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Heroin Kills Young, Smart, Mostly White Suburban Kids; Alec Baldwin Calling for Privacy Law to Be Revised;

Aired June 23, 2012 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


DON LEMON, CNN HOST: Hello everyone. I'm Don Lemon. The stories you're talking about in a moment on CNN. But first, let's get you up to speed on some of the day's headlines.

Tropical storm Debby already kicking up the surf on Sanibel Island on the west coast of Florida. Debby is turning in the central gulf and generating 50 miles an hour winds. Tropical storm warnings since across parts of Louisiana coast as Debby slowly moves west. It is expected, though, to intensify. We will keep on watch on that.

Former Penn State assistant football coach Jerry Sandusky could be sentenced in about 90 days. He is under suicide watch in Pennsylvania center county jail after being convicted on 45 counts of child sex abuse. His wife, Dotty, was spotted around noon delivering a package to her husband.

Gusty winds and 200 foot high planes are forcing Colorado residents from their homes. Fire crews are warning of the extreme fire condition and for the potential for the Hyde Park fire to rapidly grow. Number of acres burned has now jumped to 75,000.

Mitt Romney is fund-raising in Park City, Utah, this weekend. Several potential Romney running mates are also attending the weekend retreat for Republican donors including Wisconsin's Congressman Paul Ryan, South Dakota Senator John Thune, and Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal.

Here is what else we are working on for you on CNN Saturday night.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON (voice-over): It's 10:00 p.m. Do you know where your children are?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She was a good girl.

LEMON: An old drug back with a new and deadly vengeance hooking and killing young, smart, and mostly white suburban kids.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You're either going to be behind bars or you're going to be dead.

LEMON: Tonight, parents who lost their children and a young recovering addict speak directly to you about the new face of heroin. Parental justice --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Deadly force is authorized and justified.

LEMON: A father kills his 4-year-old doubt's molester.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I would do the same time ten times worst if (INAUDIBLE) to my kids.

LEMON: A couple accused of killing their daughter's pimp by playing judge, jury --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the execution all at once.

LEMON: How far should you do if someone is molesting your child are selling them for sex?

That and George Zimmerman.

GEORGE ZIMMERMAN, SHOT TRAYVON MARTIN: (INAUDIBLE).

LEMON: Alec Baldwin --

ALEC BALDWIN, ACTOR: They want you to pick your nose and get that shot.

LEMON: And America's newest anchorman.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From New York City, I'll will.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: All right. So, listen. I really want you to sit down, take a seat, and listen to this. It could save someone's life that you know or love. It is no longer hiding in the shadows of seedy downtown alleyways.

Heroin has a new home, bringing hits highly addictive and often deadly power to the white picket trees streets in Suburbia. Here's just some fact for you folks.

The average age that kids start using heroin just before their 15th birthday! And most of them are white. And more of them prefer to shoot it up than taking it any other way. Why the increase here? It's cheaper than pills.

Drug agents say the crack down on Oxycodone and other pain pills had made pills way more expensive to users, 20 to 80 bucks a pill. Heroin way cheaper and more plentiful and now, way more popular. And two people who know that painfully well is John Roberts and Pam Anderson, both parents who separately lost their sons to overdoses of heroin.

And Mr. Roberts, thank you for joining us. Miss Anderson, thank you so much for joining us. We are going to start with you, Mr. Roberts. You're a retired Chicago police captain. You move to the suburbs for a better life for you and your family and your son Billy fell into drugs. Tell us what happened.

JOHN ROBERT, TEEN SON DIED OF HEROIN OVERDOSE: Shortly after we moved, Billy had just graduated from grade school and started into high school and like a lot of kids in America, that's where they are going to be introduced to drugs and be tempted and to maybe drug experimentation. And, unfortunately, Billy making new friends in a new community, it seemed like he got in with the wrong crowd.

By and large, Don, the drugs are out there and in a lot of communities. I moved out to a beautiful suburb. I can see a farm from my back deck. This is a really nice area. And after 33 years in the streets of Chicago as a police officer, I never expected to find heroin. But why do I do what I do now? It's all over the counties, the counties of Chicago and many of our major cities.

LEMON: And you know, the reason I say that is because most people when they say you think about drugs and you think about heroin. You think about rock stars or inner city urban areas and not the case anymore.

Pam, I let you tell me about your son, Matthew. He started taking pills as a student at UGA and then it went to heroin.

PAM ANDERSON, LOST SON TO HEROIN OVERDOSE: Yes. He started in his between his sophomore and junior year he with some orally taking pills and then moved to snorting and then, -- because it doesn't give you the same high. You have to keep jacking it up and jacking it up. And then, he moved into the intravenous and that's when we found out about it and pulled him out of school.

LEMON: And did you hear when I said most kids start to take -- the kids who do start to take heroin before their 15th birthday because it's so easily accessible? They can get that faster than a pack of cigarettes?

ANDERSON: Yes, they can. It's everywhere. In the college campuses what they are doing with it is like they are just passing bowls of pills and the pushers, if I can use that word.

LEMON: Of course.

ANDERSON: They give it out for free to get somebody hooked and then they start with a lower price on the pills and jack it up, jack it up as they are more addicted.

LEMON: Yes. And many people will start, Mr. Roberts, with starting to take Oxycodone or take pills. It goes from prescription pills because the prescription pills become too expensive for them, and so, they go to heroin because heroin is cheaper and start shooting it.

And of course, once you start to use heroin, it's not just addictive, you don't want that hot, your body needs that. And so, they are hooked and they are going to have an issue the rest of their lives. And at the beginning of this show, as we said, either you're going to end up dead or in jail most times.

ROBERTS: That's true. The problem is that there's the -- a lot of drugs out there. Not all of them -- in fact, I don't believe so much in the gateway theory. But I do believe one gateway drug is the painkiller, prescription painkillers. They are opiate based drugs. Kids can get those in most at the medicine cabins in our country.

Mom and dad, you have - you got a prescription. You don't use them all. You leave them there in case you need them. Our kids are going in there and getting them and you are exactly correct. They go out and they want more and try it again.

But they are already building a dependency and a tolerance for the opiate based drug but when they find they can I don't heroin and it's much cheaper, 10 dollars a bag.

Here in Chicago, a suburban taking drive into the west side of the city of Chicago and buy a bag of heroin for $10 and they are preferred customers. When they see incoming, they will offer them, it's called a jab. A jab is ten bags for a hundred and they give them a baker's dozen to bring them back. Don't give them 12 to 13 bags for a hundred dollars and then that goes back out to the suburbs. So, that's one of the reasons why this epidemic is spreading through all of our collar counties. Is it --?

LEMON: Go ahead.

ANDERSON: It's even chirp here in Atlanta. I've heard as low as $7 a bag.

LEMON: Yes. There's a place here I've been reading called the bluffs where they - and there is even a documentary and then many -- a number of documentaries have been written about the bluffs where the kids from the suburbs go into the bluffs and they buy these bags and they know when they see these young affluent looking kids, white kids coming in, they know what they are there for.

ANDERSON: And they drive in, in their cars.

LEMON: Telltale signs?

ANDERSON: Telltale signs are things like they start missing their appointments, they cancel things. They are sleeping a lot. When they are beginning to come down from the high, they seem like they have a cold. They get the feverish, lots of sweating, very cranky, and raspy because of the heroin affects the respiratory system.

LEMON: I was talking to Mrs., you know, just little signs. I was talking to a friend last night and asking him about it who -- a friend another producer here and he said I never -- I thought maybe one of my friends might be addicted because they do heroin addicts do a clicking thing with their jaw. Have you ever had that? ANDERSON: My son didn't do that but I've heard people talk about they do this thing with their head.

LEMON: Yes. OK.

So, I want to talk about how to help. Of course, Officer Roberts, having the talk with your kids that is important, and you have to be practical about it.

I want you to tell me about that and also I want you tell about your organization called hero because you dedicated your life now that you retired to helping kids fight these demons and fight drug.

ROBERTS: And, you know, parents have to talk to their children. And we do. I was a very good parent. But you know what? We have to know how to do that. It's like having a sex education talk. Parent grew the day we have to do it but at the same time we know we have to. And parents can learn how to do that.

Here in Chicago, I work with an organization called the Robert Crown Center for Health Education and they are famous. Over 50 years teaching kids sex occasion. I'm working with them now. And this battle - but, you know, one of the things we are trying to do, we are going to develop a curriculum for the kids but also for the faculty and administrators of the schools and pilot testing it this fall.

But, most importantly, as importantly, we are going to be teaching the parents how to talk to their kids about the dangers of the drugs that are out there in our society today.

LEMON: And Mr. Roberts, if you can do me a favor. I know have you a hat for your show. Your hat and tell me your organization, if there's a Website, we would like our viewers to know that.

ROBERTS: Don, I really appreciate this. I mean, I will devote the rest of my days until I'm with Billy to fighting with hero, Heroin Epidemic Relief Organization. But our rally cry as the name implies, be a hero. The only way that we are ever going to win this battle is for people -- I'm just a dad, a grieving dad, but I'm finding ways to get out there and fight back and do something about it. I'm fighting for drug education and fighting for prevention.

Bit hero does that and for everybody, and, Don, like you, and for the woman sitting there with you who is not afraid to come out and talk about this, that's what this means. You're a hero. You're helping us fight back and until and unless we start pushing back, we're never going to win this war on drugs.

LEMON: We want to tell you that Matthew is 22 years old, Pam's son, Billy, just 19 years old when he died.

Thank you very much, John. Thank you, Pam. You're very brave to come on.

ANDERSON: Thank you.

LEMON: All right.

ANDERSON: Appreciate it.

LEMON: You're welcome.

ROBERTS: Thank you, Don. God bless.

LEMON: You too as well.

He could be your son or the boy next door hooked on heroin and you would never suspect it. You're going to meet him next.

Plus this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Parental justice. Mom and Dad accused of killing their children's molesters in pimp.

ANDERSON: I think he deserved everything he got.

LEMON: What would you do?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: That was Black Crows and song about drug addiction. Very appropriate for our discussion tonight especially when you take a look at this map. All the states you see in red, 32 of them, has an increase in heroin related patients between 1999 and 2009.

And just this week, Houston police made their largest heroin bust ever, 17 kilos found stashed inside a car and unheard of in their parts. And part of the reason it's becoming so popular, it is way cheaper than pills and offering much of the same high to users at a fraction of the cost.

So, who would know that better? No one would than Bill Patrianakos who started on pills. It got so expensive that he moved on. He switched to heroin.

So, Bill says he is clean now. He is sober and has been for four years. So, congratulations on that. We hope you stay clean and sober! What caused you to pull yourself away from heroin?

BILL PATRIANAKOS, RECOVERING FROM HEROIN ADDICTION: To pull away from it?

LEMON: Yes.

PATRIANAKOS: You know no addict really wants to stay on. But at a certain point, your life gets to a point where it becomes so unmanageable, so terrible that you have to do something. And my life, like all addicts, got that point. LEMON: OK. Tell us about that. And as you talk to us about your story, we are going to show pictures of you sober and then pictures of while you were using heroin. Your parents knew that you were using drugs but that didn't stop you. And again, you started like most people start. You started with a painkiller and doing recreational drugs and then you moved into this because it's cheaper.

PATRIANAKOS: Right. Absolutely. You know, I started innocently enough with a little bit of marijuana. It seemed harmless at the time, moved down to pills. And then, the addiction set in and I wasn't even aware of it. And everyone else around me knew it was going on but before I even did it.

There was a lot of denial. There was a lot of delusion and it took a very long time before I could finally admit that I had a problem and that was when I could finally start asking for some help. So, yes, my parents knew and did their best to try to stop me but there was nothing was going to.

LEMON: How did you get it your first time?

PATRIANAKOS: I had a friend of mine and we were -- one of our, you know, normal nightly, you know, smoking runs, a little marijuana. And this one particular night, he had a little treat for me and it was a pill, box of oxycontin. And I tried it and loved it. I didn't just like it, I loved it. And from that point on, I was asking for more and more until I was, not only I was physically and mentally dependent on it.

LEMON: And dependent on oxycontin. And when you couldn't - oxycontin became too expensive for you.

PATRIANAKOS: Yes. Yes. At that point, I started to, you know, I was pawning things, stealing from my parents, my sister. You know, everyone who cared about me, you know, I could have turned them into enemies. I was doing whatever I could to get money to pay for it but even that wasn't enough and so I decided to move on to heroin because I heard it was cheaper.

LEMON: And it gave you the same high?

PATRIANAKOS: Absolutely at a lower cost.

LEMON: At a lower cost. How long did you use it?

PATRIANAKOS: About half the time that I did opiate was heroin. And yes, started out with snorting and, of course, to be -- to conserve my money, I moved on to shooting it.

LEMON: What do you say to kids who are watching or parents who are watching because, you know, heroin is, you know, it's been around for a long time and there -- it's been used among suburban teens, mostly white kids, since the '90s. But what they are seeing now, so many people dying now and the use of it has just increased over the last couple of years. What do you say to parents and what do you say to people out there, anything you want to say to them about using heroin or about heroin?

PATRIANAKOS: Well, to parents, I would say, you know, know your child, talk to your child, don't rely on schools to do it. Lots of parents think they are just going to get caught in health class about drugs and their kids know better. Look for the signs. Look for -- if you think something is off with your kid, you know your child best and you should confront them about it.

And to kids out there, students, teens, whoever is in that range starting to use, I would tell them, you are the rule, not the exception. Before people start, they believe that they are the exception. They are going the ones -- they are too smart to become addicted. They know about addiction so that insulates them from becoming addicted. No, if you start this, you will end up in a bad place.

LEMON: Hear that, kids? You'll end up in a bad place. Every day, it's a struggle, right?

PATRIANAKOS: You know, at first, it's a struggle. I mean, at this point, I put it behind me and I'm doing very well. But for a very long time, it was a struggle. I mean, you don't get clean overnight.

LEMON: Yes. Thank you very much, Bill.

And just real quick, thank you and good luck to you. What is the name of your organization?

ANDERSON: Matthew's fund.

LEMON: Matthew's fund. It's online?

ANDERSON: Yes. Beatingthedemonsofdrugs.com.

LEMON: Thank you.

ANDERSON: Thank you.

LEMON: Appreciate you. Thanks to Bill and thanks to Pam and all of my guests.

Next, parents are risking prison to avenge crime against their children, the newest form of vigilante justice.

Plus this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: From vigilante justice to citizen justice. George Zimmerman, on killing Trayvon Martin in his own words.

ZIMMERMAN: I felt his arm going down to my side and I grabbed it and I just grabbed my firearm.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Imagine losing your daughter to a live of prostitution. You reach out to police. You do everything you can to get your daughter back. But when that doesn't work, what would you do? Well, according to San Francisco prosecutors for one mother and father, it meant killing the girl's pimp.

Here is CNN's Dan Simon.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): She was a 17-year-old run-away leaving the bay area behind for Los Angeles and lured into a life of prostitution. Her parents tried to rescue her. But, according to prosecutors, when those efforts failed, they devised another plan, to kill her alleged pimp, a 22-year-olf from the rough street of Trump ton (ph) Calvin Snead.

Barry Gilton and Lupe Mercado are in jail, under $2 million bond charged with his murder.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: That was CNN's Dan Simon reporting.

So, how far should parents go to protect their child and is what these California parents allegedly did a surprise? This comes days after a father in rural Texas beat a man to death after he discovered the man allegedly molesting his young daughter. A grand jury chose not to indict him.

Criminal defense attorney Holly Hughes is here along with law enforcement expert Alex Manning.

So Holly, to you first. What do you make of these parents taking the law into their own hands? I mean, would a jury convict any of these people for doing this?

HOLLY HUGHES, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Here is the thing. I get it. But let's be real clear. These two situations are very, very different. The little girl was currently being molested when the father walked into the barn. He heard her screaming, Don. I mean, there is a man in the middle of molesting her. So, he pulls that man off and he reacted in a way to get him to stop, beats him. That is not vigilante justice. That's interrupting a crime. That's saving your child's life. Big difference when you go out hunting for somebody.

LEMON: The California couples lawyer spoke out. Listen to this.

HUGHES: OK. Great.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ERIC SAFIRE, ATTORNEY: They were faced with every parent's nightmare and they tried their best to protect their daughter and here they are getting arrested. It's very overwhelming.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Alex, every case is different, but can you blame these parents? They say they went to police and got no results.

ALEX MANNING, LAW ENFORCEMENT EXPERT: Don, I can tell you, I myself and my old partner investigator Greg Franklin ran into the same situation and we had something like this. We would in the office; parents were at our doorsteps waiting on us. Why did you go home? Why did you go to lunch? Why did you sleep? You have to keep going at these people. Go up the chain of command. Get somebody to listen to you. Don't take the law into your own hands.

LEMON: Holly, are there laws in place to protect parents in these types of scenarios?

HUGHES: There really aren't. They are subject to the laws of everybody else. They went out there. They committed a crime. If the prosecutor can prove they intended to do it and they did it in fact. Because right now, these are just charges, they are allegations. The parents haven't been convicted of anything.

And Don, while we all get that gut reaction, we all understand why they did it, why they wanted to do it, if, in fact, they are guilty of it, but here's the thing. God forbid an innocent person be in the way when they are out there on the street firing a gun. God forbid they get the wrong guy.

LEMON: Right.

HUGHES: If they were just wrong about the pimp.

LEMON: They end up going to jail for a long time.

HUGHES: Scary stuff. They can't do it.

LEMON: It is a line between vigilante justice and citizen justice starting to blur, Alex?

MANNING: Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think it's a sign of the times. You just did your spot on heroin. It's the sign of the times. Now, this girl out in California could lose her two parents to jail. So, the situation is better she is off the street, and now she will lose her two parents.

LEMON: All right. Alex, Holly, thank you both very much.

We are going to tell about this now, from vigilante justice to someone accused of taking law into his own hands, never before seen video and audio released by George Zimmerman's defense team. He describes moments just before he shot and killed Florida teen, Trayvon Martin on February 26th. In one tape, Zimmerman re-enactments a shooting for police.

George Zimmerman now, on his own words.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ZIMMERMAN: He put his hands on his nose - no, on my nose, other hand on my mouth. He said shut the (bleep) up. And then I tried squirming again because all I could think when he is hitting my head against it; I felt it was going to explode and I thought I was going to lose consciousness.

So, I tried to squirm so that I could get because he only had a small portion of my head on the concrete so I tried to squirm off the concrete. That's when my jacket moved up and I had my firearm on my right side hip. My jacket moved up. And he saw it. I feel like he saw it, looked at it. He said you're going to die tonight (bleep).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Fast and furious. The parents of a border guard killed in the botch gun running operation with strong and emotional words for the president and the attorney general.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right. Welcome back everyone.

We are going to talk some politics because CNN contributors Ana Navarro and Maria Cardona are here to talk about fast and furious. That botched ATF gun walking operation that led to the deaths of hundreds of Mexican and U.S. border agent Brian Terry in 2010.

And unprecedented move just this week, a House committee voted along party lines to hold Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress. Republicans say Holder is lying and withholding details of who and what allowed criminals to get the weapons. But Democrats insist there is a legal principle involved and that Republicans are on a political witch-hunt.

So, the president stepped in and invoked executive privilege on not turning over certain documents.

Maria, this is the first time that the Obama, that President Obama has ever evoked this executive privilege. Why do it now when he says we're going to be the most transparent administration ever?

MARIA CARDONA, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, first of all, let's be clear as to what the justice department and the White House have turned over thus far. They have over bent backwards, Don, and accommodating the committee and what they were asking for. Almost 8,000 pages in documents and a lot of them were even including deliberative documents which you know, Don, are normally covered by executive privilege, but in good faith turned over those documents. Every single document that had anything to do with the botched operation has been turned over to congress.

What they are asking for now all of the documents in question have nothing to do with the actual operation. They are now in the surreal territory of investigating the investigation. That is not going to lead to the truth. We need the truth. They are on a political witch-hunt here.

LEMON: So, you're saying this is a political witch-hunt which many Democrats have said.

Anna, do you buy that, that all of the documents have been turned over and that this is a political witch-hunt?

ANA NAVARRO, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: You know, God forbid, we investigate the investigators in government because all know that government investigations when they investigate themselves can be terribly effective.

I think that, Don, we are a government of checks and balances. Congress checks the executive branch. The executive branch checks Congress and the judicial branch checks them both. And I think this is what this process is. This is not the first time this happens.

It is disappointing that our Congress and our executive branch can't get together in a way that can clarify this once and for all. I think the timing is very bad for Obama because it comes right on the heels of the White House leaks and his refusal to allow a general counsel.

So it kind of builds on this narrative that they have something to hide and the words of the murdered agent's parents is very powerful. We are talking about a murder of a U.S. agent.

LEMON: Anna, stand by. Not to cut you off but the reason I'm stopping you here, because I want to hear from them. Here is what the parents of agent Brian Terry said on FOX News about the answers they say they aren't getting from the administration. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEN TERRY, BRIAN TERRY'S FATHER: Already asked their selves to search their souls and also I ask the people in Mexico who murdered with them same guns who killed my son.

JOSEPHINE TERRY, BRIAN TERRY'S MOTHER: And I think that they are bringing all these stuff because they want to put fast and furious on the back burner until the election is over.

KEN TERRY: I do too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, you have two parents there who lost their son. That is the emotional part of this. And so, again, I'm going to -- I'll talk to you in a second, Maria.

But I want Ana to finish her thought because she was talking about these parents. The parents are very emotional. If I lost my child or my parents lost me, they would demand some answers.

NAVARRO: They are very compelling. It's heart-wrenching to see those parents talking about their dead son, the dead son who died in the service of this nation.

I think we owe it to them to his memory, to come to some sort of agreement where Congress can take a look at these documents where -- there's got to be some sort of agreement where maybe a few people are allowed to look at the documents, maybe not the full committee. I don't know.

But I would like to think that for the sake of those parents, for the sake of transparency, for the sake of all the people that died as part of fast and furious, we could come to an agreement and not be in this stalemate where each side is in their own trench and scoring political points.

LEMON: OK. Maria, I'm going to let you get in here. But I want you to listen to another comment from Brian Terry's mom on FOX describing her reaction to Attorney General Holder's testimony before Congress. Listen.

CARDONA: Sure.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSEPHINE TERRY: And after awhile, when you feel like throwing the TV through the front window because you get tired of hearing the constant lies that you know they are doing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK. So, again, you have two parents who are sitting here watching all of this going on. And I understand executive privilege. I get the legal arguments here.

But, Maria, why not give this family some peace of mind in some way or can that even come from even if this process played out and they turned over all of the documents?

CARDONA: I think that is exactly the question, Don. And let me just say, my heart goes out to these parents and I'm sure all Americans hearts go out to these parents. I used to work with the former IMF with the border patrol, so I know what dedicated public servant of border patrol agents are. So, my heart goes out to them.

But here is where I think is the reason why Democrats believe this is a political witch-hunt. If the Republicans really wanted to get to the bottom of this, Don, what has really struck me is that why don't they bring in the actual ATF agents who were involved in this gun-walking operation? And let's remember, this was an operation and a tactic that was started under the Bush administration and this administration ended it when they realized how botched and backwards it was.

LEMON: OK.

CARDONA: And so let's bring in the ATF agents who were actually involved in this and let's get to the bottom of this. We owe Brian Terry's parents the truth.

LEMON: OK. But, let me just say this. That fast and furious was not started under the Bush administration. Fast and furious was started under the Obama administration. Now the gun walking program --

CARDONA: The tactic was. That's why I said tactic.

LEMON: But anyway. And none of them have been successful starting with the Bush administration to the Obama administration.

CARDONA: And that is why they ended it.

LEMON: And listen. I want to say in full transparency, President Obama, it is his first time invoking executive privilege. George W. Bush did it six times in eight years. His father only once in eight years and there had been other presidents, Bill Clinton and Reagan who have invoked executive privilege.

Thank you, guys. OK. But, we are not done with you because you both are in Orlando. Both the president and governor Romney were at that big, very big Latino elected officials conference.

And Ana, you tweeted out this picture because they took your knives and forks away. You have to explain that next!

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: CNN's contributors Ana Navarro and Maria Cardona are back and they are talking immigration. And I said, you guys, you can get fired if you want. They said, come on, Don, we are both Latino, of course, we will do.

You both had the NALEO, the National Association of Latino Elected Officials this week and so were the president and Mitt Romney. Here is Romney addressing the president' recent shift on immigration laws.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Some people have asked if I will let stand the president's executive order. The answer is that I will put in place my own long-term solution that will replace and supersede the president's temporary measure.

As president, I won't settle for stopgap measures. I'll work with Republicans and Democrats to build a long-term solution.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: So, I just have to ask you, Ana, you were there. You're a Republican conservative. How was he received considering his stance, what his stance has been on immigration and also what it's been on the dream act?

NAVARRO: He was received politely. He was received civilly, courteously. They paid wrap attention to him, listened to his every word. But certainly he was not in a friendly crowd and he wasn't in his element. So, you know, I'd give him a lot of credit for showing up and I think the audience there gave him a lot of credit for showing up. They sure didn't give him love.

LEMON: Yes. Do you think it's a done deal for him when it comes to -- I don't think Latino voters are monolithic. But because of this issue there, inspires fashion. Do you think that he can win over more Latino voters in this contest before Election Day, Ana?

NAVARRO: You know, I don't know if he can, but I know he is going to die trying and I know he can give up on this. I think it's in the best interests of Latinos for us to be heavily courted by both candidate and both parties.

LEMON: Will Rubio help?

NAVARRO: I think Rubio, you know, everybody -- Rubio was actually at the conference as well. It was not a friendly conference for Rubio or for Jeb Bush both who were also at the conference.

LEMON: It wasn't a friendly conference for Rubio, you said, who is Cuban?

NAVARRO: Well, it was a predominantly Democrat crowd. The breakdown of Democrat to Republican, Latino elected officials is about 90 to 10.

LEMON: I got it.

NAVARRO: Probably more Republicans in this audience because it was in Orlando, were in Florida.

LEMON: I got to move on. I get what you're saying, just for the sake of time. I'm sorry.

NAVARRO: But I would like to tell you, though, is that Rubio changed minds and changed perceptions there and I think even Maria would agree with that.

LEMON: President Obama defended his immigration shift again. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They are Americans. In their hearts, in their minds, they are Americans through and through. In every single way but on paper and all they want is to go to college and give back to the country they love. (APPLAUSE)

OBAMA: So lifting the shadow of deportation and giving them a reason to hope, that was the right thing to do! It was the right thing to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: All right, Maria. I'm just listening to the crowd. I wasn't there. He was received very well, wasn't he?

CARDONA: Very, very well, Don. And it was a very friendly crowd.

But let's speak truth here. There were some challenges for the president up until now in terms of really proving to the Latino community that he was trying to work on changes to the immigration system.

So I give him a lot of credit for putting together this policy and whether you think that it was for political purposes or not, he was trying to do the right thing and has been trying for quite a long time which is why it rings so shallow when Romney basically blames him for stopgap measure instead of a permanent solution when he knows it's his own party that has stopped this president from gaining the permanent solution which is either comprehensive immigration reform or the dream act. He pushed the dream act in 2010 and Republicans blocked it.

LEMON: So Maria, I know you didn't get equal time here. Pardon me for that. But I just want to get the questions in to Ana. And Ana, watch is very quickly, because we showed that picture. Why did they take the knives and forks away when the president showed up?

NAVARRO: You know, I don't know. It was mostly Democrat crowd. I think the sharp knives were out for Mitt Romney but not Barack Obama. But I think, a security measure, I've never will that happen to me. And they should know that Latinos -- they not give up their food very easily. We are not going to need out forks or knives to go against anybody. We don't -- nothing gets in between us and our food. So next time, folks, at least give us a tortilla.

CARDONA: I don't think they had knives there for Romney either.

LEMON: Thank you, guys. That was very good. We appreciate.

CARDONA: Thanks, Don.

LEMON: We appreciate your passion. All right?

NAVARRO: Thank you.

LEMON: Alec Baldwin says he is tired of the all paparazzi.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Most of the paparazzi have their foot out to trip you. They want you to fall on the ground. They want to get that shot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: He wants privacy laws changed and suggests a type of buffer zone for actors. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Alec Baldwin wants everyone to keep back. Baldwin says a photographer nearly hit him with his camera this past week. Some photographer says Baldwin attacked him.

Our culture commentator Conor Knighton is back with this. And Conor, he wants a law change. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Most of the paparazzi have their foot out to trip you. They want you to fall on the ground and they want to get that shot. They want you to pick your nose and get that shot. It really is something that has become a menace.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What is the answer? Tougher privacy laws like they have in France or whatever?

BALDWIN: Yes, I think so. I think people have to get away.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So Connor, Alec Baldwin doesn't want you or me or anyone else coming a hundred feet within him.

CONOR KNIGHTON, POP CULTURE CRITIC: I don't think to get 500 feet within him. He terrifies me.

(LAUGHTER)

KNIGHTON: No. In this situation, he's a great actor. He has got a famous quick temper. He says he was provoked. The guy obviously, says that he punched him. In terms of a law though, it is just -- legally that's a difficult thing to enact especially in New York city so I don't know if he is going to have much luck in that arena.

LEMON: So, you know, the old saying is like it would -- you should be worried when they stop talking about you. So, why do you think it's so hard for many people to feel bad for the stars when they complain about these things?

KNIGHTON: Well, because for every Alec Baldwin who I believe legitimately wants his privacy, you have a star who goes to the beach in a tiny bikini and calls the paparazzi or they release their own sex tape. And so, it's this game that so many celebrities play that it's become sort of a part of how the industry works. So, for him to say that you need to make appointments with the press, it almost sounds like a quaint idea in 2012. LEMON: All right. Let's move on now and take a look at this. This weekend network newsroom gets a TV drama treatment, the new HBO series called newsroom debut on Sunday. Now, some critics have already panned it.

But Connor, will people want to watch a TV show about TV news videos? Watch TV news?

KNIGHTON: Well, as you and I both know, it's hard enough to get people to watch the normal TV news much less the fictional TV news. But it's a show about characters and relationships. Nobody watches the office because they like paper companies. Nobody watches madmen because they like advertising. So, if Aaron Sorkin can make an interesting dynamic between those characters, then I think that is all that matters.

LEMON: OK. So, here is Sorkin talking about his show where he identifies the real antagonist, the bad guy. Take a listen from Piers Morgan.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AARON SORKIN, PRODUCER, HBO'S THE NEWSROOM: It doesn't come so much in the form of a person although that is the role Jane Fonda plays and that Chris Messina plays. It's ratings that if we have a problem in this country with the news. It's at least as much the consumer's fault as it is the provider's fault.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KNIGHTON: So Conor, if you don't like the news, the problem is you. Do you think he's right?

KNIGHTON: Me specifically? The problem is me? And but there is something to that and with all entertainment. People say they hate the Kardashians and five million people watch their show.

And so, while everyone might want very smart, intelligent news, oftentimes the show is to get the best ratings aren't that. And so, it's certainly part of the consumer's fault and it also takes some bravery on the producer's part to say, you know what, we are going to give the people something they might not have said they want but we think they should have. And I think they are going to do well.

LEMON: And especially in the news lately, if the news doesn't identify your feelings or your beliefs or reinforce your belief then, people don't watch it. They - most people don't want objective news anymore. At least the ratings are showing that. Pretty sad.

KNIGHTON: It is. And you know, I'm one of those people it feels old fashioned but what I still want and I think this show and he said he is a fiction writer, it's idealized. But, maybe the news we all would like that.

LEMON: Thank you, Conor. Appreciate it.

KNIGHTON: Thank you.

LEMON: Ahead, farewell to a friend.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

T. JACKSON KAGURI, COMMUNITY CRUSADER: In Uganda, HIV/AIDS came striking like a machete in a cornfield. Killing men and women, living 1.2 million children orphaned. The grandmother stepped in and closed that gap. Some of them have up to 14 children to raise.

I was born and raised in Nyaka village. I moved to America. I went to Columbia University. I came to visit. I looked in the eyes of women who carried me a child and said now is the time to give back.

I am T. Jackson Kaguri. Nyaka AIDS Orphans project.

Who is happy this morning?

We started with $5,000 that my wife and I had saved for a house. We provide free education to children who are orphaned by HIV/AIDS. We provide them uniforms, health care, the library, clean water and we started giving them meals.

We teach the grandmothers the skills so they can support themselves. Eleven years later, this project has produced close to 600 students and helps about 7,000 grandmothers.

I feel humbled looking in the faces of the children smiling, focused on what their dreams are going to be.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Before we go, our CNN colleague and friend Daniel Funk passed away Wednesday. Daniel was one of the kindest people you would ever want to meet. He was tech expert here, never lost his cool even when we asked him some pretty silly questions like why isn't my computer working? He would just walk over and press the power button and smile at us.

Daniel grew up in McDonough, Georgia, a huge falcons fan and was quite a snappy dresser. I should say. Our thoughts and prayers go out to his family and love ones. Daniel was only 29-years-old.

We miss you already.

Good night.