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Retrial for Roger Clemens; Fallout from GSA Scandal; Mitt Romney's Religion Comes up Again; Tornado Death Toll Rises; Norway Shooter Admits Killings, Maintains Innocence

Aired April 16, 2012 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: And hello, everyone. I'm Kyra Phillips. It's 11:00 o'clock on the East Coast, 8:00 o'clock out west.

We have a busy hour ahead. Let's get straight to the news.

He's a baseball legend. Seven time Cy Young Award winner and 11- time All-Star, but, right now, Roger Clemens is also a criminal defendant, standing trial in federal court for allegedly lying to Congress when he denied taking steroids and human growth hormone. Jury selection underway this hour.

The legal analyst for "Sports Illustrated" joins me live to talk about the challenge for the feds and the cotton swabs in a beer can.

Wasteful spending to the tune of 800,000 taxpayer dollars on a Vegas junket by the GSA two years ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (singing): Tell you about global project management.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: The scandal is now in the cross hairs of a Congressional hearing today. Video spoofs even bragged about the lavish spending and poked fun at President Obama.

The scandal already has claimed GSA administrator, Martha Johnson, who stepped down two weeks ago. Republican chair of the House Oversight Committee, Darrell Issa, says one goal of the hearing is to, quote, "make sure this doesn't happen again."

The death toll from this weekend's massive tornadoes is rising. At least six people have died. All of the known fatalities right now in Woodward, Oklahoma.

The Woodward storm was just part of a massive system that spun off dozens of tornadoes across ten states in the Midwest and Plains. The National Weather Service received more than 130 reports of tornadoes.

And a major insurgent attack on Kabul and three other areas in Eastern Afghanistan is over, but gunfire and RPG explosions rocked the capital until early this morning.

Afghan officials say a total of 35 insurgents were killed in the 18-hour battle. Four civilians, eight members of the afghan security forces also dead. The Taliban claimed responsibility.

Afghan president, Hamid Karzai, condemns the attacks and blames an intelligence failure on Afghan and NATO forces.

The Norway mass murder suspect admits to the killings, but claims it was self-defense. Anders Behring Breivik is accused of killing 77 people in a bomb and gun rampage last summer.

At his trial today, he fought back tears as his video manifesto was shown. Breivik pled not guilty. If convicted, his punishment will be based on the determination of his sanity.

In Syria, a ceasefire appears to be on the verge of collapse. Opposition groups say at least 19 people have been killed in government attacks in Homs and other cities across the country.

Both sides blame the other for ceasefire violations and members of a U.N. observer team are expected to begin monitoring that ceasefire today.

We haven't heard the last of those secret service agents who supposedly hired prostitutes in Colombia. President Obama is promising a thorough and rigorous investigation and Congress may call hearings into the purported misdeeds of 11 Secret Service agents and officers and 5 U.S. troops working with them.

They supposedly brought the prostitutes to this hotel in the lead-up to the Summit of the Americas which the president attended.

President Obama's re-election campaign announces it's raised $53 million in March. That's up about 8 million bucks from the month before.

The campaign made the announcement in a web video, emphasizing how they picked up nearly 200,000 first-time donors. The campaign has raised well over $300 million since officially forming last April.

AT&T says it's having trouble finding enough skilled workers, so it's investing $350 million in its future workforce. The program is called "Aspire." It provides grants to schools, nonprofit organizations and researchers. The goal is to increase the country's high school graduation rate.

Runners facing punishing heat at today's Boston marathon. Temps there expected to hit 87. It's about 30 degrees higher than normal.

The slowest wave of runners just started the 26.2 mile course and runners were asked to sit it out if they weren't feeling up to the challenge. About 27,000 people are expected to run.

Today could wind up being the hottest in the race's 116-year history. Well, Pippa, good friends and a gun. Why the sister-in-law of Prince William could face criminal charges. You'll see the pictures, next.

But first, this story has us all believing in Cinderella and Prince Charming. Courtney Alvis has been fighting leukemia, enduring round after round of chemo. It's been so grueling she thought about skipping her senior prom.

Her weight gain from the cancer treatments bothered her and, on top of that, she didn't even have a prom date. Enter Prince Charming, former Alabama football star, Trent Richardson.

Trent heard about Courtney's story after her uncle reached out to his friends. Well, Cinderella got her happy ending.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COURTNEY ALVIS, CANCER PATIENT: He took time out of his day to come to prom with me.

TRENT RICHARDSON, FORMER CRIMSON TIDE RUNNING BACK: My mom's a cancer patient just like she is. I wanted to be with her at the prom, so I'm proud to be that lucky guy to take Courtney to the prom.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

Well, the beautiful cancer survivor and the gallant football star, both of you are today's rock stars.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Pippa Middleton, her friends and a gun, cruising in Paris in an Audi convertible. Odd and shocking pictures to say the least. Now, Pippa could face criminal charges.

The British newspaper, "The Sun," actually posted the pics and broke the story.

Let's get straight to Matthew Chance in London. So, Matthew, show us the pictures.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. They're right here. They're pretty stunning. Here they are on one of the center pages of "The Sun" newspaper.

You can see there's three or four photographs showing Pippa Middleton in this convertible car next to the driver who's wielding this pistol.

It's not clear from the photographs whether it's a real gun or whether it's a fake gun, but it looks pretty real, I have to say.

She's not actually touching the gun, but you can see that she's smirking. The headline is "Smirking Gun." Other people in the car as well also think it's very funny to wield this gun and flash it at the paparazzi photographer who was undoubtedly following them as she made her way back to a train station where she was expected to get back on the train to England.

Obviously a very serious thing to wield a gun in the French capital. The country is pretty sensitive to gun crime at the moment. Just last month, of course, seven people, including four children, were killed in gun attacks in the southwest of the country and it's something that obviously is going to look very bad for Pippa Middleton herself.

PHILLIPS: We're talking about the insensitivity, not only the shock of these pictures, but as you pointed, the insensitivity with all these high-profile shootings that have taken place in just a few weeks.

All right, you pointed out that they're not sure if the gun is real or a fake. So how exactly is that investigation going to go forward?

And we talked about the fact that Pippa -- well, let's talk about what could happen to the guy that had the gun -- and then she could face criminal charges as well.

CHANCE: It's possible, although I suspect -- and, I've spoken to a few lawyers in Paris about this over the course of the past few hours -- I suspect that possibility's been overplayed.

She didn't actually -- you can see from these photographs here -- she didn't actually touch the gun. It's not believed to be her gun.

She would have to be proven to have been an accomplice, been encouraging the driver of that vehicle, the wielder of the gun, if you will, to be doing that for her to be facing any kind of criminal prosecution herself.

PHILLIPS: Do we know ...

CHANCE: As for the individual ...

PHILLIPS: Do we know who he is, Matthew?

CHANCE: I was saying he hasn't been named. These are friends of Pippa Middleton. One of them is a relatively prominent fashion designer, aristocratic French fashion designer in the backseat here wearing a blue baseball cap.

The driver with the gun in his hand, he hasn't been named, but, according to the lawyers I've spoken to, he does potentially face some very serious criminal charges.

Threatening with a firearm is obviously a very serious offense, whether it's a real firearm or not, and so at the moment, he's the guy who's really in trouble.

PHILLIPS: OK. Well, is Pippa still in France? Is she being questioned?

CHANCE: Not at the moment. In fact, she was in this car on her way back to the Gare du Nord which is the train station that takes people back through the Channel Tunnel into Britain, so I believe she's back in Britain.

I've spoken to Buckingham Palace. Of course, they've said they won't comment on this because they say that Pippa Middleton, unlike her sister, Kate, is not a member of the royal family and, therefore, it's not their responsibility. She's just a private citizen.

At the moment, it will be up to the French authorities to decide whether they want to bring Pippa in for questioning, whether they're going to press any charges at all at this point.

PHILLIPS: All right. Matthew Chance, thanks so much.

Well, they're the people responsible for making sure your tax dollars aren't wasted and today they have to answer for some wasteful actions. The man leading the investigation talks with CNN, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Eight hundred thousand taxpayer dollars spent by a government agency on an outlandish junket in Las Vegas. It's the scandal that rocked the general services administration and some involved even bragged about it in a rap video.

But the Vegas boondoggle two years ago apparently was just the tip of the iceberg of wasteful spending by the GSA. It's all part of a House Oversight hearing today. Dana Bash now with a one on one with the committee's Republican chair, Darrell Issa.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

CONGRESSMAN DARRELL ISSA (R), CALIFORNIA: Well, Dana, when we gavel the hearing, this will be a filled room instead of an empty room.

DANA BASH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A sneak peek at the first Congressional hearing on excessive spending at the GSA, the agency that's supposed to look out for taxpayer dollars, yet held a lavish 2010 conference, awarding videos like this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (singing): Because I buy everything robbers can't afford ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: What is your primary goal?

ISSA: Our primary goal is to make sure this doesn't happen again. What often happens, an I.G. does their job. Perhaps some people are held accountable, but the culture doesn't change. BASH: The GSA inspector general briefed now former GSA administrator, Martha Johnson, 11 months ago about the over-the-top spending. Darrell Issa wants to know why the administration sat on the information.

ISSA: Let's remember when you're a political appointee, you're there for two reasons. One is you have the confidence of the president to execute and the second is you're the eyes and ears of the president through the process. We want to know where that process failed.

BASH: Issa invited us from the public hearing room ...

ISSA: You ought to see some people that don't get overtime.

BASH: ... to the committee's private offices for an exclusive look at weekend prep.

ISSA: These are just some of the men and women that are working on a Sunday.

BASH: Issa's aides praised the GSA inspector general.

ISSA: This is a very efficient investigation by comparison to the ones in which the administration is fighting us.

BASH: But why not question past administrations? Excess GSA spending in the Bush years?

Issa insisted he'll get to that. But for now ...

ISSA: Remember, this president ran saying he was going to make changes. The question is, was he well served by his political appointees when they were ordered to go in and make these culture changes?

And, if they didn't make it, is it because they didn't listen to the president or because he didn't really mean it?

BASH: Yet for all his criticism of the Obama administration, why did Issa, who took over the powerful oversight committee vowing to expose government waste, rely on the inspector general to find it?

Were you asleep at the switch here?

ISSA: We're never feeling like we're doing enough. We have 120 people between the majority and minority on this committee. The I.G. is 12,000 people.

BASH: And they found more GSA excess. Issa showed us a commemorative coin from that Las Vegas conference.

ISSA: 6,300 on about 300 of these in velvet boxes.

BASH: Taxpayer dollars.

ISSA: Taxpayer dollars.

BASH: And a souvenir book.

ISSA: Just to have something to remember it by.

BASH: 8,000 bucks?

ISSA: $8,000.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BASH: Now the man largely in charge of creating all of those excess things like the coin, Kyra, and the book is expected to come here. His name is Jeff Neely.

I believe we have a video of him, people who have been paying attention to this remember he was the guy on the red carpet joking about wearing Armani at this lavish conference.

He is going to come here because he was subpoenaed by this committee, but we're told that he is going to invoke his right to take the Fifth Amendment so he doesn't incriminate himself. The Justice Department, apparently, has a criminal investigation looking into some of the things that he may have done to break the law, not just mismanagement.

One little bit of "Old Man Washington," Kyra. He is being brought here by this committee to testify on a hearing about excess spending, flown in from California, even though they know that he's probably not going to testify.

PHILLIPS: OK. Wait, so could we consider that wasteful spending, Dana? And isn't that ironic?

BASH: I'm just saying.

PHILLIPS: Exactly. You are so well connected there on the hill. You have just an incredible slew of sources.

When this finally came out in this video where you started to see more and more of this video, what kind of response did you get from all the people that you deal with on a regular basis there?

Were they not surprised? Were they shocked? Did they think, wow, the gall to put something like this together?

BASH: Oh, it's "wow, the gall." Look, I mean, people do things that blur the lines, maybe go over the line in terms of spending all the time across the federal government, not just here in Washington.

But to put it on tape and to brag about it and boast about it and it being the so much money that was spent is just extraordinary.

And I believe what we're going to see here this afternoon in this hearing, Kyra, is more reporting from the inspector general of the GSA who did really pretty much all of this work about the kinds of things that Jeff Neely and others who ran this lavish conference in 2010 spent money on and how they did it in many cases with no big contracts, which, of course, you're not supposed to do.

And the kinds of no big contracts they were doing were, like, hiring a bike company for a bike contest. Again, $75,000 of your money and my money.

So I think across the government, people are scratching their heads saying, are you kidding me?

PHILLIPS: Yes. I think we're all saying that for sure. Dana Bash, great, great exclusive look inside of where this is all going to happen.

This is one of those stories where, you know, you've got the video, but you really don't have very fascinating elements. You got us right there inside where it's going to happen. Only you could do that. Dana, thanks so much.

BASH: Thanks, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Well, speaking of money, the clock is ticking for last minute tax filers and if you're rushing to beat the deadline, all right, we've got a few tips that might help you out. That's coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: In less than 24 hours it'll be tax day, so if you haven't already filed, well, you better get your financials in order.

Alison Kosik with a few last minute tips to get you filed on time. Why does it seem like, Alison, we are doing this same segment, same time, every year?

ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: You know what? I blame electronic filing. It makes us procrastinate even more, you know?

Just keep in mind, though, you've got until midnight tomorrow to file your taxes, so, yes, yes, get moving already.

So far almost 80 million taxpayers have received a refund of $2,794. That's down just a few bucks from last year.

According to TurboTax, more than 57 percent of adults say that the day that their tax refund arrives is as exciting as a holiday or their birthday, probably because a third of taxpayers say they plan to spend all or part of their refund this year.

That's according to Capital One's annual taxes and savings survey. Yay, the tax money's here. Kyra? Yay, the tax money's here.

PHILLIPS: Yes, right. What can people do to help lower the tax bill before tomorrow? KOSIK: OK, here's a last minute trick to lowering your bill. Contribute to an IRA. You have up until tomorrow's deadline to have it count toward your 2011 taxes.

Look at this. Here are the numbers. If you're under 50-years old, you can contribute up to $5,000 to an IRA, $6,000 if you're 50 or older.

Here's an example for you. Lynnette Khalfani-Cox says, if you're rushing in the 25 percent tax bracket and you put $5,000 into an IRA, you can save about $1,250 in taxes. Not bad.

And if you're rushing to do your taxes, Cox says try not to take the standard deduction, so if you have the time, itemize your deductions. It can save you hundreds or thousands on your tax bill. Kyra?

PHILLIPS: What if you still can't pay the full amount that you owe?

KOSIK: OK. If you can't pay the full amount, the IRS says still file your return by April 17th and pay as much as you can to avoid any penalties and interest.

But if you've been unemployed for any 30-day period or more beginning on January 1st, 2011 or if you're self-employed and your income dropped 25 percent or more in 2011 because of the economy, the IRS has their Fresh Start Initiative Relief program. That's what it's called.

That's where you can sign up for an installment payment plan with the IRS and avoid penalties. Now, there are income limits to this program, so go to irs.gov to see if you can qualify.

And I'm going to have more tax tips tomorrow for that last minute tax help, Kyra, when your taxes are due tomorrow, but you have until midnight, so I'll give you some extra help tomorrow.

PHILLIPS: You're encouraging even more people to procrastinate even more because you're going to be there to save the day.

KOSIK: Why not? Yes, I will. Red tape.

PHILLIPS: Alison Kosik, thanks.

He's a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame or was until his old trainer claimed that Roger Clemens juiced his pitches with steroids. Clemens back in federal court for his second trial on perjury charges.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, one of the greatest names in baseball is back in federal court today, trying to save his reputation and stay out of prison.

We're talking about former superstar pitcher, Roger Clemens. He's on trial a second time for allegedly lying to Congress when he said this to the House committee in 2008.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROGER CLEMENS, FORMER MAJOR LEAGUE PITCHER: Let me be clear. I have never taken steroids or HGH.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Clear enough. But Clemens' former trainer said this to that same Congressional panel.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN MCNAMEE, CLEMENS' FORMER TRAINER: During the time that I worked with Roger Clemens, I injected him on numerous occasions with steroids and human growth hormone.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Well, there's also Clemens friend and former teammate, Andy Pettitte. Pettitte says Clemens once admitted taking human growth hormone, but Clemens says Pettitte misremembers that conversation now.

Well, the feds and Team Clemens start picking jurors. I want to bring in Michael McCann. You know him well as the legal analyst for "Sports Illustrated" and NBA TV and, of course, the sports columnist for si.com.

Great to see you.

MICHAEL MCCANN, ANALYST, SPORTS COLUMNIST, SI.COM & SPORTED ILLUSTRATED & NBA TV: Great to see you, too, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Let's give people context here about the fact that this is the second time he's on trial. Let's give a little context about the first time he was in the courtroom.

MCCANN: Yes. So last July, prosecutors made a really bad mistake. They showed jurors information that went to the credibility of Andy Pettitte and his wife. It was information that the judge had said they couldn't show the jurors. So once that happened, the judge said, look, this is over. This is a mistrial. Prosecutors were really worried at that point they wouldn't have a second chance to prosecute Clemens. But the judge allowed them to do so because the mistake didn't prejudice Clemens' case.

PHILLIPS: What was the deal with Andy Pettitte's wife?

MCCANN: Andy Pettitte's wife is a potential witness in the case. And her comments about Clemens and also about Pettitte go to whether or not Pettitte, in fact, correctly remembered what happened, and specifically the conversation that Pettitte had with Roger Clemens, the alleged conversation, in which Clemens supposedly told Pettitte that he was using HGH. If that comes out in a trial, it's very damning to Roger Clemens. While Clemens' chief accuser, Brian McNamee, has credibility issues, Andy Pettitte does not.

PHILLIPS: Second trial, same judge, right? Aren't they kind of hosed from the minute go?

(LAUGHTER)

MCCANN: Well, certainly I'm sure the prosecutors are worried about the fact that they've already had one big mistake with this judge. But judges are supposed to treat each trial separately. And judge Walton's reputation is certainly one of high esteem. I suspect he'll be able to block out what happened the first time this time around. f PHILLIPS: So prosecutors could be a little gun shy here?

MCCANN: They could. Although, on the other hand, prosecutors can't lose this, Kyra. If prosecutors lose this case -- and they've already expanded their legal team from two lawyers of record to five -- there'll be a tremendous amount of questioning if not a ridicule as to the amount of tax dollars that were spent investigating and prosecuting Roger Clemens.

PHILLIPS: We know about the "he said, he said," "he said, she said," all of that. What's fascinating here, this could all come down to cotton swabs and a beer can?

MCCANN: That's right. So McNamee, if his story is true, kept the incriminating evidence in a beer can in a FedEx box in his basement. Of course, Clemens' lawyers are going to say, wait a second, you can't rely on this. This is not reputable evidence. It could have been tampered with. The prosecution is going to argue that even though it wasn't kept in a laboratory, tampering still would not have happened.

PHILLIPS: It's sort of interesting this former trainer would keep the syringes, bloody cotton balls in a beer can. It's strange. It's intriguing. What do you make of that?

MCCANN: It's very strange. It gives Clemens some potential to argue this guy was setting me up. This guy struck a deal with prosecutors to avoid prosecution by incriminating me because I'm a bigger fish in the pond. Clemens will argue that. Clemens' lawyers will also argue this is an orchestrated effort to implicate one of the biggest names in sports. That jurors shouldn't go along with what the prosecutors are arguing. They should, in fact, nullify the argument. They should find Clemens not guilty regardless of the scientific evidence.

PHILLIPS: What do you know about this judge? I mean, from what I've been reading, he does not go easy on these guys. If you get this judge, it's -- the attitude's pretty much, god help you.

MCCANN: Yes. This is bad news. You don't want to get Judge Walton if you're found guilty. This is a judge who has a reputation as a tough sentencer. This is somebody who, when Scooter Libby, the former chief of staff to Vice President Cheney, was convicted on perjury and other charges, he didn't send Scooter Libby to the recommended sentence of 15 to 21 months. He gave him 30 months, a tougher penalty than was expected, because he said the crime was so bad. I'm sure Roger Clemens is hoping he's not in those shoes.

PHILLIPS: What could he face? It's maximum 30 years in prison, right? Give me a reality check, of knowing this judge, how he's acted in the past, what this baseball player could face.

MCCANN: Well, part of it depends on how many counts he's convicted on. If he's only convicted on one count, for instance, obstruction of justice, he may get OK treatment. This is what happened to Barry Bonds when he was convicted on obstruction of justice last year. He got house arrest. It's possible Clemens could get something like that. But if Clemens is convicted across the board on all six counts, he is looking at prison time. It wouldn't surprise me if Judge Walton imposes a prison sentence in that recommended range of 15 to 21 months.

PHILLIPS: Got it.

Michael McCann, appreciate your perspective.

MCCANN: Thanks for having me on, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: You bet.

A thief drives off with a 3-year-old boy. The car is gone. But the boy is returned on the doorstep. We'll have more in "Street Level," next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Time for stories making news at "Street Level."

Tulsa, Oklahoma, a judge today entered not guilty pleas for the two men charged in a racially motivated shooting spree 10 days ago. Jake England and Alvin Watts are accused of killing three people and wounding two others in a mostly black neighborhood. Both of these men are being held without bond.

Let's take you near San Francisco, California, now. Four sailors feared dead after their yacht ran aground. Coast Guard spent two days searching for them, but have now suspended the search. The yacht was hit by several large waves and rolled over while competing in a race near the Fairline Islands over the weekend. At least one person died. Three others were rescued.

A somber day in Blacksburg, Virginia. Five years ago today, one of the deadliest mass shootings in U.S. history happened right there on the campus of Virginia Tech. A vigil will be held tonight as students and faculty members remember that moment that a gunman opened fire in a dorm and then, two hours later, in a classroom across campus. 32 people died that day before the gunman killed himself. The rampage prompted universities around this country to enhance alert systems. A terrifying moment for a dad in Colorado Springs after his car was stolen with his 3-year-old son inside. Now, the dad tells affiliate, KMGH, that he stepped just a few feet away from his running car to talk to a friend at this 7-Eleven, and someone just jumped in and took off with his kid inside the car. Police say the thief, though, later dropped the boy off at a doorstep just a few blocks from the store. A woman flagged down the patrol car and the boy was later returned to his parents. He's fine. The thief, still on the run.

The legacy of baseball great Jackie Robinson is remembered right here in Atlanta. From Turner Field to Fenway Park, there were ceremonies in honor of the 65th anniversary of Robinson breaking Major League Baseball's color barrier. Players wore number 42 jerseys yesterday to remember the day that he took the field with the Brooklyn Dodgers.

In California, talk about a show stopper at the Coachella Music Festival. Tupac joined Dr. Dre on stage at the festival. You got it right. Tupac has been dead for over 15 years but made a cameo as a hologram to perform two of his hits. According to the "Hollywood Reporter," Tupac's appearance set Twitter on fire and the crowd was in awe.

Washington's airport testing new technology to make check-ins more efficient. Transportation Security Administration says that the system at Dulles checks I.D. and boarding passes by machine instead of visual checks by officers. The TSA hopes it will weed out fraudulent documents and get passengers to the planes quicker. Houston and San Juan, Puerto Rico's airports will also test those machines.

Party isn't the first word you think of when you hear General Services Administration. That's probably how it should be. Straight ahead, more fallout from a GSA junket in Vegas that you paid for.

But first, our "Political Junky" question of the day, who's the richest person to ever run for president? Tweet me @KyraCNN if you know the answer. I'll give you a shout out right after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Just before the break, I asked who was the richest person to ever run for president. The answer? Ross Perot. He ran in '92 and '96. Perot was worth around $3.5 billion at the time. Congrats to Ceasv, New Jersey, for tweeting the right answer.

You know he saying, what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas. Some federal government folks didn't get that memo when they took a junket to Sin City two years ago and spent $800,000 of your money. That lavish spending by members of the GSA is now a full-blown scandal and the topic of a Congressional hearing today. It's "Fair Game."

Let's talk about it with the veteran Democratic strategist, Christine Pelosi; and Gentry Collins, former national political director for the RNC.

Guys, we've seen it. A lot of people have seen it. Just for old time's sake, let's remind folks about this fabulous Vegas boondoggle for a few seconds.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tell you about local project management

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's pretty good!

(SINGING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: All right. Gentry, not only did they waste $800,000 of taxpayer money, but as you can see, put a lot of effort into this. A lot of producing skills. Even poking fun at the president.

GENTRY COLLINS, FORMER NATIONAL POLITICAL DIRECTOR, RNC: Well, they sure did. Of course, not only is this a huge scandal, but it is a scandal that the GSA administrators were briefed on almost a year ago.

Look, I think the bigger problem for President Obama is that this plays into a narrative that he has not managed the federal government well. This government borrows $3 billion every day to fund the excess spending of the Obama administration.

PHILLIPS: So, Christine, how much is this within the president's realm and how much is his fault?

CHRISTINE PELOSI, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Oh, I don't think this is his fault. I don't think he's paying people to make fun of him. I think this is an outrage. Just as outrageous as the banks that get taxpayer bailouts and turn around and give themselves big bonuses. Why everyone should be concerned about this is not only the waste, fraud and abuse that is clear, but also the fact that we have over 600,000 government jobs that have been cut -- teachers, firefighters, cops and nurses. And when we see hard working teachers laid off at a boondoggle like this, it just reinforces a stereotype about government that shouldn't be used as an excuse to lay off hard working public service employees or charge retirees an extra $6,000 more a year in health care costs. So I think that's the bigger concern, is that every government employee is an ambassador for the American people and should act that way.

PHILLIPS: We should point out, Gentry, the GSA has had a long history and culture of wasteful spending.

COLLINS: Well, it has. Of course, President Obama ran in part on getting rid of some of those kinds of things, on right-sizing government. He hasn't done it.

This president now has $4.9 trillion he's added to the national debt in his first 3.5 years. That's as much as President Bush accrued in eight years as president. Of course, President Bush was dealing with the aftermath of 9/11 and the war on terror. So this president has clearly failed. I think it's part of what's driving his numbers, his approval numbers, into that dangerous territory below which most presidents haven't been re-elected.

PHILLIPS: Let's switch gears a little bit. The subject of Mitt Romney, because of the position that he holds right now, his religion, being a Mormon, it's coming up again. There's more talk about it.

Christine, what do you think? Is it time to talk about this more as a number of people are asking for? Because he is getting so close to possibly being the president of the United States?

PELOSI: Absolutely. I wrote about this a couple of weeks ago on the "Politico" blog, which is that I believe Mitt Romney ought to do what we ask everybody to do -- show us -- show us who you are. Show us what you believe in. What you'll take to the barricades. In my book "Campaign Boot Camp 2.0," I talk about how every message has to appeal to your heart and your head.

And also I would note, from a practical standpoint for Mitt Romney, when people don't know exactly where he stands on various issues, flip-flopping on guns, on whether stay-at-home moms should be honored or not, whether he should -- all these other issues he's flip- flopped on, for him to say "consistent in my life has been my faith, this is what I believe," I think he'll attract people. I would also note that there are Mormon Democrats who look at Mitt Romney as a first, the way Catholics looked at President Kennedy and the way some African-Americans looked at Barack Obama. He could actually gain votes within his own party and within his own faith, I think, if he stepped forward and talked about what he believes in.

PHILLIPS: Gentry, why is he sidestepping this issue and not doing what Christine suggests he should do?

COLLINS: I don't think he is sidestepping this issue. I don't think he will in the future. First of all, Mitt Romney has lived his faith in a way very few of us of any faith can say we do in modern American today. You see it in the fidelity in his marriage, in the way he's raised his kids, in the way he's given his money and his time. I think most Americans will respect and admire that regardless of which denomination we're talking about.

You'll also remember, of course, he made a major speech on religion the last time he ran for president, back in 2008. So he has clearly not sidestepped his faith. It's integral to who he is.

Look, the big issues of this election will be around the facts. The facts are that this president has lost three-quarters of a million jobs in the first three years of his first term. He's added more to the debt than President Bush did or as much to the debt as President Bush did over eight years. Those are going to be the big issues, driving issues of this campaign, not religion.

(CROSSTALK)

PELOSI: Also when it comes to jobs, those are government jobs. Most of those jobs that were lost -- 600,000 of those jobs that were lost were government jobs. A majority of those government workers were women. So let's talk about that. Let's also talk about, when you talk about spending, it's also the Iraq war, the Afghanistan war, and Bush tax cuts still in effect. So I think there is shared responsibility there. And on the cost of war, let's quickly put in that with 6500 veterans a year committing suicide. We ought to consider mental health to be a cost of war. And I think that that should be one aspect of government spending that we could all agree has to increase if we're going to help our veterans who have helped us.

PHILLIPS: I don't mean to backtrack, but two things sort of stood out to me. One more question about religion and Mormonism because, Gentry, as you pointed out in 2008, you were working with him on that campaign.

And then Christine, you say he talked about it, and you bring up a good point. The Bible talks about your best witness is living the lifestyle. And he's -- he does appear to have this incredible marriage and these great kids, and he's been faithful to his wife, and he's ethical in all areas of his life. He's talked a little bit about his mission trip.

But why not talk more about the Mormon religion, why he believes what he believes and go more in depth? Yes, we see him lead his life, but there really has not been a Mitt Romney that stood up and really gone in depth on his religion and his beliefs and the Mormon faith.

COLLINS: Well, look, this election is not about electing a pastor for the country. It's about electing a president for the country. And the big issue that is this country faces are not around which denomination we want to choose and that's not what the presidential debate ought to be about. The big issues are about the rate at which we're spending. This president has doubled the right at which we're indebting the future generations, and restoring economic growth and job creation I the country. Again, this president has lost three-quarters of a million jobs in the first 3.5 years of his first and hopefully only term. Those are the issues we ought to be talking about and not issues about which religion would you like your pastor to be from.

PHILLIPS: Got it.

Christine --

(CROSSTALK)

PELOSI: Well, I would say I'm happy to know that you are concerned about that number, because 700,000 jobs were lost in the last month of the Bush presidency alone. We've had 25 straight months of private growth. And I really hope that everybody listened to what Gentry said and stops attacking President Obama on his faith. It would be a great idea just to have a cease-fire right here and right now and say someone's private faith should not be "Fair Game" when it comes to public service.

PHILLIPS: We'll leave it there. Gentry, Christine, guys, thanks so much.

COLLINS: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: It's a hot day for the Boston Marathon but despite the weather, about 27,000 runners are expected to be there, including this man. His personal race to the finish line, next.

But first, 15 minutes can seem pretty short or it can drag on for months, as in the Republican presidential race. Here is a minute, 17 that just says it all.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: That was certainly a primary season to remember, huh?

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Sure was. There was even a time when people were saying I was the front-runner. Got to thank you for that, Mitt. You're the only candidate who could ever make me look exciting.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Yes. And you're the only candidate who could make me look gay-friendly.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: I hope you aren't reminiscing without me.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Hey, it's Rick Perry.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: You guys remember that weird game show we were all on and we were standing at podiums and answering questions?

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Rick, that wasn't a game show. Those were debates.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Well, well, well.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: It's Michele Bachmann.

(LAUGHTER)

(CHEERING)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: All right.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: There was even a moment when I was the front-runner, and then it all fell apart when "Newsweek" ran a very creepy cover photo of my face.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Oh, that's right. Hey, come on, Michele, show us the "Newsweek" face. UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: No, I couldn't.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Come on, "Newsweek" face.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: All right, fine, fine.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Does this bar serve food, I am starving.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: We can always order a pizza!

(LAUGHTER0

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Oh, no, guys, Gingrich is here.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Oh-oh, hang on.

(LAUGHTER)

(CHEERING)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: I can't believe he's still in the race. I heard his campaign is completely out of money.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Uh-huh.

UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Oh, man, look, he's stealing nuts.

(LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: And we've said it before, but Santorum, Perry, Bachmann, Cain, and, yes, even Gingrich, isn't it time you rallied behind one? Your 15 minutes are up.

(SINGING)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: The Boston Marathon taking place right now. We've been talking about those record temperatures. Well, there's one person running in that heat and he's not complaining. Talking about Army First Lieutenant Cameron Kerr. He lost his leg 14 months ago in Afghanistan, but once he received a prosthetic, he quickly set his sights on new challenges, including running this marathon.

Here is a look at his journey.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CAMERON KERR, RUNNING IN BOSTON MARATHON: At Walter Reed we have a thing called our alive day which we celebrate just as anyone would our birthday. It's the day we didn't die and we cheated death and we got to see the sunrise the next day. For most of us it's a day we checked on an IED or we got shot or what have you.

I'm Cameron Kerr, I served as a platoon leader in Kandahar, Afghanistan. My alive day is February 16, 2011. I didn't sleep that first night. I started think being what life as an amputee would be like. But at a certain point, I switch from what's going to be different to what's going to be better. And I started thinking about little things, how I wouldn't have to fold socks and I'm going to get to go to all these hospitals and meet a bunch of cute nurses.

Back when I was 13 or 14 is when I started first getting involved through my parents with the Sudanese Lost Boys and getting an appreciation for everything that was given to me. As a high schooler, I started thinking seriously about the Army, which worried by mother obviously.

Running the Boston Marathon is something I had never entertained as a thought. When I lost my legs, some folks showed me the opportunities they presented for veterans. That's when I started thinking about doing these events, when I got my prosthetics and I started walking and ditched my canes and crutches. Starting off small, just walking five miles in Central Park last June. I moved on to Marine Corps Marathon 10k in D.C., New York City Marathon, I hand tackled (ph) 16 miles and ran the last 10. Just in January, the half marathon, which is the furthest I've ever run in my life. Myself and my running partner though, if we can do that, why not Boston. After that I feel I'm completely ready for anything that challenges me in the future. If I can run a marathon with one le leg, really I can do anything I put my mind to.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: I can tell you right now, we will be rooting for Cameron Kerr and following up on how well he does.

That does it for us. Thanks so much for watching. You can continue the conversation with me on Twitter #KyraCNN or on Facebook.

CNN NEWSROOM continues now with Suzanne Malveaux.