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CNN NEWSROOM

Pistorius Defense Fights Back; Interview With Mark Zuckerberg and Anne Wojcicki

Aired February 20, 2013 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks so much for joining us. I'm Fredricka Whitfield in for Brooke Baldwin. In just a few moments, two men who changed the way we look up information and communicate with friends on line will join us live.

Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg and Google co-founder, Sergey Brin will be joining us for a rare live interview. Right, now they're at an event launching a new foundation that rewards research aimed at certain diseases, curing certain diseases, and extending human life. Our Ali Velshi will speak with them live right after that event. It's an exclusive and you only hear it and see it right here on CNN.

But, first here are some of the hottest stories of the day that we're following for you.

All right, just in to CNN, disgraced cyclist Lance Armstrong has once again decided not to cooperate with the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency, USADA. He had previously faced a February 6 deadline to cooperate, but received an extension until Wednesday. Today, his lawyers issued this statement saying -- quote -- "Lance will not participate in USADA's efforts to selectively conduct American prosecutions that only demonize selected individuals while failing to address the 95 percent of the sport over which USADA has no jurisdiction" -- end quote.

He had been asked to submit to a full debriefing about how he doped during competition and got away with it for years.

Olympic star Oscar Pistorius is spending another night in jail. No decision was made today on whether to grant him bail after the shooting death of his model girlfriend. The defense says Pistorius shot her by accident thinking she was an intruder. An investigating officer told the court Pistorius wasn't acting in self-defense when he shot through a bathroom door. But he also said investigators have found no evidence that is inconsistent with Pistorius' story.

And the stock market is pulling back one day after the Dow Jones industrial average reached a five-year high. Right now, the Dow is down 75 points, 13960. The S&P 500 and Nasdaq are also down in this final hour before the closing bell on 0 Wall Street.

And former congressman Jesse Jackson Jr. dabbed his eyes with a handkerchief today as he pleaded guilty to using $750,000 of campaign money for personal expenses. Among those was purchases, Michael Jackson memorabilia and a Rolex watch. His wife is due in court later on today and is expected to plead guilty to filing false tax returns. We will have a live report from Washington in just a few minutes.

The new pope could be known sooner than expected. Pope Benedict XVI is considering a rule change to allow for a vote on his replacement before March 15. That's the date set by church law which says cardinals should vote on a successor 15 to 20 days after a vacancy occurs. Benedict's last day will be February 28.

And with fighting in Syria showing no signs of easing, the U.S. is providing another $19 million in humanitarian assistance. The money will help provide emergency medical care. And the U.N. says nearly 70,000 people have been killed since the Assad government began a crackdown on the opposition two years ago.

More on the story that has the whole world talking, Blade Runner, Oscar Pistorius, spending another night in prison. He is charged with the Valentine's Day murder of his model girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp. He says it was an accident, that he thought she was an intruder. A police investigator says he doesn't believe Pistorius wasn't acting in self-defense when he shot through a bathroom door, but he also said investigators have found no evidence that is inconsistent with Pistorius' story.

Meanwhile, speaking outside the courthouse, Pistorius' uncle had this to say about his nephew.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARNOLD PISTORIUS, UNCLE: He's not a violent person. He's a peacemaker. He's always been a peacemaker. And that's his nature. He looked tough and he looked like a superstar and holds himself in public domain, but he's actually a very, very kind, soft person.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: But, today, shocking new details have been revealed as prosecutors make their case at a bail hearing.

CNN's Robyn Curnow has the latest from Pretoria, South Africa.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROBYN CURNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): More riveting details on what prosecutors say happened Valentine's Day morning and countercharges from the defense. According to prosecutors, witnesses heard arguing coming from the Pistorius home for an hour before the shooting, the defense saying the witness' house was about 300 meters, about 1,000 feet away.

On the stand, the investigating officer said Pistorius used a cricket bat to break down the bathroom door. That bat and a cell phone found splattered in blood. Using a diagram projected on a large screen, the officer said Pistorius aimed his gun at the toilet, pointing out that he had to turn and fire at an angle in order to hit the toilet. Police also say a witness heard a gunshot, then heard a female scream, then more gunshots. The defense say no female screamed. Defense attorneys pressed the police officer who admitted that Steenkamp's body had no signs of assault or signs of defending herself. The officer also conceding he find nothing consistent with Oscar Pistorius' version of events. Pistorius said he thought he was shooting at an intruder.

Prosecutors say police found bullets in a safe in the home. They say that will lead to charges of possessing illegal ammunition. But later the investigator said they did not establish whose ammunition it was. Authorities say they also found two boxes of testosterone and needles which defense attorneys contend is actually herbal medicine.

Prosecutors say there's no way the killing of Reeva Steenkamp was self-defense, that Pistorius knew his girlfriend was in the bathroom when he opened fire. They cited two previous incidents of police encounters with Pistorius that suggest he could be prone to violence adding that since they consider Pistorius a flight risk, he should be held without bail. And with that court is adjourned until tomorrow.

Robyn Curnow, CNN, Pretoria, South Africa.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: And Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg and the wife of Google co-founder Sergey Brin are joining forces in a mammoth new project. They are pouring millions of their own money into research that could save your life.

Now, they just announced the Breakthrough Prize for health sciences. Winners will get a cash reward more than twice as big as the Nobel Prize.

In a CNN exclusive, our Ali Velshi with us now with Zuckerberg and with Brin's wife joining us from San Francisco.

ALI VELSHI, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Fred, good afternoon. Good to see you.

As you said, I am in San Francisco at UCSF and they just made this announcement of the Breakthrough Prize in Life Sciences, which, as you said , is going to be bigger than the Nobel Prize. They have awarded the first batch, but on an ongoing basis they will award these prizes and the goal is to cure and solve diseases, extend life.

It's a life sciences award. As you said, I'm joined now by Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg and Anne Wojcicki, who is not just the wife of Sergey Brin, but is the founder of 23andMe, which many of you will know because you can find out where you come from. It's a DNA test that's accessible to all of us.

Both of you are investors. You are creators. I want to ask you, Mark, you said in the announcement just a few minutes ago that we need more heroes. You have both done things in markets where there were vacuums, that somebody else wasn't doing it. What's the vacuum here? There is a Nobel Prize. MARK ZUCKERBERG, FOUNDER, FACEBOOK: Well, I just think that society has a lot of heroes for a lot of different things, but we don't have enough heroes who are scientists and researchers and engineers.

And these people are just doing great work, the people who won these prizes today. And what we're trying to do is we're just trying to set up this institution and do what we can from the sidelines of that work to reward and recognize the amazing stuff that all these folks are doing to cure diseases and expand our understanding of humanity and improve all these people's lives in different ways.

So, we feel like that if we can recognize that work, then it can inspire a lot more folks to do similar work as well.

VELSHI: And, Anne, when you announced the first round of winners, I have to say of them I probably could identify or recognize two or three of the things that they're noted for doing. They are working on highly specific things. This isn't the 50 years later rewarding somebody for finding a cure to cancer. These are incremental improvements that are really changing people's lives?

ANNE WOJCICKI, FOUNDER, 23ANDME: Yes. And I think that's a really important distinction about this prize and what we want to encourage, is that we want to encourage people to take risk, make major breakthroughs, and then be rewarded in the near term after that.

So for some of these individuals, their discoveries were relatively recent and they have done recent things that have been really significant. And we really want to get people in the life sciences to actually think big, take risk, and then recognize that there's a major reward that could come their way.

VELSHI: Now, in your own family, Sergey carries a marker for Parkinson's disease. His mother has that. That's one of the things you would like to see some progress towards. What else are you looking at?

WOJCICKI: So we're going to look across all of life sciences, but we're specifically interested -- our family has been really motivated to make major breakthroughs in Parkinson's disease.

And Parkinson's is really interesting to me because Sergey, my husband, he actually does have this genetic marker, LRRK2, that makes him high-risk for Parkinson's disease. So it's a clue and that's actually a really unusual situation, where I actually think a lot of science is going to go, where we're going to start to understand that people have something earlier, and we actually have the opportunity now to potentially prevent it.

And that's super exciting. And that's one of the things I really want to encourage is getting more and more people thinking about, wow, we could identify some of these people earlier and then we could actually prevent disease, rather than potentially curing it.

And my goal is to make anyone who is actually coming up with a therapy that you are taking to actually know who was that person who invented that?

VELSHI: Reward them and encourage others to go into it.

By the way, your company that you founded 23andMe, is that clue that many people can have. It is the first step in average people taking a swab and finding out what their genetic heritage is.

Mark, so you have got -- you have got Anne and you have Sergey from Google, you have got Art Levinson from Apple, chairman of Apple. You have got -- you have got Yuri Milner on this group that has financed a lot of companies you might actually think of as competitors. This is sort of the face of the new technology. You're not all people who normally work together, certainly in business. You're kind of competitors.

ZUCKERBERG: Yes, I think all these companies actually work together a little bit more than people think, but the big thing here is that science and technology are very closely related.

And when you're building these information technology companies, the market rewards you and you can make a lot of money, but a lot of these folks who are doing such extraordinary work in science, they don't have the same opportunity. And, because of that, I think it would just be a shame a lot of folks who are growing up trying to figure out what they want to go into don't choose to go into such critical work because of that.

So, if by having these prizes, we can give an incentive and can kind of make some of these folks a little more well known as figures that some younger students want to grow up to be like, then we're doing our job here.

VELSHI: I have to ask you, I love what you do in 23andMe. But there are a lot of people suspicious of genetics and having all that information. And, of course, at Google, I use it every day, but there are a lot of people who are suspicious that there's all sorts of information on there

And you're a computer guy and just last week you talked about how a hacker got into Facebook. So we're in this world where we have got all sorts of information. I almost thought you would be involved in giving out a prize to make sure information is all secure. Tell my viewers who are watching right now about information and security and what they -- can you assure them that all of this stuff is safe?

ZUCKERBERG: I mean, on Facebook -- all these companies spend a lot of time working on that.

But it's obviously important for the health work and life sciences work as well. There's this mix between the genetics work to help understand what are the leading indicators for disease and then work on diseases like lots of forms of cancer to help solve those things once you have those leading indicators.

And a lot of these folks that we were awarding today are just doing work on both sides of that to do -- to really push the state-of- the-art forward on these things and improve a lot of people's lives around the world.

WOJCICKI: I think there's two really interesting trends happening. There is a massive amount of genetic data being generated and anyone can get access to their genetic data.

Second, you have these big databases. And what's so exciting, if I was 12 or 13 right now, the potential discoveries you are going to be able to make in the next 10, 15, 20 years is phenomenal.

(CROSSTALK)

VELSHI: But you're not living in a world where you are not troubled by the fact all that data -- some people fear that stuff.

WOJCICKI: But I think if you can actually -- if I can actually point to you and say, look, you are actually going to be -- you are going to live to be 100 and you're going to be healthy, you're going to be running around, traveling the world, if I can actually cure your disease or I can actually help you prevent these diseases, I think people are willing to take more of a risk to be part of the database and actually be part of this community that will do something that's for good.

So you don't worry when you go into Safeway or a store and you actually use your discount card and you actually get the discounts because you know you're getting a discount, you are getting something for that. Being part of this big community with genetic data and your health information is going to help solve and prevent disease. And fundamentally I think that's what people want. There's nothing worse than walking into a hospital and seeing people sick and miserable and having a horrible treatment.

And that is what this prize is going to be helping to fix.

(CROSSTALK)

VELSHI: Mark, sorry. (INAUDIBLE) talked about how in 15 years every year, we will be adding a year to how long we can live. You just mentioned living to 100. That's actually fairly common now. And we know that of kids born today, many of them will live to be 100.

How old -- how much can we extend life and how much should we extend life in your opinion?

ZUCKERBERG: You are asking questions that are a bit above our pay grade, I think. But...

(CROSSTALK)

VELSHI: I'm not sure there are a lot of people in the world above your pay grade.

(LAUGHTER)

ZUCKERBERG: But the work that these folks are doing, they're each taking big risks and taking on these big projects. But each of these is a step forward for humanity, right? These questions about we're going to be in 10 and 20 years, they're important, but I can guarantee you that people who are sick or who might have these issues want the cures that these folks are working on, on building.

And in order to get more of the best people and the smartest people who are going to school today to work on these problems to help cure these diseases, I really hope that the work that we're doing here today can just be an institution...

(CROSSTALK)

VELSHI: You talked about like the Nobel Prize or things -- it's a thing. People talk about the Breakthrough Prize. Somebody got awarded that, and that's a big deal.

ZUCKERBERG: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

ZUCKERBERG: This prize isn't really about the people who are winning it today.

VELSHI: Right.

ZUCKERBERG: It's about the college and grad students who are in the lab trying to figure out what they should be researching. It's about younger kids who are still trying to figure out what they want to be when they grow up.

(CROSSTALK)

VELSHI: Sergey had a similar experience to yours, did things in the college dorm room that became big businesses.

WOJCICKI: Yes, but let me just add to that point.

I will define success of this prize is when I go to you and I say tell me your favorite basketball player, tell me your favorite celebrity, tell me your favorite scientist. Like, that's awesome, and that's success for this prize.

VELSHI: Let me ask you, Mark, how does this work into -- I know it's not a commercial venture for you, but how does this fit into a Facebook world in five years or 10 years when this thing is a really big deal?

ZUCKERBERG: Oh, it doesn't. There are things that -- I focus on Facebook because I think it's a really good thing for the world. I really believe in our mission of helping people connect and making the world more open and connected, but there are lots of things that I think would be awesome to see exist in the world that Facebook isn't the right vehicle to work on those things through.

And it's awesome to be able to work with a lot of folks who are really smart and have been successful in other areas and draw on their experience to do things like this as well.

VELSHI: But while we're here live on CNN, any announcements you want to make about Facebook?

ZUCKERBERG: No.

(LAUGHTER)

VELSHI: Well, I guess that's it.

Do you know if Sergey had any announcements he wanted to make about Google?

WOJCICKI: Not that I know of.

VELSHI: All right.

Thanks to both of you. We really -- we hope this does end up being the institution that you hope it is and that in one day you will be able to ask people along with their favorite sports star who their favorite scientist is. So thanks for doing this and thank you for joining us.

Fred, that's it for me in San Francisco. There are a lot of people around here very, very excited about the idea that there is real money going into the development of things that we don't even know could cause us to be healthier and end up living longer.

WHITFIELD: Right. That's a lot and that is quite the endeavor. Thanks so much for bringing that to us. Ali, appreciate it.

Jesse Jackson Jr. pleading guilty today. He was charged with using campaign funds to pay for lavish personal expenses, everything from expensive watches to fur coats. The once rising political star now faces possible prison time. We have got that for you next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: Former Congressman Jesse Jackson Jr. pleaded guilty to using $750,000 of campaign money for personal expenses. Among those purchases, Michael Jackson memorabilia, Bruce Lee memorabilia, and children's furniture.

Lisa Sylvester is tracking the story from Washington.

So, Lisa, Jackson could get up to five years in prison and a $250,000 fine. Why does Jackson's lawyer believe that he actually might get a reduced sentence?

LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, his lawyers have come out and they are essentially saying, look, this is a guy who has health issues. I mean, he has talked about having -- suffering from depression, bipolar disease. But, boy oh, boy, that's really going to have to be weighed against some of the things we are now learning from these court documents that just came out today. Jesse Jackson, he was essentially using his campaign credit card like it was his own personal spending account, paying for everything from home appliances, restaurants, dry cleaning, fur coats, a $5,600 spa outing at the Martha's Vineyard holistic retreat. And then, as you mentioned, there was all of the memorabilia, and a lot of it, too, like $8,500 for two Michael Jackson hats and $4,000 for a Michael Jackson and Eddie Van Halen guitar.

Now during the court proceeding Jesse Jackson Jr., I can tell you I was in the courtroom, but several times he looked back directly at his parents and during that key moment when the judge asked him how do you plead, he looked back at them, he dabbed his eyes and he said, "Guilty, Your Honor."

Jackson also told the judge -- quote -- "I used moneys that should have been for campaign purposes." He is pleading guilty. This is a felony, conspiracy to commit wire fraud, mail fraud and making false statements and he could face up to five years in prison. But as we said during a plea agreement with the prosecutors, they had agreed that perhaps a sentence maybe in the three- to four-year range would be more appropriate because of these outstanding health issues.

WHITFIELD: Wow, that's a heavy load for Jesse Jackson Jr.

Now what about his wife? She, too, is facing some charges and will be pleading?

SYLVESTER: Yes. Actually, what is happening right now, his wife, Sandi Jackson, she does face these separate charges, filing false tax forms. She is going before a judge right now as we speak today. That proceeding is happening. She faces potentially three years in prison, Fred.

WHITFIELD: Oh, boy. All right. Lisa Sylvester, thanks so much for bringing that to us. Appreciate it.

All right. Should teenagers be required to pass a drug test before they get their driver's licenses? A new proposal in West Virginia says yes. A lot of parents aren't very happy about that. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right, the Donald is lashing out through his lawyers. The target, the man behind this petition calling for Macy's department stores to drop the Trump clothing line. Right now, the petitioner, Angelo Caruson, has collected more than 685,000 signatures.

Donald Trump's attorney sent a letter to Caruson. It says if Caruson doesn't stop his efforts, I'm quoting the letter now, "We will have no choice but to commence a major-multimillion dollar lawsuit against you, your organization, and co-conspirators" -- end quote.

The attorney calls the petition -- quote -- "mob-like bullying and coercion." The defense attorney Joey Jackson is "On the Case."

Joey, good to see you. Does Trump have a case?

JOEY JACKSON, LEGAL ANALYST: Well, listen, I have to be very careful in speaking about this because I don't want to be sued and I don't want you to be sued either.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITFIELD: Are you wearing a Trump tie?

JACKSON: No.

WHITFIELD: OK, just checking.

JACKSON: Listen, ultimately, what happens is there's something called tortious interference of contractual relations and that's when a party intervenes. They intermeddle.

And as a result of that, you lose the contract. The problem here, Fredricka, is that it's protected conduct. He, this person believes Donald that Trump shouldn't have that line. He has expressive opinions. He's getting a petition together and remember that thing called the First Amendment? It's protected.

WHITFIELD: Yes, I was going to say, freedom of expression. So, he's just speaking his mind. What's the matter with that?

JACKSON: Absolutely.

WHITFIELD: But then how is it that Donald Trump and his attorneys can say we're going to take issue with this and make it a legal matter?

JACKSON: Because what they're saying is that he's doing it in a malicious way, that he's attempting to impair his business relations, that is Donald Trump's relations, with Macy's and he has no real lawful purpose. It's just something he's doing out of malice.

You know and I know based upon reading and reviewing this case, however, that he really feels that Donald Trump is out of line, he's acted improperly and inappropriately. And so on that basis, he's getting everyone involved, comparable to a boycott, to say don't buy those products. I do believe this person is protected and well within their rights and doesn't have to worry about $25 million. And that's not legal advice, by the way.

WHITFIELD: Yes. OK.

JACKSON: Disclaimer.

WHITFIELD: OK. Very good.

We have a response, by the way, from Angelo Caruson. He told us that Trump says his Macy's line is doing well. So what damages could there be? Does Caruson -- is he driving home a real point there?

JACKSON: Well, what happens in these cases, Fredricka, is there's generally under the law a number of damages. One is an injunction. That means that, listen, stop doing this. And the law in equity can tell this person to stop and the alternative is compensatory damages, meaning if you impair my ability to make money for the amount of money I have lost, I'm going to get it from you.

WHITFIELD: Oh.

JACKSON: And finally there's punitive damages and that says if you're malicious about it, the law punishes you. I see those as unlikely. I see any damages unlikely. If anything, maybe there's an injunction, which is the court says stop it. But I doubt it. I think he's really protected in doing what he's doing.

WHITFIELD: All right, let's switch gears, so to speak. Lawmaker in West Virginia proposing that teenagers get drug tested before being able to get a driver's license. Can you do that? Can you single out a certain populace and subject them to a test that nobody else would have to take?

JACKSON: Aha. Therein lies the issue. We saw this happen in Florida and Michigan as it related to welfare recipients and the law requiring them to take a test prior, a drug test, before being given welfare and the courts didn't take so kindly to that.

There were a number of legal battles and I think there will be legal battles here and the legal battle will really be predicated upon two things, Fredricka. Number one is what you're doing is you're invading people's privacy. Right? We have a Fourth Amendment right to our individual privacy and protection.

And so when you force someone to take a test, you're invading and stampeding on that privacy. The second issue is what's called being overbroad. It's not every teenager that may have an issue or that may consume any type of substance like this. And so why are you really looking in an overbroad way to make everybody accountable for the instances of a very few.

WHITFIELD: Yes. So it sounds like you do not believe this drug testing will accelerate.

JACKSON: It may. There will be legal challenges, you can be clear. Of course, it has to pass the hurdle of being passed into law. That's more a political debate, but when it does or if it does, you better believe the ACLU and other entities will be all over regarding privacy issues.

WHITFIELD: They will put the brakes on it, right.

JACKSON: Absolutely.

WHITFIELD: All right, Joey Jackson, thanks so much. Good to see you. Appreciate it.

JACKSON: Good to see you, Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: All right.

Coming up next, for days, people staying at a hotel in downtown Los Angeles complained of something strange going on with the water. Rooms were flooding, water pressure low.