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Aired August 7, 2013 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DR. DREW PINSKY, HOST (voice-over): Tonight, manhunt. All of America on the lookout for this man.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m begging you to let my daughter go. You`ve taken everything else.
Hannah, we all love you very much. If you have a chance, you take it. You run.
PINSKY: He is the prime suspect in the disappearance of Hannah and Ethan Anderson. Described as weird and a little off, Uncle Jim may have killed their mom. Someone who knows them all joins me with the frightening details.
Our behavior bureau sounds off on the man who triggered an Amber alert.
Plus, Anthony Weiner`s sexting partner is here in a primetime exclusive, and she`s taking your calls.
Let`s get started.
PINSKY: Good evening now.
My host is attorney and Sirius XM Radio host Jenny Hutt. She is my co-host this week.
JENNY HUTT, CO-HOST: Hey.
PINSKY: And coming up, we`ve got the woman who sexted with Anthony Weiner. She is here and she is -- there she is. Sydney Leathers will be taking your calls, if you want to ring in at 855-DRDREW5. She will take your calls.
But, first up, we are talking about an Amber alert, two children missing since Sunday, mother found dead. Other bones amongst the mother`s -- the remains of the mom, they think it might be one of the children, perhaps. It`s being reported that way.
There is a young girl who is in danger. A family friend known as Uncle Jim is believed to have kidnapped them. A desperate search is under way right now.
Take a look.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Desperate search under way in California. This is a picture of Hannah Anderson. She is a white female, 16 years old.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We all miss you, Hannah. We love you so much.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a picture of Ethan Anderson. He is an 8- year-old boy.
NANCY GRACE, HLN HOST: James Lee DiMaggio believed to be on the run with the 8-year-old child and the 16-year-old sister.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is safe to say that he is a very dangerous person.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He burned down his house. That was his house that burned.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The mother`s body along with the dog found in the burning rubble of a home and garage.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He is described as a longtime family friend.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We believe the children are in danger.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m begging you to let my daughter go.
PINSKY: Joining us: Crystal Wright from conservativeblackchick.com, Mark Eiglarsh, attorney general at speaktomark.com, Marc Klaas, his daughter, Polly Klaas, of course, kidnapped and murdered in 1993. He is president of the Klaas Kids Foundation. And Brian Copeland, talk show host on KGO Radio in San Francisco, author of "Not a Genuine Black Man."
First, CNN`s Paul Vercammen joins us by phone.
Paul, you`ve had a chance to speak to Hannah`s friends. What are they saying about the relationship between this guy who`s starting to look like quite a creep and Hannah?
PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Well, first off, let me tell you that many friends said that Hannah herself is a fun-loving girl, great girl, has her stuff together, and that they don`t believe -- they had never even heard of this Jim DiMaggio. These are some of her friends. And so, they were not quite sure how or why this happened.
However, some people close to the family had suggested that DiMaggio was considered an uncle, as was pointed out earlier, that he had basically won the trust of the entire family. And it was just about as close as you could be without being a blood relative. And then a neighbor said that recently, Hannah and DiMaggio had taken a trip to Hollywood.
And one more thing about these people characterizing the relationship with DiMaggio and the family. They say it was so close at one point that DiMaggio was living with the paternal grandmother and that she had been extremely good to him and that Brett Anderson and Mr. DiMaggio -- this is the father -- had been friends for more than 20 years, extremely close friends, Drew.
PINSKY: Wow. Paul, thank you for that report. It is a confusing, disturbing, sort of disgusting story.
Marc Klaas, I`ve got to go to you first. You`ve been following this unfolding from the beginning. What are your thoughts and instincts on this?
MARC KLAAS, DAUGHTER POLLY WAS KIDNAPPED AND MURDERED: Well, my instinct is that they are still very close to home, that whatever this guy did, he got her, he`s got her -- he`s gone below the radar. And my advice would be exactly the same as her father`s advice. He made an appeal to this guy and he then told his daughter to run when you have an opportunity, and I think that`s exactly right. She has to find a way to keep herself alive. Until that opportunity presents itself, whether it`s a day, a week, a month or years away.
PINSKY: Mark Eiglarsh, your get.
MARK EIGLARSH, ATTORNEY: Well, I think that he`s just enjoying what he knows will be his last few days of freedom. There is a warrant out for him, a million dollars bond awaits him. He`ll never leave jail.
Hopefully, you`re getting the word out. Others are getting the word out. And as soon as she has a minute to flee, as Marc suggested, that would be the best course of action.
PINSKY: Brian, I have a sense that he went south of the border. What do you think?
BRIAN COPELAND, RADIO HOST: If he did in fact leave the country, that makes more sense than what a lot of people were saying, that he was headed to either Texas or Canada. It seems to me he`ll go underground as quickly as he possibly can, so I don`t see him --
PINSKY: Yes, that house that burned down, right next to the Mexico border.
COPELAND: Right. He might go over to Canada.
PINSKY: Right, absolutely. But, again, everyone, don`t take your eyes off the road, look for this car. Do we have some sort of a -- OK, we`re going to keep the license plate of the car up throughout this part of the show.
Now, the missing children`s father issued a plea. I want you to hear it. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m begging you to let my daughter go. You`ve taken everything else.
Hannah, we all love you very much. If you have a chance, you take it. You run.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Jenny, put your hand up.
HUTT: Yes, I just have to say, Dr. Drew, I`m not placing blame anywhere other than at the guy who took the kid, but I think when a grown man who`s not part of your family wants to spend alone time with your 16- year-old, that right there`s a red flag. That`s creepy and not OK.
It`s just not. That right there says keep him away from all of us.
PINSKY: Yes, Crystal, I hear you yepping. Hold on, Brian next. Crystal, go ahead.
CRYSTAL WRIGHT, CONSERVATIVEBLACKCHICK.COM: Right. Yes, I just want to say, I absolutely agree with Jenny, and I don`t understand, as a woman and having been nurtured by parents who cared about me, how do you let your child go, take a road trip to Hollywood --
WRIGHT: -- with Jim, who the neighbors -- Hannah expressed concern to one of the neighbors` daughters, she said she didn`t want to be alone with Jim, Jim didn`t want her kissing boys her own age, age-appropriate.
WRIGHT: And I just want to say one thing real quick. When I was little, I had an experience similar to this in that myself and two brothers, my little brothers, we had to wait at a bus stop. My father would drop us off by his office to shorten our bus ride. And there was this older gentleman that was always coming around and trying to talk to my little brothers.
And it was creepy. Creepy, creepy. And he wanted to -- he called my parents because he ended up being a patient of my father`s.
PINSKY: Oh, no.
WRIGHT: He wanted to take my brothers on the weekend and hang out with them.
WRIGHT: My mom`s like -- my kids have a dad. They`re not -- it`s not you.
So, this stuff is serious business.
PINSKY: Oh, absolutely.
WRIGHT: Serious business.
PINSKY: Now, Crystal asked how this is possible.
PINSKY: Brian, I want to go to you. I want to say something as a preface to your comments, Brian, which is that, unfortunately, people may not like to hear this, but if you are a mom and you were traumatized as a child, unless you had a good deal of treatment, you have a very high probability of being attracted to people that are familiar and end up being perpetrators themselves. So, know yourself. If you`ve had trauma and you find people around you trying to indoctrinate you and your family, your alarm should go off every which way.
I know in your mind, you think I would never let this happen to my kids. The thing that was the most horrific experience of my life, I will be on alert for chronically.
But the amazing thing is, we as humans re-enact the past.
Brian, go ahead.
COPELAND: Yes. OK, while the story that Crystal told is, unfortunately, a common story with the creepy guy that`s hanging around that`s up to no good, I -- and I know I`m going to get jumped on by this panel for saying this, but I just really have a problem with any male who`s being nice to a kid or a younger person being looked at automatically as a suspect.
Now, this was not some guy who the family --
HUTT: Hold on.
COPELAND: Can I please finish?
This was not a guy who the family had only known for a couple of weeks or a few months or something who takes off with them. This is a guy who knew her father since seventh grade. I`ve got three best friends who I`ve been friends with for 30 years.
WRIGHT: So what?
COPELAND: Hang on a second. Can I finish?
I`ve got three best friends I`ve known for 30 years, and my kids consider them uncles. If one of them wanted to take my daughter or son for something special, I would allow them to do it --
COPELAND: If there was something creepy about it or had the mom known, for example, that she was uncomfortable around him, that`s an entirely different situation.
HUTT: A sleepover date is creepy with an older man who`s not part of the family.
WRIGHT: Come on. Thank you.
PINSKSY: It is a point well taken --
COPELAND: You say not part of the family, but after 20 or 30 years, you consider them to be a part of the family.
WRIGHT: He`s not part of the family.
PINSKY: Mark Eiglarsh, go.
EIGLARSH: And let me support one thing Brian is saying. I`ve been in the criminal justice arena for over two decades, and the one thing that all pedophiles have alike is that they`re grooming these kids.
PINSKY: Yes, yes.
EIGLARSH: They work the families over. They`re really good.
EIGLARSH: They`d be CEOs of corporations if they had the same technique for making money.
PINSKY: That`s right. That`s right.
EIGLARSH: They`re have good at what they did the do.
PINSKY: This could be grooming behavior of a stalker, we don`t know, or a pedophile, we just don`t know, but thank you, panel.
Next up, a family friend of the missing children joins us to tell us what she knows about this suspect and his alleged crush on the 16-year-old you`re seeing there in that picture.
And later, guys, Ms. Ali joins us. She is back. Things are bound to heat up a little bit. There she is.
We`ll be back in just a moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hannah mentioned something about a big secret and I asked her what it was and she told me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hannah did say she was a little creeped out when Jim did tell her that he had a crush on her.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She said she wouldn`t go up there anymore because it was too awkward between them.
(END VIDEO CLIPS)
PINSKY: Back with co-host Jenny Hutt. Massive manhunt continues right now for this man. Put his picture up there, James Lee DiMaggio. Authorities say that`s one of his looks. He`s got several. Take a good look at them.
Authorities say he kidnapped Hannah Anderson after having killed their mother and possibly even his brother.
We are back with the panel. Joining us, Samantha Schacher, host of "Pop Trigger" on Young Turks Network.
And on the phone, Angelina Amati. She knows the Anderson family well. Her daughter was friends with Hannah, the missing girl.
Angelina, thank you for joining us.
I understand that Hannah had some concerns about Uncle Jim and that she expressed those concerns to your daughter. What did she tell your daughter?
ANGELINA AMATI, FAMILY FRIEND (via telephone): She told my daughter that one time they were driving home from somewhere and she had asked Jim if on one of her trips up there she could bring a boy with her, and his response was he did not want her to bring a boy with her because he would get jealous if he saw her making out with another boy because he had a crush on her.
PINSKY: Did you ever have any concerns about this relationship --
PINSKY: -- between uncle Jim and Hannah?
AMATI: Not until my kids told me that the day that all this came out.
PINSKY: Did you notice anything about him, or is this completely shocking and seemingly out of character for you?
AMATI: One hundred percent shocking.
PINSKY: OK. Angelina, hold on one second. Brian, you wanted to comment here. But Brian, would one of your friends that you trust for 20 years say that to one of your kids?
COPELAND: No. That`s an entirely different situation, obviously. But I just had a question for Angelina, and that is, actually, two-fold.
First of all, these concerns were expressed. Were those concerns expressed before or after the trip to Hollywood that they took alone together? And secondly, was Hannah`s mother aware of these concerns?
AMATI: These just came out on Monday when I got the phone call about the house burning down and that it was Tina`s body inside the home. I immediately came home from work and discussed with my kids if they knew anything, if they knew why Jim had done this, and that`s when the girls had told me about the comment that Jim had made about liking Hannah.
And I can tell you 100 percent, if Tina had any, any sense that this was going on, Jim would have been cut off from the family 100 percent.
PINSKY: Samantha, you want to ask something?
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. Angelina, first, I want to say I`m so sorry for the loss of your friend, Tina. I know you guys were both and I know you`re concerned about Hannah.
But my question is, did Jim have any relationship that you`re aware of? Was he a bachelor? Did he have a girlfriend?
AMATI: When I met Jim over last summer, he did have a girlfriend. The girlfriend actually came out and attended a few of the football games with us as we would sit out there on Saturdays as a family and watch Ethan play football. I don`t know why that relationship ended. I don`t know when that relationship ended.
PINSKY: Mark Eiglarsh, you have a question.
EIGLARSH: Angelina, did you know that Jim was taking Hannah to Hollywood alone? And is that something that you thought was normal?
AMATI: I was aware that he did take her on a road trip to Hollywood for her birthday, and I believe to Malibu, if I`m not mistaken. As a mother -- yes, I did think that that was strange, considering he had no kids, but at the same time, was Tina playing a sister role to me, I had never doubted Tina`s judgment.
PINSKY: Did Tina -- all right, this may be something that you may not be appropriate to answer being secondhand, but did Tina herself -- was she a trauma survivor in any way where traumatic experiences have come into her life repeatedly?
AMATI: That I`d rather not discuss.
PINSKY: OK, that`s fine. That`s fine. I understand that.
Jenny, you have a question.
HUTT: No, I just -- look, Dr. Drew, many of us have had some sort of trauma or something. I mean, a guy brought me in the woods when I was 5 and made me touch his penis. I`m fine. My kid`s not going away with a grown man anywhere. I mean, come on.
PINSKY: Jenny, you just dropped a bomb in the middle of this whole thing, but we`ll talk about that later. Go ahead.
HUTT: I`m just saying, you don`t let your child go with a grown man!
PINSKY: Crystal --
WRIGHT: I have a question.
PINSKY: Crystal, go ahead.
WRIGHT: I have a question for Angelina. You said you were close to Tina, like sisters. You never felt that you observed strange behavior of Jim toward Hannah that you wanted to talk to Tina about?
PINSKY: Or any funny feelings? Funny feelings --
WRIGHT: Did you see him act, you know, funny around her?
AMATI: Never. I was actually with them I believe on the 22nd. I believe it was at a family birthday party -- I`m sorry, the 21st of July, for Hannah`s 16th birthday party for strictly the family. Jim was there. Jim did not give Hannah any special attention. It was normal.
As a matter of fact, me, Tina, Jim and another friend, we sat around the table and just had general conversation. It was never where`s Hannah? He never followed her around. It just, he acted as an adult.
PINSKY: Brian, do you have a question? Go ahead.
COPELAND: I was just going to ask -- in your observations of Jim -- he have relationships with -- first of all, with any other people outside of this family, friendships with? And do you know if he spent time with other young people, other children, other kids?
AMATI: It was brought to my attention that just recently when we were at the sheriff`s department doing investigation, or talking to detectives, that Jim actually did pick up one of Hannah`s friends on numerous occasions and took her on lunch dates and provided her with alcohol and marijuana.
AMATI: Hannah was not involved with those. I will tell you, though, as being a person that`s dealt with trauma, the mass majority of her childhood life, I never suspected any of those signs from Jim.
PINSKY: Wow. Oh, goodness.
COPELAND: Where`s the mother of the other young girl? That`s what I`m curious about, the mother of the other young girl taking on dates.
PINSKY: This guy is a grooming child molester, classic. Go ahead, Angelina. Answer that. Go ahead.
AMATI: That I do not. My daughter and that other child had conflicts, so I kept my daughter away from that child because I didn`t particularly care for the characteristics that the child had. So, I never -- I did report it to the police and the police I do know called her in for questioning. That`s all I know.
PINSKY: Angelina, first of all, thank you so much for being so forthcoming. We hear at HLN and CNN cannot independently confirm any of the allegations made here this evening.
But, Angelina, we`ve been fascinated by your comments. We are interested in this story and we thank you for shining a little bit of light on it. Again, we cannot confirm nor refute any of the statements that she has made here this evening.
Thank you, panel.
A reminder, behavior bureau with Ms. Ali has an outspoken take on this case.
Later, I got Anthony Weiner and his sexting partner here.
We are back in a moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators believe 40-year-old James DiMaggio abducted both or one of these children.
GRACE: The mother`s body, along with the dog, found in the burning rubble of a home and garage. Forty-year-old DiMaggio admits to, quote, "romantic feelings" for the 16-year-old little girl.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We consider him to be an extremely dangerous person.
GRACE: Every minute is critical in the search for these two missing children.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It makes no sense, because he has known those kids since they were born.
GRACE: A plutonic friend of the mom.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
GRACE: Now, how the heck did all this break wide open?
(END VIDEO CLIPS)
PINSKY: Time for a behavior bureau. Back with co-host Jenny Hutt and Samantha Schacher.
Joining us: Cheryl Arutt, clinical and forensic psychologist, Wendy Walsh, psychologist and author of "The 30-Day Love Detox" and criminal investigator Danine Manette, author of "Ultimate Betrayal." And on the phone, Shahrazad Ali, author of "Are You Still a Slave?"
So, we learned something from Angelina in the previous segment, telling us that she alleges that this man was offering and grooming and hanging around and giving intoxicants to other children.
And, Jenny, you heard it as well as I did, did you not?
HUTT: I did hear that. The whole thing is such a horror show. But again, look, Dr. Drew, I keep going back to this boundary thing. There`s just certain things that seem just not OK with an adult male and a young girl. It just -- that`s -- I don`t get it.
PINSKY: Well, hopefully, people at home are beginning to get it.
Wendy, let`s paint the picture of who this guy is. What do you make of him?
WENDY WALSH, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, I definitely think he`s in a mid- life crisis, pedophile, child molester, whatever you make of it, Dr. Drew. But you know what? When you talk about not letting our kids play with guys who don`t have kids, suddenly, you`re discriminating against so many men.
And remember, 50 percent of adults are not married. They`re hanging out with families, sort of, you know, part of the whole thing. They may have sexual feelings that come up as these kids hit adolescence. That`s the main thing. They hit adolescence --
PINSKY: Wendy, are you somehow softening this story?
WALSH: I am not softening this story. This guy is an awful guy, but we have to be careful not to discriminate against every guy who doesn`t have kids.
PINSKY: Brian made that point. I get it. Brian made that point as well, but, Cheryl, I`m going to go to you. Help me out.
This guy to me is a stalking, grooming, kind of a classic situation, no?
CHERYL ARUTT, PSYCHOLOGIST: Yes. This is, obviously, this is the creepy uncle that turns into the catastrophe that everybody hopes never ever happens. This is really, really awful. And while on the one hand there can be wonderful, safe men, young girls are in a particularly tough spot because we teach girls, don`t make anybody uncomfortable, put other people`s feelings first.
And at the same time, they find themselves in situations with adults, listen to adults, uncle Jim is in charge if I`m not here, that kind of thing -- where it`s very difficult for a 16-year-old to maintain her safety and her boundaries --
ARUTT: -- with somebody who`s a creep.
PINSKY: These guys know what they`re doing! That`s how they get their way with these little kids, by little kids, these adolescents. They groom them as being special and they have a special insight and isn`t this relationship great.
Ms. Ali, help me with this. What do you see here?
SHAHRAZAD ALI, AUTHOR (via telephone): Well, I see two things. The first thing I see is that when a black guy does something and when he`s in trouble, he`s considered just a savage and a thug. When a white guy does something, he`s emotionally unstable and he`s just mentally ill.
That`s the first thing I see. I see where y`all leaning.
The second thing is, is that black children, there`s 300,000 black children missing. That`s disproportionate for the number of us that live here in this country. And we don`t get that kind of attention. You all have Amber alerts to look for your children. We don`t have the Shaniqua alert, so we don`t have any way really to get this out there --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Wait a minute --
ALI: The way that you do.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Wait a minute.
ALI: Our children are not covet like white children. But as soon as somebody steal Goldilocks, y`all are all over the television all day and night talking about a child that`s missing and it`s unfair.
PINSKY: Well, Danine, does she have a point? If you listen, Ms. Ali, if you listen carefully, there`s a little kernel of something there.
DANINE MANETTE, CRIMINAL INVESTIGATOR: There is. I`m sorry that race is being brought into this tragic case, but I do hear her to a certain degree. America is just not as interested in -- I`m going to make it broader -- America is just not as interested in nonwhite children and nonwhite women as a whole.
I mean, how often does the paparazzi follow black celebrities? They`re not that interesting. So, you know, it is what it is. I`m not, you know, crying about it, but it is what it is, and --
PINSKY: Hang on.
ALI: I`m crying about it.
PINSKY: Well, Ms. Ali`s crying about it, but Samantha, tell me is that true? There`s plenty of African-American celebrities that are in the crosshairs of the paparazzi. But then again, when you think about the ones that are really the ones that they go nuts over, they`re the white women, aren`t they?
SCHACHER: Yes, I mean --
ALI: Oh, yes, that`s who we all go nuts over is white women. See, when a black girl is kidnapped, everybody figures, well, she`s strong, she can get herself out of whatever she get in, but --
SCHACHER: Ms. Ali.
ALI: -- when somebody takes Hansel and Gretel, oh, it`s she`s weak, she`s fragile, we`d better help her, let`s get on it.
SCHACHER: I believe it was my turn.
PINSKY: Samantha, go ahead. Let me be the traffic cop. Go ahead, Sam.
SCHACHER: All right. Ms. Ali, I actually agree with you here. Now, I don`t think this is time to bring race into it, however, there is a racial and even, I`m going to suggest, a gender bias when it comes to child abduction. I mean, the ones that come to my mind when I think about child abductions, I think of Caylee Anthony, I think of Elizabeth Smart, I think abut Polly Klaas, I think of Jaycee Dugard. Those are all young, white girls. So, I get what she`s saying.
PINSKY: As usual --
WALSH: Dr. Drew --
PINSKY: Ms. Ali brings up an interesting kind of point there. Jenny, is that you?
HUTT: Yes --
WALSH: It`s Wendy.
PINSKY: Go ahead, Wendy. I`m sorry.
WALSH: Listen, Ms. Ali, I respect you, I agree 100 percent, but Dr. Drew didn`t ask you about race. He asked what are your thoughts about this case and you seem to only care about the color of their skin. Two children`s lives hang in the balance here! Two children`s lives hang in the balance.
ALI: Wait, you`re not in me and Dr. Drew`s relationship. You don`t tell me that you don`t have to interpret to me what he asked. I can answer what I want to ask and move on to that question, which is what I did, and I still bring it back to over 40 percent of the missing women out there are black women.
When are y`all going to talk about them?
PINSKY: Ms. Ali, we have a special relationship, she and I. You don`t want to get in the middle of that, my dear.
WALSH: Exactly, but we`re not going to talk about it tonight.
PINSKY: She doesn`t call me Uncle Drew or anything, but we have a special relationship. I`m just saying.
Guys, listen, we`re joking around about a serious matter. We`ve taken a big turn into race. Interesting. Interesting sort of observation that Ms. Ali, again, brings to the table that we all need to go ahead and think about, but I agree with Wendy.
Bottom line, there are several lives in the balance here. I think let`s bring it home by saying, once again, trust your instincts, anybody, parents at home. Know yourself if you have a trauma history. We have a tendency to repeat those things. And please, Hannah, if you`re listening, run. Get away. Do anything you have to do to survive. I know Ms. Ali would even agree with all three of those things, yes, my dear?
ALI: I would.
PINSKY: All right. Thank you. Thank you, guys. Thank you, panel. I`ve got Anthony Weiner`s sexting partner. We`re taking another turn. She is here for a primetime exclusive. She is taking your calls. Please don`t go away.
POLITAN: Coming up top of the hour on "HLN After Dark," we`re going to take the focus away from Little Josh for just a little bit and put it on Big Josh who clearly is the villain of this trial.
SMITH: That`s right. He`s the villain, but here`s the bold question, is Big Josh innocent? Is he covering for his son? Our jury is going to decide that. And you know what? It`s going to go a big way to determine what happens in this case.
POLITAN: Yes. And I`m going to try to prove someone innocent. How do I do that?
SMITH: I don`t know.
POLITAN: Find out top of the hour, "HLN After Dark."
PINSKY: Welcome back. My co-host, Jenny Hutt. Now, we`re talking about Anthony Weiner and his sexting partner, Sydney Leathers. She is here in a primetime exclusive and I will get her take on Carlos Danger, as he`s so-called, in a few moments. But first, Weiner says he is mentally fit to be mayor of New York, he`s staying in the race, and that means he`s still out there talking a bunch. Take a look at this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You haven`t gotten a single question about sexting today. Is that a good sign?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you have anything to say about Spitzer sort of being a little judgmental of you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Enough. Enough, enough.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re putting on a show. We all appreciate it. Enough, enough.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m putting on a show?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m going to keep talking about the things important to this city. I don`t really care if a lot of pundits or politicians are offended by that.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Even in this welcoming crowd, questions about the sexual messages and photographs he sent to women over the internet continue to follow him.
(SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
PINSKY: My panel is back with me, and we are talking about Anthony Weiner, who has declined to release his medical records. Crystal, I want to go to you first. Do you think he should have to produce --
CRYSTAL WRIGHT, CONSERVATIVEBLACKCHICK.COM: Oh, please.
PINSKY: I`m interested what you have to say. Should he produce something of a medical record to document or back up what he`s saying about his mental health?
WRIGHT: Absolutely not, because he`s exhibiting behavior of a porn star, not somebody running for mayor. He said he`s going to keep talking. Yes. What are you going to keep talking about, Anthony? Talking about your genitalia that has been displayed all over the internet? He`s pathetic, pathetic, pathetic. And also, did you know what else he did? He thought it was good behavior to call his Republican opponent a grandpa.
WRIGHT: George McDonald is 69 years old and he went up to touch him, because apparently, Weiner likes touching a lot of things. He likes touching himself, he likes touching other people, so --
PINSKY: We`ll hear about that in a minute.
WRIGHT: He touched it. I mean, anyway --
PINSKY: -- apparently, that was an AARP exchange of some type, so --
WRIGHT: A third of voters in New York are senior citizens or older Americans.
PINSKY: Got you.
WRIGHT: So, the guy has just lost it.
PINSKY: Mark, what do you think? I want to stay focused on this medical records thing because I have a strong opinion about that. Do you think he should have to produce some sort of record?
MARK EIGLARSH, SPEAKTOMARK.COM: Why is it necessary, honestly? What would a medical record show me that I don`t already know? Either the reasons why I won`t vote for him are either he has extraordinary defects in character, and I wouldn`t want anyone like that representing me, or number two, he`s really sick. He`s powerless.
EIGLARSH He just, he has no control over this, fill in the blank, whatever it is, in which case he`s sick, in which case I`d be doing him a favor, encouraging him to go get help instead of representing the people of New York.
PINSKY: Samantha, what do you say?
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Well, listen, I don`t think anybody needs documentation to prove that he`s not capable or fit to be mayor. However, I do think that, listen, if his mental health is in question and we at large are hiring him, I think that we should be privy, and the New York City voters should be privy to his medical records.
PINSKY: OK. Jenny, what do you say?
JENNY HUTT, ATTORNEY: Yes. I think a lot of politicians probably have some mental issues, so I don`t really care about whether --
HUTT: -- his diagnosis comes out, but I do think that -- and Dr. Drew, I want to hear your opinion, because you`re the physician.
PINSKY: Listen, I feel so strongly. This almost enrages me that anyone should have to produce medical records that do not want to. They are entitled to their privacy of their medical care, especially of their mental health care. If he`s exhibiting behaviors, we have a right to try to interpret it, but he has a right to his privacy.
PINSKY: I don`t care what he`s up to until he crosses into the criminal realm, which we`re not there yet. Thank you, guys.
WRIGHT: We talked a lot --
PINSKY: Crystal, I`ve got to go.
WRIGHT: We talked a lot about the stigma on mental illness.
PINSKY: Of course, and I understand that. And he may want to speak about it, but then --
WRIGHT: And that`s what I`m saying. It needs to be private.
PINSKY: He has no obligation to produce anything.
WRIGHT: It needs to be private.
PINSKY: Primetime exclusive, guys. I`ve got his sexting partner here, Sydney Leathers. She joins the "Behavior Bureau," and she is taking your calls. There she is. 855-DrDrew5. That`s 373-7395. We`ll be right back.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Remember me?
She made me famous. She made me famous.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny Hutt and the "Behavior Bureau." Sydney Leathers, another individual who made Anthony Weiner famous, joins us for her primetime exclusive. Sydney is famous for being one of the sexting partners, and she`s willing to take some calls from you guys. She`s been very kind. The number`s 855-373-7395.
So, Sydney, thank you for joining us. And I think -- I want to start with this. People have -- I want to give, "A," the panel a chance to ask you a question and, "B," callers a chance to ask you a question. But before I do, how did you get into his life? I think we have lots of misunderstanding about that. How did he find you or you find him and how did this thing unfold?
SYDNEY LEATHERS, SEXTED WITH ANTHONY WEINER: What actually happened is I sent him a message in 2011 on Facebook, just expressing disappointment in his conduct. And then, a little less than a year later, he poked me back on Facebook, and then the conversation started from there.
PINSKY: When did it get sexual?
LEATHERS: Almost immediately.
PINSKY: Did you feel any remorse? You knew he was married. You`d already expressed discontent that his behavior previously. Didn`t you, like, think something was not right?
LEATHERS: I mean, yes. The situation seemed strange from the beginning.
PINSKY: But you actually -- I don`t want to put words in your mouth, but is it true that you actually developed, like, a relationship, in your mind?
LEATHERS: Sort of. I mean, it was more of a fantasy thing, I think.
PINSKY: All right. Crystal, you have a question for Sydney.
WRIGHT: Yes, Sydney. You know, when this first happened, you acted really shocked, like oh, my gosh, you know, how would Anthony Weiner do this to me? You acted like you were such an innocent, but we know now because I think you -- didn`t you write ten tips for women if they want to lure a politician? You said that you`ve had sugar daddies in the past that have paid you for all these things.
I just want to know, do you have any, like, self-esteem for yourself or do you just depend on men to take care of you and give you sexual pleasure? Is that how you define yourself, because it`s really odd?
PINSKY: I don`t think that was a question, Crystal.
LEATHERS: No, it wasn`t a question. It was just a personal attack.
WRIGHT: No, it was a question. No, it wasn`t. I asked her -- I`m going to repeat the question. Do you depend on men to define yourself and to give you self-esteem?
PINSKY: Fair enough. To buttress your self-esteem.
LEATHERS: No, Crystal, I don`t.
PINSKY: OK. I`ve got a caller. Dina in New Jersey. Dina, what do you want to ask?
DINA, NEW JERSEY: Dr. Drew, I`d like to ask Sydney. Is she proud of herself, fooling around with a married man, one? And two, what is her motive? Does she have a book deal? What is the motive?
PINSKY: So, go ahead, Sydney.
LEATHERS: Am I proud of myself? Yes, I do think coming forward and telling the truth is the right thing to do. Yes, I acknowledge the fact that he was married, and that part of it is a mistake on my end. I`ve never tried to play the victim as far as that goes. I own up to that. And you know, there`s no master plan for this, although, people seem to think that there is.
PINSKY: Sydney, I`ll tell you what`s not coming across to me is remorse at having done this, and I don`t want to make you feel bad if you don`t, but I would think you would feel terrible to have gotten in the middle of a family like this.
LEATHERS: I mean, I do feel very badly for Huma, but you also have to understand the fact that this man has engaged in this behavior before. He`s admitted that I wasn`t the only one at that time. So, if it wasn`t me, it would be someone else.
PINSKY: Wendy, I wonder if you have a question for Sydney.
WENDY WALSH, PH.D., PSYCHOLOGIST: Yes, I certainly do. So, I`m trying to get this clear in my head. Originally, you contacted him on Facebook telling him that you were not happy with his behavior, and then, he pokes you back, like almost two years later, right?
LEATHERS: About a little less than a year later.
WALSH: OK. And then you engage in the behavior with him. So, now you don`t think it`s so bad as long as it`s with you?
LEATHERS: No. I think it`s bad either way.
WALSH: Or were you just playing with him? Was this kind of a fun game for you, like, oh my, is he really going to do this again? Could I actually see if he could do this? Was that kind of what was happening?
LEATHERS: I think towards the end a little bit just because it was so shocking that after the first scandal, he was willing to go into that all over again. And the photos he sent me, he wanted to send me. I never asked for them.
PINSKY: And jenny, I know you have a question. And it went pretty fast into some pretty heavy places where these exchanges, Jenny, were like five times a day. Go ahead, Jenny.
HUTT: Yes. So, this is what I want to know. First of all, I think there`s a bit of caveat to enter here like the buyer beware. You did know he was married and you did know that there was a prior scandal, so any sort of like, kind of shocked behavior makes no sense. How you thought that, how could it possibly happen again? I mean, duh.
I don`t think that -- this is what I think, Sydney. I think it`s really he was the one who really breached a duty to his wife, so I`ll say to you, you`re the mistress, so I get that. However, you did know this was like a big deal and you walked into it knowing it was a big deal. And so, the motive question that came up before, I`m going to throw right at you. Why did you do it? Like, why did you go public? Why are you on every show? Why, why, why?
PINSKY: Well, I`m going to defend her a little bit here. She agreed to do us. She`s not on every show. And she`s very kind to come here with us.
HUTT: Yes, she`s lovely, but why?
PINSKY: Motivation, Sydney. Is there a way of understanding that?
LEATHERS: OK. First of all, I haven`t even done maybe a third of the interviews that have been thrown my way, so to say that I`ve been on every show is completely untrue. And as far as motives go, I released the information because he`s running for mayor of New York City and lying and saying that his only misconduct was in 2011.
HUTT: But --
LEATHERS: Let me finish. He says his only misconduct was in 2011. That is not true and we all know that now. I leaked the information anonymously in the beginning. I didn`t sell the photos that he sent me or our transcripts. So, if I was really looking for attention or notoriety, that`s the route I would have went.
HUTT: Well, hold on --
PINSKY: Hang on, hang on, everybody. I need to give Sam a chance. I need Sam a chance. And what you don`t know about Sydney, she`s sort of a political junkie, and so, she`s very involved in these kinds of things and that`s one of the reasons she got sucked into this. Sam, your question.
SCHACHER: OK. It`s hard to come over the question after literally Jenny said what was in my mind and Wendy and Crystal, but OK, my question to you is, did you change your strategy? Because I`ve been listening to some other interviews that you had given where you in the beginning, it was more like an experiment.
But did you come out because maybe you thought that it wasn`t a future involved? Maybe you were scorned? Is that also something that could have happened?
PINSKY: Let me refine this -- I`ll tell you what, Sam, --
SCHACHER: I`m confused, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: I am, too, but Sydney, I know what she`s asking. And Sydney, I`m going to take a break. I`m going to have more with you after this, but I want you to answer the question, which is, did you feel like you were in love with this guy and when it didn`t work out, is this now a lover scorned that you`re doing? Are you settling a score? Hold that thought. We`ll talk about it after the break.
PINSKY: Back with Jenny Hutt and the "Behavior Bureau," including our exclusive guest, Sydney Leathers. She is known, of course, for having a sexting relationship with Anthony Weiner. She has just completed a photo shoot for Vivid Entertainment, and she was going to answer Sam`s question that was asked before the break.
And Sydney, I think it`s an interesting question, because I remember when you did your stern interview, a few callers asked the same question. The men particularly thought, oh, I know this. This is a scorned lover who`s now trying to take out her retribution on this guy who she thought she had a relationship with, but it didn`t work out. What do you say to that?
LEATHERS: That`s not actually the case at all, because although we did express that we had feelings for each other, I think both of us knew that the majority of what was going on was fantasy. So, it would be delusional of me to ever say, oh, I thought I`d have a relationship with him or I thought I`d be with him. I never thought that.
PINSKY: I`m going get a call from somebody in Nevada. Her name is Kelly. Kelly, you have a question for Sydney?
KELLY, NEVADA: Yes, I want to know if celebrities releasing sex tapes inspired her in any way, like if this was her way of jumpstarting a career for herself.
LEATHERS: No, that was not a way of jumpstarting a career for myself at all.
PINSKY: But Sydney, people then see you doing the Vivid shoot and stuff and they, go, ah, see, she`s taking advantage of this now. What do you say to people who say that?
LEATHERS: Well, my whole response to that is the fact that, you know, I released everything anonymously. I didn`t want my face out there for this. My identity got leaked without my consent. So, at that point, I had no choice but to own it, come forward, be who I am, hold my head up high, and basically, not care what a group of random women who don`t know me think.
PINSKY: OK. And before -- hang on, ladies. Crystal, hold on. Before you guys continue your attack, I want to ask Sydney, when was the last time --
WRIGHT: It`s not an attack, it`s a discussion.
LEATHERS: It is an attack.
PINSKY: It probably feels uncomfortable --
WALSH: I want to say something nice!
PINSKY: OK. Good. Wendy -- but I want to know --
WRIGHT: I was going to agree with you on something.
PINSKY: Good. We`ll get both of you guys come in a second. When was your last contact, Sydney, with Mr. Weiner?
LEATHERS: Mr. Weiner contacted me April 12th. That what the last time I heard from him, and that was of this year.
PINSKY: OK, Wendy.
WALSH: OK. What I want to say is I totally understand you and I probably would have done the same thing in my 20s. This would have been so much fun.
WALSH: Listen, you`re not married, you`re childless, you`re enjoying your sexual freedom. This guy who`s already, you know, high profile and scandalous online --
WRIGHT: Oh, come on, Wendy.
WALSH: No. I would Totally have gone for it. I would have had so much fun.
PINSKY: As usual --
WRIGHT: Wait a minute.
PINSKY: Crystal, you`re next. I`ll let you say something, but as usual on this show, we learn things about our panelists. But go ahead, Crystal.
WRIGHT: Well, Wendy, first of all, Sydney, I agree with you. You didn`t have -- you weren`t married, OK? Weiner is a pig. He was married. He had a pregnant wife. He went after you. I agree with you on that. And Wendy, I don`t think it`s fair for you to attack Sydney, oh, she`s 20. You know, it`s always like we`re blasting the single women when it`s the married men --
WALSH: I`m not attacking her. I think she`s great, she`s free. She can do what she wants.
WRIGHT: And I think with Sydney what I have a problem, Sydney, with you is, first you say oh, you want to be anonymous, you leaked all this for the good of the people of New York City. I`m glad you did it, frankly, but I have a question for you. Do you think -- I think you issued ten tips to women on how to get a man, like a politician.
Do you think that that`s a great example? If you had a daughter, is that a lesson you want to teach her?
PINSKY: I`m against the clock. Sydney, go ahead answer that and then we`ve got to say --
LEATHERS: That`s so easy for me to answer.
PINSKY: Go ahead.
LEATHERS: The article is actually meant to be sarcastic and funny. It`s not seriously like this is how you get a politician. It`s a silly thing. So, it`s not a serious thing.
WALSH: I took it tongue in cheek, too.
LEATHERS: Yes. It was just meant to be silly. So, that`s all.
WRIGHT: Oh, OK.
LEATHERS: And what was the other part of the question? I`m sorry.
PINSKY: I`ve got to go, Sydney.
WRIGHT: No, no, I think you answered it.
PINSKY: I think you got it, Sydney. Sydney, thank you. Panel, thank you. We`ll be back after this.
PINSKY: And our "Last Call" goes to Jennifer Hutt.
HUTT: Hey. So, this is all I have to say. I feel like -- and correct me if I`m wrong or you disagree, but I feel like Anthony Weiner has a duty to his wife to behave appropriately. But with this girl, I feel like she then acted a little wrong and little hypocritical. That`s what I think. What do you think?
PINSKY: Got to go, guys. We`ll see you next time. "HLN After Dark" begins right now.