CNN CNN


 

Return to Transcripts main page

ISSUES WITH JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL

Murray Admitted Giving Jackson Propofol for 30 Days Before Death

Aired October 7, 2011 - 19:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL JACKSON, POP SINGER: Don`t have enough hope, no more hope.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you know if he was under the care of any other doctors?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He never disclosed that to me.

JACKSON: I feel their pain. I feel their hurt.

DR. CONRAD MURRAY, ON TRIAL: I`m a cardiologist. As a specialist, I have a specialty of internal medicine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was not board certified in cardiology. Conrad Murray was not board certified in any medical specialty.

JACKSON: I love them because I didn`t have a childhood. I had no childhood.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The contents of this interview will never be released by us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST (voice-over): An extraordinary, monumental day, maybe the biggest day of the case in the Michael Jackson death trial.

Good evening, everyone, I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell coming to you live from Los Angeles.

Wow. Groundbreaking, a tape never before heard of Dr. Conrad Murray`s voice played in court today. His account of how Michael Jackson died minute by minute, as he told two detectives in a hotel in Marina Del Rey. Listen to this.

OK. I got to tell you this. We`re going to play clips of this tape, of Dr. Conrad Murray claiming -- claiming that all of this was Michael Jackson`s idea, that it was Michael Jackson`s idea to take Propofol, that it wasn`t Conrad Murray`s idea. OK? And he says he knew that giving Michael so much Propofol was dangerous and unnatural. And he claimed that he tried to wean the King of Pop off these drugs just three days before his death.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The first time that milk was used on him, was it your idea or was it his idea?

MURRAY: His. His.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He knew how much to put in? He knew what it was? He knew how to inject it? He knew all that?

MURRAY: Yes. And he also -- he knew that that was the only thing that worked for him.

(UNINTELLIGIBLE) I was trying to wean him off.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Trying to wean him off. By ordering boatloads of the stuff? What do you think? I`m taking your calls on this. Do these tapes that we will play for you over the next hour prove Conrad Murray is guilty or innocent of killing Michael Jackson? Give me a call: 1-877-JVM- SAYS. That`s 1-877-586-7297.

Now, what`s very interesting about this is that during these extraordinary tapes, Dr. Conrad Murray seems to have no problem pointing the finger at another one of Michael Jackson`s doctors, a Dr. David Adams.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MURRAY: Do you know his name what is his name, Dr. David Adams? He is about your height, a football player. He has more weight than you. And, you know, he gave it to me before in Las Vegas several times. He walks with his little bag.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Joining me now in an ISSUES exclusive is the attorney for the guy that Dr. Conrad Murray pointed the finger at during these extraordinary audiotapes, Dr. David Adams` attorney. So I want to welcome Libo Agwara, the attorney for Dr. Adams.

OK. First of all, Michael Jackson does know your client, Dr. David Adams. Tell me what Dr. David Adams has done with Michael Jackson, in terms of Propofol treatment. Let`s establish that.

LIBO AGWARA, ATTORNEY FOR DR. DAVID ADAMS (via phone): Jane, I don`t know if we are having a connection problem, but I didn`t quite understand the question you asked.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Has your client, Dr. David Adams, ever given Michael Jackson Propofol and if so, how many times?

AGWARA: The answer is yes, four times.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Under what circumstances?

AGWARA: When Michael Jackson had his dental surgeries in 2008 and we -- I actually did give a press conference on that particular issue. Now those are documented, we have the medical records, there were four times in 2008 and those were for properly documented medical procedures. And by the way, just so you know...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And in this case.

AGWARA: I`m sorry, go ahead

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Go ahead.

AGWARA: No, no, no. Those were also at certified medical facilities. So my client doesn`t run around giving people Propofol in their homes. No, he does it in medical settings and for appropriate procedures.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, in these tapes, Dr. Conrad Murray kind of takes this hot potato and throws it on your client`s lap and says basically, "I didn`t really know about Propofol until Michael Jackson told me he wanted his milk. And the first way I was introduced to this whole Propofol as a sleep aid was when Michael Jackson told me to call Dr. David Adams, and I ended up sort of going over and visiting David Adams as he put Michael Jackson to sleep using Propofol."

What`s your reaction? What`s your client`s reaction to him pointing the finger at Dr. Adams?

AGWARA: Well, Jane, first of all, Dr. Murray is lying. And I believe he can -- I think he has proven himself to be a good liar, because -- actually, a bad one at best. And let me explain to you. My client has only met Dr. Murray once, and he met Dr. Murray the first week of April 2009, when Murray called him, asking him to come to his house for a meeting with Michael Jackson and himself.

My client said, "No, I don`t know who you are. I`m not going to meet you at your house." So, they agreed to meet at Dr. Murray`s office. OK?

Now, at that office meeting, Mr. Jackson asked my client to join in the tour in Europe. OK? And my client gave him a list of his requirements from licensing to the possible association of the sleep specialist and told him what he wanted.

Now, a few days after that meeting, Dr. Murray called my client back and said, "Well, look, we think that, you know, what you`re asking is too much, but we`re going to take care of it, but tell us how much money you want."

My client said, "Look, if you guys want me to be gone a year, that means I have to close my practice down. OK? Well, I need -- this is how much I need. The total is going to be about $1.3 million."

Now, Murray says, "I can get somebody to do it for $600,000." OK?

Now, my client says, "Look, you can get somebody do it for $200,000, but you`re going to be giving Michael Jackson a $200,000 funeral."

Now, Murray never called my client after...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So are you saying basically that your client, Dr. Adams, turned down an offer from Dr. Conrad Murray to accompany him to Europe for Michael Jackson`s tour, because he thought what Dr. Conrad Murray was doing was too dangerous? That`s a yes or no question?

AGWARA: Exactly. Because basically he was saying, "Look, for 600,000, he could do whatever it is, OK, and hire whatever of other doctors that, you know, he needed to hire to do the work."

My client says, "Well..."

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me play -- let me play -- let me interrupt you for a second. I want to play what Dr. Conrad Murray said, one of the many things he said about Dr. David Adams today when he was trying to, it seemed, pass the ball and say, "It really wasn`t my idea. Dr. David Adams was the one who first was giving him Propofol or doing it before me." Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MURRAY: I then called Dr. Adams, David Adams. I told him that I never met him. Michael said he had worked with him before, and he had given him Propofol (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

Dr. Adams said to me, give him one hour, try and call him back. I called Mr. Jackson. I said, "I spoke to Mr. Adams, Dr. Adams. He told me that he may have enough of the product that you want. " He is quite familiar with him. Dr. Adams says, "Oh, yes, I know Michael. I know Michael very well. He always -- he does well under it, that drug. The milk. He didn`t call it milk. He just said, "He loves that drug."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Last question, Libo. Did Dr. Adams tell Dr. Murray, "Oh, he loves that drug. He does so well under that drug," Diprivan, which is also know known as Propofol?

AGWARA: Absolutely not. And just so you know, Jane, we have information that as far back as 2007, Dr. Murray was pressuring local -- some local doctors to actually give Michael Jackson Propofol.

So first of all, he hasn`t even come clear regarding when he started pushing Propofol on Michael Jackson.

And now, the other point I wanted to make -- excuse me -- now, what happened, according to Michael Jackson, was as a result of Dr. Murray`s greed. Not only did he not hire another specialist, OK, he decided to hire himself. And he didn`t know what was doing.

And let me tell you something. If Michael Jackson had hired who he wanted to hire, he would still be alive today. Dr. Murray overruled Michael Jackson and hired himself, because if my client had been hired, Dr. Murray would not have been given the $150,000 a month, because there would be no need for him.

Now, my client would have hired the necessary sleep specialist to work with him, to do a rapid detox on Michael Jackson. Murray did not want anybody else close to Michael Jackson. He had absolute control over that man, OK?

So, I don`t know what he thinks he`s doing or why he`s trying to drag my client into this mess. He killed that man by himself.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Are you considering -- is your client considering filing suit of any sort against Dr. Murray?

AGWARA: Yes. Yes.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tell us about that.

AGWARA: We just -- today was the first time we heard the tape. We did meet with detectives Smith and Mayes (ph) a while back when they were doing the investigation. They did not play that tape for us. So now that we have this, we`re going to be looking at the possibility of instituting a civil action against Dr. Murray.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And this is the first time anybody knows about this? You`re breaking this news right here on ISSUES that Dr. David Adams, now that he`s heard this tape, where Conrad Murray says -- tries to point -- point the finger at him, now he`s contemplating a lawsuit against Dr. Murray?

AGWARA: Yes.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Is he going to go forward, do you think?

AGWARA: Yes.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So you`re going to sue?

AGWARA: My client will sue. Whether it is me or another attorney that files it, it`s yet to be determined, but he will be -- he will be pursuing a civil action against Dr. Murray.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And how upset is Dr. David Adams tonight?

AGWARA: Oh, I can`t even begin to tell you how angry he is. I mean, for Murray to -- first of all, what happened to Michael Jackson happened in June. OK? My client only met Murray one time. I mean, for Murray to think that he could lie his way out of this -- his words are the words of a desperate man, OK? So, he wants to take down whoever he can with him. And why he`s doing this, we do not understand. You know, my client has put over 6,000...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Do you think it could be to save his own skin?

AGWARA: Well, of course that`s what he decided to do, but then, Jane, look at this. My client has put over 6,000 people to sleep. They all woke up. That`s what Dr. Murray needs to remember.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So Dr. David Adams is a furious man tonight and extremely angry that his name was mentioned on this tape that was played in front of the whole world?

AGWARA: He is. He is.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Correct, Libo?

AGWARA: Yes, you are correct.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Wow. All right.

You just heard it here first. The doctor that Dr. Conrad Murray points the finger at in the tape that was just played is going to sue Dr. Conrad Murray. So, he`s got more problems.

And that doctor`s lawyer just told us that Dr. Conrad Murray is lying about the relationship that he had with Dr. David Adams and is furious at being dragged into this.

More on the Michael Jackson death trial when we come back after a very short break. Unbelievable recordings of Conrad Murray telling his side of the story to investigators.

We`re also taking your calls on this. What do you think: 1-877-JVM- SAYS, 1-877-586-7297.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: First time that milk was used on him, was it your idea or was it his idea?

MURRAY: His. Him

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He knew how much to put in? He knew what it was? He knew how to inject it? He knew all that?

MURRAY: Yes. And he also -- he knew that that was the only thing that worked for him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MURRAY: I came back to his bedside, and he wasn`t breathing. Immediately, I felt for a pulse, and I was able to get a thready pulse in the femoral region. His body was warm. There was no change in color by then. Lifted his leg. We can give you an auto transfusion. And then I continued to do CPR and mouth-to-mouth resuscitation until paramedics came. Paramedics came. They called UCLA. They hooked him up to the pulse oximeter. He was not breathing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is Dr. Conrad Murray listening to his own voice as he told cops two days after Michael Jackson died what he says happened after he returned from a two-minute trip to the bathroom.

I want to go straight out to Beth Karas, who was in court today.

Very emotional, Beth, as members of the Jackson family become overwhelmed and really can`t stay in the court because they`re too emotional. Tell us what happened.

BETH KARAS: That`s right. Michael Jackson`s older sister, Rebe, and another young woman with her who may have been her daughter, Stacy, got up and left as Dr. Murray was saying in the audiotape that he was trying chest compressions, he was giving him mouth-to-mouth and all of the resuscitative efforts in those minutes after finding Michael Jackson unresponsive. It was detailed, and it was disturbing.

So Rebe got the attention of a deputy who was at the end of the jury box to her right. She walked up to the deputy, very close to the jurors while the tape was playing. And then she and the other young woman with her proceeded out of the courtroom with the deputy, but they didn`t go through the public gallery. They went into the well of the courtroom, past the prosecutors` table, and through the little entranceway that the lawyers enter the courtroom, and the judge was really upset. He stopped the tape, and he said, "I will not have that kind of disruption."

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Unbelievable.

And now there`s also controversy over whether this tape helped the prosecution or the defense. I`ve heard it both ways. Trent Copeland, noted criminal defense attorney out of Los Angeles, who do you think benefits from this?

TRENT COPELAND, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Look, I think in the end, it`s a little bit of a mixed bag, Jane, but there`s no question that the prosecution benefits the most from this.

Look, there are a lot of contradictions. There`s a lot of inconsistencies on this tape. I counted, Jane, about a half a dozen times when I heard Dr. Murray in this tape use the words safely, cautiously, as it related to the use of this Propofol.

So look, this is -- this is -- this is really the key issue in this case. The fact is that the prosecution is aware that the use of Propofol only in a hospital setting and under certain circumstances can only done if it`s safe and it`s cautious and the doctor is monitoring. And these are the circumstances that didn`t happen here. So I think in his own words, he hurts himself.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: The other side, we`ll be...

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MURRAY: He said, I do have some milk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Milk? And about what time was this?

MURRAY: He said, "Please, please give me some milk today so I can sleep. Because I know that this is all that really works for me."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hot milk or warm?

MURRAY: This is just a medicine. And he is familiar with it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What is the medicine?

MURRAY: It`s called Propofol.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Extraordinary audiotape of Dr. Conrad Murray explaining to cops two days after Michael Jackson died what happened that fateful night.

Now Dr. Murray is at the Ritz Carlton in Marina Del Rey, a hotel I`ve been to, very fancy, with his attorneys. Ed Chernoff, his lead defense attorney, is there sitting right next to him.

So I want to go out to Keith Sullivan, because a lot of people are now saying, "Wait a second. Dr. Murray is explaining himself away in a very sympathetic way. Was he coached?" They know that there`s a tape recorder running. Is this his way of testifying without having to take the stand and be cross-examined, Keith?

KEITH SULLIVAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: That`s it Jane. You got it. If this tape humanizes Conrad Murray, and it gives him the benefit of being heard to the jury, the accused, the condemned, who`s been sitting there for two weeks silent, being piled on, without having to be cross- examined by the prosecution. It`s tremendously beneficial.

It also paints Michael Jackson as another party who needs to share in some of this culpability, bringing about his own death. I think this tape overall really humanizes Dr. Murray and it`s very beneficial. And I think what you`re seeing the prosecution do here, is it`s very common amongst trial attorneys. They are over trying the case. So far what we`ve heard on that tape does not prove that he committed manslaughter on June 25 in that room by overdosing Michael Jackson.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Does anybody on our panel disagree? Holly Hughes, criminal defense attorney, you are also a former prosecutor. Do you think that this is a home run for Dr. Conrad Murray?

HOLLY HUGHES, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: No.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That he gave Michael Jackson Propofol?

HUGHES: No. In fact, he`s shooting himself in the foot. While he is trying to point the finger of blame at other people, he is essentially admitting his ignorance. What he`s saying is "I wasn`t even familiar with this Propofol. Dr. Adams is the one that administered it."

OK then, Dr. Murray, then you had absolutely no business ordering gallons of it, having it shipped to your girlfriend`s house and lying to the pharmacist, saying that was your clinic, and then administering it, since you just admitted you are not familiar with this drug.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right.

HUGHES: I think this is absolutely a home run for the prosecution.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Conrad Murray also told detectives he was surprised that Michael knew so much about Propofol, like he was almost a doctor himself. And he says, well, doctors in Germany gave it to Michael Jackson before. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MURRAY: He said to me that the doctors allowed him to infuse it himself. And I refused him that opportunity. And he asked me why would you -- why didn`t you want me to push it. I love to push it. It makes me feel great!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So there you have Dr. Conrad Murray saying Michael Jackson likes to inject it himself, which is now part and parcel of the defense theory that Michael Jackson self-ingested the Propofol that killed him. Was this all part of the game plan when they went there to the Ritz Carlton to talk to detectives? More analysis and debate coming right up. And voice analysis.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CONRAD MURRAY, ON TRIAL FOR MICHAEL JACKSON`S DEATH: I was a bit surprised of his pharmacological knowledge because that was not an agent that most people pull out from their hat. And he explained to me that he had taken it multiple times. He used it frequently on his tours. It was given to him by multiple other doctors.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Now, Holly Hughes has just said this is a big win for the prosecution. We have Keith Sullivan saying it is a big win for the defense.

Let`s to go out to somebody who analyzes it from a totally different perspective. Susan Constantine is a body language expert and also does voice analysis. So, you`ve heard this tape. You`ve watched Conrad Murray listening to himself in court. What do you make of it?

SUSAN CONSTANTINE, BODY LANGUAGE EXPERT: And I`m really glad that you said that Jane, because just watching body language is not enough. You have to tie in the verbal. So listening to the tapes, I`m putting the two together and what I`m hearing here is that he is trying to convince rather than convey.

He is always speaking in third person pronouns, so he is wanting to shift the blame to someone else. That, number one is a deceptive indicator.

Then what we are watching is for his pausing, his hesitation, his stops and starts. These are also indicators of deceptive behavior. Now you tie in the non-verbal. When I`m watching him in the courtroom, he is looking up, he tends to kind of visually kind of recall some of the events and then he gets into a point of state of mind where he is very saddened, he is remorseful, his face tends to look sunken. So there`s something there that he is feeling a great sense of remorse for what he has done.

Tying it together, he definitely is covering something up. I believe that he is responsible. And he is using clever language and shifting blame, which is one of the 12 verbal deceptors of casting blame on someone else, taking emphasis away from himself.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Mary Ann, Florida, your question or thought vis-a-vis this extraordinary audiotape? Mary Ann.

MARY ANN, FLORIDA (via telephone): Hello?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hi Mary Ann, your question or thought, dear.

MARY ANN: Hi. Oh, Jan, I`m so glad I got through to you. I thought this trial wasn`t supposed to be about, you know, Michael. You know, the use -- Michael with the drugs and everything. It`s a mean (ph) point they`re putting it all on Michael that -- you know, like Nancy was saying today when I was driving home, Nancy Grace was saying, you know, how all of Michael`s fans are like whining, you know? About they`re putting Michael - -

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Mary Ann, I agree with you, I agree with you and I get your point that we shouldn`t blame the victim here. The person on trial is Dr. Conrad Murray.

By the way, let me do a one-on-one with Nancy Grace in a couple of minutes and you`re going to hear her analysis of all the events today.

But the fact is that Conrad Murray continuously, in this audio recording, tries to say that it`s really Michael`s idea, that Michael was the one who knew all about pharmacology, that Michael was the one who knew about Propofol. That Michael was incredibly sophisticated about how you had to have the milk and the anti-burn, which is what he called the Lidocaine that cuts the burning sensation of the Propofol.

Here`s more of Dr. Conrad Murray`s interview with the cops, played for the first time in court today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MURRAY: (INAUDIBLE)

You know, when I`m on this course, when I`m on the tour, I have difficulty sleeping. And what most doctors have done for me, they helped me sleep for 15 to 18 hours, because I need it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Holly Hughes, a lot of people started saying toward the end of the interview -- just people in general, we`re getting texts, we`re getting this -- I`m feeling sorry for Dr. Conrad Murray. As if he is explaining that he is being seduced by Michael Jackson into doing something he doesn`t want to do but he feels like he can help him and maybe wean him off, so therefore, he gets involved in something.

How do you -- what do you say to those people?

HOLLY HUGHES, FORMER PROSECUTOR: This is what the prosecution is going to argue. That is all the more reason, if you have a patient who is desperate to have this drug, who is sophisticated enough to give it to themselves, to administer it to themselves, knowing that`s how your patient feels about it, why would you ever walk out of that room with him having access to it? That, in itself, is careless and negligent.

If you have a drug addict, you`re not going to throw a bunch of rocks of cocaine at him and then leave the room and say rehab yourself. So if he is claiming Michael is so sophisticated with this drug, he should never have allowed his patient access to it. I don`t care how much Michael said he wanted it who`s the adult here in the room, Jane?

Your child may want to eat Snicker`s bars for lunch every day, but you`re the parent, you know this is no good for him. This --

(CROSSTALK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: But here is the problem in your argument. Michael Jackson is an adult. He is not a child.

HUGHES: And you are the paid medical provider. Don`t allow him access.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: He may have said that he was Peter Pan but he is not actually a child.

Trent Copeland, you`re hearing both sides of this argument. Where`s the middle ground here?

TRENT COPELAND, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Look, the jury is going to have to try to find it, Jane, but here is the issue. At some point, the prosecutor is going to have to establish an issue of causation. And really we can talk about whether or not Dr. Conrad Murray knew or should have known how to deal with this drug and his defense is a lot of "yes but". "I gave the Propofol, I provided the Propofol, yes, but, I didn`t give him the fatal dose."

The prosecution, on the other hand, they have to establish a causation issue, they have to establish that even if all these things happen, even if Dr. Conrad Murray lied about his procurement of the Propofol, he used aliases to get the Propofol, someone else started Michael Jackson with the use of the Propofol. The fact of the matter is the causation issue. If the time of death, who delivered that fatal dose?

And look, I think the weight of the evidence thus far is going in terms of Conrad Murray being the person who pushed that needle, being the person who had syringe.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Except that he testified that Michael Jackson liked to push it, liked to push the needle.

Rosemary, Pennsylvania, your question or thought, Rosemary?

ROSEMARY, PENNSYLVANIA (via telephone): My question is that he bought -- he had to get the medicine for Michael Jackson to use it. He couldn`t - - Michael couldn`t order the medicine himself. Right? So, he had to get it. So, either way, he`s guilty by even getting him the medicine.

And when you go under, right, you cannot just wake up. Nobody remembers when they are in -- when they come out of the O.R. and go into the other room --

(CROSSTALK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I got you.

Keith Sullivan. Keith Sullivan, weigh in.

KEITH SULLIVAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Jane, proximate cause is the absolute issue here. The fact that he didn`t keep medical records, irrelevant. The fact that he lied to the hospital staff in the emergency room, irrelevant. The fact that he has an agenda when he goes and speaks to those police officers, irrelevant.

You are right he has an agenda. His agenda on that day was to cover up his medical malpractice. In order to get criminal liability, he is not charged with leaving the medicine in close proximity to the Michael Jackson. That`s not going to be on the verdict sheet. That is medical malpractice. It`s administration of the Propofol in that dose on June 25th that`s it. The prosecution doesn`t have it so far, Jane.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, up next, Nancy Grace is going to give us her analysis of this case, her take on the trial. Of course, she is always going to get to the heart of the matter.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I believe that the prosecution should really go on and stop the trial right now. I think they have already proven the case that Conrad Murray was negligent. I just feel it is being sensationalized now from here on and I think that they are trying to muddy Michael`s name.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRINA SOWELL, INSPIRED BY DEVONDIA ROSEBOROUGH: Hello, my name is Trina Sowell (ph) and my friend Devondia Roseborough (ph) is definitely a breakthrough woman.

Years ago, she found out that she was HIV positive and instead of lying in bed, wallowing in pity, in 2005, she started the Raspberry Rose Foundation. The purpose was to encourage the importance of education and respecting our bodies as women and preventing HIV, unwanted pregnancies and any other STDs.

DEVONDIA ROSEBOROUGH: I encourage you to go and get tested.

SOWELL: And to those young women who had been exposed to the disease, she still encourages them to take this and turn it around into something positive.

It`s good just to have women like Devondia, who can say, "Hey, what I`ve been through, this is what I`ve done. But look at me now and look at where I`m going."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HLN HOST, "NANCY GRACE": Breaking news tonight in the sudden death of music icon Michael Jackson.

Breaking news tonight, we are live here in L.A. where Jackson`s live- in Caribbean doctor, Dr. Conrad Murray, on trial for manslaughter.

Remember, cause of death, acute overdose of Propofol.

Bombshell tonight: Michael Jackson`s voice from beyond the grave.

It`s just disgusting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Nancy, huge developments in court. The testimony and the evidence shows that Dr. Conrad Murray`s fingerprint was on the Propofol bottle found inside the saline bag, the bottle that prosecutors believe killed Michael Jackson. Your thoughts on that piece of evidence?

GRACE: Well, Jane, if I were the prosecutor in this care I would take each piece of physical evidence, as I did when I was prosecuting, and break it down for every single thing it could show the jury.

Now, if you take a look at this particular finger print, you couldn`t have asked for a better fingerprint to be on the deadly Propofol bottle. Why? If Conrad Murray is right-handed, this had -- it was the left index finger -- this shows he picked up the bottle with his left hand, turned it upside down and then did the medical fiddling with it to put it in the saline bag. This puts him in my mind -- it is just like having a fingerprint on a loaded gun.

And if I were the prosecutor in this case, I would act this out for the jury in closing arguments, all interpreted by that one single fingerprint.

And you know what, Jane; I`ve had it up to here with everyone attacking the coroner`s investigator, the CSI, Alyssa Fleak (ph). Yes, she made a mistake and it is putting the state in jeopardy, but what everyone is not remembering is this, it is the autopsy report. If she didn`t take a single picture this would speak for itself. It says the cause of death is acute Propofol intoxication. It also says that Jackson did not self- administer. That lays the blame clearly on Conrad Murray.

Now, is Alyssa Fleak helping anybody? No. She has really caused a huge torpedo to the state, but it is not something they cannot overcome.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And to your point, no Michael Jackson fingerprints were found on the items, the medical items in his immediate vicinity. What does that tell you?

GRACE: Well it tells me he did not self-inject. Now the defense is bringing up another defense that the state is going to have to tackle, but surely they saw it coming. You know, part of putting on a good case for the state is a pre-emptive strike. To anticipate what the defense is going to do and to knock it out of the park before they even get a chance to speak.

The state has the advantage of going first. We know that the defense is going to claim because Alyssa Fleak screwed up, -- there`s really no other way to put it -- she did not seize that orange juice container beside the bed, the defense is going to use that to their advantage. They are going to say Jackson ingested Propofol from the orange juice container.

Now, what the state`s got to do to battle back against that, to strike back is to reinforce the theory of Jackson`s body assimilating the Propofol into his stomach and to show that`s how Propofol got in his stomach, not through the orange juice container. And let me point out, in his stomach, there was no orange juice. So, that`s something the state can use to battle back against the defense theory.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, I have to tell you that a lot of Jackson fans and friends of Michael Jackson, childhood friends, very distraught over things that are being revealed during this trial. The photo of him dead, all the talk of his urine and the condom catheter and they are asking, is it worth it, given that the max that Dr. Conrad Murray can get, four years behind bars, they are wondering, why is this even happening? Is this justice for Michael Jackson? Your thoughts on that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I tell you, Jane, I had to prosecute a lot of murder cases in which the victims were left in horrible, horrible shape. The crime scene photos were shocking. They were upsetting. I would try to get the victim`s family out of the courtroom before they were introduced. They were even upsetting to me and I have seen so many murder scenes and autopsies, I can`t even count them.

Let`s take them one by one. Number one, the photo of Jackson in death -- this is a homicide case. The state must prove there`s a dead body. So the photo was naturally coming in. Nobody said this is a tea party, Jane. It`s a homicide case. The photo has to come in.

Number two: the catheter. You know what; when you look at a man who is drugged to death and left alone to die surround by his own urine, the that fact he was wearing a condom catheter is pretty unimportant. It is an important because it shows the doctor is involved. I`m sure Jackson didn`t catheterize himself.

But none of this matters, all that matters is the jury render a verdict that speaks the truth. These are the facts surrounding the case. Prosecuting murder cases is not pretty. It is not like on TV. It`s dirty, it`s gritty, it`s angry and it`s upsetting. And that is the way they`re always going to be.

The fans need to rally and seek justice for Jackson and not whine about the circumstances surrounding his death.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think you`ve said it. And I hope that the prosecution listens to you and follows your advice, because they sometimes seem like they are getting a little far afield, and in fact, some of the testimony by the toxicologist is so unintelligible that even he can`t pronounce some of the complicated words that they are using --

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Well, wait a minute, little lady, uh-uh. That`s not the prosecution`s fault. That`s not their fault that Jackson had a cocktail of drugs in his body that none of us can pronounce. I typically use the street name for all of those drugs and that`s what the prosecution needs to do. They need to ask the doctor, for instance what`s Lidocaine, what`s Lorazepam, what`s Propofol and get the street names like Adderall, like ephedrine (ph); all that and use those names in front of the jury, not the chemical names which are practically unspeakable.

So they need to bring it down so everybody can understand what was in Jackson`s system, not make it so darn hard.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, we would like to switch gears a little bit. And talk with you and your fabulous dance partner about "Dancing with the Stars".

GRACE: Well --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So I think we`re going to go on a two-shot now.

GRACE: It just so happens this one follows me everywhere I go and behind my head he`s saying, "one, two, three. No, no, no."

(CROSSTALK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Does that include the slap?

GRACE: One, two, three. Yes, there`s always this going on, all the time.

TRISTAN MACMANUS, "DANCING WITH THE STARS": More slap.

GRACE: All the time. Eight, nine hours a day, Jane. Here he is, Tristan MacManus.

MACMANUS: How are you Jane?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: He`s leading in the dance, I guess. Is this bringing out another side of you, Nancy? I think that`s what I`ve heard a lot of people say; is that we`re seeing a side of Nancy Grace that we`ve never seen before, a really sweet feminine side and a sexy side.

GRACE: Jane, I really don`t think of myself in that way. You know, Lady Justice is not really sexy. I think it`s bringing out the more tired, exhausted side.

MACMANUS: It`s more showing off that side and bringing that side out, I think. That side`s always been there. It`s just you haven`t seen it yet, so.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, you look great in those outfits. And your moves are pretty spectacular.

GRACE: Jane, I`ve got to tell you about our dance Monday night. Tell her what it is, Tristan, since I can`t pronounce it.

MACMANUS: On Monday we`re going to be the Paso Doble.

GRACE: Which is what?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Oh, Paso Doble -- my mother was a flamenco dancer. I know all about it. It`s tough.

MACMANUS: There you go.

GRACE: It`s really tough. In the scenario, one of us is a bull and gets stabbed. You describe it. You`re the expert.

MACMANUS: Like I said, it`s flamenco style. It`s the story of the matador and the bullfight. And generally someone plays a matador and someone plays a cape, or a bull. There`s a lot of bull in the room anyway.

GRACE: We`re really rehearsing very hard, Jane. It`s such a far cry from the waltz which was so ethereal and elegant and graceful. And now there`s a lot of stomping going on. I will divulge I am wearing a miniskirt.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Woo. Well, maybe you can also express your opposition to bullfighting in general when you`re in front of the judges.

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Oh, didn`t I tell you? Enough with the animal rights; I`m all about animals. And that`s why I did not want the bull to be stabbed in the end of this.

MACMANUS: That`s why I took the bull from the dance.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I love it. I love it.

MACMANUS: We have done a matador and a cape this time.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I love it.

GRACE: That`s why I end up on the floor dead. I`m the cape.

(CROSSTALK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Thank you.

Now, let me ask you this question. Psychologically, what`s the toughest part? Because we have all been talking about how you handled the immense pressure. Sometimes if I`m standing on an empty dance floor at a party, I feel self-conscious. How are you handling it psychologically?

GRACE: Well, I have to tell you that it`s very, very hard -- the long hours of rehearsal. When, you know, I don`t know what happens. I can see him doing the step perfectly, and then I`m supposed to do it. And it doesn`t work out that way. It`s like there`s a disconnect between my feet and my head.

You know, that one step with the fox trot, I`m still not over that. Side together, side together, flick, run, run, run, run, jump, slide, jumping jacks? I`m still not over the drama and the trauma associated with that step.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think that you have a lot more dance talent than you`re giving yourself credit for, because you look like a natural out there. You look like a natural out there, Nancy --

GRACE: Thank you, Jane.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And you`re fabulous, and your posture and your smile and your dance moves. It`s all spectacular. And we`re all voting for you. We`re rooting for you. We love you both.

And thank you so much for taking the time -- now, get back to rehearsal.

GRACE: And Jane before you go, thank you --

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: -- on Monday and Tuesday. Thank you, Jane.

MACMANUS: Thank you.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We love you, Nancy and Tristan. I love those two. What a pair. And they`ve got tremendous chemistry, don`t they? Nancy Grace can win this thing if we all support her. And we are going to.

Now, on ISSUES, this coming Monday, we`re going to have a recap of all the most extraordinary moments of the trial. And we`re also going to preview what`s going to happen next. This is an extraordinary case. And you`re part of it.

"NANCY GRACE" is next.

END