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Aussies Meet 13-Foot Great White; 650 Hostages Freed In Algeria; 48 States Report Widespread Flu; Armstrong Doped And Lied; Notre Dame's Bizarre Love Story; Notre Dame's Bizarre Love Story; Giving Birth In U.S. For Citizenship: Armstrong Could Face Legal Troubles

Aired January 18, 2013 - 13:00   ET


SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: Sharks circled their boat for 40 minutes. If you're wondering what the fishermen decided to do about it, well they simply powered up the motor and took off when they what had enough.

I'm Suzanne Malveaux. Before we talk about Lance Armstrong's interview with Oprah Winfrey, we've got dramatic new developments in the deadly hostage crisis underway in a North African nation of Algeria. State media say the army has freed some 650 people from Islamist militants at a remote oil field. Most of those freed are Algerian, but there are Americans among the rescued and still among the missing. The effort to free the remaining hostages is also still going. I want to bring in our Barbara Starr from the Pentagon. Give us an update here, Barbara. This is day three of this siege. What do we know in terms of has anybody been killed? Are people still being held hostage and what is the state of Americans?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, the picture still, as you say, day three, total confusing, very limited information we're told in coming out of Algeria. But many western governments who have citizens involved in this situation also being very careful, not wanting to say much publicly because there still are hostages at the site. The Algerian forces are still there, still trying to get control of this situation. What we do know is the United States is trying to evacuate perhaps 10 to 20 wounded and other hostages from the site, get them out of there, get them back to Europe and then get them on to their home countries and families. The British prime minister, David Cameron, this morning, Suzanne, on the -- in the House of Commons said the situation remained very fluid, very uncertain and still very dangerous -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: We heard from the secretary of defense, Leon Panetta, today. Pretty tough talk saying that the U.S. is going after Al Qaeda. What are they really doing on the ground regarding this?

STARR: Well, you know, this is the problem right now for the United States and other countries, you know, Al Qaeda in North Africa perhaps the new frontier for Al Qaeda cells and affiliates. But many of these places are very remote areas, very difficult to get to, and then the case is we are seeing in Algeria, that government does not want outside military help. So, it's one thing for the secretary of defense to say he's -- you know, no sanctuary, that the U.S. will go after these Al Qaeda terrorists. But how are you going to get there with limited force? How are you going to get into these countries and get permission to undertake military operations is a whole other question. This is likely to be a very serious ongoing issue now for some time to come -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. Barbara, thank you, appreciate it.

Now this, a new report out today by the CDC says that the flu season is now getting worse. Forty-eight states are now reporting widespread flu activity. Now, widespread means more than half of the counties in a state have flu activity. Thirty states are reporting high levels of the flu, up from 24 last week. Hospitalizations for the elderly have gone up significantly, nine more children have died bringing the total since flu season began to 29. Now, the CDC does not count the number of flue-related adult deaths.

And today, we have a very different story from the man who was once the most celebrated sports champion in the world. For years we heard this.


LANCE ARMSTRONG: How could it have taken place when I've never taken performance-enhancing drugs? How could that have happen.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That was my point. You're not -- it's not simply that you don't recall, just --

ARMSTRONG: How many times do I have to say it?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm just trying to make sure your testimony is clear.

ARMSTRONG: Well, if it can be any clearer than I've never taken drugs, then incidents like that could never have happened.



MALVEAUX: So, that was then, this is now. Lance Armstrong coming clean. Listen.


OPRAH WINFREY, HOST, "OPRAH WINFREY SHOW": Did you ever take banned substances to enhance your cycling performance?


WINFREY: Yes or no. Was one of those banned substances EPO?


(END VIDEO CLIP) MALVEAUX: So, Lance Armstrong says, yes, he cheated to win and he lied to the world when everybody was asking about it. I want to get to Dave Zirin. He is here. He's the sports editor for the nation who writes his own column at Dave, you and I were talking about this in the hours here, do you -- does it help him at all that he comes clean to Oprah Winfrey at this point in his career?

DAVE ZIRIN, SPORTS EDITOR, THEEDGEOFSPORTS.COM: It's difficult for several reasons. I mean, first and foremost, you couldn't watch that interview and not think that he was sorry, not that he did it but that he got caught. He even said that explicitly in the interview that if he hadn't of tried to come back a few years ago, he wouldn't be sitting in this seat right now talking to her. Another words, he could have lived out the rest of his life as a wealthy American icon without having to deal with this. So, he's only coming to grips with this because the nuisance snared around him. And that was, I thought, a startling and underreported admission by him. And it was -- it was very cold as well. You know, if I wasn't caught, I wouldn't be here, as if there was no greater good to coming forward.

The second thing is that it's very difficult for an athlete to come back from scandal when they're basically already retired. I mean, Lance Armstrong is 41 years old. There's no more trips up the Pyrenees for him in the Tour de France. And sports is a very unforgiving business or it's forgiving if you're young and you get caught in a scandal. If you're Michael Vick and you can still play quarterback when you come back. If you're Ray Lewis, the great linebacker for the Ravens, and you are charged with being an accessory to a murder that took place, you can come back if you're young enough to do it. But if you're a Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, and your scandal occurs at the end of your career, well there is no going back to the playing field and having it absolve all your sins. Similarly, there's nowhere for Lance to really go on a competitive basis other than performing in triathlons which is something he wants to do. And so, that makes it actually very difficult for him to come back into the public's grace.

MALVEAUX: So Dave, let's say he did take part in triathlons in the future, like maybe he's participating, they allow him to do this, that there's not this lifetime ban. If he decides to do that, is there any way that he could actually fool people again, that he might be able to cheat again if he wanted to?

ZIRIN: Well, like Jennifer Anniston said on "Friends," once a cheater, I think, and that's going to be people's expectation at the very start. I mean, it's going to be guilty until proven innocent for him for the rest of his days, no matter where he is in the public eye. I mean, whether it's a career in politics, which he's told people he's interested in, I don't know how he does that now, or whether it's trying to reassume a place on the board of his cancer foundation, Livestrong. These things are going to be much more difficult roads for him to travel down. And the starting point for him coming back to any sort of meaningful public life in this country is contrition. I mean is being able to understand that you actually harmed other people, that you actually took away hours and days from people's lives who worried that you were going to sue them, to bankrupt them, that you were going to use the weight of your power to make their lives unbearable and you just did not get the sense in that interview last night, even though I felt like --


ZIRIN: -- Oprah was throwing him softball after softball to actually express those kinds of emotions, he wasn't going to do it.

MALVEAUX: Let's talk about the part where he explains the myth, the fact that the expectations were so high when he was at the top of his career.


ARMSTRONG: I know the truth. The truth isn't what was out there, the truth isn't what I said. And now it's gone -- this story was so perfect for so long.


ARMSTRONG: And I mean that, as I try to take myself out of this situation and I look at it, you overcome the disease, you win the Tour de France seven times, you have a happy marriage, you have children, I mean, it's just this mythic perfect story --


ARMSTRONG: -- and it wasn't true.

WINFREY: And that wasn't true?

ARMSTRONG: And that was not true on a lot of levels.


MALVEAUX: So Dave, he seems to have an explanation for all of this, that somehow the expectations were just too high, that he couldn't back out of his story once he had gone down that path.

ZIRIN: I mean, it's difficult to be too sympathetic to that, because for many of us, it would have been victory enough if he had just come back from cancer.


ZIRIN: Many families are not that lucky. And if he had been able to be satisfied with that. And then to use his place as a cyclist, maybe not a seven-time Tour de France winner, but as a cyclist to be able to raise awareness about cancer, I mean, maybe it wouldn't have meant bike riding with the president of the United States as he often did with fellow Texan George W. Bush, but it could have meant something where he didn't end up in the Oprah chair, at this point. And that's the thing that's really sad about this is that for a lot of people who -- and like people in my family who would've been willing to love Lance Armstrong no matter what because of the work he did on cancer, it was very painful to see last night, not because he cheated, but because he didn't quite get the equation of what he meant to people. And if he did, I don't -- it's not only that he wouldn't have acted this way in the last several years, he would never have responded to the questions the way he did last night.

MALVEAUX: Yes. Yes, I totally agree, Dave. And we're going to be watching part two, obviously, of Oprah's interview with Lance Armstrong. Thank you.

Now that he's come clean, could he face criminal charges for lying? We're going to take a look at what could be next for Lance Armstrong.

And reaction, of course, tough but mixed for Livestrong, that is the cancer charity that Armstrong founded. After last night's interview, the foundation gave the following statement. We at the Livestrong foundation are disappoint by the news that Lance Armstrong misled people during and after his cycling career, including us. They go on to say, even in the wake of our disappointment, we also express our gratitude to Lance as a survivor for the drive, devotion and spirit for helping the cancer patients and the entire cancer community. A lot of people around the world sharing what they think about this story, unbelievable here. On Twitter, I want to bring these for you. Alvin O'Brin -- O'Brien, rather, tweets, the catholic church should induct Oprah into the hall of fame, not even the pope could get a confession like that. A hospital patient tweets, I'm happy people fighting cancer benefitted from the sheer arrogance and greed of Lance. Unpopular opinion, but I've done -- but I'd have done what was necessary to win if everyone around me was doing the same. Rich Chambers tweets, did anyone come away from Lance's interview feeling sorry for the guy or believing that his image could be repaired? Doubt it. We're going to look at the disgraced cyclist, watch The World According To Lance Armstrong right here on CNN this Saturday at 10:00 p.m. Eastern.

Coming up in 30 minutes, Piers Morgan also interviewing Lance Armstrong's former teammate, Tyler Hamilton.

Here is what we're working on as well for this hour.

(voice-over): Did she or didn't she exist? And did Manti Te'o know? Questions still swirl around the Heisman trophy running up.


ZIRIN: Why would Manti Te'o knowing this person was real continue to talk about her as if she were a real person after she, quote, unquote, "died."


The latest on the Manti Te'o hoax.

Then, a shadow industry operating in the suburbs of Los Angeles. Tourists from other countries coming to the United States to give it birth. Their souvenir, U.S. citizenship for their newborns.

And we're just days away from President Obama officially kicking off his second term. He will swear in with Martin Luther King Jr.'s bible.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We received a call from the Presidential (inaudible) Committee wanting to use the bible for the inauguration.


MALVEAUX: And I got to see it. My one on one with Bernice King.

This is CNN NEWSROOM and it's happening now.


MALVEAUX (on camera): Still a lot of questions over the bizarre love story at Notre Dame University. Of course, it looked like a storybook tale of a football star, Manti Te'o, and his love for a young woman he claimed existed. Turned out that was not necessarily the case. Our Susan Candiotti has been talking to folks on campus. What do we know about this? Do we have any more answers from this very strange story surrounding him about whether or not this girl ever existed?

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I'll tell you, Suzanne, the only real answers we hope to get is when Manti Te'o finally decides to stay something, and we don't yet know when that's going to be. But around campus, people still say this is a great guy, a role model for kids, team captain, but they're also saying this. We talked to a sports blogger who said that there were rumblings on campus way back in September when Te'o initially said that this girlfriend had died. He said there was a lot of talk about it back then. Listen.


TYLER MOOREHEAD, NOTRE DAME STUDENT & SPORTS BLOGGER: And no one was ever really inquiring into this relationship statuses before. They didn't wonder which girl he was with or how that was going. But when you hear that he lost a girlfriend, suddenly questions are, well, I didn't really know he had the girlfriend, and that's when a lot of the news from, you know, people around him, you know, players and friends, you know, that spreads around campus that, well, he had never actually, you know, met this girlfriend. So how substantial could that relationship be.


CANDIOTTI: The bottom line is, Suzanne, everyone wants to hear directly from Manti Te'o.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: And, Susan, so we know there were questions about this before, but we really didn't know about -- we didn't hear about this story until very recently. How does the school explain it?

CANDIOTTI: That's right. Well, they said that -- at a news briefing earlier in the week, that Te'o found out about this on December the 6th, but he kept it to himself, didn't tell the university about it until a good 20 days later after Christmas. And then Notre Dame said it conducted its own investigation, which took them about 10 days. Finally, they turned over that information to Te'o's parents and were hoping to hear from him. Listen to what Notre Dame had to say.


JACK SWARBRICK, NOTRE DAME ATHLETIC DIRECTOR: There was not an intention of belief, anything, that this would be a story that didn't get told. It was -- it was clear it would. We had hoped the first person to tell it would be Manti. And, again, the expectation was that was going to happen next week. And he didn't get that opportunity without someone else having told the story, but he'll at least have an opportunity to talk about it in the future.


CANDIOTTI: That's right. So they didn't -- he didn't get a chance to say it before a sports blog, Deadspin, broke the story. And, you know, Notre Dame also revealed something else during their press briefing. They said that they had uncovered information that Te'o was not the only target. They said their investigators turned up this information by looking at tweets and other information. But they said they didn't concentrate on that because they were only directing their attention and focusing on Te'o. So we don't know what other targets it is that they're talking about.

MALVEAUX: Do we know when we might hear from him directly?

CANDIOTTI: I talked with his agent just this morning and they have no timetable yet.

MALVEAUX: All right, Susan Candiotti. Thank you, Susan.

Giving birth to a baby in the United States guarantees that that child will have U.S. citizenship. But having babies in the U.S. is now a business. How tourists are planning vacations to give birth here in the United States.


MALVEAUX: A shadow industry is operating in the suburbs of Los Angeles. Now, tourists from other countries, namely China, they're coming here to the United States to give birth. Now the souvenir, U.S. citizenship for the newborns. Kyung Lah has the story.



LAH (voice-over): They don't want to be seen. They won't stop to talk.

LAH (on camera): You're going on a jog?


LAH: I can jog. LAH (voice-over): They came from this house.

LAH (on camera): Hi there.

LAH (voice-over): Quietly catering to pregnant Chinese women like this one.

LAH (on camera): We just wanted to chat with you a little bit about what brings you here.

LAH (voice-over): Who are they? They wouldn't respond to CNN's calls for comment, but they're just one of many businesses that publicly advertises to Chinese mothers to be. It finds its roots in Beijing. This storefront and this one offer package deals. On Chinese language websites they advertise to parents, offer a step by step guide to obtain a U.S. visa, and then arrange travel to cushy, inviting U.S. homes, where 24-hour nurses and doctors will care for the mother. It's called birth tourism. Dozens of these houses are scattered across California, operating in the shadows within the suburbs of L.A. Pay them thousands and, according to their ads, they'll help you obtain U.S. citizenship for your newborn.

LAH (on camera): Have you been inside?


LAH (voice-over): Arthur Chen (ph), a legal Taiwanese immigrant, lives next door to what he calls a maternity hotel. On his street, he sees a lot of pregnant Chinese women every day.

LAH (on camera): Why would a Chinese mother come all the way to America to give birth?


LAH (voice-over): If people from mainland China get an American passport, he said, their life can be different. Potential access to U.S. education. And once the child turns 18, says Chen, they can help others get green cards and become U.S. citizens.

CROWD: Not here. Not anywhere.

LAH: Neighborhood protests have sprung up around the states.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Go back to your country.

LAH: Local authorities have busted some of these houses for code violations, but not for so-called birth tourism, that's because, under current federal laws, it's not illegal.

MARK TONER, SPOKESMAN, U.S. STATE DEPT.: We are legally barred from denying a visa on the basis of someone being pregnant.

LAH: And that's the way it should be say the parents of three month old Francine (ph). A family who lives in Beijing travelled to a U.S. maternity hotel so Francine could be born in America. Dad is a naturalized U.S. citizen and says he understands why Chinese citizens come to the U.S. to give birth.

VICTOR LI, PARENT: They pay the fee, they got a visa, they do it legally, so some people are upset, saying the Chinese are taking advantage of these services. Well we can say the same thing for the Americans. Some of them taking advantage of Chinese services here in China.

LAH: Back at this house, workers continue to move in baby items, prep for meals and this shadow industry continues to thrive right in the open.

Kyung Lah, CNN, Rolling Heights, California.


MALVEAUX: Lance Armstrong comes clean, but he leaves a path of lies behind him. We're going to take a look at who he's hurt and how his constant denials could cost him more than his reputation.


BETSY ANDREU, WIFE OF FMR. ARMSTRONG TEAMMATE FRANKIE ANDREU: You owed it to me, Lance, and you dropped the ball. After what you've done to me, what you've done to my family and you couldn't own up to it. And now we're supposed to believe you?



MALVEAUX: Lance Armstrong's doping admissions could open him up to lawsuits and other legal problems as well. In his interview with Oprah Winfrey on her own network, Armstrong admitted to using blood enhancing hormone EPO, testosterone, illegal blood transfusions and more.


OPRAH WINFREY: Were you afraid of getting caught?

LANCE ARMSTRONG, FORMER PROFESSIONAL CYCLIST: No. Drug testing has changed. It's evolved.

WINFREY: Uh-huh.

ARMSTRONG: In the old days they tested at the races. They didn't come to your house. They didn't come to your training camps. They tested you at the race. That's shifted a lot. So now the emphasis of the testing, which is right --


ARMSTRONG: Is in out of competition testing.

WINFREY: Right. And in 1999, there wasn't even a test for EPO. ARMSTRONG: None. And there was no testing out of competition. Well, they may have -- theoretically there may have been, but they never came. And for most of my career, there wasn't that much of that. So two things changed this --

WINFREY: That much of what?

ARMSTRONG: There wasn't that much out of competition testing.

WINFREY: OK. Uh-huh.

ARMSTRONG: So you're not going to get caught.

WINFREY: Uh-huh.

ARMSTRONG: You know? Because you're clean at the races.


MALVEAUX: So Armstrong admitted he bullied people as well, retaliated against those who accused him of doping, but he denied pushing other teammates to dope as well. Here's what he said.


WINFREY: Were you the one in charge?

ARMSTRONG: Well, I was the top rider. I was the leader of the team. I wasn't the manager, the general manager, the director, the --

WINFREY: But if someone was not doing something to your satisfaction, could you get them fired?

ARMSTRONG: It depends what they're doing. I mean if you're asking me, somebody on the team says, I'm not going to dope --


ARMSTRONG: And I say, you're fired?


ARMSTRONG: Absolutely not.

WINFREY: Could you --

ARMSTRONG: I mean, could I? I guess I could have, but I never did.

WINFREY: You could --

ARMSTRONG: Look, I was the leader of the team. And the leader of any team leads by example. And there was never a direct order or a directive to says, you have to do this if you want to do the tour, if you want to be on the team. That never happened. It was a competitive time. We were all grown men. We all made our choices. But there were people on the team that chose not to. (END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Want to bring in our legal analyst, Sunny Hostin, to talk about the liability that Armstrong could face because of this confession. And, Sunny, first of all, let's talk about the possibility of criminal charges, because there was a federal investigation. It was dropped. Could that, first of all, be revisited? And if so, what kind of charges could he face?

SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, I think there's no question that the government will be looking to perhaps resurrect that investigation, because they did shut it down in February. We don't know why, Suzanne. Typically when a prosecutor or the government decides not to prosecute a case, you don't really get a reason why. So it's quite possible. And if I were a prosecutor looking at this, I would be looking at whether or not he forced others to dope. And so you're sort of looking at sort of pushing illegal drugs, almost drug trafficking. You're looking at money laundering. Those kinds of charges. Those kinds of federal charges. So I suspect that the government, in light of this confession, no question about it, is perhaps reexamining that case.

MALVEAUX: And, of course, there are the fellow cyclists. They say their careers were not only injured, some destroyed by Lance Armstrong. And this -- I want you to listen to this. This is the wife of one of Armstrong's former teammates, what she told Anderson Cooper.


ANDERSON COOPER, CNN: He would say that he was -- he wasn't the general manager. That he never forced people to do it. He never directed anybody to do it, to take, to dope.

BETSY ANDREU, WIFE OF FMR. ARMSTRONG TEAMMATE FRANKIE ANDREU: OK, then why did -- why did they make sure Fankie's contract wasn't renewed in 2000 when he wanted Frankie to see Ferrari (ph) and Frankie said no, no, no, no. Frankie rode the 2000 tour clean, had a vast -- the vast majority of his career was clean. What was his reward? He didn't get compensated for that tour win and he lost his job and his career was derailed. That's -- that's going up against Lance Armstrong. Going up a decade of being excoriated by him.