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Caught on Tape: Woman Screams `N` Word at Man in Car

Aired June 5, 2014 - 19:00:00   ET


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s been on his way down.

DREW PINSKY, HLN ANCHOR: All right, guys.

Be sure to watch us live. That`s right. We will be back live at 9 p.m. Eastern Time. In the meantime, Jane Velez-Mitchell is up next.

JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST: Tonight, breaking news. An unbelievable, I mean shocking YouTube video goes viral. We`re talking about more than 5

million views, and it`s still rising by the second.

A self-proclaimed stripper repeatedly screams -- and I mean screams -- racist slurs and drops "F" bomb after "F" bomb at an African-American man

inside a car. Why? Well, she claims he almost hit her kids. But he says he just started his car, and she started screaming. So he starts recording

on his cell phone.

In a moment, I`m going to talk exclusively to the man behind the camera, on the receiving end of the slurs.

Good evening, I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell coming to you live. Thanks for joining us tonight.

In this video, the woman, apparently named Janelle Ambrosia, repeatedly insults the man behind the wheel, Narvell Benning, and calls him

the "N" word I don`t know how many times. She also threatens to have her husband kill him. And she tells the African-American man not to bother

calling the cops, because she has stripped for a lot of cops.

This whole rant happens right in front of her kids. Check it out from YouTube.


JANELLE AMBROSIA, STRIPPER: (EXPLETIVE DELETED) OUT. I`m telling you he`s video recording me. He scared the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) out of me.

(EXPLETIVE DELETED) wanted to run his mouth talking about me being a nasty mother.

NARVELL BENNING, DRIVER: Really? I said that.

AMBROSIA: He`s got me on videotape, but I`m still flipping the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) out.



BENNING: OK. You might want to get your...

AMBROSIA: Because he`s a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) loser. That`s why. He thinks he`s going to get something out of it.

BENNING: No. I don`t sue people.

AMBROSIA: He knows the cops? How many cops have I stripped for? You ain`t getting far, (EXPLETIVE DELETED).


AMBROSIA: Tell him, dude. You will (EXPLETIVE DELETED) kill him. Don`t even (EXPLETIVE DELETED). I`m telling you right now.

BENNING: That`s very, very good.


BENNING: Please do.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Whoa. Huh. I was floored by this. What`s your reaction? I want to hear from you at home. Call me, 1-877-JVM-SAYS.

That`s 1-877-586-7297.

We have a fantastic Lion`s Den panel ready to debate it. But first, out to my exclusive guest, Narvell Benning, the man on the receiving end of

those slurs.

Narvell, thank you so much for joining us.

On camera, she claims you almost ran over her kids. You see here there, right in front of a store. You appear parked. Tell us, from the

beginning tell us what you say happened before you picked up your cell phone camera and started recording.

BENNING: Well, coming out of -- coming out of Dollar General, I got in my truck. Her kids were walking a little bit aways before my truck.

And they got -- you know, they came in front of my truck. And she was a couple steps behind them.

I started my truck, and I guess it, you know it -- you know, it startled them. The little girl turned around looked and said, "Uh!" like


So she comes walking up, "You nasty F`ing (EXPLETIVE DELETED)." And "you F`ing ignorant" -- and she just went off.

So -- and I said, "What did you say to me?"

And she said, "You heard me." So I`m reaching for my phone, and I`m trying to find it. And I finally get it out of my pocket.

So at that time, that`s when I started to record what she was saying and asked her, you know, "I got you on camera saying what you -- or saying

you called me, you know, a nigger on camera." And that`s when the rant went.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, at one point she says her husband`s going to have you killed or words to that effect. She also threatens to throw

coffee at you, and you raise your window so that, if she does, you`re not hit.

Did you want to press charges? Do you think that she should have charges pressed against her?

BENNING: Honestly, I do, because if the shoe was on the other foot, there would be charges against me.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, Janelle spews racist insults at the gentleman that you`re seeing and hearing right here in our exclusive interview, the

one holding the camera, and it goes on for more than four minutes. And it`s just caught on tape. So check it out again. And then we`re going to

talk to our exclusive guest on the other side.


AMBROSIA: I don`t know. Why? Because he wants to put it on YouTube, trying to chart (ph) because I called him a racist, because he`s a racist,



VELEZ-MITCHELL: You know, sometimes they say, Narvell, that it`s a dumb question to say, "How do you feel?" But I really think it`s important

to ask you how it felt being on the receiving end of that tirade of profane hateful racist comments. What -- what did it do inside to you?

BENNING: It just made me realize that we are so behind in times when it comes to, you know, ending racism or getting above racism. It made me

feel hurt, but her comments didn`t affect me to a point to make me aggravated.

I was more upset that she did it in front of her kids. You know, she did it in front of her kids, and now she`s teaching them hate. And that`s

what they grow up with. And that`s that cycle that keeps repeating itself. You have to break it somewhere.

And you know, we`ve been trying to break it, you know, with me creating, you know, positive things and being positive and, you know,

telling every kid that they`re OYAB, and you know, and it`s just tough that she pushes that hate on them. You know, and it`s just sad. It`s very sad.

I was more concerned for her kids than her, to be honest with you.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And you see the kids. We`ve blurred their faces right in the background. There are two of them. And she makes reference

to her kids, but we`re going to leave them out of it. They are innocent bystanders to all appearances, of course.

I understand that you work in a business that tries to empower people, particularly children. So it`s ironic that this would happen to you. In a

sense, it shows you the need for what you do.

BENNING: And you know, and it only -- it`s only going to push me more to do it, to get everybody on the same page, because when she did that, you

know, I`m just -- was just so happy that, you know, my boys weren`t in the --weren`t in the vehicle.

You know, I teach my boys brilliance. And that`s the focal point, brilliance. They don`t hate anything. They don`t hate another race. They

don`t dislike any of that stuff. So -- and it kind of got to me, because those same kids can grow up. And then it could be an interaction later on

in life where, you know, it will cause, you know, dissension, you know, based off of, hey, that was the little boy that mother, you know, said this

and that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Narvell, let me -- let me jump in and ask you this question. First of all, are you surprised by the response? More than 5

million views. Why did you put it up on YouTube?

BENNING: You know, I wasn`t going to put it up on YouTube, but I said you know what? This is -- this is crazy how angrily she said it to me. It

kind of -- it made me think to say, you know what? Maybe I should show the world how hateful and how confrontational she presented this to me.

If she would have just said the "N" word and walked away, I couldn`t have did anything. It would have been another day in, you know, Buffalo.

You know, Cheektowaga or whatever. And -- you know, I would have went about my business. But you know, she brought it to me. I was in my truck,

you know, in the privacy of my own truck. She came to my truck window.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to compliment you for remaining so calm. The only thing you really said...

BENNING: Thank you.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: ... at one point is "Racism is alive and well," and you remained totally calm.

We`re going to ask you, if you could, to stand by. We`ve got an incredible Lion`s Den panel of people who are very, very, very excited to

talk about this subject.

Janelle called into the radio station, WBLK, to try and defend her behavior. Listen to this, and then we`re going to debate it on the other



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have something against black people?

AMBROSIA (via phone): No, I don`t.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because I`m wondering how the -- how the term like (EXPLETIVE DELETED) even came up.

AMBROSIA: He just pissed me off. I`m bipolar. And, quite frankly, if you look it up, (EXPLETIVE DELETED) means an ignorant person.


AMBROSIA: It has nothing to do with race.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. But then...

AMBROSIA: But it`s OK for him to call me a cracker and a honky, though. That`s racist.



VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, first of all, I`ve got to go back to Narvell. Let`s set the record straight. Did you call her those names, Narvell?

BENNING: No, no.


BENNING: You know, no, I will say this. I -- and I`ve said this to the other interviewers that interviewed me, and I have a ton of white

friends. I have a ton of Asian friends. I have every cultural friend you can imagine. And you can -- I will give you every single phone number in

my cell phone book -- my cell phone to call those people and question my character about that. You know, I`ve never used those words in my life.

And for her to say that is a form of defense, because she`s on tape being -- you know, using the "N" word or being derogatory towards me based

off of how maybe she was raised. You know?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, to hear that full interview, you can go to We tried to reach Janelle without success. She`s invited on our

show anytime to give her side. I have a lot of questions I`d like to ask her.

But you know, I`ve got to a behavior expert, Simone Bienne. In that radio interview, she says, "You know, I`m not racist, I`m bipolar" and then

continues to rant. Do you buy that she`s bipolar? And if so, does that have any relevance to her racist comments?

SIMONE BIENNE, BEHAVIOR EXPERT: OK. What I love, Jane, is the fact that she`s now not insulting every black American, but she`s also insulting

everybody with bipolar. It is not a moral disease. You know, the fact that she`s racist has nothing to do with the fact that she`s bipolar. And

the fact that she`s not taking her medicine, which clearly she needs to, is absolutely -- it`s so irresponsible.

So no, I do not buy it in the slightest. And I`ve treated many people with bipolar, Jane. And they are the loveliest people, and they have


VELEZ-MITCHELL: We want to go -- we want to go to the rest of our panel, but we`ve got to play this again, because really, I have to tell you

something. We had this yesterday, and I said to my executive producer, I`m not sure this is real. I think this could be a hoax, which we`ve

determined now, obviously, talking to Narvell, the man who videotaped it, it`s not a hoax. But I was like I can`t even imagine this happening in

this day and age. Call me naive.

Let`s play it again, and then we`re going to go round robin to our panel. Stay right there.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have something against black people?

AMBROSIA (via phone): No, I don`t.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because I`m wondering how the -- how the term like (EXPLETIVE DELETED) even came up.

AMBROSIA: He just pissed me off. I`m bipolar. And quite frankly, if you look it up, (EXPLETIVE DELETED) means an ignorant person.


AMBROSIA: It has nothing to do with race.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. But then...

AMBROSIA: It`s OK for him to call me a cracker and a honky, though. That`s racist.


AMBROSIA (on camera): I don`t know, why? Because he wants to put it on YouTube, trying to chart (ph) because I called him a racist? Because

he`s a racist, ignorant (EXPLETIVE DELETED).


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Sunny Hostin, CNN legal analyst, former federal prosecutor, when I look at this, first of all, do you think charges should

be pressed against her?

SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, no question about it. I mean, this is hate language. It`s hateful. It`s assaultive behavior. It`s


But I`ve got to tell you, listening to this as a person of color, I`m hurt by just listening to it. It is painful. It is a word, Jane -- you

and I have talked about it -- that needs to be retired. No one should use it. Black people shouldn`t use it. White people shouldn`t use it. I`ve

often advocated for just retiring the word, because not only of its history but because of how it makes people feel when it is directed towards one.

I can tell you, I was driving along the Westside Highway. I think someone thought I cut him off. I did not. And he rolled down his window

and called me the "N" word. It was so upsetting to me. This just happened last week. I was in tears. It was -- it`s that painful.

And I think, you know, the larger discussion needs to be why do people think it`s OK to use the word? We just have heard that Justin Bieber used

it not only in a joke but then sang it in a song. I mean, this is something -- I`m happy that we`re talking about it, Jane, but I am in pain

just listening to what she said to this actually very gracious gentleman.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: You are absolutely right.

HOSTIN: I don`t know that most people would react that way.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I would -- I`ll tell you, that`s why I thought it might be a hoax. Because I couldn`t believe how calm he was.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: But now we`ve met the gentleman, and we can understand that he`s an evolved person who decided to take action, as

opposed to letting her suck him into her negativity.

Now, you mentioned it the increase of famous people causing racist uproar saying things like what Donald Sterling said, Justin Bieber. The

Biebs was caught saying racist things not once but twice. OK, recently, a video of Bieber surfaced, and he is actually singing a racist song. Listen

to this from TMZ.


JUSTIN BIEBER, POP STAR (singing): One less lonely (EXPLETIVE DELETED), one less lonely (EXPLETIVE DELETED). One less lonely (EXPLETIVE

DELETED). There`s going to be one less (EXPLETIVE DELETED). If I kill you, I`ll be part of the KKK, and there will be one less lonely (EXPLETIVE

DELETED), there will be one less lonely (EXPLETIVE DELETED).


VELEZ-MITCHELL: It makes me sick. I`ve never been -- well, I was a fan at one time. No more.

He has apologized, saying he was much younger. But still, Ali Nejad, HLN correspondent out of L.A., what is going on here? Are these

aberrations? Seeming like the norm because they`re getting millions of hits? Or are we going backwards on the issue of race?

ALI NEJAD, HLN CORRESPONDENT: No, these aren`t aberrational events at all. And if you comb social media, you`ll find that there are plenty of

incidents like this, some of which are being recorded from within where people are taking pride in these attitudes.

In today`s day and age, it`s an unfortunate reality that racism could be extinct, but it`s not because it`s being bred, like this woman`s

behavior in front of her children demonstrates.

And what makes me happy is that this is an example of social media being something other than cat videos on YouTube. Light is the best

disinfectant in the world. And so if we can cast a public perception here of what exactly is going on in the world through this medium, then perhaps

we can bring it into people`s consciousness and reverse the trend.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I agree with you, except don`t knock cat videos on YouTube. Those are some of my favorite stuff, being a cat companion, a

human companion of a cat myself.

The phone lines are lighting up. We are just getting started.

Check out our Facebook page, at Jane Velez Mitchell Facebook. We`ve got exclusive content for you about the story you can only find there.

Don`t forget to like the page while you`re there. Really appreciate that.

We`re just getting started. More of this astounding rant. We`re going to play it for you on the other side.



BENNING: OK. You might want to get your...

AMBROSIA: Because he`s a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) loser. That`s why. He thinks he`s going to get something out of it.

BENNING: No. I don`t sue people.

AMBROSIA: He knows the cops. How many cops have I stripped for? You ain`t getting far for (EXPLETIVE DELETED).


AMBROSIA: Tell him, dude, you will (EXPLETIVE DELETED) kill him. Don`t even (EXPLETIVE DELETED). I`m telling you right now.

BENNING: That`s very, very good.

AMBROSIA: I will (EXPLETIVE DELETED) yank his ass out of the car.

BENNING: Please do.




AMBROSIA: I don`t like you. That`s OK, buddy. They don`t like black people either.

BENNING: Wow, you`ve got your kids cursing at me, too.

AMBROSIA: Don`t talk to my kids.

BENNING: This is amazing

AMBROSIA: Do not talk to my kids.


AMBROSIA: Hello? Talk to the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) right now. I`m telling you, he`s video recording me. He scared the (EXPLETIVE DELETED)

out of (EXPLETIVE DELETED). He wanted to run his mouth talking about me being a nasty mother.

BENNING: Really? I said that.

AMBROSIA: He`s got me on videotape. And I`m still flipping the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) out.




VELEZ-MITCHELL: The rage. Just the rage. And then the slurs on top of it. This woman is ranting and dropping the "F" bomb and using the "N"

word right in front of her kids. We blurred them. What does this do to the kids? Mel Robbins, CNN commentary, legal analyst.

MEL ROBBINS, CNN COMMENTATOR: Hideous, absolutely hideous. You know, Jane, one of the greatest things about this is that we now live in a post-

Sterling error -- era, excuse me -- where people realize that you don`t have to put up with this crap anymore. That if you see somebody doing

this, which there are racists everywhere. They`re not going away. But if people continue to pull out their cell phones, like this brave wonderful

man did, and sit patiently and let her slowly extend the rope and hang herself for who she is, she will be exposed to the world. And slowly but

surely, perhaps the world will see that this is not acceptable.

Absolutely disgusting. I hope that they open up an investigation in terms of her wellness to take care of these children.


ROBBINS: I cannot believe how disgusting this is.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Listen, Clay Cane, entertainment editor, the bright side is you can`t get away with anything anymore. But the downside to me -

- and I know that some of our panelists don`t believe this is an aberration. But let`s hope for the sake of humanity that it is a

relatively aberrant, that racism is going down.

We`re supposedly living in a post-racial society. We have our first African-American president, who was re-elected. So with this take, could

this take an aberration and then, with 5 million views, make it seem like it`s a societal norm?

CLAY CANE, ENTERTAINMENT EDITOR, BET.COM: Jane, I`m sorry. We are not post-racial. We are not post-homophobia. We`re not post-sexism. This

really is every day in America. This really is every hour in America. I was just called the "N" word last week. This happens every day to African-

Americans. Every day people are experiencing prejudice. All these things.

And I have to disagree with what we`re saying for a second as far as retiring the "N" word. It`s not about retiring the "N" word. It`s about

having an open and frank discussion about race in this country. And we`re not doing that.

HOSTIN: Well, I don`t think they`re mutually exclusive, though. And I think, to your point, certainly, we should have this open and honest

conversation, and we`ve been having that conversation.

But I don`t think that it helps for the "N" word to be sort of used so prolifically by not only white people in this sort of aggressive hateful

way but also black people. I mean, I don`t think that you can say, as a black person, "I`m going to use the word, but I`m going to be offended when

any white person uses it."

CANE: I disagree. I disagree.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to jump in because this is a big issue, because Drake has a hit song with the "N" word. You have Chris Rock and

other comedians, African-American comedians, using it extensively, repeatedly in their commentary...

CANE: But Jane...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: ... saying it`s OK for them, but it`s not OK for non- African-Americans.

CANE: Jane, listen, I have to say this is really unfair. You can`t blame Chris Rock, Drake...

ROBBINS: Sure you can.

CANE: ... for this racist stripper. That is really unfair. It really cheapens the conversation...

ROBBINS: Sure you can.

CANE: ... of racism in this country.

HOSTIN: No, you can`t.

CANE: You can`t blame Jay-Z for Donald Sterling. The "N" word was around long before hip-hop. It`s been around for a very, very long time.

HOSTIN: And it perpetuates it. And if you listen to it...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: It has its roots in slavery.

HOSTIN: She said -- yes, what she said, this stripper -- I don`t want to call her a stripper. I don`t know what she does.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Purported. Self-described.

BIENNE: She`s a stripper.

CANE: Self-proclaimed.

HOSTIN: She -- self-proclaimed. She is saying, you know, the "N" word, if you look it up in the dictionary, it has nothing to do with race.

And I think a lot of people do feel that way because of its use, because it`s -- it`s prolific, right? It`s used everywhere. And because they hear

people like Jay-Z, who people idolize.

CANE: Oh, come on.

HOSTIN: They hear Drake. People are using it in music. They think, well, that sort of takes the racial sting out of it. And I`m here to say

it`s one thing when people are using it -- it`s hurtful.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: One at a time, please. One at a time. Mel. Mel, go ahead.

ROBBINS: Yes, it`s one thing when people are using it in music in reference to a buddy, a friend, a this or that. She is using it with

vitriol. She is...

HOSTIN: There`s no difference, Mel. There`s no difference.

CANE: There`s a big difference. How can you say that?

HOSTIN: As a person of color, I think I can say.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: One at a time, please, please.

Listen, let me say this. OK. Here`s what -- here`s the problem I have with using the "N" word in any way, shape, or form, because we`re

debating it. And some people say, "Well, I`m African-American. I can use it, but you can`t."

But here`s the thing. We don`t live in a world anymore where you check a box off. There are many people who are multiracial, who have all

sorts of combinations. So you`re going to say, well, where do you stop? Where does this person -- you can say it, but somebody who has a white

parent and a black parent, do they still get to say it? You know, it`s madness to say that one of these people can use a word...

HOSTIN: ... should be retired.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: ... and another group can`t.

CANE: This is a very simple point. It`s Sociology 101. In certain communities you create language and culture.

In the African-American community, you create language and culture. In the LGBT community, they have language and culture. For Latinos, it is

within that community.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m a Latina, and I do not applaud any other Latino using an ethnic slur about anybody, but especially about your own people.

It opens the door for other people to do it to you.

HOSTIN: That`s right.

CANE: Again...


CANE: Again, it is unfair to blame racism on hip-hop. It`s unfair.

HOSTIN: We`re not blaming racism on hip-hop. That`s not the point. When we`re talking about the usage of the "N" word, the point is it needs

to be retired. You can`t have someone like Jay-Z, who is, you know, so respected, to just sort of use it.

ROBBINS: You better delete all Jay-Z`s songs from your iPhone.

HOSTIN: I have. I actually do not listen to any music -- because I listen to music with my children -- any music that has that word.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: You know what? Let me jump in. Let me jump in for a second, because I think we should go back to Narvell and ask him.

Narvell, you were the man on the receiving end. Do you think it`s OK for some people to use the word, like Drake and Chris Rock, and others no?

BENNING: You know, like I didn`t catch the other guy`s name. You know, growing up, it was what we said. But it was two words. You had N-I-

G-G-A, and then you have N-I-G-G-E-R. So those two words are a bit different. A lot of difference. One was used to demean slaves. Another

one was used for acceptance among the African-American community.

So to me, you know, I think it`s unfair for, you know, let`s say a white person to say it in that connotation and make it seem like it`s, you

know, they`re above you, to say it to hurt you. You know, it`s two different words. You can`t even -- it`s really apples and oranges.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Well, I thought your explanation was brilliant. And makes a lot of sense.

We`re just getting started. Again the phone lines piling up. Again, this has gotten 5 million views and counting.

Stay right there. We`ll be back on the other side with more of this insane rant.


BENNING: Wow, this it is amazing

AMBROSIA: Do not talk to my kids. Hello?


AMBROSIA: Talk to this (EXPLETIVE DELETED) right now.

BENNING: You`re not...




Right now, I`m telling you he`s video recording me. He scared the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) out of me in front of the car. He wanted to run his

mouth talking about me being a trashy mother.

BENNING: Really? I said that.

AMBROSIA: He`s got me on videotape, but I`m still flipping him the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) you`re a nasty (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

BENNING: OK. You might want to get your...

AMBROSIA: Because he`s a loser, that`s why. He thinks he`s going to get something out of it.

BENNING: No one. I don`t sue people.

AMBROSIA: He knows the cops? How many cops have I stripped for you? You ain`t getting far, (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tell him, dude. You will (EXPLETIVE DELETED) kill him. Don`t even (EXPLETIVE DELETED), I`m telling you right now.

BENNING: That`s very, very good.

AMBROSIA: I will (EXPLETIVE DELETED) kick his ass out of the car.

BENNING: Please do.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: This has become the ultimate weapon. Of revenge I guess. Let`s go out to the phone lines. LaVette, Arizona. What do you

have to say, LaVette.

CALLER: Yes, I`m here. You know, I`ve listened to this this morning. I`ve seen it several, several times. And each time that I review it, you

know, I find a little bit more and more hurt.

And what I wanted to express is that this was a hate; verbally hate. It was hatred that she -- that she allowed to come forth out of her

demeanor. It`s not bipolar. That was no more than hate and anger.

It was -- it was the fact that she even shared that very moment with her children and her child, her son, took on that same anger. And

presented to the gentleman, as well. My thing with this situation is that it`s happening...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We got to go to Ali Nejad, HLN correspondent. Hate. And as I`m looking at this woman, I would think that there was something

turbulent happening underneath, and then this exploded at a stranger. There`s got to be a very troubling back story quite possibly?

HOSTIN: Not necessarily.

NEJAD: One would certainly assume, if you put the pieces of the puzzle together, I don`t want to be presumptuous, but stripping doesn`t

seem like the sort of employment choice of the well-rounded individual with other options. And again I don`t want to be presumptuous.

But for me it`s about context -- right. When we talk about the "n" word and the usage of the "n" word going back to that, it`s about being

able to discern when it`s something between other African-Americans and something that`s coming out with venom from a Caucasian person`s mouth

toward an African-American.

Unfortunately, I don`t think that our society is intellectually equipped enough across the board to be able to give themselves anything

other than a binary solution like "Hey, let`s just retire the `n` word."

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Simone Bienne --


SUNNY HOSTIN, HLN ANALYSTI: You know what -- I have to tell you. I am so -- wait a minute, Jane. I just have to say this. I am so tired of

people saying that black people can use this term because black people are using it as a term that is non-hateful, non-racist; that black people are

using it, it`s spelled differently when black people use it. Look the bottom line is you can`t.

NEJAD: But they are.

HOSTIN: You can`t reclaim this word. Ok? You cannot. This is a word that has a history of hate. This is a word that is filled with hate

and this is a word that will continue to signify a terrible, terrible moment in our history. And I think to sort of give black people a pass,

give anyone a pass and try to explain somehow how black people have reclaimed the "n" word is absolutely ludicrous.

And it`s just so infuriating to me to hear all of you saying that it`s just ok for the term to be used with black people as long as there`s a

certain context.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. We are out of time. It`s a debate that will continue. But boy, did we cover a lot of ground.

And I think we took something that was really awful and used it as a form of dialectics to hopefully reach a higher understanding of this entire


On the other side, shock waves rock a small town, a violent bloodbath. A rampage -- a guy in camo armed to the teeth looking like Rambo kills

three cops. Injures, badly wounds two others and he`s on the loose right now.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three of Codiac RCM police officers were shot and killed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three officers dead, two others in hospital -- though their injuries not considered life-threatening. Police identified a

suspect, 24-year-old Justin Bourque.




UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The city on lockdown.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sweeping police manhunt under way at this hour.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- RCM police officers were shot and killed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Witnesses heard shots being fired.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Blood spread across the pavement.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are still actively looking for the shooter.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Searching for 24-year-old Justin Bourque.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A man considered armed and dangerous is on the loose; a man in camouflage carrying firearms professing a love of guns and

a disdain for the police.




VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight a frantic desperate manhunt reaching fever pitch as a chilling profile emerges of a man dressed like Rambo terrorizing

a small community in a deadly rampage. As we speak, there is a massive manhunt for 24-year-old Justin Bourque. Cops say he murdered three police

officers in cold blood last night and also wounded two more cops in a hail of gunfire.

This photo shows him -- you`re about to see it, there he is, right -- head to toe in fatigues, armed to the teeth possibly looking for his next

victim. He`s got multiple high-powered rifles slung over his shoulder and what appears to be a crossbow for good measure. People raced inside for

cover running into their homes as gunfire erupted. Watch.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The city on lockdown.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sweeping police manhunt under way at this hour.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- RCM police officers were shot and killed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Witnesses heard shots being fired.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Blood spread across the pavement.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are still actively looking for the shooter.



VELEZ-MITCHELL: There`s -- we`re going to show you in a second -- there`s this incident where there`s a home video camera that records people

running into their homes as the guy is shooting right outside the window and we`re going to show that to you in just a second.

The fallen officer`s blood is literally spilled out on the streets of an otherwise very safe and quiet neighborhood. This is just across the

border from Maine. And there`s concern maybe he`s fled to the United States, he`s somewhere in Maine right now.

Check out this video. It`s unbelievable.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The city on lockdown.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sweeping police manhunt under way at this hour.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- RCM police officers were shot and killed.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. We will show it to you, we promise -- in a second. The shooter has been spotted three times. Police have not been

able to capture him. I got to wonder, how can a man who looks like a ghoulish trick-or-treater varnish with hundreds of cops trying to hunt him

down? And the sick details of this mad man in camo on his Facebook page, he professes hatred of police. He`s an outcast who just couldn`t fit in.

Straight out to the "Lion`s Den" -- Nora Constance Marino, attorney, if cops spot this man, should they shoot to kill or should they try to

capture this real life Rambo alive?

NORA CONSTANCE MARINO, ATTORNEY: You know Jane, if they have some magical moment where they can actually capture him alive, and protect

themselves, I`m sure they`re trained to take it. But this guy has demonstrated that he has no qualms about pulling the trigger and shooting

cops dead. And he`s loaded with weapons and ammo. These cops need to go home to their families too.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I got to tell you, we went and looked at his Facebook page. His last post was just last night -- this is shortly before

he executes three cops in cold blood and wounds two others in a shooting rampage. He quotes lyrics from the Megadeth song "Hook and Mouth". Listen

carefully and then we`re going to analyze this sicko.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Simone Bienne, behavior expert, he talks about using an eraser to make people disappear and some of his former co-workers say he

was obsessed with infamy -- being remembered even for something bad.

SIMONE BIENNE, BEHAVIOR EXPERT: Yes. I mean, it`s quite interesting and the fact that the huge suffering that he will feel by being alienated

this huge paranoia will mean that he will want revenge. What`s really interesting is if you look at mass killings, then this same thing is

happening over and over again. It`s this delusion from reality, it is basically want of revenge, it`s feeling alienated, and it`s this utter

hatred of a larger social group.

We know all about it from the USC killing. This is exactly what is happening over again.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. And we`re going to talk about his emotional immaturity in a second but I want you to witness these folks who actually

see this guy outside their window. Check this out.










VELEZ-MITCHELL: This is terrifying and this guy is out there. They`re hunting for him.

Mel Robbins, legal analyst out of Massachusetts, if somebody spots this guy what should they do? Because if they come face to face and

recognize him --


VELEZ-MITCHELL: -- no. But I`m saying. If they --

ROBBINS: Get a gun -- Jane.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: If they admit that they recognize him he could take them out.


ROBBINS: Obviously if you recognize him, shut the freaking door, get away from the windows, call the police and grab your gun if you have one.

And to go back to your original question -- what should the police do? They should take him out. As we`re talking right now there were some

sicko that just shot four people at a Seattle college campus. For crying out loud when somebody decides Jane to take a gun and take their problems

out on the world, the police should use any means necessary which means take them out as far as I am concerned.

This guy is evading the police, he`s already killed several of them, he is armed, he is dangerous and I don`t think we need to wait for him to

surrender. Does the name Christopher Dorner ring a bell for anybody out there? The subject of the largest manhunt of the L.A.P.D. the guy dressed

in fatigue that killed four people before he ultimately blew himself up inside a house and terrorized a community like this guy is.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: You got to wonder the reason they can`t find him -- hundreds of them looking for him. Could he have killed himself already?

We`ll keep you updated.

Next, teacher/student sex -- a married 34-year-old teacher busted for having sex with 16-year-old student, a boy. And this gorgeous teacher

tonight is saying she is the victim. Does she have a case?


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, a gorgeous married mother of two, English teacher -- take a look at her -- busted for allegedly having sex with one

of her teenage students. 34-year-old Brianne Altice faces three counts of rape and one count of forcible sodomy. She could go to prison for up to


Tonight she`s fighting back saying yes, we had sex but I`m the victim here. I was seduced by this very persistent student. That`s what she

says. It allegedly began in Brianne`s classroom at Davis High in Utah. The boy told cops their inappropriate relationship escalated from flirting

to sex. The student admits he was relentless flirting repeatedly with his teacher, leaving her love notes, asking her over and over again until

quote, "Nos turned to maybes." The teen claims he told her repeatedly she was beautiful. He kissed her in the classroom. They made out in a church

parking lot and then had sex in her car up to four times he claims they had sex.

Cops arrested the teacher after the teen boy contacted cops and described tattoos on the teacher`s body he wouldn`t be able to describe

without being intimate. Listen to the teacher`s attorney.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She never used her position as a teacher to gain some sort of advantage over him or exercise undue influence as the statute



VELEZ-MITCHELL: So the school district says she`s now been fired. Out to the "Lion`s Den", Ali Nejad, HLN correspondent -- I mean does she

have a point here? She is the one who was pursued. He says you`re beautiful over and over again. He leaves her notes. He pursues her

relentlessly and then he calls cops and says she raped me.

NEJAD: You know, the boy`s doing what boys do at that age. Granted not everybody is going to put the full-court press on their teacher and,

you know, he was a little more manipulative than your average 16-, 17-year- old boy.

But I remember when I was a senior in high school, I had a crush on our girl`s soccer team coach. You know, I flirted a little bit here and

there but she certainly was equipped to deal with it. And by 34 years of age and a woman who is beautiful and has certainly been solicited before,

she`s got to have the tools to get herself out of this situation and why was it that she didn`t alert the proper authorities within the school

district to this behavior?

She clearly had some interests. And it was reciprocal and she struggled. Why not talk to your husband. Do something. She could have

prevented this on so many levels.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, the boy says that she admitted she was having problems with their marriage when they became intimate. And indeed the man

has filed for divorce.

But I want to ask you, Simone Bienne, behavior expert. You know, she`s a gorgeous women. This reminds me of Debra Lafave -- we`ve got some

video of her too. When you`re single, when you`re hot -- you`re going to get hit on all the time. Then you get married, you become a teacher,

you`re invisible. And then suddenly a boy comes and gives you all the attention that you`ve kind of gotten hooked on, and boom. I`m not

defending her behavior at all. I`m trying to understand it.

BIENNE: I mean I`m sorry -- It`s narcissistic. I like the way she actually as the adult blames the child because he`s 16. He is still a

child. His brain hasn`t fully developed.

She`s narcissistic. And no, this is all about her grabbing attention. As an adult, as a teacher, the safest place -- she needs to be

able to teach young adults boundaries. That`s part of being a teacher.

I was going to say Jane -- I mean Ali made a great point earlier. Yes, teenage boys are going to have crushes on teachers.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Especially good looking ones like this. She`s good looking -- let`s face it. She`s very good looking just like Debra Lafave.

ROBBINS: And extremely insecure.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: The sex was consensual. Then he transfers to another school, feels guilty. You know what this sounds exactly like the

hit movie "Notes on a Scandal" starring Cate Blanchett. Listen to this.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re beautiful, Miss. You don`t know how beautiful you are.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Statutory rape again? All right.

I got to ask you. Nora Marino, attorney out of New York. She`s facing serious charges of rape and sodomy. She could go 20 to life. She

could spend the rest of her life in prison. Do you think because it was consensual -- let me ask you should she have been charged with statutory

rape instead?

MARINO: She can`t be charged statutory rape because under the Utah laws, he would have had to have been under 14 and he wasn`t. But I mean I

really looked at this case and I checked the laws. They don`t have the elements for rape here based on the testimony this kid gave at his

preliminary conference. He agreed that -- he admitted that he was the pursuer, he admitted that it was consensual. He admitted that he was proud

of it. I don`t know where the prosecution`s going here with rape. There is another charge they could have brought, unlawful sexual conduct, but

they didn`t.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That`s where they were going.

MARINO: It doesn`t matter, that`s not the law. Just because he`s 16, the law does not accommodate that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Let`s stay right there. We have more on the other side. Should she go to jail for life?



UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Miss Montgomery, what can I do for you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was wondering if you could look over my reading assignment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Perhaps this could wait until after the make-up test has been administered.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Actually, it would be great if you could just review it now so I know I`m on the right track?


VELEZ-MITCHELL: Wow, that`s from ABC hit, "Pretty Little Liars".

Mel Robbins, I do believe it`s just as serious when an adult woman has sex with a minor boy as when an adult man has sex with a minor girl.

But this woman, her life`s been ruined, her husband`s divorcing her. She`s been fired. She has a bad relationship with her kids.

Do you really think 20 years to life is appropriate or is that extreme?

ROBBINS: I think it`s extreme. And look, let me be clear on what the law is. The age of consent in Utah is 18. And unless there`s a 10-year

difference there`s no Romeo and Juliet exception. And based on my reading of the law, there`s no Harold and Maude exception either. She`s way over

10 years older than he is. She knows better, but 20 years is absolutely offensive for this.

And by the way we keep talking about forcible sodomy. Underneath the law in Utah, that`s third base, folks. If you know what I mean -- this is

one of these blue laws. So it`s not what you think it is.


VELEZ-MITCHELL: I was wondering about that but I was too polite to even say anything but you have. So you have answered that question for us.

It`s a very serious, serious situation. It does affect the boy a lot.