Return to Transcripts main page

NEW DAY

Suspected Cop Killer Had Violent Past; Obama Considers Putting North Korea on Terror List

Aired December 22, 2014 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Two officers assassinated.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: New York City police on high alert, facing a new threat.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is an attack on all of us.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have to take back our community, this can't happen. Where's your humanity?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know who the heck got the impression that this community is not behind the police department.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Blood on the hands start in the office of the mayor.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have not caved, we have not given in, we have persevered and we have not backed down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The U.S. now calling out North Koreans as responsible for the Sony hack.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: We cannot have a society in which some dictator can start imposing censorship here in the United States.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They must be incredibly happy in Pyongyang.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, welcome to NEW DAY. It's Monday, December 22nd, just before 6:00 in the East. Chris Cuomo and Alisyn Camerota here with you. We start with breaking news this morning. The NYPD is in a desperate online manhunt after the deranged killer of two NYPD officers posted on Instagram about his sick plan. Authorities are taking no chances. Here's what we know, a credible threat to kill a cop was posted on Facebook by a gang member in Brooklyn. Now, that's the same borough where two of New York's finest were brutally gunned down Saturday. Also this morning, we are learning more about this cold-brooded killer of two of New York's finest. He reportedly told two bystanders, "Watch what I'm going to do" and follow him on Instagram just moments before his murders. ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: : The family of one of the slain

officers, Rafael Ramos, is speaking out, calling on citizens and police to come together, to move forward and peacefully co-exist. But there is a lot of healing that needs to happen first.

Look at these New York City cops. They are turning their backs on Mayor Bill de Blasio as he came to pay his respects to the slain officers. They say the mayor has blood on his hands for creating an anti-police backlash in the wake of the Eric Garner grand jury decision.

So much to talk about. Let's go to CNN's Alexandra Field. She begins our coverage live from Brooklyn, New York -- Alexandra.

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Alisyn.

These two NYPD officers have not even yet been laid to rest. The motions are so raw out here on the corner, where they were gunned down by an attacker who they never even saw coming.

And yet, now the NYPD is forced to look forward. They are devoting their resources around the clock to working on social media, try and ferret out and isolate threats of any further attacks.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FIELD (voice-over): Breaking overnight, officers on heightened alert, following a few online threat. In Brooklyn, police are searching for an alleged gang member who posted a threatening message toward officers on Facebook with the photo of a police vehicle. And in Memphis, police questioned a 26-year-old man after he posted on Instagram "#shootthepolice, two more going down tomorrow."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I didn't mean it like that. It got mixed up.

FIELD: Investigators scour social media on the lookout for copycats after 28-year-old Ismaaiyl Brinsley shot and killed two NYPD officers, Rafael Ramos and Wenjian Liu, execution-style Saturday afternoon.

Police looking into more than 15 online threats according to a law enforcement official.

Family and loved ones mourning the loss of officers Ramos and Liu at an evening vigil in Brooklyn.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I hope and pray that we can reflect on this tragic loss of lives that has occurred.

FIELD: Earlier Sunday, New York's commissioner and mayor attending mass at New York's historic St. Patrick's Cathedral, where the congregation stood in applause for the slain policemen.

This, a stark contrast today from the NYPD turning their backs on Mayor Bill De Blasio at a news conference Saturday, angered about his support of the protests for Eric Garner, the unarmed Staten Island man who died after an apparent chokehold by NYPD officers. The shooter's onslaught began Saturday morning. He posted this ominous

warning on Instagram, "I'm putting wings on pigs today." Accused of shooting his ex-girlfriend in Baltimore, the 28-year-old then traveled to New York, murdering Ramos and Liu with his semiautomatic gun before taking his own life.

The scene horrific.

(on camera): When you walked up and you saw that patrol car, what was going through your mind?

TANTANIA ALEXANDER, FIRST EMS RESPONDER ON THE SCENE: He has a family and you don't know if you're going to make it to your family. I mean, this job, you put your life on the line every day for people.

FIELD (voice-over): Brinsley also posting before his rampage, "They take one of ours, let's take two of theirs." His postings make references to Michael Brown and Eric Garner, according to police.

Garner's mother heartbroken all over again.

GWEN CARR, ERIC GARNER'S MOTHER: We want to not use Eric Garner's name for violence. We are not about that. These two police officers lost their lives senselessly.

FIELD: Officer Ramos' son posted this message on Facebook: "This is the worst day of my life. Everyone says they hate cops, but they are the people they call for help." He writes, "I will never forget you. Rest in peace, Dad."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FIELD: Here's what we know about Brinsley. He had an extensive criminal history, 19 arrests. He spent two years in prison. At one point he told a judge about mental health issues. And none of this answers the question of why, but certainly, Chris, it is worth looking at, because people want to know if there was anything that anyone could have looked for.

CUOMO: It's not the first time we've seen somebody who's mentally unstable take the bait and do something that's horribly wrong. Alexandra, we'll be looking into that part. Thanks for the reporting this morning.

One thing that we know for sure is that the need for leadership right now is great, starting locally. So let's bring in New York City Councilman Rory Lancman and Cedric Alexander, president of the National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives and the deputy chief operating officer of public safety for De Kalb County. He's also a member of President Obama's new task force on the 21st century policing.

Thank you, gentleman. I'm sorry to have you here for this.

Councilman...

RORY LANCMAN, NEW YORK CITY COUNCILMAN: Good morning.

CUOMO: ... you were there last night as the community was coming together. How do you explain to your constituents why this happened?

LANCMAN: Emotions are so raw. People are grieving. They're angry. My first reaction when I heard the news was rage.

The mayor was elected to try to reform police community relations. That's not an easy thing. Change is never an easy thing but particularly when it comes to public safety and how the police interact with communities of color, there are bound to be frictions.

And those of us who are in positions of responsibility have an obligation to speak responsibly. So I'm trying to talk to my constituents and the people that I connect with in a responsible measured way that respects the sacrifices of these two officers and also, hopefully, will look forward to try to constructively changing the way things are in New York City.

CUOMO: Commissioner Bratton said the mayor didn't campaign against police officers. He campaigned against police practices. But I know what your constituents are saying to you. They're saying these politician whipped people up, demonized police. De Blasio talked about how his own son, he had to teach them how to be around police. They started a firestorm. That's the word that the union uses, from the cops. Is that fair criticism?

LANCMAN: I think that's unfair criticism. The mayor was elected to reform policing policy in New York City. The famous ad with his son Dante, which many people credit his winning the Democratic primary and winning the election, was about police-community relations. I think the mayor has been very measured and responsible in his dialogue. And we need everyone involved in this situation to have that same level of measure.

CUOMO: Dr. Alexander, this was one of the concerns, when the protests started and the rhetoric was so hot, that there would be retribution against police officers and wrongly so. Now we see this. A big caveat: it was perpetrated by someone who was not in their right mind, obviously, was feared by their own families, and apparently untreated for whatever was given -- creating their madness. But how do you see this act?

CEDRIC ALEXANDER, PRESIDENT, NOBLE: Well, first of all, let me offer my condolences to the family of the slain officers and also to the city of New York, as well, too, that I know is mourning very deeply today.

But let me say this, Chris, and I've said this from the onset, is that the relationships that must be established and we must strengthen is the fact that community and police must work together.

And this one individual who launched that attack against those officers do not speak for that entire community. Nor does he speak for this nation. At the end of the day the majority of the people in this country support police officers. And you're saying that, and it's being evidenced right now in that city.

And across this great country, as well, too, we're going to continue to build those relationships, and those of us who are in leadership positions must demonstrate leadership. This is not a time for us to be divisive. But it's clearly a time for us to maintain a relationship and develop and create new relationships as we go forward. That's going to be the powerful piece that's going to move us through this.

CUOMO: We have a former governor of New York who tweeted. His name is George Pataki, Governor George Pataki, said, "Sickened by these barbaric acts. Sadly, a predictable outcome of divisive anti-cop rhetoric of" -- and then he hashtags the attorney general and the mayor. What do you make of that? Is that leadership?

ALEXANDER: No. I don't prescribe to that whatsoever. Here, again, what I think is very important for all of us who are in leadership positions, the president and the attorney general both I think have demonstrated great leadership in a crisis. At a time where you have the country calling out for some reform, they have stepped forward. And they're doing everything they can to help effect some change.

But we as an entire community must come together and be able to launch a partnership, Chris, here, that in this very tragic time that we're living in, in this very moment and ongoing threats towards police cannot be tolerated. And the community has to stand and are standing with the police across this country to combat anyone who may attack those public officials, because attacking police officers is attacking society at large, and we're not going to stand for it. No one in this country is going to stand for it.

CUOMO: Officers Liu and Ramos, obviously, living proof as officers of the diversity of the police department, who all share as we heard from the first responder, a commitment to put their lives on the line every day for others. The idea of making purpose out of this pain, how do we do that?

LANCMAN: Well, first of all, you know, we need to recognize and honor the sacrifice that they made. We're going to lay those officers to rest. And hopefully, after that, all the people who have leadership responsibilities -- the mayor, the police unions, the leaders of the protests -- are going to communicate and act responsibly to try to constructively change the way that we do policing in New York City. That's what the mayor was I elected to do, and people need to accept that that's a reality.

CUOMO: The borough president asked for protesters to stand down during this period to allow the officers to be laid to rest. Good move?

LANCMAN: I think that's appropriate. I think the focus of the city really needs to be on the grief that we have, on laying these officers to rest, respecting the families, honoring tear sacrifice.

But when that concludes, we do need to move forward as a city on an agenda of reforming policing. And the police unions, the protesters, the mayor, the city council, we all have a role in that. And it starts with not demonizing any of the other actors in that equation.

CUOMO: Councilman Lancman, Dr. Alexander, thank you very much for trying to help us figure out this situation and move forward. Appreciate it.

ALEXANDER: Thank you for having me.

CUOMO: Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, Chris, another top story, North Korea vowing to retaliate against the U.S. after President Obama made it clear that he holds the regime responsible for orchestrated attack -- attacks on Sony and will find a way to respond and may even restore North Korea's designation as a sponsor of terrorism on a list of terror states.

Pyongyang is already promising to come after the U.S. with even harsher attacks. Meanwhile, Sony claims it did not bow to hackers and is considering ways to release the film that started this whole mess.

Let's go right to Michelle Kosinski. She's live on the ground in Honolulu where the president is vacationing.

Good morning, Michelle.

MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Alisyn.

Yes, it seems like only yesterday North Korea was making announcements to the world like it had discovered a unicorn lair.

Well, today this angry back and forth with the U.S. over hacking is starting to itself seem like some kind of movie, only stranger than fiction. And this morning, the White House says that the U.S. response to the hacking will not be dictated by these outrageous statements North Korea keeps making and may not even be visible or announced when it does happen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KOSINSKI (voice-over): North Korea now openly threatening U.S. security, vowing, "Nothing is a more serious miscalculation than guessing that a single movie production company is the target. Our toughest counteraction will be boldly taken against the White House, the Pentagon and the whole U.S. mainland, the cesspool of terrorism."

And even while denying responsibility for the Sony hacking, North Korea now promises escalation, saying the hackers are, quote, "sharpening bayonets" to do damage "thousands of times greater."

CANDY CROWLEY, CNN ANCHOR: Do you think this was an act or war by North Korea?

OBAMA: No, I don't think it was an act of war. I think it was an act of cyber vandalism that was very costly, very expensive. We take it very seriously.

CROWLEY: But that characterization, not as cyber war or even terror but vandalism, has launched the president's critics here at home.

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: This is a manifestation of a new form of warfare. When you destroy economies, when you are able to impose censorship on the world and especially the United States of America, it's more than vandalism. And we need to react and react vigorously.

KOSINSKI: What America can do and when is the question. Possibly sanctions against the already strapped regime's economy, its banks or military.

The U.S. has now reached out to China and asked for cooperation. But what exactly that would look like, U.S. officials declined to say. What has been stated in no uncertain terms at the highest levels is that options against North Korea are being weighed as we speak.

OBAMA: They caused a lot of damage, and we will respond. We will respond proportionally, and we will respond in a place and time and manner that we choose.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOSINSKI: So while this is going on, today in an unprecedented move, the U.N. Security Council will take up North Korea's dismal human rights record that the U.S. ambassador calls systematic and one of the worst in the world. They'll be looking at possible referrals to the International Criminal Court for crimes against humanity -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Michelle Kosinski, so much going on with this country. Thanks so much for that update.

All right. Let's get right now to Christine Romans. She's in for Michaela today with some of the top headlines. Hi.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A lot going on today to start your Monday holiday week, folks. Let's look at some of those headlines.

Police in France have arrested a man suspected of mowing down pedestrians with his car while chanting in Arabic. At least 12 people injured Sunday in that event. The suspect was heard yelling "Allah Akbar," Arabic for "God is great" as he plowed through that crowd. A day earlier, French police shot and killed a man who stabbed and wounded three officers while also shouting that same phrase.

In northern Australia, a judge rejected a plea by lawyers for a woman charged with killing eight children. A please to have her next hearing at a mental health court. Thirty-seven-year-old Mersane Waria is accused of these murders. Seven of the victims were her children. One was her niece. Their bodies were found in her home last week. Waria was found with stab wounds to her chest. She is recovering in the hospital.

A Canadian man is in custody this morning after U.S. border officials say he approached officers waving what appeared to be a gun. The incident occurred Sunday on the Ambassador Bridge that links Detroit to the Canadian city of Windsor. It turns out the gun was a replica. The man was shot in the arm, taken into custody. He reportedly had encounters with Canadian police just moments earlier.

Pope Francis this morning with some harsh word for leaders of the Vatican bureaucracy. In his annual Christmas address, he offered a blistering critique, saying many in the hierarchy view themselves as superior. They have forgotten the spiritual guidance of God. The pontiff accused the leaders of gossiping and being indifferent to others rather than showing optimism and cheerfulness.

From the top manager to his managers, clearly saying the culture he would like to see changes. It was really remarkable.

CAMEROTA: Absolutely. Incredible message, messages coming from this pope.

ROMANS: He has been involved in just about every major story of the year. Just last week, Cuba; just last week a really important report, sort of lifting up American nuns, which was a surprise, many thought, after an investigation into their behavior. This pope has been someone who's been making a lot of news outside of the state of the union, and then he uses the state of union to talk to his managers.

CUOMO: And he's -- forget about what you believe religiously, you know. Religious so often get caught up on rules, and he is sending a message it's not about the rules.

ROMANS: Yes.

CUOMO: It's about right and why you do it. And it's a good example for the leadership that we need on a lot of levels...

ROMANS: Oh, yes.

CUOMO: ... right now.

A little bit of good news, right? We're coming into Christmas time. It would be nice to have snow on Christmas, if you can have it at any time? Right? And it is -- we're seeing some indication -- I'm going to hedge. I'm going to hedge. But what we saw before Thanksgiving that came in weather-wise, maybe we'll see something that's white and nice again.

Let's get to meteorologist Jennifer Gray. I'm hearing here on the East Coast, it's going to be wet and nasty. But I guess we want somebody to have a good Christmas, right?

JENNIFER GRAY, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes. You know somebody will have a white Christmas, and it's mainly going to be folks around the Great Lakes. Could see a little bit of snow as far south as maybe Oklahoma, but that's just going to be a light dusting.

But it is going to be a nasty mess all across the east throughout the entire week. Already starting to see rain in the southeast. That's going to continue over the next couple of days. Actually watching two systems. This is the first one. We're going to time it out for you. It just climbs up the coast. And then this one right on its heels could actually cause some severe weather tomorrow, and portions of the south, south Louisiana all the way through the Panhandle.

And then it just climbs up the coast. Wednesday into Thursday, rain, all across the mid-Atlantic, the northeast. We could see some snow across portions of the Great Lakes. A little bit of that wrap-around moisture could create about an inch or two of snow. So a white Christmas for folks around the Great Lakes.

Six to eight inches of rain, though, throughout the week for portions of Florida, two to four around other parts of the south. Once you head to the northeast, we'll see about an inch or two of rain. And then we could possibly see about an inch or two of snow across portions of the Great Lakes.

The other big problem with this storm, guys, the winds, and so that's going to create travel nightmares, possibly, for folks trying to travel because of the rain, the wind. Thirty-four-mile-per-hour wind on Wednesday in the south. That moves up to the Northeast by Wednesday afternoon. Thirty-mile-per-hour winds throughout Pittsburgh and New York, guys.

CAMEROTA: All right. Everybody should be on the lookout for those. Thanks so much, Jennifer.

Well, the North Koreans denying that they had anything to do with the devastating hack on Sony Pictures, threatening that something even worse is coming. How seriously should the U.S. take the rogue nation?

CUOMO: And the police situation in New York City. Right now, they are on high alert following the shooting death of two of their own. They're pointing fingers at their mayor for not having their backs. Is that fair? We're going to take a closer look at the tragedy and what's going on right now.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: North Korea ramping up its rhetoric against the United States this morning. Despite denying involvement in the massive Sony cyberattack, Pyongyang now warns there will be more of the same and even worse.

The U.S. even asking China for help dealing with North Korea. So how should the U.S. respond and what might Kim Jong-Un do next?

Let's bring in CNN political commentator and op-ed columnist for the "New York Times," Ross Douthat; and Peter Beinart, CNN political commentator and contributing editor for Atlantic Media. Gentleman, great to see you.

Ross, you wrote a piece for "The New York Times" this weekend. I want to read one sentence from it. It's interesting. You say, "In practice, Kim Jong-Un has our culture's number. Letting angry people impose a little censorship is just the way we live right now." Ross, you make it sound like this is an everyday occurrence. What's happening? What do you mean?

ROSS DOUTHAT, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, you know, it's a little bit of columnist hyperbole. But my point was just that what happened with Sony and "The Interview" and this movie is not all that different from what we've seen play out repeatedly in the U.S. and Europe with controversies around Islamic fundamentalism, whether it's "South Park" episodes being pulled or opera houses canceling performances or various things that have happened where basically people threaten violence, and cultural institutions basically retreat. And then this happens on a sort of lower scale on college campuses with commencement speakers getting disinvited and so on.

And the problem here is that, you know, we're talking about what the U.S. should do in response, but really the moment for a response was a week ago, when not only Sony but obviously the movie theater chains that had the opportunity to show the movie had a chance to basically say, "We're not going to give into hacker pressure and ridiculous threats."

CAMEROTA: So you think they should -- despite the threats, you think that the theaters should have run the movie?

DOUTHAT: Yes, absolutely. Because you're establishing an absolutely terrible cultural precedent if you don't release the movie.

Now, look, if you have a credible specific threat against a specific movie theater...

CAMEROTA: Yes.

DOUTHAT: ... and law enforcement is involved and says, "Don't show the movie," don't show the movie.

But we -- I mean, look, at this point we don't even know, still, that this is really North Korea. I mean, you know, we think it probably is. But the North Koreans have every reason to bluster and pretend that it's definitely them. And we have no evidence whatsoever that they're capable of actually pulling off terrorist attacks on our soil.

CAMEROTA: OK.

DOUTHAT: So retreating, as we did -- or retreating as Sony and the others did, was -- that was the mistake.

CAMEROTA: OK. Peter, how do you see this? Is this political correctness run amuck? Or are we in some age of cyber warfare now with North Korea?

PETER BEINART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I don't think it has a lot to do with political correctness. I think it has a lot to do with the bottom line.

The big fear of the movie chains was that, if it was -- people were afraid to come to the movies, it would affect the box offices of all the other movies that would be shown along with "The Interview."

So really, I think what this has to do with fundamentally was a lack of political (ph) courage, as Ross says but -- and a concern that, in the biggest movie year -- week of the year, that box offices would be down across the country.

CAMEROTA: So Peter, what should the U.S. do now in response to North Korea that's not even taken responsibility for this attack?

BEINART: This is one of the most barbaric regimes in the world, one of the most barbaric regimes in modern history. Its offenses go way beyond this. Its offenses towards its own people boggles the mind.

What the United States needs is a strategy for regime change. Not a military strategy, but a political strategy. The only way to do that is to convince the Chinese that it is in their interest for this government to fall. And the only way to convince the Chinese that it is in their interest is to convince the Chinese that there will not be U.S. troops in a unified Korea on China's border.

If the United States could reassure the Chinese that a unified Korea, with this government falling, would not lead to troops on China's border, which is after all what brought the Chinese into war during Korea, we might be able to craft a political strategy for regime change.

CAMEROTA: And before I get back to Ross, you think we cannot do this without China's help?

BEINART: China has much, much more leverage than we have. That's not to say there are not things we could do. But ultimately, China has hundreds of times more leverage over this government than we do.

CAMEROTA: Ross, let me read to you what North Korea is now saying. So while they don't take responsibility for the Sony cyber hacks, this is -- these are the threats that they are now making against the U.S.

"Our toughest counteraction will be boldly taken against the White House, the Pentagon and the whole U.S. mainland, the cesspool of terrorism, by far surpassing the symmetric counteraction declared by Obama. The army and people of the DPRK are fully ready to stand in confrontation with the U.S. in all war spaces, including cyber warfare space to blow up those citadels."

It couldn't be more hyperbolic.

DOUTHAT: Right. That's the -- no slightly. Not even slightly. That's the sort of deliberately, self-parodically (ph) unhinged North Korea that, you know, we have grown accustomed to since the end of the Cold War and before.

And I think -- you know, I think Peter is absolutely right that this regime's survival depends much more on attitudes in Beijing and the attitudes of the Chinese government than it does on us.

The point I would stress, though, is just that, you know, it isn't just China's anxieties about U.S. troops in North Korea that prompts China to sometimes prop this government up. China has a lot of the same anxieties we do, period. That, you know, this is an unstable regime. This is a regime that has every incentive, because they often depend on outside aid for survival, to sort of bully and blackmail. And this is a regime that, if it failed, would create huge refugee problems north of the North Korean border for China, as well as refugee problems for South Korea.

So there's a lot of delicate stuff going on here. And it isn't just sort of the U.S. posture that makes Beijing say, "Well, you know, we're almost better off keeping these guys muddling along in their barbaric evil than dealing with the fall-out if they fall.

CAMEROTA: Yes. All right. Ross Douthat, Peter Beinart, thanks so much for helping explain all this to us this morning. Great to see you.

Let's go over to Chris.

CUOMO: We're going to talk about the situation going on in New York City and around the country. First, it was protesters blaming the police. And now we have the people who protect us in need of protection themselves. There are new threats against police to tell you about and a hard look at who is to blame for the murder of two of New York's finest.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)