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Woolwich Victim Identified; U.S. President Barack Obama Defends Drone Strikes; Creating Interactive Tattoos

Aired May 23, 2013 - 16:00:00   ET


BECKY ANDERSON, HOST: Well, live from southeast London, I'm Becky Anderson at the scene of Wednesday's horrific murder of a British soldier. As new details emerge about the suspected terror attack, here is what we know right now.

A soldier killed outside the barracks just over my shoulder here to the right of me has been named as Lee Rigby. The 25-year-old father held the rank of drummer.

The two suspects who were both in a stable condition in separate hospitals were both known to the security services.

This is one of them, Michael Adebolajo.

CNN has not been able to identify the second.

In the last few hours, police have made two additional arrests as part of their investigation and have searched a number of residences here in Woolwich.

Well, the British prime minister met with community leaders earlier after holding a second emergency cabinet meeting.


DAVID CAMERON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: This country will be absolutely resolute in its stand against violent extremism and terror. We will never give in to terror or terrorism in any of its forms. Second, this view is shared by every community in our country. This was not just an attack on Britain and on the British way of life, it was also a betrayal of Islam and of the Muslims communities who give so much to our country. There is nothing in Islam that justifies this truly dreadful act.


ANDERSON: Well, we've got teams across the country covering all of the developments. In Manchester, the home of the victim soldier Lee Rigby, Matthew Chance is with us. And with me here in Woolwich in south London, our senior international correspondent Nic Robertson for you throughout the hour this evening. And Nic will speak in just a moment.

First, though, let me get you to Matthew Chance who as I say is in Rochdale, Manchester just outside the home of the slain soldier -- Matthew.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, Becky -- Becky, that's right. Actually in the suburb of Middleton which is a sort of working class area in the suburbs of Rochdale outside of Manchester where the family of Lee Rigby, that drummer from the Royal Fusiliers is the regiment he was in, the second battalion of the Royal Fusiliers, are currently living. They're in a house just a short distance away behind me here along this street. They've asked for the media not to go anywhere near the house at this stage. Obviously they're grieving very deeply for the loss of their son.

They've actually issued in the past hour or so a family statement, jointly, all of them inside, through the Ministry of Defense. It's a written statement. I'm going to read some of it to you here. It says, "all that Lee wanted to do from when he was a little boy was to be in the army," it says. "He wanted to live life and enjoy himself. His family meant everything to him. He was a loving son, husband, father, brother and uncle and a friend to many."

Well, the Ministry of Defense have sort of given some details about the Rigby's career. He joined the army in 2006. He served in Cyprus and in Germany. And interestingly, in 2009 he was deployed for Afghanistan, into Afghanistan, Helmund Province, where he served as an infantryman there in some -- what must have been very hostile conditions there.

And, you know, many of the neighbors who we've spoken to here along this street where he lives, or where his family lived, have expressed their, you know, kind of sense of irony that he should survive such a hostile environment as Helmund Province in southern Afghanistan only to be slain on the streets of his own country. And so there's a lot of -- a lot of anger and other feelings like that here in his hometown, Becky.

ANDERSON: Matthew Chance in the north of England for you this evening. Matthew, thank you for that.

Nic Robertson is with me here. And Nic, as I look over our shoulders, the flowers commemorating in memory of Lee Rigby, or Riggers as he was known to his friends, is there any more information as to why he was targeted at this stage?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We don't have any more information. The police aren't giving it. The army aren't giving it. But what we do now know from the army is that in 2011 he came here as a recruitment officer. And in that position, that would have put him in contact with the public more than perhaps any of the other soldiers that you would find at the barracks here.

So could his attackers have identified him in advance, known that he'd been to Afghanistan, heard him when he'd come off the barracks on recruitment drives? That at the moment is conjecture, but it's certainly a possibility that must be open for the investigators right now.

ANDERSON: And as those investigators start piecing together the events here and what may have motivated these guys, what more do we know at this point?

ROBERTSON: Well, we know the police have now said that the forensic teams completed their work here. It's open to the public again. They've taken away certain evidence at the scene here. They've raided six different premises -- premises in London, houses, three in the south -- three in the south of London, one in the east, one in the north, and another one in Lincoln about 100 miles north of London.

They've also arrested a man and a woman, both aged 29 on the suspicion of conspiracy to murder. We don't have any further details about the two people arrested, but we do believe that they were arrested in this area around here.

So undoubtedly, a few pieces of information, more known for the police slowly becoming available to us, Becky.

ANDERSON: Nic, stay with me throughout the hour as we continue to work this story. A remarkable side story has emerged in the wake of what is this brutal murder. A woman who is also a Cub Scout leader was among the witnesses and took it upon herself to confront one of the suspects. Here's her story as she told it to a morning TV program.


INGRID LOYAU-KENNETT, EYEWITNESS: Well, I saw a man on the road, obivously injured and a car badly crashed. So I assume it was road accident.

When I approached the body, there was a lady cradling him and then the guy, the most excited one of the two, said, "don't go too close to the body." I thought, OK.

Because I was down, I could see (inaudible) there a buthcer's knife and do those ax the butchers have to cut that? Yeah, that's what he had and blood all over him. And I though, what the heck, what happened here?

And I thought, OK, obviously he's a bit excited. And the thing was just to talk to him.


ANDERSON: Just remarkable stuff isn't it?

Still to come tonight, caring and on the lookout for everybody, that is how a friend has told us he would describe one of the suspects. We're going to have more of that interview coming up.

And while the extremism to blame for Wednesday's gruesome attack and how could the killing have been prevented. We speak to the former director of counterterrorism for Britain's MI-6. All that and much more when connect the world continues.


ANDERSON: Well, you're watching CNN. And this a special edition of Connect the World. Live from southeast London, welcome back.

Now details on the suspects of this brutal slaying Wednesday have begun to emerge. Both men were already known to secret services, but they were not, and I repeat, not under surveillance. One of the suspects is named Michael Adebolajo. Now a film believed to show Adebolajo talking to a bystander after the attack has been widely circulated. Before we show it to you, we must warn you that it is disturbing.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I apologize that women had to witness this today, but in our land our women have to see the same. You people will never be safe. Remove your government. They don't care about you.


ANDERSON: Well, it's a chilling watch. And according to a friend of his, it could happen again.

Abu Baraa says he was not surprised when he saw what his friend had done. He told CNN's Dan Rivers that the fault lies with British foreign policy.


ABU BARAA, FRIEND OF MICHAEL ADEBOLAJO: I mean, he's always been very vocal and very concerned about the affairs of Muslims and people being oppressed. And he could never tolerate anybody to really be oppressed and without to do -- to say anything. And I'm sure he felt very frustrated and helpless when he couldn't.

And as person, he was always very caring, very concerned. He's always had a heart for other people and just wanted to help everybody.

DAN RIVERS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What was your reaction when you saw he'd committed out this horrific attack?

BARAA: Well, I mean, the first time I saw it, I didn't recognize him. I wasn't really on the lookout for him. But I wasn't surprised that it happened, to be honest, because I didn't -- knowing what the British government are doing around the world. It's only a matter of time before the wars and the fighting spills over to the streets of Britain. The police said so themselves. MI-5 have been quoted to say that, another attack is inevitable in the UK.

I think as long as the foreign policy is engaging in violence, they're only inviting violence in retaliation.

RIVERS: Do you think this will happen again?

BARAA: Yeah, I think it's, you know, very frightening though, but it definitely could happen again. I mean, what happened yesterday does not require, you know, a lot of organization from abroad, doesn't require big organization to plan something like that, it just takes one person who just had enough of, you know, seeing the violence and atrocities, who has had enough of the British foreign policy and cannot wait for more people to be killed without doing something about it and for them to take it into their own hands.

RIVERS: Would you condemn what he did?

BARAA: I would condemn the cause of this, which is the British foreign policy. At the end of the day, Britain has taken these people, its people to war. And they've taken their soldiers to war. And knowing full well that war is a violent practice and people get killed in war, soldiers are in full knowledge that they can get killed.

So Britain is the one who is responsible, the government, and I believe all of us as a public, we are responsible. We should condemn ourselves. Why we did not do enough to stop these wars going on in Iraq and Afghanistan.

RIVERS: But you wouldn't condemn his actions?

BARAA: I would only condemn the one who is the cause of this, the aggressor, the occupier, which is the British government, the British troops.


ANDERSON: The friend of the suspect, the man I'm sure many of you around the world will now have seen video of with a meat cleaver in his hands after -- in the aftermath of the attack on the British soldier on Wednesday.

Questions remain about the motivations behind the killing. There has been much speculation. It was an extreme Islamic attack, but British Muslims have been quick to denounce it.

With me is Shuja Shafi, who is Deputy Secretary General of the Muslim Council of Britain. And, sir, we are delighted that we are with us this evening. I have to immediately put to you what the friend of this suspect has just said to Dan Rivers and to CNN. He's not surprised it's happened. And he thinks it could happen again. And he blames British foreign policy. Your response.

DR. SHUJA SHAFI, DEPUTY SECRETARY GENERAL, MUSLIM COUNCIL OF BRITAIN: Well, I think at this stage, it's not the foreign policy or whatever that we need to talk about, we need to express our concern, our condolences to the deceased, and express our condolences to the family and where this the time is now for the people to unite, come together, come in peace, communities to come together and there are issues of foreign policy. There are -- this is not the way to express it and be with certainly utterly refute something that -- to be done in (inaudible).

ANDERSON: And that I understand, and I'm sure people will appreciate your words. But it is incredibly important tonight at this time that organizations like yours understand and acknowledge that there are at least fringe elements if not more in communities possibly not just here, but around the country, to have whole cohorts of youngsters who are self- radicalizing. And organizations like yours don't seem to be able to do anything about that.

SHAFI: Well, I think we all have a responsibility in doing something about it. And we take lead from our statutory bodies to see how best we can do it. We are trying our best to make sure that people all follow the rules of Islam and...

ANDERSON: But my worry is that organizations like yours are simply not in touch. There are reports, though unconfirmed this evening -- excuse me, sir -- reports, though unconfirmed this evening, that one of the suspects didn't pray in the mosque here, he prayed with a separate group and that group are radicalized youth.

Do you have any sort of call on these guys at all? Can you reach out to them in any way?

SHAFI: Well, it -- we reach out with communities, with younger -- youth groups and we have a number of youth groups who work together with us and...

ANDERSON: Let me put it another way, how concerned are you?

SHAFI: Very concerned. If there are elements, however small in number, we are concerned and we need to do everything that we can to eliminate them. And we need the help of the authorities as well to be able to do that.

ANDERSON: You can talk the talk, quite frankly, but are you walking the walk at this point? What is being done to prevent the sort of assault, the brutal attack that we saw on the street last night?

SHAFI: Yeah, I think we have to do whatever we can. And we've got to sit down and discuss as to how we can work it. And we need to help -- we need the help of the authorities as well to be able to do that.

ANDERSON: All right. And we appreciate your thoughts this evening. We thank you very much indeed for joining us.

You're watching CNN. We're live from London.

Coming up on Connect the World, global markets suffer a tumble, but Wall Street weathers the storm. We're going to do more stories for you this hour. Find out why that happened in five minutes time.

First, though, after the break, U.S. President Barack Obama defends the use of drones in a major counterterrorism speech. All the details live from Washington.


ANDERSON: You're watching a special edition of Connect the World with me, Becky Anderson live from southeast London at the scene of yesterday's horrific attack on a British soldier. We're going to have much more on this ongoing terror investigation as we move through the hour.

First, though, some of the other stories that we are following for you this hour here on CNN.

And U.S. President Barack Obama has defended the use of drones in a major counterterrorism speech. He said he recognized their use was controversial but said they were needed in, and I quote, a just war against militants and that America was a safer place thanks to their use.


BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: To say a military tactic is legal or even effective is not to say it is wise or moral in every instance. For the same progress that gives us the technology to strike half a world away also demands the discipline to constrain that power or risk abusing it. And that's why over the last four years, my administration has worked vigorously to establish a framework that governs our use of force against terrorists, insisting upon clear guidelines, oversight and accountability that is now codified in presidential policy guidance that I signed yesterday.


ANDERSON: All right, Obama addressed efforts to close Guantanamo Bay. He was heckled by a protester shouting about the current hunger strike at the prison.


OBAMA: Once again...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There are 102 people on a hunger strike, these desperate people...

OBAMA: I'm about to address it ma'am. You've got to let me speak. I'm about to address it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You are the commander in chief...


ANDERSON: Well, our Pentagon correspondent Chris Lawrence joins me now.

Chris, what did the president have to say about Guantanamo?

CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, after he made it through that interruption, Becky, he basically pushed ahead with his agenda, which was saying he's going to take another look at trying to close Guantanamo Bay saying that he will lift the moratorium on transferring some of those detainees who have been cleared for transfer. He's going to lift the moratorium on transferring them back to Yemen. That had been in place for several years now. Even those detainees who have been cleared for transfer back to Yemen, the feeling was that the situation in their home country was not secure enough to warrant that. Now the president announcing that he is going to lift that moratorium.

He's also going to appoint a sort of a special envoy to specifically deal with looking at the detainees cases and seeing which ones may be eligible for transfer first and to work on the problem of actually trying to close GITMO, because that entails coming up with a solution, an alternative, and that's been the big hangup and that's been the criticism from some of the Republicans on Capitol Hill that while the president has been long on rhetoric, he's been very short on specifics in coming up with some sort of credible alternative.

ANDERSON: All right.

Chris, thank you for that.

It's been a tough day on the market with shares falling globally in reaction to a surprise slowdown in Chinese manufacturing, and concern that the U.S. Federal Reserve might scale back its stimulus package.

Well, the Dow Jones did manage to weather the storm, just down fractionally at the close. But it was a completely different picture in Europe. London's FTSE closing down over 2 percent. It was a similar picture in Frankfurt, while the Japanese stock market in its Thursday session tumbled over 7 percent in what was a dramatic day's trading in Asia.

CNN's Alison Kosik joins me now from the New York Stock Exchange, which of course is closed. Awaiting the opening of these Asian markets, one assumes they may bounce back a little given what happened on the Dow. But a bloody day across the board.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Oh, it was an interesting session, Becky, because initially we did see the U.S. market react to the global markets. We saw the Dow at the opening bell fall a little over 100 points, but then investors took a breath. They realized that Fed chief Ben Bernanke didn't say anything in that congressional testimony that we didn't already know, that he's still fully committed to that stimulus program, that he can add or subtract from it, so that realization of that selling being overdone, that's what investors thought of that allowed them to maybe take some money off the table and then limit those losses today.

One trader told me, at this point Bernanke didn't change his mind about quantitative easing, that it is going to end, but it's not going to end any time soon.

It has already been quite an amazing year. And many believe you can credit that quantitative easing for that.

You look at the S&P 500, it's up 16 percent so far this year. We generally consider 8 percent -- an 8 percent gain a good year. But is this the start of a longer term pullback? That's what some analysts are wondering.

But then others are more bullish. Goldman Sachs sees the S&P rising yet another 4 percent this year. And no doubt, Becky, much of that is really going to depend on what the Fed does -- Becky.

ANDERSON: All right, thank you for that.

Well, the latest world news headlines are just ahead as you would expect here on CNN.

Plus, as London police investigate Wednesday's brutal killing, the question remains how do you stop further attacks? We're going to get some expert analysis coming up next. This is CNN live from southeast London. I'm Becky Anderson, stay with us.


ANDERSON: This is Connect the World. The top stories this hour. The British defense ministry has identified the soldier killed in Wednesday's attack outside a barracks in southeastern London. His name was Lee Rigby and he held the rank of drummer. In a statement, his family said Rigby had wanted to join the army since he was a boy.

Wall Street weathers the storm as global markets tumble in reaction to a surprise drop in Chinese manufacturing. Concerns that the U.S. Federal Reserve might scale back its stimulus package also lead to sharp losses in Asia and Europe.

U.S. President Barack Obama has defended the use of drones in a just war, as he called it, for in self defense against deadly militants. He also said he remains committed to closing the U.S. prison at Guantanamo Bay in a major counterterrorism speech.

And six more people have been killed in Tripoli in Lebanon during clashes between supporters and opponents of the Syrian president Bashar al-Assad. But the city is said now to be calm following days of fighting that have left 16 dead and at least 156 injured.

Recovery efforts in the tornado-hit city of Moore are being hampered by bad weather. Flash floods and storm warnings have been issued for the area in the state of Oklahoma three days after a massive twister left 24 people dead and 377 injured.

Well, going back to our top story for you this hour and recapping what we know, the two men suspected of the murder of a British soldier remain in separate hospitals under police guard in south London. Police say their conditions are stable. One of them can be named as Michael Adebolajo. CNN has not been able to identify the second.

Two additional arrests have been made Thursday, a man and a woman, both 29, were arrested on suspicion of conspiracy to murder.

Police also say they've searched six residential addresses in connection with the attack.

U.S. President Barack Obama condemned the attack saying the United States stood resolute with Great Britain against violent extremism.

Well, meanwhile, tributes have been left at the scene of the murder. It comes amid increased security and fears of additional attacks.

So, how can we prevent attacks, all of us, around the world like this from happening in the future? Joining me now from New York is Richard Barrett, former director of counterterrorism for the British secret intelligence service MI-6.

And with me still this evening here in London is Shuja Shafi, who is the deputy secretary general for the Muslim Council of Great Britain.

I'll come to you, sir, in a moment.

Firstly, Richard, we thank you for joining us this evening. And, earlier - - I just want you to hear what former Home Secretary Jack Straw said to me; he was foreign secretary, of course, in 2005, when a series of suicide bomb blasts across London killed 52 people.

It's understood that the two suspects in this attack were known to Britain's domestic security service. Here was his reaction earlier to that development. And I want to get yours after this.


JACK STRAW, FORMER BRITISH FOREIGN SECRETARY: They would have featured in intelligence as associates of other people. And the intelligence agencies were targeting for, say, surveillance. Surveillance is really expensive. It ties up a lot of manpower, or indeed, equipment as well. Neither can be used without proper authorization.

So what it -- what this tells me is that these particular individuals, in the intelligence that was available to the agencies, did not, at the time, present an immediate and present danger. Otherwise, of course, the agencies would have intervened.


ANDERSON: Richard, does what Jack Straw have to say about the fact that intelligence service had these guys on their radar make sense to you?

RICHARD BARRETT, FORMER HEAD OF COUNTERTERRORISM FOR MI-6: Yes, it does. And I' m afraid that this will happen again, that people who are on the radar actually manage to commit an attack, a terrible attack like this, before they're stopped.

And that is just the nature of the intelligence security world and, indeed, the nature of our society, because clearly, as Jack Straw mentioned, there's a limit to resources. But also there's this whole question of legitimacy, of legality, if you like, and of values. And we live in a society where people are perfectly able to make violent protests or radical protests, you know, verbally.

But of course we limit the opportunity to do so physically, you know, by killing people like this. But where people are determined to do that, there's very little that can stop them unless they already have some sort of track record.

ANDERSON: Stay with me for a moment, Richard; I've got Shuja Shafi with me.

And Richard saying, quite frankly, he thinks this could happen again, that these guys were on the radar of intelligence services but physically sort of resources don't allow for everybody to be under surveillance at any one time, nor indeed the laws of Britain.

How much do organizations like yours know about these fringe self- radicalized young men, generally?

SHUJA SHAFI, DEPUTY SECRETARY GENERAL, MUSLIM COUNCIL OF BRITAIN: Well, if we did know, we would certainly take them to task and report primarily to the authorities, because that is really what the duty is. That's what we should be doing as citizens of the country.

We do not know and where there are tendencies, there will be -- people will report them. And I think looking back, we need to perhaps reflect back and look at and see what more we can do to stop these or reduce this and that may be how we educate them right from the beginning as children. And there are ways that we can think about and (inaudible) discussion to be had.

ANDERSON: Richard, my guest here this evening, who is, quite frankly, from a different generation, and so I hope you don't mind me saying that, from a different generation, saying that if they'd known about these guys, that they were on the community's radar, they would have reported them to authorities.

But it's interesting; I've been speaking to people here today, who have seen -- or they at least allege to have seen and heard these two suspects, or at least one of them, on the streets of Woolwich, berating British foreign policy and really whipping up a storm.

Do you think it's fair to say that ultimately there's a lot more known, perhaps about youth like this in communities than authorities are actually finding out about?

BARRETT: Yes. I think communities are the first line of defense in many ways. We can't leave it just up to the police and security agencies. We don't have that sort of state. And communities know who lives among them. And these people must have had other friends and contacts apart from their little tight group that share their views.

But the problem is that people who make protests, loud protests, aren't necessarily the people who commit atrocious acts like this. In this case, yes; but in many cases the people, the empty vessels that make most noise, as it were, not necessarily the ones that are the real problem.

So it's not necessarily an excellent indicator.

ANDERSON: Richard, this isn't, of course, the first time that soldiers have been targeted on their home soil and a foiled plot that bears striking similarities to Wednesday's attack, the ringleader of an Islamist group in the U.K. planned to kidnap and behead a British Muslim soldier during the trial of Pervez Khan (ph). A court heard he intended to behead the soldier, he said, "like a pig."

Now French Algerian Mohammad Merah went on a killing spree that terrorized the French city of Toulouse back in March 2012. Merah killed seven people, including three soldiers and three kids. The 23-year old told negotiators he was acting on behalf of Al Qaeda.

And in 2009, American Muslim soldier, let's remind ourselves, Nidal Hasan, shot and killed 13 soldiers at Ft. Hood military base in Texas before the attack, the Army psychiatrist had communicated with a militant cleric via the Internet.

Richard, you said at the beginning of this interview that -- perhaps not surprise, but that you thought this could happen again. And how concerned are you?

BARRETT: Well, it will happen again and, unfortunately, and it may not be somebody like Nidal Hasan or Mohammad Merah or these two jokers or Pervez Khan (ph). I mean, it may be somebody again like Anders Behring Breivik. You remember the guy in Norway, who committed an atrocious cold-blooded murder of young people after bombing some government offices.

So these people are going to crop up. And, clearly, the security agencies and the police are doing whatever they can to prevent them. But if you say that you're going to protect society 100 percent, then you're setting yourself up for failure, I'm afraid. It's not possible.

ANDERSON: (Inaudible).

OK, Richard, thank you for the time being, for your views this evening.

Let me just finish off with you, sir, Richard saying that this will happen again.

SHAFI: Well, it could. And what we have to do is to learn the lessons, what are the things that we learn from this, and actually make sure that it works and it's a cooperation between communities and the authorities and that's how we have to work together and make sure that we can minimize to an absolute level, but yes.

ANDERSON: Are you shocked when I said here, standing here tonight, there are reports, unconfirmed reports at least, but I've heard this from more than one person on the streets of Woolwich today, that these guys were out and about in the community.

They were angry and they'd been not talking up an attack, but certainly one person I spoke to said he wasn't surprised that this had happened, knowing Michael Adebolajo as he did.

I ask you again, you know, I'm afraid that you're from a different generation. We're talking about the youngsters in some of these communities, by no stretch of the imagination am I suggesting that it is the majority of youngsters.

But there are small pockets, I think we'd agree, of young newly self- radicalized men. I put it to you again: what can you do about that? Or what can we all do about it? Perhaps that's what I should be asking tonight.

SHAFI: Yes. I think we should be all be on the vigil lookout for these tendencies and do -- and we need to learn how to actually identify them; from our point of view, from our perspective, I think we need to reflect whether the way we teach about Islam is the appropriate way.

And how do we actually get across the values of Islam and Islamic (inaudible) virtues to these radicals? Maybe we should look at how our schools teach these youngsters, not just the Arabic version, but a lot more in terms of giving the values about Islam and the religion. And so we, in a way, we need to teach them properly, perhaps, more of Islam --


SHAFI: -- (inaudible) values are so important. And I think we need to reflect and see whether we are conveying (inaudible).

ANDERSON: Get it right.

Thank you, sir. Thank you for your thoughts tonight.

David Cameron, the British prime minister, said today that this was an attack on all of Britain and a betrayal of Islam -- the words of the British prime minister in response to what was a brutal attack on a serving British soldier here on what was a quiet street in southeast London yesterday afternoon.

You're watching CONNECT THE WORLD live from London.

Coming up next, we're going to step back from this story for just a moment, a story for you, a new paint that's proving a truly electrifying experience. We visit London's Royal College of Art as part of what is our "Blueprint" series

UEFA has approved new anti-racism measures. Find out what the organization's president, Michel Platini, had to say about them.

And just before the top of the hour, of course, we will come back to this story, this story of the hour and of the day as we reflect on what we've heard and seen here in south London today.




ANDERSON: Well, every fortnight, as part of CNN's "Blueprint" series, a fairly new series here on CNN, we take a look at ingenious products developed at one of the world's top design schools for you.

Well, today, we check out a new paint created at the Royal College of Art in London, called -- let me get this right -- Bare Conductive, which is producing truly electrifying results.



MATT JOHNSON, INVENTOR: We met while studying at the Royal College of Art in London. We were doing a program that mixed up designers, artists and engineers, and we came out with this project.


ISABEL LIZARDI, INVENTOR: We were exploring this idea of putting electronics on the body. We were like, "What if you could paint a circuit? What if you can draw a tattoo that's interactive?"

JOHNSON: If I was to sum up the paint in two words, I would probably say electronics reinvented.

LIZARDI: It's a unique material in the sense that it's not toxic and it's been developed for consumer use.

JOHNSON: Our paint could be used to turn unexpected surfaces into interfaces. We've got a light switch painted here. And when I touch the pad of paint, it turns on a light.

LIZARDI: It's a really safe material that basically brings conductive paint away from industry and into the hands of individual users and children and adults who want to really interact with technology.

JOHNSON: We've painted the poster with the material and we've got a big of hardware there. And when I touch it, you can hear that it makes a sound. The idea that a piece of paper can actually be a vehicle for much more information that's actually -- than is actually printed on it. We see that as a huge field for us.

The design critique is such a crucial part of what we do. So to meet somebody like Dick Powell, who's worked for Virgin Atlantic, (Inaudible), Casio, is really exciting for us, because we know that he's going to bring insight that is totally unrivaled.

DICK POWELL, DESIGN DIRECTOR, SEYMOURPOWELL: It's really important, I think, to understand what we mean when we talk about design, on the one hand, and innovation on the other, because design is about the creative act, about making things, creating things.

Innovation is about taking new ideas to market.

Most designers have brilliant ideas but don't think about how they're going to get that in front of potential buyers.

The main opportunity for you as a business is within education. So this is an absolute no-brainer for education for me. The real challenge is breaking through the barrier of distribution. How do you get in front of all those (inaudible)?

JOHNSON: Well, last week I presented a product to somebody, and they accused it of being a gimmick.

POWELL: It's a factor: a lot of the best ideas are simply not understood by people. They have no ability to envision the future. You do.

LIZARDI: I'm curious to know basically, obviously, we all come from a design background and we like making and playing. So how do you balance that with the business side of actually running a business?

POWELL: Well, it's very clever of you to put your finger on the key points, you know, because clearly you've been to a wonderful place at the Royal College of Art, and you come out, and you're a designer and you're creative. That's what you want to do. And after some time, you generally have to decide I'm going to be a business person more than I am a creative designer, because it occupies all of your time.

LIZARDI: It's been an amazing process because firstly, we're working in somebody's house in the kitchen, mixing and testing the product. And now we have, I think, six products on sale. So it's really things have gone from like a student project to a business that's fully functional.

Radio Shack is one of the biggest electronic retailers in the U.S. And our pens are now in every single one of them.

POWELL: I think the product is magical. And it's a real (inaudible) entrancing idea. And I think it's got commercial potential.

JOHNSON: (Inaudible) today was trust your instincts. If we keep doing that, we've got a really exciting future ahead of us.



ANDERSON: Let's get you some sports news this hour, shall we? In the longstanding issue of racism in football has prompted Europe's governing body to approve new measures. But are they enough, is the question. Let's cross over to Don Riddell, who's at CNN Center. Once again, the issue raising its head, what's being said? And is it enough?

DON RIDDELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, I guess we'll soon find out. I think the important thing is that Europe's governing body, UEFA, has at least drawn up proposals of how they're going to deal with it.

And for the last couple of years, football's governing bodies really have been grappling what to do with racist behavior, not just by the fans and the territories (ph) in the stands at football stadiums all over the world, but on the pitch itself.

UEFA has now come up with this proposal, what they're proposing is that any player or official found guilty of racism will receive a suspension of at least 10 games. And here's what they're proposing for fans who misbehave in the territories (ph). They're going to stick the club with a partial stadium closure for a first offense and on a second offense, a full stadium closure.

Now in the past, Becky, you and I know that the fines that have been given out to these clubs really have amounted to little more than a slap on the wrist, a fine of 70,000 or 80,000 euros. But a stadium closure for a big team is a really, really big punishment because you think that could potentially cost them millions of dollars.

Today the UEFA president Michel Platini, he spoke exclusively to CNN's Pedro Pinto about these proposals and what he hopes it will achieve.


PEDRO PINTO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: If there is racist abuse in the stands and the referee gives two warnings, at the third time, he can stop the game. MICHEL PLATINI, PRESIDENT, UEFA: Yes, of course.

PINTO: The game is abandoned?

PLATINI: The game is -- he has to abandon the game.

PINTO: He has to abandon the game?

PLATINI: I encourage him to do that.

PINTO: So let's say a game is abandoned; the penalty first would be to close that stand.


The next stage would be to close (inaudible).


PLATINI: That's the decisions that we propose to the national association.

PINTO: If it happens a second time, the whole stadium is closed and they play behind closed doors.

Plus a 50,000 euro fine.


PINTO: Is that fine enough?

PLATINI: We will see.


RIDDELL: That was just a snippet from a big interview with the UEFA president, Michel Platini, Becky. You can see much more from that interview airing on CNN, this network, right throughout Friday. And then, of course, there's also a part of a buildup to the Champions League final this weekend between Bayern Munich and Borussia Dortmund.

ANDERSON: It's interesting, isn't it, Don?

Just as a postscript, as I remember in the 1980s, as a fan when the British clubs or the English clubs are thrown out of the -- of what was then the European League, as a result of hooliganism, and I just wonder whether that isn't the best and biggest punishment, not just stadium closures, but actually kicking teams eventually out of the -- out of the competition.

But let's see; it remains to be seen, doesn't it, really. It's been a turbulent week so far as the golfing world is concerned.

RIDDELL: Yes, there's been this long-running spat between Sergio Garcia and Tiger Woods. And it all got completely out of hand on Tuesday when Sergio Garcia, the Spanish golfer, quipped that he would have Tiger Woods over to dinner, where he would serve him fried chicken.

Fried chicken is a really negative stereotype when mentioned together with African-Americans. That was bad enough for the golfing community. Garcia apologized; Tiger Woods said that he was hurt and offended. That was bad enough.

But then whilst trying to further defuse this whole thing, the head of the European tour, George O'Grady, on Thursday, in a live interview that was broadcast, referred -- well, he used the word "colored." So he said, "We accept all races on the European Tour; we take it very strongly. Most of Sergio's friends happen to be colored athletes in the United States."

Now, Becky, you know that that is a really antiquated and offensive way of referring to people of African descent. So it -- you know, he was trying to improve things and he's actually just made things worse.

ANDERSON: Yes. All right. Tom Riddell for you with some of the sports news this evening.

We're going to take a very short break, back with the story of the day from here in southeast London after this.




ANDERSON: I'm Becky Anderson live from southeast London for you. Let's recap what we know on the slaying of the -- the brutal slaying of the British soldier, which happened just behind me here on Wednesday afternoon, the soldier killed outside Woolwich barracks has been named as Lee Rigby. The 25-year-old father held the rank of drummer.

The two men suspected of the murder remain in separate hospitals in south London. Police say their conditions are stable. One of them can now be named as Michael Adebolajo. CNN has not been able to identify the second. Two additional arrests have been made today and police say they've searched six residential addresses in connection with the attack.

Now some footage that we've just got into CNN is something I would just want to show you now. This is footage from 2007. And it's of a man identified by friends and the British media as Michael Adebolajo, one of the attack suspects.

This was shot in April 2007, and shows him standing behind prominent British Muslim radical leader Anjem Choudary. The event in the video was a Muslim rally in London protecting the arrests of men for allegedly making inflammatory speeches at a mosque.

All right. Well, behind me is a memorial, a growing memorial to Lee Rigby, flowers throughout the day have been laid by people from the community here. He was killed just yards from his army barracks, where he was described as an extremely popular young soldier, 25 years old, remember. Earlier in the day, I took a look at the tributes that have been pouring in.


ANDERSON: His name was Lee Rigby, "Riggers" to his mates. He was 25 years old when he was butchered here in Woolwich in southeast London. These flowers have been left by local residents in memory of that brave British soldier. And just some of the messages here, (inaudible), "I'm so sorry; you didn't deserve this. You are our hero, love, Lynn (ph)."

Another one here, "Rest in peace to our brave soldier. You'll never be forgotten."

And as you walk along, similar messages from so many of the local residents here, "Rest in peace, brave soldier. You will go down in our history. Our thoughts go with you and your family, Sara (ph) and Denise (ph)."

And Cat's (ph) just leaving some flowers as well here.

And, Cat (ph), you're a local resident.

CAT (PH): Yes, I live in (inaudible). I'm (inaudible) I used to live right there. (Inaudible) have happened and it's just -- I just had to come and just pay some respects and do something after we found out his name and about his family and stuff today. So, yes.

ANDERSON: Thank you for that.

Let me carry on. I'll go through perhaps one of the.

. one of the sweetest that's been left today.

"So sorry from a resident of Woolwich. Rest in peace, brother," the writing obviously from two youngsters. And I've seen a lot of very young kids out here today, some of their parents, some of their grandparents and just a real sense of shock still in this community. Just simply can't believe this happened.

It was just a couple of hours ago.

Nic, as we reflect on the past 72 -- 48 hours, sorry; not even that, 24 hours at this point. Your thoughts?

ROBERTSON: Well, look, there have been six premises investigated by the police today, items taken away. At least two of them we know are places that Michael Adebolajo stayed at, relatives' houses. So what has been -- what have the police been able to find there?

Is this going to give them further information, further evidence, again, the critical things, what was on the computer? Who was he communicating with? These two other people arrested, what information can they give to the police? This is going to give key information whether or not there are others out there who might be planning other attacks. That will be a major concern.

And then trying to find out was Lee Rigby targeted because he was known to these men, because he was a recruitment officer here at the barracks? So I think these are going to be critical things.

But also as we've seen here tonight, young men, turning up; they're angry about the situation. This is important for the government, keep a handle right now on community tension. This has drawn a lot of passion, a lot of anger here (inaudible).

ANDERSON: Two arrests today and two men who are under armed guard as we speak at two local hospitals here in south London.

This investigation continues into the brutal slaying of a young British soldier, who had served in Afghanistan, but he was here in the U.K., as a recruitment officer just going about his job. I'm Becky Anderson, live from southeast London; from the scene here it is a very good evening.