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CNN NEWSROOM

Quarantined Apartment Cleaning; Troops to Fight Ebola; ISIS at Kobani

Aired October 3, 2014 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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RANDI KAYE, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Randi Kaye.

Breaking news right now. Hazmat crews are on the scene of that Dallas apartment where Ebola patient Thomas Duncan was staying. The one that, as Anderson Cooper broke the news yesterday, still contained dirty sheets and the towels that Duncan used before being hospitalized with Ebola. A hazmat truck from the Dallas fire department and a cleaning crew truck pulled up to the apartment just a little more than an hour ago and we've just learned they still don't have permits to dispose of the soiled sheets and towels from the apartment. State health officials say the items will be moved to a secure location in the meantime.

CNN's Martin Savidge is live there at the scene for us.

Martin, you're there. You're seeing it all happen. Do they know when the apartment will finally be cleaned up?

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Randi, we may finally be getting some answers. We've just had a brief through the fence kind of briefing from actually the -- an official with the city of Dallas who was saying that what's going to happen now in the next hour or so is that the fire marshal from Dallas County is going to show up here. Once that begins, once he's on site, then they will begin the process of removing those items that may have been tainted by the Ebola patient from the second-floor apartment unit. That process is expected to maybe take about 45 minutes with the help of a private contractor.

Also, they are now saying, that the four people, that would include the woman who's been identified as the patient's partner, Louise, and then three other people, apparently they are going to find another location to house them. This has been a concern. Actually it's one that the public has expressed. Why, if they're quarantined, if they're potentially a threat, are they living in an area with a lot of other people around them? So it is now being said that they are going to be relocated in addition to the removal of the material that could be considered hazardous inside that the patient came in contact with.

Randi, it's all happening right now and the situation is changing quickly.

KAYE: And, Martin, certainly the big question is, and a lot of people are wondering, once they get this stuff out of the apartment, once these crews actually get in there, where are they going to take it all? Any word on that?

SAVIDGE: Right. No, that's step two, actually. In other words, part of this process is, of course, just get it out of the apartment. But once you get it into the parking lot, then where does it go? Who handles it? Who has the permission? And that's been the problem that has held things up so far.

Initially when the city said, look, we've got to clean up that apartment, they had a hard time finding contractors. A number of the initial companies they went to sort of balked at the idea. And then when they found a contractor who showed up last night, they were going to start only to be told no because you don't have the authority to transport that waste material over Texas roads and that's been the sticking point so far. And you would think this is something they could iron out pretty quickly after all the feds and the locals working in concert. They haven't.

KAYE: Yes.

SAVIDGE: And it's still a sticking point and we're not sure how it's going to leave the apartment.

KAYE: And you mentioned that the people who are still in there, the woman and her child and also the two nephews, do you know if they're going to be able to remain in there while they clean or do you think they'll move them before that? What is the process there?

SAVIDGE: Well, now, this is interesting. Some of this is happening sort of via remote control. Remember, these people are in quarantine. No one is showing any sign of symptoms. That is great news because, of course, if they're not showing symptoms, then, in theory, no one has Ebola, no one is in danger of transmitting Ebola to anybody else.

But to be sure and to be careful, they are communicating (INAUDIBLE) over the telephone. In other words, kind of remote control. They are speaking to her. She's in the apartment. They're letting her know what is going on and also where to stand, where to go, while this process all takes place. Remember, this is the first case of American diagnosed Ebola and the rule book may have been written, but this is the first time they're doing it for real.

KAYE: Yes, certainly a learn as we go process here.

Martin Savidge, thank you very much. Appreciate that.

I'm going to turn now to Dr. Alexander Garza, who was a former assistant secretary for health affairs and chief medical officer for Homeland Security.

Dr. Garza, so many questions to ask you related here to Ebola. First, the hazmat teams are still cleaning the place, or hoping to clean the place at least, where Thomas Duncan was sick. Duncan went into isolation on September 28th. It's now, what, October 3rd. How at risk are those under quarantine having been that close to contaminated material in that apartment now for so long? DR. ALEXANDER GARZA, FORMER ASST. SECRETARY OF HEALTH AFFAIRS: Right.

So you always want to assume that they have been exposed to the virus. And so assuming that they have been exposed to it, then their quarantine is entirely appropriate to make sure that they don't develop any symptoms. How likely it is depends upon how much contact they had with the patient, what sort of contact it was, all of these different variables that come into play.

KAYE: And what would have been the proper procedure there? I mean what should have happened to that apartment where Duncan was living? I mean how fast, ideally, should the cleaning crews have gotten in there with those proper permits?

GARZA: Right. So understanding that this is a first case scenario and so, you know, as the old saying goes, the best laid plans always fail when you have first contact with the enemy. And that's exactly, you know, what happened here. So I think they were very well meaning and they had every intent to make sure that there was proper cleanup and all of these other things that would happen. Certainly the quicker that you can move to remove the infected material to get that apartment cleaned and to get people quarantined, the better off it is for the community, as well as for that family.

KAYE: The Texas hospital, as you know, sent Duncan home just two days before he became critically ill. The nurse did input into those computers there at the hospital that he had come from Africa but the doctors apparently didn't see it, as we've learned, on their computers. What do you make of that? I mean should be there a more urgent way to flag a patient coming from Africa, especially knowing that we're dealing with this - with this Ebola over there?

GARZA: Sure. You would think so. You would think that this would have set off alarms across the medical team. But, you know, I have a hard time placing blame on a computer when really it was a failure of a human system to really identify this patient. You know, in medical school, you're taught to take a thorough history from the patient, and including a travel history. And the fact that this patient apparently, from what I've heard, volunteered that he had come from a west African country and was exhibiting signs and symptoms of Ebola, and with all of the media attention being played to the virus, you would have thought that that would have sounded the alarm across everybody within that department. And so it's a little discouraging that this fell through the cracks. Hopefully, though, this case highlights how much awareness we have to have in the country that these patients may show up at any emergency department across the country.

KAYE: And what about this? I mean when Duncan was turned away, a friend called the CDC and was told to call the State Department of Health, who then called the county, who then called the hospital. I mean it sounds like it's a pretty long chain of people just to get some help and some guidance here. I mean once the CDC got the call of a possible Ebola case, what should have happened there?

GARZA: Right. So typically the way that the information would flow is that patient would be identified at a hospital. The hospital goes to the local health department, then up to the state and then to the CDC. So it would be very strange for the CDC to be getting a call out of the blue from a private citizen requesting, you know, information or help on a case of Ebola because normally that's not how this information is transmitted. Now, clearly, there does need to be a more simplified chain where people can get information, can report information, and learn who they need to talk to within their community.

KAYE: Dr. Alexander Garza, appreciate your expertise and enjoyed the conversation. Thank you very much.

Well, we are just getting word that White House senior officials will hold a briefing in about an hour or so to discuss the government's response to Ebola. We will bring that to you live and hear what they're saying about a response plan.

Other developments now that we're following involving Ebola. A patient is being treated at a Washington, D.C., hospital for what could be -- emphasis on could be -- Ebola. The unidentified patient recently traveled to Nigeria, one of the nations in Africa affected by the Ebola epidemic. In Dallas, the number of people being watched for possible Ebola exposure is up. Fifty people now found to have been close enough to Ebola patient Thomas Duncan to warrant daily monitoring. Most are deemed to be at low risk. Ten are labeled higher risk. An infectious disease expert with the CDC says just last hour that there, quote, "certainly is a possibility that some of the people who have been in close contact with Duncan have developed Ebola."

And overseas now, a fifth American has contracted Ebola in Liberia, but for the first time it's not a doctor or an aid worker helping Ebola patients. It's actually a camera man working for a major U.S. news organization and its high profile medical correspondent. Ashoka Mukpo is a 33-year-old cameraman. He's been freelancing in Liberia, documenting and writing about the Ebola outbreak. And just a couple of weeks ago he posted this on FaceBook, "man, oh, man, I have seen some bad things in the last two weeks of my life. How unpredictable and fraught with danger life can be." Mukpo went to work for NBC News on Tuesday. He started feeling ill on Wednesday. His mother talked on the "Today" show about her concern for his immediate future.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It can't possible, because of the lack of resources, compare to what is going to be available to him when he gets home to the United States. I think the enormous anxiety that I have as a mother, or that we share as parents, is the delay between now and him leaving on Sunday. The State Department has been fantastic. They've been compassionate. I cannot say how much I appreciate how wonderful the government has been. And I believe they're doing things as quickly as they can. But that doesn't take away from the fact that we know he's still going to be in Liberia until Sunday and I really can only hope and pray that his symptoms don't worsen.

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KAYE: NBC News says the team working with Mukpo, including chief medical correspondent Dr. Nancy Snyderman, will be flown to the U.S. on a private plane.

And we have much more on the effort to control the spread of Ebola here and around the world. The United States will send hundreds more troops to western Africa to help fight Ebola in some of the countries hardest hit. So what is the plan to make sure that they're not infected when they come back? We'll explain that.

Plus, ISIS targeting a town on the Turkish-Syrian border. Did the terrorist group make any progress in Kobani as the firefight continues, and why are they focusing on such a small city?

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KAYE: Containing the spread of Ebola is the number one priority in several West African countries. Part of the problem is finding places to properly quarantine all the patients. The U.S. is already helping with that effort. Thousands of troops now going to the region to help build medical treatment facilities. But now CNN has learned even more troops could actually be going. CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has much more on the deployment there.

Barbara, nice to see you. So how many more troops are we talking about here and what will they be doing?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, hi there, Randi.

The Pentagon, just a short time ago, revealed that Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel has now authorized up to 4,000 troops to go. A couple days ago it was 3,000. Then it went up a little bit more. Four thousand troops now that looks to be the top side of what could be going to West Africa.

And one of the questions is, so why does it take so many? They are not going to be involved in the treatment of Ebola patients. They're going to be building these hospitals, treatment facilities, providing equipment, engineering support, helping with the training, that sort of thing. But it's going to take a lot of them because, for one thing, they are going to take all the supplies they need with them, food, water, fuel, everything that they need for the deployment. They don't want to have to use anything off the local economy. They want to be completely self-contained. It's one of the ways they hope they're going to keep everybody safe and healthy on this deployment.

KAYE: And what about safety precautions for them there? I mean what are they going to do for them there? How will they protect themselves and what about when they come back home?

STARR: Good question. The Pentagon says most of the troops will never come anywhere near anyone with Ebola, but let's face it, there's a lot of concern all the way around about this because nobody can be sure of anything. So what we do know is troops that need it, that might come in contact, will be given protective equipment, protective gear, everyone will get training about public health safety measures. But all of the troops will be monitored in some fashion for any symptoms during their entire deployment. And for those who may be at the highest risk, for those who might have had the opportunity to come into contact with someone that might have had Ebola, they will face very strict monitoring during their last 21 days of deployment, that Ebola incubation period. They could even be put into some kind of isolation and the Pentagon says they're going to keep track of everyone, even once they come home.

KAYE: All right. Well, that certainly is some good news. Barbara Starr, thank you very much.

We have much more on the Ebola outbreak coming up this hour and we know that a lot of you have a whole lot of questions and we're going to be answering them for you live. So you can tweet your questions using the hashtag #ebolaqanda. Chief medical correspondent Sanjay Gupta will answer some of them coming up.

Plus, a big battle over a small town. Kobani is a city on the Turkish- Syrian border and ISIS fighters are focused on taking it over. So why are they so interested in Kobani and what could be their next target?

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KAYE: Welcome back, everyone.

Islamic State terrorists are knocking at the door of that Syrian town at the Turkish border where fighting has so alarmed Turkey, that Turkey has finally decided to join the anti-ISIS coalition. Defenders of the town have fought heroically, but as Phil Black reports, ISIS has battled its way to the gates of Kobani.

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PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It has been a very difficult day for the Kurdish fighters trying to defend the city of Kobani behind me. They've been on the receiving end of almost constant shelling from ISIS throughout the day. Perhaps the heaviest artillery fire directed against this city that we have seen so far. It has been constant. There have been fires, smoke, hovering above this city through much of the day.

The news from other parts of the city is perhaps even more concerning. Fighters within the city tell us that ISIS has actually moved into part of the built up area of the city in the southwest and now actually controls territory there. That's come from a number of sources. It is, however, contradicted by the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights. A London based group with contacts across the Syrian conflict. They don't believe that ISIS yet controls part of the city.

But all of the fighters that we've spoken to still in Kobani believe that ISIS is at the gates that they're going to be entering shortly and they say they have been getting ready for bloody urban warfare, literally defending this city building to building, street to street. They hope that in the short-term this will give them an edge. It's their home turf. They know it well. They've had some time to prepare. But ISIS has greater numbers and greater firepower, as we've seen with are artillery that it is consistently unleashing against the city. And ISIS is being resupplied from the territory it already holds. The battle for Kobani is approaching a showdown. The men and women inside that are trying to defend it are running out of places to fall back to.

Phil Black, CNN, on the Turkey/Syria border.

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KAYE: Joining me now from Raleigh, North Carolina, Lieutenant Colonel James Reese, U.S. Army retired. He retired from the Army's elite Delta Force in 2007 and he is a CNN military analyst.

Colonel Reese, nice to see you.

LT. COL. JAMES REESE, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Hi, Randi.

KAYE: Big picture here, what is at stake in Kobani? Why does ISIS want that city so badly? And what happens if they storm Kobani and take it?

REESE: Well, you know, Randi, over the last week it's been interesting to watch, but now with Turkey now committing to getting involved, it really becomes a strategic location on the map in Syria that can really set the tone for ISIS. If the Turks get involved and really want to help the Kurds, especially with counter mortar and counter artillery fire to counter the artillery that ISIS is putting into Kobani, that could be a game changer for the Kurds and really give them the confidence to help this fight there.

KAYE: Well, let me - let me get back to why it's so critical. I mean does it give ISIS some type of geographical advantage if they get Kobani?

REESE: Well, one, it does. It sits right on the Turkish border. And one of the issues that's been going on is, people think that Turkey might have been really kind of working both sides of the coin here with ISIS. And because it sits on the Turkish border, it helps facilitate movement of any foreign fighters that are coming in through Europe, down into Turkey. This gives them that whole area.

Plus also remember, Kobani is part of the bread basket area of Syria. It's a big agricultural area. It's a great place to keep food for their fighters. So really it's a strategic city for ISIS and the Kurds and Turkey on both sides.

KAYE: So with Turkey now saying that they're willing to get involved, they may even take part in some air strikes. They're going to let some of the coalition forces use their bases. I mean could that save Kobani? Is that enough?

REESE: It could, but it might be too late, unfortunately. It might be too late. With ISIS at the doors, the Kurds will fight to the death. I think the big thing the Turks could bring to the fight right now is what they call counterbattery fire. So when the Kurds throw - oh, I'm sorry, when ISIS throws artillery in, the Turks can counter that and push ISIS back and keep them at bay to allow the Kurds to do the street to street fighting. KAYE: And why do you think Turkey has finally signed on?

REESE: Well, I think there's a lot of threat reporting coming out of Turkey that ISIS has been looking at targeting some of the aspects in Turkey, in Istanbul. Our contacts on the ground have a lot of fear of what ISIS could bring to Turkey, especially along that border. And I think the Turks see it as a - as an issue right now and because of their relationship with the Turks, this could help their long term relationship between the Turks and the Kurds if they help out.

KAYE: All right, Colonel James Reese, always appreciate your expertise. Thank you.

REESE: Thanks, Randi. Have a good day.

KAYE: You too.

If you knew there was a chance that you may have been exposed to Ebola, would you lock yourself away for 21 days? That is the decision made by the NBC News crew who worked alongside the Ebola infected cameraman. Just ahead, I talked to a doctor who recently returned from treating Ebola patients in Liberia, also made the decision to self- quarantine himself.

Plus, what questions do you have about Ebola? Send them to us on Twitter. You can use the #ebolaqanda and we'll get you some answers coming up.

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