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War Brewing Between Cops, Baby Lisa`s Family?; Video of Casey`s Depo to be Released

Aired October 18, 2011 - 19:00   ET



JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST (voice-over): Tonight, more shocking twists and turns in the case of a beautiful missing baby girl. Cops now say baby Lisa Irwin`s parents are failing to answer vital questions. This on the heels of her mother`s shocking admission that she was drunk the night her 10-month-old daughter disappeared and may have blacked out. And the parents hire a new hot-shot New York attorney. Is this mother telling the truth? Where is this little baby?

Also, could Lindsay Lohan be headed to the slammer tomorrow? The troubled starlet set to face a tough judge as reports claim she failed to complete her community service. In an exclusive interview, I`ll talk to her dad, Michael Lohan, about Lindsay`s latest legal and personal problems.

Plus, are the wolves closing in on Dr. Conrad Murray? Just as his defense gets ready to start, will a new piece of evidence shoot holes through the defense story that Michael drugged himself?

And we`re taking your calls.

ISSUES starts now.



JOE TACOPINA, ATTORNEY FOR LISA`S PARENTS: Assume for a second she had nothing to do with the disappearance of Lisa. She`s a mother who is in a high state of trauma, trembles every day.

DEBORAH BRADLEY, LISA`S MOTHER: All I could think of is, you know, maybe somebody wanted a baby and she -- I hope that`s what it is.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where is the baby?

TACOPINA: If her recollection sometimes isn`t what it should be with regards to certain times of events, I don`t think we could really be too harsh on that.

NANCY GRACE, HLN HOST: I`m always concerned when someone comes into the home and takes the baby while one of the parents or caregivers are there.

BRADLEY: She`s everything. She`s our little girl. She`s completed our family. Our two other boys are waiting for her. Please, just drop her off anywhere. We don`t care. Just somewhere safe where she can come home, please.

GRACE: I`d like to find out how much of that big, honking box of wine that the mom bought was recovered. Was she out cold?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just keep praying. Just keep praying. Please, please, please, keep praying.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The truth is going to come out. I know it will, eventually. It always does.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, could there be a break in the baby Lisa case? As cops say, tipsters might have spotted the missing 11-month-old. Is there now a war brewing between the cops and baby Lisa`s family? Sure looks that way to me.

We heard baby Lisa`s mother, Deborah Bradley, had not one or two drinks or three or four, but more than five glasses of wine. And she`s also on anti-anxiety meds, we are learning now. She admits that she drank to the point of possibly blacking out and doesn`t remember key events the night her child went missing.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were you drinking that night?



BRADLEY: Enough to be drunk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you were drunk?

BRADLEY: Mm-hmm.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A lot of people are going to say, "Deborah, you were drunk that night. Is there any chance you did anything to hurt your daughter that you`re just not telling us?"

BRADLEY: No, no, no. And if I thought there was the chance, I`d say it. No, no. I don`t think that alcohol changes a person enough to do something like that.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Oh, really? Well, if you don`t remember what happened, I don`t know that you can say that for a fact, no, no, no.

The family`s new high-powered lawyer is trying to take the scrutiny off of Deborah`s binge drinking and changing time line and put it squarely on the local cops. Listen to this.


TACOPINA: People during the investigation, members of law enforcement, obviously, some members, not all, and certainly I`m not going to start identifying which -- which members or which group, but I think, in the questioning of these two people, have been a little insensitive. Do your investigation and start right here. Start right here. It`s absolutely normal for them to start right here. But don`t come to a conclusion before you have evidence and then try and look for the evidence.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK. Joe Tacopina, you`re a great lawyer, but I`ve got this to tell you. Cops say they have not been able to conduct an actual interview with your clients, Lisa`s mom or the missing child`s dad, since October 8. They said, quote, "Clearly, the parents` level of cooperation has not been what it needs to be to find this child. Should they change their minds, our door is always open." So hmm, that puts everything in a different light.

What do you think? Give me a call: 1-877-JVM-SAYS, 1-877-586-7297. I am taking your calls right now.

Straight out to Jim Spellman, who is live in Kansas City right outside baby Lisa`s home. What have you heard, first of all, about this possible baby sighting? How far away? What are the details, Jim?

JIM SPELLMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That`s Manhattan, Kansas, 120 miles to the west of here, right along the main highway. The reports are that two women in their 20s showed up with a baby matching the description. When they started getting attention because of that, they left without eating their food, in a black automobile. They don`t have a license plate number. Police right now are tracking -- running down those leads, Jane.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Deborah`s new lawyer came out firing. He says the claims that baby Lisa`s mom changed her story just are not true.

Listen to this from ABC`s "GMA."


TACOPINA: There`s not a four-hour gap.


TACOPINA: Well, there`s not, because what she said was she put the baby to bed at around 6:30. At one point during one of the 13 hours of interview, she had said she believed she checked on her at 10:30. It`s not an inconsistency. It may be a recollection that`s refreshed at some later point, but it`s certainly not material to whether or not she had anything to do with the disappearance of her baby.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Listen, I`m not saying the mother`s a suspect. The cops are not saying the mother`s a suspect, but give me a break, no inconsistencies? She first said she put little Lisa to baby at 10:30. Now she`s saying it was 6:40. That is a huge difference, Mike Brooks, HLN law enforcement analyst. I mean, a huge difference. Why are they so defensive at this stage?

MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, I don`t know. Who`d you see there, Joe Tacopina and Bill Stanton. The guy that just left there, they go right from there, right from New York on prime time in the morning.

You know, look, they can say what they want to say, but I can tell you, as a former investigator, Jane, that`s a big inconsistency.

And then, also, they`re not making the little -- the step -- the stepchildren, they`re not making them available, the stepbrothers, because apparently, she says that they heard something too. OK, what did they hear? Was it loud? Was it soft? Were the lights on? Were the lights off?

When you have that much of a gap, in you know, that all-important timeline of what really happened, they need -- law enforcement needs to talk to the Irwins again, and they need to talk to the children some more. And you know, he says they`re being insensitive? Well, you know what? Cooperate with police.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I don`t get this. The mother is hysterical, crying. She says, "I`ve got to find" -- look at this precious baby. Look at this gorgeous, beautiful, innocent, helpless child -- emphasis, helpless. OK.

Now we`re hearing that Deborah hasn`t talked to cops since October 8 and basically stopped the questioning on October 8. We`re also hearing that the cops have had trouble now reaching the parents and that the parents would not talk to cops, saying, "No, we`ve got to do a TV interview." OK, check this out. "We`ve got to do a TV interview. We can`t talk to you." Let`s take a look at the mother.


BRADLEY: She`s everything. She`s -- she`s our little girl. She`s completed our family and she`s -- she means everything to my boys, and we - - we need her home. I can`t -- I can`t be without her.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to bring in famous O.J. Simpson prosecutor, Marcia Clark, to talk about this case. And she is here. I`m very delighted to have her on set with me here at the "L.A. Times" building, with the criminal courthouse in the backdrop.

I`ve got to ask you, this mother, OK, she`s crying, hysterically, and she seems very, very distraught. And yet, cops are saying she won`t answer any questions. They cannot question her about the inconsistencies.

MARCIA CLARK, FORMER PROSECUTOR: Well, they did question her. I mean, I`m going to play devil`s advocate just a little bit and balance this picture. She did talk to them, quite a lot.

Now, they started out by being accusatory with her, which is really standard. When a baby disappears, you look to the parents; you look to the closest people. She was the last one alone with the baby.

On the other hand, she admits that she was drinking, that she had a lot to drink, that she passed out, that when her husband came home, she was still asleep at 4 o`clock in the morning. The front window was open. The front door was open. The lights were on. All of this was very strange.

And so when she tells the cops," I last saw the baby at 10:30," I can see where Joe Tacopina, her lawyer, is saying, "Really, it wasn`t so much as an inconsistency as she was confused and upset. She`s being accused of doing something horrible to her child."

And I think what she really did mean. I put the baby down at 6:30, but I checked again at 10:30 and it was all well. But after that point, she passed out. The fact that she`s as honest as she is about drinking as much as she did, no one could have checked that out. She could just as easily have said, "I was asleep."

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, yes. But I don`t know that we found that off the bat. I don`t know that we found that out off the bat. I think you make some good points, but this surveillance video of her buying a box of wine, and I said, I never even knew wine came in boxes until just -- this case has occurred, because that`s a lot of wine. A box of wine! OK? That`s when we started hearing about the wine.

Before that, it wasn`t -- she was doing -- she was talking to the media. She didn`t say, "Hey, I was drunk," immediately. She was -- she was talking about being distraught over her child missing. Then we see that video; then we learn about that.

I have to point out, "People" magazine interviewed Deborah. OK. And there are some very, very shocking quotes. "She has no recollection of whether or not she checked on her daughter or turned off the house lights before she went to bed." When asked if alcohol caused her to black out, she said, "It`s a possibility. I had several glasses of wine. More than five, probably."

So here`s what upset me. When asked if she saw anything wrong with drinking while her infant was in her care. She said, "She was sleeping. I don`t have a problem with me having adult time."

Hello. We`ve got a problem now, because your child is missing and you can`t remember the details of how she went missing or when she went missing because you don`t recall because you were drinking.

I`m not saying you had anything to do with it, but I do feel that alcohol is an issue in this case. And on the other side of the break -- and I`m a recovering alcoholic with 16 years of sobriety. On the other side of this break, we`re going to talk to an expert in addictionology to clarify what issue, if any, which role, if any, alcohol played in this horrific saga.

We also have calls lining up. We`re going to take them right on the other side.

More on baby Lisa missing, the mystery. 1-877-JVM-SAYS. Could it be that two women are on the run with this adorable child? That`s one sighting.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Every half an hour, you go, she had nothing to do with this. And then on the other hand you`re going, well, you know, things aren`t adding up. And so you just -- you want to believe that there`s not a crazy person out there who`s taking babies, but you also want to believe the mom, too.




TACOPINA: These two people standing behind me are two parents who are grieving every day, every minute, every second for the loss of their daughter. Hopefully, she will come back to them. And hopefully, she`ll be healthy, and they`ll be able to move on with their life.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: That was the new hot-shot attorney for the parents of baby Lisa, who went missing October 3.

We are now learning a shocking piece of information. Published reports quoting police sources say that the parents who are so hysterical and say they`ll do anything to find their child have not spoken to police since October 8. And the cops say they`re having a hard time getting in touch with these parents, despite the fact that the parents continue to talk to the media, including "People" magazine.

And the cops have even reportedly said, when they approached them and talked, they said, "No, we can`t talk to you right now. We`re doing a TV interview."

And I want to go to the alcohol factor. Howard Samuels, founder and CEO of the Hills Treatment Center in Los Angeles, listen, this woman says she probably had more than five glasses of wine. She doesn`t recall exactly whether or not she checked on her little daughter at 10:30 at night. She doesn`t remember whether she turned the lights on or off. Now, she says she was possibly in a blackout.

I say this as a recovering alcoholic. She was in a blackout, in my humble opinion. If you cannot recollect key events and you`ve been drinking, that is the equivalent of a blackout, is it not, Howard Samuels?

HOWARD SAMUELS, FOUNDER/CEO, HILLS TREATMENT CENTER: Absolutely, Jane. And what also you have to realize is that she was on anxiety medication. On the bottle of every anxiety medication -- Xanax, Clonopin - - it says, do not drink. So in reality, with her on anxiety medication, five glasses of wine, that means she had ten glasses of wine. That`s the result when you mix these two.

So it is such a crime when she says, "Oh, I was having adult time." How can you have adult time when you`re drinking and on anxiety medication? It is inconceivable. It is so sad that this has happened.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, and I think you make an excellent point. If you take alcohol and you add anti-anxiety meds, it equals double the number of drinks.

SAMUELS: That`s right.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So we`re talking about a huge amount of intoxicants in this woman`s system at the time her child went missing.

All right. We`re going to go to the phone lines. They`re lighting up. Andrea, New York, your question or thought, Andrea?

CALLER: Hi, Jane, thanks for taking my call. Jane, I`ve overheard so much about checking pings on telephones throughout the case. The Anthony trial, even with Dr. Murray, they`re so set on finding out pings and things like that. I haven`t heard anything about any of those three phones being pinged, except for that one phone call at 2:30 in the morning. Can you help me out on that one?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, I think that`s an excellent point. Jim Spellman, CNN reporter live outside the missing child`s home in Kansas City, Missouri. We know that the parents claim that whoever broke in, according to them, anyway, came in, they think, through the window and took the baby and three cell phones.

Whatever happened to the pings on the cell phones? And what about the cops allegedly using some kind of Doppler radar on the mother, like saying, "Hey, we`ve seen these pings"? Tell us about that.

SPELLMAN: Sure, well, we know that the mother has told in media reports that she has said that the police told her that they did ping those cell phones. We haven`t gotten that from the police. We don`t know if that actually happened or if perhaps that was just a ploy in their interrogations. That`s a big question mark, because if the phones were on and the batteries were charged, you could use that GPS technology to find out where those phones have gone.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, I want to go to Janice McConnell. You work at One-Eyed Jack`s Tavern, and what`s interesting is that I`m going to play something for you, Janice, and our viewers, and then I`m going to get your reaction, because we are following this case closely. We have theories. And so it`s no surprise that baby Lisa`s parents have their own theories, and it connects to something that happened in your bar. Listen to this from ABC`s "GMA."


TACOPINA: They have theories. You know, they`ve gone through in their head scenarios and a list of people, quite frankly. You know, I`ve heard recently they are now looking for an individual who`s a homeless person who was in the area and now has disappeared. You know...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That was a person we first heard about right after the incident, correct?

TACOPINA: There was another report I read yesterday.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, OK, so Janice McConnell, the attorney for the parents is focusing in on this homeless person, who was apparently in your bar, spitting on people. But my understanding is that authorities talked to him and decided he is not involved in this case. What do you know, Janice?

JANICE MCCONNELL, ONE-EYED JACK`S TAVERN (via phone): That`s all I really know. I know that they picked him up on Saturday night, and he`s had felony warranties, so he`s in jail for a while now anyway. But they decided that he wasn`t a suspect in the case, and what they basically said was, they just wanted to know, because he`s, in the area, that if he saw anything, and they wanted him for questioning on that. And that`s really all I`ve heard.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Janice, you`re in the area. Now, the attorney for the parents is saying, hey, focus on finding this -- I mean, there -- aren`t there helicopters and cops all over the place, searching desperately? They aren`t -- they don`t have tunnel vision, do they, Janice?

MCCONNELL: No, I mean, they`re everywhere. It makes me laugh when I hear people say that the police aren`t even trying to find the baby, and they need to concentrate on that, because I mean, our -- this whole area, there`s nothing but police and helicopters and FBI agents and private detectives. And even on Sunday, they had the...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Thank you. Excellent reporting from a tavern owner.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey Anthony apparently wore a wig and sunglasses while giving a deposition for a lawsuit against her.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Are her lawyers playing a very dangerous game with their client`s safety?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Deep breathing, nostrils flaring.

CASEY ANTHONY, ACQUITTED OF MURDER: I take complete and full responsibility for my actions.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She did not want to be there, clearly annoyed.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For the most part, Anthony refused to answer questions, pleading the fifth.

ANTHONY: I just want to let everyone know that I`m sorry for what I did. Sorry -- sorry.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Justice for Caylee! Justice for Caylee! Justice for Caylee!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Justice for Caylee! Justice for Caylee! Justice for Caylee!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Justice for Caylee! Justice for Caylee! Justice for Caylee!

ANTHONY: Can someone let me -- come on!


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Can someone let me finish? But then when she has the opportunity to talk, she doesn`t. Is Casey`s bizarre deposition video finally going to be released?

Casey is being sued by Zenaida "Zanny the Nanny" Gonzalez for defamation. She arrived to a depo for the lawsuit -- and it was a Skype deal, I think -- in full disguise on October 8. First, she wore what appeared to be a braided wig, then a Phillies cap and dark glasses.

Now Zenaida`s attorney is trying to release the video, but Casey`s lawyers are fighting back, filing a motion to seal said video.

Straight out to a very special guest, Matt Morgan, the attorney for Zenaida Gonzalez.

Matt, you were there. Why do you think they are fighting tooth and nail to keep the video of your deposition of Casey Anthony under wraps so that America doesn`t see it?

MATT MORGAN, LAWYER FOR ZENAIDA GONZALEZ (via phone): Hey, Jane, how you doing?

You know, that`s the question that we`ve been asking ourselves. We really have no idea, because there`s nothing of much consequence that was said or revealed during the deposition. So -- so we really don`t know why they`re fighting so hard.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, OK, here`s my theory. We know that Barbara Walters had dinner with Jose Baez just a couple of nights ago, and I don`t think it was to celebrate Jose`s birthday or to see a play. I think it was very clearly because the world wants to the hear from Casey Anthony. And whoever gets that first big interview, that is going to be the scoop, the coup of the year, Beth Karas.

And I think one of the reasons they want to keep this under wraps is that, first, she looks silly, and it`s going to devalue her in terms of her credibility. And second, it`s going to devalue her price for her first interview, because we can`t say then, that, oh, this is the first time we`re hearing her voice.

BETH KARAS, TRUTV: Well, you know, that`s actually a very good point. And if people see what she looks like in this video, and Matt can attest to this, because he described how aghast they were, he and his father and colleague, when they saw her, because they thought it was a disguise, as you described.

Maybe she`s got a different color hair, different hair color underneath, and she is actually out and about in the community, and people just don`t realize it.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, Matt, how weird did she look?

MORGAN: Yes, it really took us aback, because we were sitting there waiting for her to come on. And then she came onto the screen and it was just -- we just weren`t expecting a disguise. We weren`t expecting the hat and sunglasses and what appeared to be a wig. We were expecting to see her how we saw her at the trial. And so that was kind of...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Why do you think she was in disguise? Matt, why do you think she was in disguise?


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Why do you think she was in disguise?

MORGAN: You know, I think that she, in all likelihood, has changed her hairstyle or something along those lines, and at this point, you know, is trying to cover up her true appearance. That`s just a thought. I`m not 100 percent aware, but -- but that`s a thought.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Do you think we`re going to see the depo, it`s a yes or no question. Going to see it, yes or no?




VELEZ-MITCHELL: I can`t hear what your answer is.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right now, she`s thinking that she`s indestructible.

MICHAEL LOHAN, LINDSAY LOHAN`S FATHER: Dina and I still can`t seem to get on the same page.

HOWARD: Unequivocally, this is as the result of a dependency on drug use since a very young age. Lindsay Lohan has seemingly violated her probation again. She`s again on a collision course with the legal system.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s very textbook. You know, her behavior, the way she`s starting to look.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our legal system didn`t do its job in this case. Gave her so many breaks that it may have resulted and gone to a place where it shouldn`t be.

HOWARD: You there are looking at a drug addict -- whether it`s prescription or illicit drugs.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Lindsay Lohan -- La Lohan -- back in a legal battle. This as new photos have everybody asking, is the starlet still struggling to stay sober, yet again?

In this chapter of the never-ending Lilo saga, the actress could reportedly face nearly a year and a half behind bars for allegedly, allegedly failing to meet her probation requirements. Now, the word is, the reports are, the claims are that she got booted from her community service center for not showing up nine times or not staying the minimum four hours. She also allegedly didn`t meet with her shrink every week as ordered by the court.

Now, we don`t know. We`ll find out for sure when she goes to court tomorrow. She`s got a date with the judge tomorrow, here, in the City of Angels, to determine if she violated her probation and prosecutors will reportedly ask to have her tossed in the clink.

Meantime, some rather disturbing photos of Lindsay -- there she is right there -- are causing some real concern. Take a look at that. I mean she is a beautiful, beautiful, beautiful young lady, but is she looking her best? Some claim that they see telltale signs of perhaps addiction in Lindsay`s appearance, or perhaps not. Listen, I`ve been on those red carpets and taken some pretty bad photos that I wish would get off the Internet -- not that anybody`s concerned about me -- but anybody who walks down that red carpet, they do take a picture of them and sometimes it`s pretty horrific.

Joining me now, exclusively is Lindsay`s father, Michael Lohan; and Michael we`re going to get to you in a second. But first, to set the stage, your good buddy, you know her well, Jen Hager, legal editor at RadarOnline. Jen, tell us, you`re here in Los Angeles with us, this is going to happen in the Beverly Hills courthouse?

JEN HAGER, LEGAL EDITOR, RADARONLINE: This is going to happen tomorrow morning at the LAX Airport Courthouse.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Oh, at the LAX Airport -- there are so many courthouses here in Los Angeles, that it`s hard to keep track. And I`ve seen them all. In fact, I`ve chased celebrities around them all.

But what is going to happen tomorrow and what are people saying she`s done wrong?

HAGER: Well, tomorrow is a progress report hearing. Judge Stephanie Sautner had previously ordered her to appear. Now, Lindsay got booted from the Downtown Women`s Center, where she was ordered to perform community service. She has a year to perform that community service, so can the judge fine her on a technicality that she got booted out of the program? Judge Sautner specifically wanted Lindsay to do this community service at the Downtown Women`s Center so that she could be around women that had fallen on very hard times.

We know that she`s going to be in court tomorrow with her powerhouse attorney, Shawn Holley, and her long-suffering bail bondsman, in case Judge Sautner decides to revoke her probation and schedule a probation violation hearing.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me ask you a question, do you think she`s going to send her to jail? Yes or no.




Because I`ve talked to people in the know and they say yes. That they`re sick and tired of Lindsay thumbing her nose at the system; and we`ve all seen the "f-u" on the fingernails and the tweeting and the crying, but not doing the actual work.

Michael Lohan, I want to thank you for coming on, I know this is a tough subject for you. First of all, there have been some alarming photos of your daughter recently. There`s one that shows her in a motel room with a multimillionaire hotel owner. And, you know, there are those who say that -- look at the photo, we`re going to show it right now -- and they say that she doesn`t look so good in these photos. There she is. There`s a photo of Lindsay.

And, what do you make of this, Michael? Because we`re all here and talking about this, because, ultimately we`re concerned about her and I, as a recovering alcoholic, know what it`s like to be in my disease. I`m not pointing fingers, but do you think she is sober or not, Michael?

M. LOHAN: Look it, Jane -- hi, Jen.

Jane, you`ve been in this business for long enough, you know the symptoms and the signs of an addict. To see my daughter`s teeth like that and to see this disgusting human being behind my daughter in a position like that, when she`s clearly not in the right frame of mind, and he thinks he can use his power and his drugs to get over on her, is absolutely pathetic and it infuriates me.

I just don`t understand why she surrounds herself with people like this. And why Dina allows this to happen. I mean, she needs to get help. It`s obvious that there`s severe addiction problems, whether it`s illicit drugs, which would indicate her teeth being like that, or prescription drugs. I`ve said all along that this Adderall is killing her.

She never needed any drugs growing up when she was at the top of her career and her best performances. But now she`s on all these drugs that are destroying her life.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I don`t understand it. Because here`s the thing, we all know Lindsay`s no stranger to legal system. She was arrested on suspicion of DUI. She was arrested again on suspicion of DUI after that infamous car chase down PCH. Cops said she had a small amount of cocaine on her. She`s been in and out of probation since 2007, countless rehabs. We all remember about the ankle bracelet and oh, she said somebody spilled a drink on it after that went off, yada, yada.

But here`s the bottom line. That even during her probation, and we have the probation report, the probation department allowed her to take certain drugs, Adderall, Nexium, Zoloft, Trazodone and Dilaudid. Some of these drugs have been compared in strength to heroin and morphine, claiming, well, they were prescribed by a doctor.

Is that still the case? I mean is she subjected to drug tests, Michael, and are there exceptions? Ok. Let`s go to Jen on that. You know the hard facts.

M. LOHAN: Yes, Jen knows. Yes.

HAGER: She is not being drug tested.


HAGER: She is not being drug tested. In fact, Lindsay Lohan`s last progress report hearing, the city attorney asked Judge Sautner to reinstate random drug testing, and judge Sautner refused. You know, look --


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Why? Why the hell would she refuse?

M. LOHAN: Why? Why?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m saying this as a recovering alcoholic. And if you`ve got a slew of drugs that the probation department allows you to take, including Dilaudid, which has been compared in strength to heroin, that`s outrageous. Why aren`t they drug testing her?

HAGER: And you know, we`ve got this other trial going on.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, yes. Let`s keep it on this. Thank you, Jen.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Michael, why are they not testing her for drugs if she`s on probation?

M. LOHAN: That`s a great question. Jane, when I was on parole or probation, I wasn`t on for any drugs, but I was tested for drugs. I don`t understand what this judge is doing. I mean, come on, every single one of the crimes she`s been accused of had something to do with drugs or alcohol. Why isn`t she being tested? Why did they put her on more drugs when she was in rehab instead of taking off everything that she`s on. I don`t understand this.

I mean doctors have such a free hand with writing prescriptions, it`s disgusting. And it`s killing this country and all of our youth. And you know, while I care about other people, this is my daughter.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. I wrote a book about it.


M. LOHAN: Yes, you did, "Addict Nation".

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I wrote a book about it called "Addict Nation".

M. LOHAN: Yes.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: "Addict Nation" and read it, because we are in an addict nation. And you`re right Jen, you were trying to say, right behind us in this courthouse, where we are, is the Michael Jackson death trial. Now we`ve got this case here. It`s all around us. It`s not just celebrities, obviously.

But what`s going on with Lindsay? How can she be on probation and she`s got DUIs and drug use in her past and they`re not testing her for drugs?

HAGER: Here`s another distressing thing that came out of the progress report last anytime, is that Judge Sautner doesn`t believe that Lindsay has an underlying substance or alcohol abuse problem. She thinks that it`s other issues. She doesn`t think she has a drug or alcohol problem.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, you know what, this points out, Michael --

M. LOHAN: They, you know what -- then she should not be on the bench. She should not be on the bench, if that`s the case. She doesn`t know what she`s talking about. Maybe she should take a course in drug addiction and alcoholism. Because it`s clear that this poor girl has a substance abuse problem. And it`s taken her to a level that I`ve never seen before.

And now she`s submitting herself to evil people like this Vikram Chatwal that`s using drugs to get over on her. I mean how do you think I feel as a father seeing these pictures?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I don`t know who that man is -- first of all, hold on a second, I don`t know who this guy is, but he is invited on our show any time. I have no idea, just looking at it, because he has a 5:00 shadow, that he`s on drugs. I have no independent confirmation of that --



M. LOHAN: No, no, Jane, he owns --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I don`t want to get into another (INAUDIBLE) -- we want to focus --

M. LOHAN: No, no.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to focus on Lindsay. I don`t want to focus on this guy. And again, we`re going to reach out to him and he`s invited on our show --

M. LOHAN: I reached out to him. No, but he never called me back.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: But I haven`t, I`m just telling you.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: We got this statement from Lindsay`s rep regarding the pictures of her teeth. Quote, "Lindsay is widely regarded as one of the most beautiful women on the planet and is regularly sought after by some of the top photographers in the world." And they`re saying, "There`s more important issues for the media to focus on."

And you know what; I don`t think there is a more important issue, because we have a drug -- prescription drug epidemic in this country. So many people are prescribed drugs for back pain or any other little pain and these are heavy-duty narcotics. They immediately become hooked on them or quickly become hooked on them and they become addicts. They become addicts.

My own mother, my gosh, she`s 95, she says her toes hurts, she`s now been prescribed things -- she says, I don`t want these drugs that make me stupid. Ok. I`m not saying there`s never a place for them. What I`m saying is that doctors have not enough training in addiction, a lot of times they don`t know what they`re doing, and that goes for judges and it goes for probation officers. They don`t know about addiction.

We`re just getting started. Hang in there. We`ll be right back.


LINDSAY LOHAN, ACTRESS: I know that I was ordered to go once a week, and I wasn`t, you know, I wasn`t missing the class, just to hang out or do anything like that. I was working mostly in Morocco, and I was working with children. It wasn`t a vacation. It wasn`t some sort of a joke.




L. LOHAN: I`m not taking this as a joke. It`s my life. And it`s my career. And it`s something I`ve worked for my entire life.

And you know, I`ve learned from my experiences. I take responsibility for my actions and I`ve tried to do the best I can in the past few weeks since I was here last.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Everybody wondering what`s Lindsay going to wear when she goes to court tomorrow. She`s beautiful, she`s charismatic, and she also has taken to Twitter to defend herself, saying quote, "I am not to be made an example of anymore. I am working hard fulfilling my obligations every single day, to the court, as well as to myself."

But the reports are that she`s only completed 21 hours of the required 360 hours she`s supposed to do at an L.A. women`s center; a place that was chosen by the judge specifically because she wanted Lindsay to experience being around women who had fallen on hard times. And she`s allegedly yet to even begin her 120 hours of volunteering at the L.A. County coroner`s office.

Michael Lohan, you know your daughter. Are you going to be in court? If not, why not? And do you think your daughter is in the slightest bit concerned about what`s going to happen to her tomorrow? Or does she feel that she really knows how to play the system?

M. LOHAN: All good questions. Number one, do I know my daughter? I used to know my daughter. Do I know her now? I don`t understand how she thinks. Am I going to be in the courtroom? Absolutely not. I`ve done everything I can to help her. I`ve gotten her out of jail and into rehab. I got her out of jail and into home arrest. I did that personally to help her.

And at this point, I know what`s going on. And you`re right, there`s a definite problem and the governor here in Florida has taken steps to stop this prescription medication epidemic. She`s got to get off the meds. She`s got to get back to rehab. And it`s just -- it breaks my heart to see her come to this level. It really does. But I just -- my hands are in the air.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let`s take a look at some -- ok, let`s take a closer look at some before and after photos. Here`s what Lindsay looked like a few short years ago and Lindsay now. Check it out again. This is a close- up then, we`re going to show you of her mouth and her teeth, this is somebody who`s apparently very concerned about her appearance and some have said that her teeth appear to be decaying and that she`s not looking her best.

Let me just ask you flat-out, Michael Lohan, do you think Lindsay Lohan is using drugs again? And if so, why do you say that?

M. LOHAN: Do I think so? Yes. I absolutely do. Look at her two front teeth. I mean, you know this, you know this world, Jane. And I know this world. And everyone I`ve spoken to said the same thing -- it`s from inhaling smoke. And we know what kind of smoke we`re talking about.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I don`t understand what you`re saying.

M. LOHAN: Well, whether it`s cocaine, smoking cocaine or whatever the case may be, it`s destroying her teeth. Why do you think the two front teeth are decaying like that? And for a judge not to test a girl that`s been involved in so many cases that involve drugs and alcohol, I just don`t get it, Jane. I don`t.

And you asked before, is Lindsay concerned about this. When I spoke to her two days ago, from 2:53 in the morning until 4:10 in the morning, all she kept asking me was, "Daddy, you have to repair your relationship with Ali and Cody." I said, "Lindsay, you have to worry about you, I`m worried about you." I said, "If mommy would not have put a wedge between with us, you wouldn`t be like you were either, but I can`t worry about that anymore. This is up to your mother. I`m worried about you and I want you to get out."

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So you`re saying you spoke to her when?

M. LOHAN: The day before yesterday.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And so you are actually on speaking terms with Lindsay at this point. Did she sound --

M. LOHAN: Well, I would --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Listen, Lindsay or her attorney, Shawn Chapman Holley, are invited on our show anytime. I don`t know what you`re going to say and you`re saying that you think she`s on drugs. A lot of people are concerned about it. A lot of people are looking at it. We want to give her the opportunity to tell her side of the story with or without her attorney or just her attorney.

But you`re saying you talked to her like in the wee hours of the morning. Did she sound --

M. LOHAN: She called me.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok. How`d she sound?

M. LOHAN: No. She sounded like she was on Adderall. She was -- this Adderall has come to the point in her life where it doesn`t help her focus, she`s scattered all over the place. Her emotions are flying all over the place and she`s not in the right state of mind. To be up at that hour of the morning and to call me -- you know, Jane, that`s another I think.

I just had major surgery on my kidneys and I was prescribed Vicodin. I`m suffering right now with stitches in my belly button and on my sides and I`m not taking drugs, because I know what it can do. And if I did, I`d be a hypocrite.

But this poor kid, she`s got to be surrounded with the right people and listen to the advice that you`re giving her, that Jen`s giving her, that Dr. Drew is giving her, that I`ve given her, and she`s not listening to. Someone`s got to intercede. You can`t have --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. I think you hit the nail on the head when you say these judges do need to be educated about addiction.

M. LOHAN: Yes, ma`am.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We got educated, because we`re addicts. That`s how we got educated. But the normies -- the people who don`t understand the incredible overpowering craving of an addiction, they`re doing a disservice -- I had a psychiatrist say to me once, why can`t you have just a glass of wine with dinner? People don`t understand; sometimes even doctors. There`s ignorance about this issue.



CHIEF THOMAS MANGER, MONTGOMERY COUNTY: Detectives entered Miss McQuain`s residence and found her deceased in her bedroom.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His mother was a kind, actually supportive lady. He was a good kid.

MANGER: Eleven-year-old William McQuain is still missing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just want him to come home safe with no injuries. And if you know where you are, just please let him come home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: September 30th, that was the last time he was seen.

MANGER: Our priority, our focus right now is to locate William McQuain.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: So sad; we were so hopeful last night. And now unfortunately, terrible news about the search for that 11-year-old boy, William; this morning, police in Montgomery County, Maryland, discovered the body of a child in a wooded area and they believe it is that of William. That handsome little boy was last seen two and a half weeks ago with his stepfather, Curtis Lopez.

Police say surveillance video recorded at a self-storage facility shows the two going in and out of a storage unit but exactly what happened to William not yet known. Lopez is already under arrest in connection with the murder of his wife who was William`s mom. This is the suspect right here.

The body of Jane McQuain discovered last Wednesday, October 12, in her Maryland home. Police believe she`s been dead for 10 or 12 days before her body was found. That could mean that Jane and her son died at about the same time.

All right. HLN law enforcement analyst Mike Brooks, so very sad; what do you know about how and where they found this youngster?

MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, they found the little boy in a wooded area in Clarksburg, Maryland, which is just up I-270 from Germantown where the little boy disappeared. And they did have -- they`ve had video for a little while but they did not know where his body was and they`ve been centering their search in that area. They found him this morning.

Now, they believe, Montgomery County Police believe, that the little boy`s body, Jane, has been there since possibly October 1st. Now, the video also at the self storage facility in Clarksburg was taken on the 1st and they identified basically -- the initial identification was made because they could see the clothes that the boy had on in the surveillance matched the clothes to that that was found in the remains there in the wooded area, Jane.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, right after the child`s body was discovered this morning, a very grim, very sad-looking police chief from Montgomery County, Maryland spoke to reporters and here`s exactly what he said. Let`s listen.


MANGER: We believe that William has been here at this location since October 1st. We have camera footage of Curtis Lopez, the suspect in this case, with William at a storage facility. The footage was from the morning of October 1st. The clothing on the body appears similar to what William was wearing on October 1st.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, here`s what I don`t get, Mike Brooks. The child was last at school or was last seen at school September 30th. Why did it take so long for -- a couple of weeks apparently -- for anyone to get to the mother`s home and find her dead? If the child hadn`t shown up at school September 30th, why didn`t they immediately investigate because the child was still alive the next day?

BROOKS: Yes. Jane, that`s a question law enforcement has been asking, too. What took so long for the school board, you know, not law enforcement, to notify anyone that he was missing or any friends of the family to even say, where is this little boy?

Because I`m sure the little boy had playmates, had people in his neighborhood that knew, you know, where he was; who would see him on a regular basis. Right. That`s still something that law enforcement is trying to get to the bottom of.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So terribly tragic. Thanks, Mike.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Famed prosecutor from the O.J. Simpson Case, Marcia Clark, who is the author of a fantastic book, "Guilt by Association". Your thoughts on what`s going to happen as the defense case gets under way in the Michael Jackson death trial?

MARCIA CLARK, AUTHOR, "GUILT BY ASSOCIATION": Well, they`re going to have to put their experts on. I know they`re going to call patients of Dr. Murray to try and show he was a good guy and all that stuff.


CLARK: And that`s great. But the real case is going to hinge on their experts and whether they can say that what he did was not grossly negligent. That`s going to be the bottom line.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. I think it`s interesting because there`s all the reckless behavior which I think we have pretty much established but it all boils down to cause of death. And I don`t know that the prosecution had proved beyond a reasonable doubt that Dr. Conrad Murray killed -- how do you visualize Dr. Conrad Murray killing Michael Jackson? Can you visualize that? If not, we might not get a "guilty" verdict.

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