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New Twist in Abduction, Murder of Jessica Ridgeway?; Half-Naked, Hog-Tied and Humiliated by Cops?; Fighting for the Animals

Aired October 15, 2012 - 19:00   ET


JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST: Tonight, is there a new twist in the abduction and murder of 10-year-old Jessica Ridgeway? We`re going to talk to cops in just a moment about the search for a suspect in two near abductions involving a white van. Could it be connected to Jessica`s case? That`s next.


VELEZ-MITCHELL (voice-over): Tonight, a desperate manhunt escalates as Colorado cops chase down 10-year-old Jessica Ridgeway`s killer. Is this the same man suspected of trying to abduct two other children in the very same area weeks before Jessica vanished on her walk to school? Could discrepancies in information be hurting this investigation? And will they catch the suspect before he strikes again? What parents are doing tonight to protect their kids.

Then, she`s fuming mad and suing the cop she says left her half naked, hogtied and humiliated for hours during an arrest. Did these cops go too far? We`re investigating, and I`m taking your calls.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The body that was found in Arvada has been positively identified as Jessica Ridgeway.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, tragic, breaking news in the church for Jessica Ridgeway. Tonight, cops have a furious manhunt for a predator and a killer on their hands.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s scary. It`s very scary. And that`s why we`re here. Brings up the conversation.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because Jessica is in a much better place than we are now.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It broke my heart. It broke my heart.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We recognize that there is a predator at large in our community.

SARAH RIDGEWAY, JESSICA`S MOTHER: I watched her walk out the door. And I shut the door. And that`s the last time I saw her. And I want her to come walking back through that door.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The family has been notified. We can`t begin to comprehend the grief that they`re going through.

JEREMIAH BRYANT, JESSICA`S FATHER: This is, by far, the worst thing I`ve ever been through. There`s like nowhere to start.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, a killer among us. Cops are hunting down the monster who murdered 10-year-old Jessica Ridgeway. And FBI profilers believe the suspect is living right under the noses of the folks in the community, saying someone knows this person, implying he is probably a resident in the area.

Good evening. Jane Velez-Mitchell coming to you live.

And tonight, possibly a new twist about a white van seen in the area. Tragically, we found out Friday that it was, indeed, Jessica`s remains found in that Colorado field about six miles from Jessica`s home. Authorities say her body was not intact.

And every red marker and flag you see here indicates where cops for found evidence of this precious child. Who is this sadistic killer, and will he strike again?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our focus has changed from a search for Jessica to a mission of justice for Jessica. We recognize that there is a predator at large in our community.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jessica vanished Friday morning, October 5, walking to school. She had less than three blocks to walk to rendezvous with friends. Somebody snatched her in that short distance lined with homes. How is it possible that nobody saw a thing? What happened? Was Jessica lured into a stranger`s car?

We now know cops want to talk to the driver of a white van. That driver reportedly tried to abduct two little girls on two different occasions last month in the city of Arvada, which is where Jessica`s body was found. Those little girls told police the driver tried to lure them with candy.

Any break in this case cannot come soon enough, because this entire community, understandably, just north of Denver, is on edge.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s hard to imagine why someone would want to do this to such a nice little girl.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The sicko is out here still. Who knows where he`s at? But we need to find him.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: One thing is for sure, there is a monster out there, and he`s already killed one little girl.

I want to hear your thoughts and theories. Call me: 1-877-JVM-SAYS. 1-877-586-7297.

We`re delighted to have with us tonight Jill McGranahan with the Arvada Police Department. I know you are very busy, Jill, so thank you so much for taking the time to join us.

We want to clarify, because we might jog somebody`s memory. All this talk about a white van. Now we had heard at one point reports that the van was seen the day before Jessica`s abduction and the day of.

Now we`re hearing that these attempted abductions involving this white van of two little girls happened on September 9 and 12, which would make it a month before Jessica`s abduction.

A lot of people are confused. Could you clarify this for us?


All right. I will go to Jennifer Morgan, as we sort Jill out. You`re a reporter for TTN, Denver. You heard the question. Can you sort it out for us, Jennifer?

JENNIFER MORGAN, REPORTER, TTN (via phone): Well, they thought this van -- it`s been reported in Arvada that this van tried to abduct, I`ve heard, boys. It might be girls. That was in early September. We`re also getting reports that it might have been seen in the area, I think around Westminster. Now, don`t -- don`t quote me on that.

But we -- they`re still looking for the killer. Obviously, the FBI came out and gave a description of what to be looking for: someone very suspicious, somebody who even doesn`t park their car in the garage, but they have lately.

At this point what is happening is for the search for this man, Denver has lent authorities their photo radar vans. And they have set them up around the park where her body was found and around the park where she was supposed to be in the morning, meeting her friend. So they`re trying to catch -- they`re checking out every car that goes by at this point on the search for Jessica`s killer.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Who could have done something like this, to a child no less? Private eye -- famed private eye Vinnie Parko is sure that it`s somebody local. Here`s why.


VINNIE PARKO, PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR: My guess is that the person is from the community, because this person had a lot of time to dismember a body. You just don`t do it out in five minutes. This person had a lot of time to do it. So he either did it in a van, or a truck or in someone`s garage or maybe a warehouse. So these are the types of places that the police should be looking at.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Who does something like this? The FBI says it`s likely a male, somebody who might have suddenly left town, changed their appearance, called in sick to work. What else?

Criminal profiler Pat Brown, they`re saying this person is in the community. What should people be looking for? What kind of behavior? Give us examples.

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Well, if this is an abduction and this is -- I would agree that this is going to be somebody very, very local.

The first thing I want to get rid of is the white van thing. Because I have to say, in so many crimes that I`ve heard of with serial killers, it`s always a white van that people have seen. The reason is there are so many work vans that are white that if you look up, there`s a white van.

So be a little cautious, you know. It could be something else besides a white van.

But yes, if this is an abduction -- and I say that only because we don`t have absolute proof that it was at this point. We don`t -- you know, the family, the mother says she was the last one to see her. Her daughter walked out. Police say she has been eliminated.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: No, no, no. I`m sorry. The parents have been ruled out as possible suspects.

BROWN: We don`t have -- we don`t have an absolute alibi, and until we do, we have -- there should be two lines of investigation.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: No, no, no. Pat -- Pat...

BROWN: I`m going to stand with that. Because that`s the way investigations should look.

Now, as I said, if we`re looking at an abductor, we are looking at somebody very, very local, because this is what we tend to see when we`re talking about young children. We have somebody just down the block, two blocks away.

And as far as the body, we don`t know yet. We haven`t heard exactly what happened to the body. It`s just not intact.

Why do people do this? Usually because they can`t get the body of where they`re at without being seen, like an apartment or a house, so they cut it up to put it in box or a Hefty bag to remove it, not necessarily because they`re trying to do something really creepy but because they can`t get rid of the body without being seen.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, OK. Jill McGranahan, Arvada police spokeswoman, thank you for joining us.

First of all, clarify all of these sedans. We`ve heard about the white van. We had a discrepancy on the dates. What can you tell us about these different sightings? White van and then when did that occur?

JILL MCGRANAHAN, ARVADA POLICE SPOKESWOMAN (via phone): We have two confirmed attempted abductions or child enticements in September. That was two young boys that were approached on different days. It was a blue four- door sedan that approached them. That one, we believe, is one suspect and related, and that`s the one that we put the sketch out about.

We did have three young girls that came to the police and said that they felt like there was a white van that was following them. We have not been able to substantiate that. We have not been able to -- they did not have a description. They didn`t know if it was one or two suspects.

You know, we definitely take all these reports seriously, and we`ll look into them, but we can`t substantiate them. And so we try to put out facts and not theories or hyperbole.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Did they come to you after Jessica vanished or before Jessica vanished?

MCGRANAHAN: It was before Jessica vanished.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So OK. So the girls actually felt like there was enough of a reason to go and actually contact police or their parents and say, hey, this white van seemed to be following them. So that`s something that, at least, we shouldn`t discount at this point.

MCGRANAHAN: We`re looking into it. But, as I said, we -- you know, we don`t have anything to go on. We don`t have the suspect descriptions. You know, and we just -- we`re looking into it, but I can`t say anything more than that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And the authorities believe this is an abduction -- I just want to clarify. Because I know the parents have been cleared. And they had a news conference that said that. And they believe that this poor child was, indeed, abducted. That`s why they said that there is a predator at large in your community. Correct?

MCGRANAHAN: I`m not speaking about Jessica Ridgeway. I`m speaking to the abductions in Arvada. You`ll have to speak with the Westminster Police Department about -- about the Jessica Ridgeway case.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. And to clarify, Jill is from Arvada where, tragically, the body was found. Jessica lived across -- just a few miles away in another town, Westminster. So that accounts for that.

Wow! I have to say, Jon Lieberman, on the other side we`re going to talk to a very special couple who are very dear to my hearts who know what the parents of Jessica Ridgeway are going through right now. But let`s clarify some of the investigative stuff.

Again, Vinnie Parko, John, said this has to be somebody local because of what was done to the body. That couldn`t be something that could be done out of town and then come back to the same area.

JON LIEBERMAN, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: Well, that`s right, Jane. There are three new pieces of information we have tonight.

No. 1, police are searching for the primary crime scene. And that is where this girl was, indeed, murdered. Because police believe if they find that primary crime scene, it will help them with clues to this investigation, because some of Jessica`s body parts were not recovered as of right now, we have learned.

We`ve also learned that police are searching down all convicted and registered sex offenders within about a ten-mile radius of this area where Jessica went missing.

And also to your point, police are widening the investigation a little bit, also believing that, yes, the person is local. But this killer, this predator could be fading in and out of the area. He could be transient and be staying in this area for a while and then leave and come back.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: On the other side, Dan and Jill Harrington, who lost Morgan Harrington, their precious daughter, to murder.



S. RIDGEWAY: You don`t hear anything and then you get the pit in your stomach that you don`t want the any -- any parent -- any parent to ever experience in their whole entire life. When you hear that your child has just been taken.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: That poor woman, mother of murdered Jessica Ridgeway. I`m sure Jessica`s parents -- well, you can see they are going through hell, waiting for answers, waiting to find out who abducted and murdered their precious daughter.

Dan and Jill Harrington know that feeling well. And their beautiful daughter, Morgan, a Virginia Tech student, vanished after attending a Metallica concert in October of 2009. We covered this story repeatedly here on this show. Her remains were found in January of 2010. Her anguished parents still don`t know who killed her or why. This is the latest sketch of the suspect linked to Morgan`s murder.

And joining me now are two of my heroes, Dan and Jill Harrington. You started the group Help Save the Next Girl. And you`ve turned your grief and your anguish into something positive, which is truly miraculous and admirable. We`re here now, talking about another girl abducted and murdered and no arrests yet. Give us a sense of what it`s like for the parents at this stage of this nightmare.

JILL HARRINGTON, CO-FOUNDER, HELP SAVE THE NEXT GIRL: It is devastating. My heart just squeezes, listening to the tone in that woman`s voice, knowing what it was to be in her shoes.

Nothing prepares you for it. It`s sudden. You kind of shut down. We can`t remember the first days and weeks, months probably after Morgan was killed. I think that`s a protective mechanism. Thank God the body has that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And, Dan, the hell then of not knowing as the weeks turn into months, turn into years, of not having justice, of not arresting a killer?

DAN HARRINGTON, CO-FOUNDER, HELP SAVE THE NEXT GIRL: I think that the big issue is finding the person who did this terrible thing to young Jessica as well as to our daughter, Morgan.

You know, we continue to work diligently to raise the awareness in the community of Charlottesville that there continues to be a predator, just as there is in Colorado. You know, unfortunately I think our society becomes just kind of numb to this kind of thing, because it`s happening all around us. And it`s a horrible thing when you can`t have closure.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I think of you two often. And I don`t know how you do it. But my admiration knows no bounds, that you are able to turn this into something positive, Help Save the Next Girl.

John, New Jersey. Quickly, your question or thought? John, New Jersey?

CALLER: Hi, Jane. I love you. Love your network. And people that molest children should be imprisoned the rest of their lives without parole. People that kill children should be executed immediately. And why in this country -- the Bible says eye for an eye. When you kill somebody, you should die the same way.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think that people have very, very strong emotions regarding those who would hurt a child. The first thing we must do, though, is find those killers.

More on the other side.



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As horrible as a child killer is, this killer was even worse, because he may have cut her up into pieces. So we`re talking now about almost a Hannibal Lecter type person.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Cops say the key to finding the monster who abducted and murdered Jessica could be the cell-phone towers in three specific locations. Listen to this from "GMA."


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Investigators are focusing on cell-phone towers near Jessica`s home where her backpack was found and where the remains were discovered. If a phone number registered at all three towers, it could lead to a suspect.

(END VIDEO CLIP) VELEZ-MITCHELL: Take a look at this map. There is a 15-mile radius between all these three locations, and so they`re going to have to run the cell-phone numbers that are pinging at each one of these towers to see if one cell phone comes up on all three.

Meanwhile, Danny Cavallas, criminal defense attorney, over the weekend, they released balloons. Tomorrow there is going to be a memorial service in Arvada. Given what we`re talking about, somebody in the community who did this, is it possible that this person would actually attend one of these memorial services or tributes?

DANNY CAVALLAS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You hear about that all the time, Jane. These -- you hear about something about the psychological makeup of some of these killers compels them to see their handiwork, whether it be in the news or in the media, or attending funeral services.

Some of the stuff we talked about earlier, though. Things are different nowadays. We talk about those cell phone pings. That`s new technology helping law enforcement bring people to justice.

You`re also talking about Megan`s Law. Jon Lieberman mentioned that earlier. And that is an amazing tool to law enforcement, given that most child abductor/molesters, child sex offenders, they`re often recidivists. They can use Megan`s Law, and it will be a veritable Mapquest, a Google Earth of bad guys.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: In plain English, what you`re saying is that this person, this monster, Pat Brown, who did this -- and we`re talking about, at this point, an abductor, didn`t just suddenly become a monster. So it would have to probably be somebody with some kind of criminal background who lives in the neighborhood, not just the average person down the street, right?

BROWN: Well, actually, there`s a lot of methodology going on here. There`s always a first time. So when somebody grabs a child, it could be their first time. If they get panicked, they kill that child, they have to get rid of that child. So it can be the first time.

Secondly, everybody is very, very worried that this guy is going to strike again. That`s oddly not our big problem. He`ll strike again, if it`s an abductor, but it will be a year or two probably.

But here`s the real problem: the longer they take to find some guy like this, the longer he has to get rid of all the evidence, which is why these guys get away with it and cases go cold and there`s no prosecution. So that`s a really big problem.

Also, want to mention the thing about -- about attending the memorials. Actually, that`s not -- that doesn`t happen all that often unless he has to be there for some reason.

So we have a lot of these mythologies, but really what we have is a guy that probably half the people haven`t a clue would be this kind of a guy.

But it`s very important and what the police left out with their list, they needed to tell people what a psychopath is like. If this is -- if this is a child sex predator, he is a total psychopath, which means he`s a pathological liar. He doesn`t have any empathy. He`s very manipulative. And this is the kind of guy who`s always going to give you the creeps.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: He may be an employed member of the community. Look it, the BTK serial killer was the leader of his local church and was very involved in all sorts of community activities. So you don`t know.

In just a few minutes, Nancy Grace will have much more on the Jessica Ridgeway case. Nancy talks to a woman who was kidnapped, her mother and brothers murdered. It`s a case that made headlines across the country. That`s at 8 p.m. Eastern, just about half an hour here on HLN.

A group of drunk teens makes a big scene on the street. What people nearby don`t know is, they`re actors. So what would you do if you saw them? That`s the question we ask in the hit show "What Would You Do?" It`s coming on HLN this Sunday. Got to check it out.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Underaged drinking. As this video shows, it`s a disturbing national pastime that can have tragic effects.

So what would you do if you saw a group of what appear to be teens getting wasted in public in the middle of the day?



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One, two, three, drink!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re in Montclair, New Jersey. They`re all actors, and there`s no real alcohol in those cans. But what happens when a good Samaritan has their impressionable young child in tow?

For Abigail Harris, it doesn`t matter.

ABIGAIL HARRIS, PASSERBY: You are all too young to be out here drinking.


HARRIS: It`s like 11 a.m. in the morning.


HARRIS: Are you OK, sweetheart?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. She`s fine. She`s fine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She even tries to take away their beer.

HARRIS: Come here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, we`re taking care of this. We`re taking care of this.

HARRIS: You can`t drink.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Then she asks this woman for help.

HARRIS: Ma`am, can you help me?


HARRIS: These kids are drinking, and she`s like passed out.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s fine. She`s fine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And Nicole Leonucci (ph) jumps right in.

NICOLE LEONUCCI (PH), PASSERBY: She is not OK. Reality check. Give me the beer.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Time to let them know it really is OK.

HARRIS: Oh, my God, my heart is racing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Weren`t you scared?

HARRIS: No. Of them? No, not at all.


HARRIS: Because they`re young kids.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And to people who say that was really heroic, what would you say?

HARRIS: Well, that`s just being a mom. Just being a concerned, you know, an adult.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. That was a lot of fun. Interesting. "What Would You Do?" the question we`re going to be asking starting this Sunday night, 9 Eastern. "What Would You Do" comes to HLN. I can`t wait. This hidden camera show, hosted by ABC News` John Quinones, a series of ethical dilemmas that will entertain you and make you think. "What Would You Do?" this Sunday night, 9 Eastern right here on HLN.



UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This surveillance video is blurred for a reason.

ASHLEIGH DAVIS, SUING COPS: What did I do so wrong to make made them want to treat me like this?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ashleigh Davis is naked from the waist up, sitting on the floor of a holding cell, surrounded by male officers and deputies.

DAVIS: We were in that cell for I don`t know how long.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her bikini top came off as officers arrested her. She said it stayed off as she was carted through the crowd. It stayed off when she got to jail.

DAVIS: He got mad, grabbed the back of my head, slammed it into the ground. "Try to bite again and you`ll look like the rest of them."


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, public outrage as secret surveillance footage of Florida sheriff`s officers standing over an allegedly hog-tied almost completely naked woman surfaces.

32-year-old Ashleigh Davis suing after she says cops used excessive force and humiliated her when she refused to leave a concert. She says cops tackled her, hog-tied her and hauled her out of the crowd even though her bikini top fell off. And if that wasn`t embarrassing enough, Ashleigh says cops left her topless for about two hours. Listen to what she told me on Friday.


DAVIS: I was just saying I was very disgusted by the way they handled the whole matter that night. I think things could have went a little better. They could have calmed me down maybe so it didn`t escalate out of control like this.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now that woman, Ashleigh, admits she was drunk and disorderly. And probably should have been arrested but she says cops took things way too far. In fact, an officer put his hand over her mouth to quiet her screams and she bit him but that allegedly, according to her, retaliated by slamming her face into the ground and breaking her teeth. Look at her mouth.

We reached out to the Lake County Sheriff`s Office and they say they do not comment on pending or open litigation. And the Leesburg Police Department did not return our calls.

So our question tonight: did cops take things too far? What do you think? Call me, 1-877-JVM-SAYS; that`s 1-877-586-7297. By the way, anybody from either the sheriff`s or the police department in question invited on our show any time. We want to get their side of the story. That`s why we reached out to them.

Straight out to criminal defense attorney, Jayne Weintraub; you`ve seen the video. We`ve essentially we`ve only heard one side of the story but is there ever a reason for something like this, that you`re seeing on this --


VELEZ-MITCHELL: -- surveillance footage?

WEINTRAUB: There is absolutely no reason to humiliate a person, male or female, in such a deplorable and despicable manner. You know, number one, they could have caused a riot or she could have been raped, leaving her that way. They were also said to have been laughing out loud on the video.

You know cops don`t have a badge to bully or beat people up. They have a badge to identify themselves and uphold the law. This isn`t a matter of sensitivity training. This is a matter of human decency and treating someone with respect. These cops took everything into their hands. There is no reason why she was even hog-tied.

Could you imagine a man, if his boxers were torn, not being given something to put on? This happens all the time. They give him a shirt. They give him a sheet. They don`t leave somebody there to ridicule.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold, wait a second. I hear Jon Leiberman is shaking his head. So you`re defending this?

JON LEIBERMAN, HLN CONTRIBUTOR: Look, I -- no. I fight for victims every day of my life. But we`re only seeing a small part of what happened here. And when she says the officers -- maybe one or two or three of the officers are at fault. But we don`t know that the whole group of 15 officers, that nobody tried to stop it. And we know that they had a very belligerent, drunk woman there.

The topless thing, that is, you know, inexcusable. Obviously, they should have put her shirt back on. But if she is yelling at police, if she`s making a scene, if she`s biting police -- I mean police also have a job to do.

WEINTRAUB: So you undress her?


WEINTRAUB: You undress her? Give her a public stoning?


LEIBERMAN: They didn`t undress her. They didn`t undress her. Her top fell off while they were moving her from the situation.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, a couple of things --

LEIBERMAN: It`s not like they stood her up and took her clothes off.

WEINTRAUB: She wasn`t naked.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: The cops said that offered her something and she purportedly declined. But if you take a look at her mug shot -- can we put her mug shot up because she does have something on. They did give her something to put on during her mug shot. So again, there, she`s wearing something during her mug shot. You can see that at that point, anyway, she`s wearing something.

Now let`s go to the police report because that`s the closest we can get to the other side of the story. Ashleigh was arrested. This all happened about a year and a half ago at the Leesburg Bike Week. And so that`s what you see here.

Authorities reportedly found her arguing with a friend and asked the two of them to leave. They refused. And in the arrest affidavit, it says the defendant was kicking and screaming, that a deputy attempted to detain her with the help of several other officers until she was finally restrained and then once back at the booking room she allegedly bit an officer, drawing blood. All this happening while Ashleigh was allegedly topless.

So there we are, reading from the police report. Pat Brown, criminal profiler. We`re trying to be balanced as we can, given that the other side isn`t talking, but again it comes down to the hogtying and the partial nudity. Is there ever a reason for that to continue more than a couple of seconds?

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Yes, there is actually. Because anybody watch the show "Jail", when the prisoner comes in, they`re fighting like crazy, they`re violent as heck. The police must get them under control to protect everyone else and themselves. And if they keep fighting and fighting, they have to do what they have to do. This girl was fighting, she was biting, she was kicking -- she was very, very violent. They did what they had to do.

Now, did they take too long? Did they take a moment out? I don`t know. That`s what police are going to have to prove in the court of law. But I can say these people can get really, really, really violent. All you have to do is control them. That`s your job is to control them, protect themselves as well as the police.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: But you know -- well, let me say this. We did a poll. I think we got the poll results. As I was walking downstairs, it was something like 90 percent of those -- by the way, this is trending. It`s trending like crazy. Everybody in the country is talking about this story. 90 percent said yes, this was excessive force.

And what`s interesting is when we were doing this story, we were all like this reminds us of something. We kind of checked it out. And Ashleigh is suing the Lake County Sheriff`s Office and Leesburg Police Department. Both of them, we remembered, checked it out. It`s true, they`ve been in the news for other controversies.

The "Orlando Sentinel" is reporting that one of the Lake County officers cited in this lawsuit was also under fire this summer when he shot and killed a man. Cops mistakenly knocked on Andrew Scott`s door, while looking for an attempted murder suspect. Andrew answered the door while holding a gun and we actually talked to that man who is now deceased, girlfriend on the show.

Listen to this.


MIRANDA MAUCK, ANDREW SCOTT`S GIRLFRIEND: There was another just obnoxiously loud banging at our door and that`s when he got the gun and walked ahead of me. And he opened the door and the gunfire just started immediately.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: The Florida Department of Law Enforcement said that deadly shooting was justified. We`re going to go to Mark Nejame -- you are the attorney for the family of the deceased man. What do you make of these new allegations?

MARK NEJAME, ATTORNEY FOR ANDREW SCOTT`S FAMILY: Not surprising. Jane, in 32 years of doing this, I have never had so many calls, comments, e-mails come to me about excessive police force as I have coming to me now from lake county and some of the cities within.

We have another case that`s going to be breaking on Wednesday, concerning gross misconduct, alleged misconduct of another officer. And it is just outrageous that these types of things are happening. And any defender who are suggesting that in any way, shape or form that this is justified, shame on them. This is a second-degree misdemeanor, disorderly conduct, punishable by no more than 60 days in the county jail. The lowest offense under Florida statutes that could exist is a second degree misdemeanor.

To suggest that a woman should be hog-tied because she was drunk and then left partially naked and having her teeth busted out. Law enforcement --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let`s get somebody to respond. Pat brown, you just heard "shame on you".


VELEZ-MITCHELL: And Mark, you can lock right into the camera. Pat, you can respond.

BROWN: I will absolutely respond to that. I`ve done ride alongs with the police. I`ve seen some of these people. They get extremely, extremely violent. This woman was biting and she admits to biting. You know, if she had been quiet, if she had been cooperative, this would not have happened. When she becomes violent against the police or anybody around they have to do what they have to do. She bit the guy and he slammed her head down -- makes sense.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok, isn`t that why they have handcuffs?

BROWN: That`s what you have to do.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Once you handcuff somebody, there`s only so much they can do.

BROWN: They can turn their head and bite the crap out of you. I tell you somebody needs to watch the show "Jail" like every night if they think this is not happening.


NEJAME: Nice that she went on some ride alongs -- big deal. Every case is individual. Just because some people deserve to be arrested and some people deserve to be hog-tied --

BROWN: She did, because she was biting. Obviously she was a biter. She wasn`t sitting there quietly.

NEJAME: I understand why you now have your opinion. Let other people talk. The fact of the matter is that you have a woman, 32-year-old woman, half naked and hog-tied. There was no respect shown to her humanity. She was left naked, to be ridiculed. That deserves punishment and a law enforcement officer is supposed to be mature to handle people who are drunk.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Your calls on the other side.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: And here is your "Viral Video of the Day". The jump heard around the world and then some. Felix Baumgartner, he jumped right into the record books this weekend, literally skydiving from the edge of space. The Austrian daredevil broke the speed of sound after jumping out of a especially-made capsule and then going down 24 miles. That`s like running -- a marathon is just over 24 miles. That`s what he did in the sky. Holy smokes. Wow.



DAVIS: Once I did that, he got mad and grabbed the back of my head, slammed it into the ground. "Try to bite again you`ll look like the rest of them around here" or something like that. I mean that was the most devastating part.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: A public uproar over the handling of that woman`s arrest as she says she was left topless and hog-tied while a bunch of male officers walked around the booking room. And she`s suing and 90 percent of the people polled -- it`s just trending very high.

Everybody who is talking about this story say it was excessive force but the law enforcement departments involved in this case are invited on our show any time.

Cowan, Louisiana, your question or thought. Your opinion Cowan. All right. Sweetie, are you there?

COWAN: An absolute -- yes, ma`am. Hello.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. You have to turn down your TV set, sweetheart. They`re supposed to tell you that. Turn down your TV set and then you can ask your question.

COWAN: I think that was an absolute -- that`s ridiculous. That`s someone`s daughter. That`s somebody`s mom. That`s someone`s sister. For them to hog-tie the woman and put this woman on the cement, I mean that`s crazy. I would like to be in a boxing ring with those three punks and they call themselves officers of the law like that. That is horrendous. They could have easily put handcuffs and put her in a holding tank.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: I think that`s the point. Pat brown, look, hog-tying -- you know, you can Google "hog-tying". And there are sexual connotations to it. It is something that is done in bondage and sadomasochism.


BROWN: They`re doing sexual --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m not saying that that was --

BROWN: They deal with this stuff every day. We have this fellow saying, oh, she went on a ride along. If you do a lot of ride alongs, you will see how very nice the cops treat the people they deal with. They`re very, very calm. It`s amazing that they keep their calm with all the --


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok. Pat, I only have a couple of seconds. I am a big fan of law enforcement. I love law enforcement. I want to be protected. But sometimes we do have to call something to account. I`m going to give Jayne Weintraub the last word.

BROWN: Women are sometimes as bad as man. They turn violent.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jayne Weintraub, last word, quickly.

WEINTRAUB: Disgusting, deplorable, demeaning. There is no reason to humiliate people. This was a second-degree misdemeanor and she wasn`t armed or dangerous.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. It was a healthy debate. Thank you all.

On the other side of the break, I`m involved in something very special this weekend and I`m going to tell you all about it. Stay right there.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Time for our "Pets of the Day". Send your pet pics to Hershey, stunning. Look at those blue eyes. Beautiful, beautiful pose, Jake. You are tres chic with those little chicks on your back. Star and Grace, lounging, they`re just, you know, settling in. Simba loves the sink. Who knew?


VELEZ-MITCHELL: You`re looking at some of my favorite viral videos we played on the show. That little guy, Scribbles, the goat.

And take a look at Prince William and Prince Harry. We`re talking -- there they are some veal calves, I believe, these little boys would have been (inaudible) but they got rescued by an organization called Farm Sanctuary. It`s one of my favorite organizations. And they rescue all these animals from factory farm conditions and let them live beautiful lives.

And I`m very excited to say that this coming weekend, I`m going to be involved in the march for Farm Sanctuary. It`s happening all over the country. People who love farm animals, who are animals -- actually that`s the majority of animals in this country 10 billion are farm animals. And we`re all marching. And I`m going to be marching here in New York City. But you can find out where to march.

You can go to a Web site we`ll give you in a second and find out where to march. It`s

Straight out to Bruce Friedrich, Farm Sanctuary senior director for strategic services; we`re walking this weekend all over the country. Now, I understand you`re also working -- and those are a couple of cute little piglets there, having a good time -- playful piglets because they`re able to move. They can turn around. Look at them. They love to have fun, piglets.

Most pigs are kept in a -- female pigs anyway -- these crates that they can`t turn around in factory farm conditions.

You are now working to rescue a couple of oxen. Tell us about that briefly.

BRUCE FRIEDRICH, FARM SANCTUARY: Yes. There`s a college that`s called Green Mountain College. They have had two oxen, Bill and Lou who have been working at the college. The college calls them members of their farm crew and mascots for about a decade. And Lou got injured and can`t work anymore. Bill is refusing to work with anybody else and now Green Mountain College is really betraying them.

They`re doing the moral equivalent of taking your dog to the shelter to be euthanized because your dog doesn`t match the drapes. They`re going to kill Bill and Lou and they`re going to eat them. And Vine Farm Animal Sanctuary in Vermont is ready to take bill and Lou and give them a happy retirement. And we are calling on Green Mountain College to take Vine up on their very kind offer.

People can find out all about it and get active Jane. People can get active on our Facebook page. Just go to Facebook and punch in Farm Sanctuary and you can also contact the college.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We have a statement from the college you`re talking about, Green Mountain College. It reads, "Those who know Lou and Bill best, our farm staff and students are uncomfortable with the potential ramifications of sending the animals to a sanctuary. Bill and Lou are large animals weighing over a ton. A transition to a new setting will be difficult for them and only postpones the fact that someone else in the not too distant future will need to decide that`s it`s kinder to kill them than to have them continue in increasing discomfort. If sent to a sanctuary, Bill and Lou would continue to consume resources at a significant rate."

If you want to read the whole statement, you can check it out on my Web site, Farm Sanctuary`s reaction on the other side.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Bruce, your reaction.

FRIEDRICH: Jane, they`re treating Bill and Lou as though Bill and Lou were pieces of machinery instead of farm animals, instead of individuals with interests. These animals would thrive and appreciate their time at Vine Farm Animal Sanctuary. People can get involved by going to our Facebook page which is just Facebook/farm sanctuary.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: We`re out of time.

Nancy is next.