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How to Survive if Stranded; Suspended for Sexual Harassment at Six?; Frozen over Fresh?

Aired December 11, 2013 - 08:30   ET


PAMELA BROWN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And Obamacare will be front and center once again on Capitol Hill with Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius set to be grilled by law makers at a House hearing. She'll talk about improvements to the health care website.

And Nelson Mandela now lying in state for three days at the home of the South African government. Viewing for dignitaries is being held first. And the public will follow through Friday.

Of course we are always updating the five things to know, so go to for the very latest. Kate?

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks, Pamela. And talking about Nelson Mandela, Nelson Mandela inspired the world to make an impact. That goes without saying. So for more on his charitable legacy, and how you can get involved, go to


JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): All right, next up on NEW DAY, it is an amazing story of survival. A couple and four children found after being stranded in the Nevada mountains in sub-zero temperatures -- 21 below zero. How did they survive? We'll have what you need know about surviving in the wild.


BOLDUAN: Also ahead, he kissed a girl and got suspended for sexual harassment. But he's just six years old. The bizarre story that has so many folks scratching their heads and wondering what?


BERMAN: Welcome back, everyone. This is such a great story. They are calling it the "miracle in the mountains". A Nevada family of six found alive and well after spending two days stranded in a rugged mountain range, subzero temperatures, 21 below.

They heated rocks to keep the car warm. They brought it inside. They did so many things right. The question is, you know, what could the rest us do if we're caught out in something like this? To answer these questions, we brought Shane Hobel, in the founder of Mountain Scout Survival School.

Shane, thanks so much for being with us. SHANE HOBEL, FOUNDER OF MOUNTAIN SCOUT SURVIVAL SCHOOL: Thank you so much.

BERMAN: You know, none of us ever want to get caught in a situation like that.

HOBEL: Certainly not.

BERMAN: But, you know, say something like this happens, say you are caught out in the cold like this, no help around. What are the first things you should do?

HOBELL: Well, you know, it's all about pre-planning. If you're making arrangements to actually go out and enjoy recreation, going for a hike or kayaking, make arrangements to plan for the unexpected. So have extra food, have extra provisions involved. Know when you're going; know when you're coming back.

Tell other people about your plan, expected route and time of arrival coming back, and what are your communication options, you know? They had a cell phone, so through that triangulation, through the cellphone analysis, the forensics, they were able to locate at least a general idea. So pre-planning goes a long way when it comes to this type of (inaudible).

BOLDUAN: And what do you make of -- it's kind of the one that keeps sticking out, too, is the fact the father had kind of the foresight or presence of mind to heat rocks for fire and then bring them into the car to keep everyone warm. Does that go along with survival?

HOBEL: Absolutely. You know, we're talking about primitive skills. Heating rocks goes a long way, not only for warmth, making coal beds and dragging coals into a ditch and putting earth over it and keeping yourself below. Hot rocks do the same thing. So not only are they a heat source, but you can also cook with them as well. So it's an old skill.

BROWN: Yeah, you wonder if he had Boy Scout experience or something else to be able to know to do that. What else did they do right? I mean, obviously, staying together, the fact the father didn't just stray off and try to get help. I'm sure, you know, that's a big part of it, the fact they stayed with the Jeep. What else did they do?

HOBEL: You know, there's a lot of things. These are great questions. They did lot of great things together. One, staying together. That's one of the best things. Staying with the vehicle, not wandering away from the point last seen. That helps out search-and-rescue individuals quite a bit.

The fact that he was thinking ahead. You know, there's a lot of emotions going on. I can't imagine the state of mind that he's dealing with. You have children and other people's children on top of it. So no matter of the emotions, you still have to put that -- acknowledge it, not be numb to it.

(CROSSTALK) BOLDUAN: That seems to be kind of -- I don't know if we call it -- the wild card. I mean, it's one thing to survive yourself or with another adult, but there were so many children with them, how do you handle that?

HOBEL: Well, keep them occupied. Keep yourself occupied. Do the simple things. And I think what they did was the right thing: heating up the rocks; paying attention to what can I do right now; not staying involved with, "Oh, no, look at the situation I'm in." It's act, and not just think about it.

BOLDUAN: But that's so difficult when you think the hours start ticking into days.

BERMAN: The kids start getting hungry.

BOLDUAN: How does the situation start changing and how do you keep that presence of mind?

HOBEL: It's a great question. The fact of the matter is regardless of what you're feeling, you have to maintain the basic. And the basic four are shelter, water, fire, food. And these -- without those things, it doesn't matter what you're feeling.

BERMAN: So it was about two days out there with the temperatures dipping below zero at night. How much longer do you think they could have lasted?

HOBEL: Well, you know, there's a rule. Three threes when it comes -- three minutes without air; three days without water; or three weeks without food.

So, you had snow. You had the ability to melt snow with heating up and using the tire for fuel. It's very smart. Use what you have. So in terms of food, they rationed out the food and gave all the food to the children as far as I understand.

That is a good thing. It is also a detriment. You also have to take care of yourself so that you have the response (ph) being the strength to take care of others. So ration out the food accordingly. So they did a good thing.

And one of the other things to keep in mind when it comes to children is the simple things. Keep it playful. Even though it's a survival situation, it doesn't have to be heavy. So it can be very light hearted. Play games. Keep them occupied. Make it an adventure.

BERMAN: All right, Shane Hobel --


BOLDUAN: Hope you never get stuck in a situation. I wrote it down: shelter, water, fire, food. That's a good thing to remember and keep in your car.

(LAUGHTER) BERMAN: Shane Hobel, great to see you, thanks so much.

HOBEL: Thank you so much.

BOLDUAN: All right, coming up next on NEW DAY, when is a kiss more than just kiss? Why a school is defending the suspension of a 6-year- old boy what they call sexual harassment.


BOLDUAN: All right. Let's get another check of the weather for you before you head out this morning. Jennifer Gray is in the weather center.

How is it looking, Jennifer?

JENNIFER GRAY, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Oh, it's cold out there, Kate. We are seeing temperatures 10 to 15, even 20 degrees below normal for today. These are your high temperatures. This does not factor in the wind chill. So a lot of areas, especially up to north, will feel cooler. We'll see a high of 17 today in Chicago, 44 in Dallas, 45 in Nashville.

And as we go through the next couple of days, temperatures are going to stay well below normal. They finally start to stabilize a little bit better in the West by the end of the week. But still, very cold in the northeast; temperatures in the 20s and 30s.

Lake-effect snow for today, so very chilly across the north. We'll see three to five inches in Grand Rapids and possibly a foot, foot- and-a-half of snow. And this is additional snow already seen incredible always across the Great Lakes.

So this is the wind chill up north; 48 degrees below zero is what it feels like this morning. Feels like 27 below zero in Minneapolis. And that arctic air is going to shift to the northeast over the next couple of days. We'll see rain and icy mix and even heavy snow across portions of the northeast by Saturday and Sunday, guys.

BOLDUAN: All right, Jennifer, thanks for that.

So we've been talking about this morning and something you're going to want to talk about too -- it's a pretty controversial story involving a 6-year-old boy accused of sexual harassment. Why? For kissing someone on the cheek. For that, let's go to the couch.


BERMAN: So while most six-year-olds are working on their ABCs, learning a little bit of math, one Colorado boy is at home suspended for sexual harassment. You heard that right. He kissed a female classmate on the hand and cheek and the school suspended Hunter Yelton for sexual harassment -- they used these words and that's important here. They put the offense on the school record.

Joining us now to talk about this, Kelly Wallace, CNN's digital correspondent and editor at large; she's also our parenting expert. There's a lot to talk about here.


BOLDUAN: What do you think -- Kelly?

WALLACE: Well I mean outrageous -- right. And it's not just something I feel. Lots of people are talking about it online because number one not only do people think he kissed the girl on the hand that he's suspended for that. But sexual harassment? We're talking about a six-year-old.

The mom is saying her son is now asking, "Mommy, what is sex?" You know, what kind of conversation does that lead to and what impact does this have on this little boy?

BERMAN: I think it's the point here. It's the words here that are so much the issue. We don't always know the entire back story.


BERMAN: You might think he's done something before. There may be behavioral issues. They may have a reason to discipline the child but to use the words "sexual harassment".

WALLACE: I know. I think a couple of things -- I think we -- and these stories, you know, we need to hear more. We haven't really heard a ton from school. The school superintendent is saying that the behavior fits the school's description of sexual harassment in the category of unwanted touching.

We've had these conversations on your show before. These stories where it seems like schools are trying to have a very rigid sense of the rules and that goes against common sense and that kind of feels like this story here.

BOLDUAN: Because a little bit schools are between a rock and a hard place, right? They are trying -- they truly are trying to do their best. They try to put rules and policies in place but it's kind of the rigid nature of it, it seems to be where they're outrageous.

WALLACE: Exactly. They have to, you know, balance kids' safety. They have -- obviously they have rules and then some people are following the rules, if other people don't they have zero tolerance policies when it comes to bullying and other things. But I think in this case when you're talking about sexual harassment it's a very big term. They now say it's on his record --


BOLDUAN: And it's on his record.

WALLACE: -- and that's what the mom is fighting to remove.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Right. And how do you think in a situation like this -- how do you think they should have handled this? WALLACE: I mean as John was saying, the boy does have some issues -- right, you know. He was suspended before for rough housing. He was suspended before for kissing the same girl on the cheek. We should note, the mom says the girl is fine with it. They consider themselves boyfriend and girlfriend.

So it seems like the boy -- and he was so cute and the story in the affiliate he said, "I'm a 6-year-old. I have a lot of energy. I'm trying to work on it. I'm trying to do my best."

BERMAN: So parenting expert help me out here.


I have two six-year-old boys, as a matter of fact.

WALLACE: right.

BERMAN: What do you now tell this boy when he's asking the questions, you know, "Mommy what is this sexual harassment thing?"

WALLACE: I think six is too young to really explain what sexual harassment is and what sex is. I think probably what the mom is trying to do is say we're working the school, you didn't do anything wrong. We obviously have to behave in class and we have to do and respect others and have that kind of conversation. But it seems a pretty loaded conversation to have with a six-year-old about what a sexual harassment really is.

BERMAN: He didn't do anything wrong. Again, is there a difference between the term "sexual harassment" here and then maybe a kid who, you know, is in other kid's space when he shouldn't be?

WALLACE: Yes, it is. Because some people said, you know, if someone kissed my daughter and my daughter didn't want that person to kiss them on the cheek they would be upset. I think it's a sense of respecting other person's space and really trying to not invade their space, not really touching in any way that might be, you know, kind of unwelcomed by someone else. Again, very hard for a six-year-old to understand.

BROWN: Right. And on that note given the fact that he's only six- year-old who do you think should have jurisdiction over something like this between the school and the parent?

WALLACE: Exactly. It seems like, you know, the boy has had some issues. The mom concedes that he should have some discussions at home. He probably could have some counseling. It just seemed a little harsh that this is on the boy's record.

And some psychologists have been talking online today saying is this going to impact the boy in any way? Is he going to feel like he did something really, really wrong? I have a six-year-old and a seven- year-old. I'm sure they play around with other boys and girls. They are already talking about who they are going to marry. I mean --


BROWN: You chase each other around. See if you can --


BOLDUAN: I imagine you in kindergarten.

BROWN: Afraid of me.

WALLACE: No, they loved you. That is true.

BOLDUAN: Kelly, you often get very good conversations online when you take these questions online. Have you gotten reaction yet on this?

WALLACE: A little bit. And you know, on CNN's NEW DAY post, we've been getting a lot. A lot of people are saying, you know, this is outrageous. The boy is six years old. One person commented that he was in a Christian school when he was six and he kissed a girl and he had to write on the board "I will not kiss girls. I will not kiss girls." And that was his punishment and that was a Christian school.

So he says "Hello". I think there's a lot of questions that are being raised. And again, we really need to hear more from the school and the district. There may be more.

BERMAN: Kelly Wallace -- thank you so much. It's a great discussion.

BOLDUAN: Thanks, Kelly.

WALLACE: Oh, yes.

BOLDUAN: Great to see you.


WALLACE: Always good to see you.

BERMAN: For more on Kelly's thoughts, you can go to There is a great discussion going on online about this.

BOLDUAN: Yes, let us know what you think.

Coming up next on NEW DAY when it comes to fresh or frozen produce, which is better for you? The answer may be surprising. That's ahead.


BROWN: Does that music give you a hint about what this next story is going to be about. That's right. It's about a shark and this is out of California. It's really incredible video; also incredible the name, the marine who caught the shark.

Jeff Fangman doing some beach fishing with his wife and daughter when he says the line just started rolling off the reel; taking the bait a young great white shark. And though Fangman is an experienced shark fisherman this was the first even for him. Fangman posed for a few glamour shots but he did set the shark free -- a note there.

BERMAN: I didn't even know they had catch and release for great white sharks.

BOLDUAN: I'm shocked how just kind still the shark is -- kind of playing along with the whole photo shoot.

BERMAN: OK. I'm kind of shocked how the chill the fisherman. It's a great white shark.

BROWN: Fangman -- you love that name don't you.

BERMAN: Yes, Fangman. The Fangman who defeated the shark.

BOLDUAN: right.

That music means time for some health news for you. Time for "New Day New You". Is fresh really best? It's been long believed that fresh fruits and vegetables are, of course, better for you from any of their frozen counterparts but a recent study seems to be turning that thinking on its head. Research from the University of Georgia shows that frozen produce may actually off more nutrients than the fresh.

Joining us to talk more about this is Keri Glassman, a dietitian and nutritionist for "COOK YOUR ASS OFF" on HLN's Upwave. Keri, I love that title. And I also love this topic.

This is very, very interesting. And a perfect thing we're talking about it on a day when everyone across the country is freezing outside. But this study was funded by a grant from the Frozen Food Foundation which is always worth noting but it's also backed up by other research you say.

KERI GLASSMAN, HLN HOST: It is. I mean this is something I've been talking about for years. It's one of the best health secrets. Frozen vegetables are picked at peak ripeness when they are most nutritious. And then they're flash frozen. So they retain those nutrients.

What's interesting about this study though is it really looked at consumer behavior and how they actually consume those vegetables. They looked at, you know, people grocery shop about twice a week -- right. So they are not eating them the second they buy them. So this study looked at vegetables being consumed about five days later versus frozen vegetables, which I think is really interesting.

BERMAN: So why then is my wife always telling me we have to buy the local food and go to the co-op down the street to pick the locally, fresh, organic stuff?

GLASSMAN: Well, that is important too because local is good for the environment. That can also be less expensive when you buy local, and local and seasonal can be more tasty. Frozen food is just another option because let's face it. We're not always able to go and pick up food that is local on a daily basis. So this is just something that's good for people to know.

Frozen food is less expensive. This study and other studies have shown that frozen food is higher in Vitamins A, C and folate.

BOLDUAN: How much better is it, you think?

GLASSMAN: I mean that -- I mean that will depend --


GLASSMAN: -- I mean that's really going to depend on when you ate that fresh fruit. Was it local? Was it something that's shipped, you know, from California to New York? So it's really going to depend also on the food and the nutrients.

BROWN: Is this across the board, too? Is all frozen food frozen at its sort of peak nutrition value as you pointed out earlier?

GLASSMAN: Yes. Across the board frozen food will be picked again, at peak ripeness and then flash frozen. You want to think about fruits and vegetables are living breathing things. Not like humans but they are living items. They age just like we age. So when you freeze them you're retaining their nutritional value.

BOLDUAN: When people hear this, I always think people are going to go from one extreme to the other and they're only going to eat frozen fruits and vegetables. Is that your advice?

GLASSMAN: No. Absolutely not. We like fresh foods also because as you mentioned buying local, seasonal, organic foods really is the best way to go. Use frozen foods and don't feel like you're doing something bad when you do it. You are getting a lot of nutrition in there for convenience and also, again, for convenience and for expense. Just to save a little bit of money.

BERMAN: Is the variety within field here? Is there good frozen food versus bad frozen food when it comes to the fruits and vegetables? What should you look for?

GLASSMAN: What you should look for is in ingredient label -- it should just say "broccoli" or "spinach". You don't want any added ingredients because that's really key. When people buy fresh whole foods they are buying foods that aren't packaged and processed. When you buy frozen food you can also get away with just buying that one food without all those added preservatives and chemicals.

BOLDUAN: I always wonder because, you know, we talk about steaming vegetables, they lose some of their nutrients. Is there a way how you defrost the frozen fruits and vegetables that would change the nutritional values?

GLASSMAN: The one thing I just say is make sure that you take them out of the plastic. You don't want to microwave in plastic. But if you're steaming them yes steaming versus boiling is going to be a good thing too.

BOLDUAN: Good advice for you today.

Keri Glassman, great to see you. Thank you so much. GLASSMAN: You're so welcome.

BOLDUAN: A lot of news happening today which means we're going to pass it off to "CNN NEWSROOM" with Carol Costello. Hey Carol.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN HOST: Hey, thanks so much. "NEWSROOM" starts now.

All right. We'll get to this -- actually we have a lot of breaking news this morning. Let's start with this. This just in to us.

The White House has released new Obamacare enrollment numbers for the month of November. Enrollment in the federal insurance exchange has nearly quadrupled from October. Sign ups are way below the goal of seven million by March. And in just about an hour the woman in charge will be grilled on Capitol Hill. Health and Human services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius will testify before lawmakers on the improvements to the problem plagued Obamacare website.

CNN's Joe Johns joins us from Washington with those new numbers I spoke about. What are they, Joe?

JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well Carol, as you said these numbers are much better than last month's numbers so let's just go to them right away. The total enrollment in Obamacare, the bottom line numbers -- 364,682. That's not going to get them to the goal of seven million, but it's a better start than a month ago.

The federal exchanges -- that is sort of the website -- that's 137,200 people enrolled. In the state exchanges that's 14 different states that have their own healthcare exchanges, as you can see still out-distancing the federal exchange, 227,478.