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Was Travis Terrified of Jodi?; Jodi Arias Defense Asks for Mistrial

Aired April 1, 2013 - 19:00   ET


JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST: Tonight breaking news. The defense asked for a mistrial, saying a juror has engaged in misconduct. We`re going to tell you what misconduct is being alleged and how this could affect the trial.

Also, was Travis Alexander living in fear for his life? New information spilling out that Travis finally realized he was in grave danger just days before he was killed by Jodi Arias. What caused the alarm bells to go off?

Plus, I will talk to a dominatrix -- yes, a real-live dominatrix -- about Travis and Jodi`s secret sex games. Was it abuse or just fun S&M? We`re going to analyze, as well, the gas cans and why they`re crucial for the prosecution`s case, next.


VELEZ-MITCHELL (voice-over): Tonight, breaking news. Brand-new information about the week leading up to Travis Alexander`s killing. What made Travis so very afraid of Jodi in the final days just before she killed him?

Plus, Little Red Riding Hood fantasies, raunchy phone sex. Was Jodi Arias a victim of sexual humiliation or a willing participant in kinky sex games? When does playing and S&M cross the line into abuse? Tonight, I`ll talk live to a sex expert, a professional dominatrix.

Plus, new inside details about Travis Alexander`s plan to propose to another woman and how Jodi Arias allegedly stole the engagement ring. We`ll debate it with our expert panel, and we`re taking your calls.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (via phone): He has a -- he has an ex-girlfriend that`s been bothering him.

TRAVIS ALEXANDER, MURDER VICTIM (via phone): You are right, in the bath -- it was hot.

JENNIFER WILLMOTT, JODI`S DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Jodi was Travis`s dirty little secret.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Towards the end of their relationship, after they had kind of broken up and he had put some distance between them, it really was an obsession type of a thing. And the way he described it is that she was really stalking him.

WILLMOTT: When you`re dealing with a terrorist, once they know you mean business, the stalking increases.

JODI ARIAS, MURDER DEFENDANT: What is he going to think if I`m showing up at his house at 3 a.m. in the morning?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They think that you are absolutely obsessed. "Obsessed" is the word that they used. That`s the word I hear from everybody. Fatal attraction. I don`t know how many times I`ve heard that.

ALYCE LAVIOLETTE, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE EXPERT: Might call the other person just to hear their voice on the answering machine.

ARIAS (via phone): You`re bad. You make me feel so dirty.

(on camera): I still had love for him, yes. And I was thinking now more in terms of eternity.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The slashing of the tires and the e-mails. They really started to take a toll on him.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Good evening. I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell coming to you live. Breaking news tonight. The defense is asking for a mistrial, charging there has been jury misconduct. What kind of alleged misconduct? We`re going to have the very latest on this breaking development, live from Arizona, in just a moment.

But first, we`re also learning brand-new information tonight about Travis Alexander`s deep fears for his life in the days leading up to his death.

Sources say just one week before Travis was killed by his ex- girlfriend, Jodi Arias, he confessed to friends that he was terrified of Jodi. That he finally felt that he was in danger and that Jodi was an obsessed stalker.

The realization came about a week before Jodi stabbed Travis 29 times, sliced his neck from ear to here and shot him in the face, and that`s about the same time that Travis, just days before, sent Jodi these very nasty text messages. Listen to what he wrote.


ARIAS: "I sent you a response to your dire conversation that I hope you read, because you need to read it. Maybe it will spark human emotion in you, something that only seems to exist when it comes to your own problems, but everyone else is just a part of your sick agenda.

"I have never in my life been hurt so bad by someone, but why do I even say it because you don`t care? It doesn`t serve your evilness. I don`t want your apology. I want you to understand what I think of you. I want you to understand how evil I think you are. You are the worst thing that ever happened to me.

"You are a sociopath. You only cry for yourself. You have never cared about me, and you betrayed me less than any example I can conjure. You are stick and you have scammed me."


VELEZ-MITCHELL: And that`s Jodi on the stand, reading what Travis sent to her. Those texts were sent between May 20 and 26, just a week before Travis was killed on June 4, 2008. Did Travis finally see the light, but was it too late? And if he was so frightened of Jodi, why would he still have sex with her? We know they took these graphic naked photos of each other the very day he died.

So was the kind of sex Jodi and Travis had like some kind of drug? OK? Is that why Travis let her into his home and had sex with her, even though he was reportedly terrified of what she might do?

In just a moment, I`m going to talk to a dominatrix about this and ask her the ultimate question: was their sex life abusive, as the defense claims, or was it just kinky fun, as the prosecutor said? Where do we draw the line when it comes to sex?

Call me: 1-877-JVM-SAYS, 1-877-586-7297.

Straight out to Shanna Hogan, who is writing an excellent book about this case, "Picture Perfect."

Shanna, what have you learned tonight from your sources about what sparked Travis Alexander`s sudden realization that Jodi was dangerous and his fear of her just before their final and deadly encounter?

SHANNA HOGAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, Jane, talking with my sources, a lot of people have tried to speculate what were the things that led up to that murder? And we know from the text messages that we`ve seen in court, that two days before that gun was stolen, he said those things to her. You know, calling her evil, a sociopath, a liar. These evil, monstrous things and sort of, kind of realized what she was, that she didn`t -- she wasn`t like a normal girl. She didn`t have empathy, and all she cared about was herself.

And so my sources are telling me that maybe she even recorded the sex phone tape and had threatened to tell them about it or to reveal that to his friends. Something she had done had betrayed him worse than he`d been betrayed by anyone else. And he -- and I think that she might have been afraid that he was going to expose her for what she really is.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Fascinating stuff.

Now, Travis`s mentor was a guest on this show, and he said exactly what you`re saying. He says Travis believed Jodi wanted him dead. Let`s listen to this.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And he had left -- decided to leave Jodi and explained that the next day he was going to leave in his car, and his tires were slashed. And the Sunday after that, he explained to us and told us about it and said, "Don`t be surprised if some -- one of these days I don`t show up and you find me dead some place."


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now why wouldn`t somebody like that be called to testify for the prosecution?

Let`s bring in our expert panel to debate it. Because to me it seems like -- and this is true with a lot of cases, some of the most damaging evidence, some of the most damaging potential testimony, is never heard by the jury. And they were all shocked when they came to a different conclusion than the polls and the general public.

So let`s debate it. If Travis had warned that, "Hey, Jodi might kill me. If I show up dead, look at her," why doesn`t the jury know that? Why do they have to extrapolate from these cryptic texts where he says, "You`re evil"?

Let`s start with Stacey Honowitz with the prosecution.

STACEY HONOWITZ, FLORIDA PROSECUTOR: Well, Jane, you know it`s very easy to Monday morning quarterback what the prosecutor and what the defense are doing, because they know the case better than anybody. We don`t know the ins and outs; we don`t know the strategy that`s used. All we see are little excerpts about what went on. We don`t know if there were pretrial hearings to keep it out, because what he told somebody was hearsay.

So why the prosecution chose not to use this could be a myriad of reasons, and it could be used later on in a rebuttal case. But for now to sit here and try to figure out bits and pieces that we don`t know about, it`s not fair to either the prosecution or the defense.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Brian Silber for the defense.

BRIAN SILBER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, I agree with Stacey, and there`s actually some other issues. You know, the claim that she slashed the tires is a presumption. No one really knows that for sure. There`s no evidence. There isn`t any eyewitness. That`s just something that people are saying.

Same thing with Shanna`s book about the ring. You know, there`s no evidence that she actually stole this ring. This is all a lot of hubbub and gossip about this girl that you can`t allow into a trial, because it`s not supported by any real evidence.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, and to add to that, just a week before he`s killed, it`s clear, OK, from the texts that Travis sent that he`s furious with Jodi, but there`s two sides to this story. Jodi testified, "Oh, Travis is angry because, oh, he knew that I knew about his alleged attraction to young boys, and I was pressuring him to get help." Listen to what she had to say.


ARIAS: I promised him that I wouldn`t tell anybody about his issues if he promised to get help. And another stipulation I made was that he couldn`t stay the night at his friend`s house, because they have children. And until he got help.

And so my understanding was that he did actually end up staying there. And I talked to him about it, and I reminded him that he needs to get help. He was not happy that I kept pushing him and pushing him, because he wanted me to drop the subject.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jon Lieberman, the prosecutor believes this is a complete lie that she made it up and then just spins these text and says, "Oh, it`s because he was mad at me, because I was trying to force him to get help for his pedophilia," which the prosecutors say is a total lie; that he wasn`t a pedophile.

JON LIEBERMAN, HLN CONTRIBUTOR: Yes. I mean, look, a lot of Jodi`s words just serve to kill Travis over and over and over again, and obviously, he`s not here to speak for himself.

I mean, whereas there is a lot of evidence to show that Jodi, in fact, was the pursuer; that Jodi, after Travis broke up with her, that he moved to be closer to her, that she hacked into his e-mails.


LIEBERMAN: And, I mean, it`s about the credibility.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Evangeline Gomez for the defense.

EVANGELINE GOMEZ, ATTORNEY: The issue here is that, look, he was angry. He wanted to make her feel guilty. Guilt her, perhaps, into having sex with him. He missed that relationship, as was stated on this show before. The two had an addiction to one another. That`s why there`s no premeditation in this case.

Because guess what? They were still going to have sexual rendezvouses even after he went to Cancun, after he had girlfriend No. 2, girlfriend No. 3. Travis and Jodi were not going to end.


GOMEZ: That`s why she had no motive to kill him.

SILBER: She`s correct.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: You have seen the graphic...


VELEZ-MITCHELL: We`re going to continue this debate. You`ve seen the graphic, raunchy photos that were shown in court. You`ve heard the steamy phone sex tapes. So was Jodi a victim of sexual humiliation or was she a willing participant in adult sex games? When does role playing and S&M cross the line into abuse? Are they two totally different things? I`m going to talk to a professional dominatrix next.


ALEXANDER (via phone): I love the braids.

ARIAS (via phone): You`re bad. You make me feel so dirty.

I know you loved being handled. But, like, if I had to put one before the other, I like being handled.



ARIAS: Going to Nevada and Utah would have been cheaper, so I wanted to fill it up.

JUAN MARTINEZ, PROSECUTOR: You were filling up in California, right?


MARTINEZ: And after you filled that, you filled up the third gas can, didn`t you?

She called you again, asking about these gas cans to go to Mesa.

ARIAS: I didn`t have a third.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: We`re going to explain and debate the importance of the gas cans to the prosecution`s case for premeditation in just a minute.

But first, our breaking news. The defense now claiming misconduct on the part of a juror and asking for a mistrial.

This alleged misconduct came up during a meeting with jurors over last week`s big controversy. You remember: prosecutor Juan Martinez posed for pictures with fans outside the courthouse. And the defense said when they heard claims that juror No. 5 made a biased comment during the course of questioning them about this photo session.

And that apparently, quote, "Juror No. 5 engaged in misconduct that affected more than one juror."

OK. So Beth Karas, right now there are 18 jurors on the trial. Obviously, once this case is handed over to the jury there will be 12 selected to deliberate, and the rest become alternates. So what`s the story with this juror? Who is this juror? What is the alleged misconduct?

BETH KARAS, CORRESPONDENT, TRUTV`S "IN SESSION": Well, we know that it is one of the seven women on the jury. She sits in seat No. 5. She has two-colored hair or tri-color. It`s sort of blonde, and sometimes it`s red, red, red -- that`s a real red -- around -- underneath and around her face.

And she takes a lot of notes. I believe she`s one of the jurors who submits a lot of questions, too. That wire basket for jury questions sits right in front of her. So this is the juror in the hot seat right now.

We don`t know what she said, and if she made some sort of biased comment in the individual questioning last Thursday, which is when this issue arose, that would not constitute misconduct, unless she said, "I said it in front of a lot of other jurors."

The allegation here is that she said something that may have tainted other jurors. So saying something to the attorneys and judge in private doesn`t taint other jurors. So we don`t know everything that was said.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Isn`t it possible that, while they were questioning all of the jurors about whether they saw Prosecutor Martinez, which presumably they didn`t, because there was no repercussions from that meeting, but we don`t know for sure, that other jurors said -- sort of tattletaled and said, "Well, you know what? Juror No. 5" -- decka, decka, decka, decka. Right?



KARAS: That`s absolutely possible, yes.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I`m wondering if that`s the case that there are divisions already within this jury pool, because why would the defense fight to knock somebody off if the comment had been made pro-defense? Probably, if the comment was made pro-prosecution is why they would want to knock her off, right?

KARAS: Correct, right. And you see this was electronically filed, this motion for a mistrial, yesterday afternoon, Easter Sunday, about 3:30 here. It was filed. And, you know, I assume the judge will deal with it first thing tomorrow morning, since there was no court today. She`s already questioned the jurors, right?

So I have to believe that all 18 jurors have been questioned about whatever this issue is. They have their arguments. The defense refers to the sealed record, so I think there will simply be argument and no more fact-finding mission, argument and a decision by the judge.


KARAS: And you know what? This juror may be gone. Because this is a death-penalty case. The juror may not want to err on the wrong side and run the risk that she`s creating an appellate issue down the road.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Fact. Maybe it could hold up the trial a couple hours more. You never know.

Well, let`s talk briefly with our panel. Stacey Honowitz, you`re a prosecutor. I -- I`m getting a sense -- I have no idea. No idea. This is just totally, you know, a guess that maybe there are factions. They`re not supposed to talk about the case. Right? But can factions develop with the roll of an eye or -- oh, you know -- a sigh?

HONOWITZ: Well, of course. I mean, these people have been sitting on this jury for such a long time they form certain bonds with one another. That doesn`t mean that they discuss the facts of the case. They`re not allowed to.

But certainly, you have to start to imagine that there`s no way that there`s 18 people sitting there for this duration of time and not making up their minds and not signaling to one another. But certainly, there could be a divide amongst them.

And I think, in this case, the idea that the judge has already questioned them -- I can`t imagine what came across yesterday on Easter Sunday across the defense`s desk that would make them think that there`s a reason to ask for a mistrial or remove this juror.

And you`re correct: tomorrow morning it`s going to be the first thing the judge handles, and it is going to hold the jury up, you know, probably for another couple of hours tomorrow.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Evangeline Gomez, to me it signals that perhaps -- I would think, if I agree with somebody and they make a comment, just human nature, I`m not going to say, "Oh, they made a comment" unless I disagree with them. That`s when I`m going to tattle on them.

So since the defense is asking for this juror to be removed, at the very least, and also asking for a mistrial, which is highly unlikely -- I mean, they`ve asked for a mistrial several times before -- it would indicate to me that this juror that said whatever -- she said something that was pro-prosecution. anti-defense. Quickly.

GOMEZ: Perhaps she did. Again, we`ll find out all of the facts tomorrow. But is this likely to cause a mistrial? Is a judge going to rule for a mistrial? I don`t really think so. Can the juror be removed? Well, it depends on what the facts are surrounding this.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, up next, we have a very special guest. This trial is, to a large degree, about sex. OK. What kind of sex was going on between Jodi and Travis? Was it abusive, sexual humiliation, as the defense claims? Or was it just kinky S&M sex between two consenting adults?

To get the facts straight about what constitutes kinky sex versus abuse, I am talking to this lady right here, Mistress Josie. And she is a dominatrix. She works in Manhattan. And it`s her job. It`s her profession, and she knows a lot about sex as a result.

Stay right there. We`re going to talk to her on the other side.


LAVIOLETTE: She said, "I think I must have learned about giving up the things I want for somebody I love."

MARTINEZ: I thought you said your relationship with Mr. Alexander was very stressful?

ARIAS: Some of the sex wasn`t.

When he (EXPLETIVE DELETED) on my face and drove away without a word, it kind of felt like I was a prostitute.




ALEXANDER (via phone): I`m going to tie you to a tree and put it in your (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

ARIAS (via phone): Oh, my gosh. That is so debasing. I like it.

I`m game for, like, almost everything you come up with. But you really are a wellspring of ideas. You are quite the source.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, there is a little bit of the phone sex tape, now infamous phone sex tape, between Travis and Jodi.

And I want to bring in my very special guest, Mistress Josie.

You are a dominatrix. You -- this is your trade. You dominate people for a living, and they experience some pleasure as a result of it. So what we`re trying to figure out in this case -- and we come to you because you know about this. This is what you do for a living. Is where does, like, games that might involve somebody dominating somebody else and real abuse begin? How do you distinguish between those two things?

MISTRESS JOSIE, DOMINATRIX: Well, it`s all about communication. You really just have to be clear with your partner. You have to know their limitations, respect their limitations, and talk about it beforehand.

I think this case highlights the importance of consenting adults talking to each other beforehand and, you know, establishing those boundaries and limitations before you engage in play.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I understand that Stacey Honowitz is very eager to get into this conversation, so we`re going to let her jump in. Stacey?

HONOWITZ: Listen, I just think that, you know, to talk about this, I think the fact of the matter is, in this case, what you have is a girl who feels used who was blown off by somebody. And she premeditated to kill him because he was with someone else.

I mean, I know we talked -- I think there`s a fine line between -- not a fine line. I think we`re just trying to discuss obsession versus abuse. I don`t see abuse in this relationship. I see a girl who was obsessed with a guy who didn`t want her. I think a lot of girls feel used like she did, and they don`t take it to the extent that she did.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, but listen: the differences that we`re getting inside the bedroom -- and we`re hearing things that they did together, the fantasies: he wants to tie her to a tree and bleep her. She claims that he wanted to have sex in manners that many women would consider degrading. She`s supposed to perform oral sex on him in an outdoor place, and then he throws chocolate candies on her.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold on a second. Getting back to Mistress Josie. What would the bottom, let`s say, get out of a situation like that? When they`re feeling sexual humiliation, why is that pleasurable? Why do people come to you -- and I would assume that they`re mostly men. But I never want to -- first rule of journalism, don`t assume. But why would somebody come to you? What do they get out of it, to be dominated and humiliated?

MISTRESS JOSIE: Well, it`s different for everyone. I can`t speak for everyone. But as a professional and the clients I see, a lot of people really enjoy letting go of control.

We`re expected to do so much in our everyday lives. We have so much weighing on our shoulders. And just giving up that power and letting someone else take control can be an overwhelming and enjoyable experience.

And, you know, I can`t speak for everyone. But for myself and for my clients, I -- I know it`s just about giving and taking.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So it`s about a power exchange. That`s the phrase that is often used, where one person has a lot of power and the other person has no power. But is that abuse?

In other words, Jodi Arias is taking their relationship, which involved that kind of thing -- her being submissive, him being dominant, OK -- and she`s trying to turn it into the fact that she was abused, which the prosecution and Travis`s family is saying, "Nonsense. You weren`t abused. You were playing a kinky sex game."

MISTRESS JOSIE: Yes. Well, it sounds like they didn`t really have a healthy relationship outside of the bedroom either. I think that is a priority before sex. Healthy communication, healthy relationship. And it sounds like, in Jodi and Travis`s case, things outside of the bedroom weren`t very good either.

So you can`t really, you know, use everything that was happening in the bedroom as an example of abuse, or you can`t call that abuse. You have to...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I think what you`re saying is, if you want to have those kinds of experiences and use the bedroom as some kind of playground for experimentation, A, you have to figure out what the rules are, what the boundaries are; and, B, you should probably have a healthy relationship in other areas so that it doesn`t become sort of a sandbox for hostility to be expressed.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. More on the other side. It`s a fascinating subject. "Fifty Shades of Gray" and all the sequels. The books are wild best sellers. Why are people so fascinated with this subjects?

More on the other side, and we`re taking your calls.


LAVIOLETTE: They advised her to move on from the group -- relationship. That Mr. Alexander has been abusive to women.

JUDGE SHERRY STEPHENS, PRESIDING OVER TRIAL: "Did Travis ever call you names?"


STEPHENS: "Did you ever feel personally threatened by Travis?"


STEPHENS: "Was Travis ever abusive to you?"






KURT NURMI, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: And how many gas cans did you borrow?

JUAN MARTINEZ, PROSECUTOR: Wouldn`t you agree that a cash transaction is harder to keep track of than a credit transaction?

ARIAS: Going to Nevada and Utah would have been cheaper so I wanted to fill it up.

MARTINEZ: You were filling up in California, right?


MARTINEZ: And after you filled that, you filled up the third gas can, didn`t you? She called you again asking about these gas cans to go to Mesa?

ARIAS: I didn`t have a third.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: We`re approaching the end of the defense case and then the prosecution`s rebuttal case begins and it`s going to focus big- time on these gas cans. Prosecutor Juan Martinez is making a huge deal over the gas cans that Jodi bought on her way to Travis` home in Arizona. It could be the prosecution`s strongest point to prove premeditation.

We know Jodi showed up in Monterey, California on June 2nd. The next day she stopped at her ex-boyfriend`s house and borrows a couple of gas cans. Darryl Brewer testified Jodi told him she needed the gas cans for a long trip. All right. That`s the ex-boyfriend.

Anyway, Jodi drives to a Wal-Mart in Salinas to buy a third gas can and in Salinas she claims that she decided to return it after buying it. Prosecutor Juan Martinez says Jodi is lying. There is no evidence she ever returned that third gas can. Prosecutor Martinez showed receipts that prove Jodi drove up to Pasadena California to fill up not only her car but also two maybe three gas cans before driving to Travis` home in Arizona.

Prosecutors pointed Jodi did all of this to leave no trace of going to Arizona. No gas can receipt or gas station cameras would capture filling up in Arizona where Travis lived. The prosecutor said that shows her intent to leave California and drive secretly to Arizona to kill Travis.

So Beth Karas, correspondent, "In Session", tell us how the prosecution`s rebuttal case is going to focus on the gas cans and why.

BETH KARAS, CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": Well, we believe it`s possible, based upon questions we heard Juan Martinez ask that he will call someone from Wal-Mart because he did say that that Jodi Arias -- "Wal-Mart has no record of you having returned that third gas can. Does that surprise you?" She said "Yes, it does surprise me considering I did return it."

So maybe he`ll have somebody from Wal-Mart may say this is our return policy and she did not return this gas can or we would have a record for it. That -- the gas can issue coupled with the state`s argument that she shut her cell phone off. She says her cell phone ran out of power. She shut her cell phone off. There was no record of her cell phone pinging on any cell towers in the state of Arizona. No record of her stopping at a gas station getting caught on video.

She took the license plates off the car when she parked at Travis` and in her haste probably put the back one on upside down when she was getting out of town. There`s nothing to show she was in Arizona. No calls. No gas stations and that`s basically -- those are the two areas that would have probably shown her presence if she hadn`t done -- taken the steps that she did.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. And obviously the bloody handprint shows she was in Travis` home but she never wanted to have anybody know, according to the prosecutor, that she ever was in Arizona and that shows premeditation, shows consciousness that she was going to do something wrong.

It can be very hard to prove premeditation which is a key for the death penalty. Even when common sense tells you there`s a connection between this and that. For example, Detective Flores, he interrogates Jodi about the mysterious robbery at her grandparents` home about a week before Travis is killed where a gun taken is the very same caliber as the gun Jodi uses to kill Travis.

Listen to Jodi`s innocent-sounding explanation.


ESTEBAN FLORES, POLICE DETECTIVE: You reported a gun stolen .25 auto -- this happens to be the same caliber as the weapon used to kill him.

ARIAS: A .25 auto was used?

FLORES: Yes. Along with multiple stab wounds.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jon Leiberman, why are the gas cans really the ultimate proof that she premeditated the killing?

JON LEIBERMAN, HLN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, Beth Karas pretty much, you know, explained it. The fact of the matter is she did not want to be fingered in Arizona. She paid with cash. She didn`t want any record of filling up for gas.

And Jane can we go back to this abuse issue quickly?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I will get -- ok.

LEIBERMAN: We have to address it. Even if you believe that Travis was emotionally abusive to this woman and I don`t, does that give somebody a permission slip to kill? To stab somebody 29 times and slash their throat? It absolutely does not.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Of course not.

LEIBERMAN: She had plenty of opportunities to get out of that house on the day of the murder and she did not. She could have left at least three different times.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: The reason I am talking about these gas cans, Evangeline Gomez, is that when I took at look at it -- by the way, these are two gallons. She had, according to prosecutors, three five-gallon cans, which means she claims she did this because she was scared to drive into the desert and running out of gas.

To me when I see this, it`s like, oh my gosh, a fender-bender could cause the entire car to explode. But the point is that only this would show that she planned to go there. All the other stuff is circumstantial. Well, there was a robbery at her grandparents` home. You can`t prove 100 percent that that was the gun that she used to kill Travis.

EVANGELINE GOMEZ, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Jane, the gas tanks, I don`t think -- as an attorney analyzing this -- I don`t think it`s a strong case for premeditation. A jury may think differently.

BRIAN SILBER, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I agree. I agree very strongly.

GOMEZ: This is an area that has a lot of deserts. So what? She had gas tanks in her car that had gas in them. The issue here is that he invited her to his home to have sex, ok? If she planned to kill him with a gun, why was he stabbed? And if she wanted to be smart and if this were premeditation she could have lured him out of the house and let`s meet at a park. I`ve got to talk to you, let`s take a walk. But that didn`t happen.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Stacey Honowitz, your response.

STACEY HONOWITZ, FLORIDA PROSECUTOR: Those gas cans are so telling it`s unbelievable. Why would she fill -- and then if you want to go with the conclusion that the gas cans mean nothing, why did she lie about them? She was caught in cross examination lying about the gas cans.

So when you couple the gas can with the robbery, it`s not coincidental, it`s called premeditation. Like I said, he used. If she wanted --

GOMEZ: Just because she lied doesn`t meant that she --

LEIBERMAN: Why else would you buy gas cans?


HONOWITZ: He blew her off and she killed him. And that`s the --


SILBER: Hold on a second.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Listen, I lived in California for 18 years -- did I ever buy gas cans? True, I drove a Prius but did I ever buy gas cans? And I drove to Phoenix. No. I never did. Never crossed my mind.

GOMEZ: But Jane, there are some people who do.

SILBER: When you drive to the desert when else would you use gas cans? That`s what they are there for. It`s for when you`re driving through the desert alone.


SILBER: When else would somebody use the gas can.


ARIAS: This is a really trivial question and it`s going to reveal how shallow I am. But before they book me, can I clean myself up a little bit.



VELEZ-MITCHELL: We`re following all moments of the Jodi Arias trial but we want to keep you posted and up to date on other big stories making headlines tonight. Actress and all-around troubled starlet Lindsay Lohan is yet to check in to her court-ordered 90-day rehab program. Tonight we`re learning what the holdup could be. New reports claim LiLo only agreed to the plea deal in her lying to cops case if she could continue to take Adderall in rehab. If true, it`s highly unlikely any rehab facility would allow her to take the drug while in treatment. What does this mean for Lindsay? We`ll stay on top of it.



TRAVIS ALEXANDER, MURDER VICTIM: I`d like you to ride my (EXPLETIVE DELETED) like a horse.

ARIAS: yes.

ALEXANDER: I need to get my (EXPLETIVE DELETED) fix too.


ALEXANDER: I`m going to get some great shots of freaking (EXPLETIVE DELETED) in you.

I want to give you a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) too. I mean it`s going to be like legitimate porn.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Let`s bring in Tanya Young Williams, advocate for women who are abused. Tanya one of the crucial issues in this case is was she abused as she claims and there`s a domestic violence expert on the stand now saying she was sexually humiliated implying she was the victim of some sort of domestic violence or were the two of them just playing consensual adult kinky sex games?

TANYA YOUNG WILLIAMS, ADVOCATE FOR ABUSED WOMEN: Yes, Jane, listen. I have stated my opinion on this numerous times on your show and that based on my experience as a survivor as well as an advocate against domestic violence, her story doesn`t ring true.

But more importantly, I decided to listen to the silent majority and conduct a survey and ask the people who are watching who are equally as engaged as we are and to hear what their opinions are because their opinions are just as important as ours and in asking through this survey -- 3,500 respondents said -- of that respondent number, 96 percent believe that she was a victim of domestic violence.

And these are also people who are listening to the trial every day, listened to all of her testimony. So it`s not ringing true to me and it`s not ringing true to a large majority of viewers watching this trial on HLN.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok. So you did a survey and 96 percent of the people who responded said they do not believe she is a victim of domestic violence. You say you don`t buy it either. Why don`t you buy it? Spell it out exactly because some of the stuff is quite -- I mean, I`ve had people come up to me on the street who aren`t really studying this trial in-depth that have heard some of these phone calls and say, whoa, that`s some raunchy stuff there.

YOUNG-WILLIAMS: Well, one of the things that the experts said -- and I`m sure the prosecutor is going to ask -- just because someone says something one time does not make them an abuser. And so what Travis said - - it was not appropriate and I don`t condone that type of language, but I`m not going to label him as an abuser.

But what is most important to me is that when I listened to Jodi Arias speak about her abuse, it was cold. It was detached. And I always say it`s not so important that she did not call the authorities or that she did not journal the abuse but what is important is that she had the inability to explain why she didn`t do it.

And speaking to thousands of victims, they want to tell you especially when they are out of harm`s way why they didn`t reach out and some of the reasons are they were scared, they didn`t think anyone would listen, they were afraid their perpetrator might find out. But her inability to answer why raised a really big red flag for me.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. And I see what you`re saying. In other words, she`s mouthing the words that say abuse but from your experience as a survivor as well as dealing with women, she`s not saying the kinds of things that women who really experienced abuse say.

On the other side, we`re taking your calls. Sandy in Colorado, you`ve been very patient. We`ll get to you on the other side.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Here`s your shoes. Why don`t you go ahead and put those on. Stop right there and just turn around. Put your hands behind your back.



VELEZ-MITCHELL: Time for Pet of the Day. Send your pet pics to Bert -- soccer anyone? Tyler, look at those blue eyes -- stunning. Oh, my gosh. And Sadie, she says I like to party. I`m out on the river having a good time. It`s spring time, why not? Georgie and Jeter say we just like to hang close and to snuggle.



ALEXANDER: You are right, in the bath, it was hot.

ARIAS: Oh, when we took a bath together. You were amazing. You made me -- seriously you made me feel like a goddess.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes, it sounds like a mutual admiration society. And now she is saying it was abuse.

All right. Let`s go to the phone lines. The very patient Sandy, Colorado -- your question or thought -- Sandy.

SANDY, COLORADO (via telephone): Hi Jane. Thanks for taking my call.


SANDY: I just love your show. My son works at a famous vegan restaurant there in Manhattan and has waited on you a few times and he just loves you and your being an advocate for being a vegan and for your animal care that you do it is just amazing. We just love you.


SANDY: My comment is I agree with a lot of your panel tonight about her being abused -- I don`t agree, either. I think she just has no conscience. I sit here and watch all of these videos and pictures of her, all these sex poses and things. She just acts like it is no big deal like it is a normal every day thing. I would be absolutely devastated and embarrassed.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well Sandy, you make a good point. Beth Karas, there has been a lack of affect. You heard Tanya Young-Williams express it and now a caller expressing it. It`s -- there`s something flat about her. You`re in court, do you sense that when you see her live, in person?

KARAS: Yes, indeed. And I suppose there could be two interpretations to it. I`m not a psychologist. I don`t know if they would say this is what a sociopath or a psychopath will do. This is what a liar do or this is what a victim of trauma.

I happen to know from rape cases I prosecuted that there is a rape trauma syndrome. And when the victim has to relive the rape on the stand there is this flat affect. It`s just kind of a protective shell the victim puts around her to get through it and not show emotion.

Now, I don`t know if that is what is happening with Jodi Arias. She was pretty flat through a lot of her testimony, not just when she was trying to recount what she could remember of killing Travis Alexander.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And Shanna, briefly it seemed like friends said she was that way before this horror.

SHANNA HOGAN, AUTHOR, "PICTURE PERFECT": Absolutely. Throughout their relationship they noticed something very creepy about her that she had no emotion in her voice, that she was just always very flat. That she never got mad even when she should get mad. And I think that that is very telling. I think it is very symptomatic of what people would describe as a sociopath.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And it could be symptomatic of somebody whose resentments are building and building and building and they`re putting up with it. I think we can all relate to that in our own lives where we put up with some, we stuff our feelings and then all of a sudden, boom, we explode. Could this have been a rage killing where all of her resentment against being treated by Travis the way she felt humiliated suddenly exploded in violence at him?

More on the other side.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tanya Young Williams, you`ve surveyed thousands of people, what does it tell you about what the jurors may be thinking?

YOUNG-WILLIAMS: Well, the jurors believe, Jane, that yes -- 71 percent believe that Travis Alexander was using Jodi Arias for sex. However, 97 percent believe that this murder was premeditated. 94 percent believe that she is guilty of first degree murder, however only 88 percent feel that she will be found guilty. But more telling than anything -- only 50 percent of the 3,500 responded believe that she will get the death penalty.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, wow, we will see whether those survey results hold true. It`s a fascinating case. We are all over it tomorrow, as well.

Nancy Grace next.