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PIERS MORGAN TONIGHT
Interview With Whoopi Goldberg
Aired December 25, 2011 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PIERS MORGAN, HOST: There's absolutely no point in telling Whoopi Goldberg to bite her tongue. She's given a piece of her mind to presidents, politicians, and even her "View" co-stars. And tonight I've got that sinking feeling she's going to have a few choice words for me.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WHOOPI GOLDBERG, CO-HOST, "THE VIEW": You're not suckering me that way, Piers. I was not born yesterday, fool.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: She's an Oscar winner, comedienne, talk show host, Broadway producer.
Is there anything this woman can't do?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOLDBERG: i don't generally talk about the trapeze in my room, but that's a whole another thing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: Tonight, one-on-one with Whoopi Goldberg.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: You really can't wait, aren't you?
GOLDBERG: Yes. I thought you knew this.
MORGAN: I don't know how weird you are.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: This is PIERS MORGAN TONIGHT.
MORGAN: How are you?
GOLDBERG: I'm good. I'm fascinated by my own image. MORGAN: What is it -- is your wall of shame we have here or hall of fame, whatever you want to call it.
GOLDBERG: Yes. I think it's fame. I'm never ashamed.
MORGAN: You've never been ashamed about anything you've ever done?
GOLDBERG: No. I don't think I've ever done anything shameful.
MORGAN: But that in itself is shameful.
MORGAN: Isn't it?
GOLDBERG: I don't think so.
MORGAN: Shouldn't you done some things in your life which are utterly shameful?
GOLDBERG: You mean publicly or privately?
MORGAN: I don't -- well, let's go private. Stuff we don't know about.
GOLDBERG: Well, I'm sure something would have been shameful, or ways that I did things.
MORGAN: Feel free to share.
GOLDBERG: Well, no, just, you know, I don't generally talk about the trapeze in my room but that's a whole other thing.
MORGAN: What about the public things we know about you. Any of those look back, do you have regrets? I've never thought of you as somebody who over regrets things in life.
GOLDBERG: No. I only really have one really major regret. And it was I had the opportunity to spend a birthday with Sammy Davis Jr. And I didn't. If I had --
GOLDBERG: Well, because I was young and dumb. And he passed like a couple weeks later, and it devastated me because I thought, you know what? That's what you get.
MORGAN: My grandmother said to me the worst thing about getting old, by old she meant anywhere after 40 --
MORGAN: Is you start to just lose a lot of people that mean things to you. And she was so right. You know, whether it's family, whether it's people that you worked with, whatever it is, the death count goes up.
GOLDBERG: Well, you know, probably when she said that, that was correct. But if you are 40 -- are you about that age?
MORGAN: Don't flatter me, Whoopi.
GOLDBERG: May I ask?
MORGAN: I just turned 46, but I'll take the first guess.
GOLDBERG: OK. 40 -- 46.
MORGAN: But you can cut out my correction.
GOLDBERG: People my age, I'm 55. You know, we came through a period where we suddenly saw lots of young people dying at huge, you know, amounts because we come from the time of AIDS. And for us, I think for people in that age range, our age range, that changed all of that because before they were able to sort of extend people's lives with quality, and people were going like this, dancers, singers, children. I mean, it was extraordinary. But now, you know, death seems to have been sort of pushed back a little bit. And people are no longer sort of falling out the way they were.
MORGAN: People are living a very long time now.
GOLDBERG: Very long time.
MORGAN: Particularly with HIV.
MORGAN: And they seem to have got it under some form of control now.
GOLDBERG: Yes. It doesn't mean that one should explore dumb behavior like, you know, sex without a condom. But, you know, we're not under the same time threat as we were in the beginning stages of AIDS in the '80s.
MORGAN: Do you ever fear death yourself?
GOLDBERG: Well, I think I must, you know. I didn't get on a plane so soon.
MORGAN: You are afraid of flying, aren't you?
GOLDBERG: Well, I don't like it. I just feel like, you know, I understand the premise of the bumblebee and as -- you know, but I don't feel like a bumblebee. I feel like I shouldn't be flying. I should be rolling in my bus.
MORGAN: Was there something that sparked it?
GOLDBERG: Yes. There was a mid-air collision years -- almost 30 years ago when I was living in San Diego, which, you know, if you've ever been in San Diego, you know, if you stand on a balcony, anywhere in the city, you can see everything. And we happened to be on the balcony.
MORGAN: You saw it?
GOLDBERG: Yes, we saw it. We saw it happen. My little one was very little at the time, so she doesn't have a memory of it. And it was -- still hard. Just hard. Just hard.
MORGAN: Why is it so hard?
GOLDBERG: Well, because what they discovered later on is that the people on the plane were aware that they were in some danger, but I think the person who was in the smaller plane had had a heart attack. So the bigger plane, really there was no way to really figure out where to go.
And I just feel for folks in a situation like that. Who see something that they're not sure they're going to be able to live through. And so I just -- that's what stayed in my mind because I'm a visualist. So if I see it, it lives in my brain. So I always see it. So I get on a plane. And, you know, things have changed, I must say, in the 30 years.
MORGAN: How many planes have you actually caught in that period since then?
GOLDBERG: Since? Well, it's hard to say. Now I'm flying like a nun, you know, because --
MORGAN: You had a course, didn't you?
GOLDBERG: I had a course from the folks at virgin. And they do a course where if you're really afraid of flying, they can really help you through it. And they did. And also, it helps that, you know, when I'm going to Europe, I'm using my boss's plane to get there because he knows I'm, you know --
MORGAN: But for a long time you were getting on a bus to L.A.
MORGAN: Like a 50 hours journey.
GOLDBERG: Well, not 50 hours -- you have to travel with me, honey.
MORGAN: I was told it was 50 hours.
GOLDBERG: 23 hours.
MORGAN: That quick.
GOLDBERG: Yes, it's very fast.
You know, I could get on a train, but you know, it's harder to take the bus to, say, London.
MORGAN: It's tricky.
GOLDBERG: Well, if you go on the QE2, you could put it down the big thing down at the bottom but, you know. I find that, you know, I'm able to fly better. It has been a little dicey recently because, you know, people have fallen asleep --
MORGAN: Yes, I know. You see, when you hear those things.
GOLDBERG: In towers.
MORGAN: If you --
MORGAN: My mother's the same as you.
MORGAN: She has a complete phobia of flying.
MORGAN: She can't do it. And I would imagine the worst thing is whenever these incidents happen --
MORGAN: To me, I can brush them off. I catch a plane like a bus.
MORGAN: I never think about being in the air. But for you when you see an air traffic controller asleep, it must just go --
GOLDBERG: Well, the thing that I use to sort of get myself through it is that "A," we haven't heard anything in the last three months like this. So this has to be kind of an isolated incident or we would have heard about it. So I have to, you know
GOLDBERG: Yes. So, you know, inherent in that thing that's new, some people are meant to fly. You know, some people are meant to fly. And I don't know if I was meant to fly, but I do it now. I'm getting ready to go to Vienna to open "Sister Act" and then to Germany, then back to London. And, you know, it's like I have to chuckle under my breath and go, OK, OK. Thank God the drugs are there.
MORGAN: Are you a phobic generally? Do you have other things that you're worried about?
GOLDBERG: No. No. I'm just, you know, like I don't like certain food.
MORGAN: What foods?
GOLDBERG: Well, I don't like anything that has a weird consistency. I don't like anything that could be hiding something.
MORGAN: Like what? Come on.
GOLDBERG: Like cream corn.
MORGAN: Cream corn?
GOLDBERG: I don't understand the point. Yes.
MORGAN: You're allergic to cream corn?
GOLDBERG: No, I'm not allergic. I'm not allergic to anything but milk.
MORGAN: You're allergic to milk?
MORGAN: You can't drink milk and you can't eat cream corn?
GOLDBERG: No, no. I can eat cream corn, I choose not to because I want to know what's in there.
MORGAN: Cream and corn.
GOLDBERG: That's what you say.
MORGAN: It is what it is.
GOLDBERG: How do you know that?
MORGAN: Because that's what it's called. Cream corn.
GOLDBERG: But it doesn't mean anything.
MORGAN: Why do you hate a cream corn?
GOLDBERG: I'm not and I want to be clear, I love corn. I love people who grow corn. I love people who can corn. But I -- you know what it is? It's so -- it's like sauce. I don't understand sauce because you could hide stuff in sauce. Like I like my food naked. If it's the wrong color, you know, I don't like green stuff.
MORGAN: What, spinach?
GOLDBERG: Please, no.
GOLDBERG: I hate spinach.
MORGAN: You hate spinach?
GOLDBERG: Again, I appreciate the people who grow it and people --
MORGAN: So you don't eat any creams, anything green. What are we left with?
GOLDBERG: Well --
MORGAN: What do you eat?
GOLDBERG: What do I eat? I love potato chips. Those make me happy.
MORGAN: You just live off fries?
GOLDBERG: No, no, no, I mean potato chips from the bag.
MORGAN: Oh, OK.
GOLDBERG: Yes, crisps.
MORGAN: You call them crisps.
GOLDBERG: But it takes too long to say crisps. You know, this is like, crisp.
MORGAN: Can you eat meat?
GOLDBERG: I do eat some meat.
MORGAN: You're really quite weird, aren't you?
GOLDBERG: Yes. I thought you knew this.
MORGAN: I didn't know how weird you were. You told me you were a bit odd, but this is crazy.
GOLDBERG: Yes, I know this is very crazy.
MORGAN: The interview has gone completely off track.
GOLDBERG: I know. Isn't it great?
MORGAN: Cream corn is going to kill you.
GOLDBERG: No, no, don't get me in trouble.
MORGAN: Don't worry.
GOLDBERG: Cream corn is not going to kill me.
MORGAN: I'd like to take a quick break so we can both reflect on what has just happened here.
MORGAN: And when we come back, I want to talk to you about your love life.
GOLDBERG: My who? All right. If you can find it, we can talk about it.
MORGAN: Now, Whoopi --
MORGAN: I want to turn from cream corn to your relationship history.
GOLDBERG: All right.
MORGAN: You've had three marriages.
MORGAN: First one lasted six years.
MORGAN: Second one lasted two years.
MORGAN: And the last one lasted a year. So I think I know why you haven't gotten remarried. You wouldn't have enough time to actually get divorced.
GOLDBERG: No. Oh, I see.
MORGAN: They're lasting shorter periods.
GOLDBERG: Well, I suppose that, you know, you have to actually be in love with the person that you marry. You have to really be committed to them. And I just -- I don't have that commitment. I'm committed to my family. You know. And so for that relationship has lasted, you know, the longest.
MORGAN: Do you think you were in love with all your husbands?
MORGAN: Any of them?
GOLDBERG: No, I don't think so.
MORGAN: It's an amazing thing to say, isn't it?
GOLDBERG: But it's the truth.
MORGAN: It's sort of amazing.
GOLDBERG: Oh, well all right.
MORGAN: You won't -- you have church weddings?
GOLDBERG: No. Let me see. I think there's a Vegas. And maybe one was a church. And one was a house wedding.
MORGAN: Why did you do it if you weren't in love with them?
GOLDBERG: Because I wanted to feel normal. And it seemed to me that if I was married, I'd have a much more normal life. But clearly, that's not the case. That's not a good reason to get married. You have to actually want a life with someone. Through ups and downs. And I just discovered that wasn't for me.
MORGAN: How my times have you been in love?
MORGAN: Who with?
GOLDBERG: A man.
MORGAN: Go on.
GOLDBERG: I've gone as far as I'm going.
MORGAN: Can I chuck a name in?
GOLDBERG: You could chuck a name.
GOLDBERG: You're asking me if I was in love with Ted? Is that the man I'm talking about?
GOLDBERG: Mm-hmm. MORGAN: Would we know who the person is?
GOLDBERG: No. And that's the beauty of it.
MORGAN: Wow, that's amazing.
GOLDBERG: Yes, I know.
MORGAN: This is bombshell time.
GOLDBERG: Well, it's not a real bombshell but I snuck a couple in on you all and nobody knew.
MORGAN: You did. Do you -- the one person you probably loved is someone we don't know about.
GOLDBERG: Yes. And that's OK.
MORGAN: Is this a recent thing?
GOLDBERG: No, no, no. It's a long time ago.
MORGAN: You wish you'd married that person?
GOLDBERG: Because what I know now is I don't want to live with -- I don't want to live with anyone.
MORGAN: I mean you --
GOLDBERG: I was --
MORGAN: You tried it with the wrong guys.
GOLDBERG: No, no. I think I've tried it with probably the right guys for other people. But it's not -- it wasn't them. It was me. Because I actually like living on my own. I like being able to go up and down my stairs farting like a queen and not having to explain.
I like being able to smoke all over my house and not have someone go -- you know, I like my privacy. I like it.
MORGAN: Didn't you like being in love?
GOLDBERG: I don't know if I did. Because it's -- the hardest thing. If you -- if you already have a family, being in love with someone is very difficult. Because you want them to know that you also love them, and you want your family to know that you love them, and it's a very difficult choice to have to make.
You know, it's a difficult choice to have to make. And once you realize that it's one or the other, you say, oh, OK.
MORGAN: Do you think that guy knows he's the only man you've ever loved?
GOLDBERG: Yes, yes.
MORGAN: You still talk to him?
GOLDBERG: Yes, we talk all the time. He's got two great kids and a great wife.
MORGAN: So he's married and --
GOLDBERG: Oh, yes. Oh, yes.
MORGAN: I feel quite sad for you.
MORGAN: I don't know. I just feel like --
GOLDBERG: You know, people say that all the time. People always say, you know, I'm going to fix you up with someone. I go, no, no.
MORGAN: Don't be mad, I just feel sad that this guy that you loved ended up with somebody else and it didn't work out for you.
GOLDBERG: Well, but, you know, lots of other things did so I didn't do too badly. Not too badly at all.
MORGAN: Are you -- are you on the dating scene?
GOLDBERG: No. Please, honey, oh, my god. Could you imagine?
MORGAN: Not really.
GOLDBERG: Me sitting -- hey, in the bar? No, no. I'm -- I never was much of a dater. I'm not a real go-out kind of person. Though in the last couple of months, I've -- lots of my friends are on stage now so I'm getting to go see lots of shows. But I was never a real dater. I either meet somebody and then we hang out and whatever happens happens. But I'm really a singular person.
MORGAN: Do you get lonely?
GOLDBERG: I don't think so. I keep trying to.
GOLDBERG: You know, I keep trying to go -- boy, I really want someone in my life. But I don't. You know, because the greatest thing is that there are people in my life that I love and adore. Some of them are married. Some of them are not. But I don't have to -- I don't have to do any more than love them. I don't have to do any more than that.
And I actually like that. Because I love some of these folks that I know. I mean, with all my heart. But, boy, do I want them coming to live with me? Hell no. Hell no.
MORGAN: What's been good about you? One of the many good things about you, but your big campaign on behalf of gay marriage, I think, won you a lot of support from a lot of people in America. Contentious things to do. Are you disappointed that President Obama, who I know you're a massive fan of and supported, hasn't really done that much for gay marriage?
GOLDBERG: Well, you know, I'm not surprised by it because, you know, very few presidents can go on and make the change they want to make. And he was very clear that he was conflicted about it. And once he made his decision, he talked to everybody, said, look, I'm going to go for it.
And I -- you know, the guy's got cojones. I have to say. You know? He said, we're going to the generals and we're going to do this. We're going to pass the law getting rid of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell." We're doing it. Because it's hurtful to our citizens.
Now what does he feel in his heart? He has no problem with gay folks. He has a problem with gay marriage. I suggest he never marry a gay person. Then he'll always know that his heart is good. But he's looking out for gay people in the way that he can. And in this country, it's huge that anything got done. At all. At all.
MORGAN: Do you think we're getting there perhaps?
GOLDBERG: Well, listen, we didn't tip over the edge, in spite of the fact that, you know, everybody is saying, oh, he hasn't done anything. You know, we didn't go over the edge. He pulled us back. And has he spent a lot of money? Probably. But there was a lot of money spent before.
I'm sick of it. I'm sick of, you know, endless taxes by telephone companies and, you know, people telling me that I can't have a hamburger from McDonald's because I should know that it's going to make me obese. No. No, no, no. Get off my back. Get off my -- you want me to stop smoking cigarettes? Stop selling them. Right?
GOLDBERG: I mean, because they're making money from the taxes. They don't mind that. But we're concerned about your health. Cigarettes cost in some states $13. A pack. See? And until they stop selling them, I'm going to -- I'm going to smoke.
MORGAN: Good for you.
GOLDBERG: Yes, I think so.
MORGAN: You should do whatever you want to do.
GOLDBERG: Well, not whatever I want to do. Because I would not smoke without saying to you, does this bother you? If it does, I won't do it. Because I'm very -- I'm aware that other people may not feel the same way. But I do think that I was raised well. You were raised well by intelligent people for the most part, both of us, and that we know how to say to someone, would this bother you if I did that?
MORGAN: Going to take a little break now you're nicely fired up.
GOLDBERG: I'm not fired up.
MORGAN: And when we come back, I want to know what you really think of the ladies of "The View."
GOLDBERG: If anything was going to put me back in my shell, you just did.
MORGAN: "Newsweek" magazine recently said you're the most popular host of "The View" and that you're even more liked than your friend Oprah. What do you say to that?
GOLDBERG: I don't know, I don't know. You know? I don't know.
MORGAN: No denial, I noticed.
GOLDBERG: Well, I -- you know, I mean, I'm thankful, I'm grateful, but I don't know really what it means. I don't know what it means.
MORGAN: Do you actually -- are you friends with the other co-stars of "The View"?
MORGAN: Or are they co-workers that you have to get on with?
GOLDBERG: No, no, no. You know I don't have the patience for it. I don't have the patience just to sort of seem --
MORGAN: Often you looked like you haven't got the patience when you're out there with them?
GOLDBERG: Not with them. Sometimes when we're talking about -- there are things I really don't care about and I'm supposed to. You know I have to try a little harder. But there are just things I'm never going to understand the fascination.
MORGAN: Like what? GOLDBERG: Like "Dancing With the Stars," you know? Or Charlie Sheen's thing. Or, you know, any of it.
MORGAN: Don't you find Charlie Sheen's thing fascinating?
GOLDBERG: No. Maybe I'm too egocentric. I think I'm much --
MORGAN: Old torpedo winning duh thing?
GOLDBERG: No. No. I mean, thank -- God bless him if he's winning.
MORGAN: You had a problem with drugs, didn't you?
MORGAN: When you see him, do you feel sorry for him? What do you think? Whatever you want to do?
GOLDBERG: No, you know what, these are such personal issues. They are such personal choices. That if he can do it and do, you know, ten years of working and not being called out -- because he's always been on time and he knows his lines and he does what he's supposed to -- well, who am I, you know? Who am I?
I know how it is to, you know, know what you're doing when you're, you know, sort of a little off.
MORGAN: Isn't it true that when you won your Oscar, you were actually high as a kite?
MORGAN: Oh, please tell me the truth.
GOLDBERG: Well, no. I mean, it could be. I could have smoked a joint. I don't know.
MORGAN: You can't remember if you smoked a joint before you won an Oscar?
GOLDBERG: How long ago do you think that was? That was in 1990. I probably did smoke a joint. But, you know, again, to explain what you did -- you know, 1990 was how long -- I'm straight as arrow now and I can't even tell you how long ago that was.
But, you know, what you did 10 years or 15 years or 20 years -- you grow up. Would I smoke a joint now before I went to work? No.
MORGAN: Have you ever?
GOLDBERG: No, God no.
GOLDBERG: Yes. Number one, you can smell it on people, OK. So why put myself in that position?
MORGAN: You've become really quite squeaky clean, haven't you?
GOLDBERG: I still smoke cigarettes. So I'm not that squeaky clean. And I don't have a boyfriend.
MORGAN: I want to play you a little clip of some of the men you've gone after on "The View."
GOLDBERG: That I've gone after?
MORGAN: You've gone after, yes. I think you'll enjoy this.
GOLDBERG: OK. All right.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GLENN BECK, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: You're accusing me of lying. Let me tell you --
GOLDBERG: What do you mean I'm accusing you? You're a lying sack of dog mess.
GOLDBERG: You lie. So I think that's the biggest pile of dog mess I've heard in ages.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLDBERG: I do like the word. I love the word dog mess.
MORGAN: -- Called me dog mess for half an hour.
GOLDBERG: Well, they won't let me say the real word, you know.
MORGAN: What do you want to say?
GOLDBERG: I say that's (EXPLETIVE DELETED). But you can't say (EXPLETIVE DELETED) on network television.
GOLDBERG: Yes. At 11:00 in the morning, no, apparently not. You cannot say bull (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
MORGAN: Is that ridiculous?
GOLDBERG: Yes, I do.
MORGAN: I think it's kind of absurd, those fake morality plays -- GOLDBERG: Well, we have to adhere to them.
MORGAN: Tell me about what "The View" does for you. You obviously have this stunning career in many different fields. And you've ended up as this kind of voice of America in the morning.
GOLDBERG: Did you say ended up? Is this it? Am I done?
MORGAN: I didn't mean in a bad way.
GOLDBERG: Oh, all right.
MORGAN: I meant -- by the way, voice of America is a very important role. And it's a role that you seem incredibly perfectly capable of filling. But did you ever think you'd be this? Did you ever think you'd be on TV every day giving opinion?
GOLDBERG: No, no, no, I never did. You know, this is the -- I still do one woman show, one person shows, where I talk about all kinds of different issues. But no, I don't think of myself as the voice of America. But I do think that sometimes I see things from a different perspective.
Sometimes because of my race, sometimes because of my gender, sometimes because of experiences. But -- and so I don't -- I'm in a safe place where I can say, no, here's what I know, here's my experience with something like this. And it -- and it feels OK.
MORGAN: When you hear Donald Trump go after Barack Obama for where he was born, what do you think about it?
GOLDBERG: It makes me really, really angry. It makes me angry because the facts are there. And you're refusing -- you're pissing in the face of facts. Facts are facts. You know, there are a whole line of people whose job it is to make sure that the president of the United States is an American citizen.
So, if all of those people are in on some conspiracy to get some black terrorists in the White House, it's like, really? Really? Really? And, you know, he's on his thing about it, and it just makes me sad because it means facts don't mean anything.
MORGAN: Do you think a lot of people will believe it anyway?
GOLDBERG: Yes, they do. Yes, they do.
MORGAN: Is that the danger of that kind of politics?
GOLDBERG: Well, you know, it's not just the politics, you know. You know this. As a journalist, you know, 20 years ago, you had to back up what you said. You had to back up. You had to have facts. You can just write something and just leave it.
Now because we have blogosphobic -- blogosphere...
MORGAN: Blogospeople. GOLDBERG: Yes, blogospeople, you know. And we have the Internet which goes around and around and around, you know, in infinity, people can throw out anything as fact, and they don't have to check it. No one has to check. No one has to prove anything. And this, to me, is a terrible disservice to the American people and -- and to the Internet.
MORGAN: How do you think you would have fared as a young celebrity when you first hit the big-time if the Internet had been around?
GOLDBERG: Oh, my gosh. No. No. No, no, no, I don't think I would have fared as well. But, you know, it took everybody a little while to get used to me. It took everybody a little while to get used to how I looked and, you know, and how I was because I wasn't like femi girl, you know. And I wasn't considered, you know, beautiful. So, people had to get over the hair. So, you know, anything I was doing back then would have been compounded by "and look at her, look at her."
MORGAN: I've always thought you were pretty sexy.
GOLDBERG: Thank you, Piers. You are -- you are in a minority, honey.
MORGAN: I don't think I am.
GOLDBERG: Well, oh, yes?
MORGAN: I think you'd be surprised.
GOLDBERG: Oh, I don't think I would be.
MORGAN: No, you would be. You clearly would be because you're surprised.
GOLDBERG: And because you're a younger man, that's why.
MORGAN: We'll take another little break. When we come back, I want to talk to you about your defense of many celebrities who fall by the wayside a bit. It's interesting.
GOLDBERG: It is.
MORGAN: One of the more surprising things about you, Whoopi, is that you're quite happy to slap a politician around for bad behavior. But when it comes to celebrities, you see...
GOLDBERG: Who have I slapped around?
MORGAN: Well, you know, if a politician is behaving in your view wrongly or if a right-wing cable host, someone like a Bill O'Reilly or Glenn Beck, whack, whack, whack. But if it is somebody like -- well, let's play a clip. You'll get a little idea of what I'm talking about.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: See that picture? Well, that picture, it looks like - it certainly looks like a racist to me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He said he was joking.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He looks like an idiot. He looks like an idiot.
GOLDBERG: I know Mel and I know he's not a racist. Drunks say stupid stuff to people all the time, all the time, because they're drunk. They are out of control. They're not thinking. They are idiotic. That's why I don't like alcohol. I can't say anything about that because I know what people are like when they're drunk. This rant, I don't think he's drunk on this rant.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: You also defended Michael Phelps for smoking pot.
GOLDBERG: Wait, no, I didn't -- I said he had the right to smoke pot. He had the right to smoke pot.
MORGAN: You're not defending him?
GOLDBERG: No. That's just saying if you're going to condemn somebody for smoking weed, it seems kind of crazy if they're in their home and someone's taking a picture of them.
MORGAN: Even if he's a multi-Olympic champion...
MORGAN: ...who makes a lot of money from endorsements on being clean?
GOLDBERG: Is that what he was making money from endorsing? No.
MORGAN: That's what people buy into.
GOLDBERG: I don't know, but that's -- but that's a whole other thing. That means, Piers, that should you go out and have a -- I don't know if you drink, but if you have a drunk night and you say something off color to somebody, that means that you're saying that the people who hired you for this show hired you because they thought that you were never going to take a drink.
MORGAN: No, it's not the same.
GOLDBERG: Why not?
MORGAN: Because Michael Phelps is an Olympian athlete. His endorsements are specifically based on the wholesome, healthy, vibrant Olympic athlete image he probably gets.
GOLDBERG: I don't know. I don't know.
MORGAN: Yes, you do. GOLDBERG: No, I don't.
MORGAN: You know that.
GOLDBERG: No, I don't know that's true.
MORGAN: Do you also believe that people -- and I've met Mel Gibson a few times, and I kind of share your view about him. But as a rule of thumb with this kind of thing, do you think that people, when they're drunk, always say different things to what they really think? Or do you think that the drink loosens tongues, perhaps?
GOLDBERG: I think that drunks say whatever comes into their head. I don't think their -- drunks are not smart enough to think. If they were smart enough to think, they probably wouldn't say as half as the stuff that they're saying and get their behinds kicked. The thing about drunks is they just -- they don't know any better.
MORGAN: Do you ever get drunk?
MORGAN: Properly, you know, seeing stars.
GOLDBERG: Yes, oh, yes, I did once. That's why I don't drink anymore.
GOLDBERG: Yes, once.
MORGAN: You've been drunk once in your life?
GOLDBERG: Once in my life, and I was in public.
MORGAN: Where was it?
GOLDBERG: In New Orleans.
MORGAN: Go on, tell me more.
GOLDBERG: No, I've told you everything you asked me.
MORGAN: No, I want to hear all about it.
GOLDBERG: I know you do, but I don't want to tell them.
MORGAN: How drunk were you?
GOLDBERG: Very drunk. And, you know, if you -- my belief is when you're at home, you're entitled to do whatever you want. You're in the privacy of your home. Now, homes are no longer private because if you have a party, people have cameras, so snap. You're at home, it doesn't mean anything.
MORGAN: (INAUDIBLE) GOLDBERG: I'm saying Michael Phelps, if he was at home and he wanted to smoke a bong, he should have had the right to smoke the bong.
MORGAN: You don't think he has any responsibility as a role model?
GOLDBERG: He's not smoking weed out in the street. At home, no, I don't.
GOLDBERG: Yes, man. Yes. Because those ties are too hard for anybody to live up to. People say you are a role model for these kids, and you shouldn't be doing this, and you shouldn't be saying that you did this. But the truth of the matter is, I should not be your kid's role model. You should be your kid's role model. But you don't want to be your kid's role model because even you can't live up to it. So back off me.
MORGAN: So, no famous people should ever consider themselves to be role models?
GOLDBERG: People -- famous people should consider themselves whatever they want to consider themselves. But know that the consequence of saying I am a role model is x, y, z. I'm saying that no one should be held to your idea of what their life should be because your dream of what they should be doing, that's not -- that's not right. It's not fair. And it says that you can't have bad periods. Not periods, but bad swing. You know what I mean.
MORGAN: If you're a celebrity, and a few friends of yours have done this, if they sell their wedding for $1 million, are they entitled to privacy?
GOLDBERG: I don't know. If you sell it to a magazine, I wouldn't think so. I don't know.
MORGAN: It can't be.
GOLDBERG: I don't know. You know, I've never done that. So, I can't really speak to it. But you can't be surprised.
MORGAN: But you didn't seem to do that.
GOLDBERG: But my attitude is you can't be surprised that, you know, people are following you around. If you call them and tell them where you are, you cannot bitch that they are there.
MORGAN: I agree. We've actually reached a point in agreement. What did you want to say?
GOLDBERG: Well, I wanted to say for those of you out there who disagree with me in terms of being a role model, save your e-mails. I know you don't agree. It's OK. Save the e-mails. I get it. I get it. But I have a different opinion. That's what I wanted to say.
MORGAN: You're entitled to your opinion. GOLDBERG: Thank you.
MORGAN: When we come back, I want to talk to you about your work on Broadway.
GOLDBERG: Thank you, Piers.
MORGAN: So your contract with "The View" is coming up for renewal.
MORGAN: Are you going to be there for two more years?
GOLDBERG: Yes, as far as I know. I mean, unless I really step in it.
MORGAN: Would you like to extend it further? Do you love it so much you want to carry on, or is there a natural shelf life to this thing?
GOLDBERG: I don't know. I'll know in a year or two. I mean, I can't really tell. You know, I don't know. I don't know. I'm having a good time so far.
MORGAN: What do you like doing most? If you could do one thing with the rest of your life?
GOLDBERG: I'd like to sit on my porch with my cigarettes, my potato chips and my water, a great couple of thousand books and my cat.
MORGAN: For the next 20 years you'd do that?
GOLDBERG: I could do that.
MORGAN: No, you couldn't.
GOLDBERG: I could.
MORGAN: I don't believe you.
GOLDBERG: I know. That's all right.
MORGAN: I just don't believe you could do that.
GOLDBERG: I know. And you think I need a boyfriend, too.
MORGAN: No, I don't think you need a boyfriend. I don't think you need a boyfriend. I regret of the fact that the one guy you loved got away. That's different.
GOLDBERG: Right. But, you know, I didn't say whether I pushed him away.
MORGAN: Did you?
GOLDBERG: I'm not telling you.
MORGAN: Why not?
GOLDBERG: You should have asked me.
MORGAN: You just raised it.
GOLDBERG: Too late.
MORGAN: You can't take a camel to the oasis and say you can't have a drink.
GOLDBERG: Watch. A camel to -- OK, can we just talk about that, a camel to the oasis?
MORGAN: You can't take a camel to an oasis and then you say, you can't have a drink. You've led me to this -- to that story.
GOLDBERG: I clearly had enough water to get there.
MORGAN: You clearly wouldn't have raised the specter of you driving him away if you hadn't though, so.
GOLDBERG: Or maybe, Piers, I'm just that good. Maybe you'll never know. You'll never know.
MORGAN: What's on the horizon for you?
GOLDBERG: Oh, you know, I've got musicals opening. I have "Sister Act" which is opening.
MORGAN: Yes, yes. On Broadway.
GOLDBERG: Which is really wonderful. On Broadway. On the 20th of April. And we just opened another piece I call "White Noise" in Chicago, another musical again.
MORGAN: That's about white supremacists?
GOLDBERG: Yes. White sup -- well, it's -- to me, it's less about white supremacists than the choices we make when we chip away at integrity. The things that you say I would never do that, and then you make a little -- a little change. And then suddenly you made a little bit of inroads into doing something you didn't think you wanted to do but it's OK because you justified it. Then another little tweak happens.
And so it's about when fame and fortune are being dangled. Do you give up your core beliefs? Whether the people agree with them or not? Do you give them up? And then we have two sets of singing, two singing groups that have to deal with this dilemma. And so it's very interesting. And edgy. And we use all the words that have been buried and burned and, you know.
MORGAN: Is America more racist or less racist than, say, 20 years ago from your experience?
GOLDBERG: Well, I don't know. You know, I thought it was slightly less racist, but now I'm not positive anymore. I'm not positive.
GOLDBERG: Because it just feels like questions to me. You know, I have to put in my head. When you question this president, the first president we've ever had of color and you're not sure where he was born and it continues, is that about -- what is that about, really?
MORGAN: In Donald Trump's defense, I know him quite well, I don't think he's a racist at all.
GOLDBERG: No, I don't say that --
MORGAN: I don't think he means it in a racist context.
GOLDBERG: But why didn't he ask that about George Bush? Or Bill Clinton?
MORGAN: I suspect it's about votes, because his poll ratings, the more he hammers this point -- it's probably an anti-Obama vote catching mechanism.
GOLDBERG: Why not say he's a -- a crappy president.
MORGAN: I like the fact that you don't like to be seen as a successful African-American. You would rather be seen an American.
GOLDBERG: Yes, you know, too many people died for that for me to have to hyphenate my race. I'm just an American. I'm entitled to everything an American is entitled to.
And if that gives people pause, both black and white -- people are not sure where I'm coming from. I'm coming from a place where my mother worked her behind off -- she worked her behind off to educate me, to make me know that this was my country. Good or bad, this is my country.
MORGAN: Your next movie is called "A Little Bit of Heaven." When we come back after the short break, I'm going to ask you what your idea of heaven is.
MORGAN: Now, Whoopi, your new movie is called "A Little Bit of Heaven." What's your idea of "A Little Bit of Heaven?"
GOLDBERG: Being here with you, Piers. This is my little bit of heaven, damn it. Sunny days with my family.
MORGAN: Ever thought what heaven might be like when you get up there?
GOLDBERG: I just assume it's going to be good times with the family, people that you didn't get to meet because they were gone.
MORGAN: Do you believe in an after life?
GOLDBERG: Yeah. I like the idea of it.
MORGAN: Do you pray a lot?
MORGAN: You either do or you don't.
GOLDBERG: Well, no, I mean, it depends -- how do you describe praying?
MORGAN: I suppose --
GOLDBERG: Going to church and stuff?
MORGAN: Not necessarily going to church, but talking to an entity that is not physically there and asking for help. Talking through issues. Do you do that kind of thing?
GOLDBERG: No, no.
MORGAN: What's your idea of prayer?
GOLDBERG: I could use some backup. I guess that's it.
MORGAN: Do you go to any church?
GOLDBERG: No, no. I don't like being inside, you see.
MORGAN: At all?
GOLDBERG: Very rarely. If it's nice weather, then I don't want ever to see the inside of a house. I just want to be in the sun, soaking up the rays.
MORGAN: In "Sister Act," obviously you play a Catholic. I am a Catholic.
GOLDBERG: I recognized you.
MORGAN: Exactly. What I want to know is I want you to imagine you're a Catholic for a moment and confess to me your greatest sins.
GOLDBERG: Are you mad? You're not suckering me that way, Piers. I was not born yesterday, fool. That is not going to happen.
MORGAN: Got to give a dog a bone.
GOLDBERG: I know. That was sweet, though.
MORGAN: Give me a little juicy bone.
GOLDBERG: A little juicy bone.
MORGAN: If you were in the confessional now, what would you --
GOLDBERG: I would say, have you seen "Sister Act" yet? Listen, father, come on over. Yes, I'll give you two tickets. Bring some of the sisters with you, tell me what you think.
MORGAN: Let me put it more positively.
MORGAN: If you had five minutes to relive the greatest moment of your life -- it could be anything -- what would it be? Can't be the birth of your daughter. We've already established it won't be any of your marriages.
GOLDBERG: Right. And it can't be the birth of my kid?
GOLDBERG: Or my grand kids?
GOLDBERG: OK. In that case, I don't know the answer to that because I don't know if I've already had it yet, the greatest moment of my life. I don't know. If you come find -- my God, there are hundreds of times I've been the happiest. There's no one time.
But again, I don't know. So if you come see me just half an hour before I die, I could probably answer that.
MORGAN: How about winning an Oscar?
GOLDBERG: That was very, very nice. That was a lot of fun because I wanted to win. You know, I really wanted to win.
And I wanted an Oscar since I was a little kid. And Sidney Poitier was happy I won. You know what I mean?
GOLDBERG: So it was kind of a -- man, listen, he is, and will always be one of those people on screen who you just want to emulate. You want to be that good. You know? You want to be "that" good.
Same for me with Bette Davis and Judy Holliday. You want to be that good.
Oh, did I mention also that I'm doing a documentary? I'm sorry. It made me think about it. Do you know who Moms Mabley was?
MORGAN: I don't.
GOLDBERG: No. She's an American comic, '30s, '40s, '50s, '60s, into the '70s. Black lady who don't like this, Piers. Who would say, oh, Piers, you know you're so hot. You're so hot, but you just going to cuss, but too old for mama.
You know, that's how she sounded. And I'm doing a documentary about her, and we're going to do a play that I did many, many years ago onstage about her work. You know. And her comedy. She's extraordinary. And I think you would actually -- I think you would really appreciate her.
MORGAN: I look forward to seeing it.
GOLDBERG: Yes, Moms Mabley. Well, you should get some -- I know there are people out there amongst to all these things, but someone should turn Piers on to Moms, please.
MORGAN: Do you live them -- I will get this sorted.
MORGAN: And I look forward to seeing "Sister Act". When does it open?
GOLDBERG: April 20th.
MORGAN: Best of luck.
GOLDBERG: Thank you.
MORGAN: It's been a real pressure.
GOLDBERG: Thank you. For me as well.
MORGAN: Thank you, Whoopi.