But you`re trying to confirm if it is.

But it`s a photo of a woman who looks like Casey in a cap and sunglasses, shopping at Old Navy and walking around the streets of Ohio. So Al Taylor, what do you know tonight, sir?

AL TAYLOR, INDEPENDENT TV PRODUCER (via phone): Well, I know actually when I met with her, she was wearing a cap. So that confirms the way she looked when I met her.

But what I do know is my attorney, Spencer Kubin (ph) of Florida, when I mentioned yesterday on your show that we were getting ready to serve her if she came back to Orlando, he got a call where the people said that she was in Ohio. So he`s been getting calls now about her whereabouts that try to help us serve her. And so I have to believe those pictures are definitely her.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, again, we`re trying to confirm. We can`t -- we can`t confirm or deny that those photos are of her. But what`s interesting about that, Michael Christian, is that she is originally from Ohio. The Anthony family lived in Ohio before they came to Florida.

And in fact, right around the time she was released, a woman called a local radio station in Florida and said that she had heard or she knew that an Anthony family member had offered to take Casey in. What do you think, Michael?

CHRISTIAN: You know, I`ve seen those photos. And I have to say I am not quite as convinced as some other people are. It definitely could be Casey Anthony. I`m not saying that it isn`t. I`m probably 50-50 on this. I`m just not ready to commit to it being Casey.

But as you say, the family is originally from Ohio. We know that she has relatives in the Ohio area. Now, because her relationship with her family is so fractured at this point, her parents, we don`t know what kind of relationship she might have with aunts, uncles, cousins, and more extended family. If they`ve taken her parents` side, they probably wouldn`t want to do much -- have much to do with her.

But as we know, Jane, blood is thicker than water. If a family member needs help, sometimes you just chip in, despite your personal feelings. So it is possible, specifically since she does have relatives in that area.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jenny, Texas, your question or thought, Jenny.

CALLER: Yes. I want to say that in Texas, when someone`s on probation, they have to report to probation. They are monitored on the outside. They also had to pay probation fees. How do you pay probation fees if you`re in jail and you`re indigent?

I think that the judge`s intent, Strickland`s intent was for her to do the probation if she was acquitted, and she was acquitted, so I think they should hold her to that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK, Jenny in Texas. But Joe Episcopo, if it`s not Casey Anthony`s mistake, if there was a clerk who typed the wrong thing when the judge was issuing his order and forgot to add "after her release," and then probation officials actually visited her in jail, as Jose Baez is contending, and sent her a letter, which I have right here, saying, "Congratulations, you`re done," how can they make her serve it again?

EPISCOPO: They can`t. He had 60 days to amend an order. They didn`t see the mistake. Sixty days passed. So the order is going to have to be vacated. Actually, it has been vacated.

But I think the judge may have other problems with the -- we have a body here called the Judicial Qualifications Committee. People can make complaints about judges. They investigate them. They`re secret. But if they file charges, he has to answer for that. He`s not supposed to be making public comments and then issuing an order which seems to be sort of vindictive and personal in nature. Judges don`t get vindictive and personal, do they?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, let me say this. We`ve got the video of Judge Strickland on Nancy Grace and it was shortly after the verdict. So let`s hear what he has to say on "Nancy Grace."


STAN STRICKLAND, JUDGE: When I saw that this was going to become something that would lead them to criticize every future decision that I made, I thought, you know, I don`t own this case. We`ve got 70 other good judges here in the courthouse. Let`s give it to somebody else. So I got out. And I`m just kind of shocked at the result. And I really don`t know what to say beyond that.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Quickly, Joey Jackson. He said that he`s shocked at the result. Should he be issuing? I don`t think so.

JACKSON: Absolutely not.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: No, he should not. Thank you, gentlemen.



CHIEF MIKE BURNS, MACON POLICE: We have received back. We ended up going to the one person.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Breaking news out of Macon, Georgia, the police chief announcing they have just charged a man with the brutal murder of law student Lauren Giddings. So who is their suspect? Believe it or not, this guy, her next-door neighbor. But before Stephen McDaniel was arrested, this alleged killer actually talked to reporters. Watch and listen to that conversation.


STEPHEN MARK MCDANIEL, MURDER SUSPECT: They went in, looked around the place. No sign of a struggle, no sign that anyone had broken in, just nothing. She was gone. All of her stuff was there. Her I.D. was there. Her wallet was there, but she was -- she was just gone.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hmm. He`s the alleged murder, and he`s casually talking to the media. What a performance.

Stephen McDaniel, Lauren`s law school classmate, as well. So a neighbor and a classmate. Cops say a mountain of evidence points to him as the killer.

Twenty-seven-year-old Lauren was last heard from June 25. Look at this beautiful young woman. That night she reportedly messaged a friend, saying she did not feel safe in her apartment.

Five days later, police found her torso wrapped in plastic in a garbage bin next to her apartment building. The cops would not say where they believe Lauren was killed or what the motive might be.

Former FBI agent Steve Moore, does this happen often, where the suspect speaks to reporters as if he is sort of a bystander and a neighbor who doesn`t know anything?

STEVE MOORE, FORMER FBI AGENT: Not really. No. Sometimes you see arsonists standing by. But he -- this is kind of unusual. And it was interesting what he said. He was basically setting up the police, saying, "Hey, she wasn`t there. There`s no evidence there." He was kind of thinking out loud what he hoped would be found.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. And they`re saying they have a mountain of evidence that connects to this man.

I want to bring in Dr. Judy Kuriansky, clinical psychologist, because we often see this. Let us all watch this video again and study it, and let`s see what hints this guy reveals. Again, he`s accused of murdering this woman, and he`s talking to the media like, oh, he`s just this neighbor and classmate and just weighing in casually. Check it out.


MCDANIEL: They went in, looked around the place. No sign of a struggle, no sign that anyone had broken in, just nothing. She was gone. All of her stuff was there. Her I.D. was there. Her wallet was there, but she was -- she was just gone.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: What always strikes me, Judy, is sometimes, like, it`s the best interview. That`s a really good interview. Go ahead.

DR. JUDY KURIANSKY, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: You know, it smacks of really a kind of dissociative personality. These are people -- we used to call them multiple personalities, but that`s not the term any more. It means that you`re two different types of people. So you`re in one role one minute and then you can totally switch out to another. So that`s one kind of possibility here, because he is acting like he`s not the same person who did this particular, you know, crime.

But we know other people who do that kind of thing. They -- they sort of manipulate the press and the police in order to switch the attention off themselves and pretend that they`re not guilty.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s such a tragedy. Our hearts go out to this woman`s family. She had a promising career as a law student, a beautiful young woman. Disgusting. I`m so sorry.

Speaking of disgusting, the audiotapes in the Warren Jeffs trial are stomach churning. We`ll tell you about them next.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Jeffs, did you rape those two girls?

ELISSA WALL, VICTIM: He started to undress me and undress himself. I was crying and I was, like, "Please, I don`t want you to do it. It doesn`t feel right, please stop."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think the hardest part then was hearing this tiny little voice, it was a little voice of a little girl replied, "I feel fine, thank you."

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: In the United States of America, no matter what religion you are, no matter whether you`re a prophet or you say you`re a prophet or whatever, you`re not allowed to have sex with children. That`s what it comes down to.

BETH KARAS, CORRESPONDENT, TRUTV: It was some of the most disturbing evidence I have ever heard or seen in a courtroom in 25 years.


JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HLN HOST: It is stomach-churning, these new audiotapes in infamous polygamous leader Warren Jeffs` trial. Jeffs is charged with sexually assaulting two of his quote-unquote, "spiritual brides" also known as little girls, ages 12 and 15.

As the prosecution rested its case earlier today, the most damning and horrific details of the alleged sexual assaults were revealed in sickening audiotapes of alleged child rape and grooming for sex.


MIKE WATKISS, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER, KTVK: He instructs them to take their clothes off. He then instructs them how intimately, how they should shave their bodies, things that we cannot repeat and should not repeat on television. He tells them that when they come to him, they should be showered in case they are called to service.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s beyond disgusting. The latest tape has sounds of heavy breathing, a man, allegedly Warren Jeffs. Look at this photograph. That`s a 12-year-old girl.

Her voice, this little girl`s voice, the prosecution says these are the sounds of the alleged rape of this 12-year-old child bride, while -- and this is, I think, the most sickening part of all or just as sickening, it`s hard to tell -- his sister wives are in the room holding her down as others watch. And there`s evidence that she`s tied to him in some way.

On another tape, the prosecution says, you can hear Jeffs instructing little girls on how to sexually please him, quote, "You have to know how to be sexually excited and to help each other. And you have to be ready for the time I need your comfort. This is your mission. This is how you abide the law." It goes on and on.

We`re taking your calls on this. 1-877-JVM-SAYS, 1-877-586-7297. Why do you think he made audiotapes?

I have a theory. Beth Karas, correspondent for "In Session" on TruTV. You were inside the courtroom for the playing of this unbelievable tape. Spell it out for us.

KARAS: It was the most anticipated moment of this trial. Eric Nichols, the prosecutor, talked about it in his opening statement and told the jurors, they will have no doubt what was going on, who was present at the time once they hear it. It was the last evidence presented.

The courtroom was packed and it was a large public gallery. The 14 jurors, 10 women and two men who are deliberating jurors, and one man and one woman were alternates, all wore headsets along with the lawyers and the judge in the well of the courtroom so they could hear better. But speakers blared it out for the rest of us in the courtroom.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: What did they hear?

KARAS: They heard prayers in the beginning and the end by Warren Jeffs who always speaks in the same monotone. But they also heard that little girl`s voice say, when he said, how do you feel? And then he said her name, and she said, "Very well, thank you."

He instructed the others in the room, there were not men, there were only other women in the room, to back off, let go, back off, so they must have been holding on to something. At one point, there`s a reference to tying but it`s unclear exactly what that is? They heard a lot of heavy breathing and then he prayed again for her, once it was over.

What was so disturbing about this, though, is that this little girl, who was 12 years and one-month-old at the time was conditioned to believe that she really was blessed to be a new wife of the prophet. That this was right, what was happening to her and that one of the sister wives was her own sister, by the way, Naomi was her name. She was of age at the time.

That`s what was so sad, that she thought it was ok and it was right.

And yesterday, jurors heard what it meant to be ready. You must always be showered and clean and groomed, shave your armpits, groom the pubic area, be ready when I need you, basically.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Guess what? He even calls it "training", you know, which is a word that`s used in sadomasochism. What`s so amazing about this is that this is all -- all this stuff is used in hard-core serious pornography, sadomasochism, dominance and submission; and yet he is putting this cloak of religion on top of it and convincing these girls that this pedophilia alleged -- since the trial is ongoing -- alleged pedophilia is somehow, it`s going to make them closer to God. I think that is the most insidious part of all.

Mike Watkiss, you`re a reporter with KTVK, you also heard it. What was the most sickening part for you because I saw hardened reporters who had tears in their eyes when they walked out of this courtroom to talk about this?

WATKISS: The child`s voice, little girl`s voice that said -- this meek, soft, timid little voice responding. You only hear it a couple times, Jane. That`s certainly what stuck a dagger in my heart today.

You`re right. Much of the audiotape was heavy, labored breathing on the part of a man, allegedly Mr. Jeffs. But hearing this child respond and then Mr. Jeffs ending the session by saying, "We offer up this prayer in the name of Jesus Christ, amen." The little girl responds in this very timid little voice saying "amen".

The prosecutor shot up out of his chair and said, "The state rests." And, you know, it was the most powerful punch in the prosecutors` arsenal. We`ve been reporting that they`ve had that tape in their possession for some time. They`ve actually had it for five years and found it in the Escalade that Mr. Jeffs was riding in when he was busted outside of Vegas. So, it`s high time the world hears this tape.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. It`s high time the world does something about it.

Dr. Judy Kuriansky, clinical psychologist and sex expert, I was thinking why is he taping it? And then it occurred to me he`s taping it so he can listen to it when he`s on the lam and get off on it. Let`s be real.

DR. JUDY KURIANSKY, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Exactly. Oh, exactly. And that`s why these kinds of men do that. They tape, audiotape it and they videotape it so they can watch it and masturbate to it and really continue their fantasy. This is a fantasy he is having, groups of women in pure state, wearing the white robes for purity, shaving their pubic area also as if they are a child and being able to control them.

You mentioned sadomasochism, Jane. That has to do with control. And that`s what he is doing -- controlling masses of women? What outrages me is that the women allow it, whether they are brainwashed or not, they`re letting it happen and letting themselves do that. This is what we`re so upset about; that women let themselves get into these controlled situations.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Absolutely. It`s an outrage. As you have said before, Dr. Judy, it`s a warning to all women because there are these control -- there`s even something called the power and control wheel that abused women are shown to say, hey, here`s how your mate is controlling you, using male privilege, using money, using isolation; and it`s happening all over America. This is just the most extreme case and the cloak is religion.

Christie, Utah, your question or thought, Christie.

CHRISTIE, UTAH (via telephone): I am -- make this as quick as I can, this whole topic infuriates me. I am from Utah and I have lived here my whole life. You know, I know a lot of people are aware of it that Warren Jeffs has the whole area out here where he`s a prophet as well, Colorado City. I married somebody who grew up in the polygamous community, who had him for a prophet and my brother actually married somebody who broke out of the polygamists when she was young. Warren Jeffs was her prophet as well.

It is so wonderful for me and a lot of other people from Utah to finally see somebody prosecuting Warren Jeffs, doing something about this. But what frustrates me is that this has been going on, you know, behind the cloak of religion for so long.

My husband, two of his aunts were married down there in Colorado City by Warren Jeffs at 9 and 11 years old.


CHRISTIE: 9 and 11 years old. I sat down with these women and told me about their wedding night. How they were, you know raped; too small -- I mean these women hadn`t even menstruated yet. And what I just want people to realize is because of the LVS church and not just these fundamentalists, it`s an embarrassment to the mainstream Mormon Church as well because let`s face it, they all have the same -- you know, believe in the same old prophet, Joseph Smith, who had many wives that are all under- age. They just don`t do anything about it.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me just jump in Christie because we want to make a distinction between the FLDS church, which is a spin-off. And the mainstream Mormon Church which renounced polygamy many, many, many years ago.

You can tell me, Mike Watkiss, you`re the expert, how many years ago the mainstream Mormon Church renounced polygamy. We don`t want to confuse the two -- Mike.

WATKISS: Well over 100 years ago, and these polygamous groups basically -- the history of these groups when the mainstream Mormon Church stopped the practice, there were still a lot of polygamist families who said we`re not -- that`s not a real revelation from God. We`re going to continue.

In many ways they`ll tell you that they`re the real keepers of the faith. Theologians need to iron that out. But the bottom line, these polygamous groups have been splintering off themselves and splintering and splintering, there are lots of polygamous groups. This is certainly one of the worst of the group. There is another large one in northern Utah that has similar problems.

And then there`s a lot of urban polygamists that are very much like "Big Love" where the women have education and they seem to be consenting adults behind closed doors. Nobody really gives -- you know, nobody cares.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That`s the difference. Wait a second Mike. Consenting adults, I say do whatever you want. But Dr. Judy, 10 seconds, when it involves kids, then it crosses a line.

KURIANSKY: Totally unacceptable and should be stopped.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And we can stop it by A, exposing it, which this trial is doing and then B, making sure local law enforcement actually goes after these cults because what I`ve heard from people is that they are often controlled by the FLDS. Shame on you.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re hoping that someone will come forth with some information.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: A beloved teacher disappears while her husband buys concrete and large plastic buckets. Sylviane Lozada has been missing for close to a month and authorities in Baton Rouge, Louisiana now believe foul play may be involved.

Here`s why. Look at this beautiful young woman. One day after Sylviane went missing, her husband, Oscar, allegedly bought bags of concrete mix and several five gallon plastic buckets. And it`s unaccounted for. Where`s the concrete? Where are the buckets? What in the world could he have wanted that for? Ok.

Think about it. Think about it. You do to the math perhaps, hypothetically speaking.

Police swarmed their home looking for evidence but didn`t find the concrete, didn`t find the buckets. This is obviously a crucial detail because police are not saying much else.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right now, we`re not releasing too many details of the case because detectives really want to hold on to a few of those details because we`re hoping that someone will come forth with some information.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: It gets worse. Police believe a few days after Sylviane vanished, Oscar and her 5-year-old daughter flew from Dallas, Texas to Venezuela. And they have yet to return.

Now, Oscar is not being called a suspect. Ok. Baton Rouge police were in contact with him until last week when he stopped communicating with them.

With me tonight in an ISSUES exclusive, I am very pleased to have Walter Lemoyne, the principal of a high school where Sylviane teaches. Walter, thank you for joining us; I know this has to be very difficult for you and I know you`re only stepping forward because you`re hoping that maybe this conversation will cause somebody who knows something to step forward or jog somebody`s memory.

What do you know of the relationship between Sylviane and her husband?

WALTER LEMOYNE, PRINCIPAL, BRUSLY HIGH SCHOOL: Well, until this became public, I didn`t know they had any problems. She`s been a member of our faculty for 13 years. She`s been "Teacher of the Year" in the parish. She`s regional teaching (INAUDIBLE), national board certified. She`s gotten her doctorate, very professional.

One of the reports I got recently was that she had actually been in the hospital in January first, yet when we came back from the Christmas holidays, she never missed a day of work. So there was never any signs of anything to be alarmed about, no.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: You said she was in the hospital January 1st of 2010?



LEMOYNE: No. That would have been 11.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok. Well, what we`re hearing from law enforcement is that December 3rd, 2010, Sylviane actually called the police and said her husband was throwing things during an argument. And then four weeks later, December 31th, 2010, Sylviane goes to the hospital saying Oscar pushed her.

So I want to bring in Karen Wooley, who is Sylviane`s best friend and also teacher. Were you aware of anything troublesome in her marriage?

KAREN WOOLEY, SYLVIANE`S BEST FRIEND: Being a good friend of hers, I was aware. She confided a lot of things in me.


WOOLEY: What did she confide in me? Things about her marriage; the way things were going in her marriage. Situations, her plans to possibly get out of the marriage.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tell me about that.

WOOLEY: Well, she had a plan to get out of the marriage. Her fear was that she would not get out of the marriage with her daughter. Everything she did was for her daughter.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: What`s your reaction to her disappearance? Think about that for a second because while you think about it, I will give you the timeline of what happened. On July 5th, authorities say Sylviane contacted her family in Belgium for the last time. Then a day later, Oscar, her husband, allegedly buys the concrete mix, five gallon buckets -- several five gallon buckets. July 9th, Oscar, the husband takes his daughter according to cops and flies to Venezuela. July 14th, Oscar was scheduled to return, doesn`t show up. July 18th, Sylviane is reported missing by a co-worker and July 24th, Oscar`s car is found at the home of a family friend. She`s believed to have driven the car before she disappeared.

Ok. Karen, briefly, your reaction to her disappearance and the police thinking this is quite possibly foul play.

WOOLEY: Well, like you say, do the math. Do the math. It adds up. I am shocked and I`m outraged. I`m shocked because this behavior is very uncharacteristic of Sylviane.

As our principal, Coach Lemoyne, said "Teacher of the Year", national board certified, PhD -- this is definitely uncharacteristic, you know, none of her characteristics.

I am outraged --


VELEZ-MITCHELL: More on the other side. Hang in.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re hoping that someone will come forth with some information.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Where is Sylviane Lozada -- a wonderful teacher and mother of a young girl? She is missing. Did her husband flee the country after buying a whole bunch of cement mix as well as several plastic bins? Which of course, immediately remind me of the Drew Peterson case; he is the ex-cop, charged with the murder of wife number three, but the disappearance of wife number four remains a mystery unsolved. And Drew Peterson`s stepbrother claimed Drew asked him for help moving a heavy plastic container that was warm to the touch right around the time that wife number four disappeared. The container was never found.

Steve Moore, what do you make of the cement mix and the containers being purchased by this Oscar before he disappears, reportedly, according to cops back to Venezuela with the child?

STEVE MOOR, FORMER FBI AGENT: Well, this isn`t a Rubik`s Cube here, this is pretty straight forward what happened or what likely happened. The police have said that there`s evidence of foul play in the house. My wife is from East Baton Rouge Parish, I have been there a lot. There are water ways, there are bayous, there`s the Mississippi River.

It`s pretty straight forward I think right now, what they should be concentrating on is getting a warrant for this man and getting the State Department and the marshals on getting him back.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. But it can be tough to investigate somebody who is not even in this country, who has fled to Venezuela. And let`s remember, I mean this started in early July, around the Fourth of July holiday, a lot of time has passed.

MOORE: Right.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to go back to Karen Wooley, who is the missing woman`s best friend and I know you`re devastated and I thank you so much for speaking. We`re trying to jog somebody`s memory, we`re trying to convince somebody who knows somebody, knows something about this case; we`re trying to convince anybody who knows anything to come forward.

So Karen, what would you say to somebody who might have seen something? What would you say to them for your friend?

WOOLEY: For my friend, for the family, we`re asking anybody who knows anything about this case, please come forward. We need answers. We need answers. And our community and our school, her daughter need answers. Please, come forward.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Are you concerned about the reports that this husband may have taken the 5-year-old daughter -- I believe she`s 5 -- to Venezuela with him?

WOOLEY: Am I concerned about that? I am concerned that he`s not back here in the States answering questions.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tell me more about the problems. You say that she was thinking of leaving her husband. That`s historically, the most dangerous time for any woman. Was she worried? Did she express fears of her husband?

WOOLEY: Sylviane is a very strong woman. She has come through a lot. Everything she did was for her daughter. She had no fear of her husband.

Being the intelligent woman that she is, if she thought her life was in danger, she would have been out of there. Her fear --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: You told me that they had problems, why did she want to leave him?

WOOLEY: She was fearful that she would not get custody of her daughter. That was her fear. Everything she did was for her daughter.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, look at this beautiful woman. Thank you so much for coming forward Karen.

WOOLEY: Thank you.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And Steve, I really hope that there`s a break in this case.

We`ll be back in a minute.





VELEZ-MITCHELL: He`s got a pretty good voice. Who does he remind me of? Of course, Frank Sinatra. In fact that construction crooner is being called the 2nd Avenue Sinatra

Gary Russo is a New York City subway construction worker and he has been making the street his stage. Instead of eating on his lunch break, this guy is bringing out a microphone, literally, and singing his heart out to city goers.

In the middle of this loud, disruptive, long construction project, he says he wants to make people smile and he`s doing that. In fact he`s got his co-workers dancing and clapping. I love it. I love it.

Who needs a karaoke bar?

The next time you feel like singing, just stop wherever you are and just belt it out. The best part of life is when we get a chance to be spontaneous.

"NANCY GRACE" is up next.