Return to Transcripts main page
U.S. Government Shutdown Drags On; OPCW Says Syria Cooperating With Weapons Inspectors; Investigation Heightens Over 2018, 2022 World Cup Bidding Process; Protests Expected Ahead of Mohamed Morsy's Trial
Aired October 9, 2013 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KRISTIE LU STOUT, HOST: I'm Kristie Lu Stout in Hong Kong. And welcome to News Stream where news and technology meet.
Now is Syria's government living up to a pledge to rid the nation of chemical weapons? We'll tell you what international inspectors are saying.
Dying to save lives: why Pakistan's polio workers are being targeted.
And it was an email service so secure that NSA leaker Edward Snowden used it. New details about Lavabit's fight with the U.S. government.
A difficult process with significant challenges, that is how the head of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons describes the mission in Syria. Now Ahmet Uzumcu spoke just a short time ago. And he sounded fairly optimistic about accomplishing the task of eliminating Syria's chemical weapons. He says progress is already being made.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AHMET UZUMCU, OPCW DIRECTOR-GENERAL: In fact, the first inspection took place on Monday -- Sunday and Monday 6th and 7th. And some equipment was already destroyed. And this work continues. Another inspection is being carried out today.
And an additional team of 12 experts, in fact, is being deployed to Damascus.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LU STOUT: Now the director-general also said that Syrian authorities have been cooperative.
And Mohammed Jamjoom is monitoring the story from Beirut, Lebanon. He joins us now.
Mohammed, the OPCW says that some chemical weapons in Syria have already been destroyed. Tell us more about what was revealed within the last 30 minutes.
MOHAMMED JAMJOOM, CNN INTERNATIOANAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, that's right, Kristie. Not a lot of detail as far as what exactly was destroyed presented as Mr. Uzumcu as of yet. There is a technical briefing that's been underway. We're waiting to hear a bit more from that.
Mr. Uzumcu said that so far they seemed pleased with the results. And as far as Syria's compliance with this very difficult, very laborious process.
Now we know that the inspectors that are there, this expert team that right now they're involved in a phase of destroying the chemical weaponry that involves trying to dismantle weapons facilities, trying to destroy mixing and filling equipment as well as missile warheads and aerial bombs.
We didn't get a lot of detail as to what type of equipment exactly up until now had been destroyed, but Mr. Uzumcu said that so far the inspectors had visited at least one site, that they were at another site today, that they would be going to probably 20 more chemical weapons facilities in the coming days, although he failed to specify what exactly that timeline would be.
One of the key things he said was that although there were tight timelines involved when it came to the compliance that the organization needed to be seeing from the Syrians. They believed that they could be met and that they were pleased thus far with the type of cooperation they've been getting from the Syrian government.
That being said, though, as of now we're told that there are at least 19 members of the OPCW on site in Syria, that they arrived last week in Damascus and that their expecting at least 12 more in the coming days -- Kristie.
LU STOUT; Yeah. And also the question is will the Syrian government continue to be cooperative? I mean, the OPCW head says that 20 more sites in Syria need to be visited. So will the regime be fully transparent and offer up exactly where those sites are?
JAMJOOM: That's a key question right now, Kristie. It's a very important question. You know, although many international officials have thus far said that the Syrian government should be praised for their compliance up until now, for their cooperation, will that continue?
Now you heard today Mr. Uzumcu, the director-general of the OPCW, say that at least 20 more sites would need to be visited in the coming days. That's a lot of ground to cover.
But we've heard in the past that there could be as many as 50 sites that might need to be visited in the coming months. And also one of the questions that was asked after he gave his remarks just a short while ago was whether or not the OPCW intended to try to visit sites that they suspected of being chemical weapons facilities in Syria, but that had not been declared as chemical weapons facilities by the Syrian government.
And Mr. Uzumcu did not elaborate on that point. He mainly tried to talk about what they had done thus far. And that they seem to be happy with the results thus far.
But there is a lot of skepticism, especially in this region, from people who don't believe that the Syrian government is sincere in actually seeing this process be carried through until the end -- Kristie.
LU STOUT: Yeah. And what if the teams of inspectors have to travel through rebel held areas to get to these sites? Ban Ki-moon, we heard him overnight saying that the inspectors face a very dangerous environment. What are they up against? And do they have any security guarantees from either side?
JAMJOOM: Yeah. Ban Ki-moon has stated on several occasions just how dangerous this mission is. In his 10 page letter that he sent to the UN security council the other night, he stated that this was unprecedented type of mission that no organization, no body has every been tasked with trying to destroy a chemical weapons arsenal this large, which could exceed 1,000 metric tons, we're told, at a time when a civil war was also raging.
Today we heard from Mr. Uzumcu, the director-general of OPCW, echoing those remarks very much saying of paramount importance to the OPCW and the UN is the safety and security of their team members there on the ground.
Can this actually be guaranteed? Well, the Syrian government seems to think so. But you're talking about an extremely volatile situation, a civil war that has already killed over 100,000 people just by the use of conventional weapons that's been raging for close to three years now.
This is going to be a very difficult task. Can the Syrian government actually secure this team when the rebels are in certain areas? They're still fighting with the Syrian regime forces. That's a very important question. And really it's yet to be fully addressed -- Kristie.
LU STOUT: That's right, to verify and to destroy a chemical arsenal hat big in the middle of a war zone no less, very daunting task for them.
Mohammed Jamjoom reporting for us, thank you.
Now let's turn now to the bitter fight over finances in Washington. It is day nine of the partial U.S. government shutdown. Both sides remain far apart, leaving greater concern the debt ceiling deadline is fast approaching. And if congress does not raise the borrowing limit by next Thursday, the U.S. could soon begin to default on its debts.
Now President Barack Obama says that would damage America's reputation around the world.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Whenever we do these things, it hurts our credibility around the world. It makes it look like we don't have our act together. And that's not something we should welcome. The greatest nation on Earth shouldn't have to get permission from a few irresponsible members of congress every couple of months just to keep our government open or to prevent an economic catastrophe.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LU STOUT: U.S. President Barack Obama there clearly frustrated by the impasse in Washington.
Now let's go live to CNN's Brianna Keilar -- Brianna.
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Kristie, well I will tell you the stalemate does continue, but there is perhaps a small glimmer of hope that we may be able to report this morning. Not a breakthrough, but an opening, perhaps, to a short-term way to increase the debt ceiling and get the U.S. government back up and running.
KEILAR: Day nine, the government shutdown is getting real. For families of troops killed in combat, they will not get automatic death benefits during the shutdown -- $100,000 to help cover funeral costs and travel to Dover Air Force Base to witness the dignified transfer of their loved ones remains. In North Carolina, food assistance for poor women and children cut off.
CROWD: Furlough Congress!
KEILAR: And 27,000 furloughed government workers have signed up for unemployment as they go without pay. Just eight days until the United States could default, President Obama phoned House Speaker John Boehner, both sides indicating the divide is as deep as ever.
OBAMA: We have got to stop repeating this pattern.
KEILAR: But later President Obama appeared in the White House briefing room, opening the door to negotiations if Republicans agree to a short-term solution to re-open the government and increase the debt ceiling.
OBAMA: If there's a way to solve this, it has to include reopening the government and saying America is not going to default, we're going to pay our bills.
KEILAR: How long might a short-term measure last? Four to six weeks one GOP source tells CNN. Republicans may agree if the president promises to negotiate. But it's far from a breakthrough. Without some sort of concession like a cut in spending, a stop gap measure may not clear the House.
REP. JOHN BOEHNER, (R) OHIO: The long and short of it is there will be a negotiation here. We can't raise the debt ceiling without doing something about what's driving us to borrow more money and to live beyond our means.
KEILAR: The House voted Tuesday to create a Congressional committee on government spending and the debt limit as well as pay federal employees currently working without pay. But the Obama administration threatened vetoes. A stalemate still, and the clock is ticking louder and louder.
KEILAR: Now if the debt ceiling is breached, not only is the U.S.'s credit really at risk, credit standing, but there are also some very real world impacts for millions and millions of Americans, Kristie.
On November 1, if the debt ceiling is not raised, there are tens of billions of dollars in payments that are set to go out to senior citizens - - you have social security payments, disability payments, Medicare payments, so those health payments to seniors as well as paying active duty military. So that is something certainly that so many Americans would feel.
LU STOUT: Yeah, still no breakthrough. And that is taking its toll on so many Americans. Brianna Keilar reporting live for us. Thank you, Brianna.
KEILAR: Well, if you wanted to know more about the debt ceiling, but were too embarrassed to ask, CNN Money has got you covered. We've got an easy visual explainer. It's called what's up with the debt ceiling. And it explains the federal borrowing limit.
You can find it at CNN Money.com.
Now starting tonight on Quest Means Business, Richard Quest is live in Washington where world leaders are gathered for the IMF and World Bank meetings.
And we have a sit down interview with the World Bank president Jim Yong Kim. You can see that interview live online at CNN.com/international in less than an hour from now.
And then you can get even more perspective from Richard tonight on Quest Means Business live from Washington right here on CNN.
Now, you're watching News Stream. And still ahead this hour renewed turmoil in Egypt. We'll tell you why the U.S. looks set to cut some military aid to the country. That and more in a live report from Cairo.
Also ahead, the eradication of polio, surely a goal that anyone can support. So why are health workers being targeted by extremists in Pakistan?
And NSA leaker Edward Snowden, he used the email service Lavabit. And now we're learning more about why that provider closed shop earlier this year.
LU STOUT: Welcome back. You're watching News Stream. And let's look at a visual version of all the stories we've got in the show today. Now we started with a report on the progress of dismantling Syria's chemical weapons. And a little bit later we'll show you the email service that NSA leaker Edward Snowden used. But now, let's turn to Egypt.
Now the country's recent renewed violence may push the United States to suspend some military aid. Now the White House says that it will announce its decision in the coming days, but officials insist that the U.S. will not completely cut off military assistance.
Now remember, Washington has already made some moves to withhold aid after the military ousted President Mohamed Morsy in July and launched a crackdown on his supporters.
Now meanwhile, state media are reporting that Mohamed Morsy will stand trial next month on charges of committing and inciting violence.
Now Ian Lee joins me live from Cairo with more. And Ian, first, let's talk about the reaction there in Cairo to that U.S. aid decision.
IAN LEE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kristie, there hasn't been any official reaction from the Egyptian government, although it's likely to be a negative reaction to this and strain already delicate ties between Cairo and Washington.
Right now, Egypt is in the midst of fighting a low level insurgency so any aid that's seen cut from the military will be seen in a poor light.
And if you also look on the other side, the Brotherhood side, that their allies goes who are protesting against this interim government, it's not likely to please them either. They want more harsher action from the United States government to pressure the Egyptian government to reinstate the ousted president.
So this move isn't likely to please many people.
LU STOUT: All right. Now separately, we learn that Mohammed Morsy will stand trial in November. Can you tell us more about that, remind us the charges he's facing.
LEE: Well, he's being charged with inciting violence. And this stems from incidents in Cairo back in February where people were protesting his government, there was violent clashes between his supporters and those protesters, hundreds of people were injured in that clash. And that really -- that's what they're cheering him on. And there are 14 other members of the Muslim Brotherhood who will also be charged on that day.
And this will be a really significant day for Egypt. The Brotherhood has in the past on these sorts of occasions announced massive demonstrations, likely to see those again during this trial.
LU STOUT: That's right. We saw that significant flare-up of violence over the weekend. And since Mr. Morsy was ousted in July, hundreds of people have died. Is it very likely that we will see more violence ahead of this trial in November?
LEE: It's very likely, Kristie.
And really the thing, when you look at it here, is neither side is willing to negotiate and neither side is willing to make any sort of compromise. The EU has come here, tried to strike some sort of deal between the Brotherhood. Their allies in the interim government, it just hasn't happened.
And really, until that does happen, you're likely to see these protests that occur on a fairly regular basis. And you will also have the military saying that this is a red line. They will not accept these protests. There's a state of emergency right now in Egypt where the military can make these sorts of arrests. And really we're expecting to continue to see this as there isn't any side that really wants to come together and talk and try to solve this through political means.
LU STOUT: That's right, indeed. Given the deep, deep divisions there inside Egypt.
Ian Lee reporting live from Cairo for us, thank you.
Now as the Asia-Pacific economic cooperation summit came to a close in Bali, Indonesia, world leaders expressed concern about the global economy and a potential slowdown in growth. Now China's increasing dominance in the region was also in the spotlight at APEC. Anna Coren reports from Bali.
ANNA COREN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Dressed in endec (ph) shirts made from traditional Balinese cloth, the leaders and representatives of APEC's 21 countries gathered for the annual family photo.
Standing in the back row and hardly visible, U.S. Secretary of States John Kerry. America's number one diplomat had to step in after President Barack Obama canceled his trip to Bali to deal with the government shutdown back home.
Secretary Kerry was more prominent on the final day of the summit. But President Obama's absence was a major disappointment to many delegations. And it gave China's President Xi Jinping the chance to display his country's growing influence across the region.
The final communique expressed concern about weak global growth, concluding risks remain tilted to the downside. Global trade is weakening. And the economic outlook suggests growth is likely to be slower and less balance than desired.
Indonesian president and summit host Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono heralded the summit a success saying APEC countries are committed to achieving a free and open trade bloc in the Asia-Pacific by 2020 and addressing environmental challenges.
SUSILO BAMBANG YUDHOYONO, INDONESIAN PRESIDENT: In view of the scarcity of our planet resources, we agreed to cooperate in enhancing regional food, energy and water security. This effort is also aimed at responding to the challenge of population growth and the adverse impact of climate change.
COREN: But it was the TransPacific partnership promoted by the U.S. and Barack Obama that generated the most discussion. This trade and investment zone would include 12 countries stretching from Vietnam to Japan to Chile, covering a third of the world trade and 40 percent of the global economy.
Those countries say progress was made towards a deal by the year's end. But several also made it clear that there is much more work to be done.
As the fastest growing region in the world, the overarching message to come out of this year's APEC summit was a resilient Asia-Pacific, the engine of global growth.
But the reality is, it's China that will be driving this engine as it prepares to host APEC next year.
Anna Coren, CNN, Bali, Indonesia.
LU STOUT: You're watching News Stream. And just ahead, they are trying to save lives, but health workers administering polio vaccines are being attacked in Pakistan. We'll have a report coming up.
LU STOUT: Coming to you live from Hong Kong. You're back watching News Stream.
Now the human cost of war extends beyond the lives lost on the battlefield. Many soldiers sustained injuries that will impact them for the rest of their lives. And on this week's CNN Heroes, meet Michael Conklin. Now his son was wounded in war and he decided to do something to help other wounded warriors who were not getting the support they needed or deserved. Take a look.
MICHAEL CONKLIN, COMMUNITY CRUSADER: The first trip to Walter Reed was one of my toughest trips when I saw the amount of wounded it was shocking.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Both my legs are amputated above the knee.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I lost my right eye. I have a titanium rod in my leg.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was on my fifth deployment when I got my traumatic brain injury.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I gave up the idea of having a wife and even a family.
CONKLIN: I wanted to take them all home.
I'm Mike Conklin. My organization helps our severely wounded members of the armed forces reach their full potential.
My oldest son was wounded in Tikrit, Iraq. His whole group was wounded.
We have a very tight, cohesive family. And not all of them do. Some of them don't have anybody to come home to. We just can't forget them.
When Ryan moved into this unit, we did some things that are very simple. We put in these polls to assist him.
Each case is different. Some will need service dogs, housing assistance, mentors, getting an education.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think those are World War II vets over there.
CONKLIN: It's a comprehensive package.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're doing a little bit of their maintenance contract.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He talked to me every day. He put me back to work. He help set up where I wanted to go.
Today, I'm a husband, a father, I have my own company now.
CONKLIN: We don't call this a charity. We really look it as an investment.
These were at one time children who grew up on our baseball fields, went to our grade schools and then left our community to serve us. And eventually they come back. It's a full circle of service.
LU STOUT: Such a powerful story there.
Now all year, we have introduced you to ordinary people who are making extraordinary changes to their communities. And next Thursday, CNN will announce the top 10 heroes of 2013. And you'll be able to place your vote online for the CNN Hero of the Year.
Now you're watching News Stream. And still ahead, World Cup controversy. FIFA begins a probe into the awarding of tournaments to Qatar and Russia.
And what happened to NSA leader Edward Snowden's email provider? We'll have the latest on Lavabit's legal battle.
LU STOUT: I'm Kristie Lu Stout in Hong Kong. You're watching News Stream. And these are your world headlines.
Now the head of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons says Syrian authorities have been quite cooperative with international inspectors. Speaking just a short time ago he said progress is already being made to eliminate Syria's chemical stockpile. He also warned that it is a difficult process with significant challenges.
Now U.S. officials have told CNN that some military assistance to Cairo will be cut. Now one official says that's because of an accumulation of events, including recent violence in which protesters were killed.
Also, Egypt's state news agency says ousted Egyptian President Mohamed Morsy will stand trial in November on charges of committing and inciting violence.
Now at least seven people have been killed and dozens injured after a fire broke out at a garment factory near Dhaka, Bangladesh. Officials say Tuesday's blaze began in the knitting unit and later spread to three other buildings in the compound. Now the cause of the fire is not yet known.
A high court in China has agreed to hear an appeal from Bo Xilai, a former senior official in the Communist Party. He was convicted last month of bribery, embezzlement and abuse of power and sentenced to life in prison.
Now the fight to eradicate polio is becoming more dangerous than ever in Pakistan. It's one of only a handful of countries in the world where polio has not been wiped out. But extremists are targeting people who give the vaccinations.
Now Saima Mohsin has more from Karachi, Pakistan.
SAIMA MOHSIN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Protecting children from polio with a few simple drops of vaccine has become a dangerous task not for the children, but for people like Gulnaz (ph) who works in one of the most violent areas of Karachi, Pakistan's largest city. It's so dangerous, we can't use her full name.
Last year, he niece and sister-in-law, also polio workers, were gunned down by armed boys on motorcycles. UNICEF says it was simply for giving young children this vital vaccination.
But that hasn't stopped her.
GULNAZ, POLIO WORKER (through translator): Everybody in my family was suffering from shock. Some of them tried to stop me telling me not to do this job anymore, because two coffins leaving one house leaves a mark.
MOHSIN: Anti-polio campaigns have been targeted ever since U.S. intelligence used a fake vaccination program to help in its hunt for al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden in 2011. That wasn't a polio campaign, but the damage was done.
Since July 2012, 22 polio workers and escorting police have been killed.
I ask Gulnaz if she's concerned about working in the same area after so many attacks, including the ones against her family.
GULNAZ (through translator): After this tragedy, I'm not scared at all. In fact, I feel even stronger and more determined. Every woman in this country who is doing this job is praying for me. When I'm working in the field I'm with my partner, but I also sense that my niece and sister- in-law who were killed are walking along side me.
MOHSIN: We couldn't film Gunlaz and Shazia (ph) in the area they usually work in for their safety and for our own, because of the threat there they have to be escorted by paramilitary soldiers, sealing off the area and guarding a street at each end simply so that young children can be given these crucial drops that most parents and children around the world can get at their local doctor's surgery.
Rasman (ph) was infected with polio as a child, so he ensured his children took the drops. But after the bin Laden raid, he decided not to give them to his fourth child, 3-year-old Musharraf (ph) who became case number one for 2013.
So far this year, 28 polio cases have been detected in Pakistan.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): I'm not stupid or illiterate, I made sure my other children got the drops. But I was very angry and weary of aid workers, because if they are cooperating with spy agencies then it's better to keep away from them. I am sad my youngest suffered, but I don't regret my decision.
MOHSIN: Rasman (ph) only changed his mind after the government released a booklet with a series of religious edicts from Muslim scholars telling parents polio drops are safe.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): I am appealing to my fellow Pashtun society to give their kids polio drops.
MOHSIN: It's a message health care workers hope others will hear. It could make their job safer. And for the children, it could save them from a lifetime of avoidable disability.
Saima Mohsin, CNN, Karachi, Pakistan.
LU STOUT: Incredible what polio workers are up against in Pakistan.
Now football's world governing body FIFA is investigating the bidding process for the 2018 and 2022 World Cups. And this man here is tasked with kicking off that investigation.
Now Michael Garcia, the head of FIFA's ethics committee, will begin the probe in London.
Now both Russia and Qatar were picked as hosts back in December 2010. and that decision has been dogged by allegations of wrongdoing.
Amanda Davies is live from London with more. Amanada, how long will this investigation go on for?
AMANDA DAVIES, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kristie, Michael Garcia has been keen to point out that this isn't actually a new investigation it's just a case of a stepping up of the process that's been going on for some time by FIFA, by their independent governance committee.
We understand that this week will be the first of his meetings with all 11 of the countries that were involved in the bidding process for those two World Cups that you mentioned for 2018 and 2022, that's 11 nations with nine bids in total.
But he said from very early on that this is a long process. And we're not going to get any report, really, until March or April next year in 2014.
What we understand, though, is that Michael Garcia is in London this week because of a big football conference called Leaders in Football that's taking place at Chelsea's grand Stamford Bridge. A lot of the movers and shakers, football people themselves, the politicians, marketing people, they all converge for a two day conference.
And we understand that Michael Garcia will be there speaking to the former chairman of the football association, the man who lead England's 2018, ultimately failed 2018 bid, for the World Cup Lord David Triesman. They've said that the remit for this investigation, this commission is very clear. They've said they are not in the business of investigating the venue or timing of the World Cups to be played in 2018 and 2022. Instead, the quote they're using is they are investigating potential violations of the FIFA code of ethics by football officials.
Remember, there have been so many stories, Kristie, over the last few years since the vote took place in December 2010, it was the first time two World Cups were voted for on the same day at the same meeting. There were stories of vote deals that were taking place, of bribery and corruption of the officials.
Indeed, the man who had been head of the independent governance committee Mark Pierce (ph) told me just last week he had serious procedural concerns about the way Qatar 2022 was awarded.
LU STOUT: And as we have this investigation into the bidding process, we have this separate consultation taking place about World Cup timing into whether the World Cup in Qatar can be moved to a different time of the year from summer to winter. Any update on that process?
DAVIES: Well, there was that big meeting that most recent meeting of the FIFA executive committee in Zurich at the end of last week wasn't there. And it was announced on Friday that there is a consultation that will be taking place, that Sepp Blatter was very keen to point out there that he doesn't want to overshadow the 2014 World Cup, next year's World Cup in Brazil. So we will get no update on that until after next year's World Cup.
But interestingly, another one of the delegates who is here in London this week is Harold May Nichols. And he was the former president of the Chilean football association who was heading up the FIFA evaluation commission for that World Cup bidding process for 2018 and 2022. He and his team were the people responsible for visiting all the different bidding nations and compiling the reports, the pros and cons of holding the games there.
And he now isn't involved any longer, but he's put forward, and is presenting to leaders in football, what he sees as the possible time line in terms of moving that Qatar World Cup from the summer to the winter.
Lot's of different dates have been talked about, but he is suggesting that the World Cup is moved to the January/February of 2022. He's actually pointed specifically to the date January 6 to February 6. He says that would best suit the football calendar.
But the problem with this story, Kristie, is there is so much more than just the football involved. There is the television companies, there's the sponsorship and marketing people. And they have made it very clear up to this point, particularly the television people and the organizers of the Winter Olympics, the IOC, that they really wouldn't want to see it moved to the start of 2022, because there is the Winter Olympics.
There's also the Super Bowl. And both the organizers and the television companies already have a whole lot invested in those big sporting events. And they wouldn't want to Wordl Cup to come in and gate crash that party.
But this is the problem with this issue, Kristie, there's so many different people with their little stake and heir claim.
We are, you know, still nine years away. There is still a lot of time for a lot more discussion to take place.
LU STOUT: That's right, so many interests involved, so many different stakeholders. This will be a tough decision to make.
Amanda Davies, joining us live from London, thank you.
Now we're learning more about why Lavabit, the secure email service, suddenly shut down in August. Now the site's owner Ladar Levison, he posted this message blaming a secret U.S. court battle. And he vowed to continue fighting.
Now many of the court records have been made public. And it had been widely believed that the U.S. government wanted to access Edward Snowden's email, the man who leaked National Security Agency secrets. He had a Lavabit account.
Now the unsealed court documents reveals exactly how Lavabit melted down.
Let's bring in our regular contributor Nicholas Thompson who edited that article on Lavabit for the New Yorker.com. He joins us now live from New York.
And Nick, first, what is Lavabit? And why was it created?
NICK THOMPSON, NEW YORKER.COM: So Lavabit is a secure email service. So it's like gmail or hotmail or any other service, but there are a whole bunch of protections built in to protect your privacy. So, for example, when your messages are stored on the company's servers they're encrypted so that if a government agency or anybody else were to get in, it would be very hard for them to get them.
So the protections built in at a whole series of stages to make you feel more secure that nobody is reading your messages.
LU STOUT: Now the first tangle with law enforcement, it began before the first Edward Snowden leak. So how did Lavabit first get into trouble?
THOMPSON: Well, Lavabit has been -- you know, like all email providers, it has conversations with law enforcement authorities all the time. And in the past, Lavabit had cooperated and had given information to the government over a child pornographer, for example.
In May, an FBI agent left his card at the door of the founder of Lavabit. And then in June, once Edward Snowden's leaks had become public and it was very clear that he was leaking American national security information, the government was aggressive in trying to get Lavabit to give information about, we presume, Snowden's account. It's not exactly clear that they were going after Snowden's account from the court documents, because the name is redacted, but it's surely that.
And the government came and said we want all the incoming and outgoing information from his account. And then the battle escalated in some very interesting ways.
LU STOUT: Now, I'm very curious about the man behind Lavatbit. I mean, Levison, he was eventually forced to destroy his own business, his business that he built up for the last 10 years. How did he react to that?
THOMPSON: Well, so he's a very interesting guy. And he's a real advocate for the rights of privacy. And his whole company was based on that. He had business interests on fighting back against the FBI and he had personal interests.
So the FBI came to him and said give us Snowden's information. He said, well, I'm not really going to do that and sort of stonewalled. And they said, no, you really have to give it to us. And he said, OK, I'll give it to you, but it's really hard to get. I'll build you -- I'll write the code so that you can get it. And the FBI said, no, no, you don't write the code. You give us the master keys to your site.
He said, well, no if I give you the master keys then you'll have information to everything of all of my users.
And the FBI said, no you have to give this to us.
So his position is that the FBI by demanding the master keys to decrypt his site made it much harder for him to give anything. And because of that he shut down the site.
So he's saying that the FBI by asking for too much ended up not getting anything. And then if they had just asked for something smaller and narrower he would have given it to them and they would have been able to trace Snowden.
So this battle goes back and forth through June, July, August. And then it reaches its sort of, its most crazy point when he finally says the FBI all right you've demanded that I give you the master encryption codes, well here it is. And he prints it out in 4 point font, totally unreadable and hands him a stack of paper and says here it is you want it, you've got it.
The FBI said, well, you know, this is ridiculous. You can't do this. We couldn't possibly enter all of this. You have to give it to us electronically.
And at that point he just shuts the site down.
So what we're seeing from these court documents is that most email providers when the FBI came to them during the National Security Agency stuff just said, hey, OK, here it is. Here's one guy who said, no, I'm going to fight you tooth and nail and every way I possibly can.
LU STOUT: Yeah, it's incredible how Levison, he did -- he was forced to give up his website, to shut it down, but on his own terms at the very end.
Let's talk next about what all this battle reveals about the U.S. government. For the FBI and the U.S. government to go after Lavabit this way, what does that say about the psyche of Washington and how it feels about any service designed for user privacy?
THOMPSON: You know that's an extremely important question.
So of course they went after him hard, because he was Edward Snowden's email provider and they desperately wanted to stop Edward Snowden from leaking more secrets for, you know, lots of reasons that are eminently understandable.
The big question at the heart of this case, and it's something that Levison feels strongly about, is whether the FBI deliberately asked for too much not because it was interested in Snowden, because it wanted the master keys in order to help its larger method of cracking all the secret methods of communication on the Internet.
So the question is whether the FBI didn't get what it could have gotten on Snowden, because it's so intent on cracking everything. And whether the FBI and the NSA, which clearly are trying to go after all privacy -- all services that focus on privacy and have privacy deeply embedded in it and are built to scale, the NSA and the FBI have been working to crack all those.
And the question here is whether they were so intent on that larger mission of getting access to everything that they may have in a way let Snowden get away almost.
LU STOUT: Incredible. Nothing is safe, nothing secure. Nick Thompson joining us. A fascinating story. You can find it on the New Yorker website.
Nick, thank you, take care. We'll talk again next week.
Now, let's go over here and take a look at what Samsung says is the world's first smartphone with a curved screen. Now it's called the Samsung Galaxy Round. It has a 5.7 inch screen and it bends from left to right.
Now it's worth noting that while this phone has a curved screen that doesn't necessarily mean it's flexible.
Now the phone's casing, battery, other electronics are still solid.
So is it really the first smartphone with a curved screen? Well, yes and no. Now in 2010, Samsung built the Nexus S for Google and it might be hard to see it, but the screen it still has a very slight curve to it.
Now the difference is that only the glass is curved on the Nexus S. The actual electronics of the screen itself still flat.
Now this is News Stream. And coming up, we'll introduce you to the fiery flavors of Indonesian cuisine and show you while people travel from near and far to eat the meals this 90-year-old woman dishes up in her home kitchen.
LU STOUT: Now far from the discussion and debate of this week's APEC gathering, all this week CNN's On the Road series will bring you greater insight into the customs and the culture of Indonesia. From homegrown architecture to high flying photography, we've been exploring the places, the people and the passions unique to the Southeast Asian country.
And today, Anna Coren will give Indonesian food a try.
COREN: At the back of a humble house on the outskirts of Jakarta is a kitchen of an elderly woman who has dedicated her life to cooking. It wasn't out of choice, but rather necessity. As Emba Matto (ph) was forced to support her struggling family as a teenager.
She would travel to neighboring villages to sell her signature dish, mungurt lele (ph), otherwise known as spicy catfish. But now customers come to her. The 90-year-old converting he home into a makeshift restaurant.
And so this is her home.
WILLIAM WONGSO, CHEF: This is her home. This is her kitchen. It's amazing, right?
COREN: It is amazing.
William Wongso would certainly know.
WONGSO: Oh, this is a papaya leaf.
COREN: As one of Indonesia's most famous chefs, he's become an expert in culinary tradition.
What is the secret to her cooking? Why is it so popular? Why do people come, you know? It's a long way out of Jakarta.
WONGSO: It's very home cooking, very traditional, everything you see -- you don't see electronic things to pound the spices, pound by hand. And you can see there. And they cook with the wood fire.
It is a kind of cooking with passion.
COREN: Which is something he believes is missing from Indonesian cooking and a problem he determined to rectify.
Working closely with the government, Wongso has started a program training up young chefs like 22-year-old Putru Rizky Mumpu.
PUTRY RIZKY MUMPU, TRAINING CHEF: I hope some day I can learn a recipe from her, because I know for me I'm the beginning of chef, a beginning chef, but I have to learning more about Indonesian food like traditional food so you can find here.
COREN: Food is a big part of Indonesian culture. And yet their dishes are not well known beyond its borders.
WONGSO: If you come to (inaudible) this in a dish that you must taste before you leave (inaudible) called gouda (ph)
COREN: Gouda (ph), a dish of chicken, duck egg, rice and the famous jackfruit cooked for 24 hours in spices and coconut sugar.
Wongso takes us on a tour of the kitchen where the wood fires burn 24 hours a day before allowing us to taste one of his favorite dishes, showcasing Indonesian cuisine to the rest of the world has become a passion project for this 66-year-old chef.
And what better way to do it than design the menu for the state dinner at this year's APEC summit in Bali upon the request of the Indonesian president.
WONGSO: This is a dream that's almost come true that the state dinner highlighting Indonesian food.
COREN: In (inaudible) won't be cooking for any presidents or prime ministers, but her customers all know one thing for certain...
MUMPU: It's a Master Chef in Indonesia.
COREN: Anna Coren, CNN, Yogyakarta, Indonesia.
LU STOUT: Some mouth-watering dishes there.
And we will continue our On the Road series focusing on Indonesia tomorrow. Now Anna Coren met an Indonesian architect who helped a local village rebuild after an earthquake using traditional techniques and craftsmanship to make the houses more resistant to future quakes.
You're watching New Stream. And still to come, streets covered in water as Eastern China copes with flooding from Typhoon Fitow. We'll have more in our world weather forecast. Stay with us.
LU STOUT: Welcome back.
Now more rising water in China thanks to the remains of Typhoon Fitow. When will the rain let up?
Let's get answers now with Mari Ramos. She joins us from the world weather center -- Mari.
MARI RAMOS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Kristie, I think the problem is not so much rain falling now, but all the rain that's already on the ground, all of that water that has just been standing for several days across these areas.
Let's go ahead and just go straight to the pictures, because these pictures taken earlier today, this is in Xizheng (ph) province, there are still streets that are impassable, inundated by days of rain. And the rain began on Sunday, it went on into Monday and Tuesday. As of today, the rain actually -- the falling rain has stopped, but as you can see there is a lot of standing water still across these areas. There were people that were trapped in their homes and their businesses, schools that had to be closed down, huge transportation problems.
If you think about how much rain has been falling across this area, in Shanghai for example, they had over five times their normal rainfall for the month of October happen in just a period of three days. And in Yuyow (ph), reports are that that area had seven times their normal rainfall as opposed to what would happen during this time of year.
So very significant rainfall, all of that having to do with that slow moving Fitow that moved across that area.
Come back over to the weather map. Look at it now, though, looking at generally clear skies, much, much better situation -- you know, we need this break. We need this break across eastern China to dry out somewhat from all of that heavy rain.
Getting a break also across the Korean peninsula and then back over Japan. You had your own brush with a tropical cyclone in that area as well, but it was much weaker and it was moving actually a lot faster too so it didn't leave as much rainfall.
This is what Fitow did. In Hangzhou, you can see there, 320 millimeters of rain. In Shanghai over 280 millimeters of rain against an average of 61.
But we're not done yet. You saw in that satellite image that there are a couple of storms still lingering. This one is tropical depression 24. So far not still a tropical storm. In other words, remember you have your tropical depression, then come tropical storm, after that it becomes a typhoon or a hurricane depending on what part of the world you are.
Right now we're at the beginning here, at a tropical depression. But this is likely to become a tropical storm over the next couple of days and maybe even a typhoon. This is very important, because look at this track. You know, just moving in this westerly direction over toward that northern part of Luzon again we get another tropical cyclone threatening this area. In the next couple of days this will be a big weathermaker for you. So make sure you're aware that this storm is getting nearby.
So far the rain shower will be there, but not as heavy. The waves, I think, will be a bigger factor along this eastern side of the Philippines over the next couple of days. And we do have another tropical cyclone, this one, Kristie, is in the Bay of Bengal. Tropical Cyclone 2b is the name of this store. B for the Bay of Bengal. We only get about maybe two or three per year. This one forming just north of the Andaman Islands (ph) right over here. They're at advisories already posted for those islands. And for areas here across the northern Bay of Bengal fishermen in particular, coastal areas could be affected. The forecast has this storm also intensifying, also becoming -- reaching typhoon strength or hurricane strength in the next few days and by the weekend a big weather maker also in this densely populated area of India.
We'll keep you posted, of course, on all these storms.
Back to you.
LU STOUT: All right, Mari Ramos there. Thank you.
Now the Nobel Peace Prize will be announced on Friday. And potential front-runner Malala Yousafzai, the Pakistani teenager who was shot in the head by the Taliban exactly one year ago.
Now they said they would target her again, but she told the host of a U.S. TV program that she would respond to their violence with kindness.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MALALA YOUSAFZAI: If he comes, what would you do Malala? Then I would reply myself that Malala just take a shoe and hit him, but then I said -- but then I said, if you hit a Talib with your shoe then there would be no difference between you and the Talib. You must not treat others that much with cruelty and that much harshly, you must fight others but through peace and through dialogue and through education.
Then I said, I'll tell him how important education is and that I even want education for your children as well. And I'll tell him, that's what I want to tell you, now do what you want.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LU STOUT: She is amazing.
And that is News Stream, but the news continues at CNN. World Business Today is next.