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JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL

Secrets from Anderson Autopsy Revealed

Aired September 24, 2013 - 19:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST: Tonight, secrets from a house of horrors revealed. We are now learning teenage kidnapped victim Hannah Anderson`s mother and brother were sadistically -- and I mean sadistically -- tortured by their long-time family friend, who also abducted the high-school cheerleader. What Uncle Jim DiMaggio did to his best friend`s wife and her little boy is beyond evil. Tonight, we debate why.

Good evening. I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell coming to you live. Thanks for joining me.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This man was terribly infatuated or more with Hannah.

JENNIFER WILLIS, AUNT OF CHRISTINA ANDERSON: I just get this feeling that it`s not as cut and dry as it seems.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Chilling and graphic details about what happened to the mom and the brother of kidnap survivor Hannah Anderson.

LORI DIMAGGIO, JIM DIMAGGIO`S SISTER: You need to watch out for that one, she`s trouble.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She is a victim in every sense of the word in this horrific crime.

DIMAGGIO: And I do believe that my brother gave his life to protect her.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: James DiMaggio was a beloved family friend of the Andersons until he murdered the wife, killed her 8-year-old son, and took off with the Andersons` beautiful 16-year-old daughter Hannah, setting his own house on fire with those victims inside.

Cops launched a nationwide manhunt for DiMaggio, tracking him all the way, 1,000 miles all the way to the Idaho wilderness. About a week after the brutal murder happened, cops rescued Hannah and killed DiMaggio, but the autopsies have just been released, and the gruesome details of Christina and Ethan Anderson`s death, they`ve only stirred up more questions.

Hannah`s mother, Christina`s mom, was found with duct tape, her ankles bound with zip ties, her arms fractured, her legs broken. Her 8-year-old son`s body was so badly burned the medical examiner couldn`t even give a definitive cause of death. Shockingly brutal murders, and the Anderson family is demanding answers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIS: Beside the fact for him, he`s sick, he`s a monster, he did what he did, why did it have to happen to them? I just get this feeling that it`s not as cut and dry as it seems.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. What do you think? Why? Call me: 1-877- JVM-SAYS, 1-877-586-7297.

Tonight, in the Lion`s Den, we have a fantastic debate panel, including Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, famous forensic scientist, and Lisa Lockwood, investigator and author of "Undercover Angel."

Straight out to investigator Lisa Lockwood. Why would Jim DiMaggio torture -- not just kill -- the wife of his best friend and their little boy? But torture and kill the wife of his best friend and this little child?

LISA LOCKWOOD, INVESTIGATOR/AUTHOR: Usually situations like this are caused from rage, from anger, passion, in the moment. But when we`re looking at some of the pieces of the puzzle and the timeline regarding this, I`m not so sure that this is what happened. Because think about it. The mother said, "Go ahead and pick up my daughter from school."

So if she`s got a relationship with him that`s not in rage, why would she permit him to go and pick up her daughter?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, what`s your theory, then? What`s your theory?

LOCKWOOD: Well, a lot of people are not going to like my theory, but my theory is this. She had issues with her mother for over a year that we have evidence of. There were letters to DiMaggio saying that -- "Help me with my mom. I`m having issues," et cetera, et cetera.

We`ve got sisters saying the daughter stayed with her for three weeks, and she`s not the same person that she`s showing up on television. She`s barely remorseful about her brother a little bit, but Mom, come on, what does she say? My mom taught me to be strong. There was no tears whatsoever.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, what are you saying? Spit it out. What are you saying?

JON LEIBERMAN, HLN CONTRIBUTOR: It`s irresponsible. It`s irresponsible to suggest -- it is so irresponsible to suggest that she`s an accomplice in the murder of her mother and her brother. Not only the murder, but the torture. I mean, her mother`s throat was slit postmortem. The family dog was shot and, moreover -- let me finish -- moreover...

LOCKWOOD: How about the...

LEIBERMAN: ... she did not -- there is zero -- there is zero. Just because she had some discontent -- just because she had some discontent with her mother doesn`t mean that she tortures and kills her own mother and her brother. Not to mention separate the two bodies. I mean, the 8-year- old was found in a completely other part of the house from his mother. I mean, it`s irresponsible to...

J. WYNDAL GORDON, ATTORNEY: She may not be an accomplice, but I don`t think she`s awfully disappointed by the fact that they`re no longer with us.

And I agree with the doctor. I agree with everything he says. She could very well be an accomplice. You can`t just discount her merely because she`s a child or she`s a young person or it may be her mother. There`s a lot to this story that we just don`t know, and you know, I believe that, even if she`s not responsible, she is not all that upset about it.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, let me say this. Cops picked up a whole bunch of evidence from DiMaggio, including letters Hannah had written to him, but Hannah explained that those letters were her just asking for advice about problems she was having with her mom. Every teenager has problems with their mom.

Listen to this from "The Today Show."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HANNAH ANDERSON, KIDNAPPING SURVIVOR: The letters were from, like, a year ago when me and my mom weren`t getting along very well. Me and him would talk about how to deal with it, and I`d tell him how I felt about it, and he helped me through it. They weren`t anything bad. They were just to help me through tough times.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, here`s what could have happened. DiMaggio could have misread the signals from Hannah. Hannah`s friends said Hannah told them DiMaggio had a crush on her.

So Dr. Ramani Durvasula, clinical psychologist, is it really fair to point the finger at a 16-year-old child? This man is an adult. He is the guy who is having an obsession with her. That doesn`t mean that she shares that obsession and has an obsession with him.

DR. RAMANI DURVASULA, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: I`m sorry. Being 16 doesn`t get you off the hook, Jane.

The fact is, she could have been an accomplice. Something strange was going down in their relationship, and I think this idea that it`s irresponsible to think that she could be involved, why? How many times do we see murders committed by family members? I don`t care if they`re 16 or 60. It happens.

I do think that the relationship between the two of them was getting to be more and more inappropriate all the time. It makes me wonder if maybe her mother was starting to call them out on it.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let me say this. Ashleigh Merchant, defense attorney, law enforcement has said she is a victim and nothing but a victim. A victim, pure and simple. They`re not going to go out on a limb and say that if they have questions.

ASHLEIGH MERCHANT, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I don`t think that she`s actually capable of the type of violence and the type of actual brutal killing that was done in this situation. I don`t think she could have done that to her mother. I don`t think she was capable of doing that to her younger brother either.

But I do think that there`s a chance that she may be involved somehow or there`s more to this story that we don`t know about, some other type of illicit situation going on with Mr. DiMaggio. Something else that we may never get the answer to.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think you hit the nail on the head when you said there`s no way that a child could have a role in something this brutal. And I want to bring in Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky to analyze the autopsy report, which holds some very gruesome details.

Hannah`s mother, for example, was duct taped around her neck and mouth. Plastic zip ties were used to bind her ankles together. The medical examiner said she had at least a dozen blows to the head, probably from the crowbar found near her. She also had a slit throat, a broken arm. Both of her legs were fractured.

Hannah`s little brother didn`t fare any better. His body was so badly burned the medical examiner could not even determine the cause of death, except to say there was no soot in his airways.

So I want to go to Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, famed forensic scientist. First of all, I want to say that I don`t feel that, in any way, shape or form, this child who has suffered the horror of knowing finally learning, after she was rescued, that her mother and brother died in this way, I don`t think she has anything to do with this. And I want to say that flat out, and the cops agree with me.

But Dr. Kobi, what can we learn from these autopsy results?

DR. LAWRENCE KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST (via phone): Well, it`s clear that, because the arm had both the ulnar and radius, they were broken. The fractures to the arm, that sounds like it`s a defensive wound, and she tried to protect herself. But she was restrained. She was gagged, and as you said, the cutting of the throat, that in and of itself would have killed her, but that was a postmortem incision.

She was brutally beaten over the head at least 12 times, causing these subdural hemorrhages. And that is exactly what killed her. This was a very violent crime. It was a crime of rage and, quite frankly, he had a gun. He shot the dog. So he could very -- have very easily shot her. But that was not his intent. His intent was to bind her, restrain her, and beat her to death, literally beat her to death. Despite her attempts to save herself, it just was not enough.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So it`s a rage killing. It`s a sadistic, violent killing.

Jon Leiberman, I always say, first of all, things are multi- determined. I don`t understand why such sadism directed at the mother. But I know that he had lured this family to his home. And his home, he told friends, was going into foreclosure, and he had money problems.

So here`s a bitter man who is kind of really in a downward spiral. He was a handyman. His life is going nowhere. The Andersons, the father, had left to go do some work, I believe in Tennessee on the East Coast.

LEIBERMAN: Yes.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And he left his family in the hands of this man, saying that, well, he could take over the role of daddy or papa while this -- while he was gone, raising money for his family. And then this sicko turns around and tortures the family to death and kidnaps.

And look at him here, Jon. Look at him here with the young woman he was obsessed with and that he kidnapped. This is an emotionally stunted man who was obsessed with a 16-year-old girl. But I`m shocked, Jon, that so many people on our panel think somehow it was reciprocated. Debunk it.

LEIBERMAN: Well, I`m shocked, too. I mean, frankly, this is one of the more sickening crimes that I`ve ever seen, and I`ve seen a lot of them. This was premeditated, you know, that he knew that the rest of the family was going to be out of town. It clearly has to do with sex. It has to do with his money problems. It has to do -- you know, we won`t know the exact motive. We may never know it.

But this killing was so gruesome, so despicable that, again, to suggest that Hannah played a role, I do believe is irresponsible. Because there were -- there were no signs that she wanted to be with this man.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, here`s the truth.

LEIBERMAN: It was quite the opposite.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: These conspiracy theories are rampant on the Internet. Just Google any words to the effect, and it`s right at the top of the search engine.

And so we`re going to take a look at the timeline on the other side of the break and look at the 13 texts or communications somehow via cell that were exchanged between DiMaggio and the teenage girl, Hannah, around the time of all of this. Stay right there.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A best friend turned worst enemy.

BRETT ANDERSON, HANNAH ANDERSON`S FATHER: This gentleman that was a friend of ours for a long time has taken everything.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hundreds in desperate pursuit of one teen in grave danger.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Amber Alert was on. I seen a picture of this blond-haired girl. I said, that`s the girl we seen up on the mountain.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: DiMaggio`s cabin was ablaze, and so was the garage. Firefighters investigated.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So they went into the detached garage looking for any fire extension, and during that search they came across a body in that garage.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Later, another charred body was found in the house.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jim DiMaggio lures a family, the Andersons, to his house, murders the mother, murders her 8-year-old son and then set the house on fire and ultimately kidnaps the daughter, the beautiful teenage daughter Hannah.

Hannah and Jim DiMaggio were in contact before her disappearance. She explained to NBC`s "Today" why. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: They were texts, because he was picking me up from cheer camp, and he didn`t know the address or what -- like, where I was. So I had to tell him the address and tell him that I was going to be in the gym and not in front of the school.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Published reports suggest the following timeline. Hannah and DiMaggio reportedly exchanged 13 phone calls or texts on Saturday, August 3, the very afternoon he picks her up from cheer camp.

Four p.m. that day, both of their phones are shut off. Just after midnight, Hannah and DiMaggio are photographed together in his car at a highway checkpoint.

Cops think DiMaggio used a timer so that the fire would start after he and Hannah were long gone. It wasn`t until 8 p.m. the next day, Sunday, August 4, that the fire at DiMaggio`s home was reported and the bodies of Hannah`s mother and brother were found inside.

So she disappears with him a full day before his home exploded.

So let`s go back out to the Lion`s Den. J. Wyndal Gordon, that would mean he would have had to have committed the murders while she was at cheerleading practice?

GORDON: Yes. And one of the things that really strikes me about this case is that he really wanted her dead. Not only did he strike her multiple times in the head, but he slit her throat, which leads me to believe that she continued to breathe, even though she was unconscious. And he wanted to make sure that she was absolutely, no chance of surviving, dead. And so he slit her throat.

And then the way he did it was just so premeditated. I mean, if there ever was a term "monster" to be applied to anyone, it really applies to this guy.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Dr. Kobilinsky, famed forensic scientist, just to set to rest all of these conspiracy theories and the rumors that are rampant on the Internet, completely unsubstantiated, saying that the victim, the one authorities call the absolute victim, Hannah, was -- somehow knew about this because of an exchange of 13 communications around that time and letters she wrote to him.

Wouldn`t an autopsy reveal the exact time of death to corroborate that when he was killing them, she was not there?

KOBILINSKY: Well, I must say, it`s difficult to determine the exact cause of death because of the fact that he set this house and garage on fire. And, you know, when you have a situation like that, you can destroy important evidence. You can get a fairly good idea of time of death based on rigor mortis, liver mortis. They can do that for the dog, as well.

And in fact, they noticed that they could upset the rigor and unleash that locking of the muscles. So they -- they could have a fairly good estimate of the time. Not precise, but plus or minus a few hours, I would say.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Let`s go out to the phone lines. Michelle, Canada, your question or thought. Michelle, Canada.

CALLER: Yes. Hi, Jane. I love your show.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hi.

CALLER: I want to give a quick shout out to my grandma. I just want to know what could have happened in someone`s childhood or early life to cause them to display this type of behavior and to commit this type of crime. This is an extremely violent act and definitely not behavior of a normal person who`s functioning properly.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Dr. Ramani Durvasula, clinical psychologist, when I see these photos of this killer and this teenage girl together, what I think is emotionally stunted men who cannot relate to women their own age because they are immature, and they get obsessed with a teenage girl.

DURVASULA: I agree with the emotionally stunted part. Now in terms of what happened in his early childhood to make that happen, we don`t know. But I really think that he was really operating at her age, and he misread a lot of signals from her and kind of probably over-interpreted it and then really thought that those text messages, every messages he ever got from her, meant more.

So I just think he was one of those people who never really grew up, and when this little girl, Hannah, grew up he hung out with her.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jon Leiberman, there`s a backstory. This all happened on an anniversary that was very significant to this killer. And his father had a very similar, weird problems and ultimately, he died, correct?

LEIBERMAN: Well, yes. I mean, and that`s why I keep saying this was so premeditated because of the anniversary with the dad. Because of this, you know, inappropriate relationship that it appears that he had formed in his head with Hannah.

And that`s why when we keep saying that -- or people are saying that somehow Hannah was involved here, again, there`s absolutely no evidence of that, not to mention the huge age difference between Hannah and this man.

So clearly he was misinterpreting whatever was going on there and it, in part, it appears, led to this gruesome, gruesome killing.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I`m glad that we`re diving into this and clearing it up. Because this poor girl, the Internet has -- a lot of people are saying things like this, and we want to set the record straight. So let`s get into it. We`ve got more. We`re going to have Hannah on camera talking about her reaction to these horrors, and she`s a 16-year-old girl. Let`s remember that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He just said that he had a crush on her and then he said, "Don`t think I`m weird or creepy Uncle Jim. I just want you to know that, if you were my age, I`d date you."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my gosh. I`m so glad she`s safe, and she`s OK. She`s such a strong girl.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m so happy. I really am. I want to cry because I`m so happy, and I don`t have any tears left.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Kidnap victim Hannah Anderson`s mother and kid brother tortured by this man, killed by the FBI after a nationwide manhunt. And now is Hannah being tortured again by conspiracy theorists out there on the Internet?

There are still a lot of unanswered questions about Hannah Anderson`s disappearance and the murders of her mother and kid brother. And the Internet, again, awash with questions.

Authorities say unequivocally Hannah is not a suspect at all, period. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want to emphasize that during the law enforcement interviews with Hannah, it became very clear to us, very clear, that she is a victim in every sense of the word in this horrific crime. From the time of her abduction in Boulevard to her recovery in Idaho by the FBI`s rescue team, she was under extreme, extreme duress.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: At her rescue, some critics suggest that Hannah seemed emotionless. She was photographed laughing at her mother`s memorial.

But Hannah has lashed out at her critics, saying she did not want to go with her father`s best friend. And if she had tried to escape she would have been killed by him and that she did not even know that her mother and brother had been killed until the FBI rescued her.

Back out to the Lion`s Den. Lisa Lockwood, she`s stating that she is a victim. Police are stating that she is a victim. End of story.

LOCKWOOD: And I still, after that interview -- think about this. They let her go, she does an interview on "The Today Show." She`s weeping over her brother. She makes the comment that her mom taught her to be strong, but where was the rage toward DiMaggio? Zero rage. That`s the part that doesn`t -- that doesn`t jive with me.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think that people go into shock. Anybody who`s ever lost a loved one -- I lost my father many years ago. I didn`t sob hysterically. I went into shock initially. What is it, the five stages of grief? I think denial is right up there, Dr. Ramani.

DURVASALA: Yes, denial, anger, bargaining, acceptance, absolutely. She may have been in a state of shock, but she was incredibly composed when she was in front of the media. That`s what doesn`t add up. She didn`t look like she had just been a deer in the headlights.

And why she wasn`t really speaking strongly against DiMaggio leaves a lot of us wondering what was the nature of that relationship? There was something going on there. Was she complicit in the way we think? Probably not. But I do think that her lack of reaction is giving all of us pause, when she`s able to speak so eloquently about her brother.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, actually, Hannah has spoken out. She even broke down in tears when talking about how important her mother and brother were to her. And let`s listen to this from NBC`s "Today Show."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: He had a really big heart and...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hannah struggled as she tried to talk about Ethan but says her mother instilled a strong spirit within her that is helping her through tough times.

ANDERSON: She was strong-hearted and very tough. She knew how to handle things.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ashleigh Merchant, defense attorney.

MERCHANT: Yes, I think...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: She is emotional.

MERCHANT: And I think the problem, Jane, the reason we have so many conspiracy theories here, is because there`s so many unanswered questions.

Joe DiMaggio didn`t live long enough to be interrogated. We don`t know why. We don`t know how. We don`t know exactly who. There`s no actual real evidence telling us this case is solved. We all believe that it`s Joe DiMaggio, but we don`t know that for sure. And so I think that`s the reason that there`s so many people saying, "Well, was she involved? What exactly happened?" There`s just so many unanswered questions.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think the fact that DiMaggio`s own father pursued a 16-year-old girl and later killed himself, you know, the apple doesn`t fall far from the tree.

On the other side, this beautiful little girl missing for two years and now her mother is speaking out, and what she is saying is a shocker.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Baby Ayla, her dad was the last person to see her alive. That was nearly two years ago, and mom says all the answers could be in his house.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have exclusive new details today in the case of a toddler missing in Maine.

TRISTA REYNOLDS, MOTHER OF BABY AYLA: There was blood on Ayla`s baby doll.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her father put her to bed only to discover her missing the next morning when he called the police.

REYNOLDS: There was blood like everywhere.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: The father says he put the child to sleep at 8:00 that night and then approximately 12 hours later the child is missing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Searchers have scoured several blocks surrounding Ayla`s home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The biggest investigation in Maine`s history.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What did they show you in the basement?

REYNOLDS: A murder scene.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, a two-year-old`s mysterious disappearance takes a chilling new twist. Her mom is revealing brand new clues never before disclosed to the public. Little Ayla Reynolds vanished nearly two years ago from her dad`s home in Maine. Her mother says earlier this year police showed her photos from inside the house, the evidence she says she saw was absolutely horrifying.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REYNOLDS: Her blood was found on her left shoulder strap to her car seat in Justin`s truck. The living room sofa had a little bit of blood on it that was Ayla`s. There was blood on Ayla`s baby doll which to me kind of looked like maybe she was trying to wipe blood from her mouth or whatnot because of the way that it was on her doll. She had pink princess slippers with pom-poms on them. On the pom-poms were droplets of her blood.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Coming up, you`re going to hear that mom describe the blood stains on little Ayla`s car seat, toys, and the furniture. Mom, that woman you just heard from, was in rehab at the time of her daughter`s disappearance, the little girl was with her father.

Now Ayla`s dad told cops he put his little girl to bed at night and in the morning she disappeared from the home. He`s never been named a suspect. In fact, police have said little more than this is a missing person`s case with no suspects. What?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE MCCAUSLAND, MAINE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: Trista has a right to be frustrated. She`s Ayla`s mom. And at times during the past 21 months we`re frustrated, too, but we remember who we`re working for and we`re working for Ayla.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And you`ve got a missing toddler, right? And according to mom, a blood-filled house -- a house full of blood evidence.

Straight out to "The Lion`s Den" -- nearly two years after this little girl vanishes, why on earth isn`t there an arrest or at least a suspect named? And I`m going to start with Lisa Lockwood, investigator and author of "Undercover Angel".

LISA LOCKWOOD, INVESTIGATOR/AUTHOR, "UNDERCOVER ANGEL": I commend -- I commend Ayla`s mother. Of course she`s bringing light to it after 21 months. There`s no indication whatsoever of any new suspects in the case and why not share that? Why not bring it to the media so we can talk about it tonight so they can be re-interviewed. The case can be looked at again and to try to find out where did the police drop the ball?

Maybe they need to be inspected in what they had done and a government agency has to find out what they did. What`s missing in the puzzle? I would do exactly the same thing.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I mean apparently there`s blood everywhere according to this mother. There is blood that was visible to the naked eye. There was blood visible with luminol. There is blood here, there`s blood there, there`s blood everywhere.

J. WYNDAL GORDON, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: But no corpus delicti -- that is, no body of the crime. They don`t have a body so for that reason. I mean they are being very cautious about it. Not that I necessarily agree with this tactic but I can`t wholeheartedly disagree with it. They don`t want to arrest someone without the proper evidence to secure -- at least secure a conviction.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right. If they arrest the person and they don`t have the evidence to actually prove the case, then that person can walk free and double jeopardy can prohibit them from ever prosecuting that person and that would be tragedy.

GORDON: Once they arrest, they have to bring him to trial within a certain period of time or they violate his speedy trial rights. So there are a lot of considerations that they have to --

(CROSSTALK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: This isn`t a search like a manhunt that goes all around the nation. I mean look, there are three adults inside the home the night she vanished and she vanished about two years ago, ok. These three people are the little girl`s father Justin DiPietro, Justin`s girlfriend and Justin`s sister. Ok -- three people -- his sibling and his girlfriend. None of them face any charges in connection with this child`s disappearance, although according to the girl`s mother, there`s blood all over the place.

Now, can any of them, one of them, perhaps, be encouraged to turn against the other and shed light on this case? Let`s listen and then we`ll debate it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REYNOLDS: Was there a party going on? Were there drug there is? Did she get a hold of, you know, drugs or whatnot. But at the end of the day, no matter what happened, I still blame three people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Straight out to "The Lion`s Den", and we`re going to Ken Altshuler, radio host WGAN "Morning News". You are in Portland, Maine. You`re in the state where all of this has happened. I understand the dad is going to be in court tomorrow and it concerns alleged domestic violence against this very girlfriend who was in the house with him at the time the child disappeared?

Tell us about that because I would think that would be a natural way to put a wedge between them.

KEN ALTSHULER, RADIO HOST WGAN "MORNING NEWS" (via telephone): Well, that`s true, Jane. And Courtney Roberts, who was his former girlfriend in the house of the time, broke up with him quite some time ago. Allegedly he grabbed her and pushed her during an argument. He was in court for his arraignment back in July and evidently he`s also been charged with violating the terms of the bail.

However, police have said that this domestic violence charge is unrelated to Ayla Reynolds disappearance. We were hoping that this would cause Courtney Roberts to provide the D.A.`s office with information about Ayla`s disappearance. It hasn`t happened yet. I suspect that the attorney general`s office is going to have to offer immunity but she`s also going to have to take a lie detector test before she`s going to be granted immunity. So there`s a lot on the line here and a lot of people know a lot of information that they are not giving up.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And again, we`re not suggesting that she had anything to do with this. There are no suspects. And she would be invited on our show any time to talk as would Justin.

Police say Justin, the dad, is not a suspect but of course he`s one of the last people if not the last person to see his daughter. Listen to what he said just days after his child vanished and followed by some analysis from a body language expert.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JUSTIN DIPIETRO, FATHER OF AYLA: I`m not here to answer any questions. I`m just here to show my support for the community that is supporting Ayla.

PATTI WOOD, BODY LANGUAGE EXPERT: How bizarre. Did you notice his mouth, notice how he pressed his lips together in what I call the "envelope" and then licked his lips, what I call a "tongue eraser". He did not want to respond to that question. He says he`s here to support his community.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He should be there to find his child.

WOOD: I know. It`s so odd. In content analysis, you look at every single statement. He had a great opportunity there to say, "I`m here to find my child. I`m here to find my daughter."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Dr. Ramani, it`s so easy to sit here and analyze but that doesn`t make a case. You know, that`s not evidence. That`s sort of mumbo jumbo in a legal sense.

DR. DURVASULA RAMANI, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Yes, legally it doesn`t hold water but the fact is you look at all these tiny threads. When you`ve got nothing, you look at all of this together and see if you have to hold on to.

She raises an interesting point. He never said he wanted to find his daughter. In fact, if he thought that she`s still alive and nothing happened to her he would say, I want to find my daughter. That omission to me does speak volumes. It`s not enough to hang a case on.

(CROSSTALK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, we don`t know for sure but I have to say with all the blood that the mother of this missing child -- look at that beautiful face, look at that angel. Who could have hurt her or could it have been an accident and then a cover-up? Look at that innocent face. Imagine the torture that mom is going through as she seeks answers.

We`ll keep you posted.

Next, a basketball star`s father declaring war on the Kardashians. And he says they are to blame for his superstar son`s huge problems.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KHLOE KARDASHIAN, REALITY TV STAR: I married him 30 days to the day that I met him.

We`re so honest and we signed up doing this show and we wanted to let you guys in and us not really hide anything from you guys.

LAMAR ODOM, NBA PLAYER: Do whatever it takes to win basketball games, to erase the last season I had. I wasn`t myself.

KARDASHIAN: He just said he wanted to make sure that we lasted forever and that we got married before kind of all of the chaos happened but I think we caused more chaos.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He has a tragic background with an addicted father.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, shocking and I`ve got to say nasty claims by NBA superstar Lamar Odom`s dad. Joe Odom speaking out since reports surfaced of his son`s alleged drug abuse blaming reality starlet Khloe Kardashian for ruining Lamar`s life.

Lamar`s dad told RadarOnline he is better off without wife, Khloe, calling her controlling, toxic and the worst mistake he`s ever made. Lamar married Khloe in 2009 after only 30 days together. That`s right -- a month of dating, prenuptial.

But his dad didn`t stop there. He also ripped into the entire Kardashian clan calling momager, Kris Jenner, "evil" -- not my words, his. And he claims Lamar has been cursed ever since he married into the reality TV family.

Now we reached out to Khloe Kardashian`s rep who told us, "no comment". Lamar`s dad Joe has reportedly battled a drug addiction himself and here he is on the couple`s e-reality show "Khloe & Lamar". Check it out.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE ODOM, FATHER OF LAMAR ODOM: Thank you.

KARDASHIAN: Lamar wanted me to give you this jacket.

J. ODOM: Really.

KARDASHIAN: Yes.

J. ODOM: Man.

KARDASHIAN: Do you like it?

J. ODOM: Yes, ma`am.

KARDASHIAN: Yes.

J. ODOM: It`s beautiful. You just made my day.

KARDASHIAN: Good. How do you like the bike?

J. ODOM: Beautiful. Beautiful.

KARDASHIAN: Isn`t it cool?

J. ODOM: You know, you guys be looking out for me. I appreciate everything you do for me, Khloe, on the real side.

KARDASHIAN: We love you, Joe. Lamar was excited about the bike.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We love you, Joe. Not anymore.

Straight out to RadarOnline senior reporter Alexis Tereszcuk -- wow. This is war between the Odoms and the Kardashians like the Hatfield & McCoys.

ALEXIS TERESZCUK, SENIOR REPORTER, RADARONLINE: It absolutely is. The modern day version here in Hollywood because it really is -- the Kardashians are Hollywoods number one family -- those reality television stars.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Right there.

TERESZCUK: But Joe is so mad. He was defending his son --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Sorry.

TERESZCUK: It`s true.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s right too that they`re Hollywood`s number one family. But continue on. Continue on.

TERESZCUK: He is saying that his son has no responsibility in this situation whatsoever and that it is all Khloe and her family and especially her momager, Kris Jenner. He called her the "b" word -- I don`t know if I can say it.

But he said that she`s evil and he said in fact that his son did not do drugs before Khloe and that she is probably the reason that he`s doing them now. He says maybe he took a couple of sleeping pills but nothing as to what he`s accused of now. And he says he thinks that it`s probably, possibly -- those are his words -- their fault that he`s now in the trouble that he is in.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Did he address his own purported alleged history of addiction? Because usually it`s that the chardonnay, a grape doesn`t fall far from the chardonnay tree, if you know what I mean.

TERESZCUK: He did say, "Oh, I had some problems" but I don`t he`s ever going to admit the problems that he really, truly has had. And he was an addict for years but he says he`s been sober for over a decade.

Lamar, though, has had a really troubled life as well. His child died of SIDS quite a few years ago. He has an older daughter who`s been struggling with some issues lately. I believe his transfers from all of the basketball teams he played on were a big factor in all the trouble that he`s been having. But Joe is saying that none of that matters and it is all Khloe and her family -- those are the only reasons that he`s in trouble now.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Sounds like he`s seeking revenge. Khloe and Lamar seemed to have a fairytale romance, at least at the start. Here`s what I think is the key issue here. They tied the knot after less than a month of dating. What else do you need to say?

Check this out from "Keeping Up with the Kardashians".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARDASHIAN: I just want him to know I love the flowers and I love everything but no matter what I`m always going to like be there for him and I understand. I love him no matter what; he doesn`t have to buy me things because like I know he loves me and I like, I love him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And now she`s going by her maiden name, removed her husband`s last name from her Twitter page. Gee, Ashleigh Merchant, I mean reality television is also a curse. I mean we`ve seen it. There is even the reality TV curse.

ASHLEIGH MERCHANT, ATTORNEY: Right. But the fact is, it sounds like he was doing drugs before all this happened. The fact that the dad is now blaming her, that`s really unfortunate. They probably did get married a little bit too early and that`s probably part of their problem.

But I think that the apple doesn`t fall too far from the tree. And I think that drug abuse probably runs in the family and so if he`s plagued with it as well, I think it`s unfair to blame her.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And it`s a big if because we`ve heard all sorts --

MERCHANT: Big.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: -- of rumors and reports from various publications, we have never been able to confirm whether he went into rehab, whether he didn`t go into rehab; whether he`s really fighting with his managers. Are they really trying to get him into rehab? We don`t know. But we`re going to talk a little bit about the impact of reality TV on his life right on the other side of the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Time for Pet of the Day. Send your pet pics to hlntv.com/jane. Rufus -- where are you? You seem to be on a wilderness tour? But Chloe says "I`m sticking close to home because just got a new do. How do you like it?" And how do you do, Brody and Ziggy -- what a fabulous pair. And speaking of fabulous pairs, Daisy Duke and Ladybug -- they say "We`re a team. We go together. We hang."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I got to tell you, it`s getting ugly. Lamar Odom`s father is on the war path against the entire Kardashian clan. They say that they`re destroying his son, and he even brings up Kim Kardashian`s infamous sex tape calling her quote, "a porn star". Others say, blame reality television. Watch this clip from their hit show on E! -- Lamar and Khloe arguing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KRIS JENNER: You`re going against every single thing that I believe in. You grow up and you get married and you have babies -- a tradition.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED) your tradition. I`m happy, Mason`s happy. Scott`s happy.

JENNER: I don`t see what the problem is. Why you don`t want to get married?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`ll do it when I want to do it in my time.

I`ve never even said that I`m for sure having a baby, trying to have a baby. My mom takes one little bit of information and just blows it out of proportion.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`ve got to say, J. Wyndal Gordon, to live your life on reality TV, and I think Lamar, who`s smart to stay out of that particular clip, and here`s his dad who`s on the war path against the Kardashians. I mean, reality TV there is a curse for good reason. How can you have intimacy when the world is watching?

GORDON: You can`t. And once you sign up, you sign on to put yourself in a fishbowl virtually for the rest of your life. If you have a popular hit series, you know, the dividends are great. I mean it pays well. But at the end of the day, you lose a lot of yourself in that situation.

But I said from the very beginning, the Kardashians were going to be blamed for the downfall of Lamar Odom. So this -- you know, other people agree.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, let`s go to the phone lines. Jan, Georgia -- your question or thought? Jan?

JAN, GEORGIA (via telephone): Well, my thought is this. I`m in Georgia, but I was in California all my life. I`ve watched him since he was a Clipper. Let me tell you something. You can see the health of that man, until he got later up into his relationship with this family. You can`t be a crack head for two years and your wife not know it. I was married to a musician who was one.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Allegedly.

JAN: There is absolutely no way. Crack and meth is a physical drug. You will know if someone is smoking it. So, this right here, this is smells of -- I wanted to leave Khloe-type thing and Kris is a mogul when it comes to any type of attention. There`s no way --

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right Jan. You are passionate about this. We have to say we don`t have any confirmation of drug abuse. There are reports and allegations, and of course, Lamar or his dad, are invited on our show anytime. Stay right there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: When it comes to Lamar Odom`s dad war against the Kardashians, all I can say is -- Lamar, you got married to a reality TV star after 30 days, not a good idea. I`m really sorry you`re having all the problems you`re having and I hope you get help for whatever problem you may be having, which we can`t confirm. But don`t get married after 30 days.

Nancy Grace is next.

END