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NANCY GRACE

Israel Keyes: The Mind of a Serial Killer

Aired August 28, 2013 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Israel Keyes is, like many serial killers, extremely nondescript. He comes from the Washington state area, lived in Alaska with a girlfriend and her children. He did have one daughter. He was very concerned about her finding out about his crimes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The FBI may never know if Israel Keyes simply enjoyed the murder of strangers like Samantha Koenig, seen here in the Alaskan coffee shop she worked in moments before he led her away. But they revealed he may have murdered as many as 11 people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We know of 11 victims, but it`s projected that he killed many, many more, possibly into the 30s, the 40s or the 50s. He had one of the most unique styles of murder. He did it clean. Clean. He did this for years and was never caught, and this is how he did it.

He would take a flight. He would fly, say, from Alaska to the Northwest. He`d land there. Let`s just say he`d go to Chicago, rent a car and go driving. He would drive all over the Northwest. He never had a cell phone on. He would go dark, according to friends and family. He would stay gone for three, four, five weeks at a time. That would be the time that he would embark on killing sprees.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Keyes strangled Koenig in his girlfriend`s shed. He positioned her corpse to look alive and then sent a photo to her parents demanding a $30,000 ransom. It was the last arrogant and careless act of a killer police described as usually meticulous in planning.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: These are some more very interesting facts, very confusing, very cryptic facts that we know about Israel Keyes`s movements on and around the time of Koenig and the Curriers` deaths. We know that he murdered the Curriers. About seven months and 4,000 miles later, he murders Samantha Koenig in Alaska -- Vermont to Alaska.

After he murders the barista, as she is called, Samantha Koenig, he then goes on a cruise to the Caribbean to relax. So he murders the Curriers in Vermont. Seven months, 4,000 miles later, he murders the coffee girl, Samantha Koenig. He then goes on a cruise to the Caribbean, comes back to the U.S., still has Samantha Koenig`s cell phone, and he texts from her cell phone, to give the appearance she`s still alive, a ransom demand for $30,000 for her safe return.

He had her ATM card, and he was using it and using it and using it. But the minute that police would hit on the ATM card and get there, he`d be gone.

Now, here`s the kicker. He gets to Arizona. He does a bank robbery. His car tag is caught on the camera at the bank. Lufkin (ph), Texas, cops pull over a car for speeding. Inside, Israel Keyes. He has an Alaska driver`s license, guns, cash with the dye pack from the bank and a "scream" mask. Needless to say, he`s busted.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It led to his arrest and an interrogation. The scale of his decade-long rampage began to emerge, where he buried his guns and which lakes hid victims.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: It is extremely rare that a serial killer is caught on police interrogation tape, but in this case, Israel Keyes spoke to police for over 40 hours on tape.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ISRAEL KEYES, SERIAL KILLER: When the time comes, you know, that I do plead guilty to the Koenig case or whatever, whatever happens -- but whenever the next release of information to the public is, I -- you know, whatever else we`ve been working on becomes null and void if all of a sudden, there`s this flood of information about what happened in the Koenig case and I`ve pled guilty to it, and then it doesn`t matter.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And in return, I mean, for not introducing that information, we want information about the other murders.

KEYES: I understand that. I don`t -- like I say, I don`t care -- like, all the other -- anything else, it doesn`t matter that much.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) give us something to take to Vermont.

KEYES: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And when we got New York, we went to Vermont (INAUDIBLE) because of your cooperation, we got New York. And then that immediately generated this letter of intent. So -- but in order to kind of keep, I think, Vermont on board, it certainly would be nice to kind of say, All right, you know, based upon your letter, we also got (INAUDIBLE) the name of a victim...

KEYES: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... the location of a body. And you know, we already have their assurance about the Currier matter. You don`t have to worry about what`s happening with that because that`s all tied up in this. And we could do the same thing with the New York victim.

KEYES: Right. Where are they at with the -- did they find the bodies yet?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) football field where the stuff they`re going through.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. They`re making progress, but it`s just -- it`s...

KEYES: It could still be, like, a couple weeks or something?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, it definitely could.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re not going to stop.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is, you know...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tenacious.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One of the best analogies I`ve heard for it is it`s more like an archaeological dig, just kind of going through and tossing things until you find what you think you`re looking for.

KEYES: Yes. That`s a lot of trouble to go to. I almost feel guilty...

(LAUGHTER)

KEYES: ... costing the taxpayers a lot of money to find them. I could have just kept my mouth shut.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But that`s how committed the -- you know, the FBI is.

KEYES: No, I understand. They -- you know -- well, it sounds like they`ve got it. They`ve got the area. They`ve just got to find it now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re very confident. They`ve been finding things that are in the right timeframe, and you know, from residences and businesses in that immediate area. So they`re confident they`re in the right area. But as you can imagine, it`s something that they`re trying to do precisely and accurately.

KEYES: Right. And there hasn`t been -- I haven`t honestly, you know, had access to any news stories related to that. I saw the one that you show me...

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I Google it almost every day. There`s nothing -- they haven`t -- it`s kind of a dead story at this point.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: It`s interesting the way that Israel Keyes gave information in dribbles and bits. We figured out why he did that, or at least, we think we know. It`s because he wanted to always hold something back as a bargaining chip. He didn`t want to give it all up at once.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEYES: And I know you`ve got your agenda, what you need to get done and what you need to -- you have to have something to show for it, for your work on this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, that`s sort of funny, because we thought it was your agenda that was kind of driving this and wanting to move things quickly and wanting to keep the media -- you know, that`s why we`ve been working on kind of your agenda. That`s why I`m, like, Wait a second. This is what Israel wanted.

KEYES: No, you`re right. I mean, it`s -- it so far has gone according to -- according to my agenda as much as it can. The issue is there`s still a lot of time that`s going to pass before I get the things I want.

So -- if I give up all my cards right away, then that`s it, you know? I have no control over what happens a month from now or six months from now.

(LAUGHTER)

KEYES: First of all, I didn`t agree to do anything today. I already told you that. So you know, I told you I`ve got a different agenda now than when we came up with that plan because of things that happened between then and now. So you know, I -- you know, fine. I changed the rules. Shame on me. But that doesn`t really change the bottom line.

I`m not going to -- I`m going to at least find out what my options are, and that hasn`t happened yet. So you know, I understand it put a hitch in the schedule, but you know -- and that`s not the only issue right now. There`s some other -- you know, other things that we can`t talk about, and that`s an issue with me, too. And I know that, you know, there`s a lot of debate that these things aren`t connected. But to a certain extent for me and what happens to me and they are pretty closely connected, so...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, as we`ve said before, we won`t talk to you about anything related to Samantha Koenig now, but if you want to request a meeting...

KEYES: Right.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... if that`s what you guys decide, that`s totally up to you and your counsel.

KEYES: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And we`ll make ourselves available. But we won`t discuss them now.

KEYES: No, I understand that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, you said you don`t want to give up all your cards. We understand that. We haven`t been asking you to do that. All your cards (INAUDIBLE) sure, we`d love it if you just said, yes, I`m just going to tell you everything.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Authorities used all sorts of ploys and tricks on Israel Keyes to get him to talk more because we all firmly believe that there are many, many, many more murder victims, people that died at the hands of Israel Keyes, possibly dozens of victims more.

On one occasion, they told him to give them a name of a victim, have a nice lunch, have a cigar -- their treat -- and then come back and tell them some more. He declined.

Then one time, he intimated he wanted to die, that he wanted the death penalty. They said, Well, OK, if you give us some more names, it`s more likely you`ll get the death penalty. Well, that didn`t work, either.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Here`s what can happen today. You give me the name. I write it down. I don`t ask any more questions. We all have some lunch, talk about whatever you want to talk about. You have a cigar. You know, we can talk about the weather, what`s going on in Anchorage. You know, I`ll just write down the name. You have lunch. You have a cigar.

KEYES: Well, I mean, it sounds tempting, but no, I`m not going to give a name. I`m not naming names until I find out what my options are.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s fine. You do what you need to do. We`ll see if it changes next week. I mean, I think we`ll be in the same position next week where we are today. And so by not acting, we`re going towards plan B. That`s all. It`s not a threat or anything like that. It`s just saying, you know, (INAUDIBLE) path A and path B.

KEYES: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: By doing nothing, we kind of are making a choice.

KEYES: No, I know. It`s a reality.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think you can take control of the situation today and let me write down that name. That`s the control you have. Write down the name, and you`ll see that next week, nothing different has happened. It isn`t (ph) out there. It hasn`t impacted you. It`s just allowed us to say path A. (INAUDIBLE) decision that you can make today.

KEYES: I think I could probably tell you everything today, and being the case that it is, I`m sure we could probably keep stuff under wraps for, what, a year, two years, whatever. I`m not worried about that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, there you go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What`s the deal?

KEYES: I`m worried about after that. Eventually, my name is going to be attached to it. So if there`s a way that I can protect myself from that and still get you guys what you need, then I`m going to do it.

Look, I -- I don`t need to be punished for these other things that I haven`t talked to you about yet because -- yes, all these other -- they`re not going to -- they can`t prosecute a dead man. So it`s, like, what...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you think anyone`s going to really -- do you think Vermont, state of Vermont charges you for the Curriers, you think they`re really going to give you the death penalty, knowing that there`s more things out there? Do you know think they`re going to say, Oh, you know...

KEYES: Right.

(CROSSTALK)

KEYES: I know it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re in a Catch-22, my friend.

(CROSSTALK)

KEYES: I already (EXPLETIVE DELETED) up.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The middle ground I think is what you suggested at the end. You give me a name. I write it down. You have lunch and a cigar, and we all meet again whenever you want to meet again. And you`re not going to hear anything about it between now and then.

KEYES: No. No, I`m not -- I`m not giving a name (INAUDIBLE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: A particularly chilling detail of Israel Keyes and his modus operandi, method of operation, were murder kits. Keyes had created murder kits and hidden them all over the country. They would contain large sums of cash that he apparently got from bank robberies, knives, guns, weapons. That made it easier for him to travel. He would not have to travel with large sums of money or weapons, knives or guns that would be detected at airports.

It`s extremely eerie, very chilling. We believe there are dozens of these kits still out there. Two have been uncovered so far. One was in New York. One was in Alaska. And in it, of course, were weapons, cash, but also a shovel and jugs of Drano.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you find any knives in New York or in the boat, folding knives about six inches long?

KEYES: I don`t know. I think there might have been in the boat.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You told us you thought there were knives in the boat, right?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think there was (INAUDIBLE)

KEYES: There were two knives that were not in Kimberly`s house, and I don`t know where they were. I thought they were in that bucket. I thought that they were -- there may have -- I may have left one in New York. I thought there might have been one on the boat, just knives that I had from a long time ago. But I haven`t seen them in any of the pictures so (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) I can find out about the boat. I don`t -- I think there was a knife on the boat. I don`t remember a knife being in the bucket, though, in the photos.

KEYES: The knife would have been on the boat was -- well, there was a folding knife from years and years ago.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why is that knife important?

KEYES: Well, it`s a folding knife, so -- I don`t know. (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would there be blood on the knife?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: the kind that has the -- handles are actually bolted or screwed to it or something (INAUDIBLE) you can disassemble it in some manner?

KEYES: Yes (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is the -- would the blood be from a long time ago, or just the knife?

KEYES: No, the blood`s not from a long time ago, but I haven`t carried it for a while so I couldn`t remember where I left it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So there`s no knife?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No knife. There was no knife on the boat.

KEYES: There may have been -- yes, I don`t know what happened to that knife. It was a Tanto (ph), cold steel Tanto.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How big? Like, was it a...

KEYES: It had a -- it was a four-and-a-half-inch folding blade.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.

KEYES: And I think I bought it at Walmart in Port Angeles (ph).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you remember what color the handle was?

KEYES: It looks very similar to the one that I had on me when I was arrested, just a different blade style, same company and everything (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So I`m correct about that, that was the murder weapon for one of the Washington murders?

KEYES: Well, it was involved.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was involved. What about the other caches (INAUDIBLE)

KEYES: Well, the other caches aren`t related to any -- I mean, that one in New York (INAUDIBLE) some of the guns were stolen.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, that would give us something to go on if there was a cache that they could go and retrieve.

KEYES: Yes, I suppose.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That would keep -- that would keep the FBI busy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

KEYES: Well, I have to think about which ones I`m willing to part with.

(LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Many questioned why Israel Keyes actually talked at all because, again, he violated one of his cardinal rules, and that is never, ever leave a trail. And for over a decade, he did just that.

He claims he wanted to give victims` families closure. He also claims that he didn`t plan on being on this earth, being around for very much longer. That may have been a nod to the fact that he thought he could very well get the death penalty.

He also said that he didn`t want his daughter one day to type in his name and all of these articles pop up that would be generated from a trial. And just to top it off, he said he didn`t want to waste taxpayers` money.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEYES: I do want to continue to cooperate. I`m having some issues as far as -- this is somewhat of an unrealistic expectation on my part, but I was thinking there might be a way to disclose all this information to you and to the FBI and to some way ensure -- somehow ensure that we could work out some sort of agreement that, you know, I give you all the answers on these cases, and you know, families get closure, and you find as many -- as many of them as possible.

And in return for that, you know, I -- you know, I don`t plan on being around a whole lot longer, but a really a big concern to me is, you know, my kid`s going to be around. I don`t want her to, like, type my name into the computer and I have it pop up, like, you know -- you know, I already know stuff`s going to come up. I know that. But I`m just trying to minimize that at this point, I guess.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: As I had mentioned, it is extremely rare that serial killers ultimately divulge their secrets, and many people wonder how these hours of police interrogations came to be.

This is how it all went down. Israel Keyes was busted. He broke one of his own cardinal rules, and that is never to kill in your backyard. Well, he did. He couldn`t help himself. He is a killer by nature. When he murdered barista, the coffee girl, Samantha Koenig, and was finally caught for that in 2012, I believe that he began divulging tiny bits of information about other murders in order to cop a deal in exchange for not getting the death penalty.

Remember, he had crossed state lines. This became a federal crime. The feds had him. It wasn`t just up to Alaska anymore. The feds do have the death penalty. So he threw out a little line to catch his fish. That would be avoiding the federal death penalty, by giving them information on other cases. And it evolved to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think we talked about before when we were asking about federal jurisdiction, about guns.

KEYES: yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were either of those victims shot?

KEYES: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. Strangled?

KEYES: You`ll get the whole story eventually.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We just need to get parts so that we can move --

KEYES: No. The only person I ever shot was Bill Currier.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everybody else was strangled?

KEYES: Yes, or -- yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Or? I don`t want to have the wrong impression, you know. So, everybody else was strangled or was there something else?

KEYES: Well, one of the Washington things -- there was -- well, it doesn`t matter. It just -- no, it wasn`t. It wasn`t strangling. I hit somebody in the head, so.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you mean to kill them or they died as a -- was there a struggle and you hit them and they died or did you mean to kill them?

KEYES: No, I wasn`t -- wasn`t trying to kill them. I just took them out of action.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And I think we read that in one of the letters, the male/female couple.

KEYES: Yes. It`s a little -- I don`t know. Rich mentioned that they gave you all that stuff. So I should have asked him to give me copies so I`d know which ones you have.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We could go over that together and you could fill in the blanks. At some point in time.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, we know in Washington --

KEYES: I didn`t realize they were allowed to just take stuff out of my cell that I wasn`t mailing. That was a pretty big mistake on my part.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you know -- there was a couple in Washington state, a male/female couple. We read that in the note. Are those the same couple that you took to the boat and dumped in the lake, or were there others?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They went in the hole.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know--

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, they were buried.

KEYES: Yes. That was a while ago.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That was a long time ago? Was that right after the military? You told us once right after the military, after you got out of the military.

KEYES: It was before I got the boat.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you told us one time that, you know, it wasn`t long after you got out of the military that you killed somebody, and it was that sort of feeling, that you needed to do something, that it was hard to resist.

KEYES: Yes. Neagh Bay`s a boring town.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is it fair to say that we`re looking at a lot -- more around the Washington area than that? Just the two in Washington?

No, there`s a couple -- There`s a couple in Washington and then there`s two with the boat. Is that right?

KEYES: Yeah.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. So if we can`t find this knife, I guess, unfortunately, that doesn`t give us much to go on.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know we took some knives. I don`t know what all we have.

KEYES: I know you got some from Kimberly`s.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is it possible that it was at Kimberly`s?

KEYES: I don`t think so. I haven`t seen it for several years.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Could it be in a different Washington cache?

KEYES: No.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Or the Wyoming one we talked about?

KEYES: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The couple, husband and wife, do you know?

KEYES: I`m not going to talk about that stuff.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: When questioned about how he selected his murder victims, he indicated that it was at random, that he would travel to a remote place and then go to a place where he could find people, like a jogging trail or a hiking trail or a park. Some of his words, I can`t get them out of my mind. For instance, he said, you know, when you`re looking for a murder victim, it`s like when you`re hunting. You really can`t get picky. You can`t really always get exactly what you`re looking for.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are we misunderstanding you?

KEYES: The fine print in that letter is that at their directive, they can reassume control. At your directive, I mean, you -- all you have to do is say, well, Israel`s not giving us any more information, do what you`ve got to do.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you expect something different? I mean, really? Though there`s nothing else we could do.

KEYES: I don`t know what I expected, honestly.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I mean, there`s nothing else we could do. They would never sign it--

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They were never going to agree to something that says.

KEYES: I understand that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah, so --

KEYES: I know I don`t have any rights in this situation. All I have is information. So now you`re upset with me that I want to control the information.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, I`m not upset with you. I started by saying it`s more depressing, and yet there`s frustration.

KEYES: There`s going to be a lot of frustration before this is all over, but I mean, it`s already been years of frustration for a lot of people. So they`re going to have to learn to live with this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: We believe that Keyes is responsible for dozens and dozens of murders. He admitted to three. Of course, the Alaskan barista, the coffee girl, Samantha Koenig, but he also ultimately admitted to the murders of Bill and Lorrain Currier. They are a Vermont couple murdered in 2011. And this gives you insight into Israel Keyes` mind. These particular victims - - this is all he was looking for. He was looking for a home with an attached garage, with no cars in the driveway, no dogs, and no children. And as soon as he could find that, that would be his victims.

Now, coincidentally, information popped up on his computer, his home computer, stories about the murders of Bill and Lorrain Currier. Police had some inkling he might be responsible. He did confess to those murders.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEYES: But in regards to the Currier thing, I went through that letter several times, and there`s nothing -- first of all, I was pretty ticked off just thinking back about the way things played out with the whole Vermont thing in general. I remember specifically before we even had, you know -- before I gave you the location of that house or anything, I was like, I`ll give you the location of this house, but I don`t want the locals involved. I don`t want -- I didn`t see any reason to bring any -- anyone back there in that area into the fold that -- so to speak, as to what was going on. Because they didn`t have any clue anyway.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: yes.

KEYES: And the next thing I know, there`s like articles in the paper, like this big dig site going on, you know. There was a lot more discreet ways to handle it, you know. So you got your information. You went. They went right away to the lead investigator on the case, and, you know, my name got leaked out somehow way back then. And then, you know, months later, you dig and you dig. You never find anything, aside from what I gave you in the first place. And then my name`s attached to it anyway. It doesn`t get me anything I want. It doesn`t get me anything that I`m not going to get anyway. You just said Vermont is champing at the bit now. They want to see me indicted for this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In their jurisdiction.

KEYES: Whatever. I mean, the whole deal originally was that I would be charged federally with it. And now you`re ready to just hand it over to them and let them charge me. So, I don`t care. If they want to charge me, I`m not -- it`s pretty clear at this point I`m not going to get what I want. At least not -- I`m not going to get a straight answer on what I want. And, you know, I -- apparently I misunderstood the way the whole process works from the beginning, you know. So all the information that I`ve given you now is probably going to get out anyways. So, whatever.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: More compelling -- I can tell you in my experience the more compelling a case is for the jury, the more likely it is, the stronger the evidence, the more likely it is that you get a favorable verdict. So, yes, you can go before the jury in the Curriers case and say, yes, you killed these two people and, you know, that would be the evidence. But at sentencing, you may get a much more compelling case if you say, all right, there`s also, you know, eight other people that you killed. And you provide evidence on those, and, you know, by virtue of the agreement, you know, we would be circumscribed from telling the jury about that. I mean that`s one way to handle it. You know, I think the problem is you`re sort of between a rock and a hard place. You don`t want to give the jury all the information because --

KEYES: I don`t care if the jury has the information. I just didn`t want it all over the media.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All over the public?

KEYES: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That goes back to sort of the first --

KEYES: But apparently that`s not possible. So can I see that letter?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

KEYES: There`s something else in there I wanted to go over.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think the -- like I said, there are law enforcement exceptions to keep things sealed and from the public if we`re still investigating it. You know, we just need to get approval of it. That`s something we can put in that letter, that we would seek approval --

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m pretty sure in this letter all we`re asking for on anything else is who and where.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, the details.

KEYES: Yes. No, I see that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you get to -- you control that information by telling us just that.

KEYES: Right. But the problem is with some of that, it`s going to give you more than enough that if this doesn`t work out in my favor, you`re going to keep playing connect the dots and I`m going to keep getting bounced around from one jurisdiction to the next.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: It`s very difficult to catch a serial killer when they are totally unrelated to their victim. They`re not the delivery boy. They`re not the ex-boyfriend, the husband, the neighbor, the weirdo down the street or at the workplace. Totally unrelated. This guy saw the United States as one vast hunting ground.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEYES: I mean, at some point, though, I don`t -- I mean, I haven`t felt like this so far. I mean, I know you guys keep wanting information, and like I said, I don`t want to give out everything all at once. But I just don`t want us to get in a situation where, you know, we reach an impasse and you`re like, OK, we`re going to go and start doing press releases now, or whatever, and I -- and then I`m going to be all pissed off, frankly.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

KEYES: So, that`s all I ask. I`m not saying this is going to remain a compatible relationship, obviously. But, you know, if we can keep it at least an open communication.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And that`s why we`re frankly, we came over there today and you told us you weren`t in a talkative mood, and we still wanted to bring you over because we still want to keep this --

KEYES: All right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This relationship going. We`re all getting pressures from the powers that be that control us, our bosses.

KEYES: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To get information. You understand that. We all have jobs to do, and so we just want to keep the communication open with you.

KEYES: And that`s my -- I guess that`s what I`m saying. I`m not so concerned about the people in this room. I`m concerned about people putting pressure on you to get the answers. I imagine they don`t care about my agenda. They want all the answers like right now. I understand that, but I just hope it doesn`t come to that. I just hope it doesn`t come to like a standoff type situation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, this is a business deal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: And of course, there was the incident that made authorities question whether he was confessing in good faith. This is how that went down. He was in court, Israel Keyes, and he suddenly made an escape attempt. Well, of course, cops tackled him and beat him down. Somebody in the courtroom yells out, kill him! And the next day, he starts talking. They are questioning his good faith after that, of course.

But come on, please, you`re dealing with a serial killer. You think he`s talking in good faith? I question that they questioned his good faith. Of course he doesn`t have any good faith.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Um, we`re jump in here and the first thing I`ve got to tell you, Israel, as we talked about a little bit earlier, that stunt yesterday in the courtroom did not go over well.

KEYES: With who?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, with a lot of folks, not the least of which were the prosecutors. That was the delay actually getting in here, is we knew you had some legal questions, and so we reached out for him to say, hey, Israel says he`s got some questions, are you guys available to speak to him, and I couldn`t even get through. One was in court, and the other one said, you know, basically, what the [ EXPLETIVE DELETED,] after yesterday? So, they didn`t think that was too funny. So --

KEYES: Why, are they afraid I`d actually get away? That would be very embarrassing for them, I guess.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t think they were looking at it from that perspective --

KEYES: Lawyers just don`t like excitement, that`s all it is.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, it`s more of an understanding that they thought we were kind of working towards a goal in there, and they`re working on trying to get, keeping Vermont on board, doing everything --

KEYES: I would have sent them an anonymous letter.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. And so, they`re kind of wondering where we`re at with that. Where are we at with -- what`s changed since yesterday?

KEYES: More handcuffs, I don`t know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What`s changed for you, though?

KEYES: Nothing. Possibly additional charges. I don`t know.

Well, I don`t understand why -- it surprises me that they would take that personally when it really doesn`t have anything to do with them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Everyone, Labor Day coming up. We celebrate a very special group of workers, working moms. Are you a working mom? Do you know one who deserves recognition for hard work at home and at work? I want to hear from you. Send us a video explaining why you or your loved one is the best working mom in America. Five videos with the most votes win my signature handcuff necklace, earrings, t-shirts, the works. Details? Go to nancygrace.com. After you go to the website, send in those videos.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEYES: Just thinking that hypothetically, best route for me to give you all the information you need might be kind of like a last-minute kind of thing, so I`m not around for the aftermath.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Israel Keyes, a very, very mysterious person. His closest friends, his family, his girlfriend, his daughter, co-workers, neighbors, no one suspected him as being a criminal, much less a murderer and a serial rapist to boot.

END