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DNA Evidence Might Link One Of Paris Killers To Larger Terror Cell; Possible Ringleader of Paris Attack Has Been Identified; Louisiana Governor Warns Against Muslim Immigrants Carving Out Enclaves In Light Of Paris Killings; Driver Survived in the Car Smashed by Two Trucks; Children Die Because of Their Parents' Religious Beliefs; The Ridiculist

Aired January 19, 2015 - 20:00   ET


ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: Hey, good evening. Thanks for joining us.

Tonight, the DNA evidence that might link one of the Paris killers to a larger terror cell. And new reporting on all the mistakes that allowed the other two killers to remain free to plan their deadly rampage.

Later, hundreds of children buried here. The local coroner says that many simply did not have to die. We investigate the faith healing sect they belong to and talk to a lawmaker who wonders why it's operating with the apparent blessing of its colleagues.

Later, sandwiched between two tractor-trailers. How do you walk away from a wreck like this with barely a scratch. There's a person there, a man sandwiched in there in his vehicle. We will talk to him, he survived.

We begin tonight with Paris investigation and some possibly vital new pieces of the picture starting to come together. Item one is DNA evident, time the kosher market killer to one of several suspects now in custody. Evidence found in the killer's car.

Item two concerns the Koauchi brother. It's actually a collection of more missed opportunities to keep a closer watch on them. Yet more warning signs that were not acted on. Details on that now from Pamela Brown who joins us from Paris.

So authorities in France are following up on this DNA evidence collected to the attack on the kosher market. What's the latest on that?

PAMELA BROWN, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: That's right. Authorities here in France are honing in on two individuals, Anderson. One is in police custody right now. His DNA was found on Amedy Coulibaly's car, the car that was used to transported him to that kosher market where he killed four people. And then there is another man, who was still on the run, his DNA was found on Amedy Coulibaly's gun magazine.

Of course, it is very concerning. Officials want to track him down to see if he was in anyway complicit in the terror attack here -- Anderson.

COOPER: And in terms of tracking the Kouachi brothers in the months and years before the "Charlie Hebdo" attacks, I understand intelligence failures have now been revealed.

BROWN: Yes, some significant missteps we're learning about, Anderson, from sources. We know that the Kouachi brothers, they were put on surveillance in 2011. But as it turns out, intelligence agencies here in France only tracked and monitored their phones, not their computers.

So some critical evidence that may have been on their computers was missed. We know one of the brothers was watching sermons from American cleric tied to Al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula and where al-Awlaki.

Also we learned that in 2014, one of the intelligence agencies was alerted to something found on Said Kouachi's phones. I mean, that was concerning. But they didn't pass that on until four months later to the main domestic spy agency here in France. And by then, the brothers were already taken off surveillance.

And just the fact in general they were taken off surveillance is concerning, Anderson. We know that one of the brothers, Cherif Kouachi, was telling how to fit good. That that point, authorities didn't think he was a threat anymore or involved with terror activities. So they lifted the surveillance on him. Turns out he used the proceeds from those sales to buy weapons -- Anderson.

COOPER: And we're going to report more on the Belgium threat in a moment. But I understand, the French, they arrested two people allegedly connected to that plot trying to cross their border.

BROWN: That's right. So there were two people apparently crossing from France into Italy that have been arrested in connection to the Belgian terrorist plot. We learned that those terrorists who were planning an imminent threat, trying to murder police officers there. Belgian authorities have asked for the extradition of those two suspects as well as the extradition of the suspect in Greece and Algerian man believed to be tied to the cell. But it's very concerning, Anderson, because authorities believe there are other jihadists who have returned from Syria fighting alongside ISIS, in addition to these suspects, in their custody that are still on the loose in Europe and various countries. So a manhunt is under way for those people, Anderson.

COOPER: All right, a lot of moving parts. Pam Brown, thanks very much.

Another major new development today in that alleged Belgian plot that authorities say involved up to 20 sleeper cells, up to 180 people they say ready to carry out attacks across western Europe.

Now, police in Belgium has swept out as you know a number of them last week. We reported on that. In a raid that left two suspects dead in Belgium. Other countries, as Pam Brown just reported, have also been rounding up suspected cell members.

Tonight, a possible ringleader has been identified, a man who one counterterrorism source calls a link to ISIS in Syria. Our terrorism analyst Paul Cruickshank has been reporting the story. He joins us now.

I know you've been talking to Belgian counterterrorism officials. What have they are telling you about this alleged ringleader?

PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, they have identified in as Abdul Hamid Abaud (ph). He's a Belgian-Moroccan. He is 27 years old. He went to Syria and Iraq to join ISIS about a year ago. And he is believed to have directed this cell who were plotting this attack in Belgium from Greece. He was operating in Greece. He traveled from Syria to Greece. And in turn, he had connections to the senior leadership of ISIS.

Belgian counterterrorism authorities now believe that ISIS directed this plot. And it was going to be a major plot in Belgium.

COOPER: Now, you've talked about this as a potential game-changer, the notion that ISIS could actually be directing attacks in Europe. Why? Because it's the first time that there seems to be evidence of an effort by them to actually do that?

That's absolutely right, Anderson. And think of all of ISIS' resources. I mean, we've been talking about it for a long time, the tens of millions of dollars of cash reserves, all that training camps, the fact that they have up to thousands of recruits in Iraq, the fact that there are up to 500 people that have returned from Syria to Europe who thought jihad had potential terrorist skills.

All that amounts to a very big threat. European intelligence agencies has detected ISIS moving into the international terrorism business, plots in Europe against the countries involved, and air strikes against ISIS in Iraq, countries like France and Britain and Denmark and Holland but also Belgium, Anderson.

COOPER: We just heard Pamela Brown's report, and she was reporting on intelligence lapses, and stopping the "Charlie Hebdo" attacks. Are France and, I guess by extension, some of the European countries, are their intelligence agencies not connecting the dots? I heard some people relate it to the same way the U.S. wasn't prior to 9/11.

CRUICKSHANK: Well, it is a hard challenge for the Europeans. I mean, there's not the cooperation between the different countries that you see between, say, different agencies in the United States. Because obviously many different countries in Europe, they all have different systems. And even within countries, there are rivalries within the intelligence services. For example, in France between the external intelligence service and the domestic intelligence service. They're trying to improve this. They are trying to rotate staff between the different agencies so they can connect the dots. But clearly, we've seen several failures most recently with these attacks in Paris, Anderson.

COOPER: All right, Paul Cruickshank, I appreciate the update. Thanks very much talking to your sources in Belgium.

Now, Yemen, which stands at the (INAUDIBLE) of this latest terror threat, authorities now say both of the Kouachi brothers who attacked the offices of "Charlie Hebdo" had traveled to Yemen for training and inspiration from the leaders of Al-Qaeda in that country. That fact as put fresh spotlight on the country and it is certainly not a pretty picture.

Nick Paton Walsh is on the ground in the capital, Sana'a. He joins us now.

It's obviously very confusing, very fluid situation on the ground there. What's the latest tonight in terms of this security situation?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We have a standoff now for control of the country. The (INAUDIBLE) movement who today seemed to move toward the presidential administration, they claim they were attacked first, effectively surrounding the prime minister and his residence and around the president administration itself.

There are tense talks happening in which there's supposed to be, frankly, a bit of magical political compromise. Some of that were dismissed that talking to the presidential administration asking, it seems, according to the information minister, for change in the constitution, get this, in order to release the president's chief of staff from their detention.

That's really what sparked all this. The president's men deeply concerned. More of them could be abducted by the Houthis (ph). Put them in extra security. The Houthis (ph) didn't like that. The fight has been started. We've seen a remarkable artillery duel in the resident administration. The ceasefire talk for both (INAUDIBLE), the prime minister and the Houthis (ph) delegation as they left those talks being shut out by unknown parties. A very messy day.

And actually, I just heard over as we see potentially dawn rise in the next hour, some light gunfire to the left of me. That being an exception really. It has been quiet since the cease-fire. The political deal must deliver or we could see violence again this morning -- Anderson.

COOPER: So explain the players here. Because there's this rebel group, what you keep talking about, the Houthis (ph), but the Al-Qaeda affiliate there is an enemy of the rebel group, correct?

WALSH: Absolutely. This is what makes it so much more dangerous. The Houthis (ph) predominantly share a collection of militia, tribesmen, but actually from the north of the country. Have been very effective recently. Some of west diplomats are say assisted by Iran, which they denied. Sweep into the capital of Sana'a in the last few months so to say, putting up check points, taking over much of that key city, clashing with the government. But also letting them exist briefly. But of course, eventually those two powers came to some sort of clash, and we saw that today. Separately are the Sunni tribes who feel threatened by the Shia

advances. Sunni Shia divide merry in what we have seen. Of course, a lot of the Middle East increase this sectarian. Sometimes Al-Qaeda joins those Sunni tribes to and the attacks of the Houthis (ph) as well. The real fear being that the Shia are effectively fermenting Sunni unity alongside Al-Qaeda in giving Al-Qaeda re-boost here. That's why this chaos is in two ways so damaging potentially to western interests.

COOPER: Dangerous days there. Nick, stay safe. Nick Paton Walsh, thank you.

Quick reminder, make sure you set your DVR. You can watch "360" whenever you want.

Coming up next, video documenting nearly every step, in one man's plot to commit mass murder in the name of Islam.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm going put everything on my body. I'm going to go inside a real place, maybe a capital, or somewhere who I'm going to explode.


COOPER: Later, what one politician, this one did, when his talking points on Muslim no-go zones in England came up against the facts. Did he drop the talking points? We're tracking them and keeping them honest, ahead.


COOPER: Last week's arrest of 20-year-old Christopher Cornell for planning to sent off pipe bombs at the U.S. capital, and should anyone running away confirmed many of the fears of law enforcement has about lone wolves terrorism naming that a single person with some bad intentions who might be easily influenced by internet jihadist propaganda can wreak havoc. They can be hard to identify and stop. We've been talking about that. New video released by the FBI shows just how hard it is to infiltrate a suspect's dark world and groom them and then arrest them. (INAUDIBLE) had similar plans to violence to Cornell allegedly. but agents were with him nearly step of the way shooting video all the while. Video you're about to see.

Here's our Susan Candiotti.


SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The video is convincing. Watch the man sitting in the front seat. A hidden camera rolling inside a car. Amin El Khalifi sounds like his mind's made up.

AMIN EL KHALIFI, LONE WOLF SUSPECT: I'm going put everything on my body. I'm going to go inside a real place, maybe a capital, or somewhere who I'm going to explode.

CANDIOTTI: A rare, frightening look inside the mind of a would-be suicide bomber. Ready to strap on a vest with explosives, and blow himself up at the U.S. capitol. A lone wolf stopped by an FBI undercover sting.

ANDREW MCCABE, FBI ASSISTANT DIRECTOR: The difference here is not just the clear intent to strike us here, but the pursuit of the capability to be able to conduct that attack. And I think the tape shows that very well.

CANDIOTTI: El Khalifi, an unemployed DJ seeking revenge on the U.S. for its war on terror. He's convinced God's telling him to kill.

EL KHALIFI: This is not about happiness. This is about Allah. This is not about, you know, us anymore. It's about Allah.

CANDIOTTI: El Khalifi is in a hurry. The Moroccan national is living illegally in the U.S., dealing with assault charges.

EL KHALIFI: I'm done. I'm done. My work is done in this life.

CANDIOTTI: Willing to die, he's inside a store buying nails for shrapnel for his body bomb. Bragging about the size of the nails, excited about the damage he can do.

EL KHALIFI: Thick ones I got. Thick ones not thin ones. The one who's going to make damage, right?

CANDIOTTI: Again, he brings up his target, the U.S. Congress.

EL KHALIFI: Yes, I want to go somewhere with those suits, those heads, just them. Exactly I want those people.

CANDIOTTI: Undercover agents drive him to a landfall, setting up a test bomb for his suicide vest. Back inside the car, undercover agents using a cell phone show him how easy it is to detonate a bomb.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're going to call it. OK?

CANDIOTTI: He gives him the phone, and moments later -- the time is getting closer.

EL KHALIFI: I'm not thinking about anything. Nothing. I have my decision. I seen same stuff in my dreams.

CANDIOTTI: And his dream includes shooting anyone who gets in his way. In a hotel room with undercover agents, he practices with a Mac- 10.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You hold the trigger, it's going to keep firing --

CANDIOTTI: Ready to target the capitol. El Khalifi drives to a DC garage, puts on what he thinks is a real suicide vest and grabs a loaded Mac-10. Both are duds provided by the FBI, and agents take him down. MCCABE: Individuals who are self-radicalized, can exist off the

radar, as it were, for a long time until they're ready to actually go out and act. And that's the scenario that causes us the most concern.

CANDIOTTI: After pleading guilty, El Khalifi gets a 30-year sentence. He tells a judge, I just want to say, I love Allah.

Susan Candiotti, CNN, Washington.


COOPER: Well, that undercover operation there lasted more than a year. El Khalifi, a resident of Virginia was arrested in fact in February of 2012. Fast forward to the arrest of Chris Cornell in Ohio. There are similarities.

Joining me is national security analyst and former Bush homeland security adviser Fran Townsend.

So after watching that, I mean, you have to ask, why do these FBI undercover agents wait until the last minute to take him down? Was that just a matter of trying to build their case as much as they could?

FRAN TOWNSEND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CONTRIBUTOR: It is not only that, Anderson. In these sorts of undercover operations, it is the primary defense they're trying to protect the case and investigation from is entrapment defense.

You know, you saw in the tape, they didn't -- the undercover agents didn't leave this guy, El Khalifi. He was explaining to them what he wanted to do, why he wanted to do it, the capability that he was seeking. I mean, this is really a very clear crisp case that sort of thwarts the entrapment defense. But the longer they let it go, and the longer they show both his intent and his capability to carry it out, the more solid the case is for prosecution.

COOPER: There is a lot of criticism of the FBI in cases, in past cases like this. Even I talked to Chris Cornell, the young man arrested, allegedly with an idea of attacking the capitol as well, his father was indicating to me in an interview that he believes maybe his son was led down a path he would not have otherwise taken by an informant, or by the FBI.

TOWNSEND: And that's always the defense. And Anderson, that's exactly why what you'll see are long-term investigations, multiple meetings, and as much as possible, you want to show that the intent is on the part of the individual, not on the part of the undercover agent. And it's also why, Anderson, these investigations involve prosecutors very early on, so the undercover agents are getting legal advice from the prosecutor to make sure that they don't overstep, or lead this person, and by the way, all that evidence is reviewed by the prosecutor before charges are brought.

COOPER: Have they had much success, or does the idea that, you know, that a person was led down this road, was set up essentially? How is this worked out in past cases?

TOWNSEND: The FBI has actually been very successful because of the involvement of the prosecutors and lawyers very early on. And over time, they've gotten more and more successful at ensuring that they build these cases slowly and deliberately. And frankly, what that means is, ultimately it's the defendant that's driving the pace of the investigation. Because they're the ones who have to talk about why they want to do what it is, and what the capability is they need. What is their intent and how are they going to carry it out. It's got to be in their words, not in the agents' words.

COOPER: So even if it's the FBI supplying them with a dummy cell phone, with a suicide vest, with a weapon, as long as they have expressed their intent, the FBI's had success in getting prosecutions?

TOWNSEND: Absolutely. And it's very important that these cases are very, very hard to put together without this sort of undercover work.

COOPER: Fran Townsend, appreciate it. Thanks.

As always, you can find out a lot more on this story and others at

Up next, this governor of a major state is speaking out against o-go zones in England, where non-Muslims cannot go and regular laws don't apply. He is saying that, the facts, we'll look at those. They say otherwise. See how he explains himself. "Keeping Them Honest" ahead.

Also later tonight, a crash course in survival from the survivor himself. There's a guy in there. That's his vehicle crushed between two other vehicles. He was able to walk out of there on his own. I'll talk to him ahead.


COOPER: "Keeping Them Honest" tonight, politicians, not to mention pundits in cable new talking heads, who don't let the facts get in the way of a good talking point, even when the talking point question has already been repudiated apologized for and backed away from by the very same people who got it going in the first place.

Today in London, Louisiana's governor, Republican governor Bobby Jindal who said to be considering a 2016 run for president, spoke to members of a British think tank. And he warned that in light of the Paris killings about Muslim immigrants carving out enclaves in England where Sharia law is the rule, and non-Muslims, especially the authorities simply do not go. It is startling, he said today, to think any country would allow, even unofficially, for so called no-go zone. If that phrase sounds familiar, there's good reason why. Take a look.


SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: One place non-Muslims are reportedly not allowed to enter. They called these no-go zones. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- Muslims to say we want to be self-ruled. We

want to rule by Sharia law within these areas. They are called no-go zones.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That Muslim populations that have taken over that police don't even go.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No-go zones throughout Europe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So-called no-go zones.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: These no-go zones.




UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is no-go zones.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think they'll look hard and long throughout Europe at no-go zones.


COOPER: Well, we counted at least three dozen clips from FOX News alone where it is certainly been a talking point for quite some time. The notion came to global attention, though, two Saturdays ago when terrorism analyst Steve Emerson appeared on FOX.


STEVE EMERSON, TERRORISM ANALYST: In Britain, it is just no-go zones. There are actual cities like Birmingham that are totally Muslim, where non-Muslims just simply don't go in.


COOPER: Well, that came as news to Britain's Prime Minister David Cameron. Watch.


DAVID CAMERON, BRITAIN'S PRIME MINISTER: What I heard is frankly, I thought it must be April fool's day. This guy is clearly a complete idiot.


COOPER: Mr. Emerson since apologized to the people of Birmingham in England saying his comments about the city were totally in error. And over the weekend, FOX issued a pair of retractions saying there's no credible information to support its assertion that there are specific areas in these countries, meaning Britain and France, that exclude individuals based solely on their religion.

The story isn't about FOX. It's about a governor, possible presidential candidate, making assertions with these kinds of statements without any facts to back them up. Max Foster was in London today to confront Governor Jindal about this story. Here's how it went.


GOV. BOBBY JINDAL (R), LOUISIANA: Look, I've heard from folks here, there are neighborhoods where women don't feel comfortable going in without veils. That's wrong. We all know there are neighborhoods where police are less likely to go into those neighborhoods.

MAX FOSTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: But you need to have proper sort of facts to back that up. (INAUDIBLE).

JINDAL: Well, I did said so-called no-go zones. I think that the radical -- look, actually he wants to pretend like this problem is not here, pretending it is not here won't make it go away.

FOSTER: But the no-go zone is also --

JINDAL: Look, there are people here in London that will tell you there are neighborhoods where the women don't feel safe walking through those neighborhoods without veil. There are neighborhoods where the police are less likely to go. That's a dangerous thing.

FOSTER: You're making an assertion like that. You need to give me the area so we can look at it.

JINDAL: I think your viewers know the places they're less likely to go. They absolutely know their neighborhoods where they wouldn't feel comfortable.

FOSTER: That's high crime rates. It's not because there are too many Muslims there.

JINDAL: We are not saying -- look, this is a question. I know the left wants to make this an attack on religion, that's not what this is. What we're saying is, it absolutely is an issue for the UK, absolutely is an issue for America and other European and western nations.


COOPER: Max Foster joins us now.

I mean, even after you pressed him on this, he continued to stand by the claim without actually giving any specific evidence saying -- at one point he said he met with elected officials and others about this. But just to be clear, no-go zones in England in terms of areas the police do not go, you're saying that just does not exist period.

FOSTER: Well, we sort of trying to get to the bottom of what he's talking about, really. He referred today to a British newspaper article in "the Daily Mail," he referred to "The Daily Mail." He said it was today. He said in there, there is an admission that there are no-go zones in London from the police chief. This is "the Daily Mail" today. I've looked at the Web site. There's no story about that. The police chief is someone I know (INAUDIBLE). He's not quoted in this paper. He's not quoted anywhere. I searched on the Web site and nothing comes up from him for at least the last week. So I'm not sure where he is pointing right now.

He also couldn't name any other people he had spoken to so we couldn't way off how credible his sources were.

What I can say is that I spoke to someone just last week, very well placed in counterterror in London, and he didn't talk in any way about no-go zones. Certainly there are communities, and there are issues with people in communities, jihadist communities talking to each other. But it wasn't a geographic thing. It wasn't an area you can go into. And I've worked with the police before about areas where they are apprehensive about going into. But certainly the police would never say they would never go into an area. And those areas are mixed. They are just high crime areas, estates which are dangerous. It's nothing to do with Muslim communities. So I'm still a bit baffled about where he is making his point from.

COOPER: CNN did air a report, I think it was two years ago, about kind of a Muslim patrol in one community in England, people kind of telling people, you know, don't drink alcohol here. This is a Muslim area. But you're saying even in a place like that, that doesn't make it a no-go zone where police don't go, where others aren't allowed to go?

FOSTER: No. And there hasn't been much of that since. I mean there has been talk about a bit of that in other areas outside of London, but certainly not in London. Those have been very isolated cases. And they haven't prevented other people from coming in. It's more focused on people who are living there, and part of the family communities. But even then, it hasn't become an issue when non- Muslims can't go into those areas. London is a very diverse area, there are lots of communities. Polish, Jewish, all sorts of communities. That's what people love about London. And there's nobody concern, really, I don't think, about going into a Muslim areas.

COOPER: All right, Max Foster, I appreciate it. Thanks very much.

Up next, meet the man who walked away from a remarkable, incredible crash. His name is Kaleb Whitby. He was sandwiched between two semis inside what was left of his pickup truck. Here's how he made it alive.


COOPER: Icy weather of the weekend made driving treacherous in more than a half dozen states. At least five people have died, dozen people were injured in this 26-vehicle pileup in I-84 in Oregon. According to reports, 12 semis were involved. Amazingly, thankfully, no one was killed, and it's truly amazing considering what happened to Kaleb Whitby. Take a look, this image, it's hard to kind of get a sense of what's going on there. That is him crushed in between two semis in what was left of his Chevy Silverado. His truck slammed into a (INAUDIBLE) semi, and then was hit by a second semi. You can see that he's sandwiched there between the two huge tractor trailers. He was able to walk away once he got free. He only needed two band-aids and ice for his minor injuries. It sounds impossible, right?

Kaleb is alive and well. He joins me tonight.

So Kaleb, I mean the picture of you wedged in between those two trucks, is just unbelievable. Take us through what happened. I know you were driving down a hill and a truck jackknifed in front of you. What happened then?

KALEB WHITBY, SURVIVED CRASH WITH TWO SEMIS: I mean, the first thing I did was kind of - I mean gasped. I aimed the pickup as best as I could to a place where there wasn't going to be any people, which ended to be up in the trailer. And so I aimed for the trailer. And somewhat did. And ended up hitting the corner of it head-on. And as soon as I hit it with my pickup, it shut the pickup completely off and left it kind of sprawled out in the road. With the passenger side facing oncoming traffic.

COOPER: So you could see -- you're out of your passenger window, you could see other vehicles coming toward you.

WHITBY: I saw one vehicle. I mean as soon as it stopped, and all the lights shut off, I looked out my passenger window and I saw one pair of lights, and that was a semi coming at me.

COOPER: What is that like to see this semi-truck coming after you - coming right at you right after you've had this crash?

WHITBY: It was one of those things where it's like, oh, my gosh, is this actually going to happen. And it was from then on that I grabbed on to the wheel, turned my head back forward and closed my eyes and prayed.

COOPER: And did you feel your vehicle essentially crumpling around you?

WHITBY: Yes. Yes. I mean, it happened so fast. So, I mean, it was loud. And there was glass everywhere. And the next thing I knew, I could just feel everything just kind of tighten in around me. And if you've looked at the pictures, every single point on that pickup, if you were to divide it kind of -- I mean, the only corner that was not crushed or pushed forward was my spot. Everything else was completely pushed forward and down and covered in glass and metal.

COOPER: And once they got you out, I understand you were actually able to walk away?

WHITBY: Yes. It took about 10, 15 minutes for stuff to slow down. Vehicles to shut off. And people to get out of them. And be able to walk around the accident. It was then that I was able to yell for help. And a group of truckers to hear me. Now, they kind of walked past at first glance because there might have been at the widest point four or five feet. So they didn't even think there would be a vehicle in there. But they were able to shine their flashlights in and see me. And they came running. They checked on me for a few minutes and made sure that I was OK. And that's actually when the picture was taken. I mean the one of the guys that took the picture, he made sure to ask if it would be OK if - He just kept saying, that you're never going to believe how tight this picture - how it is. And how incredible it's going to be when you get out.

COOPER: How are you feeling now? I mean I see it looks like one of your eyes, like you have got a black eye there.

WHITBY: Yeah. My left eye here, it looks like I have eye shadow on. That's - I mean that's a couple of days with the bruising. But I have a couple of scratches on my right hand, just from the glass that was smashed down. But other than that, that's it.

COOPER: Well, it's just extraordinary - that - I mean thank goodness you were able to walk away from this.


COOPER: And, you know, and talk about it. Kaleb, I appreciate you being with us. Thank you.

WHITBY: No, thank you.

A: Incredibly lucky.

Let's get the latest on other stories we're following tonight. Amara?

AMARA WALKER: Hi, there, Anderson. Parades and memorials across the country today honor the legacy of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. The slain civil rights leader would have turned 86 this year.

In Washington, President Obama along with the first lady and eldest daughter Malia marked the day helping with projects at a boys and girls club. The president says Americans who use this holiday to volunteer honor Dr. King by heeding his call to serve.

And we have new details about Pope Francis' trip to the United States. He is attending the world meeting of families in Philadelphia in September. And today he told reporters he will also visit New York, and Washington. The trip will be the popular pontiff's first to the United States as pope.

And the New England Patriots are headed to the Super Bowl. But not without controversy. It is being dubbed ballgate. The NFL is looking into whether the Patriots deflated the footballs used in yesterday's emphatic 45-7 win over the Indianapolis Colts. So there you have it. Controversy once again surrounding the Patriots.

COOPER: Yeah. Yeah. It seems like - Amara, thanks very much.

There is new developments in a story I did for "60 Minutes" back in 2012 that we aired in this program. I interviewed Shin Dong-hyuk, a North Korean man who described what it was like to grow up in a North Korean prison camp. Well, since the story first aired, questions have been raised about the truthfulness of some of his account. This month the journalist Blaine Harden who wrote a bestselling book about Shin's experiences, said that Shin had changed key parts of his story, including the timing and circumstances of the time in prison, his torture as well as his eventual escape. Our efforts to reach Mr. Shin so far have been unsuccessful.

A lot more ahead, children dying because their parents were members of a reclusive religious sect refused to get the medical care. The question is, is it religious freedom or abuse? Our Gary Tuchman went to get some answers and it's certainly wasn't not easy.


GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I want to ask you about the ...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are not welcome.



COOPER: Well, there are many people in the United States who certainly pray when a child is sick. But some faith healing parents believe their devotion to God is the only acceptable treatment for illness, even if it means letting their child die. Many members of religious sect called The followers of Christ are moving to Idaho because under state law parents who choose not to take their children to the doctor for religious reasons are exempt from prosecution. They are not charged even if death could have been prevented with basic medication or treatment.

Gary Tuchman traveled to Idaho to investigate the alarming rate of child deaths within this sect and the efforts to change the law that allows them to happen.


GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Inside this Idaho church are reclusive members of a Christian sect who don't believe in medical treatment from doctors. Even when one of their own children is near death. And they don't particularly like questions from reporters.


TUCHMAN (on camera): We're just trying to let our viewers know ...


TUCHMAN: Why doctors can't be used for your children.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good-bye. Good-bye.

TUCHMAN (voice over): Erwin Sonnenberg is the veteran coroner in Ada County Idaho. He has done autopsies on children who are part of that sect. The followers of Christ Church. Which has an estimated 1,500 members. Mostly in Idaho and Oregon.

(on camera): Do you believe that many of the children you've done autopsies on would be alive if their parents took them to the doctor?

ERWIN SONNENBERG, CORONER, ADA COUNTY: Oh, yes. Without a doubt. That's not even a question.

TUCHMAN (voice over): And this is where some of those children have been laid to rest. The peaceful valley cemetery in rural southwestern Idaho. A cemetery that belongs to the church.

The sense of despair when you walk through here cannot be overstated. This is a relatively small cemetery, so it's fairly obvious the high percentage of grave sites that are the final resting places for children. There are adolescents buried here, toddlers, babies, and infants who died the day they were born. It's not known how many would have lived with the proper medical care. But people who have left the church tell CNN that roughly 200 of the 600 people buried here are children. One of those former members says this is the church's philosophy.

BRIAN HOYT, FMR. FOLLOWER OF CHRIST MEMBER: Everything that happens to you in your life is God's will. It's pre-destined for you. And you either have faith in God to be strong and survive it, and that he will take care of you, or your faith fails you and you do not.

TUCHMAN: At this point in the story, you might ask yourself, can this sect knowingly refuse medical care to dying children and get away with it? The answer is yes. Idaho allows religious exemptions for negligent homicide, manslaughter or capital murder, one of six states with similar laws. But of those states, Idaho is the only one where such deaths openly occur. Bills have been drafted in the Idaho legislature to change the law. But there has never been enough support to get legislation to a vote.

(on camera): Bottom line, do you believe that certain legislators, because of politics, are willing to let children die?

SONNENBERG: Yes. I mean, I think that's obvious, just by, you know -- I guess the bill last year never even made it to committee.

TUCHMAN (voice over): We wanted to ask Idaho legislators why they're willing to accept this. Many refused to talk to me about it. One of the House Republican leaders did agree to go on camera, Representative John Vander Woude saying he realizes something needs to be done. But the politics in this deeply religious state are challenging.

JOHN VANDER WOUDE, IDAHO STATE REPRESENTATIVE: There's no sense in my opinion of running a bill that doesn't have a chance of getting through.

TUCHMAN (on camera): But you'd want to see some kind of compromise?

VANDER WOUDE: I would like to see something that also helps protect the child. TUCHMAN: Does it trouble you, though, that children are dying in the

state because of this law?

VANDER WOUDE: It does. It does. We do everything we can to try to protect the unborn, once they're born we should also still try to protect them.

TUCHMAN: But you're still not willing to say we should get rid of this law entirely, this religious exemption entirely?

VANDER WOUDE: That's right. Because I do believe we also have to protect religious freedoms.

TUCHMAN: You were sick, you were hurt, no doctors were ever called.


TUCHMAN: And this is what you (INAUDIBLE) ...


TUCHMAN (voice over): Brian Hoyt left the church when he was a teenager. He says this isn't an issue of religious freedom.

HOYT: I think that it's 100 percent neglect and abuse. I think it's sick, and I think it's sadistic.

TUCHMAN: Brian says he was beaten with objects when he disobeyed. He broke bones, got sick and never saw a doctor, or got antibiotics or any medicine. And then there was the time in 6TH grade when his mother gave birth to a baby brother without a doctor.

HOYT: My own mother, the baby was hung by the umbilical cord during birth.

TUCHMAN: And what happened?

HOYT: I got to hold it while it was still blue, and semi-warm. And tell him good-bye.

TUCHMAN: Another case, this is the coroner report in Canyon County, Idaho, for a 14-year-old boy who died without medical care. The parents stated that he had been coughing and running a low-grade temperature for about two weeks. As time went on, he began having more shortness of breath, and the rattle in his chest got worse. The mother was holding him on her lap when he died. The boy's father did not want to talk to me.

(on camera): I just want to ask you about your son ...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are not welcome.

TUCHMAN (voice over): The Followers of Christ have church services twice a week. We visited after a nighttime service.

(on camera): I just want to introduce myself -- UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bye.



TUCHMAN: I'm Gary Tuchman with CNN, I just want to ask you about some of the policies in the church.


TUCHMAN: Can you just ...


TUCHMAN (voice over): One church member, though, did give us a brief answer about why no doctors.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We believe in putting our faith in god.

TUCHMAN: Steven Paul Hughes died when he was two of pneumonia. Jerry Lane Gardner died when he was 11 from diabetes. So many other children from this faith, dead. So many outsiders, aghast.

SONNENBERG: They don't have a choice. They're under their parents' care.

TUCHMAN: And take a look at this tombstone in the Followers of Christ cemetery, with words that are disconcerting to many outside of the faith. "Sleep on sweet, Neil and take thy rest, God called thee home, he thought it best."


COOPER: Gary Tuchman joins us now. Gary, I understand the Ohio legislature, they are currently in session. Is there any movement on a new bill, excuse me, Idaho, is there any new bill to deal with the situation?

TUCHMAN: Like the session began last week that lasts for two months. There's absolutely no bill, no draft of any kind. It's very clear, Anderson, that legislator - because most of them would not talk to me who I reached out to. They want to stay as far from this as possible. The fact is, these children have absolutely no say. They get sore throats, they get fevers, they get stomachaches, they get stuff that could be cured easily with medicine. They don't get the medicine. They then suffer, they linger and they die. And while parents often think this is god's will at its core, this is inhumane.

COOPER: Gary, appreciate the reporting. We'll continue to follow. The Ridiculist is next.


COOPER: Time now for "The Ridiculist." And tonight I'd like to address something - sometimes referred to as the gay agenda. Now, I've never actually been to the secret meeting where the gays plot their agenda, although I imagine the catering is quite amazing. But thanks to someone named Larry Tomsack (ph), my eyes have been open. Larry says there's an avalanche sweeping across our society today, it's not a trickle, it's a tsunami. The mixed metaphor, by the way, is hilarious. In an op-ed for "The Christian Post," he writes, and I quote, "The indoctrination and propaganda coming from those advocating a gay lifestyle in our country, classrooms and culture are increasing. All of us need to take note and take action to guard those we love. We are being bombarded." You can tell Larry's being serious, because the Bs are capitalized.

Now, look, I don't know what a gay lifestyle is, just like I don't know what a straight lifestyle is. It seems like all the gay people I know, just like all the straight people I know, live all different kind of lives. I know gay police officers, and doctors, gay Marines in ministers, even a couple of gay TV news anchors, believe it or not. And all the ones I know just want to be able to live their lives with the same kind of rights and responsibilities as everyone else. Now, Larry says that indecent behavior is being conveyed to unsuspecting children and points to the fact that both "Dancing with the Stars" and "Survivor" have had gay contestants and that Ellen DeGeneres celebrates her marriage, yes, by the way, he puts marriage in quotation marks. Ellen talked about other examples on her show recently.


ELLEN DEGENERES, TV HOST: So, in the article the pastor criticizes a lot of TV shows for promoting gay agendas. He says that "Glee" has over five characters. Modern family had a gay wedding. Anderson Cooper boasts about his homosexuality. If you ask me, Larry is watching a lot of gay TV.




COOPER: That's right. I'm in there as well. Me and my constant boasting. Larry Tomsack has a solution for avoiding this gay problem. He recommends that parents turn off the TV and turn on the DVD player so their kids can watch wholesome shows like "I Love Lucy" and "Leave it to Beaver." Now, listen, I agree with Larry, I grew up watching "I love Lucy" and I'm as straight as they come. As for the Beav, I never tuned into that. It just never sparked my interest for some reason. I don't know why. Anyway, those are the good old days when gay people could be arrested for going to the bar, fired from their jobs, which actually they still can in many states, and live life largely in the shadows. Good times. Larry may also like the New TLC show, all about men who are naturally attracted to other men, but decide to marry women anyway, it's called "My husband's not gay." And some of the couples were on "Good Morning, America" explaining their very reasonable decisions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Every time I got to the core of who I am, I knew that I wanted to be married to a woman. And I knew that I wanted children. And I wanted to be a father. And I want to be called daddy when I come home.


COOPER: For the record there is plenty of gay people having kids these days. And, by the way, if you're a gay guy who wants to be called daddy, you don't necessarily have to get married a women. I'm just saying.

There's been a lot of criticism of the show by gay people who feel it supports the notion that somehow gay people can and should change. I feel certainly for anybody who's not happy with who they are. The guys on this show insist they have regular marriages and do regular guy things like go shopping together.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You see that guy over there?


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do you think?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's a good looking guy for sure.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's OK. I kind of like guys that are a little more athletic.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is it your type?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah, I think he's a great looking guy. I like the swimmer's build.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's the swimmer's build?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, what kind of guy are you into?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Usually taller.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Like Ryan Reynolds.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With you there.



COOPER: Just like a bunch of straight married guys going out shopping together. They also insist they can have attraction toward their wives even though they're naturally inclined to be attracted toward men.

I'll let them explain. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You could say I'm oriented toward doughnuts. And if I was being true to myself, I would eat doughnuts a lot more than I eat doughnuts. But am I miserable? Am I lonely? Am I denying myself because I don't eat doughnuts as much as I might like to eat doughnuts? I'm not.


COOPER: Yeah. Not gay. Who's the doughnut in that analogy, by the way? I think he needs to throw something else in there, perhaps a bear claw. The point is, gay people are more visible today.

And while that makes Larry uncomfortable, so much so that he - as Ellen points out to, spends a lot of his time watching and thinking about gay people. I'm not sure turning back the clock or the T.V. dials the solution. But look, Larry, don't worry, when you're up late at night, thinking about what gay people are doing then I'm sure you can at least find a good rerun to watch somewhere on The RidicuList.

That does it for us. Thanks very much for watching. We'll see you again at 11 p.m. Eastern for another edition of 360. CNN Special Report "INSIDE THE PARIS ATTACKS" starts now.