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ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT

Southwest Crash Landed Nose Wheel First; Zimmerman 'Got Away With Murder'; 80 Killed In Train Crash; Weiner Still in the Race

Aired July 25, 2013 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next, breaking news. Federal investigators make a startling revelation about Monday's Southwest Airlines crash. Why they think it wasn't mechanical error. But the only minority on the George Zimmerman jury said Zimmerman got away with murder. A lawyer representing Trayvon Martin's family responds to that OUTFRONT tonight.

And the latest from the Anthony Weiner texting scandal, the candidate reveals there were more women he estimates how many of them there were and we hear from one of them for the first time. Let's go OUTFRONT.

Good evening, everyone. We begin tonight with breaking news on that Southwest Airlines Flight 345 crash landing at New York's LaGuardia Airport on Monday. Right now, federal investigators are saying the plane landed nose wheel first. This is the first real clue we've gotten as to why the plane's landing gear collapsed because obviously as you know, planes usually land on the back, not the front.

Let's get to aviation correspondent, Rene Marsh. Rene, the investigation is still going on, but does this open the door to pilot error?

RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: You know, we spoke, Erin, to a few pilots when we just got this information a short time ago. The pilots we spoke to say it is really too early to know for sure why the plane landed this way, but they say it does suggest human error could have played a role. Here's what we do know. This plane landed nose gear first then the main gear, but in a successful landing. It is supposed to be maybe gear and then the nose gear.

That's because the nose gear is not built to withstand the weight of the plane. Again, main gear, then nose gear. That's the basics of landing a plane, Erin. So they're going to be looking into why did this happen? Why did this sequence of events happen the way they did?

BURNETT: What else did we learn from this investigation? I mean, obviously that is a crucial clue, but what else did you find out, Rene?

MARSH: Well, we also found out that in the final 4 seconds of the flight, the plane essentially, the nose of the plane went from 2 degrees upward to 3 degrees downward. That should not have happen. It should have maintained a nose up position. So again, why did that happen? Why did the position of the nose of the plane switch from 2 degrees up to 3 degrees down? That remains a mystery, but again it is not supposed to happen that way -- Erin.

BURNETT: Absolutely now. All right, Rene Marsh, thank you very much. A big obviously development there in that investigation and one that makes everyone flying thinks twice.

Other top story is George Zimmerman, quote, "Got away with murder." At least that's what Juror B29 said she believes. Despite the fact, and I want to emphasize this, she did vote to acquit Zimmerman in the shooting death of Trayvon Martin. The only minority juror on the all-female panel is speaking out for the first time. Here's what she's just told ABC News.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

"MADDY," ZIMMERMAN JUROR B29: George Zimmerman -- George Zimmerman got away with murder, but you can't get away from God. At the end of the day, he's going to have a lot of questions and answers he has to deal with. The law couldn't prove it, but you know, you know the world goes in circles.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: How does the Martin family feel about this? Did George Zimmerman's team worry that this one juror could put their client away? Natalie Jackson is an attorney for Trayvon Martin's family and Robert Hirschhorn was the jury consultant for George Zimmerman's defense team.

All right, it's great to see both of you again on the show. And Natalie, let me start with you. She said she owes the Martin family an apology. I want to play that clip and get your response to what she said to ABC.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

"MADDY": It is hard for me to sleep. It's hard for me to eat because I feel that I was forcefully included in Trayvon Martin's death. And I carry him on my back. I'm hurting as much as Trayvon Martin's mom is because there's no way that any mother should feel that pain.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: What's your reaction, Natalie?

NATALIE JACKSON, TRAYVON MARTIN FAMILY ATTORNEY: Well, my reaction is that I feel for her. I do and I know that she issued an apology to Sybrina Fulton and I think that's between her and Sybrina to talk about, really. I have not spoken to Sybrina about that, but you know, it's her decision and she has to live with that.

BURNETT: Barbara, let me tell you what we know that this juror. Obviously, I want to emphasize, she did choose to show her face, but obviously she is going by quote/unquote, "Maddy," not giving her full name because she is worried about possible retribution. We know that she is 36 years old. She describes herself as Puerto Rican. She has only been in Florida five months. She had lived previously in Chicago, married for 10 years. She has eight children. She is a certified nursing assistant and she was arrested at one point in Chicago, but the case was disposed. You have that data then you saw her. Was this someone you wanted on the jury or did you have reservations?

ROBERT HIRSCHHORN, GEORGE ZIMMERMAN DEFENSE JURY CONSULTANT: Yes, no reservations. Good evening, Erin. Great to see you again. So B29 was one of our younger jurors. She had eight children. She could have gotten out of jury duty if she had told the judge. Judge, I can't do it with all my kids, but she did the right thing, Erin. She chose her duty to her country, to serve as a juror and made the personal sacrifice. What I liked about her, I went back over my notes. One of the things she said in jury selection was everybody needs a fair trial. At the end of the day, I have to listen to both sides. That's all you can ask for from jurors and that's what she did. We should all be very proud of her.

BURNETT: And she did. And Natalie, you know, she also told ABC that she didn't think Zimmerman was guilty according to the law. You know, the point she made there when she talked about the remorse and sadness she felt he was guilty. She was talking about God, but in the eyes of the law, she did not come to that conclusion and here what she said happened.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

"MADDY": He's guilty because the evidence shows he's guilty.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's guilty of --

"MADDY": Killing Trayvon Martin, but as the law was read to me, if you have no proof that he killed him intentionally, you can't find, you cannot say he's guilty.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: And she stood by the decision of the jury, Natalie. And then when she was asked by Robin Roberts there whether the case should have gone to trial, she answered, quote, "I don't think so." Natalie, from your position, do you wish the jury, the prosecution had gone for a lesser charge to begin with? That they stretched too far? They should have gone for manslaughter.

JACKSON: Listen to what she said. She said that the evidence was there to prove that he's guilty. She believed that he was guilty. The jury instructions said that you can use your common sense. I think she was confused. That's what I hear from her.

BURNETT: So you think she was confused as to what the law said.

JACKSON: It sounds that way from what I hear. I have only have heard that portion that you played for me. From what you played, when she says the evidence prove that he was guilty. That pretty much seems that she is confused that what the law says.

BURNETT: Right. I mean, it is unclear. She said he is guilty of killing Trayvon Martin, which of course, she doesn't dispute. But she is saying there was no proof that he killed him intentionally. Obviously, Robert, that could be the nuance here. To Natalie's point, it is unclear exactly what she was saying.

HIRSCHHORN: Yes, the idea is this woman has a heart the size of Texas and the patience of job. She really did her good job because what she said, Erin is, I had to put my heart and my emotions aside. That's what all jurors have to do and decide this case on the evidence and the law. That's what she did. It was a very hard decision. You can see that this woman has a world of empathy for the Martin family, but the evidence wasn't there and that's what she based her decision on.

JACKSON: She said the evidence was there though. That's what I don't understand.

BURNETT: She said for killing him but she said not for intentionally.

HIRSCHHORN: For killing, not for murder. That was undisputed.

JACKSON: Well, murder two is not intentional. The jury instructions says so, so that's why I believe she is confused.

BURNETT: Well, Natalie, let me ask you. She was the only minority on this panel, right? That surprised a lot of people. That there was only one minority and it was Maddy. She told ABC News actually something that completely fits with what the juror who actually seem to think George Zimmerman was innocent from the beginning, which was the case wasn't about race. She said to Robin this case was never about race to her. Are you surprised about that?

JACKSON: No. I'm not surprised about that. I think the prosecution and defense, everyone told them that it was not about race, but just because you say that it is not about race does not make it true.

BURNETT: All right, thanks very much --

HIRSCHHORN: But the juror -- and now we have two jurors that reached that same conclusion. The case was not about race.

JACKSON: It was about race. The jurors got picked because of race, Robert. I mean, a lot of people got excluded because of race. Being jurors because they sat --

HIRSCHHORN: Not by us. Not by the defense.

BURNETT: You're saying you did not exclude anyone.

HIRSCHHORN: The idea is we wanted jury pores could hear all the evidence -- JACKSON: Robert, there was a questionnaire. It asked people whether or not they participated in the protests to get George arrested. That excluded a lot of black people.

HIRSCHHORN: Absolutely not true. That was not on the questionnaire.

JACKSON: Absolutely true. There were questions absolutely true.

HIRSCHHORN: I've got the questionnaire right in front of me. Here's the questionnaire. It is right here.

JACKSON: Robert, were there questions asked -- were there questions asked about whether or not people participated in the protests?

HIRSCHHORN: Of course, there were questions asked about the protests, what you heard about the case, what opinions you've drawn. Absolutely, that has nothing to do with race.

JACKSON: Many black people were excluded because of that, Robert.

HIRSCHHORN: That's not true.

JACKSON: If we're going to discuss, let's -- OK, Robert.

BURNETT: All right, I'll merely hit pause there, but I thank both of you for taking the time and that conversation that I think a lot of people at home are having, too.

Still to come, we want to share the latest with you on the horrific train derailment in Spain. Eighty people are dead at least. There are significant clues tonight as to what might have caused the crash.

Plus new details in the Anthony Weiner texting scandal, he is finally admitting how many women he estimates that there were, estimates, and we hear from one of them for the first time.

And then Facebook's huge day, what has brought the social network back from the so-called dead.

And more than a million people gathered to hear the pope speak in Brazil. There were nuns on the run.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: Our second story, OUTFRONT, rising death toll, an American among the 80 killed in a horrific train crash in North Western Spain last night. Now last night we told you about this, but now look at this. A security camera caught the exact moment of the crash. You can see the cars separating from the engine as the train attempts to negotiate this curve. You actually see the car in the back come off and that pulls the entire conductor train off. Flame burst out of one car as it left the tracks. Another was snapped in half. That's why after this you saw this horrific pictures of bodies scattered around the ground.

Karl Penhaul is OUTFRONT at the scene of the crash tonight in Spain for us. Karl, what's the latest on the investigation? I'm also curious, what do we know about the train's speed at the time of the crash and how much faster that was than the speed limit?

KARL PENHAUL, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, certainly, there have been suspicions and those were first raised by Spain's development minister this morning. She suggested that excessive speed may have been a factor in this accident, but then we heard from the Spanish prime minister. He came and visited the crash site in the course of the day and he said no, we must keep an open mind on this.

He said speed may be a factor, but also there may be many other factors as well. So he said all the possibilities were currently being investigated. He urged people not to leap to conclusions. We also know that the engine driver has spent much of the day in police custody. He also is being questioned about what he did, what he saw and what he knew about this crash. But so far, authorities haven't said what he's been talking about so still very much an open book -- Erin.

BURNETT: All right, Karl Penhaul, thank you very much. He is live there as we said all along the tracks. David is OUTFRONT now. He is the former deputy chief of field operations for the major commuter rail service here in New York City, which is one of the busiest in the United States. I really appreciate you taking time.

Now the speed limit for the trains on this -- this particular corner that we are showing people, it is about 50 miles an hour. According to reports, we are waiting for the numbers. The train was going more than 100 miles an hour. Obviously more than double the speed limit. Let's look at this video. As it rounds the corner, you see a flash and some smoke first. What is that?

DAVID SCHANOES, FORMER DEPUTY CHIEF OF FIELD OPERATIONS, METRO- NORTH RAILROAD: Well, the first thing to notice about the video is you look at the power car is able -- the lead car was able to negotiate the curve until it gets pulled off. That's because it is heavier weight. The following cars are much lighter, the passenger cars and they're the ones that fly off the rail. I think the spark you're seeing is because this is a double track with overhead electric power, is the top one of the cars is engaging the electrical lines. That's what I think the flash is.

BURNETT: The flash that we're zooming in. After that flash, he is saying where the cars might have engaged one of the electrical lines you start to see the cars flying off the tracks. What happened at that moment when it loses control?

SCHANOES: Well, what has happened is that the initial point of derailment, the wheels first lift off, the linear speed of the train pushes it to the outside and all the cars follow and the lead car right off the track. It is a pretty horrifying picture. When you look at some of the still shots, what you find surprising about this is how little track damage there is, which means the derailment was sudden, complete, and straight off the track.

BURNETT: Just flipped it off.

SCHANOES: As if the cars had been tipped over.

BURNETT: So is there an explanation? Just to go through speed with me for one more moment, how the driver approaching this, these are really sophisticated trains. My understanding is they're supposed to tell you when you're going too fast and force you to not do that. How could this have happened to go double the speed limit?

SCHANOES: It depends on what the -- what we call the train control system in use was at the time. There are more advanced train control systems that automatically enforce speed restrictions on trains including around a curve, and there are less sophisticated train control systems that don't automatic will he enforce the proper speed. I'm not clear which signal control system was in useful whether they were using the automatic system or this was one where it basically depends on an employee compliance with the rules.

BURNETT: But the bottom line is speeds, we don't know. That fits to you.

SCHANOES: Right. The prime minister said this correctly, you don't jump to conclusions. You don't make any conclusions. You work from a process of elimination. Clearly this speed has a very important part to play in this derailment.

BURNETT: A 118 versus a 50-mile-an-hour speed limit. It certainly seem that way. Thank you very much for making sense of that video has been impossible not to watch today.

Still to come, a prominent doctor was found dead today and police say she was murdered. Her husband now has been arrested tonight.

Mark Zuckerberg's net worth rose $3 billion in a day, yes, $3 billion in a day. We'll tell you why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: Our third story, OUTFRONT, investors like Facebook. Today, the world's number one social network posted its biggest single day percentage gain since going public. It was up nearly 30 percent to close at $34 a share. Now what drove this rally was a huge jump in revenue from advertising on the web, which was something everybody said Facebook can't do because everybody has absolutely hated this company ever since it went public and you may remember, it was a rather abysmal public offering.

That's why we're talking about the big surge today. Today's surge made the company CEO, Mark Zuckerberg $3.7 billion, according to "Forbes" in one day. I've met the guy. He doesn't have to dress like that. Sure nice to know you've got it. His Facebook figured it out tonight.

OUTFRONT, David Kirkpatrick, author of the "Facebook Effect." Good to have you with us. So we're doing this story because a lot of people in this country, they've seen the movies. They use Facebook or they were in that IPO and they got burned and burned badly.

DAVID KIRKPATRICK, AUTHOR, "THE FACEBOOK EFFECT": Most viewers do use Facebook. There's no question. Many did buy the stock, too.

BURNETT: So two headlines, the rush for the exits doomed Facebook stock. Facebook's mobile miscalculation because everybody said they can't make money on the web. This is a pretty big hey.

KIRKPATRICK: This is a major seed change for the company. I think it was an historic day yesterday when they announced that not only are they growing everything, usage, revenues generally, growing ads in a very big way. They're growing on mobile and growing in mobile ads. Everybody really knows that the mobile internet is really the future of the internet. And many said, Facebook can't really do that properly. They have proved those people wrong and they really changed the whole sent I am about the company that has prevailed since the IPO.

BURNETT: Which is amazing and people love to hate them. People really did. Everybody said terrible things. When you look at that May 2012 IPO, anyone who bought it, I know you're probably painfully aware of this. It was at $38. Even with this surge we're still not there.

KIRKPATRICK: Yes, but we'll get there. This is getting closer than it's been since the first day. So it is really a strong indication that Facebook is a real business that will be able to figure this stuff out tomorrow. It was a tremendously reassuring development for a lot of skeptics there's no question.

BURNETT: All right, it is nice to see somebody picked on be able to say --

KIRKPATRICK: They keep focus on making it better and they're doing a pretty good job.

BURNETT: All right, thank you very much.

Still to come, a cyclospora outbreak in America, a dozen states affected tonight.

Plus three women were allegedly held captive by Ariel Castro for more than a decade and there was a huge development today. Should he be offered a plea deal and not the death penalty?

And the latest from the Anthony Weiner texting circus, we're going to hear from the latest woman at the center of the scandal.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: This is just in to CNN. The Obama administration will not make a formal determination as to whether the government upheaval in Egypt was a military coup. This is according to a senior administration official to our Jill Dougherty. Now, this is interesting. The official goes on to say, such a determination, should it be made, would force the United States government to stop providing military aid to the embattled Middle Eastern country. Now, of course, the U.S. provides about $1.5 billion in aid to Egypt, one of the largest on the planet.

"The law," this is a quote here to Jill Dougherty from the administration official, "the law does not require to us make a formal determination as to whether a coup took place. And it's not in our national interests to make such a determination," the official said. This is obviously at the center of one of the greatest international debates right now. Should someone who was not removed democratically be called a coup or not? This will be a story that has a lot more to come.

Welcome back to the second half of OUTFRONT.

We start with stories reporting from the front lines. And I want to begin with the Cyclospora outbreak. Health officials are trying to determine the source of the outbreak. It has infected at least 285 people in nearly a dozen states.

Now, while previous outbreaks of the gastrointestinal illness have been linked to imported fresh produce like snow peas, raspberries and basil, the CDC says at this point, no food items have been linked to the cases. Our senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen tells us the symptoms are common to a lot of other illnesses like fever, diarrhea and vomiting.

Well, an Air France spokeswoman has confirmed a story first reported by "The Associated Press." Here's the story: a body fell from an Air France flight as it was going over the western African country of Niger en route to Paris.

Air France tells OUTFRONT that that plane which was headed to Paris has been grounded in Niger pending an investigation. The airline said the man fell out of the landing gear.

Now, that could mean it was a stowaway. We don't know. If so, it's actually not as uncommon as you think. I mean, when you're at 30,000 feet, how could you stowaway in the landing gear? But since 1947, at least 96 people on 85 flights have reportedly tried to travel in wheel wells, 23 of them survived.

And murder by cyanide. Pennsylvania police arrested Robert Ferrante today in connection with the death of his wife, Dr. Autumn Klein. Police say Ferrante called 911 in mid-April saying he thought his wife was having a stroke. She died in the hospital three days later. But then tests showed she was poisoned.

According to a criminal complaint, Ferrante requested the purchase of cyanide at the laboratory where he worked and it was delivered a day later on April 16th.

BURNETT: It has been 719 days since the United States lost its top credit rating. What are we doing to get it back? Well, even though tech stocks were higher today and, of course, Facebook was a big part of that, one tech company was reeling. BlackBerry, 250 employees laid off at the company as it struggles to sell smartphones. I might myself have a new Q10 and I'm very happy with it.

And now, our fourth story OUTFRONT: Anthony Weiner taking a guess.

Yes, because at a press conference this afternoon, the candidate for New York mayor answered questions about his sexting scandal. I will let you listen to his answer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: How many -- how many conversations did you have with women after you resigned that were sexual in nature?

ANTHONY WEINER (D), NYC MAYORAL CANDIDATE: I don't believe I had any more than three.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: I don't believe I had any more than three. Well, that may sound like a strange response. But maybe the strangest part of this is that Anthony Weiner is still in the race at all.

Tom Foreman is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): With well over 8 million citizens to choose from, some New York Democrats may wonder how Anthony Weiner is even in the race for mayor -- staging photo ops, shaking hands and laughing off his sexting scandal.

WEINER: Our campaign is on Twitter.

FOREMAN: Both major parties have held on to or recycled politicians in sex scandals. Clinton, Vitter, Spitzer, Craig, just to name a few. But why? Maybe because the rules of political resurrection make it possible.

Rule one: even damaged players are known commodities.

Tracy Sefl is a Democratic communications consultant.

TRACY SEFL, DEMOCRATIC COMMUNICATIONS STRATEGIST: There is a reward system for familiar names, the incumbent nature of so much of American politics.

FOREMAN (on camera): Even if the name is known for scandal?

SEFL: Well -- or even if a name is known for its ability to lend itself to a tabloid headline in some cases.

(LAUGHTER)

FOREMAN (voice-over): Voters laugh at Weiner's name but they know it. So much so that he was leading the mayor's race a short while ago. And even though he has now fallen 9 points behind Christine Quinn, he still has a month and a half until the vote.

Rule two: recognition means money. In May and June, Weiner raised $828,000, more than any other Democratic contender. And his war chest started at nearly $5 million.

Rule three: even damaged candidates can still win.

REP. MARK SANFORD (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: I've ever experienced how none of us goes through life without mistakes.

FOREMAN: Former South Carolina Governor Mark Sanford was shunned by national Republicans when he tried to grab a Republican seat following his marital cheating scandal. He won any way. And now, they have to work with him.

And rule four: finding strong new candidates is not as easy as you may think. Newcomers can be daunted by the process and unnerved by the scrutiny.

SEFL: To imagine your personal life being turned into that reality show fodder is sad and scary and I'm certain that that detracts people from newly running for office.

FOREMAN: So, even when party leaders speak up, they often stop short of demanding that others get out of the game.

Listen to Nancy Pelosi talking about Weiner and others.

REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), MINORITY LEADER: Let me be very clear: the conduct of some of these people that we're talking about here is reprehensible.

FOREMAN: Because, well, now and then, a damaged politician such as John Ensign or Mark Foley will resign and ride off into the sunset, many others hang around and wait for the sun to shine again.

For OUTFRONT, Tom Foreman, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BURNETT: Roxanne Jones is a former vice president of ESPN and CEO of Push Marketing Group. She's the author of a column on CNN.com today called, "Will Sexters in the City Give Weiner a Pass?" It is getting a lot of buzz. You'll see why in a second.

Also with us, Ari Fleischer, our political contributor and a former White House press secretary under President George W. Bush.

All right. Let me start with you, Roxanne. I want to go straight to it. Read a snippet from your column today that's getting a lot of buzz. A lot of people say, look, can't we do better than this? Why don't good non-perverse people, deviant people want to run for public office? OK, you say, "Like it or not, we have become a sexting nation which may explain why some voters are willing to forgive politicians caught up in sex scandals and give them a second and even a third chance."

Really?

ROXANNE JONES, CEO, PUSH MARKETING GROUP: Yes. And actually, I used data to back that up. It was a Harris Poll. It was just done about 2,200 Americans, married, unmarried, across all economic levels. And it found that 32 percent of men 18-34 use their mobile device or some other device to sext, 25 percent of women, and I think they were 35 to 44. And 30 percent of married couples sext.

So this is a phenomenon that's happening in the country. And Weiner is part of it. And I think we should talk about this in context, because he certainly is not the only person sending trashy text messages and photos.

BURNETT: All right. I guess I hear your numbers and I'm not going to sit here and dispute them.

JONES: They're not my numbers. They're Harris numbers.

BURNETT: They're Harris numbers. I know, but I'm hearing you cite them. I'm shocked. I would like to think better of people's judgment. But you make a point.

And now, Ari, what do you think about that? This is the way people are now. And so, therefore, you're going to have people like this running for office. And maybe they're not as strange as it might seem.

ARI FLEISCHER, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR (via telephone): I think whether it is true or not is beside the point. This is not about sexting. This is about judgment and trust people have to now to put in for man who might lead New York City.

Anthony Weiner has proven himself to be a man with no self- control. He resigned from Congress just because of this activity, left in disgrace and then continued this activity, which shows he has no self-control, because he after all said it was wrong and he shouldn't have been doing it.

It's equivalent of electronically preying on somebody. This is not somebody with a relationship with their wife or girlfriend who is engaged in this activity. This is a man who is picking up strangers online. That's what he is doing.

That's why it is such an issue of trust and judgment. Do you want to give power, mayoral power to somebody who has no self-control? That's why he is dropping like a rock in the polls. You know, I think to a certain extent, if this was a Bravo show, it would be "real candidates of New York City." We are in celebrity stage of what's happening in the mayoral race and the comptroller race with Spitzer as well. I think at the end of the day, on serious day, which is Election Day, they're both going to lose, certainly. Certainly, Weiner is not going to win.

BURNETT: Roxanne, do you -- do you though, I mean, I understand the point that you're making here. But, you know, Ari also has a point, that he doesn't seem to have self-control. You want to be able to trust people. I mean, when you look at the biggest city in this country, I mean, people around the country hopefully can relate to this, because I know a lot of people hate who they have in public office, 83 percent of people disapprove of Congress. It's just one example.

JONES: Right.

BURNETT: Shouldn't we expect more than people who were running for office, trustworthy and not preying on young women on the Internet? We're the United States of America.

JONES: Yes, we're the United States of America and this is a familiar story. And so, Ari certainly has a point. And my column was not to say that we should make him mayor of New York. I am a New Yorker. I voted in New York.

May column was to say, many politicians are like. And so, it is our duty as voters to decide whether we will accept these politicians, and I mean Newt Gingrich and everybody else who has come along after him. Eliot Spitzer, Bill Clinton, I mean, the list goes on and on.

Ari has been around politics for a long time. And I'm sure he understands that people in politics and around politics get caught up in sexual scandals. And we still, as voters and American citizens, have the right to have a voice and decide whether we want people with his past to represent us. That was the point of my column.

And it is also about technology and sexting, because that's something that we will have to deal with.

BURNETT: All right. Ari, quickly before we go -- why don't people want to run for office, though? You know, you look at what they make. They don't make a lot of money. CEOs make $14 million on average in this country and a lot of people who might run for office are going to pick the corporate sector. The mayor of Boston, $170,000. It's just an example. Congress -- a congressional member makes $174,000.

You're going to get slammed by the media, every text you ever sent is going to come out and you could make more money on the private sector. Why would anyone go to one (ph)?

FLEISCHER: Yes, I think we have a real crisis --

JONES: That's a good question.

FLEISCHER: -- of quality in terms of who is running for office, certainly on the federal level when you look at who is not running for the United States Senate, which used to be one of the most prestigious (INAUDIBLE) to run for.

Part of it is the dysfunction in the system, the best and the brightest want to devote their energy to someone that works, instead of someone that doesn't work. And we're left with the rest. And as part of the celebrity culture, we're left with Anthony Weiner.

But, again, we're left with him for the campaign. We won't be left with him as mayor. I think there are many more qualified people who will win.

BURNETT: All right. Well, thanks to both of you. We appreciate it.

And still to come, the pope is literally a rock star. Millions coming out to see him -- rock bands playing left and right in Rio. Nuns rushing to touch him, an amazing site to show you.

And Ariel Castro allegedly holding three women captive for more than a decade. So, would a plea deal where he does not stand trial for the death penalty, they take that off the table work. Will that cheat those women of justice?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: We are back with tonight's "Outer Circle", where we reach out to sources around the world. And tonight, we go to Rio de Janeiro where Pope Francis held a massive worship service tonight for World Youth Day. It's the highlight of his week-long trip to Brazil where he called on the rich to do more to aid the poor.

Shasta Darlington is there and I asked her about just the heady excitement you could see all day surrounding tonight's service.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHASTA DARLINGTON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Erin, a million people are packed on to the beach here in Copacabana Beach. There's a lot of excitement and they're all here to see Pope Francis who is seated on the stage right behind me, a stage especially built for World Youth Day celebrations.

It has been a busy day for the man called the People's Pope. He also visited one of the shanty towns, really posing a bit of a security challenge as he kissed babies and reached out to touch some of the city's poorest, Erin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: Thanks, Shasta.

Now, our fifth story OUTFRONT: Castro considers a plea deal. So, tonight, the Cleveland kidnapping suspect and his lawyers are reviewing a plea deal. If they accept it, it would spare Ariel Castro the death penalty.

According to the source, the deal would include a recommendation to keep Castro in prison for life. He is facing an aggravated murder charge for a fetus along with hundreds of other charges of rape and kidnapping for allegedly holding Amanda Berry, Gina DeJesus and Michelle Knight captive for nearly a decade.

Now, Castro could formally accept a deal during a hearing tomorrow morning. But a lot of people are angry. They say he shouldn't be offered any kind of a deal that could potentially spare his life, that he should go to trial and the state should push for the death penalty.

OUTFRONT tonight: Dean Obeidallah, Stephanie Miller and Michael Medved.

All right. This is -- this is a tough issue.

Let me start with you, Michael, on this -- on this issue. Should the state not have offered this plea to Ariel Castro and gone straight for the death penalty?

MICHAEL MEDVED, RADIO TALK HOST: No. They are doing the right thing. The problem with the death penalty is that extends the case. It keeps it going.

And that's bad for three different sources.

Number one, it's obviously bad for the taxpayers.

Number two, it's obviously bad for the victims here who would have to testify if there was a death penalty case. They want this behind them.

And number three, it's bad for the country. I actually believe that the more attention we have toward this kind of case, the more attention we have to the lurid details of this story, the more likely there will be copycats, that it's going to infect our national blood stream.

I think putting this behind us for everyone as quickly as possible is the right thing to do.

BURNETT: Stephanie, you think so even if it takes possible death penalty off the table?

STEPHANIE MILLER, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: You know, I actually do here, Erin. I think that if you saw the interviews with the girls, they have clearly been so traumatized at this point. And I think to put them through this is also like further torture.

And in addition, I think it is a little bit apropos, don't you, that his sentence be life in imprisonment which is what he sentenced them. I think in some ways, it's more apropos and it's more justice, that -- you know, he suffers the same fate that he inflicted on them.

BURNETT: And, Dean, some people, though, are very angry. The state had a technical reason to go for the death penalty, right?

DEAN OBEIDALLAH, COMEDIAN: Right.

BURNETT: You can't put someone up for the death penalty because they're a monster and you wish they were dead.

OBEIDALLAH: Sure.

BURNETT: There was a technical reason. And that would be if they could prove beyond a reasonable doubt, that he killed an unborn fetus. That would have been incredibly difficult to do.

OBEIDALLAH: If the standard was horrible, people (INAUDIBLE) reality show stars killed right now. And we can't do that. However, viscerally, I would like to see this man killed. In reality, I would defer to the victims. If the victims said, I want this case tried, I want to see this man put to death, I was a prosecutor --

BURNETT: And they'd have to testify in this case and relive it.

OBEIDALLAH: In fact, there are 440 counts of rape. So, they would have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt each count. So, they have to testify about the details of each one, which would be painfully horrible.

But let's keep in mind, some people go: prison is not easy. I've been to prison. As a lawyer, and I deposed someone in person. It was a horrible three hours.

So, believe me, prison is horrible for people. If there is punishment, life in jail is not pleasant.

(CROSSTALK)

BURNETT: Go ahead, Michael.

MEDVED: Erin, I think this makes an important case of why it's important that we have the death penalty on the books, because, frankly, this gives us something to bargain with. If there were no death penalty possible here, they would have to go to a trial and trial and the defense, and he'd tried everything. The thing would be extended.

The death penalty here played its role. It got him to accept this plea bargain if he does and I hope that he does.

BURNETT: And, Stephanie, you think that he will? Otherwise, he'd have to go through and it and what will he get? Basically the best he's going to get is life, which they offered him anyway.

MILLER: Yes. I mean, you know, Michael can tell you this is a tough one for a law and order liberal. I'm a little squishy on the death penalty in the first place. I have wished on my radio show they put him in solitary confinement with Jodi Arias. But that's just -- that's a pipe dream sort of thing.

BURNETT: That would be a form of death penalty, right?

Anyway, quick final word, Dean?

OBEIDALLAH: I think they are doing the right thing, but I think honestly, the victims wanted to go to trial and they want to go through it --

BURNETT: You would go.

OBEIDALLAH: I would be 100 percent say death penalty, even though you're saying, you know, it's ambiguous standard, I'd do it.

BURNETT: All right. Thanks to all three. We appreciate it and let us know what you think.

And now, every night, we take a look outside the day's top stories for what we call the OUTFRONT "Outtake". And tonight, it is France and France is under attack.

This is a very important story but it is not from an outside army or a nation. This assault from France is coming from within. We're talking about the cats.

Every single day, 8,000 feral cats are born in France. If the country had a birthrate like that, we wouldn't have this aging problem around the world. But, anyway, they are taking over and things turned violent.

This week, a French woman told authorities -- look -- told authorities she was jumped by a group of six cats as she was walking her poodle. Of course, it was a poodle. She says the cats dragged her to the ground and then mauled her.

Now, the woman and her dog are fine but tourists are being warned formally about a violent cat problem. Apparently, there are cat related travel advisories about France.

"The Daily Telegraph" in London even run this photo of the suspects cleaning themselves. Now, yes, this could be the vicious gang behind the mauling, we don't know. But this cat attack is just the most recent report of animals turning on people.

A German town is being terrorized by a stock. That is their word and that is their picture of the terrorizing. The British apparently have been targeted by sea gulls. And a Florida man was hurt by an alligator during an animal show.

The animals apparently are rising up around the world. So, what to do? Issue travel warnings or target cats like the French, or just try to control the pet population, stop using animals for entertainment and always avoid cat down when you're walk you foofoo dog. I mean, that's the thing -- when cats finally rise up against dogs, do you think a poodle has a chance?

All right. Still to come, one week ago the city of Detroit filed for bankruptcy. Tonight, an idea that might get Detroit running again.

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BURNETT: It's been a tough week for Detroit. Motor City became the biggest city in American history to file for bankruptcy and one outspoken company decided to address the negativity by taking out an ad in "The New York Times" that read, "To those who have written off Detroit, we give you the Birdie."

As you can see the ad features a large photo of a watch and the image of three watch makers. Turns out the Birdie is actually the name of the watch and the watch is an idea built on Detroit's never say die/can do spirit.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LAKISHA RAYBON, SHINOLA EMPLOYEE: Even though it is the beginning, you want to put your best foot forward and try your best.

BURNETT: Here in downtown Detroit, in a building that was home to a General Motors design studio, a company called Shinola is trying to turn Motown's fortunes around one second at a time.

Watches -- high-end watches that cost up to $1,000 each. They are being manufactured in a city that filed for bankruptcy, where unemployment is near 16 percent, homicide rates are the highest they've been in 40 years and the population is plunging.

HEATH CARR, SHINOLA CEO: Anyone can get in the car and drive around Detroit and see the past and understand the past very clearly. It was all about the spirit of the folks that we met and they were steadfast focused on where the future of Detroit was going to be.

BURNETT: Shinola CEO Heath Carr wants to be part of the city's comeback using the very skills and resources that once made Detroit an industrial power house.

CARR: We have some folks that came from manufacturing. We have one lady on the line that actually, her job was replaced by a machine many years ago and manufacturing.

We have Willie, who's on the line, used to be the security guard for the building. So, we have people from varied backgrounds -- I think that makes part of this exciting.

BURNETT: And rewarding for the employees who've seen Detroit in better times.

RAYBON: People are going buy watches we made. It's going to be a big deal to me.

BURNETT: The brand is quickly catching on. Shinola opened two years ago and in the past month, have opened stores in Detroit and New York. In fact, Shinola watches are selling out on Barneys on Madison Avenue.

CARR: We're getting international requests, as we'll. So, made in the United States means something beyond the United States and people love the story of Detroit around the world.

BURNETT: As for the company's name, if it's ringing a bell, you're on the right track.

CARR: Somebody used the phrase at a meeting said, "You don't know from Shinola", and we said we know we have our name now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BURNETT: Just an amazing story, and there is so many companies trying to take Detroit back. We're going to keep talking about that.

Well, as always, thanks for watching. We'll see you tomorrow night. Have a very nice night.

In the meantime, "A.C 360" with Wolf Blitzer starts right now.