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Ignored & Abused 9-Year-Old Dies
Aired April 10, 2014 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST (voice-over): Tonight, beaten to death. This little boy told a teacher about abuse at home. Cops were called to the school and did nothing. Who failed this child?
Plus, a teacher is charged with sexually assaulting three students and sending pornographic texts.
Then, disturbing videos gone viral.
Let`s get started.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Good evening.
I`m joined tonight by my co-host Jenny Hutt from Sirius XM Radio.
And coming up, a teacher charged with sexual assault of three teenage students.
First, though, new developments in the case of the 9-year-old Omaree who was stomped to death by his own mother.
Jenny, I know how disturbing this was. He told me before this show you wanted to throw up last night.
JENNY HUTT, CO-HOST: Yes, I`m having a really hard time with this story, Dr. Drew. I -- there were signs, there were warnings. Why didn`t someone rescue this child?
PINSKY: That`s what we`re going to get into. Last night, you heard a disturbing 911 call in which the parents, the stepdad and the mom, curse and berate this child. That is six months before the ultimate demise in their hands. And tonight, we`re learning that this 911 call is just one of the instance of abuse in which police have been called and nothing done.
Watch this. A warning, it is very disturbing.
STEPDAD: Shut the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) before I really (EXPLETIVE DELETED) pop you hard, man.
MOM: You caused this on yourself, Omaree.
STEPDAD: I`ve never hated nobody like you in my life, ever.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The video begins with two officers arriving on scene.
OFFICER: The 911 lady sent me a call. She said if I was to hear the call, how bad it was.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Lapel video shows Varela Casaus and the boy`s stepdad, Steve Casaus, giving police all kinds of excuses.
UNIDENTFIEID MALE: It said that somebody was abusing the kid or yelling at the kid.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just because they don`t listen and I was just stressed out. I was just having a bad day.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Guys, you seem like good family, decent family. I`m going to overlook it right now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMAEL: The way police handled this case was so horrifying.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One officer has been fired. One officer has been suspended.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two more Albuquerque police officers have been suspended for their handling of the Omaree Varela case.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A teacher at Omaree`s Varela school notified authorities after the child told her his mother beat him with a phone and belt. She did write a report. There were problems with the way evidence was processed and issues with the follow-up in the case.
Today, Jara was suspended for 40 hours and Jara`s supervisor was suspended for eight hours.
PINSKY: Joining us, Segun Oduolowu, social commentator, Anahita Sedaghatfar, defense attorney, Vanessa Barnett, social commentator, host of hiphollywood.com.
Vanessa, give us more of the details in this case.
VANESSA BARNETT, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. Now, we know two officers have been suspended in connection with this situation. Omaree showed up to school with visible bruises on his face. The teacher then called the police. Officer shows up.
By that time, Omaree`s mom was already there. He, of course, changed his story. And the officer said that she did not think he was safe with his mother. Did nothing. Didn`t arrest her. Didn`t take Omaree away. And then CPS was also there and they felt it was not necessary to remove him from the situation, either.
So, the officer was suspended and now her superior, too, has been suspended.
PINSKY: Anahita, you`re saying unbelievable.
ANAHITA SEDAGHATFAR, ATTORNEY: It`s unbelievable, Dr. Drew. You just asked who failed this little boy. I think everyone failed him. OK?
It was just -- it was the police. It was CPS. It was the teachers. It was the school.
So many people knew that this little boy was being abused and yet no one could protect him. He had called 911. He had told his teachers. They saw bruises on him. No one was able to help him.
So, kudos to this police department for firing and suspending each and every police officer, Dr. Drew, that failed to follow simple protocol here. Because I think this boy`s life really could have been saved. Obviously, his parents failed him the most -- his deranged, disgusting sick parents. He really could have been saved had someone simply followed protocol, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Segun, do you have -- do you disagree, as often you disagree with everything. Are you disagreeing tonight, or do you agree? Just answer me that.
SEGUN ODUOLOWU, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: No, Dr. Drew, I don`t --
PINSKY: No disagreement. Then answer me this.
ODUOLOWU: Yes, sir.
PINSKY: Anahita says fire everybody associated with this case. These are people in helping professions that make mistakes. This is the thing I was saying last night.
ODUOLOWU: No, no.
PINSKY: It`s an unbelievable situation. Why can`t we make helping people better? They`ll never do this again, but they`re going to be fired, they`re never going to do it again because they were fired.
ODUOLOWU: Here`s the issue, Dr. Drew. For evil to reign, good people do nothing. In this case, good people did nothing at every turn. The teachers, the police -- everybody who was in charge to help this kid failed him. So, firing is not enough because firing won`t bring the kid back.
PINSKY: Oh, you`re saying criminal charges against people who are trying to help. Jenny, go ahead.
BARNETT: They`re not trying to help. They actually did nothing. They weren`t trying to help. They had the opportunity to help and did nothing. It`s not like we`re firing these great people that are upholding the law and doing their best. No, they didn`t do anything. You get fired when you don`t do anything.
ODUOLOWU: Anahita, you know this mother had been arrested 35 times. The stepdad 18. That kid would have been put back in the home even if CPS had removed him in the first place.
PINSKY: Shame on the legal profession.
SEDAGHATFAR: Yes, the system is terrible when it came to this particular child and lots of other children, Dr. Drew.
But to touch on your point you made, why not teach these police officers, educate them, give them training? That`s fine and dandy. But this is plain common sense. OK?
When you`re a police officer and you get called in to investigate child abuse, how about interviewing the child? Take him away from the parents. Ask him some questions.
How about filing a police report, writing down that you went there? If someone tells you, Dr. Drew, there`s a 9 11 tape with evidence of child abuse, why not listen to that 911 tape?
So, I don`t know how you can teach --
ODUOLOWU: Dr. Drew, this is why the book needs to be thrown at them. There was a two-hour interview in the home but the cop`s recorder only took 15 minutes of it. So, what happened to the other one hour and 45 minutes the cops didn`t have on the tape that could have shown much more evidence to how bad the kid was being treated?
PINSKY: All right. Give me, me and Jenny. Just me and Jenny in the screen for a second.
Jenny, here we are again, we did this last nights you and I. We`ve gone through the same cycles. I have misgivings about it. I understand what everyone is saying.
Do you see this differently tonight or is this panel right on?
HUTT: Oh my gosh. It`s worse and worse.
First of all, the good news is -- there`s no good news except that we see this boy, we see the parents and we see the whole picture now and it`s so tragic and vile that my hope is nobody else will have to go through something like this and a child will be saved because someone watching won`t make the mistake.
PINSKY: That`s right. Here`s my thing. This is what I want to be sympathetic to. Our systems are not necessarily the issue. Systems can`t solve family problems, necessarily. They`re going to be flawed. There`s going to be mistakes.
The problem is screwed up people, screwed up people being parents. That is the problem. For all I`m saying --
SEDAGHATFAR: They were screwed up.
PINSKY: It`s all I`m saying, guys. We should be protecting kids. I agree with you guys completely.
But there are going to be failures in the system. System is overwhelmed from all the screwed up people having so many kids. That`s our problem, here.
Thank you, guys.
ODUOLOWU: When the powers that be fail, throw the book at them.
PINSKY: I`m with -- then who`s going to go into helping professions in every time you make a mistake you have a criminal liability?
ODUOLOWU: When it causes the life of a kid.
BARNETT: When somebody dies --
PINSKY: You guys are right, but you`re not. That`s all I`m saying. I have deep sympathy with the points you`re making and don`t disagree with them. However, who`s going go into helping professions if every time there`s a slip, there`s a criminal liability?
ODUOLOWU: Better people than these ones.
HUTT: People who really want to help.
PINSKY: Apparently these were good --
ODUOLOWU: They`re not good people.
PINSKY: Listen, I`m having a panic attack, so I need a behavior bureau, OK? Let me do that.
And later, I`ve got a teacher, this is even more disturbing. Well, not more disturbing. The viewers` reaction to it is what`s disturbing. A teacher is charged with sex crimes against some male students. And how the Twitter-verse is responding to this will shock you.
Back after this.
STEPDAD: I could beat the life out of you, shut up! That is not a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) rugburn.
MOM: It`s not a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) bruise either. That`s not a bruise. That doesn`t hurt.
STEPDAD: You`re a (EXPLETIVE DELETED), everything hurts you.
I`ve never hated nobody like you in my life, ever. You know that, Omaree? I hate you more than I hate anybody no my whole life. And I`ve been on this earth 41 years and nobody`s ever made me (EXPLETIVE DELETED) feel the way you do, Omaree, ever!
PINSKY: And Jenny back with me.
It`s hard to believe anyone who`s been on this earth 41 years could behave like that towards any child. It`s unbelievable.
HUTT: As I said last night, Dr. Drew, I want to kick them. I want to kick the mother and I want to kick the father. Thank goodness that kid`s not suffering.
PINSKY: That is a --
PINSKY: That is a the 911 call, it reveals the extent of the verbal abuse 9-year-old Omaree endured. He told his teacher about physical abuse, but police showed up to the school. Still nothing done.
Let`s bring in the behavior bureau. I`ve got Wendy Walsh, psychotherapist, author of "The 30-Day Love Detox", Samantha Schacher, host of "Pop Trigger", Danine Manette, criminal investigator, author of "Ultimate Betrayal".
Danine, you always have a way of helping me with these situations. I`m having a panic attack about this. It`s easy to say -- it`s really easy to say, hey, fire everybody who touched this kid, there`s a child`s life on the line here, put these parents away.
DANINE MANETTE, CRIMINAL INVESTIGATOR: Right.
PINSKY: You heard what I was getting panicky about, this idea everyone in a helping position, if they make a slip, it`s a bad one admittedly. It has to have a criminal liability or fear of being fired or both.
MANETTE: That`s the problem, Dr. Drew. You`re referring to this as a slipup or mistake. Not writing the proper name in a police report is a slipup or mistake.
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, POP TRIGGER: Right.
MANETTE: Failure to ask the people when you get to the home if they`re on probation or parole is standard protocol in these situations. Isolating the victim and interviewing them separately is standard protocol. This is gross negligence on their part.
If this had been a call with a battered wife in the background, they would have gone there, would have separated the two parties, they would have found out what was going on. Someone would have either been arrested or detained or something. This was absolute gross negligence on their part. They are paid to intervene, they are trained to intervene and they just did not do a good job.
SCHACHER: Yes, amen, Danine.
PINSKY: Now, listen, I`m reading a tweet alongside in my head, it says, "The root cause is bad people becoming bad parents."
That, ladies and gentlemen is the core of the problem. I`ve been doing a show called "Love line" for 30 years. And that`s when Carolla and I used to do that, we`d always say, what did we learn on that show every night? Screwed up people having screwed up kids, the scores of our problem.
On the phone, I`ve got Roberta Morales. She is a friend of Omaree`s mother.
Roberta, you say you never saw Omaree`s mom abuse him, is that right?
ROBERTA MORALES, FRIEND OF OMAREE`S MOTHER (via telephone): That`s right. That`s right. I`ve never seen Omaree`s mom abuse him. I`m irritated about this whole story.
When this first story first aired, the first breaking news that was said, they separated, they took the siblings. The siblings stated to them that the parents, with an "S," first story -- first story that hit that the parents disciplined them with belts. So that means there`s more than one. They didn`t say my mother, parents.
But her husband, Stephan, which was not ever talked about or anything was in that home. OK? If you look on her Facebook page --
PINSKY: So, Roberta, let me get this. The husband and the stepdad?
MORALES: The stepfather.
PINSKY: OK. Let me tell you a quote that the mom is alleged to have said. She said, quote, "I kicked him the wrong way," unquote. And that`s why he died.
MORALES: Correct. Here`s my point. Here`s my point. First of all, there`s two parents in this house. OK? They know this.
Now, he was never surfaced, he was never on the news. He acted like he wasn`t there. Now, you --
PINSKY: Listen, I`ve got his voice. Roberta, I`ve got his voice on the 911 tape saying things that are unspeakable to another person, a 9 - year-old.
OK, hold your horses, Roberta. I`m going to give my panelists a chance to talk to you.
Sam, what do you have to say?
SCHACHER: Yes, Roberta, so she stomped -- I can`t even verbalize it it`s so disgusting. She stomped her child to death. Why are you even somehow trying to take the blame away from that?
MORALES: No, I`m not --
SCHACHER: Both of them are monsters. Both them are monsters.
MORALES: Let me tell you what I`m trying to do. You guys don`t listen very good because when it first aired, it said the parents. Now, the man, the husband, the stepfather, was never even acknowledged until a couple of days ago.
Recently, his story changed. He was in the house when that happened. OK? The whole time. On her Facebook page, when we were posting, the daughter of the father -- the stepfather, did what he said. She can`t hear you. Don`t say nothing. Why -- the daughter or stepbrother say, you know what, this b-i-t-c-h kill my brother. She didn`t say that.
So, in my heart, I believe and I know with everything I have, Cynthia`s innocent. Now, I don`t condone that she allows this type of behavior.
PINSKY: Hold on a second, Roberta, hold it, hold it. I know, yes, yes, I agree this is an abusive home. Wendy, go ahead.
WENDY WALSH, PSYCHOLOGIST: You know, I`m going to say something that in some degree backs up Roberta. I`m sorry, Dr. Drew, this is the worst story we`ve ever covered. We`re able to see the emotional abuse and hear it in the 911 call.
And when I hear that kind of criticism aimed at a small child with a developing brain, my heart breaks. If we can say that there`s justice for this child at all --
MORALES: There`s going to be justice.
WALSH: Wait, excuse me, darling. Can we just say that at least we can educate the world that emotional abuse is abuse? This is damage. This is an injury.
PINSKY: It injures the brain.
WALSH: Here`s where I will back you up, and this goes out to every freaking single mother in America and I`m one of you. One of the most dangerous places for a child to live in America is in a home with a non- biologically related male.
You watch your, you know, where you`re putting your stuff, lady, when you`re out messing with men and bringing a man into your home who can potentially hurt your child. Now, I do think this mother is culpable, too, but I think she`s also compliant with this guy. And this is not good. \
PINSKY: Wendy, one more thing. Roberta, hold on. I have to put her on hold. We`re going to have to get control of this.
Let me say one thing to follow what Wendy said.
Roberta, I want to thank you for joining us. I`m going to thank the panel.
If you have a history of abuse yourself, particularly sexual abuse, you`re likely to be attracted to a man that will repeat those patterns and potentially be a perpetrator. So, be careful to Wendy is saying to the guys you bring in. If you were an object of physical abuse when you were growing up, you`ll likely bring that kind of guy around the house. Just be aware of those patterns. So, if you`re super attractive to a guy that may have -- Wendy, you agree with me on this? Maybe that kind of person.
WALSH: I absolutely agree.
In fact, if you become more sexually stimulated by these guys, they probably are the bad guy that you don`t want.
PINSKY: So don`t bring him in. You can go ahead and date them, whatever, don`t bring them around the kids.
HLN, by the way, cannot confirm or deny the claims made by Roberta this evening. I want to thank the panelists. I have to move on out to the next story.
We have a story of a woman cops say molested three of her students. It`s uplifting night. It`s a night of uplifting stories. Two of these kids were in the classroom. They`re males. And again, what`s most disturbing about this story is how you all reacted to it.
And later, it looks like a cop, a policeman, has a young, young almost a child in a choke hold. There`s a lot more to this story.
Back after this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Students at the school where she thought, accused of molesting them, using a classroom in two of the cases and the inside of a car off campus in the third. Some horrible charges. She`s accused of sending sexual texts and smartphone messages to three boys.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There are people who are taking advantage of their positions of trust.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny, Segun, Anahita, and Vanessa.
Students called the middle school teacher prior to having been reported for this behavior. Prior, she was described as flirty, and then they were not surprised to hear she was arrested.
Twenty-eight-year-old Melissa Lindgren is accused of sexually molesting three teenage boys in her class. Police say she sent them sexually explicit text messages, then nude photos, then two of the boys say she touched them inappropriately in a classroom. Third case, she`s alleged to have molested a boy in car parked off campus.
Vanessa, you were a teacher. Your thoughts?
BARNETT: Well, yes, I was a substitute teacher for some time, in junior high. I taught eighth grade, actually. And, you know, I`m not defending this woman and I`m not blaming the victim, but I know what it is to have 13, 14, 15-year-old boys come and say things to me that would make you blush.
I`ve been hit on by 14-year-old boys that don`t care about my age, their age. And they`ve just say -- they`ve asked to do things to me that my husband hasn`t even had a chance to do yet. These little boys are pretty fresh. And so --
PINSKY: But, Vanessa --
BARNETT: People want to know why --
PINSKY: You held your boundary, though. You did what a teacher needs to do to keep a child safe.
BARNETT: When you mix a teacher with low self-esteem and meager morals with these fresh kids -- she`s going to make very bad decision. That`s what happened.
You want to know why people don`t view it the same way when a young girl is molested? That is why? I`m giving you the facts. That is why because that`s what they see and that`s what you see in society. So, that`s why people are taking it that way.
ODUOLOWU: Wow. Wow!
BARNETT: It`s wow but it happened. I`m an example of it. It happened.
SEDAGHATFAR: You know the boundaries.
ODUOLOWU: OK. So first of all, I was a teacher as well. I taught eighth grade English. And what you just said quite possibly is the worst thing as a teacher I`ve ever heard another teacher say. I don`t care --
BARNETT: OK, Segun.
ODUOLOWU: I`ll tell you why, because I don`t care how fresh the kids are, as the adult, you know better. And she`s a woman.
Hold on a second. Let`s all put it on the table.
BARNETT: I`ll let you talk.
ODUOLOWU: And we think that because it`s a woman and that these are young boys that it`s somehow not as disgusting or not as bad. But the bottom line is, they were molested by a predator. And because of their age -- hold on a second.
BARNETT: I never said it wasn`t disgusting. She is disgusting.
ODUOLOWU: No, what you said is these boys, because they`re so fresh, might in some way say things that will lead someone with low self-esteem on.
BARNETT: And meager morals. She`s disgusting. She`s disgusting. And in her mind that opened the door.
She`s a disgusting human being. I never doubted that. I never said that wasn`t true.
PINSKY: Ladies, gentleman, Anahita, I want to go to you real quick. It sounds like, in professional training, the talk about boundaries is constantly on the table. You can`t violate a boundary, and a physician, in your case, an attorney and client.
How do we help people understand this is damaging when that boundary is violated?
SEDAGHATFAR: Right, Dr. Drew, you`ve talked about it quite a bit in situations like that, the adult should be the one that sets the boundaries.
PINSKY: Has to be. Has to be.
SEDAGHATFAR: It shouldn`t be on the child setting the boundaries.
PINSKY: They can`t. They learn to set boundaries from adults.
SEDAGHATFAR: Exactly and you said that children of this age, their brains aren`t even fully developed.
SEDAGHATFAR: They`re not capable of making or connecting --
PINSKY: They can`t render consent. Here`s the deal. OK. On the phone --
BARNETT: People you put in these places, you have to put people in places.
PINSKY: Vanessa, I know, I`m going to protect you, I know you mean what you`re saying that sounded, Segun, twisted it a little bit.
ODUOLOWU: I didn`t twist it. America heard what she said. Shame on you, Vanessa.
BARNETT: You have to put the proper people in place to teach children. She wasn`t the proper person.
PINSKY: Well, we have to train them about boundaries. That`s why I brought a superintendent -- hold on.
BARNETT: She wasn`t the right person.
PINSKY: Hang on. Listen, Mr. Pletka, thank you for joining us.
BOB PLETKA, SUPERINTENDENT, FULLERTON SCHOOL DISTRICT (via telephone) : Good evening.
PINSKY: Maybe you can help us on this particular issue. People seem to not understand that a female teacher violating these boundaries with the young males is as destructive, potentially, as the male teachers with female teachers. These are zero tolerance issues.
PLETKA: It`s very destructive. In fact, what our parents give us, what`s most precious to them, is their kids. So they expect that we treat what is most precious, which is their kids, with that same dignity and honor, and in some ways ferocity in protecting them like they to.
And so, as far as its impact, it had a real impact on these boys. We`ve had counselors and psychologists over this last month working with those boys. Working with not just the boys that were violated, but also all the other kids. And because of their sense of trust was broken, that an adult, somebody that they need to rely on and depend on and who`s supposed to protect them did something that ultimately damaged their faith in us as adults.
PINSKY: And, Mr. Pletka, these are still allegations, is that correct? Or is something -- is there more than just an allegation that`s going on here?
PLETKA: She admitted to it.
PINSKY: Oh, my goodness.
ODUOLOWU: Mr. Pletka, if I may ask --
SEDAGHATFAR: Can I ask a question, Dr. Drew?
PINSKY: Segun, real quick.
ODUOLOWU: Mr. Pletka, if I may ask you a question, what is the vetting process? Because we`ve seen so much of this happen more often. What is the vetting process that you guys use to find out a teacher`s background? And if she`s violated this, what is the recourse? What`s going to happen to her?
PINSKY: A real simple question, were you an object of sexual abuse as a child, yourself, and have you had treatment for that?
ODUOLOWU: Mr. Pletka, what do you think of that?
PLETKA: We do a full background check. People are fingerprinted. There`s an FBI check that comes back.
In terms of if there are any priors on an employee. And so that was done also with Melissa in this case.
And so, as far as all the reference checks that are quite extensive, and those background checks are all part of it. But, again, we also look for criminal record as well.
PINSKY: Mr. Pletka, I`ve got to go. Thank you so much for joining us.
Now, what I want to get to, the behavior bureau, what you`re all saying on Twitter, you find nothing wrong with this woman`s behavior because she perpetrated on the young males.
ODUOLOWU: They`re like Vanessa. Shame on Vanessa.
SEDAGHATFAR: Oh my God --
PINSKY: We`ll be back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE REPORTER: Some horrible charges. She is accused of sending sexual texts and smartphone messages to three boys, students at the school where she taught.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: There are people who are taking advantage of their positions of trust.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE REPORTER: Accused off molesting them, using a classroom in two of the cases and the inside of a car off campus in the third.
DR. DAVID DREW, MSNBC HOST OF "DR. DREW ON CALL": Back with Jenny and our behavior bureau, Wendy, Sam, Danine. We are talking about A middle school teacher accused of sex crimes against three of her students.
A teenage boy says she kissed them, touched them inappropriately. We just heard from the director -- the supervisor -- what is his position? -- superintendent of the school district who tells us that she has admitted to some of this.
Take a look at some of the comments online from you all viewers. Luckiest kids ever, those boys scored big. Girls get slut shamed for stuff like this. Boys get high fives. I see all three of my panelists shaking their heads vigorously. Wendy, do you want to have it first.
WENDY WALSH, PSYCHOLOGIST: Yes. I want to explain actually the history of why there is a double standard in the punitive phase in these kinds of crimes. Historically, it was believed that a female victim suffered worse, physiologically because there was more likely chance she could get pregnant, and STD that she would lose her virginity.
DR. DREW: And, people -- let`s be fair, Wendy. That is right. There is a certain sense a woman loses her chastity. They shame her. She is responsible somehow.
WALSH: Right, because of the sexual double standard she loses --
DR. DREW: And, there is a body violation of her body that a male does not have.
WALSH: But, now that we understand so much about sexual development in boys as well as girls, this kind of thing can have huge emotional consequences of boys. So, now we are seeing this backlash where we are saying, wait a sec, we cannot have the double standard anymore.
DR. DREW: However -- however, I got to say, Wendy, there is a little bit of a controversy, and Danine, I will put this on your plate, which is there are these women who are perpetrators selecting males that who are at risk, who already would have had, what we are seeing is more sociopathy, more psychopathology, more substance use. So, the males have terrible outcomes just like the females but are these perpetrators selecting guys who are already going to go bad?
DANINE MANETTE, AUTHOR, "ULTIMATE BETRAYAL": I think they are. I think they are. And, I also think that the person who is doing this selecting, I tend to agree with what have Vanessa was trying to say in the last segment before her words were twisted around.
It is that people who have low self-esteem and are more prone to be attracted to somebody who is going to pump up their feeling and tell them they are great and hit on them and they are more prone to do that and to reach out to these kids that are already in a place of being a little bit more vulnerable.
And, it is really, really sad because these boys suffered just as much as the girls do. But, they have to suffer in silence because everyone is high fiving them making them think, what is wrong with you, why would you report something like that?
DR. DREW: Yes. Right. And, so, Sam, how do we deal with that? How do we deal with that? How do we deal with the world that says, "Oh, I wish I would have been one of those kids when I was 15."
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, HOST "POP TRIGGER": More dialogue like this, Dr. Drew. And, you are right, I was shocked today when I was looking not only on Twitter, but just read the comment section underneath any of the numerous media outlets, who are reporting on this story.
And, not only are you seeing people essentially high fiving this teenager and commenting that this teacher is hot and they wish that, that was their teacher when they were a teenager, but almost condemning the children for speaking out. I cannot even say the language that they were - - yes, calling the children certain words because they are not going along with the teacher. It was beyond me. I knew there was a double standard, but this was alarming.
DR. DREW: All right. Yes. And, Jenny, let me finish with you. You have a middle school-aged kid, young high school-aged kids.
JENNY HUTT, HLN CO-HOST OF "DR. DREW ON CALL": Right.
DR. DREW: You -- yes, go ahead.
HUTT: Well, no, I have not had this experience, thank God --
DR. DREW: Well, the experience of your children having affections for their teachers.
HUTT: Yes. Yes. And it is very different with boys and girls. That is true. But, with my almost 14-year-old girl who talks about the hot history teacher, whatever, it is the teacher`s job to make sure that boundary is never crossed. It is just beyond inappropriate and I fully agree that Vanessa`s words got turned around.
DR. DREW: Big people take care of little people. People in authority have an on obligation to maintain their boundaries with those for whom they are responsible.
DR. DREW: Next up. A cop who appears in this cell phone video tried to detain back teenager in a choke hold. And later, policeman makes a split-second decision. Life-or-death decision. We will show you what he did in response to something, there it is -- After this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(Earlier this week, a woman used her cell phone to record a campus police officer allegedly putting a teen boy in a chokehold.)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: Stay back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: I am staying back.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: We are not doing anything.
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: Stay right there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: I am selecting my citizen rights.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: He is a little kid.
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: Stay back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: I am back.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: We are here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: Am I moving back or am I moving forward? I hear you. You hear me? You are choking the little kid.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW: Back with Jenny, Anahita, Danine and Sam. A police officer assigned to a Southern California school district being investigated for allegedly putting that 14-year-old boy into a choke hold. The teen has been charged with vandalism. We are going to talk to the woman who shot that video, but first I am going to show you a little more of it. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: Stop fighting me.
UNIDENTIFIED 14-YEAR-OLD BOY: I am not fighting you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: He is not fighting you. Are you crazy?
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: He is fighting me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: Are you crazy? Because you are choking him, man.
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: Do not move. Hey little man. Hey little man.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: Hey, do not move, dog. You are good. We have got this on video.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: You are not getting arrested, miho.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: Calm yourself. Calm yourself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER: Relax. Relax. We are right here.
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: Stop speaking Spanish.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW: Anahita, you are the legal representative for the team. I cannot make sense of this one.
ANAHITA SEDAGHATFAR, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Dr. Drew, it is getting to the point where police officers cannot do their jobs because they are worried about lawsuits and public outrage.
DR. DREW: That must be the attorneys` fault.
SEDAGHATFAR: Well, no, absolutely not. It would be the fact that these things get blown up in the media, so that people eventually have to do something.
DR. DREW: So, it is my fault.
SEDAGHATFAR: And, here is the thing -- yes. I like that better, Dr. Drew. But, when you have cell phone videos like this, I have a problem with that because it is totally out of context. We do not know what happened before this woman started recording. Was this guy trying to resist arrest? Did he threaten the officer?
HUTT: A 14-year-old.
SEDAGHATFAR: Did he have a weapon? I think that we really have to wait.
DR. DREW: But, there is an offensive piece in here, Danine, where this woman is speaking in Spanish trying to help assuming this child maybe does not speak English. It is Southern California. There is a lot of, you know multilingual people --
SEDAGHATFAR: He was speaking English.
DR. DREW: Well, Danine --
MANETTE: Who cares?
DR. DREW: Help me with this.
MANETTE: OK. Yes, you know, I do have a problem with the do not -- you know, stop talking in Spanish part. That part bothers me.
HUTT: Me, too.
MANETTE: But, every time I comment on these cases here I get like berated on social media as if I do not know the history of brown people in law enforcement and how we have been mistreated.
But, the fact that the matter is I have been that person who has had to restrain that child in a prone position in a public location while the child was screaming, "They are killing me. They are killing me." So, what I do know is that I need more than a tape that just starts when they are laid flat out on the ground.
I need more information. I need to find out what happened, what transpired. I cannot form a lens mob -- may be the cop is wrong. I just do not have enough to say right now.
DR. DREW: All right. Sam, go ahead. After you, Sam, I am going talk to the woman who actually reported this. So, go ahead.
SCHACHER: OK, and I commend her. For once we are seeing someone who is actually using their smartphones to record an incident for not amusement like we have seen before but to document, to actually show to the police.
So, bravo to the bystanders. But also, besides this video, we also do have eyewitness reports, and they claim that the police officer had the child apprehended with his arms behind his back before he decided to pin him down and get crazy and become power hungry.
DR. DREW: Well, and -- Danine -- Anahita, now you are defending him. OK, interesting. I expected that from Denine. OK. Let me get to the eyewitness. Elvia Fernandez, she is the eye witness who recorded the incident on your cell phone. You were driving by but pulled your car over because you did not like what you saw there. Is that accurate?
ELVIA FERNANDEZ, FILMED BOY BEING CHOKED: Yes.
DR. DREW: What did you see?
FERNANDEZ: I saw him, like, drop him really hard -- with a lot of force, you know? He already had him on the bench, like, it is horrible. It is so hard.
DR. DREW: Alvia, hold on a second. Danine, I want to give you a chance to interview the eyewitness. Is there something she can tell you, Danine, that will help you conceptualize this?
MANETTE: Yes, I need to know at what point you came on the scene. What was going on? Was the child already detained or was there any type of interaction going on between the child and the officer --
DR. DREW: Struggle.
FERNANDEZ: Sorry. He was standing up and the officer was going toward him. He grabbed him, sat him down on the bench. He already had him on the bench. I am like, "OK, he already had him on the bench." He was forcing him a lot on the bench with a lot of force, you know?
MANETTE: OK. Right. That is the part I need to know. I need to know exactly what hand before the tape started running.
SEDAGHATFAR: She still did not tell you --
DR. DREW: Anahita, go ahead.
SEDAGHATFAR: The eyewitness -- I mean, is it true, though, you did not see what led to the officer even approaching this child? Because he is being charged with assaulting an officer. So, did you see an altercation take place?
FERNANDEZ: The little kid did not do nothing. I was there since he got -- since he was grabbing the child.
SEDAGHATFAR: Yes, but you did not see what happened before. That is, I guess, I guess that is my point is we do not know what led the officer to want to apprehend this child, Dr. Drew.
DR. DREW: I tell you what --
SCHACHER: If he was already detained on the bench, though, I do not get the point to go to the ground.
DR. DREW: I need to read a statement from the school district, employs officer -- The school district that employs the officer released this statement which reads in part, quote, "Safety is our number one concern. We do not want to speculate on the case because it may compromise the integrity of our investigation." Thank you, Elvia, thank you, panel.
Next up, this officer is about to get run over. Can he get out of the way fast enough? And, a reminder, you can find us any time on instagram @drdrewhln. Back after this.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: An incredible crash involving a Midwest City police sergeant. He pulled this car over for a seat belt violation. When he turned to see a woman on her cell phone headed straight for him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: By the grace of God, we are lucky we did not lose an officer that day. He saw her on her phone that is why he knew she was not going to stop.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: As the video is slowed down, you can see the moment of impact as the video drops out, the officer is leaping toward the curb.
DR. DREW: Back with Jenny, Anahita, Danine and Sam. Sam, what do we know about this driver is.
SCHACHER: This is a 35-year-old woman, Dr. Drew. No drugs, no alcohol. She was fined $295 for it. I have the police reporter right here, failure to devote full time and attention to the road. Now, if she would have killed the officer, she would be facing negligent homicide and/or manslaughter charges.
DR. DREW: Now, I am joined at this point by the police chief, Police Chief Brandon Clabes from this precinct. First of all, chief, how is your officer doing?
CHIEF BRANDON CLABES, POLICE CHIEF: Dr. Drew, he is doing really well. We are very fortunate that he is alive today and did not suffer serious injury or death from this accident.
DR. DREW: For those of us from the state of California, we cannot believe for this kind of violation, the punishment seems so benign. Why?
CHIEF CLABES: Well, we push for our legislators in Oklahoma to move forward with a texting law that will add more teeth to it. In other words, driving is a privilege. It is not a right in the state of Oklahoma or across the United States. What we are looking for is, if you have a situation like this where a driver is distracted and this case the female driver was on her telephone and it results in something like this, you need to have your driver is license suspended.
DR. DREW: And, Danine you have a question for the chief?
MANETTE: I do. I have two real quick questions. Number one, I want to know what her demeanor was after this, and number two, I see that he did this traffic stop in a lane of traffic. Do you all typically do that there? Do not you think it would be a little safer to pull off the main road to do these traffic stops?
CHIEF CLABES: Well, it would be if we could get the driver to follow our instructions. But, most of the time -- in law enforcement officers are in harm is way, we make traffic stops every day. The demeanor of the driver, she was injured. She was dazed and unable to really speak to us. But, officer actually saw her on her telephone as she approach the patrol car --
DR. DREW: And, by the way, Chief, this is not -- Anahita, you have a question, but she was not texting which we are accustomed to, she was talking on the telephone. Anahita, last question.
SEDAGHATFAR: My question is, do you think that these no texting while driving or no distractions while driving laws are actually deterrents? Because we have that law in California, and I can tell you that there is a day that goes by when I am driving and do not see everyone around me texting, talking. Do you think --
DR. DREW: Let me translate you. There is not a day that goes by when Anahita does not text while she is driving. I have actually texted her while she is in her car.
CHIEF CLABES: Well, we see it here in Oklahoma but our hopes would be if we did have this law, it would help us tremendously with efforts to cut down on actually distracted driving through texting and on their telephone.
DR. DREW: Well, thank you, chief, for joining us and thank you for letting us tell this story and the best to your officer for the quick thinking. Next up, a wrong way chase begs the question, who should have a driver`s license? The chief just said driving is a privilege. I am going to explain my position on this one after the break.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICEMAN: Driver, stop the vehicle. Driver, stop the vehicle.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER (voice-over): Reports say drivers of about 30 cars had to swerve out of the way so Albert Urban would not hit them. After driving the wrong way on I-25 near Las Vegas for 17 miles last January, straight into other traffic. Twice spike strips did not work. So, state police officer crashed his own car into Urban`s van causing it to flip.
Then police say as Urban tried to get back on to the highway, he hit a squad car, putting officers in danger. State Police Officer Jonathan Wright fired multiple rounds, hitting Urban in the arm.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW: Back with Jenny Anahita, Danine, and Sam. And, that video was from YouTube and affiliated KOAT. The driver it turns out was a 72- year-old man with dementia. Danine, do you have any thoughts on this?
MANETTE: I do. You know, dementia does not come overnight. It is something that spends it`s time growing and getting worse and his son knew it.
DR. DREW: Right.
MANETTE: When people know that their parent is dealing -- their elderly parent is dealing with dementia issues and may be a danger on the road, they need to go to the department of motor vehicles --
DR. DREW: Yes.
MANETTE: -- And let the department know that this --
DR. DREW: I cannot tell you -- Absolutely. And, Anahita, I cannot tell you how often family members are not willing to do that. They are fearful. They are emphatic. They are concerned about the independence of their loved one. I understand that. But, they endanger their loved one. They endanger other people.
And, they are afraid also of angering the father in this case, but the fact is we have an obligation to do this. We are getting older. A lot of us are living a lot longer and driving a lot older ages. The DMV is who reserves the right to take that license away. What say you, Anahita?
SEDAGHATFAR: You are right about that. Welll, Dr. Drew, what you just said is to true. And, guess what? So, this guy`s family, I read, is suing the police department. So, that is a total joke. They are going to lose the case. There is no viable case. These people -- the police officers had no idea this guy had dementia.
He is driving the wrong way, 17-mile chase. And, then they do the pit maneuver and this guy floors it and goes towards the police officers. They had to take that action, they had to shoot him.
DR. DREW: Of course. Of course. There was a tweet just up there saying there is a lot of paperwork involved, difficult for the position. It is a little bit of a paperwork for us once it comes back to us. But, the DMV has been much more vigilant about this, Jenny, in my experience in recent years.
HUTT: But, Dr. Drew, do not you think part of the problem is that there is so much stigma with anything that is brain related and being diseased? People do not want to have that conversation.
DR. DREW: No, no, no, no. People separate neurological from psychiatric. I mean they just do. Sam, let me ask you, do you think most people are aware that they need to do this for their parents, their elderly parents if they see problems?
SCHACHER: Dr. Drew, I would hope so. I really would. I do not understand why they would consider a lawsuit. If this was my family member, I would be grateful to the police department because guess what, they took this man out of harm`s way for not only killing himself but another person.
That is a whole other onslaught of problems they could be dealing with. But, also these dash-cam videos, Dr. Drew this one, the one in the previous segment, so important. They are going viral, thank God because it teaches all of us to be aware because we, ourselves, can help stop these dangers.
DR. DREW: OK. So, it is distracted driving like we are seeing here. But, this dementia thing has bothered me for many years. It is extremely difficult. And, for a long time, DMV, Anahita, was not listening to the physicians. I would say that tweet is right. Put in a lot of paperwork -- they go and bring the patient in for their own evaluation.
And, we have been like, you are not going to get it, you are not going to see it. I see it and the patient would drive and there would be trouble. Thank you, guys. Thank you. "Forensic Files" is next. Tonight the most bizarre crime police say they have ever seen. It is the "Forensic Files" and it starts right now.