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Justin Bieber`s Mom Tells All

Aired October 10, 2012 - 21:00   ET



DR. DREW PINSKY, HOST (voice-over): Sex, lies and cardio tape. A Zumba instructor is accused of using a studio as a brothel, filming sex sessions with the a client list that reportedly includes local mayors.

Then, sexual abuse, drugs and a suicide attempt. The mom of one of the biggest stars written a book revealing the most personal, intimate, and traumatic details about her life. Justin Bieber`s mom Pattie Mallette is here live.

And later, the real life soap opera of Jodi Barrus, a teacher who`s falsely accused of having sex with a student. She lost her marriage and she says she is still paying the price for a crime she didn`t commit.

Let`s get started.


PINSKY: All right. First, the town of Kennebunkpo -- Kennebunk, which is next to Kennebunk, Maine. They are on pins and needles as residents wait for authorities to release a list, this list contains the names of up 150 people who allegedly had sex with a fitness instructor who is allegedly running a prostitution ring out of her Zumba -- it`s incredible.

Alexis Wright had pleaded not guilty to 106 counts of prostitution, violation of privacy and tax evasion.

Joining me to discuss, Sam Phillips, radio talk show host, and by Skype, attorney Kenneth P. Altshuler, and divorce lawyer and radio host in Kennebunk, Maine.

Kenneth, I understand there`s well-known local figures on this list, as well. Can you tell us what you have heard?

KENNETH P. ALTSHULER, DIVORCE ATTORNEY: I can. Rumors are flying and they say there`s prominent names on this list -- lawyers, doctors, firemen. We have a town manager. We have a well-known TV anchorman or woman. We`re not quite sure which one. And we have a cattle rancher.

PINSKY: How is it you have access to this list? How -- you can`t give your sources?

ALTSHULER: Well, we`ve been talking about this quite sometime around here and it`s a -- you know, this is a small community. And people talk. The police officers, you know, that are investigating it have been letting information.

So remember this all started by a blogger who over a year ago said that Alexis Wright is not innocent person she appears to be. So, there`s been a lot of Facebook. There`s been a lot of Twitter.

And remember, she also has videos that have been posted on pay for view, so a lot of this information is out for a year and just no names assigned to the faces.

PINSKY: Now, your little town has I understand about 3,000 people, 150 people on the list. This means everybody`s going to really probably know somebody on this list, right? Are people freaking out about this?

ALTSHULER: Yes. There have been people trying to have the media not cover this. We have had people who have tried to plead guilty before being charged to not have the publicity for this. We have had people who have offered to pay to have this go away.

So, yes, everybody will know somebody who`s involved in this.

PINSKY: Now, why shouldn`t people be allowed to pay for their crime but not have it go public? I think that would be a reasonable, Sam. Do you agree?

SAM PHILLIPS, RADIO HOST: From what I understand, prostitution is illegal.

PINSKY: No, but let`s say a guy steps up to the court and goes, you know what, judge? I did this but please keep my name out of the papers and, you know, I`m guilty. I`ll plead guilty. Let me stay out of this thing.

PHILLIPS: I -- I feel that you`re engaging in a risky behavior so you`re running the risk of getting caught.

PINSKY: So they should just come with whatever consequences come?

PHILLIPS: Well, that`s what happens when you -- and forgive me.

PINSKY: When you go to a prostitute that happens.

PHILLIPS: My perverts and deviant fan base will be against me saying this but I don`t -- I feel if you have committed what`s --

PINSKY: A crime.

PHILLIPS: -- a crime.


PHILLIPS: That you should atone and pay for it.

And, obviously, what everyone`s freaking out that the names are going to be made public, clearly -- look at the people that are the names on this list. They`re newsmakers. They`re big people in this town.

PINSKY: Public figures.

PHILLIPS: Yes. So --

PINSKY: So people should know about it is what you`re saying?

PHILLIPS: Well, I think that there`s a whole host of wives that need to be told what`s going on by their husband`s personally before it`s made public. And then similarly, if there`s some lawsuit or case happens, aren`t these people named in a suit? Isn`t it going to be made public at some point?

PINSKY: Well, Ken, no matter what, is this made public?

ALTSHULER: Oh, yes. They said they`ll release the names, probably released as early as Friday. They have already begun sending summons out to as they characterize them the Johns or the John Does.

And remember, there`s videotape evidence on all of these people. So they have the evidence.

Now the question is, was Alexis Wright planning on blackmailing the people? She was selling them of on the pay for view videos.

So, yes. You know, the bottom line here is that this was very public. This was in the middle of Kennebunk. People knew about this. It`s open and notorious. There were cars driving up, men getting out. Spending 30 minutes in Zumba lessons and then leaving.

So, it was well-known around the neighborhood what was going on.


ALTSHULER: It took the police a year to investigate.

PINSKY: It`s incredible.

So I want to make sure I really understand this. Did she actually have Zumba classes? Did women go and take Zumba classes while the husbands had extracurricular activities there?

ALTSHULER: No. She did have lessons. She`s evidently a very good Zumba instructor. However, the extracurricular activities were on other hours, but in the middle of the day. So she would have classes that were scheduled particular times.

PINSKY: Let me ask this. Was she well liked? In addition to being a good instructor, was she somebody that was liked by the community and supported?

ALTSHULER: I think that there was some women who knew that the husbands doing more than lessons, and I think that`s what started some of the Facebook postings and some of the blogging.

So I think there were some jealous women who were exposing her as not the nice, innocent women she appears to be.

And, by the way, it`s more than jealousy. I mean, these women should be mortified.

Let`s go to Marisa in Pennsylvania.

Marissa, what do you got?

MARISA, CALLER FROM PENNSYLVANIA: Hi, Dr. Drew. You have my biggest and deepest respect. I think you`re wonderful.

PINSKY: Thanks, Marisa. It`s very kind.

MARISA: Here`s what I don`t understand -- who cares? If their congressman or judges or the mayor, who cares? There`s regular men out there doing this, too? What about those men. We`re just supposed to care about the congressman? They cheat and have sex all over the place anyway.

I mean, really? Why are we making this such a big deal? There`s other situations going on, other men. And this goes on all the time --

PINSKY: Marisa, did you have a personal experience with this? Somebody --

MARISA: No. But what bothers me, is the fact that -- I mean, there`s poor women out there don`t suspect this and then this is made a big deal because they`re congressmen or they`re some a political figure? How about the women whose husbands aren`t anything and they`re out there running around doing this?

PINSKY: I couldn`t agree with you more. Certainly, those women`s husbands are going to be on this list as well.

Now, on the phone I`ve got Dan Breton. He`s a store owner in Kennebunk.

And as I understand, Dan, your child goes to the same school as Alexis Wright`s son. Alexis, this is this woman accused of running the prostitution ring from her Zumba camp. She`s a single mom.

So, Dan, let me ask you. Are the parents aware of what`s going on? Is this sort of something that`s discussed or had been discussed before the rest of the country found out about it?

DAN BRETON, STORE OWNER IN KENNEBUNK, ME (via telephone): Well, Hi, Dr. Drew. How are you?

PINSKY: Hi, Dan.

BRETON: I think it started off like a little snowball on top of a mountain and now as, you know, as the articles started coming out in the papers, a lot of the hearsay that was going around, now, it`s a big old snowball.

PINSKY: Dan, let me ask you.


PINSKY: Same thing I asked Ken. Was she a mom in your kindergarten community that`s well-liked or well-supported? Are people mortified that this is happening?

BRETON: I think people are taken aback. I think her Zumba class was pretty popular and I think, a lot of women taking it.

PINSKY: This is like a "Saturday Night Live" skit.

BRETON: Yes. I think they were taken aback. I have seen her around. I have seen her around elementary school events.

PINSKY: right. That`s my question. Is she someone that was a supported member of that little community with your kids or with her kids? And parents support one another. And is this now a shock that this woman that they were, you know, connected to in a community --

PHILLIPS: It`s a betrayal.

PINSKY: -- is betraying them. Right. And maybe worrying about the husbands that might have been clients. Is that what`s going around?

BRETON: There`s a lot of unknown. That`s the big word. We don`t know.

I mean, we hear these leaks about these prominent names on the list and all these husbands. I can tell you that Kennebunk is a little bit bigger than 3,000 from what you said. It`s about 10,000 and about pretty close to 10,000. It`s a little bit bigger community.

But, you know, people there`s just a lot of unknown. And I can tell you the people that come in to my store, you know, there`s a lot of anticipation of what names may be on the list but now that they`re beginning to feel, you know, somewhat -- you know, somewhat sad for what`s going to happen.

PINSKY: Thank you, Dan. Yes. It is sad. It is a sad story and I guess the list is going to come out on Friday and we will keep on top of this.

And thank you, Ken, as well.

Sam, thank you for your thoughts. Hope you didn`t offend your fan base.

PHILLIPS: No, I hope not.

PINSKY: Next up, I have Justin Bieber`s mom. She is here. She`s written a book. She`s going to talk about really intense childhood traumas that she was able to overcome to become the person she is today and we`ll talk about her book. She`s right here with us. Don`t go away.


PINSKY: All right. Well, until now, most of us knew my next guest as Justin Bieber`s mom. But Pattie Mallette has recently opened up recently about some deep secrets in her past. She`s written a book called "Nowhere But Up."

Pattie, I read the book. I found it deeply moving in lot of ways. I think some people might find it actually troubling. And the thing -- the sort of headline that struck me was you`ve been through some really intense trauma. Now, I want to talk about and I think you were incredibly honest and it will help other people --


PINSKY: -- who have been through similar things and common things these days.


PINSKY: But how did you go from there to where you are now?

MALLETTE: A lot of hard work.

PINSKY: Is that professional help?

MALLETTE: I did. I had a lot of -- a lot of counseling and therapy and for me, my faith was a big part of me getting better. So a lot of prayer and just a lot of -- pretty tenacious.

PINSKY: Let`s take people back to what happened. The first episode was with little kids playing doctor, right? Tell us about that.

MALLETTE: Yes. You know, even writing it was furthering my healing process. It was really tough to write and even talking about it, it`s still --

PINSKY: Do you feel OK talking about it?

MALLETTE: You know, I was -- I was playing doctor with a bunch of kids and thermometers ended up in places they shouldn`t.

PINSKY: If I remember, crayons they were using or something goofy like that or actual thermometers?


PINSKY: A lot of people call and say I`ve never been sexually abused. But I play doctor like everybody did.

There`s playing doctor and there`s playing doctor.

MALLETTE: Yes. That`s where I started. When I was 5 years old, it started two ongoing abusers for five years --

PINSKY: The babysitter?

MALLETTE: I specifically don`t reveal in the book --

PINSKY: That`s fine.

MALLETTE: -- who -- yes.

PINSKY: But there`s five years of overt sexual abuse, five to 10.

And then usual what ensues, drug use and chaotic relationships and being in situations you shouldn`t be in?

MALLETTE: Yes. You know, because of at 2 years old, my parents split. My dad abandoned us, moved really far away. I didn`t meet him again until he was 9 -- until I was 9. Sorry.

And then all the sexual abuse that happened when I was younger sort of spiraled everything out of control until, you know, as a teenager I was going a lot of drugs and alcohol.

PINSKY: We are looking at a picture of a smiling little girl. You see that picture down there, maybe see it over here.


PINSKY: You know, a lot of people can`t imagine that`s a girl being sexually abused.

MALLETTE: Yes. It`s --

PINSKY: What do you think when you see that picture?

MALLETTE: It makes me really sad. You know? I don`t think any child should have to go through that.

PINSKY: And yet, at that moment, in the picture, were you suffering deeply? Although we look at the smiling exterior, inside things were shattered?

MALLETTE: Things were shattered, yes. There was a lot of confusion and a lot of my purity had been taken at a really young age.

PINSKY: How bad did it get?

MALLETTE: You know, through the therapy, I learned that it was severe sexual abuse and --

PINSKY: Can you take us to your darkest moments in that? Again, what I want to do is help people understand, a lot of people go through stuff like this.


PINSKY: How you then survive and thrive. Let`s go to the moments that were intense. Did you have darkest moments?

MALLETTE: I think that for me I -- when things -- when the sexual abuse was happening, I would almost escape my body and everybody has their own coping mechanisms and we`re built to survive just ridiculous things that happen to us in our life.

And so, while I coped and I survived through such horrendous acts, you know, in my childhood, it was years later that I started feeling even more of the effects.

PINSKY: So, let me help the viewers understand what you described. What she is described, Pattie is describing disassociation -- really connect, out of body. May be imaging yourself hovering over yourself who when these things are happening. And then becomes a freeze response, whenever you`re threaten in the future and victimizers seem to see that, know that, and many more victimizations I`m sure happened. Were there rapes later?

MALLETTE: When I lost my virginity, it was actually a date rape and but during the years of sexual abuse, there was, you know, it was -- it was -- there was no penetration.

PINSKY: Right. But when it did finally happen, it was under forced circumstances. You didn`t want it. It`s awful. People forget, this is Justin Bieber`s mom.


PINSKY: How`s it for him to hear all this? Did he know it already?

MALLETTE: It`s difficult for him to hear this stuff about his mom, you know? But I`m not stuck in that place and that`s the point of, you know, why I wanted to write this book, is just to say, you know, if I can overcome it, you can, too.

PINSKY: Well, that`s the theme I want to paint here for you is for viewers, is that you really -- I mean, I recommend the book. If anyone wants to read a really, really good detailed conversation of what it feels like to be in that situation and I know millions of women have been through what you have been through and yet many continue to use drugs, many continue to stay in horrible relationships, many -- we may find out that woman I reported who`s a prostitute in Kennebunk had been an abuse survivor and that was her way of dealing with it.

How can we urge people to start moving in the right direction?

MALLETTE: I say reach out for help. You know? For me, I couldn`t afford proper counseling, but there was so many churches that even offered help.

PINSKY: So reach for others? Trust others. In your book, you said you have trouble trusting still. But you had enough trust to reach snout.

MALLETTE: I had no other options. I wasn`t going to stay stuck. I was in such deep depression and darkness that I didn`t want to stay stuck there.

PINSKY: When we come back, I`m going to have Pattie tell us a story about nearly getting in front of a Mack truck. That was a dark moment, right?


PINSKY: You get sad when you just think about that. We got lots of calls for you as well.

And then later, a teacher who`s falsely accused of having sex with a student pays a steep price for her innocence. Her story is going to have you angry, frankly.

Be right back.


PINSKY: We are back with Justin Bieber`s mom, Pattie.

I want to play a clip of a public service announcement by Emmanuel Lewis, a kid who played Webster in the `80s. Yes. You`re taking a deep breath.

I understand this is a significant thing for you to have watched. Take a look at this PSA.


EMANNUEL LEWIS, ACTOR: Sometimes grown-ups touch kids in ways they don`t like.

UNIDENTIFIED KID: I was wrestling with my uncle and it changed. It felt icky.

LEWIS: When something feels funny, it`s hard to know what to do.

UNIDENTIFIED KID: He said I shouldn`t tell anyone.

LEWIS: If that ever happens to you, say no.


PINSKY: That affected you, didn`t it?


PINSKY: You`re crying now when you watch it.


That public service announcement in a lot of ways saved my life. You know, I`d been going through ongoing sexual abuse for five years up to that point. And when I saw that commercial, I thought, say no? It can`t be that easy.

And it -- I just couldn`t shake it. And I finally got up enough courage that the next time my abuser started his routine, I got up enough courage to whisper the word no. And then again, I said it a little louder, no. I don`t want to do this anymore. And miraculously, he said, OK. And --

PINSKY: It was confusing to you?

MALLETTE: It was confusing. But ultimately, it stopped so that PSA sort of gave me the voice I never had and that`s sort of the reason why I wanted to write this book is to help others find a voice that, you know, have a voice today that I never had as a child and help others.

PINSKY: I`m actually getting chills as I hear your story. I wonder if that sort of moment if, you know, again, it`s listening to other people, taking it in, and doing something different. Just that little turn may have been where you started getting better.

MALLETTE: Yes. Somebody, you know, gave me permission, you know, to say no and to have courage. And it made all the difference in the world. And, you know, ironically, I felt guilty thinking that it was my fault that I didn`t say no sooner since that`s sort of all it took. But --

PINSKY: There were two perpetrators that point, too. Did you say no right away?

MALLETTE: I did, I did. And, again, it stopped.

You know, I can only think that they obviously knew it was wrong and they must have been struggling with their own guilt or something for that long because it`s never a child`s fault. I know now looking back that it was not my fault.

PINSKY: Though you felt that it was.

MALLETTE: Though I felt at the time if I had said no sooner, it could have stopped a long time ago. Again, it was not my fault just because I didn`t do that but I felt it at the time.

PINSKY: It`s an incredible story.

MALLETTE: Thank you.


But let`s see if a caller wants to add something here.

Hannah in Maryland -- Hannah.


PINSKY: Hi, Hannah.

HANNAH: Hi, Dr. Drew. Hi, Pattie.

MALLETTE: Hi, Hannah.

HANNAH: I have a question for you.


HANNAN: What advice would you give to teen moms out there?

MALLETTE: I would give the advice to, you know, surround yourself with good people. Surround your kids with good people and yes. It`s hard to try to do it alone but there`s help out there.

PINSKY: Hannah, are you a teen mom?


PINSKY: How old are you?

HANNAH: Sixteen.

PINSKY: Sixteen and pregnant?


MALLETTE: Wow. Are you -- you`re pregnant right now?

HANNAH: Yes. I`m 23 weeks.

MALLETTE: Oh. Are you scared?

HANNAH: A little. But I have a lot of support from my family and friends.

MALLETTE: Oh, good. That`s so important.

PINSKY: You know, that is the difference. Do not expect necessarily the father to stick around. That`s statistically is not likely but your family is what makes a difference. Without them, survival is in question for you and your child.

Also, you might want to look at Tyler and Catelynn`s story from "16 and Pregnant," they chose adoption, which is a really interesting option for some teen parents as well. I`ve got to take a break.

I want to get to the story of you walking out in front of the truck. You`ve been so forthcoming with your feelings and, I could talk to you all day. So, are you ready to tell that story after the break?

MALLETTE: Yes, I am.

PINSKY: So for those of you who want to talk to Pattie, 855-373-7395.

Be right back.



PINSKY (voice-over): Sexual abuse, drugs, and a suicide attempt. The mom of one of the world`s biggest stars has written a book revealing the most personal, intimate and traumatic details about her life. Justin Bieber`s mom, Pattie Mallette, is here live.

And later, a real-life soap opera of Jodie Barris (ph), a teacher who is falsely accused of having sex with a student. She lost her marriage and she says she is still paying the price for a crime she didn`t commit.


PINSKY (on-camera): OK. Pattie Mallette, Justin Bieber`s mom is still here with us. The book is "Nowhere But Up." It is a very compelling chronicle of a life of very serious childhood abuse and the road to recovery. You and I were talking during the break about substance abuse. You got deeply into substances, but I was telling you, I don`t think you`re a drug addict.

PATTIE MALLETTE, JUSTIN BIEBER`S MOTHER: Yes. You know, during the time, I definitely abused drugs and alcohol. And for me, I think it was a way of self-medicating from all the childhood pain.

PINSKY: And gluing yourself back together.

MALLETTE: Somewhat. An escaping reality. Yes.

PINSKY: And reality being the horrible feelings inside.


PINSKY: Yes. And, let`s go to some calls. This is Lisa in Canada. Lisa, you got something for us?

LISA, CANADA: Hi, Dr. Drew and hi, Pattie.


LISA: I have question for you, Pattie. Has writing the book given you any closure?

MALLETTE: Oh. Writing the book was definitely part of my healing process. I don`t know about closure, because I don`t think I`ll ever completely arrive, but I`m much healthier today than I was when I was younger, yes.

PINSKY: If we were talking to the young girl -- let`s throw up some pictures of Pattie as an adolescent. Do we have pictures of her? And if we were talking to her, that young girl, what would she be like sitting here? Would she be anxious, difficult to be in her own skin? Anything from the teenage years.

MALLETTE: The 1980s.

PINSKY: Yes. The 1980s. Any of those pictures from the 1980s.

MALLETTE: The 1980s hair.

PINSKY: What would she be like?

MALLETTE: She was pretty rebellious. Angry.

PINSKY: Angry.


PINSKY: If I asked her to talk about -- I`m going to show you guys -- come back here to me and I`ve got some of these 1980s pictures you can zero in on maybe. If I were talking -- there she is down there in the -- in this corner here. If I were talking to that young lady, nice 1980s hair --


PINSKY: Would she -- if I were to ask her about these things such as her abuse or depression or substance abuse, would she be able to talk about those things?

MALLETTE: I don`t think so. No. It was only about five or six years ago that I really started digging deep into it just from all the affects of the anxiety and the depression over the years. I was in a lot of denial like a lot of people I`ve talked to have similar stories. They say, well, you know, I was sexually abused, too. That stuff happened to me, but it doesn`t really affect me.

PINSKY: They always say that.

MALLETTE: It`s OK with me. It didn`t really affect me.

PINSKY: Doesn`t bother me anymore.

MALLETTE: It doesn`t bother me anymore. You know, that was then. This is now. Unfortunately, it`s -- if you don`t ever deal with it, it`s still in there and it may not affect you on a conscious level, but it affected me on -- you know, my anxiety, my depression, extremely forgetful. disorganized, losing things. You know? It`s just the sadness.

PINSKY: The sadness. Walk me through that moment when you almost stepped in front of a truck.

MALLETTE: Well, you know, like I said, when I was -- during my teen years, sort of everything had come to a head. I had, you know, the abandonment, the abuse, the -- I had just not a healthy relationship with my parents, just fighting a lot.

And, by the time I was 17, add on to that, drug and alcohol abuse, and just everything sort of came to a head and spiraled out of control until the day I decided I wanted the take my life. So, I -- I had just gotten in to an argument, a fight with my boyfriend at the time.

And, you know, some horrible words were exchanged and I was just fearful of all this pain and fearful of people finding out about, you know, my past and what had happened to me.

PINSKY: The abuse. He was going to tell people about the abuse.


PINSKY: Which you felt responsible for still then.

MALLETTE: Well, I just --

PINSKY: Or ashamed of.

MALLETTE: Yes. I was in a lot of shame.


MALLETTE: And a lot of pain. And so, just I panicked and I just wanted to die. And, so --

PINSKY: How did you not die? You walked in front of a truck.

MALLETTE: Well, you know, I thought about cutting my -- slitting my wrists and waiting to bleed out. I didn`t know how long that would take. I didn`t have the guts for that. You know, in Canada, they don`t have a lot of guns around, so I just thought what`s the quickest way to die?

And selfishly, I thought about my sister. My sister had been killed by a car when I was in my mother`s womb.

PINSKY: Oh my goodness.

MALLETTE: And so, I knew that that, you know, that had worked and I wasn`t thinking about the affect I would have on anybody else. I just thought of the immediate escape now. And so, I went out and in front of my house and I thought I timed it perfectly. There was a big truck coming down the road and I jumped out in front of it.

And it -- it -- there was another -- there was a street here and a street here and I jumped out in front of it and it screeched on the brakes and it tilted over and landed in the street beside it and didn`t even touch me.

PINSKY: Oh my goodness.

MALLETTE: And I was embarrassed. I was devastated. I still wanted to die.

PINSKY: You were hospitalized after that. You chronicled that in the book, but there`s a reason you lived.


PINSKY: And we`re all sort of the beneficiaries of that.


PINSKY: OK. More with Pattie. More of your calls when we come back.


PINSKY: I`m here with Justin Bieber`s mom. Her name is Pattie Mallette and she`s written a book, "Nowhere but Up." We`ve been talking about the tremendous courage of being able to tell a story that many people have lived through. And I was telling you during the break that I felt like you really owned the narrative of your life which is what we`re looking for when people heal.

And before I go to call, let me do say this, that so much of what we see out on the press and TMZ and in the tabloids is young celebrities with tumultuous relationships with their parents, particularly, if the parents had difficult pasts.


PINSKY: And we don`t see that with you and Justin. Why is it so different?

MALLETTE: I don`t know. I think every situation is different. And for me I`ve, you now, been extremely intentional about getting healing. And I think that makes a big difference.

PINSKY: Has he participated with you in that? Has he had to be a part of the therapeutic process?

MALLETTE: You know, we`ve done some family counseling, but a lot of it, I had to do on my own.

PINSKY: And does he discuss with you any feelings he`s had? Has he read the book?

MALLETTE: Yes. He wrote the foreword.

PINSKY: Did he have reaction to it?

MALLETTE: Yes. It was difficult for him to read parts of it, you know, knowing I`m his mom, and he knew a lot of it beforehand, but, yes.

PINSKY: Did he cry?



MALLETTE: There were tears.

PINSKY: I would imagine.

MALLETTE: Yes. He`s been very supportive, though, because he knows that the only reason why I wrote this book is to help other people that have gone through similar things. And he, you know, holds that belief that it`s going to make a difference. He`s seen it, you know?



PINSKY: Let`s go to some calls. Cindy in Wisconsin -- Cindy.

CINDY, WISCONSIN: Hi, Dr. Drew. Hi, Pattie.


CINDY: Hey, I just want to commend you on your journey to healing and your vigilance in trying to move past the dark ways in your life.

MALLETTE: Thank you.

CINDY: And I really think it`s awesome that you can be an inspiration. I can relate to so many things that you`ve said. I, myself, am just getting out of an extremely dating domestic violent relationship. And what I found is that until I looked at the abuse from my childhood, that pattern would just continue.


CINDY: And so, I guess, I wanted to ask you, if you came to a place where, like, where I`m at right now, I have a lot of rage and just feeling like so much of -- so many things have been taken away from me and how you handle that rage --


CINDY: -- and look through it.

MALLETTE: Yes. I think there`s a definite healthy time and place for that anger. It belongs there. You know, you just don`t want to get stuck there. You don`t want to stay angry and that`s why I think it`s so important to find people to talk to and to talk through it with. For me, my faith was really helpful, and so, I screamed at God a lot and I prayed through a lot of it. So --

PINSKY: Faith and others. I think those are the two things. Connecting to other, faith, those are the two ingredients that people need and trusting both --


PINSKY: -- which is hard for a trauma survivor.


PINSKY: And so, for this young lady that`s calling us, reach out, get help. There`s domestic help hotline. There`s people -- at every community, there`s domestic violence, shelters. Get help. Get out before things get awful.


PINSKY: Now, Pattie, I think I said I was going to let you go, but I`m not. I`m going to keep you here. This is too much, OK. Are you enjoying this?

MALLETTE: I`m enjoying it.

PINSKY: OK. Well, good, because you`ve been a great guest, and I want to get more into this. I do -- the control room would tell me I do want to tell that Jodie Barris (ph) story. I`ve been sort of promoting -- all right. So, maybe one more segment if you don`t mind.


PINSKY: Let`s, during the break, talk about what is the one sort of thing we want people to know. Oh, do I have to do that now? They`re telling me I have to do something -- I`m doing something called "our Country Votes" first before I go to break. So, it`s time for that.


PINSKY: Pattie Mallette, Justin Bieber`s mom, has ended up being such a good guest. I`ve moved the rest of the show around, and as a result, created a lot of technical problems for myself. "Our Country Votes" that I (INAUDIBLE) before that commercial will be happening shortly. Live TV, of course.

We`re going to keep Pattie in this segment and take more of your calls. Jodie Barris (ph), a story that I think is very important. I`m going to introduce you to her towards the end of the show, and then, we will do her story tomorrow.

So, let`s go to calls. Patty in Florida -- Patty.

PATTY, FLORIDA: Yes. This is similar to the call before about anger and resentment. I am almost 60 years old and I was sexually abused by my father in the 1960s. So, there was so little information, the media coverage of there is today and books like Pattie has written and so appreciated now because it helps me in my healing process.

PINSKY: Great.

PATTY: First time -- last several years I feel like I`ve been in a good place. My father`s been dead for 30 years. It was a lot of emotional work. But now, my mother is diagnosed with terminal cancer and the resentment that I have toward my mother now, it is so consuming and I`m -- takes me back to that place and I`m having a hard --

PINSKY: It`s a common thing to resent the parent that didn`t rescue you or who brought the perpetrator in to the household. That`s a common feeling. Can you relate to that?

MALLETTE: I can. You know, I`ve had to work through some issues, you know, with my own parents. They -- my parents are great parents. But neither one of them knew what was going on.

PINSKY: And that would make you angry as a child. Why didn`t you protect me from this?

MALLETTE: Right, right. But, you know, it took me some working through. I knew that there was, you know, it was a busy house. They had no reason to think that anything was going on, but I totally understand that resentment.

PINSKY: And you were able to let go of it?

MALLETTE: Yes. I had to work through. I think forgiveness is a huge part, but it`s a process.

PINSKY: Resentment will eat you up.


PINSKY: Well, that`s the thing I want to sort of focus on. Your story -- you own your story. And you`ve written something in the back of the book. Do you want to read this to people because I think -- or do you want to just say it in your own words?

MALLETTE: Yes, I can read it. I was just saying that -- it summarizes that, you know, what I want to say is that, you know, "whether you`re a single mom, an addict, a victim of abuse, whether you`re on the verge of bankruptcy or the brink of divorce, whether you`re in a dysfunctional family or the product of a broken home, battling depression or struggling with anxiety, living in fear or hiding in shame, abandoned, rejected, ignored, there`s hope."

"So, it doesn`t matter where you find yourself today, how broken, hurting, wounded or ashamed you are. If God can help me find my way up, I promise, he can do the same for you."

And so that`s just my story is to bring hope because when I was in the deepest, darkest places, I would look at someone else and say, you were there and you`re not anymore? How did you get out of it? You mean, I don`t have to stay stuck in this place? And that`s the whole reason I wanted to share my story.

PINSKY: Never give up?

MALLETTE: Never give up. You know -- sometimes, it looks hopeless. It looks helpless. But don`t give up. Just don`t give up.

PINSKY: Take one more call. Kathleen in South Carolina -- Kathleen.

KATHLEEN, SOUTH CAROLINA: Hey, thanks, Dr. Drew and thanks, Pattie. That book is going to help so many people.

MALLETTE: Thank you.

KATHLEEN : You know, we talked -- I was molested when I was four by like a 17-year-old family friend, and I never thought it really affected me because, you know, I remember saying, no, but it affected me deeply and then that combined with losing my dad in an accident when I was nine really messed me up.

And, I feel the same kind of stuff that, you know, I`m sure Pattie`s going through and the first caller talking about domestic abuse. When I finally realized how much the abuse had affected me, it was when I was coming out of that violent marriage and thinking, why did I choose this man?

And so, I think it`s important. It`s my faith and going to therapy. A good counselor that is able to work me through that and a book I`ve read, too, called the "The Wounded Heart."

MALLETTE: I read it. I read it.


PINSKY: I`ve got to interrupt you. Maybe we can put the -- we`ll Twitter or put our Facebook up with that name of that book for people. Pattie, you`ve been a great guest.

MALLETTE: Thank you.

PINSKY: You`ve -- I don`t think of you as Justin Bieber`s mom, I think you as Pattie with an intense story.

MALLETTE: Thank you.

PINSKY: Oh, you`re -- I get another segment with Pattie? Is that right? Oh, you get to stay. So, you`re not going anywhere yet. I have to do "Our Country Votes." Let` let`s do that right now.




PINSKY: We asked on Facebook, each of the presidential candidates has spent more than half a billion dollars on their respective campaigns. How would you rather the money be used?

Leslie writes, "To provide health care to uninsured people versus placing a tax on us to pay for health care."

Wendy says, "pay off some of the national debt. Duh!"

Anita, "education, homeless shelters, diseases, hospital care."

Got a bunch of places we could use some money, don`t we? Back after this.


PINSKY: So, earlier, I talked about a female high school teacher who was accused of having sex with her student and then found to be innocent. I have run out of time tonight, but I`m bring you Jodi`s story soon. It`s an important story.

I`ve got Pattie Mallette. Her book is "Nowhere But Up," the story of Justin Bieber`s mom. And what I was just telling her is she is Pattie and that Pattie has a very important story to tell. The fact that you are Justin Bieber`s mom, I think, is going to amplify the impact, but it`s just your story. It`s your narrative and being a trauma survivor, that`s what`s so important is owning their experience.

MALLETTE: Yes. Yes. I thought it was important to share and tell. He`s got, you know, such a big platform and I have over a million Twitter followers that call me mom because of him and I feel a responsibility to be able to share it.

PINSKY: Let`s go to calls. Sandra in Colorado -- Sandra.

SANDRA, COLORADO: Yes, Dr. Drew. Thank you for taking my call.

PINSKY: Sure thing.

SANDRA: I would just like to say that I think that Pattie is very brave to be able to finally let it be known.

MALLETTE: Thank you.

SANDRA: I, too, was a child of sexual abuse. However, when I talked to my mother, she played off like she never knew anything about it.

PINSKY: You know, I`m going to stop you. I`m going to tell you, because that`s a common story for people to tell. Oftentimes, those mothers themselves were sexually abused and it`s too -- too overwhelming to them to hear that it`s happened to their daughter. they just can`t deal. They push it aside. Are you still there?


PINSKY: So, you were going to finish your call. Please go right ahead.

SANDRA: And anyway, after I tried to talk to my mom, I went through a difficult time of loss and depression.


SANDRA: So, I thought I`d go to confession, because I thought I could get rid of it that way as well as the hate that went along with it. However, the priest asked me if I had ever considered that my abuser had been abused himself.

PINSKY: Which is -- which also is typical, which is typically the case.

SANDRA: Right, right. But I think -- I mean, I just got so angry that I never went back to see the priest even if I was supposed to write letters of forgiveness to them and to myself.

PINSKY: Right. I`ve got to interrupt you. We could have done this all day, Pattie. I`m sorry, we`re run out of time. Yes, it`s the fact that the abuser was themselves abused does not impact at all, make it OK, does not make it say anything about what happened to you. He should have gotten help before he perpetrated.

Pattie, thank you so much. Thank you for writing this book. Thank you for being so open and honest today. Like I said, we could have done more. But --

MALLETTE: Thank you.

PINSKY: -- thank you for being able to (INAUDIBLE). Thank you for watching. Thank you for calling. And a reminder that Nancy Grace begins right now.