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Authorities Foil Plot to Kill Police Officers & Activist; Jeb Bush to Make June 15 Announcement; Baltimore Asks for Federal Help to Fight Crime; Anthrax Samples Sent to 51 Labs; ISIS Using Water as a Weapon. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired June 4, 2015 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: According to an FBI affidavit, 26-year-old Rahim purchases this Marine fighting knife on Amazon on May 25. The following day, on the 26th, he allegedly makes a phone call to his nephew, 25-year-old David Wright now being charged with destroying evidence on Rahim's smartphone.

[07:00:15] The FBI says Rahim told his nephew about the knife over the phone and that Wright later responded with a reference, investigators say, to terrorist beheadings.

The next day, on May 27, the FBI intercepts the Amazon package, X-rays it, and finds the knife and a knife sharpener. But then abruptly this week on Tuesday, the FBI says Rahim calls his nephew, saying he's changing the plan, because he can't wait that long. Instead, he's going to "go after the boys in blue," and Rahim reveals his plan to randomly kill police officers in Massachusetts on Tuesday or Wednesday.

This supposed escalation, investigators say, is what prompted them to approach Rahim at this shopping center Tuesday morning.

WILLIAM EVANS, BOSTON POLICE COMMISSIONER: The video clearly shows these four or five officers backtracking away from the suspect as he's coming at them.

FIELD: On Wednesday, investigators showed the surveillance video of the shooting to community leaders.

IMAM ABDULLAH FAARUUQ, MOSQUE FOR THE PROPHECY OF ALLAH: Based on the video that we saw, I would 150 percent collaborate what the commissioner had just stated.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FIELD: So that surveillance video, of course, has to do with the death investigation. And it won't be released to the public, likely, until the death investigation is concluded. But that's part of the puzzle here, of course, because we know that investigators are certainly focused right now on whatever alleged plot they believe that Rahim had been behind.

So they're looking at potential accomplices and associates here. We know that David Wright has been charged in federal court, but court paperwork also shows that police believe that Wright and Rahim had communicated with a third person, someone in Rhode Island. But the documents at this point do not name that person, Alisyn.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: OK, Alexandra. And in the next hour we will speak with one of those alleged targets, Pamela Geller. She will be live here on NEW DAY. Stick around for that.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Breaking news of the political variety. Jeb Bush setting June 15 as the date for a big announcement. What do you think that's going to be? He is expected to announce that he's joining the growing list of Republicans running for president.

Let's bring in CNN chief national correspondent John King, live from Washington. First, let's make it sure we have it straight. Is there a chance he's announcing anything else? Are we pretty sure on this?

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We are told by his aides, Chris, that he is in, that he's ready, that Jeb is going to go. Remember, he said early on he would only do this if he could do it with joy, do it joyfully. He's had some bumps on the campaign trail. He's in the middle of the polls when people thought he would be the frontrunner.

But all indications are at Miami-Dade Universe -- Miami-Dade College, which is the biggest higher education institute in the state of Florida, he's going to say, "I'm in. I'm running for president." Jeb Bush joining what could be, Chris -- we could have as many as eight current and former governors in a Republican field that is going to get up above a dozen and maybe even higher than 15.

CUOMO: For all of the celebration of the urgency, I think it's worth a discussion about why he hasn't announced until now. Fair criticism that maybe part of the reason he wasn't announcing wasn't just timing the media cycle but to keep raising unlimited amounts of money through his super PAC, and is that a problem?

KING: Is it a problem? With some of voters, it is. Some of the good government groups, the campaign finance watchdog groups, have criticized this, because if you watch him on the campaign trail, it's actually kind of comical sometimes. He will say, you know, "As president I'll do this. As president I'll do this. As president, I'll do this." And then he says, "if I run." It's clear he's running, and he's been running for some time.

You know, and so people say, "Well, he's doing this to skirt the law. He's doing this to build this gigantic war chest of money so that when he does officially get in, especially now that he has struggled in the polls, that money could be quite important to him as he tries to carve his way back to the front of the pack." Is he being criticized? Yes. Do you often see these campaign finance issues become, you know, the yes or no issue in a campaign? No, they don't. They -- usually, they're criticized in Washington. The groups go after him. Voters don't tend to rebel because of campaign finance questions. CUOMO: I know. And that's somewhat of a shame, though. Isn't

it, John? It does wind up becoming the most dominant and corruptive force in politics. I mean, this guy in "The New York Times," Jay Sandstrom, campaign finance lawyer, served on the FEC, the Federal Election Commission, he says it makes a mockery of the law, what Jeb Bush is doing. Not that Jeb started it. This is a game they're all playing. But is it time for that game to stop? Do you think that becomes an issue, or as you're saying, no; voters don't care, no?

KING: In every cycle, somebody learns to push it a little bit further in both parties. In both parties, they learned, "OK, this guy exploited this loophole. I'm going to take it and go this way." So we've seen this continuously.

Is it about the change? Look, this Congress has shown no willingness, Chris, to take up a big campaign finance legislation. The Supreme Court is on record in the citizens United case saying that's the right of free speech. Corporations are people, too. If you will, that they can spend all this money. If the Supreme Court says they can spend all this money, the candidates are going to try to collect it.

So unless you get a public demand for change, don't look for it.

[07:05:03] CUOMO: And is it true that a lot of the people who are working with him now as his team are going to be split: some will be on the campaign; some will be working for the super PAC. And yet, there is this definition of separation that they don't coordinate, whatever that means in legalese?

KING: Once he announces they're not supposed to coordinate. They're not supposed to be technically coordinating now, but he's not a candidate. So Right to Rise is his super PAC. Right to Rise is his political organization. There will be other PACs set up, as well. Won't just be Right to Rise.

Several of the candidates have not one but maybe two or potentially three super PACs out there helping them. And that's one of the fascinating things that has changed in American politics, Chris. It used to be you built your campaign team. Right? So you took your best guy from your race for governor, your best guy from your race for Senate. This was your ad guy. This was your pollster. This is the guy you trusted for grassroots. And you put them on your campaign team.

Now candidates have to make split decisions. Because they want to take some of their best people and actually say, "I want you to go over here and wants you to work on my super PAC. Now we can't talk anymore. But you're the guy I trust. You know me. You think like me."

So you can make your decisions knowing what I'm going to be like as a candidate. It's actually a fascinating challenge for candidates to decide who's on the official campaign team and who goes over here, allegedly behind a fire wall to help you out. CUOMO: And you've been covering this so well for so long. No

small irony that you have Hillary Clinton going -- she won't talk to us, but she's going to talk to the people, because that's what it's about. And you have 250 people on the GOP side, all saying that this is about people and making it about that.

And yet, it's all about money. And every issue of viability for a candidate is about how much money they can raise. I had a Republican guy who's close to the Jeb team say to me, "Well, we had to time the announcement and make sure he had enough money that when he comes in, you know that he's making a strong presence." It's all about the money, John.

KING: And the question is how does he spend the money? Because again, he's struggling in the polls. Does he spend it just to say, "Here's who I am. Think again"? Or does he spend it to say, "Here's who I am?" And go after some of his Republican rivals right now.

There's an interesting -- granted, an interesting point in the Republican race. A lot of people thought Jeb Bush would at least eke out a little bit of a frontrunner's lead. He does not have that, Chris. And if you look at the early state, you're right about money. It has a huge impact.

But you do have to communicate with voters. You need to go to Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina. You need to do town halls. Maybe you can avoid the mainstream media. But you have to interact at some point.

And right now, if you're Jeb Bush, you're at odds with your party on education -- common core. You're at odds with most of your party on immigration. He wants a path to status or citizenship for the undocumented. He has to convince voters essentially, you know, I think you're wrong or vote for me even though you think I'm wrong. He's going to have to interact with voters. Right now, if you look at the early states, where is he going to win? Is he going to win Iowa? Not today. Is he going to win New Hampshire? Not today. We could go on and on. It's fascinating.

He knows he needs to get in. He needs to change the dynamic of this campaign.

CUOMO: And keep up in the money. So they have to do it less and less. What do you want? Your guy across from John King, so he's getting pop-pop-popped with facts all day? Or a controlled message that you can run on the airways in that place and hopefully do better.

Anyway, John, always good to have your perspective on it. We'll be seeing you in a little bit -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK. Back to the developing story about crime spiking. Baltimore's police commissioner asking for the feds' help in fighting a surge in violent crime there. He says drug wars are fueling the violence and the drugs flooding the streets came from a particular incident. CNN's Miguel Marquez is live in Baltimore with the latest. What's his theory, Miguel? MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, specifically many of

the drugs that are on the street, pharmaceutical drugs, came from the businesses that were robbed and rioted during the worse of the rioting here. Of the pharmacies, 27 pharmacies they're saying were robbed, as well as two methadone clinics.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

COMMISSIONER ANTHONY BATTS, BALTIMORE POLICE: There's enough narcotics on the streets of Baltimore to keep it intoxicated for a year.

MARQUEZ (voice-over): This morning, Baltimore struggles to contain over 175,000 stolen doses of narcotics. A massive amount of prescription drugs, authorities say, taken from 27 pharmacies looted during and after the Freddie Gray riots.

The drug wave, officials say, could be playing a significant role in the dramatic increase in crime here. Forty-three homicides reported in the month of May, this city's deadliest in over four decades.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And we're still counting.

MARQUEZ: The DEA says the number of stolen drugs could potentially double. Around 40 percent of the looted pharmacies haven't even finished tallying their losses.

BATTS: Individuals are getting high to a greater degree and at a greater pace than any time before.

Baltimore police commissioner now pleading for more federal resources, prosecutors and law enforcement officers to boost the city's response.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Criminals are selling those stolen drugs. There are turf wars happening which are leading to violence and shootings in our city.

BATTS: These figures now being used to bolster arguments for stronger police enforcement. Baltimore's police union president says after the six officers were charged in the death of Gray, police he spoke to say they've been more hesitant to draw their guns.

GENE RYAN, BALTIMORE POLICE UNION PRESIDENT: They're afraid to go to jail for doing their job. So they are hesitant and they're reluctant to take action.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[07:10:04] MARQUEZ: Now, it has been the case that feds have come into cities like Baltimore in the past to help out. What is still unclear in this case is how many agents from those many agencies will step up and how they will be used -- Chris.

CUOMO: All right, Miguel. Thank you very much. Other news this morning, the Pentagon anthrax scare is widening.

Officials now confirm suspected live anthrax samples were sent to nearly double the locations originally reported.

Let's bring in CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr.

I don't know that we've covered anything like this anytime recently. Do you?

BARBARA STARR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's not in the Pentagon here in a very long time, at least.

Look, it appears that a procedure for irradiating the anthrax, killing it off, a procedure they used for decades, simply did not work. They do not know why, and the problem is escalating.

Right now, four major lots have tested positive for anthrax. They have about 400 lots left to test. From the four that are positive, samples have been sent out to 51 labs in 17 states at least across the country. Plus the District of Columbia. Plus three countries overseas.

So they have a big rob right now trying to round this all up and figure out exactly where live anthrax may be.

Now, the Pentagon says this is not a public health hazard, because all of it's contained in labs. But listen to the deputy secretary of defense, the No. 2 man at the Pentagon who came out yesterday and the concern that he does have about this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BOB WORK, DEPUTY SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: I have no reason to believe that there's any danger of this causing any type of an outbreak outside the laboratories. And I don't believe that we will have anybody infected. But we are waiting to find out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STARR: But we are waiting to find out. What he is saying is there may be hundreds if not thousands of lab workers who work in these labs across the country and indeed around the world that they have to take a look at their potential exposure to live anthrax. Already some 30 people are getting protective medical treatment -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: The breadth of this is just incredible, Barbara. Thanks so much for all that background.

Well, a former top U.S. soccer official who was on FIFA's executive committee admits he and other members took bribes to rig votes for the 1998 and 2010 World Cup locations. Forty pages of newly-released federal court documents reveal Chuck Blazer pleaded guilty to money laundering, fraud and tax evasion in 2013 and played a central role in the U.S. government's case against other FIFA officials. CUOMO: New details in the grisly murder of a wealthy Washington,

D.C., family and their nanny. Investigators now say there are signs the suspect or suspects forced their way into the home of the Savopoulos family. That's a change from what police initially reported.

Now, Daron Wint has been linked to the crime. He is charged with first-degree murder. Authorities say it is likely he did not act alone and that other charges will be coming.

CAMEROTA: Ted Cruz's timing may need some work. The Texas congressman and Republican presidential candidate joked about Vice President's Biden propensity for verbal gaffes, this at a time when the Biden family is deeply mourning the death of Beau Biden. Cruz now apologizing, saying in a Facebook and Twitter post, quote, "It was a mistake to use an old joke about Joe Biden during his time of grief, and I sincerely apologize. The loss of his son is heartbreaking and tragic, and our prayers are very much with the vice president and his family."

CUOMO: Instant debate. Why it was right, why it wasn't right.

CAMEROTA: I just think that it shows an out of -- deeply out-of- touch quality to make a joke days after his loses his eldest son. I mean, why make that joke?

CUOMO: Because politics is nasty and getting nastier. And when you attack the other side it plays to the crowd that he was in front of.

CAMEROTA: So you think it was intentional?

CUOMO: Absolutely.

CAMEROTA: Not just that he had forgotten?

CUOMO: You even gave him a pass on the read. He has to work on his timing. It's not timing. He knew what he was saying. He thought it was going to work on that crowd. It didn't. It backfired. And then he apologized, and he says it's a horrible thing to do.

Ted Cruz isn't alone in this. You hear from politicians all the time. They do something that works for that crowd. It goes a little too far, right? And then they have to wind up doing what they do, which is dive on it and say it's all horrible. "We're all praying for them."

CAMEROTA: Let us know what you think. You can find me, @AlisynCamerota at Twitter, @ChrisCuomo.

CUOMO: No. That one's not working today.

CAMEROTA: Meanwhile, ISIS has a new weapon in its arsenal, and it does not involve high-tech arms. Desperate Iraqi officials say dire consequences are inevitable. We'll fill you in. CUOMO: We have more on Jeb Bush's 2016 plans and don't forget

Rick Perry. Big announcement later today. He's the man with the glasses. Does the Texas governor have a chance for a second chance? John King, "Inside Politics" with the analysis to come.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:18:29] CAMEROTA: New developments this morning on ISIS's battle for supremacy in Iraq. Residents near Ramadi dam fleeing as the terrorists have reportedly found a new weapon.

Christiane Amanpour is CNN's chief international correspondent. She joins us now in studio.

Great to see you.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: So the terrorist, ISIS has found a new weapon, and that weapon is water?

AMANPOUR: It's tried to do that before in Mosul when it took Mosul last summer. And I've just been talking to one of the major Sunni tribal sheiks in Ramadi. And basically, they are complaining that they have been left abandoned. They don't have enough weapons. The U.S. is trying to get the Sunni tribe to do another awakening. In other words, gather together and beat back the separatists. But they're not getting enough wherewithal, weapons and help to do that.

And with ISIS trying to use water as a weapon, it's going to put a huge amount of pressure on it. Now, apparently there's a huge amount of discussion as to what they want the U.S. to do, what they want their own government to do to try to get this dam out of the hands of ISIS.

CAMEROTA: Well, we say that they're using it as a weapon, meaning that they would flood towns or they're restricting water?

AMANPOUR: I think -- we don't know. They either want to use that water to enable them to be able to use the terrain and the battleground to their advantage and maybe press their advantage in a way that the water was impeding them. But also, they have been known to use any kind of weapon against people, as well.

And let's face it: Syria's Assad has also been using water and food and sieges to starve out many of the rebel holdouts. So this is probably a -- what they think a military weapon, but it also will have the effect, if it proceeds, of denying people water and exacerbating terrible droughts in these countries which reach 50 degrees in the summer.

[07:20:15] CAMEROTA: Absolutely. And also exacerbating the exodus. Because then people are already, we're seeing, are having to go somewhere. AMANPOUR: Yes. As you know, there is a catastrophe of refugees

happening in that area right now, something like 52 million refugees worldwide. That's the highest that this world has ever seen, really, in terms of refugees. And Syrians and Iraqis and all of these people fleeing this consistent and unabated ISIS onslaught. The most people coming over the Mediterranean as migrants have been Syrians so far.

CAMEROTA: I want to talk about the fight -- the U.S. fight against ISIS, because top official, Tony Blinken, has given an actual number that we hadn't heard before. And he says that he believes 10,000 ISIS fighters have been killed. What do you think of that number?

AMANPOUR: Well, I'm sure Tony Blinken is ruing the day that he said that to the French media, because body counts are really not a very smart way to talk about what's going on.

We don't -- I hate talking about Vietnam, but you know, this is what really bogged down everybody in Vietnam. The idea of a body count. They may be trying to walk that back.

But here's the thing. It doesn't really matter. Because what they're doing is getting thousands and thousands of more recruits. And what they're doing is getting thousands and thousands of more acres of territory, whether it's in Iraq or whether it's in Syria. And the fight that the U.S. and the west has is not going well right now.

I've spoken to the deputy CIA director, former Mike Morrell, who said, "I don't see a strategy. Even if we're doing something in Iraq" -- he called it a hammer -- "we have no anvil in Syria. These two are inevitably linked."

The U.S. and other world powers got together in Paris on Monday, and they came out with virtually no strategy. And one of the big attempts at a strategy, as I said, is to get the Sunnis in Iraq to band together and push back the extremists like they did under the surge in the awakening in 2007. It is not happening.

CAMEROTA: What about that argument and that strategy to help arm the people fighting ISIS better?

AMANPOUR: Well, as you know, this administration has gone back and forth over the last several years, pooh-poohing the notion, saying they'll do it, not doing it. And right now, that seems to be, as best I can find out from all my interviews and conversations in the field, that a very small group are being -- are being armed and trained, if at all.

And there is this claim from the field that the United States does not want to hand over weapons to the moderate rebels unless they pledge not to fight Assad. Well, you know, this is craziness on the ground. Craziness. Because now Assad is considered to be helping ISIS against the rebel...

CAMEROTA: But why would the U.S. want not to fight Assad? AMANPOUR: They don't want to get in the fight against Assad.

They just want to do the fight against ISIS. But everybody who I speak to says that the two are inevitably and inextricably linked. You can't just fight ISIS. You have to have a strategy against Assad, as well.

And this is a big problem. And all these years later, now not to be arming and training those moderate rebels which still exist, it's not too late, says former President Clinton to me recently, says Mike Morrell to me recently. But it may be too little still, and that's a problem.

CAMEROTA: Christiane, always great to get all of your information.

AMANPOUR: Thanks, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Thanks so much for sharing it on NEW DAY.

Let's go over to Chris.

CUOMO: All right, Alisyn. Big headlines. Jeb Bush announcing he's announcing. Is he the man?

Conservative blogger targeted for beheading, Pamela Geller. Is this about free speech or the price of provocation or both?

We have former New York mayor, Rudy Giuliani, once ran for president himself, joining us with his take on the big situations.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: You know how politics goes. You don't get it all at once. So 11 days from now Jeb Bush will make a big announcement from a college in Miami and guess what he's expected to declare? Yes, he's running for president.

There are big headlines this morning, and we have a big guy to talk about it, former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani. Mr. Mayor, good to have you here.

RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER MAYOR OF NEW YORK CITY: Nice to be here, Chris.

CUOMO: First the obvious, Jeb Bush getting in. Do you believe he's the best you have?

GIULIANI: Pretty close. I mean, right now I can't say for sure. I think Jeb is someone I've known for a very long time. I'd be very comfortable with him as president of the United States. I think he's just very, very well-qualified on every front.

I think the question for me and all Republicans is who has the best chance of winning. So then you also have to consider Marco Rubio. You have to consider Chris Christie. You've got to look at a couple of the long-shot candidates like Lindsey Graham who just came in with the foreign policy experience and George Pataki with the experience that he had and Scott Walker. But I'd put him right near the very top.

CUOMO: Put him near the top.

GIULIANI: Certainly, if you just said to me he's going to be president of the United States, I would tell you the man is extraordinarily intelligent and very, very well-qualified for the job, both by background and by temperament.

CUOMO: So if he were to become president of the United States, at this point you'd say he'd have your support. But you do not know at this point that he is definitely your choice?

GIULIANI: Yes. Really for reasons of I wanted to pick -- in my case, and I hope all Republicans, I want to pick the one who has the best chance of winning. Because from my point of view, the way I look at politics, it's so important that we have a Republican president to correct a lot of the things that I believe President Obama is doing wrong.

And I don't think Hillary Clinton will make those corrections. She -- I believe that, had Hillary been elected in '08, she'd have been a better president than Obama.

But I think now we need someone who can really correct what Obama has done, and she won't do that. Plus, the questions that have now come out about her give me real, real....

CUOMO: You think there's "there" there with any of the allegations? You're a former federal prosecutor. People should know that.

GIULIANI: Oh, I look at it as a former federal prosecutor. There's no way she wouldn't be in front of a federal grand jury if I was U.S. attorney of New York.

CUOMO: Really? On which allegation?

GIULIANI: The conflict of interest. I mean, we have lots of money going to her husband and to her husband's charity and her charity. Her taking action favorable to the causes that paid money...

CUOMO: Is it her or the State Department...