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Penn State Scandal; Interview With Gloria Allred
Aired November 9, 2011 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DR. DREW, HOST (voice-over): Here we go.
Child sex abuse victims across America are coming forward tonight, revealing what they`ve kept secret till now. Is the Penn State scandal allowing them to finally tell their stories?
And Gloria Allred is here, putting sexual harassers on notice.
Then, the woman who was beaten by her own father joins us. I`ll tell you why people who abuse, harass, and bully must stop.
Let`s get started.
(on camera): Tonight, a child sex abuse scandal rocks the Penn State campus. You want to watch it. Check this out.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tonight, a shocking child sex abuse scandal ripping apart Penn State University.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A former assistant football coach at Penn State, Jerry Sandusky is embroiled in a child sex scandal, charged with 40 counts of sexually abusing children.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He made admissions about inappropriate contact in the shower room, Jerry Sandusky did.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A graduate assistant saw, he says, he claims, Sandusky sexually assaulting a naked boy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joe Paterno was made aware of his former assistant coach, Jerry Sandusky, raping that 10-year-old boy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Paterno told the athletic director but at no time did he call the police.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Curley, the Athletic Director, and University Vice President Gary Schultz. It would appear they tried to sweep it under the rug.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: JoePa is hiding behind the letter of the law instead of the intent of the law. The intent of the law is to protect these children.
PINSKY: Let`s lay it all out for you.
This man, Jerry Sandusky, is a former defensive coordinator for the school`s football team. Tonight, he stands accused of sexually abusing and having been witnessed sexually abusing some of these boys, nine boys in all. Penn State Athletic Director Tim Curley, the Athletic Director, and the school`s Senior Vice President for Business and Finance Gary Schultz have been charged with lying to a Grand Jury. That`s one count.
They went to the Grand Jury and distorted the facts. And they`re being found guilty of failing to notify authorities after a witness reported an assault to them in 2002.
So someone, a man you saw in that tape, an assistant, sort of a graduate student, saw - visually witnessed this, went to his superiors, and they did not report it to the appropriate agencies.
Also under fire is Penn State`s head coach, Joe Paterno. Now, he is of course a Penn State legend and regarded by many, not just at his school but throughout college football, as a hero. He apparently knew that the abuse of the young boys was happening and did not report it to the police.
Now, we`re going to talk about his shocking decision to retire a little later. But first, now remember this. Some people want to make this a sports story. This is not a sports story. This is about children`s lives being destroyed. I talk about this kind of abuse as being the gift that keeps on giving. These victims` lives are changed forever. And in this case they`re changed by a man they worshiped and trusted.
Tonight, mothers of two of the alleged victims are speaking out. One mother says her son told her, quote, "You just can`t say - tell him no," unquote.
Let`s go to my guest now. Troy Craig is with us. He knew Sandusky and was one of the boys he, quote, "helped through his charity, the Second Mile." That is a charity for at-risk youth that he was heading up from when he farmed some of these kids. Former NFL player and advocate for victims of childhood sexual abuse, Heath Evans. Former Penn State player, who played under Coach Joe Paterno, Matt Hahn. And of course I`ve got HLN Anchor Mike Galanos.
Mike, this is a - this is a story that is - it`s intense, painful. I don`t have words to describe it yet. I know it affected you very deeply earlier today. What can you tell us about what is happening right now at Penn State?
MIKE GALANOS, HLN ANCHOR: Well, you know, Drew, I`ve had a chance to talk to almost two different camps. I`ve talked to students. And it is almost 100 percent yes, they wish Joe Paterno would have done more, would have called police, would have called authorities, but they still believe he should be able to coach these last few games and then ride off.
But then there are people who live in state college. A little different feel. A little different vibe from them. They`re thinking he should go now. I talked to one guy who works at the stadium. He said if Joe Paterno takes that field I`m not working that day.
So that`s - that`s the differing things, Drew, that we`re talking about here.
And real quick, when you talk about victims, one story struck me more than any. And I`m talking about victim number 5. Eight-year-old boy, Drew, gets invited to the game by Coach Sandusky, this revered defensive coordinator. And the quote that got me was this 8-year-old says, I was - he was thrilled to attend. Imagine a wide-eyed, innocent 8-year-old boy who gets to go see Penn State, maybe meet a player, stand on the sideline. Little did that 8-year-old know what was coming next.
PINSKY: I don`t want to - I don`t want to know. I don`t want to know what was coming next because I`ve read the Grand Jury`s report. I have the report here. I have it dismantled a little bit. It`s about 30 pages of, oh, to call it tawdry, disgusting behavior wouldn`t begin to sort of give it justice.
One of the victims` moms tells the "Patriot News" her son met Sandusky through the charity, of course that charity we`ve been talking about called the Second Mile. She says her son was, as she described it, quote, "quickly drawn into his world of big-time college football, gifts, trips, sporting events. Hanging out with a guy who seemed to be loved by everyone." That`s what Mike is talking about here.
Now, this kid finally confessed to a school principal. Troy, you spent time with Sandusky also through the charity. And I guess you personally observed some peculiar things. Can you tell us what - what you observed?
TROY CRAIG, KNEW SANDUSKY THROUGH HIS CHARITY: You know, anything I observed was - was firsthand. I never saw Jerry do anything to any other children. In fact, most of my experiences came from being alone with Sandusky. Usually during a long car ride. It was pretty much a given, you got into the car, just like strapping on a seat belt. His right hand went on my left thigh, and then it stayed there.
You know, and I lived about 25, 30 minutes from campus. So if we were going to any kind of an event in state college, you know, it was - for me it was kind of a long car ride to have, you know, a grown man`s hand on my thigh. It never steered into the overtly sexual or anything criminal, but certainly made me uncomfortable.
And I couldn`t have told you why exactly at the time. You know, I didn`t obviously see it as an 11- or 12-year-old as any kind of sexual perversion. It - you know, looking back on it, obviously, as a - as a grown man, that`s not the way that - you don`t touch a 12-year-old boy that way. But at the time -
PINSKY: Troy, let me ask you this. Troy? I want to ask you whether -
PINSKY: -- any other - you know, kids talk. Was there anything that ever was reported to you by the other kids that seemed like hard to understand or looking back raises eyebrows now?
CRAIG: Nothing criminal. I remember - and I think I initiated the conversation. I seem to remember a conversation with an older boy who I knew to be - you know, maybe have been in Jerry`s good graces longer than I had been.
And I think I remember as I - as I got a little older and a little more emboldened I remember asking him, you know, "Does Jerry do that thing with the hand on the leg, you know, does he do that to you?" And I seem to remember him saying, "Yes, yes. That`s Jerry, you know, he`s weird. That`s, you know, he`s always got his hands on you. You know, he`s weird like that." But I don`t think there was -
CRAIG: -- this conception that -
PINSKY: Well, thank God. Thank God you weren`t subjected to anything else.
Now, according to the Grand Jury report, it`s a graduate assistant who`s now coaching at the school who saw former Coach Jerry Sandusky - again, get the kids out of the room here, guys.
This gets - what`s in this Grand Jury report is problematic, and here`s what this young graduate student saw. He saw in the shower Sandusky having anal sex with a 10-year-old, the shower of the team locker room. There`s also allegations of oral sex.
Matt Hahn, you played under Paterno. Why do you think this was ignored by so many Penn State officials?
MATT HAHN, FMR. PENN STATE FOOTBALL PLAYER: You know, I wish I had a great answer for that. I don`t. It`s something that`s very disturbing as a former player because being within the program you never thought that anything like this would happen.
We always would pride ourselves on being a program that did the right thing, carried ourselves with integrity. And I don`t really have a good answer on why this would be coming up and why this wouldn`t be reported to police officers.
PINSKY: Matt, let me - let me ask a little bit - a couple of different questions. One is the behavior in the locker room showers seems cavalier is not a strong enough word. I mean, is it even - do you think it`s conceivable that that was going on in the locker room and that an assistant coach or a graduate student could walk by and witness this? Does that seem like something that could happen?
HAHN: You know, from reading the Grand Jury presentment, it sounded, you know, like it could happen. It happened a day before spring break, when typically all the guys on the team are already home at their - you know, vacationing. And there`s nobody around. And it seems like it probably would have been the perfect time for it to happen because there would have been nobody around.
PINSKY: All right. Then there`s one other point to make here, the perfect time. That just rings through your - you know, it rings in your head like sadly ironic.
Here`s what the authorities at the school did not do. Pennsylvania has a mandatory reporting statute for suspected child abuse. They provide that the staff must - or the person in charge of the school institution has a responsibility and legal obligation to report by phone or writing within 48 hours to Department of Public Welfare of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. I think every state has something like this.
Why do educators not know this? How is it possible that the directors of the Athletics, the - some high-level administrators in the institution thought it wise not to follow a basic statute? I know as a physician we are required to report this stuff immediately or we go to prison. These are - these are criminal acts not to report and protect children.
How is it possible - is it possible they just didn`t know? Do we have educators out there that don`t understand their basic responsibility to protect not just their own students but - but the community in which they live?
If that`s true, I guess it could be true, we`ve got some educating to do around here. That`s not OK that we live in a world like that. And by the way, for all of us, for everyone out there, think about the fact that the authorities are there not to punish but to protect. And the social agencies, again, to intervene on behalf of and to make better.
So by hiding and handling it internally, that`s like a sick family handling stuff inside. Think about that. Do you know how many sick families out there that hide, make things seem perfect on the outside? That`s not the way you do it. And not only is it critical that you report it to the appropriate authorities, you can actually do something. It`s the law.
Now, I`ve got a few thoughts about this that I`m going to give you at the end of the show. And you can of course read my commentaries about it at HLNTV.com.
Coming up, Penn State`s Head Coach Joe Paterno announces he`s going to retire at the end of the season. The people are outraged. Not within Penn State, as Mike was saying, but certainly outside. Is retiring enough? Stay with us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE PATERNO, HEAD FOOTBALL COACH, PENN STATE: Remember, we`re always going to be Penn State, regardless of what happens to certain people. We`re Penn State. I`m proud of you folks. I`m proud of you. I`ve always been proud of you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: All right. Now, listen up.
We are talking about sexual abuse tonight. I`m going to be taking your questions in the next - after the next break. And I`m going to try to connect the dots tonight. Obviously, this is a - this is a topic that gets really upsetting because anyone who`s worked in mental health, this is the stuff we`re contending with all the time in this country. Strangely enough, I have friends in the U.K. They don`t deal with it so much. Kind of rare over there.
It is the thing we see. It`s the source of most of the stuff that causes outpatient referrals, certainly inpatient referrals these days. And I want to connect the dots between the sexual abuse and the physical abuse. They have similar effects on young people`s brain.
And if you remember, I got very upset about Hillary Adams, whose father had beaten her with the belt. I`ve got Hillary in here tonight and she`s going to be up later in the show. We`re going to connect these different experiences and how they profoundly affect young brains and change the trajectory of the development of our - our citizens, people in this world, and the adults that they become.
Now, tonight Penn State head football coach and local legend Joe Paterno - local? I mean, national treasure we call him. But he announced he`ll retire. And the question is, is that enough?
He released a statement saying he will finish out the season and saying, quote, "This is a tragedy. It`s one of the great sorrows of my life." And actually, I believe him when he says that. "With the benefit of hindsight, I wish I had done more."
Heath Evans, I want to ask you your reaction to that. Because I wish I`d done more. He had a legal obligation to do more. And you`ve had experience. You`re a survivor, is that right, Heath?
HEATH EVANS, FMR. NFL PLAYER: No. My wife was.
PINSKY: Your wife (INAUDIBLE) -
EVANS: But legally it doesn`t even - that doesn`t even matter. It`s morally. I mean, what is wrong with our society right now that we don`t see the difference between right and wrong? It is truly a simple matter to go do the right thing when you know this.
And if you back up this case, you know, the late `90s, JoePa knew that at that time Sandusky was being investigated on charges of sexual abuse. So in 2002, when you have a G.A. come to you and say hey, I saw this in the shower. I don`t care if he just said, "Hey, you know, Sandusky was naked with a 10-year-old boy and he was washing his back with a bar of soap."
That should still, hey, alert, alert, alert, there`s a problem here. Let me do the right thing as a man of character and integrity. And he refused to and he buried this.
And so now we don`t even know how many kids have been abused. The numbers are growing and growing. The last number I heard was 20 today have come out now that other people have stepped forward. It`s sickening.
This guy needs to be fired. He doesn`t need to be on the field on Saturday, and it starts with him. NCAA needs to step in and clean house.
PINSKY: Matt Hahn, do you have a reaction to that?
HAHN: Yes, I do. You know, just playing for Joe, I know that he is a man that prides himself on integrity and having - and having, you know, outstanding character. And I agree with Heath. I think that Joe needs to step down, and I think that he needs to step down before the game.
I`ve been searching for reasons why Joe should be able to finish out the season and leave on his own terms. But this is - this is a good enough reason that Joe needs to just kind of -
PINSKY: Well, Matt - so Matt - so both of you guys say step down, and that would certainly be a gesture to kind of - a very powerful gesture, let`s say.
But I have a question for you, Matt. You`ve been a football player on that team. Is there something about the culture at Penn State that made this so secretive? I mean, if you look at the - again, this Grand Jury report, there were reports in 1998, in 2002. And at certain times the police actually were notified and did nothing.
Is there something - is there a collusion, you know, endemic in this community? Is there something going on there?
HAHN: Well, you know what? Happy Valley lives up to its name, Happy Valley. And I know just from being out a couple years, I love Penn State, but I know that from being out a couple years it`s a different world. And I would think that as soon as this happened the police would have been notified right away and it would have been handled from - from that aspect moving forward -
PINSKY: But it wasn`t. But it wasn`t. Twice. Twice they reported it twice and nothing happened.
HAHN: And it - and it should have been. And I agree 100 percent with that. And it pains me that, you know, a place that I love so much did this.
PINSKY: Troy, I think they need (ph) to clean up there -
EVANS: Matt, and Dr. Drew, this is - this the power of Joe Paterno.
PINSKY: -- but he - well, maybe. But Heath, let me ask you something. I`ve got less than a minute left. I want you to tell my viewers what it does to somebody to have been a victim of sexual abuse. Your wife was a victim. How has she suffered? And what do people need to understand about this? Can you do it in 30 seconds?
EVANS: It wrecks your train of thought. I have a beautiful, beautiful wife. She blamed herself. "It was my fault. I allowed this to happen," and yet none of those things are true.
Sexual abuse is cancer of the soul. It`s emotional cancer sets in. It reprograms your train of thought. This beautiful woman you`re seeing on the screen right now wanted to end things a few short years ago because of this style of abuse.
PINSKY: Heath, well done. Thank you for sharing that. Thank you to your wife, and our prayers go out to her.
Stay in treatment. Treatment works. People can get better from this. But it is the gift that keeps on giving. It takes a long time.
Troy, Heath, thank you so much.
Next, your questions and comments about this Penn State sex scandal.
And later, another story that generated outrage, certainly in myself. The woman in this videotape - there she is. Oh, geez, I can`t - I cannot watch this thing again. She`s here. Does she regret sharing this with the world?
Stay with us.
PINSKY: We continue to follow the child sexual abuse scandal at Penn State. Now, many of you, naturally, have strong opinions on this story, so let me get right to the phones.
Ginger in Tennessee, your thoughts.
GINGER, NASHVILLE, TENNESSEE: Hi, Dr. Drew. You know -
PINSKY: Hi, Ginger.
GINGER: -- sadly, we`ve come to the point in our culture where power and prestige have been placed so highly on a pedestal that protecting an institution`s reputation was much more important to them than protecting the innocence lives of young children. And - and the shame felt by these young boys and the torment of the memories that the - they feel now as men, who are now in their 20s, it - it can never be undone.
PINSKY: Ginger, I completely agree with you. As I`ve said repeatedly on this program, abuse is the gift that keeps on giving. It stays with people the rest of their lives. It leaves an imprint on their brain that changes how they regulate emotions, and it`s something that will never be undone, as you say.
But I don`t think this is something new that people in authority protecting themselves, protecting institutions, family protecting themselves. This has been going on for a long time. I think, finally, we are really pulling back the curtain on something that`s become a pandemic. It`s really a common problem now.
Gina on Twitter writes, "I was wondering if there are any particular types of children that are at increased risk of sexual abuse?" Well, what we call at-risk kids. So, exactly the kids that Sandusky was serving in that - I think it`s called The Second Mile, whatever the program was called that he has headed up there.
It`s the kids that are vulnerable. In other words, kids that have been abandoned, kids who have been abused previously, say, physically abused. Those are the ones that become good victims in the future. So, once a victim, they become - somehow, victimizers can sort of smell that victimization potential, and they go after it.
Back to the phones. Devon in Arkansas, go ahead there.
DEVON, LITTLE ROCK, ARKANSAS: Hi, Dr. Drew. I just want to say -
PINSKY: Hi, Devon.
DEVON: -- that I think the grad assistant should have called the police as soon as he saw a crime happening to a child. How could a person witness something like that and not call the police? What could be going through their mind?
PINSKY: Well, he - well, he went to - what he actually did, according to, again, the Grand Jury report, which is he ran home, told his father. He was, you know, what do I do? What - he probably - you know, it`s a young man. He`s probably having trouble processing what he even saw. He wanted to go to a trusted source, go did I - did I really see this? And what do you - how would he - a 22-year-old, whatever he was, know what to do with that?
He went, he told authorities. He reported it repeatedly on up the food chain, met with people in administration, and it was him that was ignored, by the way. That`s where things fell down. It wasn`t him. It was what they did with what he told everybody.
And, by the way, they denied - then they denied it to the Grand Jury, after he reported it.
Richelle on Facebook writes, "Is it true that sex offenders are often known and trusted by the children they victimize?" Sure. Proximity. Absolutely. They can be nearby, they can build trust with those kids, and that`s how they do their thing. It is - it`s disgusting. It is disgusting.
I`ve got time for one more Twitter or something up there? No? OK.
So, next up, I`ve got Gloria Allred. She is here with some of the - now we`ve got tawdry allegations against presidential candidates. This is Herman Cain`s story, but I guess we can look at whether or not they`re true and get some more details about them.
And, later, the woman who blew the whistle on the father who beat her is going to be here with me. She`ll reveal where their relationship stands now, where their relationship is with her mom, who was part of that beating, and she`s can talk about why she went public and how she feels about it.
Stay with us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM ADAMS, TEXAS FAMILY LAW JUDGE: Bend over the bed.
HILLARY ADAMS, VIDEOTAPED FATHER BEATING HER: Stop. Stop.
W. ADAMS: Bend over the bed. I`m going to keep beating on your legs. Bend over the bed. Stand up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY (voice-over): Herman Cain, sure, he`s an aspiring politician, but he`s also a husband and a father. A man caught in a sexual harassment scandal. Are we seeing denial from Cain or fabrication by his accusers? I see both in my practice every day, and I`m helping you understand it.
And later, the girl who taped her father`s horrific abuse speaks out right here. I am talking exclusively to Hillary Adams about her nightmare of abuse. And, explaining exactly why this kind of childhood trauma is so devastating.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY (on-camera): Tonight, the fallout over Republican presidential candidate, Herman Cain`s, accusers. Is he guilty of sexual harassment or is this a political hatchet job as he claims? Will this cripple his candidacy? Take a look at this.
PINSKY (voice-over): GOP presidential hopeful, Herman Cain. His meteoric rise to the top of the polls marred by a barrage of sexual harassment allegations. First, reports he harassed two female employees while CEO of the National Restaurant Association. Then, another accusation and another. Finally, one accuser goes public.
SHARON BIALEK, CAIN ACCUSER: He put his hand on my leg, under my skirt, and reached for my genitals. He also grabbed my head and brought it towards his crotch.
PINSKY: The next day, a second public accusation. Cain vehemently denies inappropriate behavior.
HERMAN CAIN, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have never acted inappropriately with anyone.
PINSKY: While his supporters blame political opposition and racism. Even the alleged victims themselves for what they call baseless charges.
PINSKY (on-camera): Here with me to discuss this is criminal defense attorney, Mark Eiglarsh and criminal defense attorney, Gloria Allred, who is currently representing one of Cain`s accusers, Sharon Bialek. Gloria, why did you decide to come forward now or why did your client decide this, when, apparently, this all happened in 1997?
GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIMS` RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Well, hi, Dr. Drew. By the way, I`m not a criminal defense attorney. I`m a victim`s rights attorney.
PINSKY: Fair enough.
ALLRED: But having said that, Sharon, my client, decided to come forward now because she wanted to empower other women on the issue of sexual harassment, and she understood that there were at least three other allegations of sexual harassment before she came forward, two which allegedly resulted in a civil settlement with the employer.
These were sexual harassment allegations against Mr. Cain. And they - - apparently, those persons were not willing to either give their name or come forward put a face on, put their voice to it, and I respect that, and she respects that, but she felt that it needed to be done. And since she had a similar experience, she wanted to come forward at this time and encourage other women to do so.
PINSKY: Did he violate a relationship with an employee, an HR issue here, or was there some law broken?
ALLRED: Well, I`m not privy to the details of the other women. I am aware of what my client alleges. And my client alleges that she had been employed by a foundation which was created by the National Restaurant Association, that she was terminated, that while she was employed, she met Herman Cain, had a very cordial relationship with him, and in fact, he met her boyfriend as well at an after party for a National Restaurant Association conference.
And so, when she was looking for another job, her boyfriend suggested that she contact Mr. Cain, maybe he could help her to become employed elsewhere, maybe on the state level of the National Restaurant Association. So, with that, she did contact his secretary. He called her back. And, they made plans to meet in Washington, D.C., where she thought they would have coffee.
But, anyway, they ended up having a drink, going to dinner, and she didn`t have a car. So, she was in his car, she alleges. And she alleges that he wanted her to see the National Restaurant Association. The car was parked. And then, she alleges improper sexual advances to her at the time that they were parked in the car.
PINSKY: Now, two days ago Sharon Bialek held a press conference and gave a detailed account of what transpired between she and Herman Cain in 1997.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIALEK: Instead of going into the offices, he suddenly reached over and he put his hand on my leg, under my skirt, and reached for my genitals. He also grabbed my head and brought it toward his crotch.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Mark, a couple things. Do you believe this woman, number one, and number two, what do we make of all this?
MARK EIGLARSH, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, first, I have absolutely no idea if she`s telling the truth. I`d certainly like to know whether Gloria ever had her polygraph. Same question I asked of the alleged baby mama of Justin Bieber, the lawyers who came on. I wanted to know that. That`s the first thing I would do and see whether the person`s telling the truth.
But one thing that we do in the interest of disclosure we have to add. I have no idea if she`s telling the truth, but one side is calling her a gold digger, and to support that, they`re alleging that she declared bankruptcy twice.
And the last time she declared bankruptcy, one of the liabilities included a $14,000 credit card debt, $17,000 for an attorney who handled a paternity suit. These are facts that need to be disclosed for the public to make a decision.
PINSKY: Gloria, do you respond to that?
ALLRED: She could have sold her story for a substantial amount of money instead of and in lieu of holding a news conference. She chose not to do that, even though that would have relieved her of many of the financial debts that she has.
EIGLARSH: Gloria, my shy, timid, reserved friend, may I ask you, are you saying that there`s no way that she will capitalize in the future, whether it be an interview, a movie, or a "Playboy" spread like some are alleging?
ALLRED: Well, I don`t know if you`re going to in the future do a "Playboy" spread or "Playgirl" spread or anything else.
ALLRED: But all I can tell you is --
EIGLARSH: Yes. I am. Thank you.
ALLRED: -- we have not sought nor has anyone offered to pay for anything in terms of an interview or anything else, and we`re not looking for that. That is not what she has any intention of doing at this time.
PINSKY: He responded to her accusations yesterday saying he didn`t even know who she was. Take a look at this tape.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAIN: My first response in my mind and reaction was, I don`t even know who this woman is. I have never acted inappropriately with anyone. Period.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: What is the exact thing she says he did wrong?
ALLRED: Well, if in fact it`s true that they`re in the car, that he puts his hand up her skirt and gropes her legs and then tries to grab her genital area or does grab her genital area, then that is completely inappropriate. And she indicates she said to him, "you know I have a boyfriend. That`s not what I came here for." And that she asked to be taken back to the hotel immediately, which he did.
PINSKY: HLN reached out to Herman Cain`s campaign on this matter today, and they did send a response. Here it is. Quote, "There have been a number of interesting revelations that the public has learned about these women over the past few days. We hope the court of public opinion will take this into consideration as these women continue to try and keep this story alive."
Mark, how crippling do you think these allegations are to Herman Cain`s campaign?
EIGLARSH: Well, we know that whether they`re true or not, he`s plummeting. I mean, this week alone, apparently, he`s down, I think, nine percentage points, where he on the other side is alleging he raised $2 million since the allegations came about. I have no idea whether it`s truthful or not.
If this is true, obviously this is troubling, but the mere mud, the smoke and the mirrors, assuming it`s not true, is enough to significantly hurt his campaign.
PINSKY: Yes. It seems like a big issue. Thank you, Mark. Gloria, thanks for coming here and talking about this. I appreciate it.
And when we come back, remember this tape? This is the one that still makes me livid every time I see it. And the young woman you see being beaten here by her own father is coming on this show. She`s going to be here, and she will tell us what really happened that day, next.
PINSKY: Well, I referenced -- I referenced a tape going out to commercial there, and I guess you didn`t get to see it. We`ve seen enough of it, frankly. It`s an online video that`s created a public outcry. A teen with cerebral palsy -- hang on here, guys. I`ve got the teen herself on the other hand, and I don`t particularly want her exposed to this tape. So, please stop running that tape.
I`m asking you to please stop rolling it. Thank you. OK. Now, I watched it for the first time last week, and it`s tough enough for me to shake these images. The young woman featured in that video is with me now, and we`re going to talk to her. Actually, I want her, if you`re listening to me, if she`s on the other end, it`s Hillary Adams.
Please take out your IFB and look away -- there you are, Hillary. I don`t really want you re-exposed to this video. Is it hard for you to watch? Are you okay watching it?
HILLARY ADAMS, PUT VIDEO OF BEATING BY DAD ONLINE: It is definitely hard for me to watch. Sometimes, I break down crying. So --
PINSKY: OK. So, here`s what I want you to do. I want you to take out this IFB, this thing that`s in your ear. I want you to turn away just for, you know, 30 seconds while we show it to the audience. OK? Okay. Let`s now show this tape to the audience. OK.
PINSKY (voice-over): Hillary Adams was a 16-year-old girl with cerebral palsy, but her suffering apparently did not end there. According to Hillary, beatings at the hands of her father, a Texas family law judge, were so frequent that she sensed when the next one was coming.
In 2004, Hillary set up a camera on her bedroom dresser and recorded this disturbing beating by her father and mother. I want to warn you, this is graphic.
JUDGE WILLIAM ADAMS, ARANSAS COUNTY, TEXAS: Bend over the bed.
HILLARY ADAMS: No. Stop.
WILLIAM ADAMS: Bend over the bed.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Get on your (EXPLETIVE DELETED) stomach.
WILLIAM ADAMS: Get on your stomach.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Get on your stomach.
PINSKY: Two weeks ago, Hillary posted the seven-year-old video online, leaving viewers like myself outraged, and wondering why her father has not been removed from the bench.
PINSKY: All right. Now, Hillary, who you`ve just been introduced to, is 23 years old. She is with me. You`ve got your earpiece back in, Hillary? Are you with me? Oh, we`ve got to get her to get that earpiece in. You got it? So, I can talk to you. You hear me?
This is my -- this is my own -- this is what I get for having you take your earpiece out. Can you hear me, Hillary? There you are. OK. Listen.
HILLARY ADAMS: Talk, talk.
PINSKY: OK. Now, I`m talking directly to you now. Now, here`s -- I`m even more upset, Hillary, now looking at this tape, I must tell you, because you seem like such a lovely, lovely young woman that -- yes. I know this is really tough for you to look at and talk about. I mean, those of us that haven`t been physically abused, it`s hard enough too.
Let me ask you this. Let`s go down this path. There are people out there in the world that defend that kind of discipline of children.
HILLARY ADAMS: Yes.
PINSKY: What would your message be to them?
HILLARY ADAMS: To me? Well, I`m sorry. Could you repeat the question? I think you cut out a little bit at the beginning.
PINSKY: OK. My question is that you and I know how traumatic this kind of an experience is and how damaging it could be. I deal -- and I suspect you`ve probably had some treatment because you seem just great and it takes a while to kind of dig your way out of this kind of an experience, and you seem great, and that`s wonderful.
But what would your message be for people out there who defend this kind of what they call discipline of children?
HILLARY ADAMS: Oh, man. For people who call this discipline, I think they should probably re-examine their methods. And, I think, probably, they don`t really know what a normal environment is if they think that that`s an acceptable way of punishment. And unfortunately, I was one of those people.
I thought that was a normal situation. And, as of now, with this public outcry and outrage I`ve learned that it`s not. And now, I`ve made that my goal to make sure as many other people as possible know that that`s not normal, either.
PINSKY: Now, your mother was involved in this episode that we see on the videotape. It seems like you`ve sort of healed that relationship a little bit. How were you able to do so?
HILLARY ADAMS: My mother and I, we were always best friends. She was the one that sat with me, practiced thousands of hours on the piano. She helped me with school. She helped me with all kinds of things. We spent so much time together. And unfortunately, I think something that a lot of people are having trouble grasping is that abuse changes the dynamics of a family in very strange, terrible ways.
And my mother, she was bearing even more emotional abuse than I was. And all she really wanted to do was please my father because he was such a controlling man. He was influencing her to discipline me how he saw fit. So, I don`t blame her at all, because she just wanted to hit me once and get it over with so he would stop.
But unfortunately, it didn`t work. She feels so bad. And, I just -- I completely forgive her. And right now, we`re trying to work through this the best we can together.
PINSKY: Well, and your dad seems un -- you know, sort of unrepentant about this. He was asked about his role in the beating. Look -- have you seen this footage of him sort of being defensive? I`m going to play this. And again, I don`t want you to be re-traumatized by all this. I`m also going to ask you permission to play the tape.
When you look at the camera now, do you see video? So, if we play a video, you don`t have to watch it kind of thing.
HILLARY ADAMS: I`m not seeing any video.
PINSKY: OK. Good. OK. So, we can play both, then. Let`s first talk -- let`s see the video of her dad first.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM ADAMS: In my mind, I haven`t done anything wrong other than discipline my child after she was caught stealing, and I did lose my temper, but I`ve since apologized. It looks worse than it is. There is a story. It`ll come out in due time. OK?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: All right. Now, your father said there`s a story that will come out in due time. The only story that I can imagine that could justify his behavior, Hillary, I`m sorry, is that you were trying to kill somebody at that moment. That`s the only thing that would justify that behavior. What does he mean by this? What does he mean?
HILLARY ADAMS: Well, he -- the original reason that the video happened, the reason that that scene happened in the room is because I was using an old file-sharing program to obtain media that I couldn`t have purchased if I wanted to really. And since he didn`t understand that, he was afraid I would be prosecuted and he would have a criminal for a daughter. And he just couldn`t have that reflecting onto him. So, he went overboard --
PINSKY: Hillary, I`m certain that was not the first time that he had punished you like that. I`m certain of that. I`m certain of that.
HILLARY ADAMS: Yes.
PINSKY: And so, for him to even come up with any kind of defense for that behavior sends me into outer space already. And again, now to know you a little bit, it makes me even angrier. Now, we actually reached out to the attorney representing Hillary`s father for a comment, and he made a statement.
You need to listen to this, because it implicates you. "Just prior to the YouTube upload, a concerned father shared with his 23-year-old daughter that he was unwilling to continue to be her primary source of financial support. Hillary warned her father if he reduced her financial support, he would live to regret it. The post was then uploaded."
Hillary, personally I`m disgusted by that. It`s implying that you were threatening him if he cut off any financial support with you that you were extorting him with that video. How do you respond?
HILLARY ADAMS: Well, that section that you picked out of the statement is very easy to retort. In fact, he was not my primary source of financial support. I have no idea why he would say that, because I can provide you with pay stubs that show I work to support myself. My boyfriend --
PINSKY: Hillary --
HILLARY ADAMS: My boyfriend also works.
PINSKY: Hillary, I`ve got to stop you. Of course, you`re not. He`s victimizing you again. And I`m the agent of that victimization. This is - - I`m sorry. I`m sorry --
PINSKY: Say that again.
HILLARY ADAMS: I think I`m pulling through, OK? Oh. I think my father really doesn`t know how to not victimize people. He only knows how to remain in control. And I think that really came through in the statement that he wrote, because I`ve never said he would live to regret it.
PINSKY: Does he belong on the bench? What do you think?
HILLARY ADAMS: I think -- I honestly think he needs to take some time off. I mean, I don`t want to wish anybody to lose their job. And in this case, the more he remains silent and not apologetic, the more I`m swayed to think he should be removed. I used to not think so, but my mind is slowly changing.
PINSKY: OK. Hillary, stay with me. We`re going to keep with you. We`re going to talk more about this after the break. We`ll talk a little bit about Hillary`s mother and what she had to say about her role in these beatings. Hear about that when we come back.
PINSKY: A 16-year-old girl is, let`s face it, savagely beaten by her parents with a leather belt, and it is all captured on videotape. That girl`s name is Hillary Adams, and she is here with me today. And I just want to remind the people that Hillary -- I don`t want to re-expose her to this. This is traumatizing.
When you`ve been traumatized, when you get re-exposed to stuff, it can evoke in ways that are unhealthy. So, I`ve asked her not to listen to some of this, and she doesn`t get to see what you`re seeing at home, which is what she posted online, this brutal beating.
Now, I want to share a clip from the "Today" show. It features Hillary`s mom, Hallie Adams. She is also seen with her daughter in this videotape actually beating her, but watch this interview.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hallie, let me turn to you, because you`re in this tape.
HALLIE ADAMS, HILLARY`S MOTHER: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And we heard you in the tape, turn over, take it like a 16-year-old girl. I mean, --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s chilling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How does a mother not only stand by and watch her husband do that to her daughter but take part in it?
HALLIE ADAMS: That`s a good question, and that`s what I had to ask myself. I didn`t know about the video until this -- well, until this past April. And this past week was the first time I saw it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: We reached out to Hillary`s mom for a comment. She did not wish to respond. Now, Hillary, you said that you`re good with your mom now. You and I can agree it`s not OK what she did in that video, right?
HILLARY ADAMS: No, it`s not OK, and she knows that, too. She definitely knows. She`s been hurt unimaginably -- unimaginably by this. And she`s -- I admit she`s been put in a very difficult position because of this. But if I had cut the video to remove her from it, it just would have looked suspicious. So, I didn`t know what to do.
PINSKY: Well, Hillary, I mean, it`s what happened. Now, I guess I`m going to ask you a tougher question. You may not actually even be able to answer. Was your mom a victim of domestic violence herself at the hands of your father? Because that`s usually how this works.
HILLARY ADAMS: Yes. Unfortunately, I can`t really answer if she was a victim of physical violence, but as for emotional abuse and all that, definitely. She had more than I ever have. She bear the brunt of it.
PINSKY: OK. That`s what I figured. And we`ve got less than a minute here. But I`m sure your wish is for your family to be brought back together and for everyone to heal. Do you have any last thoughts along those lines, your hopes for the future?
HILLARY ADAMS: Well, I really -- I really just want my father to admit that maybe what he did was wrong. And I really -- I need all of us to take advantage of counseling and try to be a family as much as we can. But marriage may never be repaired, but at least, perhaps, our relationships can be.
And I also hope that other people out there will be able to use this video as a control to figure out if their own situation is normal or not, because it`s not always easy to tell if that`s all you`ve --
PINSKY: Hillary, that is two -- that is three sigma. That`s way outside of normal, my dear. This is not OK, not even close to OK. So, let`s look at it as way outlying behavior. So, if anything comes close to that, you know you need help. But people can heal and people can get help.
And I do want to send that message out, that if you get help, things can get better. And Hillary, I commend you just for standing, coming forward with this. It will help other people. And I hope you`ll be back when I speak to you again in the future.
HILLARY ADAMS: Thank you so much.
PINSKY: OK. Now, listen, a few words before we go about sexual abuse and physical abuse. I`ve always talked about prescription pill abuse, but here`s the deal. The thing that incites severe addiction is abuse.
I`ve got 10 seconds left. Is that really all I`ve got left? So, I`m just going to have to say goodbye, and I`ll pick this up tomorrow and try to connect the dots on how abuse affects our children. See you then.