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Canadian Porn Star Killer?

Aired June 5, 2012 - 21:00   ET


DR. DREW PINSKY, HOST: Here we go.

A Canadian porn star is arrested for gruesome murder of his lover. What goes on in a mind of a psychopathic killer? We will speak to a man who knew him.

Call us, you can talk to him, at 855-DRDREW5.

And later, your calls, all of them, any topic, no topic taboo. We want to hear from you.

Let`s get started.


PINSKY: All right. Good evening, welcome to the program.

Tonight, truly disturbing crime. You`ve been hearing about it all day for a couple days on HLN. Twenty-nine-year-old Luka Magnotta, I`m not sure if that`s precisely you pronounce his name. I don`t know really care with this disgusting beast allegedly killed his male lover and ate some of the body parts.

Take a look at this.


PINSKY (voice-over): Cops nab a porn star who allegedly seduced his boyfriend, killed him, dismembered him and had sex with dead body parts. Get this, he videotaped himself doing it and put it online. He fled and an international manhunt ended with his arrest in Germany yesterday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Head is still missing. We get one in and one foot`s still missing at this moment.

PINSKY: As this young man awaits extradition, back to Canada, we ask, what kind of mind does this sort of thing? Could someone you know be on the brink of something bizarre?


PINSKY: Joining us is Joe Warmington. He`s a reporter for the "Sun News" network who interviewed Luka in 2007. He right now joins me by phone. We`re having technical difficulty getting him by satellite.

Joe, how did you respond to this? Did this all surprise you given how you had experienced this man in the past?

JOE WARMINGTON, REPORTER, SUN NEWS NETWORK (via telephone): Well, Dr. Drew, in retrospect, the whole thing, it`s freaking me out because I`ve got a couple of feelings about it being so close to somebody that`s done so something so heinous allegedly and also the fact that, you know, I didn`t pick it up. I`m just a reporter here in Toronto.

It was five years ago. I thought he was a guy that needed help. We tried to get him help. And, you know, it`s really scary. I also think that he`s -- when he was on the lam there, that he was sending me e-mails. So, it`s pretty close to home, and it`s pretty frightening.

PINSKY: Joe, I want to check with my control room. Am I right we have footage of this particular interview that led Joe to learn there was something medically wrong with him? Can we show that footage? We`re going to show that in just a second.

Here it is. A 2007 interview. A "Sun News" exclusive. This is what led Joe to conclude this kid needed help. Let`s take a look at it.


LUKA ROCCO MAGNOTTA, MURDER SUSPECT: I was a stripper, and then basically I went from there doing adult films and I`m not ashamed of doing these all things.

I have a problem, though, with people saying those to relatives. Wants to talk to me, I don`t have anybody basically. Whoever`s doing this, please stop. You know, you`re doing a lot of harm.


PINSKY: Joe, was it what he was saying or that he seemed intoxicated or just a gut feeling there was some real bad potential here?

WARMINGTON: Well, there`s all of the above, doc. Basically his eyes didn`t blink, and so he was looking right through me, and he was a sympathetic character to me. I felt sorry for him, and I`ve spent the whole weekend thinking that he would be able to utilize that so well.

And someone, you know, almost like prey, because myself and the photographer were worried about him. We even made a phone call to his agent at the time. The same time he was, I saw the narcissism. I saw this desire for attention.

And the reason I wrote the column on him and ran this video was because I was trying to shine some light on him. I didn`t think that we have seen would happen. It didn`t occur to me.

Although, the whole reason for him coming in was he was claiming to -- he was involved with this woman that was a notorious killer here, Karla Homolka, tried to deny rumors he was linked to her even though he was the one starting the rumors.

But I`d seen that before here in Canada. That was a notorious case. It was still 12 or so years removed from happening. And I just thought it was a guy that needed help and now I know that, you know, this was obviously a slippery slope.

PINSKY: Can we actually show -- I want to show Joe. He`s up now. We`re struggling away here. He`s on the phone. You guys mind showing him? I want to -- there you are, Joe. I appreciate you struggling along with us. He`s been talking to us obviously via the phone.

Do we have audio now with him I guess?

WARMINGTON: You got audio? That`s great.

PINSKY: I`m hearing yes and no. Whatever. I can talk to you. That`s the important thing. Oh, there you go.

Joe, my question is this. You`re up in Canada talking to us now from Canada. Are Canadians shook up by this? Are they as disturbed by this as we are down here?

WARMINGTON: Well, they are, and, Dr. Drew, what happened here today is now coast to coast because it went up to Vancouver where two of the missing body parts, another hand and foot had been sent to two separate schools.

Yes, this country is in the state of shock. I mean, the headlines out of Germany, calling him the Canada cannibal. I mean, it`s just not something that we`re used to. For me having met this guy and interviewed him, it`s surreal. I mean, I interview a lot of people.

I`ve been a reporter at the "Toronto Sun" for 21 more years and more recently with the integration of the media with the "Sun News" network. This is one of the very first videos I`d ever done and it was just one of those things, it was an interesting character. And I just didn`t dream anything -- I will never, ever look at anybody the same, though, dr. Drew, after this. I`ve really done a lot of soul searching on it, wishing I had have caught something that I could have alerted the --

PINSKY: Joe, don`t do that to yourself. Even real experts would not have been able to predict something like this. This is really wild behavior. I mean, it would be hard to predict something like this. Let`s take a quick call.

Roland in California. Roland.

ROLAND, CALLER FROM CALIFORNIA: Hey, Dr. Drew, how are you guys doing today?

PINSKY: Good, Roland. Thank you. What do you got?

ROLAND: The writing was on the wall with Luka Magnotta if you look. He published a lot of articles on Internet about necrophilia and how he was, you know, killing little animals and he would escalate it to adults.

So, here`s what I don`t understand, he was such a friendly person, it would be easy for him to lure someone. How do you go on betting someone in a relationship before you get into a relationship like that?

PINSKY: This is very much the point. This is what`s so creepy and scary about people like that. True psychopaths can be very difficult to ferret out.

And, Joe, you clearly saw the addiction, the sort of strange affect, you saw the funny feeling he gave you. You appropriately sort of wanted to reach out and help him.

He may or may not have been helpful at that point. He may or may not have already been engaged in problematic behavior that frankly would still be considered disgusting. But please don`t blame yourself. I hope other people aren`t looking at you as somebody who should have stopped this train.

WARMINGTON: No. No. I don`t think they are, because it`s five years removed, but I didn`t know about all these postings. I don`t spend a lot of time Googling. I`m one story to the next kind of reporter here.

And I just didn`t know about the kittens and things like that. And had I seen that, had somebody sent me that, then it would have alerted and I could have maybe at that point done something.

You know, I guess you`re right. There`s nothing I can do. It`s on my mind.

When he was on the lam, you know, my wife and I were concerned and there`s still that head out there and, you know, he definitely fixates on people.


WARMINGTON: When he came into the "Toronto Sun" building back in 2007, he looked like Paul Bernardo, who`s one of our most notorious killers. And Paul Bernardo severed his victims, three young women, with his wife Karla Homolka.

So you know what? Anybody who sort of tried to emulate that, I think I should have picked it up a little more. I wrote the column because I wanted to shine some light on it.

I just thought he was a guy with fantasies, maybe off his meds. His manager said he was fine. I called him, he said, look, he just seeks attention, he`s harmless, he`s a good kid, that`s why he gets all these different jobs in modeling, et cetera.

PINSKY: Yes, maybe that`s the guy -- yeah, that`s maybe more the guy we should be holding accountable here.

Now, speaking of trying to get, you know, get ahead of -- or being able to ferret out this kind of disgusting person, we have a profiler who watched the videotape of the murder, actually watched it. And she`s going to join us. She`s going to analyze it for lack of a better way of talking about it.

Also I`ll keep taking your --



MAGNOTTA: Yes, you know, I really do enjoy my work. I get to meet new people all the time, and, you know, I`m a people person and, you know, it just worked out great for me.


PINSKY: That was an interview with Luka Magnotta 11 years ago when he was 18 years old, apparently an escort at that time. Tonight, he`s behind bars for the murder and dismemberment of his male lover which was filmed and then posted online.

If that was not disgusting enough, police say he mailed some of the victim body parts to Canadian officials. I guess Joe was just telling us a school.

And Tonight, Vancouver police are investigating the delivery of suspicious packages to those schools. They appear to contain human remains.

Joining me to discuss this, criminal profiler Pat Brown.

Now, Pat, you actually watched this unbelievable videotape. Before we get into that, I want you to help me reassure for Joe, the reporter that interviewed him five years ago, help him understand that he couldn`t have stopped this train. I mean, neither you nor I -- we would have felt horrible, we would have tried to do something with this kid. But we would not have foreseen this unless we knew about previous violence or the animal cruelty that we all now know about.

Even then I don`t think we could have foreseen this.

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Well, even if you can foresee it, Dr. Drew, the problem is, what can you do about it? If he hasn`t yet committed a crime you can`t put him away, you can`t get him psychiatric help, which psychopaths don`t use very well anyway. I mean, I know personally serial killers and other murderers out there through my work, and I know they`re out in society. I know who they are and where they live. I can`t do anything because I can`t prove they did anything.

So they`re out there until they kill somebody else. It`s a very horrifying thing to think about, but, you know, there`s only so much you can do within the law.

So, Joe, yes, you didn`t do anything wrong. There`s no way you could have known what he could have done, what he was able to do, what he would do and that you could even do anything about it.

PINSKY: Right. That`s the unfortunate reality. I saw show shudder when you talked about there are people out there.

Go ahead, Joe.

WARMINGTON: Well, I was just going to say, I was going to ask your expert, if you wouldn`t mind looking at the video that I did do and see if you would have seen anything. Because those eyes did freak me out. He wasn`t blinking.


WARMINGTON: And I thought it was medication issue, and I asked somebody, and they said it`s because he doesn`t have his medication. And so, you know, is that what it was? Or is there something more to this?

BROWN: No, that actually is psychopathy, Joe, because they tepid to be like snakes. Their eyes don`t blink a lot. You do get really crept out.

And, yes, I saw the narcissism there. But he was also a good actor. He was playing you to get your sympathy going. And what the problem is, we don`t want to say this guy`s hopeless.

WARMINGTON: I felt bad for him.

BROWN: Got into bad ways. Yes, you feel bad for him. If we can get him out of the prostitution, we just get him out of porn industry, he`s being abused by people, if we can just get him into a situation where we can have some help, he can be OK.

PINSKY: Let`s be clear, pat, you`re calling him a psychopath.

BROWN: You know I would.

PINSKY: Of course I knew that. There`s still another explanation here that he took some sort of -- he was a bad drug addict pretty clearly. Looks like that. He might have, you know, we know there are cases these days of people taking bath salts and things like that and doing terrible, violent, bizarre things and this is still a potential explanation.

Though, I want you to tell us, Pat, my understanding is you saw this videotape and rather than being wild and violent in it as many drug addicts are, he was methodical and dispassionate.

BROWN: Absolutely, Dr. Drew. When I watched that tape, you could tell he set the tape up, he was purposely videotaping it, he edited it. He wanted people so see certain things on that tape.

So, he went into different positions. He posed parts of the body. He did everything he could during that tape for the audience. And he was very methodical and very calm. He clearly knew what he was doing. There were no drugs involved whatsoever that I could see except the poor victim who was thankfully pretty much out of it.

PINSKY: He might have been drugged to make him disconnected and dispassionate. That`s a possibility, too.

Jen in Georgia, you have a question for us. Go ahead? Jen? I don`t hear her. Jen in Georgia?

How about Jackie? Jackie, are you there? Jackie?


PINSKY: Jackie, go right ahead.

JACKIE: Hi, Dr. Drew. I`m hearing all the disgusting names, you know, about him being a monster and hearing all the disgusting things that he did and, yes, the acts that he did were absolutely grotesque beyond words.

But one of the things that no one is addressing is what about us as a society? Somebody was actually paying to have sex with him, someone was enjoying his body. Someone was enjoying his services. Somebody was paying him. And somebody was making him feel that he was something special, doing something good, and obviously that`s exactly what he was seeking.

But what about the people that were out there looking for his services?

PINSKY: Jackie --

JACKIE: Why isn`t anyone saying anything about that?

PINSKY: That`s sort of a rhetorical question. I`m not sure we can really answer that. Yes, there are people that go to prostitutes, people that make pornography and it`s not healthy for the people being exploited of the systems.

For people who assume it`s just fun, it`s just OK, this is a reminder that people, you`re right, they suffer. We really need to think about -- we need to check ourselves. We need to check ourselves here before consuming any of this stuff.

Back with more calls after this.


PINSKY: We`re talking about the case of the Canadian porn killer, so- called, who`s also known to have killed kittens and posted videos of that online as well.

Pat, according to, people who kill animals are five times more likely to commit violent crimes against humans. That`s something I look for to distinguish between someone who`s merely a sociopath or a psychopath.

BROWN: Well, you know, the kitten-killing thing, those videos are pretty unpleasant as well. And one thing that`s interesting to note, in both that video and the other one, was that Magnotta, before he does the horrible things, is actually a pleasant and friendly person as with in that interview we saw.

PINSKY: With his boyfriend? With his friend there?

BROWN: Well, there were only a few seconds there. You know something happened that was pleasant prior to that moment because that poor man did not see that coming.

PINSKY: What does he do? What does he do? Forget the kittens. What does he do to this guy?

BROWN: You don`t see that. The kittens he picks up and pats the kittens and plays with their ears and he plays with their paws. You think he likes the little kitten then he kills it.

So, this is the kind of person who has zero, zero empathy for other beings and can very quickly flip.

But I want to address what the woman said who called in about what about society? This gore site, Magnotta knew this gore site, he knew where to send the video. My guess is he`s been on the gore site over and over and over again and other gore sites, fueling his fantasies.

And the man who ran the gore site came out in the Canadian press and said, oh, I put this up for the good of people.

PINSKY: Oh, my gosh!


PINSKY: Joe, hang on, are you aware of that guy who operates this site?

WARMINGTON: You know, I`m aware of that and there`s another bigger part of that story for me is the fact it was on that site and people were watching it. So many so, Dr. Drew, that it crashed the server. And there was a guy from Montana who tried to tell the police about it everywhere. Miami, the FBI, Denver police, Toronto police, RCMP, and nobody would listen to him.

And so, people are watching this as if it was mainstream, hundreds of thousands of people, you know?

And so this guy, Magnotta, if he did this, has basically made a snuff film into mainstream for a lot of people. I didn`t watch it. I could have watched it. I decided not to. I didn`t need to.

And I don`t understand. It`s not lawful to watch something like that in Canada. It`s a disgrace that ended up out there like that.

PINSKY: Pat, I`m going to ask you what you saw. What did he do?

BROWN: What did he do in the film?


BROWN: The movie? Everything that he could have done. He killed the man. He had sex with the man.

He had sex with the body parts. He ate the body parts. He had the dog eat the body parts.

It was about the most -- let me put it this way -- I will have that emblazed in my head the rest of my life. What I didn`t do, which I want to point out, why this gore site is so dangerous, what I didn`t do is hit replay and replay again and put up a message that says, oh, how cool. Do you have any others like this?

You know, this is what the -- people going to the gore sites are thrilled about watching this. They watch massive quantities like pornography. So it`s not a matter of little bit of education, or professional reason they`re doing it. They enjoy it. And they want to see more of it.

And that`s the kind of thing Magnotta got ahold of himself. That validates his own ideas and gives him fantasies and says, I have an audience I can send the tape to. So, that helped him out a bit.

PINSKY: We can`t confirm nor deny that this was him in these tapes, of course. And Pat did watch these tapes. And I -- I got to say, if -- what I find -- the whole thing is just so awful we even have to have these conversations.

But the fact there`s a sexual component to it makes it more troubling because you know that`s what that energy is that`s directing people to these sites. And think about that. We have people out there that are involved in that in that way.

Please, anyone who knows anyone who thinks that way, please get help before you hurt somebody else or hurt yourself. I mean, there are -- maybe treatments aren`t great.

Pat, I know you don`t have great confidence in treatments. At least we can potentially, potentially help people before it`s too late.

And, Joe, I tell you what, both you guys, I want to hold you over across the break. I didn`t even have a chance to even take any calls this segment. I`m so -- I don`t want to say I`m taken with this story, but I`m so disgusted, but it`s kind of weirdly fascinating. I think we have to talk about it.

I want to take calls so I`m going to hold you guys across the break here. We`ll take more calls from viewers. The number is 855-DRDREW5. That`s 373-7395. We`ll do one more segment of this but with your calls. I want to hear what you want to know about this after this.



MAGNOTTA: Very dangerous, you know, I do have a lot of client horror stories. Ninety percent of the time, everyone is very respectful of me and treats me with dignity and, you know, I`m a nice person and if I`m nice to somebody, you know, have a good attitude, I expect that back.


MAGNOTTA: And there were some clients, you know, mostly the ones that are on, like, drugs, you know, alcoholic, drinking alcohol, can get very violent. But I know how to handle myself in that situation.


PINSKY: That is Luka Magnotta when he was an 18-year-old escort. Little distorted self-concept there. He`s nice man. Talking about his clientele there. And tonight, he`s a prisoner charged with murder who allegedly dismembered and sexually assaulted the body parts of his victim and then posted it online.

I`m joined with Pat Brown and Joe Warmington who stayed with me. Joe was doing the interview we just saw here. And Pat, of course, -- finally, Pat, we get to talk about a real psychopath. And when -- and all through the Casey Anthony thing --

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: You`re going to agree with --

PINSKY: Because all during the Casey Anthony thing, this is my idea of a psychopath. And Joe, you mentioned a couple times, Karla Homolka, which of you want to look -- my viewers want to look that up online, that`s a hair raising tale, not much different than this one, I got to say, in its own way.

And this guy interestingly, apparently. was preoccupied with that. I`m going to show you some footage where he`s talking about that. I`m going to show it right now. Here`s Joe -- I guess, Joe, you were talking to Luka about his alleged relationship which he claimed with Karla Homolka. Look.


LUKA ROCCO MAGNOTTA, MURDER SUSPECT: The rumors destroyed my life basically, and I`ve been receiving death threats. My address is posted. That`s why I had to move. I want my Pomeranian back. It was taken out of my SUV. (INAUDIBLE). My reputation`s completely ruined. I just want everybody -- I want to set the record straight that me and her have absolutely no connection.


PINSKY: Joe, what was that all about? He was alleging or people were alleging that he had a relationship with one of the most notorious Canadian serial killers of all time.

BROWN: He wanted attention --


PINSKY: Is this her we`re seeing on -- is this her on the screen here we`re looking at?


PINSKY: Yes. I guess, this is Karla Homolka, and she killed family members and everybody. Go ahead, Joe. tell me that story.

WARMINGTON: Well, she was involved with her husband and killing her own sister and two other young 14-year-old girls here. And the two later girls were both dismembered and put in cement and that kind of thing. And it was a case that shocked this country and it still probably until the killer colonel (ph) of this year, you know, the base commander at CFB Trenton who flew the queen and all that.

That was some big scandal, too. We`ve got some pretty scary people up here in Canada. And this guy, Magnotta, is right there with them now in terms of notoriety and disgust.

PINSKY: I don`t know, Pat. I thought the Americans were the screwy ones. I`m beginning to worry about our northern compatriots up there. I`m concern. That`s all I`m saying. Let`s take some call. All kidding aside. Let`s go to calls. Roxanne in Canada, go ahead.

ROXANNE, CANADA: Thanks for taking my call, Dr. Drew.

PINSKY: Hi, Roxanne. What`s up?

ROXANNE: We`re sickened and dismayed to the nth degree over this horrible scene of event, but my question for you is, 300,000 hits in four hours of the Canadian website that posted the video originally before anyone contacted the authorities. I had the misfortune of reading the comments on the website.

I didn`t view the video. I don`t want to. The comments are terrifying. There`s such a degree of glee and happiness and thrill from these young people watching the video. And I want to know where is the sickness coming from?

PINSKY: Wow! And Pat, my question to you then is, does that mean we have 300,000 potential young people that could act out like this? Is that what that`s telling us or is this just some depravity of a different nature?

BROWN: It is really frightening. And I`ve been harping on this for the longest time that what we give our children as food is how their health is built. What we give them physically, physical food builds their physical health. What we give them for mental food builds their mental health.

And once upon a time, when children were growing up, unless, you`re in a war zone or some other horrific societal situation, you were growing up in a house with a mommy and a daddy and you play with your puppy and you read nice books like Sally, Dick and Jane, and you got grew up maybe read some Nancy Drew, and you write a little, you know, Hardy Boys.

You didn`t see this kind of junk. And the television was also very nice. You saw musicals of Lawrence Welk. Now, young children, very young children are watching this kind of stuff. And it`s so -- the internet is so available. And you can see it in droves, not just one time. You can see it, as this woman is pointing out, you can just keep hitting the button.

You can watch hundreds and hundreds of different things, decapitations, beheadings, you know, hangings, people being raped and murdered, run over by buses and trains. I mean, it`s just ungodly what`s on these sites. But, it`s not going to make you a psychopath.

But if you`re already a person -- a young person with a personality disorder that is getting more and more hateful of society, you`re looking for a fantasy, you`re looking for a way to get back at society, now instead of becoming like a con artist, you get into this violent stop that you start watching over and over again and you start thinking, that`s cool.

Just like pornography, eventually you want to do what`s in those pornographic films. Many of these -- not going to say many of them -- some of these people will eventually want to do what`s in this stuff they`re watching on the gore sites. And I think it`s extremely dangerous. I think we need a society to stop this stuff.

PINSKY: Well, just think about this. While you were talking, Pat, I was thinking to myself, think how we sit in disdain of, say, roman classical times when tens of thousands of people witnessed horrible slaughter.

In that day, hundreds of thousands of people were infected with that virus of slaughter, and as you`re saying, they continue to watch other horrific things that are probably available to them right now.

Come on, guys. Let`s think about this. Hundreds, perhaps, millions of us are being exposed to that, and we sit in disdain of classical time when tens of thousands were exposed to awful things. Maybe, the internet is our new coliseum, and this is where the horrible slaughter is going on. I don`t know. Just tossing that out there.

Pat, thank you for being here today. And Joe, I`m going to give you a chance to give us any concluding thoughts because you really give us a lot to think about. I know this has rocked you. And I want to say thank you for coming here and talking about it.

WARMINGTON: Yes. It has affected a lot of people here, but, you know, Pat, it`s been great to listen to you as well. And Dr. Drew, this guy, he was following, in my view, the game, ripper, which is a video game starring actors like Christopher Walken.

His character`s name was Magnotta. And if you go through all of his personalities, he`s picked up things from movies, from "Basic Instinct," to "American Psycho," to "Catch Me If You Can." And so, I think Pat`s on to it. There`s been -- he`s followed pop culture. You know, he`s been playing a game for a while.

PINSKY: Well, this is no game. This is no game. Thank you, guys.

I`m taking more calls after the break. The rest of the show, call me now, 855-DrDrew5. I hope we`ll sort of broaden out the topics and other things on your mind. You may be flooding me with this topic. I`m ready to move on a little bit and talk about other things if you guys are. So, stay with us.


PINSKY: Wonder if my staff remembers me talking about jerk perverts. Jerk pervert name? Yes. Yes. Well, remember old Jerry Sandusky? Well, he`s in the news again. He is, of course, the Penn State football coach accused of pedophilia. He`s on trial now for child abuse. ABC reports tonight that he sent handwritten love letters, so to speak, to some of his victims.

We asked, what would you do if you found such a note to your child? We got a rapid response to that on Facebook.

Debbie writes, "If I found love letters to my child from a creep like this, I think I would end up in jail the same night I found them." Way to go.

Cathleen writes, "I`d call the police so my husband wouldn`t kill him."

Now, I`d take a call on this. Brenda in Pennsylvania. Brenda, you got a comment?


PINSKY: Hi, Brenda.

BRENDA: My comment is, you know, if one of my children ever came up to me with a letter, some kind of love letter from someone like that, I would go to the local police department --

PINSKY: Right.

BRENDA: -- and have the proper authorities take care of that.

PINSKY: Right. Any adult, any adult that is expressing any kind of - - any kind of intimate feeling towards a child, taken away right away. That`s it. Intervene fast. You don`t have to wait until they touch a child. Any inappropriate boundary violations, I`m with you. Do you have kids?

BRENDA: No, I don`t have any children, but I would go extremely to the local authorities. Police department --

PINSKY: I`m with you 100 percent.

BRENDA: And bypass all that other stuff.


PINSKY: OK. My previous callers -- my Facebook answers were going to bypass all of it and just go ahead and kill him, themselves, it seems like. I wouldn`t advise that either. Thank you for your call. Move on to other topics. I guess, I`ve got Desiree in New York. Desiree, what do you got?


PINSKY: Hi, Desiree.

DESIREE: My sister, we`re actually identical triplets, which is really weird, but she`s actually addicted to nail polish remover.

PINSKY: Hold on a second. Hold on. Like huffing it? She inhales it?

DESIREE: She huffs it, but she also drinks it.

PINSKY: Oh, my goodness! Wow! Oh, is that dangerous? OK. Is she taking other drugs, too?

DESIREE: Not that we know of. She -- but she does -- she smells it, she takes it with her everywhere. She even goes as far as drinking it because it`s not illegal, we don`t know what to do.

PINSKY: OK, but Desiree, here`s the deal. This is effectively an emergency. It`s a mental health emergency. Inhalants of this type, there are various different categories of inhalants that people get into.

I don`t really want to break them all down, but there are lots of household products that people can soak a towel and put a plastic bag and huff it, even gasoline, people use in computer cleaners, there`s propellants and there`s dissolving agents, there`s various things that people use, but pretty much, they all harbor the same potential risk.

First of all, they do make you high, that`s why people use them. But the risk is, they destroy the front part of your brain here, the part of your brain where your judgment and your reasoning and your ability to contain impulses occur. They also have been associated with sudden death. People get this sudden death, this huffing sudden death syndrome.

DESIREE: Right. I mean, because that`s what we`re afraid of. We`re afraid that she`s going to, like, just, I mean, especially drinking it.

PINSKY: Drinking it, I`ve never even dealt with that, I got to tell you. She`s just crossing to territory that even I haven`t been dealt with. I can just imagine the potential medical consequences of that. So, she needs to get to the medical system immediately.

I mean, she needs to be in a psychiatric hospital or rehab center or some place where she can be contained or whatever she`s done to herself can be managed. OK? Is that possible?

DESIREE: I mean, it`s possible, but we were just wondering how come it hasn`t affected me and my sister because we are identical --

PINSKY: It is -- you know, here`s what I bet. I`m not even sure it`s addiction. It may just be severe abuse. And I bet your sister had some kind of a trauma growing up that you guys aren`t aware of, and she`s been too ashamed to talk about. That`s my bet. It`s a great question because you are genetically identical.

And why the one with the wild outlined behavior? Usually, that`s because something tremendous happened from the environment, something really bad happened to her. So, please get her that help. OK? I got to go to the next call. I`ve got Janet in Kentucky -- Janet.


PINSKY: Hi, Janet.

JANET: I have a question. I was addicted to Oxycodone for, like, ten years or more.

PINSKY: Good times.

JANET: I`ve been off of it for like three years.

PINSKY: Say it again? What for three years?

JANET: Oxycodone.


JANET: And I`ve been off of it for about three years.

PINSKY: Three years. Got it. OK.

JANET: OK. But I dream a lot about having it to take.

PINSKY: Oh, hell yes you do. Your brain still wants it. It wants it like nothing else.

JANET: OK. Is that what it is? Because, like, you know, dream, like my purse tips over a whole bunch of pills fall out and I`m excited --

PINSKY: Of course you are, but then, if you use it in the dream, then what happens when you wake up?

JANET: I`ve never used it.

PINSKY: OK. You will one of these days -- I give you permission to use it in your dream because that`s sort of a rehearsal. And what happens when you wake up, you sound like you`re solidly OK now. When you wake up, you will feel guilt and shame and all the horrible things that you would feel if you --

JANET: If I actually did it.

PINSKY: And by the same token, particularly, with stimulants like cocaine and speed, but cocaine most classically, using dreams, people wake up, and they`re actually high -- have all the physiological effects.

JANET: Well, you know, I didn`t know through. It`s just where I had taken it so long and it was, you know, normal or probably crazy.

PINSKY: No. It is that motivational drive that`s still in your brain. It`s why drug addicts relapse, because your brain is still romancing and in love with and wants that back so much so that it consumes your dreams much the way other profound motivations consume -- people dream about having romantic liaisons, they dream about eating, and addicts dream about using.

And they`re OK. They`re rehearsals. They`re normal. And opiates just keep a deep grip on people for long periods of time, and don`t worry about it, OK?


PINSKY: All right. Well done.

JANET: Thank you.

PINSKY: Finally, Joe in Toronto. Joe, what do you got for me?

JOE, TORONTO: How are you doing, Dr. Drew?

PINSKY: Joe, I`m great. What`s up?

JOE: I need you, if you can, to clarify for me actions and behavior of a person that`s been diagnosed as bipolar type 1 and bipolar type 2?

PINSKY: Well, you`re either one or the other, but has she been manic?

JOE: Yes. Well, she was.

PINSKY: OK. So, she had manic episodes. Got it. And now, you want me to clarify and explain behaviors of a manic person.

JOE: Yes.

PINSKY: Hang on. Do you remember the guy that did the documentary, the Kony documentary, about the leader in Africa?

JOE: Yes, yes. Yes.

PINSKY: That was manic behavior. That was an acute manic episode. For sure. So, to try to explain that doesn`t make sense. Why don`t you hold on the line? Let me hear more about what`s going on with your wife, and we`ll try to break down what, in fact, you need to do.

Speaking of addictions, you can also be addicted to electronic devices like your cell phone. I guess, we`re taking a call about that next. Be right back.


PINSKY: OK. I`m continuing with my caller, Joe, who`s talking about his wife who has bipolar and mania. And we were comparing her to the Kony video of the gentleman down in San Diego in that acute bizarre manic episode that he had. That`s what mania is. That`s where it goes. What happened with your wife, Joe?

JOE: Well, you know, it started off with an accidental swinging situation with another couple who are very good friends of ours.

PINSKY: Just a quick poll in the room, anybody who`ve ever been in accidental swing? Just checking a quick poll. Come on. Come on, now.

JOE: Well, it actually was, but whatever, you know --

PINSKY: Whatever. All right. Whatever. OK. Go ahead. I got you.

JOE: Basically from then, it was, you know, she liked the excitement factor of it, so she started doing, you know, getting the hair all done up, the nails, the sun tanning, the going to the bars, to getting drunk --

PINSKY: So, you guys --

JOE: -- meeting guys.

PINSKY: OK. So, you guys were swinging with a couple you knew, is that right?

JOE: We weren`t swinging. It just happened one time, one time only.

PINSKY: I understand. One time, you were swinging with a couple you knew, accidentally. Somebody fell on top of somebody. I get it.

JOE: Yes, that`s right. Somebody fell off the swing.

PINSKY: All right. But then, it got more serious after that because then she started doing herself up and going out, and then, did she start acting out sexually with other men?

JOE: Oh, yes, yes, yes.

PINSKY: So, Joe --


PINSKY: All right. So, Joe, I suspect -- what was her explanation for what was going on?

JOE: She just -- she wanted to do it. She was having fun. She didn`t care. She was just going to town and doing all kinds of stuff she never did before.

PINSKY: All right. She wasn`t saying, I feel like I`m getting manicky, maybe my meds need adjusting, not know that kind of thing?

JOE: We had no idea about bipolar until after she was ready to crash and burn.

PINSKY: OK. So, is she on meds now?

JOE: No. She hasn`t been on meds -- she has an allergic reaction to every single kind of medicine they`re giving her. So --

PINSKY: All right. So, something`s got to be done for her bipolar. That`s number one. So, the manic behavior, they can be hypersexual, they can be a lot of verbiage and derailed thinking and bizarre behaviors and whatnot. But the other thing I think this is more of, this may be also in the realm of sexual addiction, my friend.

And this may have triggered that in some way. She may have been a trauma survivor and getting invocative situations. People start re- enacting their traumas. It`s a crazy thing that humans do. I would suggest you check out a website called SASH,, Read about this and get her to read about it as well, so she can understand some other things that are happening to her and what needs to be done about it.

I got to move on, my friend. Dave in California -- Dave.


PINSKY: Dave? What do you got?

DAVE: I got a question for you about -- systemically, I want to know your thoughts regarding using acupuncture to treat addiction.

PINSKY: I refer patients for acupuncture all the time for all sorts of things. Mostly pain related, I would say. And I know lots of people that have attempted to control addiction with acupuncture and all kinds of things, but the fact is none of those easier, kinder ways work. It`s really like trying to rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic.

I`m sure it`s not -- doesn`t hurt anything. It might be a little helpful, but it does not replace real, intensive, primary, long-term, highly structured daily treatment. More of your calls and questions after the break.


PINSKY: All right. Let`s get to your calls again. Julie in Massachusetts -- Julie.


PINSKY: Hi, Julie.

JULIE: I was just wondering if you could just summarize the general impacts of marijuana on the human body? I know people tend to downplay it.

PINSKY: You know, I`m not sure I can do that in any kind of simplistic way, because the effects are protean and complex. They affect the cannabinoid system, the so-called (INAUDIBLE) system. And there are two major receptors, the CB1 and CB2 receptors. Already, I`m losing viewers just talking about this.

People have differing quantities and regions of these particular receptors in the brain. Some cause euphoria, some people get more euphoria than others, some people get more anxiety than others. It can affect the gut. It can affect all parts of the body. The people have concern that it may be associated with lung disorders, chronic bronchitis, most particularly, and even lung cancers.

Doesn`t seem to cause heart disease, so people are worried about that as well. That`s the shortest hand explanation I can give you, and it does cause addiction in some people.

Lorrie in California.


PINSKY: Hi, Lorrie.

LORRIE: I`m on a reality TV show, "The Swan" season 2, the cosmetic surgery makeover show.

PINSKY: Yes. Yes. Interesting.

LORRIE: Yes. I was wondering if reality TV syndrome exists because since the show, I`ve gone totally downhill with my weight, with my emotional -- with my emotions, like, I take meds every day. I don`t shower (ph) or any other hygienic kind of stuff.

PINSKY: Lorrie, that is a fascinating question. In fact, I may want my producers to keep in touch with you so we can sort of mind this a little further, maybe do a little exploration of other people that have been on reality shows and what happens after shows, because I`ve wanted to actually do another show where we go out and talk to people whose lives have been affected by being in a reality show.

I was in some consulting back in the day on "Big Brother 1." And I remember all those -- a lot of people left their homes and came out from the Midwest and ended up like ruining their lives. I really wonder if there is something like this, Lorrie, and it`s not been well studied. People -- I know I`m concerned, particularly, those reality shows that are not sort of therapeutically based and give you an ongoing plan.

VH1, the organization I work with, has been very good about making sure people get after care, and that it`s all therapeutically oriented. I don`t know if anyone obviously really gives you that support after you`re done. I`m so sorry to hear that your struggling.

I do have to go to break. I want to thank you all for watching. Stay with us my dear Lorrie, we`ll call you back. And, let you know that Nancy Grace starts right now.