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Unresponsive Aircraft Flies from U.S. to Cuba; Cuba Could Down Aircraft Before Crashing in Populated Area

Aired September 5, 2014 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: We're told the aircraft has entered Cuban airspace and it is the understanding of NORAD that a Cuban fighter jet has -- is now intercepting and trailing the aircraft. This is the latest information from an official at NORAD, the North American Aerospace Defense Command, which maintains surveillance of U.S. airspace and watches for any aircraft out of place, of course, especially since 9/11.

So, again, the U.S. F-15s broke off before entering Cuban airspace. The plane, this unresponsive aircraft, now has entered Cuban airspace. I want to read precisely. "It is the understanding of NORAD," quote, "a Cuban fighter has intercepted and is now trailing the aircraft."

Wolf, this raises some very interesting issues for the United States. Because the whole issue of what to do about unresponsive aircraft, even though they may be small business jets usually, when they are over land, when they potentially are overpopulated areas, what do you do about them when they're not under flight control, when the pilot is clearly not in control of the aircraft. The solutions about what to do, about how to bring a plane down when it's not responsive is something the United States military, the FAA, everyone has struggled with of course since 9/11. There are procedures in place in the United States where shooting down small aircraft. Let's be blunt. There are procedures for shooting down small "unresponsive" aircraft. They've not ever had to do that, thank goodness, but it raises a very significant question. The Cubans now trailing this and, look, they are not going to want to see this aircraft go down or potentially go down over one of their populated areas -- Wolf?

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: In other words, that one Cuban fighter jet that's chasing this plane, if they see that small plane, that private plane -- and this is an ominous thought -- looks like it's going down into some sort of populated area in Cuba, what you're saying is there is the possibility this Cuban fighter jet could simply blow it out of the sky?

STARR: There is, Wolf. Let's be blunt. One can assume, I would think, that the fighter jet, if not the first one that went up, at some point, the Cubans may send up armed fighters. By the way, those F-15 we're told, they were armed, as is standard practice for protecting U.S. airspace. So the Cubans might likely well do the same thing. The Cubans generally fly some older models of Russian MIG-type aircraft. They would be capable, by all accounts, of conducting such a mission, if they had decided that they need to do that to protect their people. It is one of the reasons I think it is very fair to say that using

that Coast Guard channel of communication, the U.S. military was in touch, passing along everything to the Cuban authorities that it knew about the aircraft, what the situation was, what the status of the aircraft was, the fact it did not appear to be flying under any control, that the pilot was unresponsive. The U.S. would have, as a matter of airspace safety, maritime safety, the U.S. would have passed along all the information it had to the Cuban authorities to give them a full picture. And now that it is over Cuban airspace, it will be a decision by the government of Cuba as to how they proceed, how long they trail this aircraft, where they trail it to. They will be -- the Cubans will be watching to see where it goes and what decisions they may have to make about it.

I think it's fair to assume very soon, in the very soon time frame, this aircraft is going to run out of fuel and then it will go down at some point. It's just a question of where it will go down -- Wolf?

BLITZER: It's now entered -- you see the map right there. Barbara, you see the map. You know Cuba. You've been to the Guantanamo, for example, the U.S. Naval base at Guantanamo. They, in Cuba, the bottom part of the Cuban island over there, this plane is now in Cuba -- over Cuba, being followed by a Cuban fighter jet.

We're going to stay on top of this story, because there are serious potential ramifications unfolding right now, not only for the pilot, the co-pilot, the others who may be on board this plane, but obviously U.S./Cuban relations. We'll see what happens.

Stand by.

Peter Goelz will be joining us in a moment, the former managing director of the NTSB.

We'll have much more of the breaking news right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: We're following the breaking news here on CNN. NORAD saying they have been tracking a small plane en route from Rochester, New York, to Naples, Florida, but unfortunately, there's been an unresponsiveness coming from the cockpit of that small plane. It's now over Cuban airspace. It's being followed by a Cuban jet fighter. Two U.S. Air Force F-15s who were tracking that plane deviated because it was entering Cuban airspace.

We're getting more information. Rene Marsh is working the story.

What else are you picking up?

RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: We just heard from the FAA this pilot has not communicated at all with anyone on the ground since 10:00 this morning. It is now after --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: The plane took off about 8:00 this morning, right?

MARSH: Correct. We're talking about more than three and a half hours in which they have not been able to make any contact with the pilot.

We're also learning a little more about who this plane was registered to. We believe, at this point -- and, again, we're still getting information in, we're still trying to verify all the details. But we believe at this point it is -- this plane is registered to a real estate development company in Rochester. We have reached out to the company at this point, but right now they are not talking. Of course, I'm sure they're trying to get a hold on as far as what is going on here with this pilot and why this pilot is not communicating.

BLITZER: It's a TBM-700 light business and utility aircraft, seven passengers, right, Tisurbo prop?

MARSH: Seven seater. We don't know at this point how many passengers were on board. But you're looking at --

BLITZER: Here's what it looks like.

MARSH: -- pictures here. This is an example of the type of plane we're talking about here. A private plane. We believe it belongs to this real estate development company out of Rochester, perhaps on business, headed to business, we don't know. We know the destination was Naples, Florida. We know this is a seven seater. But what we don't know is how many people were actually on board.

BLITZER: All right.

Barbara Starr's at the Pentagon getting more information.

What are you learning, Barbara?

STARR: Wolf, NORAD is now saying, by their calculation, they believe the situation could be resolved in the next several minutes. That basically the plane will run out of fuel. It is coming to the end of its fuel load. This question will be --

BLITZER: But, Barbara, but it's over Cuba right now. We're tracking it. It's right over Cuba.

STARR: Indeed. The plane is going to run out of fuel, Wolf. The question will be, how do the -- at what point will the Cubans respond, if they have to respond, if they have to bring that plane down, because it's over a populated area. That is what the U.S. is watching right now. Now, I asked them, how will you know when it goes down whether the Cubans brought it down, or did the -- you know, bluntly, how will you know very quickly, did the Cubans shoot it down or did it simply run out of fuel, which it will do very soon, we're told. U.S. officials are saying they may not know right away. They're watching that flight tracker, as well, that we have up on our air, to watch for the first signs of the plane going into rapidly declining altitude.

We mentioned those two F-15s broke off before they got into the 12- mile airspace of Cuba. What we know now is those two F-15s and a refueling plane, to keep them up longer, are circling around the southern side of Cuba. So if by chance the small plane crosses completely across Cuba and goes back over the water, they will be able to pick it up. But the F-15s are being refueled in midair. They're going around, headed around to the south side of Cuba to pick up the plane if it is able to stay in the air long enough to cross over Cuba.

But I have to tell you, candidly, NORAD officials are telling us they do not think that is the case. The rough calculation is this will be resolved soon. The plane will simply run out of fuel. The question that may not be readily answerable is will the plane simply go down or will the Cubans have to bring it down. We don't know. It is flying right now it a straight line, but what we don't know is if it's headed to any populated areas in Cuba -- Wolf?

BLITZER: Can you make out, based on that map, that flight tracker that we're showing viewers, how close that plane might be to the U.S. Naval base at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba?

STARR: I well tell you, I have asked that question, and NORAD's calculations are, at this point, that it is not a threat to Guantanamo Bay they don't believe, unless for some reason it was to suddenly change course, which they don't think it will. It's on the equivalent of autopilot, though it may not technically be on autopilot. They don't think, at this point, it presents any threat to Guantanamo Bay.

BLITZER: Barbara, stand by. We're going to get back to you.

We're following the breaking news. We'll take another quick break. We'll go to Cuba. Our correspondent on the ground is standing by. We'll get new information. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: We're following the breaking news. A small plane that took off hours ago from Rochester, New York, en route to Naples, Florida, has gone off track. There's been no response from the cockpit now for hours. The plane is over Cuban airspace. You see it being tracked right there. It's being followed by a Cuban jet fighter after two U.S. Air Force F-15s stopped, didn't want to encroach Cuban airspace.

Let's go to Havana right now. CNN's Patrick is standing by.

What are you hearing in the Cuban capital, Patrick Oppmann?

PATRICK OPPMANN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, there's a flurry of communication going on between the U.S. interception, the diplomatic mission here in Havana, and their counterparts at the Cuban foreign ministry and elsewhere. And what we're hearing from multiple sources is the U.S. is operating under the assumption this plane is not a threat to Cuba, this is some kind of tragic accident that's happened aboard that's rendered the pilot unconscious. It seems that Cuban's authorities are tracking this plane, so far are not treating it like a threat.

Of course, this brings back memories of 1986 when Cuba did down two planes that came from the United States. A very different mission, to drop anti-government pamphlets here. You know, they were shot down, killing all aboard. Another plane managed to escape. And they were shot down as they entered Cuban airspace.

This plane is being tracked. Obviously, it could be a threat if it were to crash in some of these populated areas. There are a number of towns along the coast there. Getting down to the second largest city in Cuba, which is Santiago. One million people here.

But so far, again, multiple sources, Cuban government seems to understand, seems to agree with U.S. assessment this is not any kind of threat. This is some sort of flight that's just gone terribly wrong and they're keeping a very close eye on this plane. They are tracking it, but they are working very closely, it appears, with U.S. authorities to monitor this plane. And they're not, Wolf, treating it like any kind of threat and are trying to avoid another international incident -- Wolf?

BLITZER: We see, it's now over most of Cuba, and potentially, assuming it has enough fuel, it could get back out over the Atlantic Ocean.

Patrick, stand by. We're going to get back to you. Patrick is our man in Havana right now.

We'll take another quick break. More of the news right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BLITZER: We've been following the breaking news now. It looks like it's almost over as far as U.S. Officials are concerned. Fuel as far as this small plane that left Rochester, New York, en route to Naples, Florida, hours and hours ago now flying over Cuban air space. You see where it is getting ominously close right now I should say to the U.S. Naval base at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba. Appears to be two pilots on board. This unresponsive plane flying into the Caribbean, potentially. That, a federal aviation source is telling CNN's Deborah Feyerick, the source described the two pilots as unconscious, based on calculations of the fuel known to be on board the aircraft chief, reporting according to the source the plane will likely run out of fuel just about now.

Peter Goelz, former director of the National Transportation Safety Board, is on the phone.

What's your analysis based on all the information, Peter, you've heard?

PETER GOELZ, CNN AVIATION ANALYST & FORMER NTSB DIRECTOR (voice-over): It looks eerily like the Payne Stewart accident in 1999, where the Pro Golfer Payne Stewart's Learjet depressurized and we tracked it into South Dakota before it finally crashed. Unfortunately, it looks very similar to that tragedy.

BLITZER: It looks like the pilots are unconscious for some sort of reason. This aircraft, are you familiar with this TBM-700 light business utility aircraft?

GOELZ: I am. I am.

BLITZER: Is it similar to a Learjet in the sense you could lose oxygen and then you go into this kind of unconsciousness?

GOELZ: It is a high-performance turboprop that's pressurized and can cruise at 25,000 feet. Anything above 12,000 feet, you need to have pressurization. And if it loses pressurization gradually, it can easily disable the pilots and disable the passengers. They might not have even known it was happening. There haven't been any reports about any holes in the fuselage or something dramatic so it most likely was a gradual depressurization. And unfortunately, this is not going to end well.

#; Because it looks like some other pilot may have been able to look into that cockpit and see an unresponsive crew, if there are two pilots inside. So that clearly is, as you point out, very ominous.

If this plane is going to crash into -- on the ground in Cuba, would that Cuban fighter jet following it take it out of the sky before it crashes or just let it crash into the ground?

GOELZ: It depends on what they're over. I know in the Payne Stewart case, we tracked it carefully, because we were fearful it might run out of fuel, perhaps over St. Louis or some other heavily populated area. And this case, I'm sure they're tracking it carefully. If it appears as though it's going to crash in an unpopulated area, they're going to let it go down.

BLITZER: Peter Goelz, we'll stay in very close touch with you and we'll stay on top of this story. Very ominous story indeed.

That's it for me. Thanks very much for watching. I'll be back 5:00 p.m. eastern in "The Situation Room."

NEWSROOM with Brooke Baldwin will start after a quick break.

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