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Saudi Women to Get the Vote; Nobel Peace Laureate Dies; Libyan Ghost Town; Chinese Plants Under Environmental Scrutiny; Google Digitizes Dead Sea Scrolls

Aired September 26, 2011 - 08:00:00   ET


KRISTIE LU STOUT, HOST: Welcome to NEWS STREAM, where news and technology meet.

I'm Kristie Lu Stout, in Hong Kong.

And we begin in Saudi Arabia and a breakthrough for women's rights.

Also, ahead the world mourns the death of a pioneer. Nobel Peace Prize winner Wangari Maathai dies after a long illness.


REZA SAYAH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Four suicide bombings in a little bit more than two months, all of them targeting some of the most important leaders in Afghanistan, and they all had one very unusual thing in common.


STOUT: We'll tell you about a new tactic used by suicide bombers in Afghanistan.

And is Mark Zuckerberg taking tips from another tech titan? We'll take a closer look at his new presentation style.

Women's rights activists are hailing an historic change for Saudi Arabia, even though it's not clear when it will actually take place. Saudi King Abdullah has announced that the kingdom's women will be allowed to vote for candidates and run for office in future municipal elections.

The move comes too late for Thursday's scheduled vote. And this week's upcoming municipal elections are only the second in nearly half a century. And while another round of elections is expected in 2015, that date is not definite.

Now, these are still many things that women in Saudi Arabia are not allowed to do, basic things that women in other parts of the world may casualty take for granted. Now, for example, they cannot drive because of religious edicts or open a bank account, or even go to school without a man's permission.

We are seeing Saudi women become increasingly vocal in their calls for more rights, and some women even got behind the wheel earlier this year to protest the driving ban.

Let's bring in CNN's Mohammed Jamjoom at our bureau in Abu Dhabi.

And Mohammed, with Saudi women still not allowed to drive, will this electoral reform help bring about more change for women there?

MOHAMMED JAMJOOM, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kristie, I can tell you that as of yesterday, when the announcement was made, that everybody there was taking it to mean that women would be able to vote, that they will be able to participate, and that there's an expansion of their role in the election process and these municipal elections, and they were elated at the news. Now, here's what one Saudi human rights activist had to tell us after the announcement was made.


MANAL AL-SHARIF, SAUDI WOMEN'S RIGHTS ACTIVIST: We weren't expecting -- the Shoura Council, they sent their recommendation that women can vote, and we were expecting King Abdullah to come up and say, well, they can vote. And then he surprises us and says you can vote, you can stand for election, and you can even be a member in the council, which is the legislative body in the country.


JAMJOOM: But today, I'm hearing some disappointment from female rights activists. While they're still happy that this announcement was made, they're wondering when exactly it will take place. It's important to note that the king didn't use the word "vote" in his announcement and didn't specify a timeline.

I spoke to prominent Saudi women's rights activists Wajihad Huwaidi (ph) just a short while ago. She said the fact that this could be prolonged for a few more years, said it would give time for extremists to reverse the decision. "The government thinks they will give time for people to adjust to the idea, but if you're against something you'll never change your mind, and if you're for it you'll never change your mind. Why do they hesitate when it comes to women's issues? The government always hesitates."

And that's the key thing right now, when exactly will it happen? Municipal elections are going to happen this Thursday, then another four years from now. The king is suggesting that in another four years, women will be able to vote and run.

Also, the king is saying that women will be appointed as full-time members of the Consultative Council, but the Consultative Council doesn't get appointed again for at least another year and a half. So, right now, that's where the disappointment is coming in.

In that time between now and then, what could happen? Could this be taken away? Could there be an excuse by the conservative faction in the government there to make sure this doesn't happen? And that's where a lot of the concern is lying today -- Kristie.

STOUT: Also wondering if there's concern about -- you can make an announcement for women's rights, for there to be a right to vote, but will it take root in the society there? We did hear those words of elation from a human rights activist, a woman there in Saudi Arabia. But are we also hearing from many people who are not welcoming this decision? And just how powerful is their voice?

JAMJOOM: So far, we haven't heard a lot of the hard-liners come out and condemn this decision, and one of the reasons for that is because this was a royal edict from the king himself. So, even the conservatives, even the hard-liners there in Saudi Arabia, have to be very careful so that it does not appear that they're coming out and trying to offend the king. These are lofty remarks that he made at the gathering of the Consultative Council, and the king made mention yesterday that he had consulted with the clerical establishment in Saudi Arabia before he came to this decision.

So, if there's going to be criticism, the criticism is going to have to be couched very carefully so as not to upset the powers that be. But there can always be a conservative backlash, and you could see a big power struggle going on behind the scenes between the conservative factions of the government there and the more progressive wing, the wing of the government, including Saudi King Abdullah, by most accounts, that want to see an expanded role for women in the political arena and in all other arenas of society there -- Kristie.

STOUT: Mohammed Jamjoom, joining us live from Abu Dhabi.

Thank you very much for that.

Meanwhile, Africa is mourning the death of Nobel Peace Prize Laureate Wangari Maathai. The 71-year-old environmentalist lost her battle with cancer in Nairobi on Monday. Maathai founded the Greenbelt Movement more than 30 years ago, and she won the Nobel Peace Prize in 2004 for her efforts to promote sustainable development, democracy and peace.

For more on the life and death of this remarkable woman, I'm joined by CNN's David McKenzie in the Kenyan capital.

And David, let's first talk about and celebrate the life of Wangari Maathai. She was a trailblazer. Tell us about her many pioneering achievements.

DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, certainly the world should be mourning Mangari Maathai's death. She really was a trailblazer, as you say.

In her life, she achieved many, many things. From the very beginning, when she could barely read at the age of 7, went to school and managed to get a scholarship to the U.S. and studied there. She became the first East African woman to get a Ph.D. in biology and anatomy. She came back to Kenya and she saw the wholesale destruction of Kenya's and the region's forests, and she decided to take a stand.

It's easy now to think of all the plaudits she's won, and the Nobel Prize, and how celebrated she is. Back in the '80s, here in Kenya, she was vilified, she was arrested multiple times, and she was really the first person to link the efforts of conservation with human rights, and she was punished for that many times.

It was only when Kenya found multiparty democracy that she was really lauded within general society here and by politicians. She became a member of parliament.

And her greatest achievement, she says, possibly was the fact that she led this extraordinary effort to plant trees across the region. Thirty million trees planted across East Africa. That really is the lasting legacy of Wangari Maathai, and her spirit will live on.

STOUT: Once vilified, now a hero. What is the reaction there in Kenya to the news of her death?

MCKENZIE: Well, certainly there is some level of shock here, because though we knew she was ill, and she was -- it first came out publicly last year that she had ovarian cancer. The end was quite swift, and a lot of people are kind of catching up and taking stock of her life. It's interesting to note that Twitter and the local television station and the radio, everyone is talking about the legacy of Wangari Maathai.

And she stood up to presidents, she stood up to politicians and businessmen. At some point she got death threats.

One interesting thing, she always had a positive attitude. I have talked to her a number of times. I remember this quote she said, which was that, "No matter how dark the cloud, there's always a thin silver lining." And she kind of lived her life in that way, Kristie, and she really saw that the way forward was to push up against government, to push up against people who didn't want to create the green spaces for the long-term legacy or the long-term security of Africa. And she started that trail.

It's by no means a trail that is finished, and hopefully she will pass the baton on to activist and conservationists who will secure those green spaces for the future.

STOUT: All right.

David McKenzie, joining us live from Nairobi.

Thank you very much for that.

And coming up next here on NEWS STREAM, we'll look at one Libyan ghost town.


PHIL BLACK, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): -- the people who lived here. "We can forgive Gadhafi before we forgive the Tawurgha people," this man says.


STOUT: How does he feel that way, and why? It's a complicated story, and we'll tell you ahead here on NEWS STREAM.

Plus, turning a turban into a murder weapon. This new tactic in Afghanistan is nearly undetectable.

And could the gadgets you love make people sick in China? Some people in this industrial town say yes, and we investigate.


STOUT: Welcome back.

Now, officials in Mexico say the decapitated body of a newspaper editor has been found. The woman's murder in Nuevo Laredo, it appears to be another message from drug gangs.

Media reports say a note next to her body claims that she was killed for posting on a social networking site. Now, that is similar to another attack in the same city earlier this month, and you'll remember in that case, two mutilated bodies were left hanging from a bridge with that warning message taped above them.

Now, in Libya, the National Transitional Council is asking for global help to investigate a suspected mass grave. The site sits next to Tripoli's infamous Abu Salim prison. NTC officials say the discovery likely dates back to a notorious crime of the Gadhafi era, the 1996 slaughter of some 1,200 prisoners. But so far, there has been no excavation to confirm those suspicions.

Meanwhile, NATO says loyalist forces are threatening the civilian population of Sirte. Its planes have bombarded Gadhafi's hometown as NTC fighters reportedly prepare to stage another advance there.

Now, the other remaining holdout is Bani Walid. Some people who once supported Gadhafi say they are afraid.

Phil Black takes us to the town of Tawurgha, not far from Misrata.


BLACK (voice-over): Driving through Tawurgha is an eerie experience. This poor town used to be home to tens of thousands. Now they're all gone.

Green flags flying above buildings show its people supported Moammar Gadhafi. Now most of the shops and homes are vandalized, burned, looted.

(on camera): It seems someone who liked Colonel Gadhafi certainly lived at this home. And someone who didn't feel the same way has slashed this image and done all of this. This is pretty much in the same state as all the homes we're seeing in this town. They have all been roughly searched or looted for things of value and use, and we're told that the residents of this town left quickly, at short notice, and there is evidence of that everywhere -- personal possessions either left behind or tossed aside by those who have come through afterwards.

(voice-over): The only people in Tawurgha now are anti-Gadhafi fighters. They openly hate the people who lived here.

"We can forgive Gadhafi before we forgive the Tawurgha people," this man says. The fighters say they have good reason to feel this way. They're from Misrata, a neighboring city that, for months, suffered through the fiercest battle of Libya's civil war.

Gadhafi forces repeatedly hit Misrata with rockets and shelling, often firing from positions inside Tawurgha. And Misrata residents accuse Tawurgha men of raiding their homes and committing terrible crimes.

MOHAMMED ALI ISSA, MISRATA RESIDENT: They were here, killed the women, killed the children, burning the house, stealing everything. Doing very, very, very bad things.

BLACK: When Misrata fell to the revolution, the people of Tawurgha fled. They're now scattered across the country.

We found around 1,000 of them in Tripoli, staying in former military barracks. These fighters from Misrata found them, too, and weren't happy to see us.

The Tawurgha here say the fighters arrested two men and took them away. Most of these people admit they were on Gadhafi's side, and some of them fought for him. They believe individuals who committed crimes should be punished, not the whole community.

They tell me they want to go home. That suggestion has found little support among Misratans.

(on camera): Yes or no, should they come back?


BLACK: Racism is also an issue here. Some graffiti in Tawurgha describes its mostly black population as animals and slaves.

While Misratans must rebuild much of their city, these people from Tawurgha are too scared to leave their camp. Fighting in Libya isn't finished, reconciliation hasn't started.

Phil Black, CNN, Tripoli.


STOUT: Now, a little later on this show I'll be speaking to a young man who fought with anti-Gadhafi forces, a young American who goes to UCLA. You may have heard of his unusual story. His name is Chris Jeon. He's a 21-year-old college student born and raised in California with no prior connections to Libya. Find out what motivated his journey when we speak to him live a little bit later this hour on NEWS STREAM.

Now to Afghanistan, where we are seeing an alarming and deadly trend. In just the past two months, suicide bombers have targeted some of the country's most important leaders and peacemakers, and they were able to get close to them and kill them because of what they were wearing.

Reza Sayah has more.


SAYAH (voice-over): July 14th, a suicide bomber kills a senior Afghan official at a funeral for President Hamid Karzai's slain brother. July 27th, a suicide bomber assassinates the mayor of Kandahar City. August 19th, a suicide bomber targets a government building in Helmand province. September 20th, another suicide bomber assassinates Burhanuddin Rabbani, the man leading the peace talks with the Taliban.

(on camera): Four suicide bombings in a little bit more than two months all of them targeting some of the most important leaders in Afghanistan and they all had one very unusual thing in common. In all four attacks, assailants hid their bombs underneath their turbans.

TABASAN ZAHEER, HEAD OF PAKISTAN POLICE BOMB SQUAD: If he's coming here to embrace him, well the turban can certainly kill both of them.

SAYAH (voice-over): Tabasan Zaheer is head of the police bomb squad in Islamabad, Pakistan. His office decoration decapitated heads of suicide bombers. Pictures too graphic to show. Zaheer says turban bombs seem to be the newest weapon in the fight for Afghanistan because asking to search the Islamic headdress is often viewed as disrespectful.

(on camera): Would you be comfortable asking tribal elders to remove their --

ZAHEER: No. It's not that easy.

SAYAH (on camera): It's not that easy.

(voice-over): With powerful explosives like this C-4 turban bombs can weigh as light as a tissue box and nearly impossible to detect.

(on camera): You're telling me all you need to make a bomb that fits in a turban is this little bit of C-4, this detonator and a cord. That's it.

ZAHEER: That's it.

SAYAH (voice-over): The power of those explosives is on display in this police training video. Last month, President Karzai called on clerics to condemn turban bombings, calling them an affront to Islamic values. "The bomber was not a follower of God," says this man. "I condemn all bombings," says Malik Muhammad Rafik (ph). "Whether they're in shirts, trousers or turbans."

Explosives experts say the Afghan government will have to use more metal detectors, search people in clothing they may not have in the past. And until then, they say turban bombs could remain the Taliban's most effective new weapon.

Reza Sayah, CNN, Peshawar.


STOUT: Now, just two weeks after militants stormed the U.S. Embassy in Kabul, Afghanistan, there has been another deadly attack in the area.

Let's find out more from Nick Paton Walsh. He joins us now live from Abu Dhabi.

Nick, what have you learned about this latest attack in Kabul?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The key thing is where it happened, Kristie. We're talking about an annex to the U.S. Embassy compound already very secure, an annex where it's believed many CIA operatives function inside Kabul.

What we're hearing about this attack is an employee in that annex, an Afghan employee, began shooting around various people inside that annex, killing one U.S. citizen also employed by the embassy and injuring another one. He was then apparently shot by Afghan security -- sorry, by American security contractors working there who used a flashbang grenade to disorientate him.

But really, this is the key psychological impact of this. Yet again, the third time, frankly, in the last two or three weeks we're seeing in the most secure parts of Kabul what could possibly have been an insurgent attack, although it's unclear what the motivation behind this particular killing was today -- Kristie.

STOUT: You know, just last week we had CNN terror analyst Peter Bergen on this show, and he told me that these attacks in the heart of Kabul were expected.

So, is this part of a strategy by the Taliban there to reassert themselves nearly one decade since U.S. troops first entered the country?

WALSH: It's all really about perception, NATO admits. And the perception, I think, in the last few weeks is that this supposedly most safe part of Afghanistan, where America is supposed to have strongest control, is vulnerable to attack.

The U.S. Embassy, the ISAF headquarters are vulnerable to a lengthy assault by militants. A senior Afghan peace coordinator is vulnerable to an assassin coming straight to his home. And now it seems that we're not quite sure the motivation behind this attack, it seems that also, the CIA station near the embassy is perhaps also vulnerable as well. And it's about, I think, the insurgency in those first two attacks and perhaps this one -- we're not entirely clear -- showing that they have a reach where they shouldn't be able to get -- Kristie.

STOUT: Nick Paton Walsh, joining us live on the story.

Thank you very much indeed for that.

You're watching NEWS STREAM. We'll be back right after the break.


STOUT: Welcome back. Coming to you live from Hong Kong, you are watching NEWS STREAM.


STOUT: Now, still to come here on NEWS STREAM, this factory in China is alleged to supply U.S. tech giant Apple, but the residents there are claiming that it is pumping out pollution, as well as products.

And we have noticed that Facebook has a few new features, but it seems its founder has new style as well.


STOUT: Hello there, I'm Kristie Lu Stout in Hong Kong. You're watching News Stream. And these are your world headlines. A historic change for women in Saudi Arabia. King Abdullah has announced that Saudi women will be allowed to vote and run in the Kingdom's next round of municipal elections. Now the announcement comes too late for Thursday's already scheduled elections. And it is not clear when the next vote will take place.

Kenyan Nobel laureate Wangari Maathai died on Monday after a long battle with cancer. She was a leading environmental activist campaigning for human rights and the empowerment of Africa's poor. And she was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize in 2004 becoming the first African woman to receive that honor. And Maathai was 71.

Libya's National Transitional Council is asking for global help to investigate a suspected mass grave. It has been discovered next to Tripoli's Abu Salim Prison. NTC officials say some 1,200 inmates may be buried there, the victims of a massacre back in 1996. And so far there has been no excavation to confirm those suspicions.

Now six young men are due to appear in a British court later today facing terrorism related charges. The men are from Birmingham in central England and were arrested a week ago in what investigators called a major operation. Now police say they're questioning a seventh man, but have not charged him.

Now it is a long way from Silicon Valley to the city of Suzhou, China near Shanghai, that's where many of the world's computer products are built. Now, though, questions are being raised about the environmental awareness of suppliers for the U.S. space tech giant Apple. Eunice Yoon has more.


EUNICE YOON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORREPSONDENT: (inaudible) in Suzhou, an industrial town in China dotted with factories churning out electronics for the world, benefiting residents like Miller Shu (ph). The 33 year old engineer moved for a job, but now has second thoughts about living here. His biggest concern fumes from an alleged supplier to U.S. tech giant Apple right next to his apartment.

"It makes you feel sick," he says.

This is one of the factories that environmentalists say makes products for Apple. The residents in the area have been complaining of a hazardous gas. And could really smell a strong odor.

With the help of concerned citizens like Shu (ph), veteran green activist Ma Jun (ph), tracked suspected polluters like the one in Suzhou in a seven month investigation targeting Apple in a 46 page report.

MA JUN, ENVIRONMENTALIST: They commit to ensure highest social responsibility standards. If they cannot manage their supply chain, it's just empty talk.

YOON: In this town not far from Suzhou residents complain suspected supplier emit noxious gases right next to their local kindergarten. In the village next door, locals say they live daily with polluted water and air. Many attribute the high cancer rate here to the ever worsening environment. Young villagers have moved away, and the elderly who remain, say they feel powerless of convincing the government to enforce its own laws.

"Our words are totally worthless to the authorities," 75 year old Lubao Yun (ph) says. "There's nothing we can do.

Activist Ma says public scrutiny is key. His group compiled a database of tens of thousands of local violators and regularly names and shames big brands.

JUN: Major companies like Apple, you know, coming to China. They only care about the price.

YOON: In a statement, Apple said the companies we do business with must use environmentally responsible manufacturing processes. Since the findings, the company has discussed the report with Ma who told CNN the two sides have no agreed to work together.

Officials in Suzhou say the factories we saw are regularly checked and meet China's code.

At the factory next to Shu's (ph) home expands, he hopes to keep the company in line for himself and his family.

"Health cannot be the price of wealth, right?" He says.

A philosophy shared by many in China's grassroots environmental movement.

Eunice Yoon, CNN, Suzhou.


STOUT: And now to a project that marries 21st Century technology with 1st Century religious texts. The Israel Antiquities Authority has teamed up with Google to digitize the Dead Sea Scrolls. Now the ancient manuscripts, they were first discovered in 1947 on the northwest shore of the Dead Sea. And are the oldest known texts of the Hebrew bible. And since 1965, you've had to go to Jerusalem to see the scrolls, but now they are available online.

And this is what you can find on the web site, 1,200 megapixel images of five of the manuscripts, that's almost 200 times higher in resolution than those you get with the standard camera.

And with this one, the great Isaiah scroll, you can search by column, by chapter, and by verse. And you can even click on the Hebrew to bring up an English translation.

Now the Dead Sea Scrolls project is designed to make the manuscripts interactive and accessible to everyone.

And Yossi Matias helped bring that idea to life. He is the head of Google's Israel's research and development center. And welcome to News Stream. And first tell us what can I learn and what can I do with the Dead Sea Scrolls digital project?


So first I do the project with Israel museum in Jerusalem. And this really were privileged and honored to be able to work with them and bring - - help bring some of the Dead Sea Scrolls online.

This is really about enabling every person to access those high scrolls that we just made available online. And as you mentioned search and access every verse, for example in the Isaiah scroll, and even share it with their friends and colleagues through social networks.

STOUT: Let's go behind the scenes, how did you go about scanning thousands of ancient scroll fragments. How did you and the team do it?

MATIAS: Well, the actually digitization is done by the content owners. In this case, what we announced today is launching five scrolls. These are complete scrolls which are owned by the Israel Museum in Jerusalem. And they were actually doing the scanning with their own (inaudible). And we were using cloud technology to make them accessible online.

So the power of cloud technology is you can take these high resolution images and make them available through any browser, even for a mobile phone. And every verse in the scroll of Isaiah can actually be accessed on his own. So if I would search for wolf and lamb on the (inaudible) scroll site which was launched this morning, I would find the verse thou shall -- the world shall dwell with the lamb.

And then I can take, say, the particular segment of that verse, share it with others through Google+ or Facebook or Twitter or by e-mail. And anybody then can in one click have direct access and see the text as it was written over 2,000 years ago, the very same text. Which is pretty powerful, especially for students, for anybody who is learning the material.

So I believe -- we that this is a very strong engagement. And in a way connect people to their heritage across so many years.

STOUT: You can search, scan, and now share the Dead Sea Scrolls. This is new technology. But have you talked to historians about whether or not it offers a new perspective on ancient society and the scrolls themselves?

MATIAS: Well, the scrolls, of course, were well studied and there are many books actually written from them, so their availability was already there to some extent. The hope, of course, is now that this is going to be even more available to more scholars over the world. They don't need any longer to come physically to the shrine of the book in order to study them in detail in a way they can use the web to study them in more detail than they could in the naked eye. And this is now open not only for scholars, but also for the general public.

So obviously the value there, the (inaudible) value of the scrolls already well known, well established and now it's an opportunity for everybody to appreciate it and to open it up for even more scholars to have access to that.

STOUT: And also, why did Google do this? How does this project fit into your overall mission?

MATIAS: Yeah, that's an excellent question. So this is really an excellent (inaudible) to our mission, because really our mission is to organize world information, make it available in a ubiquitous way to everybody. And I cannot think of more important content to be available to people than heritage, cultural, historical archived information.

Now the Israel R&D center started out this project actually a broader project in a way by collaborating with the Yad Vashem, the holocaust museum. This was started a few years ago and we launched a few months ago. And so after we observed actually the opportunity the have access to documents in collections is really broader.

There are many collections out there, which people care about. It's about their history, their heritage, their culture. And really what we'd like to have is everybody to have access to this content.

So this started out kind of these partnerships. And at some point we met with the museum, with Jim Schneider (ph), and also George Blumenthal (ph) who was a facilitator. And we identified we have a shared vision about making this content available online. And in the course of a few months we actually took this digital material, or digitized material and made it available through that site.

And the way we view that is this is part of a broader project. There's a lot more heritage and cultural and historical content out there. And obviously we'd love to see as much of it online and accessible to everybody. And leverage on the most modern technologies to see that, to have the engagement, the experience, the access.

This is really something very powerful. And we believe that people can actually get better understanding of this heritage and culture if they have better access to this information and content in a more engaging way.

STOUT: That's right.

And you said it is a very powerful application of Google technology. Thank you very much for sharing your story and your new project with us here on News Stream.

MATIAS: Thank you very much, Kristie.

STOUT: Take care.

MATIAS: Thank you very much.

STOUT: Now the founder of Facebook has unveiled a new look for the site and plenty of new features last week. But Mark Zuckerberg, he took to the stage on Thursday, it wasn't just all the new features that caught our eye. We also noticed something different about his presentation.

Let's go live now to CNN Center for more on this.'s John Sutter joins me right now. John, good to see you.

And let's start by looking at how Zuckerberg used to handle these presentations in the past.

JOHN SUTTER, CNN.COM: Yeah, Mark Zuckerberg has sort of this history of not being, you know, the most like sort of people friendly tech CEO. You know, he was in the movie the Social Network. He's sort of parodied as this kind of misanthrope who can't really relate to people. And this has come through in his past presentations, which are mocked in real-time on Facebook and Twitter sort of as he gives them. People sort of don't have the same, like, trust in his presentation historically as, you know, for other tech CEOs.

So you have, I think, a quick clip from him earlier this summer to get a sense of sort of, you know, why this has people talking.


MARK ZUCKERBERG, FACEBOOK FOUNDER: If you took a piece of paper, right, and folded it on itself 50 times, how tall would it be? Haven't you guys heard this before. It's pretty interesting. How tall do you think it would be? Most people would say it's like, you know, a few feet, right. I mean, that's 50 times, that's a lot. It turns out it goes to the moon and back more than 10 times, which is -- I mean it's kind of interesting. Like your intuition around how these exponential functions grow, because it's 2 to the 50 times whatever the height of a piece of paper is.


SUTTER: So that's a little bit tone deaf, right? Like it's an analogy that -- you know, maybe potentially interesting, but didn't quite work, you know, when it came through. And I think people watch these tech presentations, especially lately, very closely. When a new product comes out, everyone wants to know, you know, what people are going to think of it. And that is, in large part, determined by sort of how the CEO is able to sell it.

So historically, at least, you know Mark Zuckerberg sort of came across as, you know, as -- not quite as well as other tech CEOs like Steve Jobs for instance.

STOUT: Yeah, you know, I remember when that presentation came out. And we're pretty geeky here at News Stream, but it had a lot of us scratching our heads at the moment.

But John, let's compare that Mark Zuckerberg with the guy we saw on the stage on Thursday. Let's take a look.


ZUCKERBERG: It's the heart of your Facebook experience completely rethought from the ground up. So this is the first thing that I want to show you today. We've been working on it all year. And we're calling it Time Line.


STOUT: OK. He's still wearing the gray t-shirt, but there's a lot more polish here. John, what do you make of the difference.

SUTTER: Yeah, I think -- I think what a lot of people have been saying is that he's channeling Steve Jobs who is sort of the king of the tech presser, as it were. You're right, he still has that sort of goofy outfit on. And a lot of magazine writers, especially fashion magazines in the U.S. sort of make fun of his, you know, typical outfit.

But I think what he was doing here was appealing to why consumers would want to use Facebook and use these new features. He really hammered home the point that this new time line feature lets you tell the story of your life and collect sort of everything about you on one page on the internet, which some people find frightening, but is a very powerful idea and it's personalizing these changes.

In the past, you know, we saw the other (inaudible) sort of speaking in the abstract. He shows a lot of graft in his old presentations. He was showing like log normalized graphs and using terms like that. Before it was just geeky and fun, but sort of confuses a lot of people.

So I think, you know, the reaction from the internet has been that he is trying to channel Steve Jobs pretty directly if we look at, you know, a previous clip of how Jobs would handle a similar presentation.

STOUT: That's right...


STEVE JOBS, FRM. CEO APPLE: ...that is. And we like to show it to you today for the first time. And we call it the iPad.


SUTTER: Same font, right? Like it's the same set-up. It's a giant, you know, PowerPoint presentation on a screen. He's, you know, doing the whole I have a tech CEO uniform thing. So it's pretty hard not to see the differences.

And we'll have to see, you know, whether this pays off for Zuckerberg who announced some very radical changes to the site. And usually, you know, whenever Facebook changes something it's met with a lot of criticism, especially initially on the Internet. He's seen as more of an engineer and less sort of a people person who can sort of make these kind of sell to the public.

So we'll just have to see sort of where this goes. But the changes are very significant.

STOUT: That's right. Well, you know, Steve Jobs, he's got the presentation skills. And he's definitely one to model. Thank you very much for that. John Sutter

Now Don Riddell, he's going to be here with all the latest from the Rugby World Cup. And we will hear from the fastest marathon runner in the world. All that coming up next.


STOUT: Welcome back.

Now there is a new world record holder in the marathon. Don Riddell is here with that and the rest of the sporting highlights -- Don.


You know for so long Ethiopia's Haile GebreSelassie has been the dominant force in distance running, but events in Berlin on Sunday which suggest a changing of the guard. On the marathon course that GebreSelassie set the world record three years ago, Kenya's Patrick Makau destroyed that record by a massive 21 seconds coasting victory in a time of 2 hours, 3 minutes, and 38 seconds.

Meanwhile, GebreSelassie was struggling to breathe. He couldn't even finish the race.

Afterwards, Makau told me it was a proud day for he and his country.


PATRICK MAKAU, MARATHON RUNNER: Actually, the first thing I have done is for my country, because Kenya is full of champions, especially the medium distances starting from the 8,000 meters going up. We are all champions. And we don't -- we don't believe in being beaten by people like Ethiopians.

RIDDELL: So this is a really proud day for you.

MAKAU: Yes. This is a very proud day. It's very great day to my country Kenya.


RIDDELL: And we'll have more on that interview in the next addition of world sport in two-and-a-half hours time.

Meanwhile, Wales had recorded their biggest ever win at the Rugby World Cup today setting up with is effectively a knockout game against Fiji on Sunday. The winner goes through to the quarterfinals, the loser goes home.

Scott Williams led the Welsh with a hat trick of tries against Namibia in New Plymouth, meaning their opponents became the first team to be knocked out of the tournament. This was a fourth defeat for Namibia.

Wales scored a dozen tries in all, romping to victory by 81-7. And that gave them a crucial bonus point.

However, the Welsh team labored at times. And there will be one or two things they'll want to improve ahead of Sunday's crunch game against Fiji in Hamilton. For now, though, a pretty satisfying day's work.

That's all we've got time for just now, Kristie. Back to you.

STOUT: Don, thank you.

Now many college students, they use their breaks to gain real-world experience, but we're not betting not many experience this. I'll be talking to Chris Jeon about why he fought in Libya's revolution. Stay with us.


STOUT: Welcome back.

And when you ask American college student Chris Jeon how he spent his school break, the 21 year old will have a very unusual story to tell. The UCLA math major, he left California and traveled to Libya where he fought with anti-Gadhafi forces. He spent about three weeks there, arriving around the time that Tripoli fell.

Now Chris, is now back in the U.S. He joins us live from CNN New York.

Chris, good to see you, but why? Why did you do this?

CHRIS JEON, UCLA STUDENT: You know, I define through these kind of experiences. I feel the more varied and different experiences I have, they give me a fresh perspective. And, you know, I do these things pretty often, actually. Three years ago I went to Cambodia. I lived in an orphanage. I've lived with indigenous Indians in Amazon. And you know I go places like Seattle with just nothing more than a dollar in my pocket. I mean, it helps me understand the world a little bit more doing these kind of things.

STOUT: But Chris, you were in a war zone. So were you worried about getting shot or potentially getting killed?

JEON: Yeah, of course. I mean, the risk is there. But the group I was with I felt very safe. You know, they protected me. And I felt like I was in good hands.

STOUT: But did you fire a weapon when you were there in Libya?

JEON: Right. For training purposes.

STOUT: OK. Did you ever kill anyone, hurt anyone?

JEON: Oh, no, no, no.

STOUT: OK. Did you know how to handle a gun before you joined the rebellion in Libya/

JEON: No. I didn't. It's funny, because the first night I slept, you know, they told me anybody who sleeps with us they must know how to assemble and disassemble the AK-47. So they actually taught me on my first night.

But I didn't go in there expecting to shoot guns or anything, I just went -- my only intention was to live with the rebels. That was my only goal.

STOUT: And did the rebels welcome you, or was there some resentment? Did some view you as a tourist?

JEON: No, no, no. Actually I think they tested me in the beginning. They took me out to the front, front line, see whether whether I got scared or not. You know, we had all these machismo contests, too, like we would have wrestling matches. We would dive from cliffs that were 20 feet high in shallow water.

And I didn't say know to any of these. And, you know, I actually did pretty well. And I think I gained their respect that way. And I think -- I believe they thought that, you know, this kid is open-minded. He actually wants to learn about our culture, our cause. And I think that's a big reason why they took us in.

STOUT: Chris, it sounds great, but you don't speak Arabic, so how were you able to understand the rebels and communicate with them?

JEON: That's funny -- my vocabulary, half of it was actually food and slang words. So I would say really traditional Libya foods like Zalmata (ph), Asida (ph), Bezin (ph), and then I would say slang like zhobay zhobay (ph) good weather. And they would laugh. And they would think how does this kid know this? You know, he must have really been immersed in the culture. And I think that really warmed them up to me.

STOUT: Now Chris we haven't talked about your parents, because they had no idea that you were in Libya fighting with the rebels until they saw you on the news. So how did you explain yourself to your parents?

JEON: Right.

I mean, first of all I have to thank them for being very understanding. I'm very grateful for my family. When they -- when I first spoke with them, I told them I went to Egypt. And after that, you know, when I was able to contact them in Libya, they were just glad to hear my voice. You know, they asked me to come home.

And you know, once they found out I didn't want to put them through any more suffering, so I decided to go home after that. And I think they were just relieved that I was there safe. And they told me, you know, Chris, you know, I hope you get a -- one day you have a son like you so you know what we go through.

STOUT: And what do you say, Chris, to those who say what you did in Libya was a publicity stunt. And you're nothing more than a thrill seeker. How do you respond to that?

JEON: I think you have to understand my motives. You know, I have a history of going out and doing different things. You know, I don't seek publicity. Anybody that knows me knows that I'm not looking for attention.

You know, I do this for myself, for the perspective, you know. This is how -- how I live my life. You know, this is what I do.

STOUT: Well, Chris, I think you're a pretty crazy guy, but you've got a great story to tell. Chris Jeon, thank you very much for joining us here on CNN.

JEON: Thank you.

STOUT: Now. You know how some music defines a generation? Well, the soundtrack perhaps to my generation might very well be Nevermind by Nirvana. Now, 20 years old. It's an iconic album. And the photo on the cover of the naked baby underwater reaching for that dollar bill, it's one of the most defining images of 1990s grunge music.

Well, that baby, his name is Spencer Elden. He's now 20 years old as well and tells CNN it was his dad who got him in the picture.


SPENCER ELDEN, NIRVANA BABY: He had a good friend that was a photographer. And the photographer, Kirk Whittle (ph), they went to school together. And he needed -- he just got a job that, you know, needed a baby to be in the water swimming. And I was just born at the time. And my dad doing sets, props, reading and magic and special effects for the film industry, he -- you know, it was like another job for him. So they went down to the local pool and threw me in the water and that was about it.


STOUT: That was the Nevermind baby.

Now Elden has never received any royalties from the image, but says he's a big fan of Nirvana's music.

And that is News Stream, but the news continues at CNN. World Business Today is next.