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Missing Baby Gabriel`s Mom on Trial; Lohan Arrested

Aired September 19, 2012 - 19:00   ET



JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST: Tonight, is Baby Gabriel still alive? A young mother claimed she murdered her baby boy but then she changed her story. Tonight, as her trial starts, we are learning that police have a stunning theory about the adorable child who would be 3 years old now. Will this trial finally reveal what happened to Baby Gabriel?


VELEZ-MITCHELL (voice-over): Tonight, judgment day for the mother of missing Baby Gabriel. The adorable boy was just 7 months old when he vanished. Now his mom, Elizabeth Johnson, is standing trial.

Cops say she told the little boy`s father she suffocated their baby and threw him in the Dumpster. But then she told cops she gave her son away to a mystery couple. So what really happened to beautiful Baby Gabriel? Is he still alive? We`re investigating his baffling disappearance and bringing you the very latest from court.

And Lindsay Lohan`s arrested again. And again she`s behind the wheel. The troubled star is accused of clipping a man`s leg with her Porsche in Manhattan. Is Lindsay back to her bad girl ways? What is she saying?

Plus, could this mean La Lohan is headed back to the slammer? We`ll take your calls for the full hour.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where is Baby Gabriel?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The 8-month-old was last seen at a Texas motel back in 2009.

ELIZABETH JOHNSON, GABRIEL`S MOTHER: I don`t exist anymore. I`m a ghost.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The boy`s mother, 23-year-old Elizabeth Johnson, picks up everything and takes her baby on a two-day journey, traveling from Arizona to San Antonio, Texas.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) when you push them enough.

LOGAN MCQUEARY, GABRIEL`S FATHER: She told me on the phone, "You`re never going to see Gabriel again."

Where are you? Where`s Gabriel?

JOHNSON: I killed him this morning. Gabriel is in the Dumpster. You want to talk to girls, that`s the price you pay.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, a beautiful missing baby boy and a twisted web of secrets at the center of an explosive new trial.

Good evening. Jane Velez-Mitchell coming to you live.

Twenty-six-year-old Elizabeth Johnson goes on trial in Arizona in the disappearance of her infant son Gabriel, known as Baby Gabe. He was just 8 months old when he vanished almost three years ago. Tonight, the missing child`s mom is put on trial. And there`s word tonight that police believe the child may still be alive. That`s right. Baby Gabe might still be alive.

Now, Baby Gabriel`s dad, Logan McQueary, was in the middle of a nasty custody battle with the boy`s mom when he got a horrifying text from his ex.


MCQUEARY: I was at my grandma`s house or her retirement home. And I was actually just leaving when I got text message from Elizabeth. And the only text message she sent me was "I killed him" with a bunch of exclamation points.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: That dad frantically tried to contact his ex, Elizabeth, not knowing she`d already taken off and was halfway across the country with their baby boy. When he finally got her on the phone, Elizabeth made a chilling statement. Listen to her in her own words.


JOHNSON: I suffocated him and he turned blue, and I put him in his diaper bag, and I put him in the trash can.

MCQUEARY: You did not hurt Gabriel.

JOHNSON: Yes, I did. I suffocated him.

You knew I would do it, and you pushed me anyway.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: How horrifying and unthinkable. But Elizabeth later took it all back and changed her story. Then she told police, oh, she gave Baby Gabriel up for adoption to a mystery couple in San Antonio.

And then, in a very bizarre twist, Elizabeth`s former friend, Tammy Smith -- you see her there -- has already been convicted in this case, said to be desperate to adopt the boy. She was found guilty of forging adoption papers and conspiring with Elizabeth to keep Baby Gabriel from his dad.

But now, will the ex-lover and this former friend be the prosecution`s two star witnesses against Elizabeth? And will this trial finally reveal what really happened to Baby Gabe?

What do you think? If he`s still alive. Call me: 1-877-JVM-SAYS, 1- 877-586-7297.

Straight out to KRLD investigative reporter Joe Gomez.

Joe, what`s at stake in this trial now getting underway?

JOE GOMEZ, KRLD INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: Well, Jane, this certainly is a bizarre case and one that pulls at your heart strings. This 8-month-old baby caught in this ugly battle over custody.

The boy`s mother has said to have taken him on a multi-state trip from Arizona out to Texas, where he was last seen at a San Antonio motel room. Around that time is when she had sent the text to the boy`s father that she had killed him.

In a very disturbing message she even suggested she had suffocated Baby Gabriel, that she would tell him where to find Baby Gabriel`s dead little blue body if the garbage didn`t come first.

It was only later, Jane, that she recanted these statements, suggesting that a mystery couple in San Antonio had actually taken the boy instead.

So which is it, Jane? Is Baby Gabriel still alive somewhere out there? Or is it as his mother suggested, and did she toss him away like so much trash?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, we have some breaking news. Michael Board, WOAI News Radio, you are there in San Antonio, Texas, where this supposed mystery exchange occurred when she changed her story and said, "No, I didn`t kill this precious child. I gave the child to a mystery couple."

What are police telling you about a possibility that this angel is still alive?

MICHAEL BOARD, WOAI NEWS RADIO (via phone): Well, Jane, I want to bring you the latest on this case. What is happening right now is San Antonio police are still investigating this case. No, not as a murder but as a missing persons case. I was told by investigators that there were no signs of any harm done to this child.

Now, we know where this child was staying when it was in San Antonio with her mother. If there were any signs of any harm done to this child in any of these motel rooms, you know police would be charging murder on this. But they`re not. They`re saying this is a missing persons case. They still believe that they will find this missing child.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. And she is charged -- she is on trial right now for kidnapping and custodial interference.

Now, here`s what gets me, just wanted to pull my hair out in tufts. It gets me furious. Why was this troubled young woman anywhere near this boy? OK.

She and her ex, Logan, the dad, who seems like a straight arrow, were in the middle of a nasty custody battle. But this woman has a history of extremely violent behavior, if you listen to Logan. When you hear Baby Gabe`s dad talk about Elizabeth, we`re talking about erratic, violent behavior. Why was this young woman ever awarded joint custody? Listen to Logan, the dad.


MCQUEARY: She just kept getting mad and mad. And then eventually, it escalated to where she slapped me in the face. And she grabbed me by the throat.

(via phone) She destroyed my apartment. She caused $4,000 in damages to my apartment. Busted out my windows. Cut up my clothes with scissors. And broke everything. Took a knife to the couch. And she cut up some of the baby`s stuff with a knife. Thank God he was at day care.

(on camera) We were sitting around the fire, and I was just standing there, you know, warming my hands in the fire. And she came up right behind me and shoved me right in the fire.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Those are horrifying allegations.

So Robi Ludwig, psychotherapist, this woman should have never been anywhere near this child, not capable of taking the child and running away, because she seems to be violent. There she is.

ROBI LUDWIG, PSYCHOTHERAPIST: Well, at the very least this woman should have had supervised visits so she wasn`t a danger to the child or wouldn`t put the child in jeopardy.

Still there -- there is this idea that children should be with their parents if possible. And maybe it wasn`t so clear that this woman had a violent history with her child. Maybe that couldn`t be proven. It`s not really clear.

But -- but we are hearing that this woman is a very unstable woman and is clearly out of control. And just by the way the story has turned out, we know that there`s something seriously wrong with her.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Vinnie Politan, host "In Session" on TruTV, thank you so much for joining us. You did an extraordinary interview with Baby Gabriel`s dad. And I`ve heard this woman described as bipolar. That`s a phrase that`s tossed around. But to me, the outrage that she ever had the chance to take her child and run.

VINNIE POLITAN, HOST, TRUTV`S "IN SESSION": This was such a complicated relationship, Jane, that Logan had with Elizabeth Johnson. Because they were on again/off again. He -- she would get violent, but he would take her back. He wanted to be with his son.

You know, Jane, I had an opportunity to go into that hotel room where those photos were taken, which were the last photos of Baby Gabriel. And I was in that hotel room with Logan. And it was the first time he had ever been in there.

And I asked him the question, "Do you believe that Elizabeth Johnson murdered your son in this room?"

He started to cry, but he didn`t know. He doesn`t know the answer to that question. And he`s holding onto hope, Jane. And that`s why I think, you know, if you`re a father you hold onto hope. If you`re an investigator and you don`t have enough evidence to charge her with murder, you`ve got to hold onto hope that this baby`s alive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Logan McQueary, the dad, has already testified about Elizabeth`s wild and violent behavior. He acknowledged he was afraid of her and her temper. Listen to this.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It sounds like maybe you w percent were a little afraid of her.

MCQUEARY: A little bit. I just didn`t want to piss her off.


MCQUEARY: I just didn`t want to piss her off.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Didn`t want to piss her off? And why is that?

MCQUEARY: Cause she`s not really like -- how can I explain it? A normal person gets mad, they get a little pissed off. When she gets mad, it`s beyond mad.


MCQUEARY: I don`t know if they would -- they`d classify it as bipolar. I don`t know exactly what she is.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Was she taking medication?


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did she need to take medication?


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Elizabeth was ruled twice incompetent to stand trial. So what happened to make her mentally fit for this trial? On the other side.



JOHNSON (via phone): Gabriel is dead.

MCQUEARY (via phone): What?

JOHNSON: I killed him this morning.

MCQUEARY: No, you didn`t.

JOHNSON: Yes, I did.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Oh, that`s tapes being played in court of the baby`s mother and father arguing over what really happened.

I`ve got to go to Stacey Honowitz, Florida prosecutor.

She`s charged with kidnapping and custodial interference, get her nine months to 20 years. They can`t charge her with murder because there`s no body. And now police are saying they think that the child is alive. Can`t they use this case as leverage to pressure -- pressure her into telling the truth?

STACEY HONOWITZ, FLORIDA PROSECUTOR: Well, listen, she`s a defendant in the case, and she never has to say anything. We all know that.

The fact of the matter is, you know we were talking before the break about her competency. That was an issue. Now she`s back, and she`s competent. She can understand the charges against her. They can try to leverage, and they can try to get her to talk, but she never has to talk.

And the fact of the matter is, Jane, in family court when you`re fighting for custody, most family court judges, unless one spouse comes in there armed and prepared to say that the other spouse is a baby murderer killer, they want both parents to have custody. They don`t look at supervised visits as something that`s being very important until something like this happens. And that`s what we have right here now.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I wonder if the courts might have been influenced in some way by the fact that this is a very beautiful young woman. And sometimes people go gaga, and they can`t think straight. Or they can`t comprehend the idea that a really beautiful, model-beautiful, movie-star- beautiful young woman is capable of committing violence.

I want to go out to the phone lines. Norma, Texas, your question or thought. Norma, Texas.

CALLER: Well, Jane, I just want to say thank you for all you do. My husband and I watch you from Texas all the time.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Oh, wonderful.

CALLER: And we love your -- we love your show.


CALLER: We went to the city of San Antonio this weekend, and we passed right by that hotel. It`s not a hotel; it`s more of a motel kind of. And we went to put gasoline in our tractor. So there was a gas station directly next to it.

So it gave me the opportunity to kind of watch people get off the bus station that is directly next to that motel. It`s a motel or hotel/motel studio suite that has a lot of buses from Mexico. And people just getting off the bus and people getting on the bus. And my theory -- and I`ll tell you because I had the opportunity to watch these folks get off the bus is that they were getting off the bus and they looked so scared and they were hurried -- they seemed hurried and started walking along the side of the service road to wherever they were going, I think she`s not talking because she doesn`t know who she gave the baby to. I think she gave it to somebody on that bus. The baby`s in Mexico.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, ma`am, that is a very interesting possibility. And Michael Board, WOAI, you`re right there in San Antonio. That presents a problem for police because how on earth do you forensically follow thousands of people who could be going a across the border?

I mean, obviously, if they`re holding a child who fits that description, that`s a start. But could they -- I remember one case where a whole family disappeared. They went back to the day that the family disappeared and they actually got a shot of what they thought was the family crossing the border at the border cross point. Have they checked those surveillance cameras to see if there was this child crossing the border with somebody?

BOARD: Yes, they have. They did not find any evidence of that.

Another theory that`s been floated in this investigation is that somehow Elizabeth Johnson was hooked up with some sort of an underground adoption ring, families who don`t want to go through all the process. You know, these are possibilities out there that there`s a family out there who has him that thinks that maybe they were doing the right thing by adopting this child, that maybe they were getting him out of a bad relationship, when in reality they`re taking this child away from a father that loves them and wants to be with him.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. And you got to wonder how could a mother hurt a child? But Vinnie Politan, my understanding is that she was consumed not only in this custody battle but with jealousy over what she thought was Logan`s cheating or playing around.

POLITAN: Absolutely. It`s such -- it`s such a complicated relationship that gets to the heart of what happened to this child. Because they broke up, they got back together.

And Elizabeth Johnson accusing Logan McQueary, oh, you`re with this girl, that girl. Well, guess what, you know, the only thing that she had that she could use against Logan McQueary was the child that he loved so much. And that`s why some people think the worst here, that not only did she not let Logan McQueary be with his son but she actually killed him in a fit of rage and bragged to him or told him on the phone and in that text message afterwards.

And it`s very possible that it could have happened that way. You know, we don`t have enough evidence one way or the other. But because of the rage, the immaturity and whatever`s going on between her ears, it`s very possible that she could have done this out of a fit of jealousy.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Then again if you`re that immature, maybe you just take your baby and hand your baby to somebody who says what a beautiful baby. The child`s beautiful. More on the other side.




JOHNSON: I said, you would be surprised what a person will do when you push them enough.

MCQUEARY: I`m not pushing you. I gave you your space.

JOHNSON: No, you did push me. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) you hurt me. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) and have sex with all these people.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Where is Baby Gabriel? The trial for his mother is starting. She`s not charged with murder. She`s charged with kidnapping and custodial interference. And police say -- we just heard police tonight that they think this child may be alive.

She says -- at one point she said she killed him and then she said, "Oh, I gave him away to a mystery couple."

Let`s go to the phone lines. Paul, New Jersey, your question or thought?

CALLER: Yes, how are you doing, Jane? First, I`d like to say me and my sister always watch your show and we think you`re great.


CALLER: I was really wondering, would it be possible for the court to maybe administer her a lie detector test? Or has it been done yet? And if so, wouldn`t that be able to lead the detectives or anyone else in their investigation?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Stacey Honowitz, excellent question.

HONOWITZ: That`s an excellent question. Most people want the defendant to be able to talk or say something. They can`t force them to do anything. Lie detectors are not admissible in court because they`re not deemed to be reliable. They are used as an investigative tool, previous to filing charges, or maybe you`re looking into charges later on. But they can never force a defendant to do anything, especially to take a lie detector test.

This is a mystery for everybody. We`re going to have to wait and see what pans out in court.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Did Elizabeth even want Gabriel in the first place? The baby`s dad says she made it clear she never wanted children. Listen.


MCQUEARY: If any kid made like a snide, like, look at her or something like that, she`d do the same back. You know, like stick out her tongue at them or something like that. And I just kind of laughed it off as kind of nothing. But I knew she didn`t want to have kids. She always said that.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: And this is Vinnie Politan`s extraordinary interview. Vinnie, it must have been heart-wrenching for this father to know that he was so close and then this child slipped out of his hands.

POLITAN: Yes. And he -- you know, he tried to do the right thing by using our family court system, right? He goes in with Elizabeth Johnson. They get joint custody. They come up with an arrangement, what days he can have the baby and what day she can have the baby, because he`s got to work.

Then when it`s the first time for her to give the baby back to him, she doesn`t show up. He goes back to court. That`s when he gets custody, and she flees for San Antonio.

But for Logan McQueary, this is something that has never ended. It continues day in and day out for him. And it`s because he doesn`t know the answer to the ultimate question.

Think about it, Jane. The best-case scenario for Logan McQueary is that his beautiful baby boy is being raised by somebody else. Because the worst-case scenario is -- he can`t even think about it.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Of course death. Because she maybe doesn`t want to tell because if she tells, then they will find him, and then they will return him to Logan who is, I guess, her arch enemy. So sad.

Trial`s just starting. We`re all over it. And we`re also going to do Lindsay Lohan arrested up next. But Nancy Grace has two fabulous stories coming up at 8 p.m. Eastern. What do you got, Nancy?

NANCY GRACE, HLN ANCHOR: Jane, on the radar, tracking crime and justice, South Carolina. Fifteen-year-old high-school cheerleader asleep in her own bedroom. Mom checks on her at 3 a.m., 7:30 she`s gone. Gabby`s mother comes forward insisting she is still alive, being held.

And, Jane, to Denver. A teen gymnast performing at a local mall, a little act with a hula hoop. There were other youth involved. She was whisked away from the local mall by a mystery man. Tonight we go live.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Lindsay Lohan arrested again. She was leaving the scene of an accident.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Lindsay Lohan has been arrested. This time it was last night in Manhattan.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She`s in trouble with the law again.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police say the man went to the hospital, and he should be OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It seems like every time Lindsay gets behind the wheel of a car, something crazy happens.

LINDSAY LOHAN, ACTRESS: And I respect you. I`ve been taking it seriously.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s been one thing after another for the former child star, who`s trying to make this comeback. She could certainly go back to jail. It`s really going to be up to the judge.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Breaking news tonight. Lindsay Lohan arrested again. The actress was driving into a very trendy Manhattan hotel a little after midnight when a man claims she hit him with her Porsche. And she proceeded to drive into this hotel driveway. She parked her car and went on her merry way.

The alleged victim was taken to the hospital with a knee injury. And La Lohan was arrested at about 2:30 in the morning and charged with leaving the scene of an accident.

Cops apparently say they don`t believe alcohol was involved. But this comes just two days after Lindsay`s dad came on our show this week and said he believed Lindsay was drinking again over the weekend while celebrating with her mom, Dina, for Dina`s birthday.


MICHAEL LOHAN, FATHER OF LINDSAY LOHAN: It was reported in "The Daily News" just today that she was out for her birthday with Lindsay just the other night after this interview that she was drinking again. Why Lindsay was drinking. And this came from the host of the restaurant.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: We reached out to Lindsay`s rep about Michael Lohan, her dad`s claims and they did not comment -- declined. But they gave us this statement about this alleged leaving the scene of an accident. "While some of the facts are still being gathered, it appears this is much ado about nothing. We`re confident this matter will be cleared up in the coming weeks. And the claims being made against Lindsay will prove untrue."

Straight out to TMZ news manager Mike Walters; you`ve been all over this story. What do you know? What`s the latest?

MIKE WALTERS, TMZ NEWS MANAGER: Well, Jane, usually Lindsay Lohan does not get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to a story like this, but I have to say I think she has a case on this one. I spoke to somebody who witnessed the actual security camera that shows this entire thing happening and actually watched it with two NYPD detectives to see if Lindsay Lohan actually hit this guy.

Here`s what they said. Each detective, one of them said I think he -- or she might have grazed him. The other one said I don`t think they made contact. So here is the issue. It looks like she really might not have hit this guy on tape. So this guy has a lot of, you know, time where he`s going to figure out how he`s going to defend this when they come to him and police want to talk to him about it.

The second thing is it shows on the tape this guy sprinting after the car, running after, you know, then he goes to the hospital and says he`s really injured and had to get morphine for a torn tendon in his knee.

I don`t know if it`s consistent, Jane. He might be exaggerating.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, let me ask you this. Mike Walters, I got to ask you this because I think I read on TMZ that he sprinted and then it was after he sprinted down the ramp he recognized that it was Lindsay Lohan. So you would have to be psychic to claim that he was injured by somebody before he knew that he was injured by Lindsay Lohan.

And also, secondly, I know in accidents I think I`m fine, I`ve had a couple of fender benders and then oh it starts creeping up on me a couple of minutes later. So that could account for the sprinting.

And you`re saying that it`s divided. One detective thought he did get grazed. The other one said no.

WALTERS: But the problem is, Jane, if that`s true, which I know it is, then the injury couldn`t be that serious that he was transported in an ambulance to a hospital if you couldn`t even tell whether she actually hit him with the car. And with the point about him knowing who it is, I was told he told them he didn`t need an ambulance at first and then once everything kind of started coming out, Lindsay comes back on the scene, they start to figure out what happened then he said "I need an ambulance." So I`m not sure he`s going to get away with this one.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Mike, I love you. You and I go way back to the Michael Jackson child molestation trial. We worked together in another incarnation --

WALTERS: Absolutely.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: -- but I disagree with you in terms of giving her the benefit of the doubt. It was back in June that she had a fender bender, a serious accident on Pacific Coast Highway. In her Porsche -- now there was question about who was driving. Of course she said she wasn`t driving but who knows. But a truck got hit. It was her -- in a Porsche she`s driving --

WALTERS: I know.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: She may not have been driving but she was in it. How many times -- I got to go to Jen Hager, assistant managing editor, RadarOnline, how many times does she get the benefit of the doubt? Or is this a case of a woman with extraordinary bad luck where everywhere she goes people somehow walk toward her car or drive toward her car?

JEN HAGER, ASSISTANT MANAGING EDITOR, RADARONLINE: You know, with Lindsay -- in my next life I want to come back as Lindsay Lohan because nothing -- no legal problems or whatever issues she has stick. She`s like Teflon -- John Gaudy, nothing sticks.

So maybe this guy, maybe Lindsay didn`t recognize that she hit this guy and he recognized who she was after the fact, but number one she just told Matt Lauer about a month ago on an interview on the "Today" show that she wasn`t going out drinking anymore, she wasn`t going to nightclubs. She was just staying home.

So she`s out in nightclubs in New York City, not in Los Angeles. She clearly is not staying home and hunkering down with her friends and trying to lead a low key life.

Secondly, this just comes days after -- her arrest, comes days after she`s going after Amanda Bynes and asking her fans on Twitter, Lindsay tweeted out why is a nickelodeon star not facing any consequences. So you know, Lindsay is not -- she`s a hot mess, nothing ever sticks. And you know, it`s just another day in the life of Lindsay Lohan.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: You know what, dramarama. This is a telenovela that is just never ending. Lindsay ended her probation for one of the DUI cases in March. It was a love fest in court. The judge however gave her some advice.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m not going to give a lecture because you know what you need to do. You need to live your life in a more mature way, stop the nightclubbing and focus on your work. Ok?

LINDSAY LOHAN, ACTRESS: I just want to say thank you. It`s really opened a lot of doors for me. So I really appreciate it.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. That`s what the judge said, stop nightclubbing. Lindsay completed her probation for the DUI, but she`s still on unsupervised probation for a shoplifting case. It doesn`t end for two years. The judge said she was required to obey all laws. So potentially - - and I`ll get to this in a moment -- we got to wonder if this could be a probation violation, maybe, maybe not.

Anna David, you`re executive director of The Fix, which is a wonderful Web site about addiction; you`re in recovery and you`re the author of "Party Girl". What could be more appropriate?

What do you make of her behavior pattern? We don`t know. She says she wasn`t drinking. The cops gave her a breathalyzer, reportedly she wasn`t drinking. But what do you make of her behavior as somebody who`s been to rehab five times she has, so she should not be using any mood- altering substances whatsoever.

ANNA DAVID, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, THE FIX: Well, I think two things. I think with Lindsay, where there`s smoke there`s fire. Whether or not, you know, she grazed this guy or not, what is she doing driving a car in New York? We take cabs when you`re Lindsay Lohan and you have a history of car accidents, late at night leaving clubs, why would you not be in a cab?

But you know, what keeps coming to mind, Jane, is a phrase that I`m sure you`re familiar with too. But just self-will run riot -- a popular phrase in recovery. That`s just all I can think when I hear about the latest Lindsay Lohan. It`s like, you know, your bottom is when you stop digging and she just digs lower and lower and lower.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, she might like the adrenaline high of doing exactly as she wants. And she is consistently -- she`s been in court 20 times before four judges and she`s done less than two weeks in jail all told despite a couple of DUIs, drug problems, all of it, missing court appearances, probation violations and she continues to just go on her merry way.

So what incentive does she have? Nobody`s cracked down on her. You know, I got to tell you, if she wasn`t a beautiful starlet and you take her exact same story in terms of her criminal timeline, her court timeline, and you put some poor person who`s unattractive into her facts, I want to know if that person would do less than two weeks behind bars after all of this.

Today`s Shocking Video" of the day -- and we`re going to get more Lindsay on the other side -- but this takes us down under. Look at this. This is a fire tornado or firenado. I`ve never heard that phrase. Fire devil is what they`re also calling it. It`s a fire that also has become a tornado. Oh, my gosh. What`s happening to our planet?

More Lindsay on the other side.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: I don`t know about you but I have a bad habit. It`s soda, in my case, diet. But regular, diet, there is an alternative. One that is cheaper that`s healthier for you and also zero calories. It`s good old-fashioned lemonade.

My recipe is Stevia lemonade. I cut up some lemons, right. I put them right there in the water -- good old-fashioned water. You can filter it if you want. And then I add my secret ingredient, Stevia. You can do it in powder form or in liquid form. 50 times sweeter than sugar, doesn`t upset your glycemic index.

It`s all good. And guess what; it`s kind of old-fashioned too. Want some lemonade?


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Our "Viral Video of the Day". You want to learn about unconditional love -- just look at our companions. Look at this happy guy, so thrilled to see daddy. Yes. If people only welcomed us this way -- this is unconditional love.



L. LOHAN: I`m not taking this as a joke. It`s my life. And it`s my career and something I`ve worked for my entire life. And, you know, I`ve learned from my experiences. I take responsibility for my actions.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: What some would say was a dramatic performance a while back in front of one of the many judges that she`s been before. The ladies of "The View", of course, had something to say of course about the fact that Lindsay Lohan has been arrested again. ABC --


JOY BEHAR, CO-HOST, "THE VIEW": She`s gotten into this type of thing before. She doesn`t need rehab. She needs a driver this girl.

BARBARA WALTERS, CO-HOST, "THE VIEW": Everybody is looking to find something --


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. And we raised it. Why doesn`t she take a cab or everybody -- there`s so many people running around town with drivers. You can get these black cars that aren`t really limos. But I don`t think she wants to do that or the subway for that matter. Or a New York City bus because people would hear what she`s saying, doing and then in her defense, unless they signed a confidentiality agreement that was ironclad, they might leak those stories to the press.

Let`s go out to the phone lines. Chris, Florida, your question or thought, Chris.

CHRIS, FLORIDA (via telephone): Yes. I was just going to say that I think anybody can get hurt bad. I don`t think like you said he didn`t know it was going to be Lindsay. And he didn`t just like see a car pass him and then go chasing after it for no reason. And I want to also know, is New York going to treat her more like a regular person and not a movie star?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, very good question. Stacey Honowitz, Florida prosecutor, the real problem is in California where she`s still under unsupervised probation and she`s supposed to obey the law. Could this send her back before a judge or back in jail?

STACEY HONOWITZ, FLORIDA PROSECUTOR: Yes, absolutely. I mean the fact of the matter is she really has a difficult time being reined in, you know. She`s on probation whether it`s informal at this point or formal. Any violation of the law and certainly if they gave her a notice to appear, which is in essence a release -- you`re arrested but you`re released, that goes in front of the judge.

Certainly a judge has a right to review; you`re on probation you`re supposed to abide by what the judge says. So we have to wait and see. But New York has nothing to do with this. It`s California that will take this New York process and this paperwork and then decide whether or not she violated this probation, the California probation.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Listen, Lindsay, I have a subway pass and I`m willing to give it to you, ok. I think it`s got like $40 on it. You can ride for a long time. And it`s yours. Call me.

Hey, by the way, I want to say Lindsay`s helped us go green because this is -- look, this is our file on Lindsay. It`s the biggest file we have except for Casey Anthony. And I finally cracked and said no more -- no more printing out anything about Lindsay Lohan. I`m going to have to do it on my Blackberry, ok? Because you`re killing too many trees, honey. We both are. Clean up your act.

All right. Look, I got to say this has been a bad week for the Lohans. On Monday we told you about Dina Lohan, Lindsay`s mom`s disastrous interview with Dr. Phil. Could that have been the trigger?


DR. PHIL MCGRAW, TV HOST: It`s all a fraud. It`s just a dodge. And you said I want to come on and I want people to really know me. And what you have done is distinguished yourself in the negative. You have come on here and been phony and inauthentic --


MCGRAW: -- with these deflections and dodges. And that doesn`t help. That doesn`t help.

D. LOHAN: Truth will prevail.

MCGRAW: So, what does that mean, truth will prevail?

D. LOHAN: You have to ask me. I don`t -- I mean --

MCGRAW: I did. That was a question.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jen Hager, quickly. Ok. I`ll answer the question --

HAGER: All right. You know -- It absolutely could have been a trigger. I think there are questions whether or not Lindsay -- Dina Lohan was under the influence. I think Dr. Phil came across a little bit of a bully. I think it was a really, really bad decision for Dina to go and be interviewed in that setting.

But clearly Dina has been very upset. I know, I`ve talked to sources close to the family tell us Lindsay is upset about how her mom was treated.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I respectfully disagree with you. I think Dr. Phil did a great job and asked her the questions that have to be asked. We can`t be co-dependent enablers.

Your "Kooky Video of the Day".

More Lindsay on the other side.

But we heard rumors, we want to know -- Jennifer Anniston, is she pregnant or not? Check out this commercial she did.


JENNIFER ANNISTON, ACTRESS: Oh, God. Oh. So much better. How are my little triplets doing? You must be so thirsty.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Pretty, pretty darn funny. She`s making fun of herself. What this has to do with selling bottled water, I have no idea. But in the clip she has fun.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Oh, time for our pets of the day. Emma -- oh, so regal. Regal beagle. And take a look at Sunny and Stewie, they love each other. And Brooklyn is the hipster dog. Wow, I wonder if he raps when he barks? Gracie, you are just angelic and innocent and Sammy is just adorable.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now we`re being followed by a GMC. This gentleman jumped out of the car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ok. And what did he do?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my god, sir. They`re following us. We need help.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: That was a woman telling cops, hey, Lindsay Lohan is chasing me. Now, Lindsay Lohan has had two DUIs -- that was one of them. And she`s been found in violation of her probation four times -- four probation violations. I mean, come on, she`s been arrested for possession of narcotics, driving with a suspended license.

Stacey Honowitz, you know, I don`t know whether she grazed this person, but if they determined that maybe she did, she`s already charged with leaving the scene of an accident, even if she didn`t graze the person, if the person is complaining, should she have stayed there and waited because the guy did call 911, waited for police? And since she didn`t do that, reportedly allegedly, would that be a probation violation?

HONOWITZ: Well, listen, any time you`re charged with disobeying the law -- and leaving the scene of an accident is of course disobeying the law -- you will be charged with a violation of probation. Whether or not you`re found guilty is a different circumstance.

The fact of the matter is the standard is lower; it`s by preponderance of the evidence. Was it more likely than not that you committed this crime? So probation violations are a lot different than regular cases.

But certainly any common sense -- anybody can tell you that if you think you`re involved in something, and evidently somebody got out of the car to check to see if the car was ok --


Honowitz: -- if you think you`ve involved in something, you stick around and you wait for the police to get there.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Anna David, The Fix, you wrote "Party Girl", you`re in recovery, briefly what should Lindsay Lohan do?

DAVID: Lindsay Lohan should do what she should have done years ago which is just stop running, just accept help. Start listening to people outside of your mom and people who are on your payroll and start changing your life because I disagree that she`s so lucky and she`s acting when she`s saying she`s going to change. I think she`s in desperate pain and she does want things to be different but doesn`t seem to know how to get it, so she`s got to act different. She`s not going to just start thinking different.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: More on the other side.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Lindsay Lohan arrested? A guy says, oh, look, she grazed him going into a Manhattan club -- hotel, and we`re all thinking here why is she driving? Two DUIs, a slew of legal problems -- unnecessary risk is what our executive producer said. Guess what, that is what addicts love -- unnecessary risk and I say that as a recovering addict. Whether you`re in recovery or not, you love it.

Nancy, Vermont -- your question or thought, quickly. Oh, Nancy.

All right, listen. I want to go to Jen Hager. What do you think is going to be next for Lindsay? I thought she was doing "Scary Movie 5" with Charlie Sheen, another winner?

JAGER: Yes, you know, she just finished wrapping before that another movie. She just wrapped "Scary Movie 5". What I can tell you with Lindsay -- and you and I have been covering her for years is to expect the unexpected. I predict that this will not be the last of her legal problems that she will be seeing this year.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me say this. I was 26 and I loved to go dancing and I loved to go out. I thought it was my constitutional right, so I do empathize with her. But you can`t do it.

Nancy next.