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How Liable is Amtrak?; House Panel Back Amtrak Funding Cut; Bush Tries to Move Past Iraq Questions; Honda Recalls 5 Million Cars. Aired 7:30-8a ET
Aired May 14, 2015 - 07:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[07:30:15] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: There is new information in what happened to this train in Philadelphia and there are big concerns. So let's tell you what we know right now about the Amtrak crash. The engineer, his name is Brandon Bostian, he's from New York, he's 32 years old and he's the focus of investigators on one level.
He was driving this train. He says, according to investigators, he doesn't remember how fast he was going even though he was going double the limit, over 100 miles an hour as he entered a curve that had a 50- mile-an-hour speed zone.
His lawyer is now saying that the engineer doesn't even remember the crash. But officials say it was certainly he who applied the emergency brake. The officials also say that they're going to look at the speed, but also why this train was going that fast.
Was it about equipment? Was it about distraction? Was it about intent so they're going to look at that and they're also taking a very close look at this section of track because there could have been safety systems in place?
Infrastructure that is supposed to be there that has a deadline at the end of this year that is not there. Why not? And what does it mean about stopping situations like this going forward?
And that matters because of what was lost here. Not just the mangled train, the people in it. Seven people lost their lives, hundreds were hurt. There are still those unaccounted for.
So a big question becomes how do you make this not happen again? That goes to responsibility, accountability and liability. Amtrak, this is an Amtrak train, this is the ninth time they've had a problem this year. That's much higher than the average.
So we bring in Andrew Maloney. He's litigated a number of these train accidents including the deadly 2013 derailment in the Bronx. He represents victims in these cases.
Now Mr. Maloney, when the engineer here said I don't remember what happened, that smacked familiar for a lot of people because we heard that from the engineer in the Bronx in that New York 2013 crash. Now, in that case he wound up having some kind of non-diagnosed apnea -- sleep apnea and there were no charges or really any liability or change there. What do you see as the concerns here?
ANDREW MALONEY, TRANSPORTATION ATTORNEY: It sounds like they didn't learn their lesson from the accident in metro north in the Bronx. This sounds very, very similar. You have an engineer that's speeding into a curve.
Why he did that I don't know, he was distracted, obviously human factors have to be looked at. And clearly Amtrak is vicariously liable for the actions of its engineer, in this case the engineer that drove this train far too fast.
We also know from the Bronx accident that that train didn't have the technology known as positive train control, which you commented about at the top of the hour. And this happens to be the busiest section of railway in the United States. Why they wouldn't start implementing it right there is beyond me. It's shocking frankly.
CUOMO: Now, they're fighting over money when it comes to funding Amtrak and D.C. right now. So you have a very divided political atmosphere. And when you say, they should have had better infrastructure and this wouldn't have happened.
You're getting an eye roll from half the political partisans in the country because they're saying they just want more money, it doesn't matter. It was all about the engineer. What's the reality?
MALONEY: The reality is money's necessary, even Amtrak will tell you, they've said many times they need more money to fix a deteriorating system. Some of the parts of this system are over 100 years old, the tracks. Some of the equipment has to be continually upgraded.
It gets worn out. You need money to do that. I understand the rhetoric that you can't just throw money at any problem and expect it to be fixed. There are management issues here that have to be looked at here and dealt with, but frankly you can't make a lot of these safety technology changes without money. It's necessary. The rails are a vital part --
CUOMO: But isn't it also true that we haven't had the accountability here that should be in place? Because the money has been there, billions and billions go to Amtrak. The government runs it. It's not a private company, right?
It's one of those odd partnerships that the government created for this when it was going broke many years ago. And you seek protections from Congress here. They have a deadline. They're supposed to have these safety systems in place.
They want it extended, the companies, because it's about their time and money. Congress is considering that. There's a cap from 1997 of just $200 million in these situations. People say just $200 million. When you have a lot of people involved that money goes fast, Congress gave them that. Isn't there some protection of the industry going on? MALONEY: Yes, there's definitely some protection. There are those that want to protect an industry like this when it comes to legal liability and when it comes to management issues. Again, as I commented a second ago it's not just a money issue, it's a management issue.
And I think it's been mismanaged. The first place I would have started in putting positive train control technology in would be this very corridor. Why it wasn't here, the busiest corridor in the country is shocking to me.
[07:35:08] CUOMO: Well, look, it's probably going to have a practicality reason, right? It's about time and money and resources and where the company decided to put it.
The question is how do you force them to do better because that seems, you know, we have these accidents, people die, people get hurt, the NTSB investigates, they say you need to do better with your infrastructure and safety systems and this won't happen and then nothing happens. So what do you do?
MALONEY: Well, unfortunately, people like to criticize lawyers like myself, but sometimes it takes a lawsuit to hold them legally accountable in a court of law to force them to look at and fix safety issues like this one.
This has been -- this type of accident's been known for a long time. There's going to be human error in any system and you have to plan for a redundancy to protect people from somebody making a mistake. And the technology exists here. They didn't put it in place. It's that simple.
CUOMO: And, you know, we're dealing with a system they're going over 100 miles an hour and they don't even have seat belts on these trains, Mr. Maloney, which also speaks to how old-minded this system is.
But here's a prediction for you, when liability starts to come into play, get ready to hear from Amtrak and other management involved here that, let's not forget this is about human error, it's not anything more than that. You're going to hear it that's for sure. Mr. Maloney, thank you for the perspective. Appreciate it -- Mich.
MALONEY: Thanks for having me, Chris.
MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: All right, we're going to have more on our train derailment coverage from Philadelphia. But also Jeb Bush trying to right the ship after stumbling on comments about the Iraq war, did he get it together or is it strike three for the likely presidential candidate? Jake Tapper is here this morning. He'll share his insight.
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[07:40:49] PEREIRA: The NTSB is investigating the role speed played in the deadly Amtrak train crash in Philadelphia. Preliminary data shows the train's speed exceeded 100 miles per hour as it rounded that bend. The train's engineer, Brandon Bostian, handed over cell phone records to detectives and also gave a blood sample.
He has since stopped talking to authorities. His lawyer says he does not remember the crash. Seven people were killed Tuesday night. Eight people remain in critical condition.
ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Iraq's military says an air strike eliminated ISIS' number two man, but the Pentagon is not corroborating that claim. According to Iraqi officials Tuesday's strike killed an ISIS deputy and the senior ISIS security figure. U.S. Central Command denies those reports that the coalition however -- that the air strike also hit a mosque.
PEREIRA: A striking reminder of the danger officers often face on the job as Savannah, Georgia police officer dragged by a suspect in a speeding car captured on the officer's body camera. The officer was responding to a shoplifting call Saturday night. You'll see what happens when he asks the suspect to hand over his car keys.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get out of the car. Get out of the car.
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PEREIRA: And then you can see what a tumble he is taken for. What's amazing is that officer was not seriously injured. The suspect, 23- year-old Brandon Adams and they sure got a good look at him there, is still on the loose.
CAMEROTA: All right, they will find him. Now to our best story of the day --
PEREIRA: You love this.
CAMEROTA: I love this story. One Connecticut great-grandmother was celebrating a very happy 102nd birthday.
PEREIRA: At 102.
CAMEROTA: Now watch what happens when she begins to blow out her birthday candles.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Blow it out.
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CAMEROTA: Oops. Her granddaughter caught that all on camera.
PEREIRA: Of course, she did. CAMEROTA: The video has gone viral. Everyone at the party including toothless Louise had a good laugh.
PEREIRA: She's a fabulous 102-year-old, who has a great sense of humor, which I really appreciate. It seems like a nice segue to our next guest.
CAMEROTA: Yes, let's talk politics. It really does from sublime to the ridiculous.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST, "THE LEAD": How is that a good segue way?
CAMEROTA: I'll show you because Jeb Bush is trying for a third time to answer the question of whether he would have invaded Iraq in 2003. So let's listen to Jeb's latest answer.
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FORMER GOVERNOR JEB BUSH (R), FLORIDA: Of course, you know, given the power of looking back and having that, of course, anybody would have made different decisions.
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CAMEROTA: All right. Will that put all these questions to rest? Here to weigh-in is CNN chief Washington correspondent and anchor of CNN's "THE LEAD," Jake Tapper.
TAPPER: Hi, guys.
CAMEROTA: Great to have you in studio.
TAPPER: Thanks for the 6:30 a.m. wakeup call.
CAMEROTA: Would it have been better for Jeb if his teeth had fallen out before he tried to answer?
TAPPER: No, but it's been a rough week. What's so odd about this is it's an obvious question. It's about what is widely considered one of the big foreign policy blunders of the last 15 years. Hotly debated at the time and yet the Democrats went through this whole thing in 2008.
You might remember every Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden, others all coming out saying, yes, I would have voted differently in the Senate and it's confusing. I understand why it's so difficult for him to answer the question.
CAMEROTA: Why?
TAPPER: Because his brother is the one that led the country to war and you want to support your brother. You don't want to be disloyal.
CAMEROTA: You want to distinguish yourself also from your brother's foreign policy choices? TAPPER: Well, that's a difficult thing for Jeb Bush. In some ways, and I'm not the first one to make this comparison, but he is having the same kind of issue that Al Gore had in 2000, which is you want the benefit of all the people who supported what Bill Clinton did or George W. Bush did and you don't want the baggage.
And it's not always easy to negotiate. That's the politics of it. The policy is, and I'm still not exactly sure what Jeb Bush's position is on whether or not he thinks WMD was the only reason why the U.S. went to war in Iraq.
I mean, you've seen other people say there are plenty of people in the foreign policy establishment who think, no, it was not a mistake. I'd make the same vote today again.
[07:45:06] Saddam Hussein was a ruthless tyrant and the Middle East is better without him. There are a number of people who think that. Not a majority of the American people but a number of people who think that.
PEREIRA: Well, and what's interesting is it's giving a bunch of hopefuls like "The Washington Post" to pounce on it. You sat down with an interview with Chris Christie, great job, by the way. And he had this to say, let's listen to the sound.
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GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: I don't think you can honestly say that if we knew then that there was no WMD that the country should have gone to war so my answer would be no. I think what we got to avoid is continuing to go backwards in this country. I wouldn't have gone to war, but we don't get to replay history.
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PEREIRA: So is that a smarter tact? Is that what Jeb Bush should have done? Sort of I don't get a chance to remake history if we had known what we know now?
TAPPER: Again, there's the politics and policy. In terms of politics, this is a good opportunity for people like Chris Christie and others to distinguish themselves.
In the full answer he gave me not only does he say we need to look forward, which is kind of a zing at Bushes or Clintons, but also he said and this isn't a major thing in my campaign, but you asked me a direct question and I'm going to answer it directly because that's what I do.
That's another opportunity for Chris Christie and others to distinguish themselves from the not so direct answer we're getting from Jeb Bush.
CAMEROTA: But the zing we need to look forward is the journalist asking the question. Is it a fair question? TAPPER: I think it's completely a fair question. First of all there are very few unfair questions when it comes to the presidency, I think. We can ask anything we want. How they answer is a different matter.
But more importantly this cost tens of thousands of lives of innocent Iraqis and U.S. troops. And we're still seeing the effects of the Iraq war on the region. Somebody pointed out, a student pointed out to Jeb Bush yesterday.
He was faulting Obama for the creation of ISIS by withdrawing U.S. troops leaving a vacuum and a student pointed out using that same logic one could say ISIS was the creation of George W. Bush because originally their roots were the al Qaeda in Iraq and Zarqawi.
Yes, absolutely it's a major foreign policy issue. Look, Republicans and the Clinton campaign are going to attack the media to a large extent no matter what we do. And I think that it is a completely relevant question.
CAMEROTA: Jake Tapper, great to have you on with us.
PEREIRA: Love you got up so early for us.
TAPPER: Only for you two. I would not do it for Chris. Don't tell him that.
CAMEROTA: We won't let him know that you were here.
It never happened. Make sure you watch Jake Tapper's show "THE LEAD" today at 4:00 p.m. Eastern only on CNN.
PEREIRA: Ahead here he's no stranger to the big decisions with the clock ticking down. Tom Brady has hours, just hours, to decide whether to appeal that four-game ban for Deflategate. Some big legal help is on the way. We'll tell you who.
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[07:52:00]
PEREIRA: The TV tells us it's "CNN Money Now" time, CNN Money correspondent, Cristina Alesci is in our Money Center. Good to see you, Cristina. Airbag problems we are looking at today.
CRISTINA ALESCI, CNN MONEY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this seems to be a never ending problem for car makers. Honda is recalling 5 million cars because of potentially fatal Takata air bags. Yesterday, Toyota also recalled 5 million cars and Nissan 1.6 million to the same exact reason. At least five deaths are linked to the faulty airbags.
It's being dubbed Frappuccino fraud. Thieves are breaking into the Starbucks mobile app that let customers play with their phones and they are buying gift cards and stealing from credit cards or Paypal accounts connected to the apps. Starbucks says users need strong passwords. That app is extremely popular. It accounts for 1 in 6 transactions as U.S. Starbucks stores.
PEREIRA: That's incredible. I think we used that most of it. I think we skew the numbers here because those are ours.
CAMEROTA: Thanks so much, Cristina, you want to talk sports?
PEREIRA: Yes, I love talking sports with you and I know Andy Scholes does as well.
ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS: Good morning, guys, it's a happy day for New York sports fans, especially -- some people say there is nothing better in sports than a game seven in the Stanley Cup playoff, and boy, we had a good one last night at Madison Square Garden.
The Rangers trying to complete an amazing comeback after being down 3-1 to the Capitals, and this was a physical game seven for 60 minutes, and it would go into overtime, and off the rebound, Stepan would put it in the Ranger's win, and they will face-off against Tampa Bay in the eastern conference final.
A scary moment during the Indianapolis 500, three-time winner, Helio Castroneves loses control of his car. It turns around and does a complete flip before landing back on its wheels. Check out the view from inside the car. Amazing he was not hurt. The Indy 500 is next Sunday, May 24.
All right, Tom Brady is expected to officially appeal his four-game suspension sometime today before the 5 p.m. deadline, and Brady is going to have a super team of lawyers working to get his suspension overturned.
Jeffrey Kessler has been hired by the Players Association to represent Brady. Kessler has a stellar record against the NFL. He's represented Adrian Peterson, Ray Rice and he has won all of the cases where he got the suspensions overturned. He doesn't think Brady is going to miss one game.
CAMEROTA: That's an interesting prediction.
PEREIRA: So much for discipline.
CAMEROTA: Yes, we'll see what happens. Andy, thanks so much for that.
All right, let's get back to Philadelphia where Chris is following our breaking news and following up on the train derailment. Chris, tell us what you are learning down there
[07:55:05] CUOMO: We got new information, guys, that's for sure, but they are raising more concerns, and that's good. That's what this process should be.
They are looking at speed specifically what the engineer was doing and why this strain was going twice the speed it should have been, well over 100 miles per hour.
So we have the latest information and there are concerns that things we are being told could have made this not happen and why weren't we doing better? We'll take you through it.
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CUOMO: Why was this train going more than twice the speed it was supposed to?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The man at the center of this is that engineer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The engineer is not talking at this point.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Clearly he was reckless and irresponsible.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To make comments like that is inflammatory at this point.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This section of track was not equipped with the speed control system.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Positive train control would have prevented this accident without a doubt.
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[08:00:07] CUOMO: It's Thursday, May 14th, 8:00 in the East. Alisyn and Michaela are in New York. I'm in Philadelphia covering breaking developments in the Amtrak crash.
