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Dzhokhar Tsarnaev Apologizes; Boston Bombing Victims Speak Out. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired June 24, 2015 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:43]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Exactly what he said, and we will talk to our correspondent in the field here in just a second.

He said: "I would like to apologize now to the victims and the survivors. If there's any lingering doubt," he said, "I did it, along with my brother. I am sorry for the lives that I have taken."

The judge here inside this federal courthouse, this federal judge George O'Toole, addressed him specifically and said, "Whenever your name is mentioned, what will be remembered is the evil you did. What will be remembered is those you murdered and maimed, innocent people."

Again, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev breaking the silence, addressing the court head on, spoke with quite a bit of an accent, spoke quietly and quietly from that defense table.

I have got a lot of people I want to parse this through with. But I want to begin with our national correspondent, Deborah Feyerick, who is inside that courthouse and saw him with her own eyes.

So, Deborah, just walk me through exactly how he sounded, how he appeared and who he looked at when he was arresting the court.

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the one thing we do know for sure is the tit didn't sway the judge. It certainly did not sway any of the survivors or their families who were in that court listening intently to what he was saying.

He appeared wearing a dark suit, gray button-downed shirt. His hands were folded. He had a very thick, heavy accent, sort of combination of both Russian and Arabic. Interesting, because his wrestling friends have said he had -- he didn't have any accent when they knew him in high school.

But he stood and he addressed the judge. He did not look to the jurors, some of whom were in the jury box. They were there because they wanted to be. They wanted to see what was going on. He did not turn and he didn't look towards any of the victims or the survivors either. But, as you said, he did apologize, he said, and he admitted his guilt.

He said -- quote -- "The bombing, which I'm if there's any lingering doubt, I did do it, along with my brother." And he apologized to the victims, saying: "I'm sorry for the lives I have taken, the suffering I have caused, the damage I have done."

Now, a couple of people outside the court afterwards, they said they did not believe it. One man essentially saying that his lawyer set him up to do, another individual saying, if he was sorry, he could have said it a long time ago, which he didn't.

But there was a lot of drama in the courtroom and it wasn't just the fact that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev broke his silence, Brooke, but it was also about the incredible bravery of the men and the women who stood in that court and essentially gave their victim impact statements.

And one of the amputees, a lovely lady by the name of Rebekah Gregory, she said: "You want a victim impact statement. I'm not someone's victim. I'm not yours. I'm not your brother's." And then she said, "That sign that you gave to everybody flipping them off," she said, "that's what you are doing to us now. You thought that your weapons of mass destruction could separate us," essentially, she said." "In fact, it united us."

And she just -- after she was done testifying, you really heard a number of people in that courtroom almost gasp at the bravery that this woman just talked to him directly, saying your brother is not here, so you get my dose of reality.

A number of the other people, Brooke, they did walk through the pain and the suffering that they have been through, not just the amputees, but people whose injuries are not visible on the outside, but they are so significant on the inside, people who are losing their businesses, whose life savings have gone to paying for insurance and the prosthetic legs that they wear, also marriages being broken up because of all of this.

So it was really powerful and just listening to this very understandable that this is not going away for these people. Maybe over time, it will diminish, but right now it's very fresh and we do know that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev will be going to Terre Haute, Indiana, the same facility where Timothy McVeigh was sentenced before being executed -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Deborah Feyerick, you have been on this from the very beginning and thank you so much for all your reporting outside that federal courthouse.

We're going to get more color from inside that courthouse in just a second.

But I want to turn to these ladies next to me. I have got Sunny Hostin and Ashleigh with me.

And I think the first thing I really want to hear from you, Sunny Hostin, is, listen, we will never know how remorseful this man was uttering these words. From what I understand, he never once like looked around the courtroom or made eye contact with any of the survivors or family members.

But are you surprised, A, that he spoke, B, the words that he chose? [15:05:03]

SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I actually was surprised, only because, during the course of the trial, we didn't really see a lot of emotion from him.

BALDWIN: Right.

HOSTIN: The only time we saw emotion was when his family members, his aunt were on the witness stand.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Talking about "The Lion King" and then he cried. That's about it.

HOSTIN: Exactly. So, I was very surprised not only that he chose to apologize, but the manner in which he apologized, taking responsibility for his actions.

I don't think we have seen that sort of thing when you talk about these federal death penalty cases. If you go back to Timothy McVeigh, he remained defiant through his apology. He sort of said, I apologize that people lost their lives, but this is part of it. So, he still blamed the federal government for it.

So, I thought we would perhaps hear a much more radicalized statement, rather than this what appeared to sincere language, not talking about his intent, but the manner in which he chose the words I thought was really rather interesting.

BALDWIN: The language he chose.

You agreed, too. You thought he would take the moment and say something very differently.

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Or stay totally silent.

BALDWIN: Yes.

BANFIELD: I sure didn't expect him to talk about Ramadan. I'm sure that a lot of people out there who truly follow the tenets of Islam and celebrate Ramadan and deprive themselves during Ramadan are probably pretty offended that he would bring Ramadan into this.

BALDWIN: He brought up forgiveness within Ramadan apparently.

BANFIELD: Well, we're talking about the death penalty. There's very little forgiveness in the death penalty.

BALDWIN: Right.

BANFIELD: So, the whole thing is just such a strange exercise, just the notion that the state looks at a man and says you're finished. For now, you're finished. We are going to work very hard to make sure you're finished, but you're finished. And I have said this over and over. I'm not 100 percent certain that we will ever see the death of this man, 20 years or so down the pike, because that's often what it takes, or...

BALDWIN: Twenty years potentially.

BANFIELD: ... or the number of other people who are adjudicating as well against the death sentence that may have received.

I just think that we're entering a new age in the United States whereby we're already challenging the drugs that we're using in the Supreme Court. And there is a slide of support. It is sliding below the majority for those who support the death penalty. We may not have it. It may be commuted.

But, rest assured, everyone, he's got multiple life sentences. He's going nowhere. And he will be classified. He will be going through a process right now for the next several weeks where they will classify what kind of person this is, what kind of inmate he can be, what kind of stresses and pressures he can undergo and undertake.

But he will more than likely be in a small box by himself in a restricted custody for 70-some-odd years if he doesn't get death.

HOSTIN: And I think you're right. I think sort of the tide is turning when you talk about the death penalty.

The pendulum is swinging, because we first have to challenge the cruel and unusual punishment. Now we're certainly having the challenge as to the way you put people to death. But I think when you talk about the worst of the worst, when you talk about a terrorist, when you talk about people that lost their lives in Boston, I suspect that this will not sort of speed up the pendulum swing.

BANFIELD: It won't curry any favor against the death penalty.

HOSTIN: It won't curry any favor.

BANFIELD: Yes.

HOSTIN: And I also think that perhaps he will take the Timothy McVeigh route. Perhaps he won't appeal. He has an automatic appeal, of course.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Let's hope that he doesn't. Let's hope he doesn't.

HOSTIN: But perhaps he won't do that, and then we could see his death rather quickly.

BALDWIN: Let me jump back to Boston.

I have Kevin Cullen. He's a columnist for "The Boston Globe" who has done phenomenal reporting throughout this entire story. And, Kevin Cullen, let me just begin. Listen, I was reading some of

your tweets live on the air last hour. Can you just please -- you were sitting in the courtroom. Cameras are not allowed in there. Can you just paint the picture how this murderer was standing, who he addressed, the emotions within the courthouse? Tell me everything.

KEVIN CULLEN, "THE BOSTON GLOBE": Well, I mean, he didn't really turn toward anyone. He just stood there.

And it appeared that he was glancing down at a prepared statement as he spoke. He actually showed -- not only did he apologize. He actually showed some real emotion. He paused at length at one point in the middle of his statement and had to gather himself.

So, the other reality, just the acoustics of it, Brooke, a lot of the victims really didn't hear much of what he said. It was really hard to hear exactly what he was saying. But he did not turn to anybody, but obviously he did apologize to his victims.

BALDWIN: What about this judge here, this Judge George O'Toole speaking directly to Tsarnaev and also -- did he quote an opera?

CULLEN: Yes. He quoted from one of Verdi's opera. And he quoted from Shakespeare. I don't know if I'm leaving anything out. George will be mad if we leave anything out.

But it was a very, very good speech by the judge. It's often in times like this that you will hear a judge, and, you know, in such a -- when you think about the cruel aspects of this case, I think Judge O'Toole turned to something like a Verdi opera, like the work of Shakespeare, to provide some comfort that life goes on and these are the things that are important to us.

I also thought probably the best stuff that Judge O'Toole talked about was what we will remember from this case. And he said it won't be the acts of cruelty.

(CROSSTALK)

[15:10:04]

BALDWIN: Kevin, forgive me, if you will stand by. We're hearing from some of the survivors and the victims' families at the podium.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

LYNN JULIAN, BOMBING SURVIVOR: And they'd be here to speak for themselves if they could.

I just wanted to vent a little bit about the first time we heard his voice today. Nobody really realized that we didn't know what he sounded like after two years. And after we heard it, we wished we hadn't, because the things he had to say were sort of shocking.

He talked at first about Allah and this being the month of forgiveness, implying that we should all forgive him. And the last thing we wanted to hear was about Allah and why he did this in the first place and changed all our lives forever.

And then he went on to give a sort of Oscar-type speech, thanking the judge and thanking the jury and thanking his legal team and those who couldn't be here and his family for testifying and making -- and I quote -- "making my life easy for the past two years."

Well, our lives have been anything but easy and our lives will never be the same again. I live a block from the finish line and my neighborhood is changed forever.

He threw in an apology to the survivors that seemed insincere and just thrown in because he was supposed to, and then ended again with Allah, talking about leniency, implying that we should now be lenient to him, because Allah says so.

And I just was unaware that he would get up and just say whatever he wanted, and that's the law. And I regret having ever wanted to hear him speak, because what he said showed no remorse, no regret, and no empathy for what he's done to our lives.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)

JULIAN: Lynn Julian -- L-Y-N-N J-U-L-I-A-N.

QUESTION: Where were you standing when the bombs went off?

JULIAN: I live a block from the finish line, so I was at the first explosion. And I have traumatic brain injury, permanent hearing loss in both ears, and a back injury, and the worst of all is post- traumatic stress, because...

QUESTION: Do you think he should get the death penalty or life?

JULIAN: I don't think that either of those things are going to change anything for any of us. It's never going to bring back our old lives.

I lived in perhaps a false bubble of security that I would go to all the Boston events just like so many people and never feel unsafe, never worry. And now we feel like we're the police. We are the judge and jury of everyone around us, grading their safety level and how much threat they might cause us at any given time just riding the T.

And I'm never going did look at Boston or the world again the same, and none of us are because they took so much more than innocent people's lives. They took our sense of security. They took our sense of safety. We can never leave our homes again and just take a walk without wondering and judging everybody else that walks by us.

QUESTION: Why do you think he spoke today?

SCOTT WEISBERG, BOMBING SURVIVOR: So, I would like to speak. My name is Scott Weisberg. I'm one of the survivors as well. And I'm from Birmingham, Alabama.

I'm a family physician. And I specifically came up today to tell my story. I, as a family physician, have hidden and invisible injuries which most of the media are not aware of. Those injuries for me are bilateral hearing loss, for which I wear hearing aids. I have been wearing them since August of 2013. I also have a mild traumatic brain injury, in addition, have PTSD as well.

And part of today for me was to explain what it's been like to live with for the last two years these injuries. To all of you, I look completely normal. But, inside, I have significant injuries that I have been living with and going through. And, as a physician, and having to go through the struggles of getting diagnosed and having to convince medical professionals what it's like to have injuries and to seek the proper care, part of my treatment has been to make the public aware and also to be an advocate for other survivors.

So, one of my goals and missions ever since this -- since I have been diagnosed, which took me 16 months to get my diagnosis, is to be an advocate for other survivors and for other future events where if somebody has a hearing loss or a brain injury, where they do go? How do they get care? Where do you -- so that they can be treated effectively right from the beginning.

[15:15:21]

And that is one of my main purposes for being here today in this courtroom and coming from Alabama.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE) Tsarnaev's speech, what did you think of (OFF- MIKE) Tsarnaev statement?

WEISBERG: So, I was surprised that he spoke.

I think most of the survivors were, that he spoke today. He said that he was remorseful. I find that hard to believe, since I have come to a lot of the trial and never really saw that at all from him. It really does not change anything for me because what he took from me, I'm never going to be able to regain, nor what he took from my family, nor from any of us as well.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)

WEISBERG: I think he spoke because people were sort of expecting that from him. Since the -- everybody during the trial was commenting on him not making any comments and his lack of remorse and not -- no facial expression, so this was that one last moment for him to kind of just put things aside.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)

WEISBERG: I don't think he was genuine, but that he will say otherwise. And that's not going to change my impression of him or what he did to us. Basically, as was said by, you know, people this morning is, what this tragedy has done is, it's made us stronger as a survivor community.

And, more importantly, it has made us more resilient. And we are still alive. There's four people that aren't, but the rest of us are, and we as a community are going to be stronger and we are going to continue to heal through this. And the main thing for me in speaking was that we will not be forgotten.

QUESTION: You talked in the court about how your life has been completely ruined and in a split-second, the aftereffect of that has completely destroyed your life as you knew it. What did you it mean to you to be able to stand up in court and say that and at least, if he wasn't looking at you, he at least heard you? What did that mean to you?

WEISBERG: To me, being able to finally express what I have been holding in for two years was very powerful.

It gave me the opportunity to let not only the media, the defense, the judge, even the jurors have an opportunity to hear from a survivor that basically has these hidden and invincible injuries, that when you see me on the street, I look completely normal. You know? If I pull out my hearing aids, then you will see that I wear hearing aids.

The brain injury, you can't see. It's not something that's visible. The PTSD, you are not going to see that. So, for me, it was the idea of actually being able to physically express all of those feelings that I have been dealing with for two years and verbally being able to express it to the public.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE) You said you're a marathon runner. Have you run marathons since Boston?

WEISBERG: I have. I came back in 2014, ran the 2014 marathon with the 415 Group, which was the group of survivors. And I did it again this past year. And after the 2014, I started running again marathons like I did before.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)

WEISBERG: A sincere apology would have been nice. A simple, believable apology would have been great. And there was nothing simple about what he said and there was nothing sincere.

One thing that we have done -- you were talking about being proactive and moving forward. Scott and I are both on the board of the Massachusetts Resiliency Center, so we are taking positive steps to unite the community and what we call our marathon family to continue to grow and continue to heal long after this trial is over.

QUESTION: The defense said that they have tried to come to a resolution on this -- on this issue back in October, and that this thing kind of preceded (OFF-MIKE) they would have pleaded guilty at that time. (OFF-MIKE) Do you think that the -- that that should have been accepted, that government offer -- I mean, that offer from the defense team to the government, such that it would have prevented a trial and perhaps some of the -- some of the -- your experience throughout this trial?

[15:20:17]

HENRY BORGARD, BOMBING SURVIVOR: You know what? Today was actually the first day that I learned of that. I was not aware of that before today. And I know that the government

had a good reason for going to trial. So, I can't -- I can't fully answer your question.

I would like to make my own statement. My name is Henry Borgard. Last name is spell B-O-R-G-A-R-D.

I'm from Chicago, Illinois, specifically Downers Grove. And I was out here, living out here attending Suffolk University at the time of the marathon. And I wasn't trying to be there. I wasn't trying to spectate. I didn't have any friends running. I was just walking home from work, and I was a victim of circumstance.

But that being said, I have made a host of friends within our survivor community. They're going to be lifelong friends. They're people that I continually rely on and lean on. And I really want to thank a couple of people, or groups, I should say. First is my family, specifically my mother, who, as you heard in my victim impact statement today, received a phone call from me just three minutes after the explosions went off, and I scared her half to death.

So, I'm sorry, mom. And thank you for your support.

And I also want to thank War Dogs of Chicago, which their organization gifted me my service dog. Her name is Friday. She's a PTSD service dog. And they generously donated her to me after hearing about my story.

I want to thank the people that have worked tirelessly to get this whole trial to a resolution, to capture Dzhokhar Tsarnaev during the manhunt. And I also want to give a sincere thank you to the prosecution staff because they have been absolutely phenomenal. The attorney general's office has been wonderful to all of the survivors.

In regards to Dzhokhar Tsarnaev's statement, my personal opinion is a little bit different than my two compadres here. I was actually really happy that he made the statement. I -- as I said in my personal impact statement, I have forgiven him. I have come to a place of peace, and I genuinely hope that he does as well.

And for me to hear him say that he's sorry, that is enough for me. And I -- I hope, because I still do have faith in humanity, including in him, I hope that his words were genuine. I hope that they were heartfelt. I hope that they were as honest as the statements that you heard today in court from the victims and the survivors.

I obviously have no way of knowing that, but I'm going to take it on faith that what he said was genuine. There was a little bit of rhetoric in there. And I agree with what you said, absolutely. Some of it was hard to hear, you know? But I really -- I was really profoundly affected, really deeply moved that he did do that, because, whether we like to acknowledge it or not, his statement, like ours, takes courage, because the entire world is watching us right now.

And the fact he made a statement, which he didn't have to do, gives him a little bit of credit in my book. So I will answer any questions that you have.

QUESTION: Are you for the death penalty or a life sentence?

BORGARD: Personally, I'm against the death penalty. I do not believe that someone should be punished for killing people by killing that person. That doesn't make sense to me. I would have rather seen him get a life sentence.

That being said, I am happy that justice has been served.

QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)

BORGARD: You know, I -- I made the mistake of looking over at him while I was giving my statement. And he was looking right at me, which was a little disconcerting.

And I had to resort to reading directly off of my little script that I had in front of me after that. I wasn't expecting that, being that he hasn't had any real reaction in court, other than the one with his aunt.

QUESTION: So, you made eye contact?

BORGARD: Yes.

QUESTION: What did that feel like?

BORGARD: You know, he's a human being. I don't know to what extent my forgiveness extends, but what I do know is that I believe in second chances.

And I -- when I made eye contact with him, it wasn't like looking in the face of a criminal. It was like looking in the face of a boy, because I'm going to be 24 in a couple days.

[15:25:04]

Happy birthday.

(LAUGHTER)

BORGARD: And I -- he's younger than me, and that's been something that's really been a hang-up for me to reconcile the fact that -- I was at the second explosion -- to reconcile the fact that the man, the boy who planted that bomb that blew up in front of me is younger than I am. So that's something that's been very difficult to process.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, guys, last question.

QUESTION: Is there anything for your victim statements that you (OFF- MIKE)

JULIAN: I just feel like that the bubble has burst. Perhaps we didn't know we lived in a bubble before. Perhaps we took our security and our sense of safety for granted every time we went out to Fenway Park or TD Garden or just to Boston Common. And now we take nothing for granted. Every time we go out, we are in

flight or fight. We are hyper-aware of everything going on around us. And it's both embarrassing and exhausting.

BORGARD: Agreed.

WEISBERG: And so, basically, in my speech, basically, as a family physician, which is what I am, as a marathon runner on that day, I emphasized the idea that my injuries that I suffered and continue to are invisible and hidden, what it's like to live with those, and the challenges of basically presenting myself as, like, one of you, and what's really going on, on the inside on a day-to-day basis, and how this is going to be a lifelong process of relearning and reinventing myself and refiguring out my new identity, and not only mine, but as a survivor community.

And that's my main mission is so that we're not forgotten, because you can't see those injuries, and that we need resources that we're going to need to continue to seek medical care, professional opinions. And if the one good can come out of this from this event is that there's more public recognition for how to diagnose sudden hearing loss, tinnitus, mild traumatic brain injury, PTSD, and how to get that care right away, so that people don't have to search and struggle to where to turn to get that medical care and expertise.

JULIAN: We hope our work with the Massachusetts Resiliency Center will continue to promote awareness and education.

WEISBERG: And that Resiliency Center is the mainstay for the survivor community going forward.

JULIAN: Thank you, guys.

BORGARD: Thank you.

BALDWIN: All right. So we have just heard from these three different survivors at different places along Boylston Street two Aprils ago in Boston, when those pressure cooker bombs went off.

First, let me just say, I think it's really a testament to the survivor community there in Boston just how phenomenal these people are and how they have really come together in the wake of such a tragedy, but secondly how so entirely disparate the -- how some of these folks really took that apology or the apologetic language inside that courthouse moments ago from this convicted terrorist.

So, I want to go to Mel Robbins, who is a lawyer. She's a CNN commentator. She lives in Boston.

You have been eating this, living this, breathing this here for I don't know how many months it's been. And I'm just curious. You heard the first woman say, listen, it was hearing -- hearing Dzhokhar Tsarnaev's apology was like this Oscar-worthy speech, absolutely, in her opinion, insincere.

And then you hear this 24-year-old survivor saying, listen, I'm taking it on face value. I believe him. I forgive him.

What do you make of this?

MEL ROBBINS, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: You know, Brooke, you said it earlier in your comments, that they were on different spots along the route as the explosion went off.

What I make of it is, they are on different spots on the road to processing it. And when you see Lynn, who was the first woman that talked, who called who called it an Oscar-worthy performance, and who was frankly furious, furious that he invoked Ramadan, furious that he asked for forgiveness from Allah, and that Allah's name was mentioned in the proceedings, angry that he apologize -- and I may be parsing the words, Brooke, but he apologizes for taking lives. He doesn't apologize for setting the bombs.

He never actually apologized for doing what he did. He just apologized for the damage that he caused, and she was very angry because she felt that it was extremely insincere.

Now, contrast that with Henry, the 24-year-old that you were talking about, and I was struck, just like you were, by this guy. And the difference is, he has clearly come to terms, Brooke, with what happened to him. And, as he told all of us, he has found a way to forgive Tsarnaev, and so he could accept the apology at face value.