Return to Transcripts main page
Interview with Gloria Allred and Daughter Lisa Bloom; Interview with Kato Kaelin
Aired September 20, 2012 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW PINSKY, HOST: "People hated me." "I`ve been spat upon." "They threw gum in my coffee." Those were the words of Brian "Kato" Kaelin, the infamous house guest of O.J. Simpson, who was there the night Nicole Brown and Ron Goldman were murdered.
Did O.J. do it? What does he know?
Eighteen years later, Kato Kaelin is here with me ready to tell the truth.
And attorneys Gloria Allred and her daughter Lisa Bloom share like you`ve never seen, sharing family secrets -- including rape, abuse divorce, suicide, mental illness. Surprising, shocking, inspiring, perhaps controversial.
Let`s get started.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Welcome to the program. We have Gloria Allred and her daughter Lisa Bloom.
And this week, we`ve been sort of pulling the curtain back on some of our contributors. And these guys have been kind enough to be part of our show for quite some time.
Gloria, I want to start with you. We just picked up a new article about you -- I`m not sure if it was new, frankly, but it was new to us -- which chronicled some of your life experiences that helped me understand your passion. Rape, gun point, abortion, sepsis after an illicit abortion.
Tell us about those experiences. And is that what led to Gloria Allred, the advocate for women?
GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIMS` RIGHTS ATTORNEY: That and of course that I have a wonderful daughter, Lisa, who`s sitting right there. Happy birthday to my little girl, my baby.
LISA BLOOM, ATTORNEY: You like that segue?
PINSKY: I was going to get to that, Gloria, just -- you know, but yes. Happy birthday, Lisa.
And more importantly, Gloria, spending her birthday here with us, a big deal. I want to mention that.
BLOOM: It`s a pleasure.
ALLRED: Yes. So I just want to say but that is part of why I am who I am is because I do what I do for our daughters, my daughter, my granddaughter, and everyone`s daughter and sister and mother and so forth. So -- but let me just say, yes, my life experience is the person that has made me the person that I am today.
You know, having been raped when I was younger at gun point, becoming pregnant, being compelled to have an abortion when it was illegal for a doctor to give one although not for a woman to receive one and therefore it was unsafe. Therefore I hemorrhaged and almost died from the infection and had to go to the hospital. And fortunately I was able to live.
And hopefully my work is to make sure that no one else`s daughter will ever have to face an illegal and unsafe abortion again, which is why I`m so pro-choice and want abortion to be safe and legal and available.
PINSKY: I`ve heard you call the back alley abortion, the Vietnam for women.
ALLRED: Well, it is, because we often say in the women`s movement that it was our Vietnam that more women died or were maimed by illegal abortions than men ever died or maimed by the Vietnam War. And, of course, we have great respect for al those who sacrificed for our country in the Vietnam War.
But also there has been a war on women. I`ve said it for many years. There still is a war on women in terms of politicians in Washington and the state legislatures trying to eliminate any rights we have fought to win and that the Supreme Court has afforded us. And try to do away with those rights, whether it`s birth control, trying to cut back on the right to birth control, or abortion, or other rights.
And this is simply not to be tolerated because we`re talking about our daughters and their rights to be safe and to be equal.
PINSKY: But, Gloria, I think anyone who knows the name Gloria Allred would not be surprised by any of those positions. But I do think they would be surprised by some of your life experiences. So I kind of want to focus in on that if you don`t mind.
For instance, you mentioned how the doctors, it was illegal to do abortions. So they practice unsafe abortion. If I remember the story right, it was a doctor that held you at gun point. That cuts through me. Is that right?
ALLRED: Well, that`s true, on a vacation to Mexico. And of course being very young, I had no suspicion. You know, I thought, well, my goodness, I had a great father and he always protected me and was good to me, and I would never think that a man would hurt me or, you know have an act of violence against me.
PINSKY: Right there, Gloria -- right there, though, right there is where women share a common ground these days more often than I care to think about. Interestingly when I mention the story, Lisa took this giant sigh.
You took a huge breath when I told that story. Is that story --
BLOOM: Well, that`s my mom.
PINSKY: Did you grow up with that story?
BLOOM: No. That happened when I was a little girl. So I didn`t know about it at the time.
PINSKY: Did she tell you about it? Did you have a sense something happened to her?
BLOOM: I remember that years later, when my mother very bravely decided to go public with this story, that before she did that, she sat me down and she said I need to explain to you.
I think -- you know, mom, you can correct me -- I think I was either late teen, maybe early 20s. And, you know, she felt it was important to come forward with the story which I agree with. So she sat down and told me the story. Of course, it`s horrifying.
PINSKY: Did you react? Did you have trouble sleeping? Did you think oh, mom?
BLOOM: No, because she told me it to me in a very brave way. Just the way she`s telling it now.
You know, my mom is very honest about her past, but she`s also forward looking. What can we do to protect women now? You know, it`s a very forward-looking, preventative political kind of life.
PINSKY: For a second I`m looking backwards at a picture of the two of you there.
BLOOM: I`m the little one. She`s the momma. That`s the front yard of our house in Philadelphia. That`s the row house where my mother grew up and where I live from my first five years.
PINSKY: I can tell you have tender feels looking at that. But Gloria, I imagine you have some conflicted feelings, because this is another part of your story. I guess Lisa`s father also had some issues that were a surprise to you.
ALLRED: Well, yes. You know, I met him in college. He was gorgeous, he was brilliant, he was funny. He was charismatic and he was my first love.
PINSKY: There he is.
ALLRED: I met him the first week of college at University of Pennsylvania. There he is. And it was exciting to be with him and I met him in my freshman year and I married him in my sophomore year. Gave birth to Lisa in my junior year and then got divorced in my senior year. I graduated two weeks late.
He was all of those things, but also, he was bipolar, which I didn`t know anything about at the time, and really had very serious mental health issues and challenges. And although I tried to work with that and hope that things would change, I realized that it really was beyond my power to change and I needed to leave with my little girl.
I didn`t want her to grow up in what was an environment that I thought was not going to be healthy for her.
PINSKY: I feel -- Gloria -- if you`ll permit me --
ALLRED: But not be in that home.
PINSKY: That you`re trying to protect all the little girls out there. Lisa`s had the benefit for sure and she`s living proof of that. But I get the feeling that you -- this and the rape has -- some of that passion has got to be rooted in these experiences. I also read that one of your friends said, well, he drank, he hit her. That`s just the way it was back then.
Was there that -- have we traversed that much territory in the last 20, 30 years that that was normative and that now, we have people like you to thank for raising awareness and not allowing these things to go by unannounced, unaddressed?
ALLRED: Well, I give credit to all the women who have broken the silence in our country, whether they`ve done it in a larger bully pulpit such as this is or just in their own families, broken the silence, told someone, gotten help from their support team, whether it`s their family, or their friends, or their religious ministers, priest, rabbis, whomever they can talk to. All those women who break the silence.
And then, you know, utilize the criminal justice system if they think it`s appropriate in their case or the civil justice system or just get out and be safe and have their children safe as well. I give credit to all of them.
PINSKY: Lisa, you`re beaming. Are you proud of mom?
BLOOM: I am.
And I would add supportive men out there who don`t stand for domestic violence, who stand against it, who stand for their daughters and their wives and their girlfriends. I mean, you know, the women`s movement has always encouraged men to be a part of it and they have been a part of it.
You know, there`s no question that my mom`s life is informed by her decisions, like all of our lives are, and by her experiences.
PINSKY: Her experiences more than her decisions. Her decisions are sort of on top of these experiences. I wonder maybe just -- let`s sit with this thought, Gloria, until after the break.
Are you still haunted by some of this stuff? Does it still bubble up for you? And is perhaps this -- acting on behalf of women a way of being of service and manage those feelings?
We`re also going to talk about how both Lisa and Gloria survived the suicide of Lisa`s dad, after this.
And also later, we have Kato Kaelin. That`s right. He made national news. He is here today about -- he`s erupted into the news as of this morning. Yesterday he was leading his usual life hopefully quietly. There he is right now.
All of a sudden an article appeared. And everyone wants to hear from him. He has elected to come on this show and set the record straight. Stay with us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALLRED: On January 22nd, 1973, the United States Supreme Court decides in this landmark case that the American women have a constitutional right to liberty and privacy, which includes the right to choose abortion. In recent years, this decision has been under attack in the courts, in the legislature and in the streets by anti-choice forces who sought to reverse Roe v. Wade and stop women from exercising their constitutional right.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: There is that passion. Also there is some good old `80s hair there, Gloria. Way to go with the big hair. Very nice.
PINSKY: I am back with victims` rights attorney Gloria Allred and her daughter Lisa, author of the book "Swagger" and legal analyst for Avvo.com. That`s Avvo.com.
We`re pulling the curtain back and talking about them as people and what motivates and what creates that kind of a passion. I want to go right to calls if we could because I`m interested to see how the viewers are reacting.
Everyone knows Gloria Allred, and, of course, people who watch this show know you, Lisa. But you may not know this piece. And we`re going to talk also as we go along, a little bit about your biological dad and how that`s affected you.
Maureen in Washington. Maureen, go ahead.
MAUREEN, CALLER FROM WASHINGTON: Hi, Dr. Drew.
I would like to ask Gloria Allred what she feels is her most -- her greatest professional accomplishment and what she`s most proud of?
ALLRED: Well, I am the most proud of every single client of the thousands I have represented in the 36 years I`ve been practicing law, because I think it will -- it takes a real courage to become empowered, to stand up and say, I am not going to accept the injustice I have suffered. I am going to do something about it. It`s scary but I`m going to do it because I deserve justice.
And a lot of the women who have been very traumatized by what that injustice was that was inflicted upon them, really have to demonstrate a whole lot of courage to move forward. That`s why I`m so proud of them --
BLOOM: Can I say some of her greatest cases? She`s too diplomatic.
PINSKY: Go ahead. I figured you have something.
BLOOM: You hear about the celebrity cases. You don`t hear about most of her work, which on behalf of secretaries, farm workers who are underpaid.
PINSKY: Does she have gay rights victories?
BLOOM: She`s had a lot of gay rights victories going way, way back. My mom has been a gay rights activist since way before it was fashionable, and good for you taking me out to gay pride parades when I was a kid, you know, back in the `70s. Good for you.
She had a great case against Holocaust deniers. People who said the Holocaust never happened. She sued them, got a $5 million verdict, shut them down, if I recall that correctly.
So, she has a lot of cases to be proud of that you don`t hear about very much in the news.
PINSKY: What is your most personal proud moment of your mom, would you say? I`m sure there`s a lot.
BLOOM: Oh my gosh.
PINSKY: But is there one?
BLOOM: Personal most proud moment -- well, I can tell you challenging moments. Other parents would come to parent/teacher conference, and, you know, just chit-chat with the teachers. She would open up the history books and say, why aren`t you teaching about women`s history? Why aren`t you teaching about African-American history?
She`d go to my English class and say, why aren`t you reading authors that are female or minority?
You know, at the time, I was kind of embarrassed, but --
PINSKY: I`m sure. But what a great thing. And of course she`s right.
BLOOM: And now, you know, everybody eventually catches up to my mom. And now everybody has caught up to the idea that diversity is important. But at the time, you know, that was an out there thing to do, wasn`t it, mom?
PINSKY: So that was your proudest moment, though, of her?
BLOOM: I was proud of her, yes. Well, I mean, we had little pickets when I was growing up. We picketed my school because there was a faculty student baseball game and girls were not allowed to play.
BLOOM: So, my mother said -- you know, don`t agonize, organize. So, she got all of us. You know, I was always the smallest in my class, I didn`t really want to play baseball, but I was part of the organizing process. We had picket signs and we marched around and we got them to change.
PINSKY: Let`s talk about your dad. How did his illness affect you? Bipolar and alcoholism, I heard. Right? Is that correct?
BLOOM: No, he wasn`t an alcoholic. He may have drunk when I was a baby, I don`t know about that. But he was not an alcoholic.
PINSKY: Bipolar --
BLOOM: He was severely bipolar, all of my life.
PINSKY: And he died of his bi --
BLOOM: Took his own life about 10 years ago. And it was the worst day of my life when I got that news.
PINSKY: Well, I`m going to step back from that and say did you have a close relationship?
BLOOM: I had a very close relationship with him.
PINSKY: And did you know he was sick?
BLOOM: I always news he was sick. Yes, I always knew he was -- he used to call it manic depressive and bipolar. But, you know, he was a full human being. That was one part of him.
PINSKY: Of course. One thing I`ve admired about -- Gloria`s mentioned him to me a few times. She could tell the difference between him and his illness, which is something very few people can do.
BLOOM: I don`t know if I could. The greatest struggle with the relationship with my dad was when to figure out when he was just being a jerk and when it was his illness. And sometimes, it`s very hard to tell the difference. If he`s just being a jerk, I could call him on it. If it was the illness, I had to be understanding and accepting. And that was very hard.
But I was -- I have to say that 98 percent of the time he was not a jerk at all. He was a wonderful, loving man. The funniest, the smartest guy I ever know. I wrote a whole chapter about him in a book I wrote.
PINSKY: Let me ask this to Gloria -- tougher question, (a), did you feel you had to protect Lisa from him and, (b), were you worried about the genetics coming through?
ALLRED: Yes to both questions, Dr. Drew. Yes, I did feel I need to protect her. But at a certain point, I mean, he was with his mother. She had a great grandmother, her half brother. And I knew if others were there, I didn`t have to worry about it.
And secondly, yes, I just was -- you know, always concerned, but I always wanted her to have a relationship with her father. And I did recognize he had a mental illness. I tried to take care of my anger against him because he didn`t do some of the things I felt he should be doing to be responsible to our daughter.
But I also knew that he had this illness and I couldn`t be -- it wasn`t fair for me to be angry at somebody who has an illness that he really had no control over.
BLOOM: But, you know, there are millions of people, as of course you know, who are mentally ill, who raise children anyway, whether they`re depressed, bipolar, et cetera.
PINSKY: Very common.
BLOOM: He was a wonderful dad to me. The worst thing that would happen would be I can`t see you today, because he was so depressed. And he would just go off by himself and close the door and remove himself.
PINSKY: Painful for you.
BLOOM: Painful for me. Look, when I was a young adult I would visit him in San Francisco and he would slam the door in my face and say, I can`t see you. That was very, very painful.
PINSKY: Did that affect you as a parent?
BLOOM: Just (INAUDIBLE), but it also was a growth experience for me, because I had to learn that this is a person with a disability and how lucky I am that I don`t have a mental disability. And it`s my job to have compassion for him. And not be angry with him. And to understand the hell he lives in.
And so, you know, it was an experience to help me grow as a person.
ALLRED: I also know he was very proud of Lisa. And he understood her and he did love her very much and cared for her.
PINSKY: I think that`s -- that was clear to Lisa that she did have a loving father.
BLOOM: He was a cool guy. I could always call him. I could talk about anything. Nothing shocked him. Nothing fazed him.
He was the smartest I ever knew. He read books all day long. You know, you always had that moment where you realize you`re dad isn`t the smartest person in the world. I never had that moment.
BLOOM: He could cite ancient Chinese history. He was reading authors that are still difficult for me to read. But I hope to read all the books that he`s read in his life. It`s like a challenge to me.
PINSKY: Got to take a break.
ALLRED: And I think the good things about him she did genetically inherit.
PINSKY: Yes, I see that. I get that.
By the way -- maybe after the break, I`ll show early pictures of Lisa where you can see the precociousness. You really can see it.
OK. Now, more of this stuff.
And later on, a rare interview with the O.J. Simpson witness Kato Kaelin who made headlines today. Well, it`s hard to decipher why there was a headline today, frankly, because I don`t think he made the headline. I think somebody made the headline for him.
He`s going to explain that and try to set the record straight and talk about what he knows. If you guys have questions, this is your chance. Call in, 855-373-7395.
First up, little more Gloria and Lisa.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
ALLRED: I`m attorney Gloria Allred.
My client Sharon Bialek and other women have claimed sexual harassment against Herman Cain.
Nicky revealed how she was treated by Meg Whitman when she was employed by her as her housekeeper for nine years.
Under the circumstances, Jocelyn has decided that Tiger will just have to live with this on his conscience if he has one.
Sometimes, he would try to take it to another level, mentioning his quote, "package".
Women will no longer be silent when they suffer injustices against them.
(END VIDEO CLIPS)
PINSKY: Just some of the high-profile cases that have had Gloria Allred all over our TV screens in the past few years.
We are back with victims` rights attorney Gloria Allred, and her daughter, legal analyst for Avvo.com, Lisa Bloom.
I have so many questions for you guys, and I want to get to calls.
I mean, just say one thing to begin with -- Lisa is a product of a divorced family and it shows you that even in a divorce, with two loving parents who are doing their parenting job, even one is encumbered with an illness, you can end up with a Lisa Bloom. I`m just --
BLOOM: Well, there`s a lot of people who are divorced.
PINSKY: Most people are.
BLOOM: I think you just hit on the important point, because unfortunately, I got divorced and I raise my kids mostly as a single mom. And I think if you both love the kids and you don`t fight ever in front of the kids, you express only positive things about the other though kids, it goes a long, long way. Kids just want to be loved and have the attention.
PINSKY: Tell me something about Gloria Allred I don`t know and that nobody knows.
BLOOM: Ah, OK. So she is wicked good at skee ball. You know that weird game in the arcade? I mean, it`s crazy. Nobody can beat her.
And she has a viciously funny sense of humor you don`t necessarily see on camera. But she has it all in stitches on Sunday --
PINSKY: How is she as a grandma?
BLOOM: She`s a fantastic grandma. She just convinced my daughter to go to law school. My daughter is now just finishing her first month of law school.
PINSKY: Wow, fantastic.
BLOOM: My mother just believes that everybody in the family should go to law school, right?
PINSKY: I see, it`s working.
Quick call. Renee in California, we`re running out of time. Renee, what have you got?
RENEE, CALLER FROM CALIFORNIA: Hey, Dr. Drew, really quickly. How do you doing?
PINSKY: I`m good.
RENEE: Gloria -- Ms. Allred, nice to talk to you.
Lisa Bloom --
RENEE: Let`s do the mother/daughter component of this. You know, I`m not sure what the premise or the predicate of the show is. I`m a retired court reporter of 28 years. I did a deposition with you. It was 21 days with a big law firm downtown.
Gloria, let me tell you something. I lost my mother about four or five years ago. Your daughter -- I sat there in amazement. You know, she was talking so quickly. She was so smart.
RENEE: I didn`t know she was your daughter. I don`t know if you remember this. Every time I see you on TV, I remember thinking that girl is really smart.
Gloria, you did a great -- I`m not even listening to what you`ve been talking about. Be proud of your daughter.
BLOOM: Well, thank you. It`s so sweet. I`m sorry for the loss of your mom. And I do have the bad habit of speaking too quickly in depositions and in court, and the court reporters hate me. So, sorry about that.
PINSKY: Speaking of speaking quickly, I got --
ALLRED: Let me just say I`m so proud of my daughter too, because as I always say, she lives her values, which is important.
ALLRED: She doesn`t just talk the talk. She lives her values. And that is what is so essential. And that`s why I`m so proud of her.
PINSKY: One other observation, you guys smile and beam in a way you don`t in any other circumstances than --
BLOOM: Because she`s so cute. Look at her. Look at how adorable she is, adorable. She`s not just the tough as nails fighter all the time.
PINSKY: You guys are great. I got to take a quick break. Thank you for sharing your birthday with us.
Gloria, thank you for staying an extra day in New York.
ALLRED: Thank you, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: I`ve got to take a quick break. I`ve got Kato Kaelin who is going to set things straight about the headlines about him today. And we`re talking your calls. Be right back.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: People hated me. I have been spat upon. They threw gum in my coffee. Those were the words of Brian Kato Kaelin, the infamous house guest of O.J. Simpson who was there the night Nicole Brown and Ron Goldman were murdered. Did O.J. do it? What does Kato know?
Eighteen years later, Kato Kaelin is here with me ready to tell the truth.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: OK. So here is the deal. We have Kato Kaelin. He became famous for being O.J. Simpson`s house guest.
He made headlines today for reasons that are somewhat confusing and we are going to get into this. He has elected to come here to discuss this. I do appreciate that. I want you to be able to set the record straight.
I also have Alki David, the founder of -- and CEO of film on TV networks. Of course Gloria and Lisa have agreed to stay with us as well again, spending Lisa`s birthday with us. I appreciate that.
All right now. So Kato, this morning you were living -- or yesterday you exercised, did your normal life, did your TV show. And what happened today?
KATO KAELIN, O.J. SIMPSON MURDER TRIAL WITNESS: So my phone is just ringing off the hook. And when I don`t recognize the number, I don`t pick up the phone and it just kept ringing, ringing, ringing. So finally, there`s these voice mails. I picked up the voice mail. And it was TMZ. And I said what is going on? And so, I went right to my computer and saw the article that said from the "New York Post" there was an article written about me --
PINSKY: Cindy Adams.
KAELIN: Cindy Adams wrote an article about me.
PINSKY: Here`s what she said.
PINSKY: Ask Kato today, this very minute if O.J. killed his wife and I repeat his exact words. The statue of limitations has now passed so I can now say yes, he did it, unquote. Doesn`t say she talked to you. Where does she get this from?
KAELIN: That`s what I don`t know.
PINSKY: Is that true?
KAELIN: Absolutely not.
PINSKY: It`s not true?
KAELIN: Absolutely not.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let`s get that bit settled first.
PINSKY: Not only that it was not you said. It is not true.
KAELIN: Exactly. Not what I said. Never talked to the post. Never talked to Cindy Adams, 100 percent untrue. I have been on shows that I expressed an opinion. On your show. My opinion is I think he`s guilty, can I prove it? Absolutely not.
PINSKY: I remember you saying no one ever asked you. And that`s why you never said these kinds of things. No one ever asked you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And there`s no statute of limitation of murder, so it doesn`t make any sense either.
PINSKY: So what are they talking about?
KAELIN: I know. I love the statue of liberty but what is this? I don`t know. I`m not a lawyer. And that`s why I said, this is not cattle talk.
PINSKY: All right. Let`s keep going.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`ve got a birthday gift for me.
PINSKY: Why didn`t he come forward and tell the truth? Ask why he let O.J. Simpson get away with murder. And I repeat his exact words, not to her, to somebody. Quote "I was too scared. I was terrified." You must have said that somewhere, it might be you were talking about Halloween. I don`t know what are you talking about.
KAELIN: Yes. I don`t understand how the media can work and how things can be said about a person, myself. Because, Drew, I got to tell you. I want to share with you guys. There`s twitter. There`s so many social medias. And people can be so mean and they are destroying me of calling me things I can`t say on your show.
It really affects a person no matter what. I mean, I got to -- it`s part of the job, I guess being out in a public figure. But oh, my God. They have no idea that this person wrote something that I never did an interview for. And yet they bring it up. They bring it up out in the public now. And I think about the Goldmans, I think about the Browns. They`re going through -- they`re saying oh, my God. They`re reliving this grief. And it`s God awful and I -I just want to get that out of the way.
PINSKY: You`re almost crying. You`re getting tears.
KAELIN: I was completely teary eyed today.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This man was crying in the studio.
PINSKY: But let`s -- here`s the deal. Print journalists can adjust language just a little bit and it can be devastating when that breaks into the social media. I have grave concerns about social media being an environment where people learn to be abusive and bullying to another human, a real guy and they think nothing of trying to destroy him. Think nothing.
GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIMS` RIGHT ATTORNEY: Yes.
PINSKY: I mean, people worried about video game.
ALLRED: Doctor Drew.
PINSKY: Gloria, please.
ALLRED: Dr. Drew, I was going to say double jeopardy which is a legal concept attached as soon as O.J. Simpson was acquitted in that criminal case. And that was many, many years ago. And so, even if there were a statute of limitations, Lisa`s right there is not for murder, he couldn`t be re-prosecuted for that crime.
PINSKY: Do you want to settle any of that business about did he do it and what your opinion is about that, just to kind of --?
KAELIN: Basically I think my opinion for whatever it matters is I think he`s guilty. Like I once again, I cannot prove it. He went through a first trial where the jury said he`s not guilty. So I kind of, that`s in the past. And I hate that it`s brought up again.
Honestly, Drew. I have not gone out looking for publicity. I`ve been inundated by calls.
PINSKY: Do you feel victimized by this?
KAELIN: I hate bringing it on me, because it`s not about me. I feel bad they`re bringing up the murders again for them, to the people that have to all the grief again.
PINSKY: The Goldmans and Browns.
KAELIN: The Goldmans and the Browns. It is terrible for them. and it`s - like a I said, it is not about me and I said to one of your produces, everybody called from the "Today" show, "Good Morning America" which I love and I said I don`t want to do any press at all. My life is so different. And then I decided -- first of all I have a relationship with you. To do this show and get this one show out there to do this one show and just go, listen. Not about me people, please.
PINSKY: Is there more you want to say? I want you to have the chance to sort of set it straight here. Is there more to be said to the people on twitter that are mistreating you, to the posts that you --?
ALKI DAVID, KATO KAELIN`S FRIEND: Sure. I mean, look, Kato works for my company. And he`s one of our if not our main host. He`s on live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays. And it`s very important for the company to maintain a good entertaining image and not to be maligned. And so, we will pursue the post legally for this liable. I mean, this is both slanderous and libelous. And they just can`t -- there must be an immediate retraction. And we will reserve all out rights and pursue all of our rights.
PINSKY: So, slander, libel, if they don`t retract this immediately. You will go after the Post.
DAVID: We Will go after them any way.
PINSKY: Whether they retract it or not.
DAVID: Whether they retract it or not. I mean, this is very, very damaging for him today. I mean, the flood of insults and abuse that have come in both to our station as well as to him directly and --
KAELIN: Not to mention a terrible picture of me. I`m kidding.
PINSKY: Also what`s the thing we heard with the win case recently where slander - with the sort of some things said on the Internet. There is now precedent for people taking pot shots at people in the public and having to pay the price for that.
LISA BLOOM, ATTORNEY: Right. Because -- listen, slander online is just the same thing as slander at a print newspaper or book or any of the old media. You can`t make false statements about something that`s going to malign them.
KAELIN: And there`s commercials -- have you seen all the commercials about saying you`re gay not do, you know, people shouldn`t say these things because it hurts people. It`s basically the same thing. It`s basically I`m the one -- there`s other people, but it`s the same thing.
PINSKY: It`s bullying.
KAELIN: It`s bullying. And it affects -- I wish I was Teflon. I wish it could bounce off me. Because I swear to you, Drew, my spirit is about having fun. And it really affects you. And you kind of like, oh, my God. Now I`ve got to be an introvert again.
PINSKY: Let me - I want you think about something. I`m going to go to break. I want to take some calls. But, think about what your feelings are about going back into a courtroom in a legal case again, is that something that you`ve -- think about it.
Got to go to break. I want to take your calls out there 855- DR DREW- 5. Everyone stays with me. Be right back.
PINSKY: OK. Again, Kato Kaelin has elected to come in here and set the record straight. The trial was so polarizing. People had just vehement feelings about him. I understand you`re thinking about hiring a bodyguard for tomorrow. Did I hear that right?
KAELIN: Well, here`s the deal. On my show I do a monologue. In my monologue, I always mention please, come down to our studio. We are located here. Come on in we have new couches from Sweden, it`s IKEA.
KAELIN: Come on sit with us. We always do a joke monologue and we invite people to come in right of the street of Beverly Hills.
PINSKY: But now, you are going to need some security there.
DAVID: Yes. We`ve upped the security. We just actually added a whole new set of locks and access to the building. But now, we have to --
PINSKY: Words, printed word has consequence, guys. It really does. It affects people`s life. Let`s get some calls. Blair in Texas -- Blair.
BLAIR, CALLER, TEXAS: Hey, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Hi, Blair.
BLAIR: I appreciate you taking my call. Hey, Kato. I have been following you ever since the O.J. trial 18 years ago. How you doing my friend?
KAELIN: Blair, look great. Nice to talk to you.
BLAIR: And I`ve got a question for you.
BLAIR: Have you ever had the opportunity to ask O.J. why he killed his wife and her friend? Because I still truly believe without a shadow of a doubt that that idiot did that.
PINSKY: OK. Hold on. What do you think?
KAELIN: Well --
PINSKY: Let me compare for a second. One thing you`re polarizing is people think Kato helped him get away with it.
KAELIN: Yes. Well, I think people think that. Now they really think it after that article which is just going back 18 years I guess. So yes, it`s a terrible thing. And Blair, my opinion is what I told Dr. Drew is -- once again, my opinion is that I think he`s guilty. And I never had an opportunity to talk to him. Last time I saw him was in a deposition for his second trial.
PINSKY: Dianna, West Virginia.
ALLRED: Dr. Drew, let me point out very important. Everyone should remember that a civil jury did find by clear and convincing evidence that he was, in fact, liable, that is responsible for the death of Nicole Brown Simpson and Ronald Goldman, may they rest in peace.
BLOOM: And he`s rotting in prison in Nevada on other criminal charges. He`s his own worst enemy.
ALLRED: He is in a very secure location.
PINSKY: Let me ask you Gloria and Lisa, people that are acquitted, they eventually -- if they are a criminal, in fact, don`t they eventually come around and do something else in.
BLOOM: Yes. You can`t help yourself. Especially if you have an ego the size of O.J. Simpson`s. I mean, there is no question. We all knew that it was going to happen eventually and that`s what it did. Now, he is a long term guest of the state of Nevada.
PINSKY: Dianna in West Virginia.
DIANNA, CALLER, WEST VIRGINIA: Hi, Dr. Drew. I would like to ask Kato how the involvement in the O.J. case has influenced his life and his relationships. And does he involve in any way in helping women of abusive relationships?
KAELIN: That`s a good question. I do tons of charity. That charity, I have been to a few where my name has on it, where I do an event and show up. But I`m tied more to a make a difference charity. I do (INAUDIBLE), actually for FOX`s NFL analyst and I do any kind of charities to help. But, yes -- and I was telling Drew and Lisa and Alki over here, my spirit is always about the light. So I end everything with be a moth, chase the light. And that`s what I live by.
PINSKY: But, what is this mean to you. I want people to understand what you`re feeling today. I`m not sure it gets through on television. I see - I know as I see how upset you are. I mean, I feel like you`re not going to sleep tonight.
KAELIN: No. Like I -- this -- first of all, like I said, when I get these things I wish I could make them think bounce off me when I hear negative things about me. It`s so hurtful that there`s so much hate. When you hear that it`s like oh, my God, I`m going back 18 years. It was so hard, Drew, for me to get to where I`m at now, to work with Alki and to have a show. It is so hard.
PINSKY: Do you have PTSD from what happened 18 years ago, do you think? It`s like revoking --? Is it a post-traumatic stress reaction or is it just --?
PINSKY: I knew that meant. I know DMB too. I don`t know medical terms. I don`t think so. I think I`m to get enough what I do. It does bring me down and I do get very, very sad. It affects my being. I can get over it, but it does take that time. And it takes away from who I am. And it`s just like I said. It`s going back in time. And I hate reliving that. And it is such a negative feeling. And to know that people driving out on the street, being anywhere, I think they read the story. And when you think they read a story you`re going oh, my God, the guy looked at me different. He hates my guts. It affects me.
DAVID: You should tell about the interview we set up at the prison.
PINSKY: OK. Hold that. Hold it. We will talk about it after the break. I want to get as many calls here as well. Again, 855-373-7395. Gloria and Lisa will stay with us. Be right back.
PINSKY: I`m back with Kato Kaelin. I think you agree it`s a different Kato Kaelin than you remember from 18 years ago. And you were saying it`s funny, ironic funny that you are the number one trending topic on yahoo right now.
KAELIN: Incredible. I don`t even follow that. I was told by other people. I thought I married a Kardashian.
KAELIN: Which one is available.
PINSKY: The sex tape. There is a sex tape. Put out a sex tape. You`ll be fine.
BLOOM: That`s what trends. It`s the negative stuff.
KAELIN: Kim, quit blocking the camera.
BLOOM: Don`t believe the gossip columns, people.
PINSKY: Let`s get some calls. Michelle in Michigan -- Michelle.
MICHELLE, CALLER, MICHIGAN: Hi. I have a question, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Yes ma`am.
MICHELLE: It seems that these -- the more celebrity cases that keep coming on and keep coming on, it just seems that they`re -- like they want to draw, you know, celebrity statue from that.
PINSKY: You mean -- let me ask this. You mean Kato developed a celebrity status by being around O.J.
PINSKY: OK. How do you respond to that?
KAELIN: That`s a great question. But it`s so untrue because I never chased it. The trial sort of happened. I became a celebrity through the media that after testifying the first time ever, people knew who Kato was. I didn`t go searching for that. I was the same person but people responded.
PINSKY: Let me ask you. Are there tough questions that people can ask you now that makes you nervous. Because I - you said the networks are calling you every once --. What do they want to ask you? Are they going to attack you for letting O.J. get away with it? Is that what they want? Is that what makes you nervous? I don`t understand what they want to ask you.
KAELIN: Exactly. What do they want to ask me? Because , me saying, I didn`t do the article. I never talked to the post, Cindy Adams`. OK, the story is over. It`s done. You would think.
BLOOM: Let me say. Kato Kaelin is not responsible for O.J. Simpson being acquitted. You know, I covered that trial. I read about five books that analyzed it afterwards. Not a single intelligent person thinks Kato Kaelin is responsible for that acquittal. You know, there was the whole defense team. There was the prosecution that mistakes were made. It was triad in the wrong court. I mean, there are a lot of problems with that case. Doesn`t boil down to one -- sorry, but relatively minor witness in that trial.
PINSKY: Sorry. But as your mom mentioned, has Gloria mentioned, he was found guilty in the civil trial. And so --
ALLRED: He was found liable, Dr. Drew. And by the way, it would not have been proper and it would not have been admissible for Kato to say I think he`s guilty or I think he is not guilty from the witness stand of the criminal case.
BLOOM: Good point.
PINSKY: Which is exactly why no one asked him. That was not his role.
BLOOM: His lawyers would not be allowed of that.
PINSKY: I have not got to enough calls yet. I want to try to do that in the segment. Please stay with us.
PINSKY: I want to get to calls, but I have one more thing that`s going to hopefully put a cap on this story. I want you to tell them what the plan is.
DAVID: In six weeks we have planned an interview between O.J. and Kato.
PINSKY: What would you say to people who say this is all publicity for that? Because I didn`t know about that.
DAVID: Not at all. I mean, I woke up this morning with him screaming down the phone. This is certainly not publicity.
PINSKY: This will just be another --
DAVID: Sure. In fact, I`d like to invite Lisa to take on the case and sort of write some rude letters to the post and follow up.
PINSKY: Lisa, do you accept?
BLOOM: Let`s talk about it off camera.
PINSKY: OK. Fair enough. Let`s go to Christa in Iowa -- Christa.
CHRISTA, CALLER, IOWA: Hi, Dr. Drew. Thank you for taking my call.
CHRISTA: I just tweeted today first to Kato, I wanted to say first to Kato, I want to express my sympathy for what you`re going through. And I am -- I am just livid about this. Because people -- I feel like right now you`re even being put on trial by the general public. Even by callers that call in and possibly misunderstand, but they`re asking you questions about the O.J. trial when I feel like they should be supporting you and showing compassion. And really being angry at the media for putting you through this.
PINSKY: How does it make you feel to hear that?
KAELIN: I love it. And once again, I want it deflected off me because it really is about the families. It is. And it --
PINSKY: The Goldmans and the Browns.
KAELIN: The Goldmans and the Browns to bring it back. And for people to write an article and bring up something that`s the past and now you have to go through grief again, regardless. Because it`s fresh in your mind, it`s a terrible thing.
PINSKY: Again, the --
ALLRED: Dr. Drew, let me just say --
PINSKY: Go ahead, Gloria.
ALLRED: Dr. Drew, let me just say. O.J. Simpson testified under oath in the civil trial. He was not believed by the civil jury and therefore they found that he was liable. So, I don`t know what he`s going to say to Kato Kaelin in six weeks, but I can tell you this. He had the greatest lie detector test of all, the jury. And jury in the civil case did not believe him and his denials.
PINSKY: And also, I want to say that the print media is so desperate now for survival, they will do a lot of things like this. And this is also an example of the brutality of social media. Remember, our young people are out there under the scrutiny of social media and getting beat up like this. They may not be equipped. They are not an adult. This may be a warning shot you were one of the first victims of something we may hear more about this as time goes on.
Kato, thank you. I hope you have said it.
KAELIN: Thank you so much. Be a moth, chase the light.
PINSKY: There you go. Fair enough.
Thank you to Gloria from New York. Thank Gloria, for staying on for this show tonight. Lisa on your birthday, thank you for joining us.
BLOOM: Thank you, everyone.
PINSKY: Kato of course. And Alki, thank you for choosing to speak on our show about this topic. Hopefully this kind a put the stress. You can kind of dock him. People can get over this.
All right. Thank you for calling. Thank you for watching. I`ll see you next time.
Nancy Grace, begins right now.