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Olympian Accused of Murdering Girlfriend
Aired March 4, 2014 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST (voice-over): Tonight, Oscar Pistorius covers his ears at his own murder trial. He can`t look at victim`s mother in the eye. What does this say about the man called Blade Runner?
Plus, murder on Facebook. When a young man dies of a drug overdose, his friends post pictures of his body online. The behavior bureau is here.
Let`s get started.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Good evening, everyone. My co-host is Sirius XM Radio`s Jenny Hutt.
And coming up, pictures of a teen lifeless, his lifeless body photo posted by his friends on Facebook. Social media run amok.
But first, Oscar Pistorius covered his ears today during graphic comments in his murder trial. He admits he killed his girlfriend. Fired four shots through a locked bathroom door, hit her in the head.
Take a look at today`s proceedings.
REEVA STEENKAMP, MODEL: It`s a really, really big production in its fourth season now. And, yes, watch this space.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The night Reeva Steenkamp was killed on Valentine`s Day of last year.
Pistorius has said he thought he was shooting at a burglar.
PROSECUTOR: The fourth bullet hit her in the head. She then died.
NEIGHBOR: It was clear that this person`s life was in danger.
NEIGHBOR: You could hear that it was bloodcurdling screams.
NEIGHBOR: The last scream faded moments after the last gunshot was fired.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There has previously been situations at the home of Mr. Oscar Pistorius, allegations of domestic nature.
PINSKY: Joining us, Samantha Schacher, social commentator, host of "Pop Trigger" on the Young Turks Network, Mike Catherwood, TV and radio host, my co-host on "Loveline", Eboni K. Williams, attorney, talk radio host, and Segun Oduolowu -- well, there`s an empty chair down there.
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Oh.
PINSKY: It sounds like some sort of group therapy exercise where we talk to the empty chair. In fact, get the chair off --
MIKE CATHERWOOD, TV AND RADIO HOST: Oh, good. We`ll get a chance to talk.
PINSKY: Right. I think probably they were afraid of dealing with Eboni or Anahita. So, he`s turned tail and run.
But first before we get to the panel, joining us live from south Africa, independent journalist Lisa Dewberry.
Lisa, tell us about the trial today.
LISA DEWBERRY, INDEPENDENT JOURNALIST (via telephone): Dr. Drew, whereas yesterday, Oscar Pistorius barely reacted, don`t displayed emotions during testimony, today was a whole different story. At one point when the prosecutors were describing the four gunshots and the way the bullets landed, Pistorius his hand -- his head in his hands. A short time after, he wept visibly. Remember, it`s not to influence a panel of jurors like it would be in the U.S. But the judge will be deciding on the murder and other charges -- Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Lisa, thanks so much. That was live from South Africa. She is watching this carefully.
Sam, tell me about these tweets that the victim tweeted and there`s a surveillance video apparently.
PINSKY: Gave us a sense of where the relationship might have been at. Go ahead.
SCHACHER: Right. Yes. So just hours before Reeva was killed, she posted two tweets that would paint her as a woman who was in a happy relationship. The first tweet reads, "It`s a beautiful day, make things happen starting my day off with a yummy healthy shake from my beau." The other tweet reads, "What do you have up your sleeve for your love tomorrow? #getexcited #valentinesday."
And then there is surveillance footage just days before she was killed of the two of them in a grocery store kissing and seemingly happy.
So, many are saying that this will help support Oscar Pistorius` defense, but I say no way, Dr. Drew. Listen, I don`t doubt that he loved her, but, listen, a number of people have told authorities that he is a loose cannon, that he is possessive. He is jealous.
Plus, couple that with the ear testimony we`ve heard in court of them arguing supposedly before he shot her. And it just lends to the fact that he lost control in that fight and killed her in cold blood.
Eboni, I want your thoughts on this too. You heard that officer in that piece of tape saying they`ve been out there before for domestic disputes, that there`s been a history perhaps. We heard yesterday on the behavior bureau he had a major head injury, that he may have had some behavior problems after that. What`s your take on this trial?
EBONI WILLIAMS: Yes. Respectfully I`ve got to disagree with Sam`s take on that. If anything, those tweets and surveillance could help poke holes in the prosecutor`s theory of the case. Which is there was this mysterious fight that led to this very intentional killing. Also, what helps the defense the most, Dr. Drew, is the fact that South Africa is a very, very violent place.
You`ve got over 50 percent of the country saying they themselves are afraid of a home intrusion style that Oscar was describing that he was afraid was going on in his home. So, look, there is certainly some reasonable factual circumstances to support his theory that he was being the victim of a very high profile home intrusion. So, therefore --
SCHACHER: How afraid do you have to be, though, Dr. Drew? How afraid do you have to be in a gated community with guards and an electric fence?
CATHERWOOD: The point is whether or not he was afraid.
PINSKY: What is the point?
CATHERWOOD: I think the point is that -- well, listen. He murdered her. No one`s ever been more guilty.
Secondly, let`s say he didn`t murder her. Let`s say his story is true he thought there was an intruder in there. This is a man who blows holes in doors without screaming, is anybody in there?
JENNY HUTT, CO-HOST: Right.
CATHERWOOD: Let me check and see if my girlfriend`s in a bedroom before I start firing a weapon, live rounds inside a building. Do you know how insane that is to just wake up and throw on your prosthetics, grab a gun and be like, I don`t know. I`m not sure who`s behind this door. Just to be safe I`m going to start opening fire. Open rounds. Real -- not a paint ball gun. He`s blasting holes in the door with a gun.
PINSKY: I get your point. But, Jenny, hold on one second. Our buddy Lisa Bloom was just in the greenroom here at CNN.
PINSKY: She`s from Avvo.com. She`s an attorney. She was with us yesterday.
And she said she was in South Africa and that she actually was so uncomfortable there because she said that`s how people live. They live in these fortresses where everyone is scared out of their mind that they`re going to get attacked all the time. It`s sort of a weird consciousness they have about this where they`re always afraid of a home intrusion.
I don`t know how -- what the customary reaction is when you think somebody is in there in South Africa, you just start firing as Mike so poetically put, after you throw on your prosthetics.
But, Jenny, what do you want to say? What is your point?
HUTT: But, Dr. Drew, it`s four shots. Listen, if he really thought there was a stranger in the bathroom, then I think the one shot would have been enough and a hey, buddy, you make a move, there`s three more headed your way and then he would have heard his girlfriend`s screams. So I think --
CATHERWOOD: Preach on, Jenny Hutt.
SCHACHER: Let`s not forget the testimony, Dr. Drew. Let`s not forget all of the testimony, the witnesses not only hearing her scream but one saying she heard them arguing for an hour to point they had to cover their ears with a pillow. So, there are so many factors he`s guilty.
PINSKY: But, Eboni, you`re still sympathetic to Pistorius.
WILLIAMS: I am, because again, that witness respectfully saying 177 feet away. We don`t really know what she heard. And that`s what she was questioning on cross examination, a vow from the defense counsel.
Look, I`m not saying he didn`t kill her. That`s obviously clear. But the fact he had a reasonable fear, Dr. Drew is right, Lisa Bloom is right, the culture of South Africa, you`re talking about 45 murders a day. That is an extreme hyper society panic that is difficult for us to understand here in America. But places in those situations, perhaps that reasonable fear is a little more understandable.
Not excusing the behavior, but it`s something to consider.
PINSKY: Slide in that empty chair again, if you could. Oh. Segun, thanks for joining us.
HUTT: Oh, Segun!
PINSKY: I do want to hear from you, but I got to go.
Next up, what is it like to testify in a high-profile trial? This woman who you see here running from cameras is going to come in and tell us. Remember this young lady in that? Yes, yes. There she is. She`s going to join us.
And later, did social media contribute to this teen`s death? Pictures of his lifeless body posted on Facebook.
Back after this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JUNE STEENKAMP, REEVA`S MOTHER: There was one occasion where I didn`t keep strong and I just had a little breakdown. You know, when they`re talking about Reeva, what she went through and how she was traumatized. Well, obviously, you can imagine. She`s locked herself in the toilet and she`s been shot and she`s in pain. And that`s one of my things that I wish I could have been there to protect her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Jenny and I are back.
Very sad story. That was Reeva Steenkamp`s mother. Her daughter was shot to death by the so-called Blade Runner Oscar Pistorius.
Let`s bring in the behavior bureau. First, I`ve got Ginger Gonzaga. She`s new to the bureau. She`s actress and writer. She`s one of the costars of Jim Jefferies on "Legit."
Samantha Schacher, host of "Pop Trigger" on the Young Turks Network.
Wendy Walsh, psychologist, author of "The 30-Day Love Detox".
And if you would like to join the conversation, you can tweet us right now @DrDrewHLN, #behaviorbureau.
Wendy, what are your thoughts on what was going down with this couple? It seems there was evidence of some domestic tension here, maybe domestic tension. We heard yesterday, Judy Ho told us about the fact that she -- he may have had a head injury, and so, his frontal lobe function may have been impaired.
What are your thoughts?
WENDY WALSH, PSYCHOLOGIST: I don`t know any specifics about ahead injury, Dr. Drew, but I want to talk basic human mating strategies here. On the scale of human mating values, shall we say, made value in the market place, he was actually a low contender on the scale because of his disability, sad to say. But he overcame that by getting this Olympic -- becoming an Olympian and eventually getting a woman who scores a ten on the mating scale.
So, he would have to practice so much mate guarding because psychologically he might perceive himself as a low mate value.
Now, when men practice mate guarding, it sometimes verges into violation and intimidation because their fear of losing this high status mate. I think that`s what went on here.
PINSKY: All right. Wendy, I was watching Sam and Ginger both when you were making their case and they looked like they sucked on a lemon or something.
So, Ginger, I`m going with you first. Is that what you`re thinking about this case?
PINSKY: Welcome to the panel.
GINGER GONZAGA, ACTRESS & WRITER: Thank you. All of the dates that I go on I think in terms of mating.
But no, I find it interesting there may be a history of violence. From what I read, she was kind of a spokeswoman for women`s rights. I know that she did some sort of activism about -- I know she had tweeted at some point not everyone wakes up safe in their home, I did today, while she was dating Oscar.
I find it interesting she might have been a victim of some sort of domestic abuse sometime in her life when she also speaks against it. Maybe that`s why she was recently involved in that type of advocacism (ph).
PINSKY: Interesting and, Sam --
PINSKY: She said both of you should be mate guarded. Wendy said you both should be mate guarded. That was her point.
SCHACHER: I don`t know what that means.
WALSH: You should think about human mating strategies when you`re out there.
Yes, you`re a ten. I`m sure your husband guards you. Trust me.
SCHACHER: Thank you. Thank you, thank you.
But, Dr. Drew, I thought it was really interesting what was just stated about her possibly having a history of domestic violence, because she has been open. When I was doing my research, there was a relationship she was in years ago when she was in college where she really was a victim of abuse. Now, I`m not -- I don`t know if that led into other relationships, but that`s what led her to becoming an advocate for women against domestic violence because she was a victim herself.
PINSKY: Yes, however, Jenny, that does put them at risk for playing one of those roles again.
HUTT: Right. That makes me think even more this might have been that Oscar Pistorius shot her in some sort of rage and killed her.
And, Dr. Drew, people keep trying to say the video of the canoodling so they were in love. But how many couples in love end up in awful fights that don`t usually end in death but sometimes end in death.
WALSH: I`ve got to talk about that.
PINSKY: Well, they`re often very intense relationships. Ginger, you want to say something.
WALSH: No, it was Wendy.
GONZAGA: I was just saying there`s a lot of intensity with the weight of Valentine`s Day. I don`t know if they also honor this in South Africa, but she did tweet about it. It seems crimes of passion, I think it`s a specific date. I think that could be --
PINSKY: All right. I want to talk about Reeva`s mother again you saw on the tape. She said the main reason she went to the trial was to make eye contact with Oscar Pistorius.
Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEENKAMP: He just walked into the courtroom and he looked straight ahead. And then he sat down and never looked my way. It doesn`t matter to me what happens to Oscar, because my daughter is never coming back.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Here is what it actually looked like when Pistorius walked past her. We`ll show you that picture. There. He looked straight ahead, didn`t say anything to anybody. I don`t know, Wendy, if it`s because he was so ashamed or so distraught. But it`s pretty low not to make eye contact.
WALSH: The last thing he`s going to do is look at his victim`s mother. A woman who I assume he knew and would be the one probably most hurt by this event.
I want to go back and say one thing about public displays of affection and them canoodling. Research shows that the more public displays of affection in couples, the less secure the relationship. So, what happens is people -- again, mate guarding when they`re holding hands and they`re touching, what they`re trying to do is say this person`s mine. Don`t take them. We`re in a secure relationship.
But actually that shows that they`re less secure.
PINSKY: Joining us now for an exclusive interview -- hang on. Exclusively joining us is Gypsy Willis. She was the mistress of Dr. Martin MacNeill who had murdered his wife. You probably remember this video. Gypsy is trying to get away from someone chasing her in a parking lot.
Gypsy, the media is not allowed to show the neighbors who testified in Pistorius` trial. That was not the case for you. What was that like to be the object of that kind of scrutiny?
GYPSY WILLIS, MISTRESS OF DR. MARTIN MACNEILL: That was terrifying. I never expected to be in that circumstance and then I had cameras chasing me everywhere. The courtroom was terrifying. However, I looked to the media, I felt like a humming bird inside. I was really scared.
PINSKY: Do people still look at you that way? Are you still under the influence of whatever was projected or said about you in the media?
WILLIS: Absolutely. I`m recognized everywhere I go. It`s very hard to find a job. It`s very awkward.
I have a lot of social anxieties now that I`m being judged everywhere I go. But it is certain that I am recognized and my name as well.
PINSKY: I guess I can`t resist asking in retrospect, what is your take on your role in that case?
WILLIS: I was held as incentive and I disagree with that.
PINSKY: You were an incentive for the murder?
WILLIS: I was held as incentive for this trial. I don`t believe to this day that Martin is guilty.
PINSKY: Oh, interesting. I wonder if my panel has questions.
HUTT: Wow. Wow. Wow.
PINSKY: Sam, a question?
SCHACHER: I do. I have to call it like I see you. You screwed up criminally. You slept with a married man. A lot of people would say you are an accessory. A lot of people would say Martin MacNeill killed his wife because of you.
So, is that unfair portrayal of who you are or do your actions warrant those labels?
WILLIS: I think it`s unfair. I think my story would be completely different than it has been portrayed.
HUTT: Here`s my question for you. I`m not going to make a moral judgment on your behavior. You weren`t the one married. I`m not comfortable with what went on, but I`m not making that moral judgment.
However, the moving in as the, quote/unquote, "nanny". Can you please explain what that was about? Because I don`t get it.
WILLIS: When Martin MacNeill`s wife died, the family sounded like they were in chaos. What I heard was Martin`s story, but he needed help and he asked for my support and I told him I was there to help any way I could. And so that is how that began.
PINSKY: All right. Thank you, panel.
Next up, imagine thinking a loved one might have died by seeing pictures of his lifeless body on Facebook. That happened.
And later, Rob Ford goes Hollywood. What is he doing here with Jimmy Kimmel? We`ll be back to look at that and more after this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That night in my home, nobody had (INAUDIBLE). Never.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She`s accused of injecting heroin into Dylan`s arm. The 19-year-old died inside this home that night. Tina Owens says three of his friend had a hand in his death. The trio abused his lifeless body, handcuffing his wrist to a bed post.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The one boy videotaped my son and took pictures of Dylan and posted it on Facebook.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny and the behavior bureau. Mike, Sam, Ginger, and clinical and forensic psychologist, Cheryl Arutt, joins us.
We`re talking about a kid who died of a heroin overdose and his friends took pictures of the lifeless body. Now, to be fair, apparently, they didn`t know he was dead at the time. But come on.
They posted these photos on Facebook. Dylan was weeks away from enlisting in the army. He apparently was partying with three friends, and one is accused of injecting heroin in his arms. While he was unconscious, one friend took pictures and posted them online.
Mike, here`s my concern. Mom seems to be blaming and rationalizing and deflecting, and this guy going to the army, no bueno.
CATHERWOOD: You`re exactly right. I mean, this is a tragedy through and through. And his friends -- regardless if they knew he was dead or not, I think it`s a little bit disgusting. And it`s just a bit insulting to him to post pictures on Facebook after just apparently overdosing on heroin.
But this young man, like all drug addicts and all drug users, myself included, you know what you`re getting into when you start to use these dangerous drugs. And that`s oftentimes why it`s so tragic when young kids fall victim to drugs, because they`re fatal. They`re fatal drugs. And that`s the consequence.
And everyone out there contemplating getting involved in the game of heroin, needs to understand even a kid looking at going into the military and has his life ahead of him, that`s all it takes, really just one time, to, quote-unquote, "party with your friends."
PINSKY: Yes. The party -- it`s not partying. These are co-addicts using together. The business of him being shot in two arms, oh my goodness. Look, when you`re shooting airline, you lose a vein and go to the other one. That`s just how it works when you`re shooting heroin.
So, Mike, people can understand where you`re coming from -- how many times were you resuscitated, dead, and how many times to be taken into hospitals with seizures, would you say?
CATHERWOOD: Just in the last two months of my heavy use when I was on the east coast, I was rushed to the hospital three times, in just a couple months. And it didn`t seem to faze me one bit.
And I laugh, but it`s really not funny. That just shows you the extent of the disease. Once you get to the point where the -- your actually love affair with your drug of choice becomes so much more -- profoundly more important than anything else in the world, you almost recognize the fact that it could be potentially fatal and don`t care.
CATHERWOOD: I think that -- yes. And I truly feel so sorry.
PINSKY: Yes. Yes. That`s what I was saying. The disgusting part of this is not that the kid died of a drug addiction. The disgusting part, Sam, is that people think it`s OK to put this stuff on social media.
SCHACHER: I know, Dr. Drew. It`s so disgusting, but I hate saying this. It`s common. Not to the point of a heroin overdose and then taking pictures, while they thought he was passed out if that is the case. But you see people posting photos of their friends inebriated or blacked out, or writing stuff on their face, because they`re looking reaction from their friends, or they`re seeking some sort of validation. And it`s not all that uncommon, as disgusting as it is.
GONZAGA: Yes. I agree. I think they were behaving the way that people would be behaved while they`re high. I think they thought he was passed out and they did something where it`s instant.
You know, on the Internet you can do something. It takes one second to be instant and three seconds to make a good decision.
However, I think the mom might be in a little bit of denial about the child`s drug use. Obviously, he had friends over. I read he left a 2- year-old child behind. So, this is an 18-year-old with a 2-year-old child. He should not have friends over and partying at all. He should be with a child.
So that`s -- I mean, there`s just a whole slew of problems with this, the child could have had.
PINSKY: Absolutely, Ginger.
And, Cheryl, there`s another layer to this that drives me insane, which is young people are using -- they see somebody passed out, let`s leave them alone, let`s put him in the shower, let`s take a picture, won`t it be funny, you know, take pictures on his face. When somebody is unconscious, like un-arousable using drugs, that`s a medical emergency.
CHERYL ARUTT, CLINICAL & FORENSIC PSYCHOLOGIST: You`re absolutely right. I think what you`re talking about is bystander intervention. If you see a girl who`s passed out and some guys are carting her off, why not be protective. We`re teaching people specific steps of what they can do. If you see something, say something.
I also want to say there are other victims here, too, which is the family of Dylan Owens in that we kind of have the perfect storm of traumatic stress here. You have -- not only did he die be people who were supposed to be his memory, but visual memory is the worst kind. There are people, for example, who have PTSD because they saw the planes hit the World Trade Center so many times who weren`t even there when it happened, because of visual memory.
PINSKY: This poor mom, other friends, had to see his picture probably before they found out he died by seeing his pictures. And the people opposed to those pictures --
ARUTT: And it`s burned in their brain.
PINSKY: Not facing any charges.
Thank you, panel.
Next up, the man known as crack mayor hits Hollywood. What`s he up to now? You`ll find out.
And later, did too much sex force a woman to kill her husband? That`s what she wants the jury to believe.
Back with that after this.
PINSKY: Not facing any charges. Thank you, panel.
Next up, the man known as crack mayor hits Hollywood. What is he up to now? You`ll find out.
And later, did too much sex force a woman to kill her husband? That`s what she wants the jury to believe. Back with that after this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROB FORD, TORONTO MAYOR: I do not use crack cocaine nor am I an addict of crack cocaine. Am I an addict? No. Have I tried it? Probably in one of my drunken stupors.
Excuse me, guys.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny and Wendy, Ginger, Sam, and Mike. Coming up, we have a story where a wife, perhaps, killed her husband as she says because he forced her to have too much sex. We will debate that and more details about that case.
But first, Toronto`s crack mayor, Rob Ford, he appeared on "Jimmy Kimmel Live" last night. That guy does not disappoint. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIMMY KIMMEL, HOST, "JIMMY KIMMEL LIVE": Listen. You know, if you`re drinking enough that you try crack in your 40s and you don`t remember it, maybe that`s something that you might want to think about like talking to somebody.
FORD: I wasn`t elected to be perfect, Jimmy. I was elected to clean up the mess I inherited, and that`s exactly what I`ve done.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Ginger, I see you going nuts laughing at the footage here. What are you going to say?
GINGER GONZAGA, GINGERGONZAGA.COM: I mean, I just love him so much. First of all, he says he`s there to clean up the mess. You can`t clean up the mess if you are a mess. He has several claims like he saved Toronto billions of dollars. Something tells me he just probably forgot to pay their bills. But I love him. He implemented into his council if you see him dancing, he implemented these dance breaks because he heard that they do that in Texas.
And by the way, Canada, if you`re going to take tips from us for your legal advice or however you run your town, don`t take it from Texas. I mean, they`re like executing everyone left and right.
PINSKY: I`m concerned. I think he may be a good politician, but I`m concerned he`s going to die of his alcoholism in some sort of binge some time.
MIKE CATHERWOOD, RADIO & TV HOST: You isolated the one clip from Kimmel`s interview with him last night that I thought he came off poorly. I thought every other aspect of the interview, he really came off as the type of politician we need more of in the United States. And I don`t mean his antics. I mean, the fact that he seems to be incredibly transparent.
And by all accounts, you know, Ginger makes fun. He does have these wild claims about saving a billion dollars and things. But, by all accounts, his head financial expert or chief of his financial staff there in Toronto, I don`t know what they call it in Canada, who is an opponent of his politically, you know, agrees with him, that he has saved the city a lot. He`s initiated incredible rapid transit development, but he did not cop out or come to any level of honesty when it came to his drinking and drug use.
PINSKY: Mike, you said you want to see more of him on Kimmel. So, here`s more from the crack mayor on "Jimmy Kimmel Live." Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FORD: I`ll rip (EXPLETIVE DELETED) throat out.
KIMMEL: it was clearly not your friend videotaped you without your knowledge here. Who are you talking about in that video? You don`t know.
KIMMEL: You have no idea.
KIMMEL: You have that many enemies that you don`t know which one this was.
KIMMEL: That lady, you apologized to her afterwards.
KIMMEL: Is it -- once you get up to a certain speed there`s no stopping?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Actually, you have to see more of this. Jimmy Kimmel then asked the crack mayor -- I`m going to show more of this -- asked him about his chances for re-election. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KIMMEL: So, you`re running for mayor right now for re-election.
FORD: Absolutely. I`ve been responsible with taxpayers` money for 14 years as a counselor and a mayor. I`ve saved a billion dollars. And it`s customer service and accountability. And I`ve got a proven track record of success. Talk is cheap. Action speaks louder than words. We`ll let the people decide on October 27th. I`m just a normal, average, hard-working politician that`s real.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Jenny, I think he`s going to get re-elected.
JENNY HUTT, ATTORNEY: Listen, Dr. Drew, I think he`s going to get re- elected. But there was a part of this interview that really -- that upset me and probably because I have own issues about food, but at one point, Jimmy Kimmel after he`d been talking about dieting the mayor, Jimmy Kimmel showed a picture of his dressing room and the dessert tray was empty and that vegetable tray have been untouched.
PINSKY: All right.
PINSKY: But he likes crack and he likes to binge on alcohol. That`s the biggest problem.
WENDY WALSH, PH.D., PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, I don`t know that he necessarily likes crack. I know he stumbled upon it once -- in a stupor. Listen --
PINSKY: Mike, do you like crack? Mike Catherwood, you like crack --
CATHERWOOD: Crack is so awesome.
PINSKY: OK. Thank you. Just checking.
PINSKY: Go ahead, Wendy.
WALSH: Well, my thinking is this. You know, as Mike said, he`s really real. And he has this transparency that we certainly don`t have here in America. But he also has this real, like, regular guy working class attitude. And I think there are a lot of voters in Toronto, I`m from Toronto, who might look at that and say this guy is anti-establishment, he`s our man. He`s one of us in there --
PINSKY: I think that`s why, Sam, he`s going to get re-elected, but I hope he survived his next administration.
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. It`s interesting, Dr. Drew, because I`ve been highly critical of Rob Ford from the very beginning, but after watching that clip last night, I`m sorry. He is likable. And then I did some further research about how great his track record is, and it is. And even little sacrifices like he will forego a driver wherever he goes to save the taxpayers their dollar. He will pay --
PINSKY: Sam, hold on.
SCHACHER: Yes? Yes?
PINSKY: Everybody, let`s pull back and see the panel. How many people given we`ve been reporting on Rob Ford him for a while and his antics? He is an alcohol -- binge alcoholic over here. He apparently is a good politician. Sam, you`re looking at everything he does. You like it. Ginger, you say it`s good. You like him. He`s great.
SCHACHER: I didn`t get to finish what I was saying.
PINSKY: Well, what I want you --
PINSKY: Wait a second. Who would vote for him in the next election if you`re a Toronto citizen? Hands up.
CATHERWOOD: right here. I`m moving to Toronto just to vote for him.
CATHERWOOD: Love it!
PINSKY: No. OK. It`s 3-3. The critics agree, 3-3.
WALSH: We`re not his demographics.
SCHACHER: I hope that he gets help, but what I was trying to say is he does make a lot of personal sacrifices for the people. And I thought it was really interesting a radio show recently called up 600 members of office to complain about a pothole. And Mayor Rob Ford was one of three that called back and then he handled it personally himself without even know that it was a setup. So, he is a man of the people.
PINSKY: There you go.
PINSKY: Next up, a wife says --
PINSKY: Hold on. A wife says -- you guys will chew on this one next. A wife says too much sex led to the killing of her husband by her.
And later, the reporter who got slammed by a snowplow speaks after this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Marissa Devault grabbed a hammer and beat her sleeping husband repeatedly in the head.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Marissa Devault claims abuse.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She claimed her husband had choked her.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I woke up to this.
SEGUN ODUOLOWU, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: While she claims all this sexual abuse was going on, she was carrying on an affair with another man.
SCHACHER: She lied to her boy toy on the side as well.
PINSKY: The constant lying, the constant manipulations.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In this interview she blamed the hammer attack on her roommate, Stanley Cook.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: I`m back with Jenny, Eboni, Cheryl, and Segun. A wife now on trial, admits she killed her husband with a hammer. But before she confessed, she told police her roommate did it. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I woke up to this.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Okay.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And he was bent down a little bit lower and he was very polite to me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What did he say?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This (EXPLETIVE DELETED) is mine. It`s the one I remember the most, something about (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You blacked out.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And then the next thing I see is -- I saw a hammer go into Dale`s head.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: And she`s laughing. Segun, she blames the roommate and then he confesses to something he didn`t do. There`s this roommate thing is adding a whole wrinkle that I can`t quite get my head around. Do you have any way of understanding this?
ODUOLOWU: Well, yes, Dr. Drew. It speaks to the despicable nature of this woman. Number one, this soiled dove of a lady was on a website for sugar babies looking for sugar daddies. So, her judgment is actually suspect. And the guy that -- the roommate we`re talking about is a mentally ill who has severe brain damage that she left in charge of watching the kids. So, again, her judgment is not the best.
And this roommate, I don`t think he knows what he`s doing. He admits to having memory losses, not understanding questions. For her to say that he did it, to even implicate this man whose intelligence is compromised just speaks to the kind of character this woman displayed. She was carrying on an affair, like I said, last time with another man. Then she`s claiming too much sex is why she killed her husband with a hammer.
You know what? She`ll probably get off because someone as talented as Eboni in the defense department will find that she`s just like some psychotic creature we`ve never seen before. And they`ll put her in the (INAUDIBLE). And she`ll get away with murder.
PINSKY: Eboni, what do you say? Go ahead, Eboni.
EBONI WILLIAMS, ATTORNEY: Yes. Not only is her judgment suspect, Segun. Her credibility is horrible. She`s a defense lawyer`s worst nightmare. We saw on the footage there, Dr. Drew, she`s laughing as she`s describing her husband`s head being pounded in. She`s telling one story. The physical evidence shows something else.
She`s clearly talked this poor roommate of hers who has serious mental illness into being some scapegoat. She probably promised him some money from the insurance claim she`s probably --
PINSKY: Or sex.
WILLIAMS: It`s absolutely horrible. Her defense lawyer is going to have a hell of a time trying to convince a jury of anything other than this woman`s complete and utter guilt.
ODUOLOWU: But I thought you loved challenges like this?
ODUOLOWU: I thought defense attorneys love challenges like this.
PINSKY: And a day after this woman is bailed out of jail, get this, guys, she was found beaten on the side of the road. Just beaten up. She claims didn`t know who beat her. Later, the roommate whom you saw -- put up on the screen again, the problems with the man. You know, his brain injury, the fact that he`d been living with this family for five years rent free, taking care of kids, very suspect, he originally confessed to Dale`s murder.
He was going to take the fall for this woman, and apparently, it was a motorcycle accident that caused the brain injuries. In court, he apparently was a complete mess. He couldn`t remember who his attorney was. He describes himself as a manic-depressive. He only thing he could say was I can`t remember to almost every question he was asked. Cheryl, she was beat up on the side of the road.
CHERYL ARUTT, PSY.D., CLINICAL & FORENSIC PSYCHOLOGIST: What`s the question, Dr. Drew?
PINSKY: You`re right. There were a lot of things there. One was what`s up with this guy that`s living with them for five years that was willing to take the fall for the murder. And second, what`s up with the chaos in this woman`s life that she ends up on the side of the road when she gets out on bail for murder?
ARUTT: Well, first of all, it is -- unfortunately, it`s quite easy to take advantage of someone who has brain injuries or has a lower IQ. And clearly, I think she was manipulating him. My understanding is that she may have learned that the insurance policy wouldn`t pay out if she had anything to do with the murder. So, what I think probably happened is she explained this to Stan and painted a picture of how this would be a good idea for him to say he did it.
It makes me very sad and very uncomfortable that she was willing to put this guy in this position. I do think, though, that we can`t just say that because she did these despicable things and because her judgment was really poor which it clearly was and all of that, that there was not domestic abuse there. I do think this woman was a victim of domestic violence.
ODUOLOWU: Can you say the despicable acts make her a despicable person?
ARUTT: I`m saying I think there`s more than one despicable person here. And clearly, I think she`s got some huge, huge problems. But even when she finds her sugar daddy, he makes it a loan. She`s sleeping with him and he makes it a loan at 30 percent interest and subtracts when she buys herself a sandwich. I`m sorry, but on what planet is that even a sugar daddy?
PINSKY: She went to a sugar daddy website. She went to a sugar daddy website --
ARUTT: And had a deal.
PINSKY: -- there was nothing suspicious about the husband, the victim, and yet, the wife, they were concerned about for quite some time. We have to leave it there.
Next, snowed under on live TV. We have the video. The reporter`s reaction to this close call.
And a reminder, you can find us any time on Instagram @DrDrewHLN. We`ll be back right after this.
PINSKY: Back with Jenny, Sam, Mike, and Segun. Now, you guys -- have you ever been standing on the side of the road, doing live when a snowplow comes by and just ruins your day?
PINSKY: Well, this reporter in New Jersey --
PINSKY: -- knows exactly what I`m talking about. Well, not in L.A. This doesn`t happen.
PINSKY: Take a look at this from my Fox Philly. Check it out. He doesn`t miss a beat. Let`s show that footage if you can. There it is. It`s like being hit by a wave. Doesn`t miss a beat. Keeps right on reporting. But the snowplow driver`s wife saw the video, made her husband call that reporter and apologize.
PINSKY: And of course the reporter had really a sense of humor about the whole thing. He eventually tweeted later, "I knew I was in for a bad day when I saw an e-mail from fired Governor Christie staffer, quote, "time for some snowplow troubles for Steve Keeley." And then "pow."
SCHACHER: Oh, boy.
PINSKY: Yes. So, what`s that, Mike?
CATHERWOOD: It`s just so awesome. It`s so awesome.
CATHERWOOD: You know why? Because, let me tell you something. And I know this for a fact. I don`t know how, but that snowplow driver saw that they were filming and that was the greatest day of his life. He said watch me get on TV and just rocket this guy with a wave of snow.
ODUOLOWU: Mike, you`re 100 percent correct. He did that on purpose.
PINSKY: However, Segun, it was a miracle that he wasn`t hurt. A miracle, I tell you.
ODUOLOWU: Well, no, Dr. Drew. It is a miracle because that guy -- you see, guys, how I love the way that you poke at miracles like miracles don`t happen. That`s fine. But he was professional. And we should all be that lucky to be that professional when you get hit by a wave of snow and you don`t miss a beat, because you know, Some of us if our makeup is wrong, we can`t even talk.
SCHACHER: You`re absolutely right, Segun. I`m sure if that was me, I know, I would have screamed or laughed or cried. I mean, he just carried on like it was no big deal. Props to him.
ODUOLOWU: Sam, you agreed with me? Sam agreed with me.
PINSKY: Yes, Mike?
CATHERWOOD: I just want to say that I`ve had a very similar dream with Sam where I was covering her in a wave of white substance too.
HUTT: Oh, Mike!
PINSKY: Stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, Mike.
ODUOLOWU: Commercials. Commercials. Commercial break. Commercial break.
PINSKY: Now, this is a perfect opportunity for me to say something.
PINSKY: If you have a criticism --
SCHACHER: I`m red.
PINSKY: -- of any of my participants, you can now vine us #DrDrew, #gripevine. Isn`t that cute? Not grapevine but gripevine. There`s no middle man. No gate keeper. I`ll see them all. I`m sure we`re going to have a lot about mike. This may be his last appearance on here. Sam, I apologize.
CATHERWOOD: Oh, come on!
SCHACHER: No. It`s all in fun. Dr. Drew, no apology needed. It`s all in fun.
PINSKY: Got to go. "Last Call" is next.
PINSKY: Time for the "Last Call." Jenny, your comments on Rob Ford.
HUTT: I just felt a little bad for him on Jimmy Kimmel. But I was happy, Dr. Drew, that Jimmy Kimmel did bring up that he should get help. That was responsible.
PINSKY: There you go. "Right This Minute" starts right this minute.