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Trump Comments Regarding Megyn Kelly Examined; Ferguson One Year Later. Aired 10-11p ET
Aired August 10, 2015 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[22:00:00] ANDERSON COOPER, AC360 SHOW HOST: CNN Tonight with Don Lemon starts now.
DON LEMON, CNN TONIGHT SHOW HOST: Trump means never having to say you are sorry. This is CNN Tonight. I'm Don Lemon. You heard it here first, the republican frontrunner taking a shot at Fox News Megyn Kelly.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So, I have a, you know, she gets out and she starts asking me all sorts of ridiculous questions. And, you know, you could see there was blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her wherever, but she was -- in my opinion, she was off base.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Well, that was right here Friday night. But Donald Trump is not backing down. In fact, he says Megyn Kelly owes him an apology. But what is he so angry about? I want you to listen to the exchange from the GOP debate that started it all.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MEGYN KELLY, THE KELLY FILE SHOW HOST: Mr. Trump, one of the thing people love about you is you speak your mind, and you don't use a politician's filter. However, that is not without its downsides. In particular, when it comes to women. You've called women you don't like, fat pigs, dogs, slobs, and disgusting animals. Your Twitter account says several...
TRUMP: Only Rosie O'Donnell.
KELLY: No, it wasn't.
KELLY: Your Twitter account...
TRUMP: Thank you. KELLY: For the record, it was well beyond Rosie O'Donnell.
TRUMP: Yes, I'm sure it was.
KELLY: Your Twitter account has several disparaging comments about women's looks. You once told a contestant on "Celebrity Apprentice" it would be a pretty picture to see her on her knees. Does that sound to you like the temperament of a man we should elect as president? And how will you answer the charge from Hillary Clinton who is likely to be the democratic nominee that you are part of the war on women?
TRUMP: I think the big problem that this country has is being politically correct.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: And the mogul who wants to be your next president doesn't stop there. Here's what he told me just 24 hours after the debate. And I want to point out we're not editing what he said. Here it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Well, let's talk about Megyn Kelly because you brought her up. She did push you, pushed a lot of people. But what is it with you and Megyn Kelly?
TRUMP: Well, I just don't respect her as a journalist. I have no respect for her. I don't think she is very good. I think she is highly overrated. But when I came out there -- you know, what am I doing, I'm not getting paid for this. I go out there, and you know, they start saying lift up your arm if you're...
And you know, I didn't know that it was going to be 24 million people I figured, but I knew it was going to be a big crowd, because I get big crowds, I get ratings. They call me the ratings machine. So, I have, you know, she gets out and she starts asking me all sorts of ridiculous questions.
And you know, you could see there was blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her wherever, but she was -- in my opinion, she was off base.
And, by the way, not in my opinion. In the opinion of hundreds of thousands of people on Twitter. Because it has been a brutal day. In one way, a great day for Fox. And another day in the Twitter sphere, it's been very bad because she's been badly criticized.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Well, shortly after that remark about Megyn Kelly, Donald Trump was dis-invited to the annual Red State gathering in Atlanta. He later tweeted that he was talking about blood coming out of Kelly's nose. So, what does all this mean for his campaign?
Joining me now is democratic strategist Maria Cardona, republican strategist, Rick Wilson, CNN political reporter, Sara Murray, and Katrina Pierson, spokesman for the Tea Party Leadership Fund.
I appreciate all of you joining us tonight. So, let's have a great conversation about this. OK. So, Maria, you first. Trump says only deviants would assume that he was talking about women -- I can't even say this, menstruating. Are you a deviant?
MARIA CARDONA, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Right. No. Well, you know what's interesting, Don, when I heard the comments when he was doing the interview on your show, I didn't think of it that way. And so, I actually believed Donald Trump's explanation.
But here's the point. It doesn't matter. He disqualified himself in terms of being somebody capable and deserving of being a commander-in- chief a long time ago. And what I find sort of amusing and interesting is the conservative blogger's sphere's selective outrage.
Where was their outrage when Donald Trump essentially insulted a whole country and 54 million that being also live in this country? Where was their outrage when he insulted our veterans, our military heroes? When he insulted the whole of nursing mothers.
[22:04:51] So, I think what he said was outrageous. And if people who heard it that way, of course they are going to be offended. I think it was stupid for him to talk about that. I don't think any man speaking in public should ever talk about blood coming out of any part of a woman's body.
LEMON: Well, Maria, I think that when you say...
CARDONA: And so, you know, I just think it's Trump.
LEMON: ... when you said that, I wasn't sure what he meant. But certainly in my mind it doesn't that way. It didn't strike me that way when I heard it.
LEMON: I thought it was crude but Donald Trump is crude. And Megyn Kelly is a friend of mine. Had I thought it was that way I would have defended her more. But she doesn't need me to defend her. She is a strong woman.
LEMON: What does the rest of you think about Donald Trump, what do you think when he meant when he said about that, said that on Friday? Rick.
RICK WILSON, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Look, I think a lot was indicated by that sort of snide 13-year-old boy tone he used when he said something like in other places. That was obviously something that you -- you could easily infer that. And the fact of the matter was that this is not a guy who has covered himself in glory when it terms of dealing with women.
LEMON: OK. WILSON: And so, this is -- go ahead.
SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes. I just think that that kind of comment when you are talking about blood coming out of someone's body one way or another is not what you want to be talking about as a republican presidential candidate or any presidential candidate. The reality is that is pretty crude language as you pointed out, Don, and I think the people who are offended just don't think that belongs in the dialogue for people who want to be president.
KATRINA PIERSON, TEA PARTY LEADERSHIP FUND SPOKESMAN: Well, and I'm going to have to agree with Maria on two counts. So, first of all, you know, it is interesting that there is selective outrage because we didn't hear anything from the other side when Sarah Palin was being dragged through the mud.
And more importantly, I watched the show myself and I just like Maria, I didn't take it that way. When you hear all the comments in context, it didn't come across that way. It came across because they're trying to things this happened.
LEMON: Well, perhaps because he said that -- he said similar things about Chris Wallace and he was, you know, went on to say that.
LEMON: It didn't strike some people that way. But, you know, he's...
PIERSON: But people hear what they want to hear.
LEMON: We have to take him at his -- people hear what they want to hear. But we have to take him out of his word. He said he didn't mean it. It was certainly crude.
LEMON: But, listen, just moments ago, Megyn Kelly actually addressed the whole thing on her show and here's what she said tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Apparently, Mr. Trump thought the question I asked was unfair and felt I was attacking him. I felt he was asked a tough but fair question. We agreed to disagree. Mr. Trump did interviews over the weekend that attacked me personally. I've decided not to respond.
Mr. Trump is an interesting man who has captured the attention of the electorate. That's why he's leading in the polls. Trump, who is the frontrunner, will not apologize. And I certainly will not apologize for doing good journalism.
So, I'll continue doing my job without fear or favor. And Mr. Trump, I expect will continue with what has been a successful campaign thus far. This is a tough business, and it's time now to move forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Maria, that is what one calls taking the high road.
CARDONA: Yes. And I actually think that she is -- she is going to be viewed very highly because of that. But here's the point. Again, where was the outrage, not just from the conservative blogger's sphere, but from the proper candidates who were on the stage with Mr. Trump when he went after Megyn Kelly in the debate?
CARDONA: And over the weekend, when he re-tweeted a tweet about her being a bimbo. All of that, I think underscores that he is not qualified to become President of the United States.
CARDONA: And everything that he has said before that as well.
LEMON: Here is what Roger Ales, Fox News president, said about the whole thing. He said, "Donald Trump and I spoke today. We discussed our concerns, and I again expressed my confidence in Megyn Kelly. She is a brilliant journalist and I support her 100 percent. I assured him that we will continue to cover this campaign with fairness and balance. We had a blunt but cordial conversation and the air has been cleared."
So, Katrina, Trump is now saying that Megyn should apologize to him. He also posted a tweet linking to an interview that she did with Howard Stern. This is back in 2010. And it says, "Oh, really, check out innocent Megyn Kelly discussion on Howard Stern show five years ago. I am the innocent pure one." And here is the interview Trump is referring to where Howard and Megyn talk about, well, just about everything.
PIERSON: Well, yes, and I think he was referring to...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD STERN, THE HOWARD STERN SHOW HOST: Those are real breasts?
KELLY: Yes, these are real. I mean, they don't look fake, please.
KELLY: You know what is funny when I got...
STERN: And you're a C cup, aren't you. You are.
KELLY: My husband calls them killer bees. STERN: Other bees.
STERN: They looked like C's to me, don't they?
KELLY: We used to call him the killer bees and then -- and then when I was pregnant, they became swimming C's and Doug was frolicking in the ocean.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: OK. So, here's the thing, Katrina. I remember when that interviewed air. I lived in Atlanta and I watched Megyn Kelly. I didn't know her then. But when you go on Howard Stern, that's what he does. That's his stick. And I thought she handled it -- she handled herself very well on that show. She didn't give away anything. She played along but didn't give him too much. Is it time for him to let the feed feud with Megyn Kelly go?
[22:09:59] PIERSON: Well, yes, I do think so. And she did handle herself very well. And what we're seeing with Trump is the way Donald Trump responds, this is the exact same thing, like Howard Stern. But Megyn did a really good job. I think where he feels a little slighted is the question she had asked him about his comments had nothing to do with Donald Trump the man.
It had everything to do with Donald Trump the television character. It's no different than calling Ronald Reagan a wife beater just because he beat up a woman in a movie he played in once. So, I think that's why he feels a little slighted.
LEMON: Rick, you're being off quite this evening. Rick, you know, I went back, they replayed the debate this weekend on Fox and I watched the whole thing. I do have to say, it was pointed. I mean, Donald Trump did get personal questions and the other guys mostly got policy questions. But Donald Trump is not a politician, so there weren't many policy questions to ask him.
WILSON: Right. There is no policy to be had with Donald Trump. This is purely an ego operation with Donald Trump. There is no they're there policy wise. I'm sure his policy papers is going to come out with the giant Trump logo on a single page of double space paper saying things like, I'll make our health care system terrific.
You know, the problem with the debate and the questions is that Donald Trump took questions about his character that will be asked of him if he is the nominee -- if the apocalypse is upon us and Donald Trump is the nominee, he will be asked questions like that.
LEMON: But should you not hit back when someone attacks him? Or do you think something is inappropriate, why shouldn't he hit back?
WILSON: Let me tell you, there is a difference between being not PC and being a giant epic Deutsche canoe. And this guy goes, he acts like somebody who is not presidential. He acts like somebody who is not -- he doesn't have the gravitas and dignity of the president's office. You know, and it's a tough balance.
You want to punch back, you want to be assertive, you want to test some presence on the stage. But on the other hand, this becomes completely about Donald Trump's delicate little ego. And you notice, this isn't all about Megyn Kelly, who is an outstanding journalist by every account. This is isn't about her. It's every time he is dinged by a reporter, they are suddenly an idiot, a loser, a jack ass, the worst in the world. This is a guy who deals in this hyperbolic rhetoric in language at all times. This is isn't about...
LEMON: Rick, I did not give a -- I did not give a warning before the show because I'm sure kids may be watching. But I tell you what.
PIERSON: It's late, Don. But, Don, but, Don, Rick is right. Rick is right on one aspect.
LEMON: Yes. You know, this is Don after dark. This is -- it's early on the west coast, so I apologize to all the families there.
WILSON: Sorry about that.
LEMON: But, Sara, before I get you back in as the trusted CNN correspondent let's have a little palate cleanser and then we'll come back. So, what will Donald Trump say next, we're going to hear him live on CNN's New Day tomorrow morning at 7.
Stay with everybody. We have a lot to talk about. Coming up, does Donald Trump have a woman problem? Hillary Clinton says, his remarks are outrageous and offensive. But there is another republican that she says is just as troubling.
Plus, crowds of demonstrators gathering on the streets of Ferguson tonight, a year after the death of Michael Brown. You're looking at live pictures now. We're going to go there live.
[22:15:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Donald Trump's comments about Megyn Kelly right here have a lot of people wondering, does Trump have a woman problem? And will it hurt his campaign. Back with me now, Maria Cardona, Rick Wilson, Sara Murray, and Katrina Pierson.
So, Sara, I want to get to you. You've been covering this and watching. Does he have a woman problem because -- I don't know if the polls are even reflecting that right now? Is that just fodder or the ponterati (ph)? MURRAY: Well, I think the reality is the polls aren't reflecting that
right now. Right now the polls show Donald Trump as a frontrunner who is polling from a broad base of the Republican Party. But I think the question is, whether those polls starts to change post-debate and as more people hear the things he said in that debate and about Megyn Kelly.
And the reality is this is in an area where republicans have been working really hard to shore up their support not just in 2012 but for decades. It's been much easier for democrats to win women voters than for republicans. And they're trying to change that. And they're not really sure comments like this about Megyn Kelly or about women generally are going to help them with that cause.
LEMON: OK. Rick, you know, Roger Stone, trump's former adviser, he resigned or was fired depending on who you ask, right? He spoke to my colleague Anderson Cooper earlier tonight and he was asked about whether Trump who is a guy who likes to fight back has a temperament to be president. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROGER STONE, TRUMP'S FORMER ADVISER: This is a Trump maxim, which is also is don't max him. If somebody hits you, hit them back, but harder. I agree with that. But not if you're a candidate running for the president of the United States. It's different to be a real estate developer or a mogul or a celebrity television star. But in the realm of politics you'd better off to ignore those criticisms and move back on to your main message.
COOPER: It's time wasted?
STONE: Yes. In my view, it's not just productive. And we've already seen that when he talks big picture he zooms to number one in the polls.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So, Rick, here's the question. I watched the interview, the one with Poppy Harlow here on CNN this weekend. I wasn't really quite sure he said -- he said he quit. But then he is also still supporter.
So, I mean, what is -- is this all some weird strategy that we don't know what's going on behind the scenes? Are they in collusion? The Trump campaign is saying he is doing it for his own publicity? What is going on here?
WILSON: Roger moves in mysterious ways. He's one of the greats in this business and he is the guy with a lot of deep knowledge. And if Roger has actually departed from the Trump orbit I take him at his word that it was his decision. Because what he says has the ring of truth because it's obvious that Trump is not listening to political council, he's listening to that voice in his brain.
LEMON: But it's working for him so far. WILSON: You know, here's the thing. He is a guy who is racing down the track and parts are falling off the machine but he still thinks he is going to lead and win the race. And without political counsel, you know, he brags about not doing polling, he brags about not having consultants, this is eventually going to be something that Donald Trump can't put together on his own.
He can't wing it. He can't call in to interviews and make the campaign consistent just of that. You have to run an actual campaign. You have to build out a series of policy ideas, you have to build out an operational plan for the states. You have to build out a broad national strategy not only to win the primary but to win the general. And he's not doing those things right now.
[22:20:00] Because most of the time he is hold up in Trump tower. He's taken a few little journey out. But like Howard Hughes he is stuck in Trump Tower most of the time isolated from the world calling into TV shows and running his campaign that way.
WILSON: You know, look, God bless Twitter, because I love it, but you can't run the whole campaign based on that.
LEMON: Hey, Katrina, here's to presidential candidate Lindsey Graham said about Trump that he is permanently damaging the GOP. Is Lindsey Graham right?
PIERSON: No. Lindsey Graham damages the GOP simply because he's one of those go along to get along politicians tuck your tail and run and apologize before you leave and do anything wrong. Donald Trump isn't doing things the traditional republican way and he is still ahead.
He is not paying for digital, he's not asking for money, he's not doing those traditional things, and yet, his numbers continue to go up.
CARDONA: That's true.
PIERSON: But whether or not he wins the nomination, I think republicans should take notice as to what's galvanizing his acceptance in this race. And it's the simple fact that he is an apologetic and yet, he and Megyn Kelly got into it.
But Rick was right. He's like that with everybody. So, it's not just against women. Donald Trump is Donald Trump, and anybody that goes after him knows he's going to come back right back at them. And people want somebody that is going to defend themselves for a change and not what we've seeing ...
WILSON: What they don't want, though, is a president who's going to stick -- what they don't want is a president with his finger on the nuclear button who is short tempered...
WILSON: ... thin skinned impulse impulse-driven guy with no fuse.
LEMON: OK, Rick. All right. Here's what -- when I had this conversation with friends. As you can imagine I was very popular this weekend for people talking about this interview, less so than Megyn Kelly and Donald Trump. But people wondering what was it like for that moment, and blah, blah, blah.
So, someone said the same thing that you said. I really appreciate his candor. I like someone who doesn't have political points. I like that he says like it is. I like all of that stuff. But is he the guy that I want to have his finger on the button. I think that's a very good point that you're not the first person I hear -- I've heard to say that. Maria, what do you make?
CARDONA: Yes. And, Don, one voter's candor is another voter's jerkiness. And so, absolutely, a commander-in-chief should be blunt, should talk the truth to voters but they also need -- they need to know how to conduct themselves on the world stage. And that's exactly what Donald Trump has demonstrated he doesn't know how to do.
LEMON: But there are people who say that's what exactly -- that's what the world needs. I mean, that, you know...
LEMON: ... because -- no. People say that's what America needs, someone who is blunt now, straight talking, can tell people like Putin where they need to go and they think that Donald Trump is the answer regardless of history honestly.
CARDONA: But you know what? Those people, Don, are -- I think have a limited number within the Republican Party. Though, Katrina did say something that is true. Republicans do need to take notice in terms of what Donald Trump is doing?
CARDONA: And the kind of focus that he is putting on voters that don't feel like other republicans are speaking to them.
LEMON: OK, OK. I want to get to Sara, because Sara, basically for Hillary Clinton's comment. If you can tell us what Hillary Clinton had to say and play them for us. Where are Hillary comments on this?
MURRAY: So, as you might imagine Hillary Clinton was not very impressed with Donald Trump's comments about Megyn Kelly. Let's take a look at what she had to say today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILLARY CLINTON, U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think the guy went way overboard, offensive, outrageous, pick your adjective. But what Marco Rubio said has as much of an impact in terms of where the Republican Party is today as anybody else on that stage. And it is deeply troubling. And it should be to the press, not just to those of us who those of us who have been doing this work for so long.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Is that resonating? Is that, Sara?
MURRAY: I think the shrewd thing about that is obviously all republicans candidates aren't talking about women in the same way. But when she says they have the same policies, they're not for paid maternity leave, they want to defund Planned Parenthood, they're all pro-life and one form or another, whether believe an exceptions or not.
I do think that's a potentially potent political attack. It's just, you know, the same policies wrapped in a different packaging.
LEMON: Yes. Hey, I was miss...
MURRAY: But isn't that typical -- isn't that typical of Hillary Clinton, though?
LEMON: Sara, I was remising-- hang on. Sara, tell me about the Rubio comment she's referring to.
MURRAY: The Rubio comments she's referring were in the debate where in the debate where he was saying that he doesn't believe in any exceptions for rape, incest, for life of the mother when it comes to abortion.
LEMON: When it comes to abortion. Yes.
MURRAY. Which is interesting because he's been a co-sponsor of legislation that includes all those exceptions, but apparently, now this is where he stands.
WILSON: He clarified that statement later.
LEMON: Go ahead, Rick.
WILSON: He clarified that statement later. It's striking to me, though, that Hillary chose to attack Marco by the vector of Donald Trump because I know that she is -- he is one of the few candidates that makes Hillary clutch her life alert. Because she's terrified -- because she's been to this rodeo before when her husband was the young, fresh, dynamic outsider with the great rhetoric and the great presentation.
She recognizes the power of somebody who is a new player on the field who doesn't come across as somebody like her who's been in public life for 374 years now. And so, she attacks Marco through the vector of Donald Trump. You're
going to see that Trump is going to be like radiation of a lot of the candidates. They're going to try to say, oh, just like Donald Trump, you are contemptuous of women.
Just like Donald Trump, you are a, you know, you are someone who doesn't, you know, respect the, you know, wages or rights or whatever of women. You are going to see them try to use Trump as a back stop to attack other republicans.
CARDONA: Well, no.
PIERSON: I think they don't need Donald Trump for that. Hillary Clinton has...
PIERSON: For a very long.
WILSON: They don't need him, but it's an extra bonus. They're using his celebrity as a bounce to get even further traction on the messages that they normally would use in their normally deceptive and...
CARDONA: But also, republican wise Mitt Romney won and John McCain won.
LEMON: Hang on, Maria first, and then Katrina.
CARDONA: Thank you. Republicans are making it really easy, first of all, because Donald Trump is the frontrunner of the republican primary.
LEMON: Do it fast, Maria.
CARDONA: Secondly, because he is essentially denigrating, once again, the republican brand with the two constituencies that the GOP need in order to win the White House. Latinos, bye-bye Latino vote and women. You're going to see a huge...
LEMON: OK. Katrina, I've got to go. I'm getting Maria a bit. Go ahead.
PIERSON: Not at all. Not at all. Look, Donald Trump wasn't around when Mitt Romney lost. He wasn't around when John McCain lost. And frankly, I will talk to Hillary Clinton about her war on women when she talks to everybody else about the all-rich white people democratic primary.
LEMON: OK. That's it. Last word. Thank you, guys.
CARDONA: Thank you, Don.
LEMON: I wonder if Rick had he had nails tonight for dinner. He was on fire. We're not done talking about Donald Trump. When we come right back, a former "Apprentice" contestant who defends the republican frontrunner. Omarosa Manigault is here.
[22:30:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DON LEMON, CNN: In the wake of Donald Trump's comments about Megyn Kelly on this show, a lot of people are asking if he has a woman problem. But not my next guest. She defends Trump even though she was fired by him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You not only lost. You got creamed. You know, I've always been a big Omarosa fan, but Omarosa, you're fired. This was not close.
OMAROSA MANIGAULT, "THE APPRENTICE" CONTESTANT: Thank you for bringing that.
TRUMP: Thank you very much.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Joining me now is Omarosa Manigault. Did I say that right, Manigault?
MANIGAULT: Don, can you start with like me not getting fired.
LEMON: Well, let me introduce you. Former contestant of "The Apprentice," and former consultant for vice president Al Gore. I mean, you are first...
MANIGAULT: Yes. I got to correct you. I was deputy associate director of presidential personnel.
MANIGAULT: My last appointment was in the Clinton administration. I did work for Gore, which was torture, but that was for a very short amount of time.
LEMON: Am I fired now? Yes.
MANIGAULT: Yes. But get my credential's right, boo.
LEMON: All right. So, listen, many people are polled at the language and the tone that Donald Trump uses. He speaks like the reality show celebrity that' he is. But you're not one of those people who has a problem with him?
MANIGAULT: I don't. Because you know what, I think it's just so unfair. I know you shouldn't talk about fairness. But what a colossal waste of time that we're spending all of this time trying to interpret what Donald Trump said about Megyn Kelly, as opposed to getting down to where he stands on women's issues.
We've slander a whole weekend speculating whether or not he's talking about hormones or not, instead of trying to figure out about the gender wage gap, talking about reproductive health for women, talking about funding or defunding Planned Parenthood. Shame on the press. Shame on the media. Shame on people wasting women's time.
MANIGAULT: He needs to know where are the candidates...
LEMON: So, he have no women problem, no.
MANIGAULT: ... on this serious issue.
LEMON: So, no women problem for him do you think?
MANIGAULT: You know what, Donald Trump has an authentic problem. He's too real for the Republican Party. I heard on your last panel that you were saying Donald Trump had some way damaged the GOP. Do you know who damaged the GOP? George W. Bush, when he couldn't pronounce certain countries. George W. Bush, when he didn't know the geographical location of our enemies.
Sarah Palin. I mean, are we seriously trying to figure out whether or not Donald Trump would make a good president. The man has major, major skills that he can offer. And instead, we're trying to figure out what tabloid headlines to come up next up with next week for Donald Trump.
MANIGAULT: We need to treat him as a serious candidate.
LEMON: So, you said he is too real for the GOP.
LEMON: Is he too real, though, to be president? And what about -- because, you know, it has to translate to other parts of the world. Not just here in the United States.
MANIGAULT: Well, they were talking about his temperament in your last segment. And have you ever met Dick Cheney? Seriously. If you want to meet somebody with a temperament problem. He shot his friend in the face. Donald Trump can be president.
He's cool, he's calm, he's got New York swag. And you know what, we need a little of that in your face. I can't wait to see him go toe to toe against Hillary Clinton on real issues because if the GOP keeps playing around with Donald Trump, he is going to slide right in there and steal that nomination and we will see the best debate in history. Hillary Rodham Clinton, Done J. Trump.
LEMON: So, I asked him this question on Friday, I said, you know, you -- if you...
LEMON: ... you're going to stands up against Putin and against China and all of that, but then you get upset when someone like Megyn Kelly asks you a tough question -- a question that many people saw as fair. He didn't see it as fair, but I think most other people saw it as fair. Then how are you going to negotiate with world leaders if you are viewed as so thinned skinned. You don't think he is thin skinned, though?
MANIGAULT: No. I've been on the receiving end of one of Donald Trump's kind of wraths. He is tough but he's fair. I've also attended amazing event that Donald Trump had. He opened up Donald Trump Dubai. There were world leaders at this event. I talked to them.
I met people from India, from Russia, from Asia, they were there, they loved him. He knows how to negotiate on an international stage. Do not underestimate the power of Donald Trump or you will be scratching your head wondering how did he get the republican nomination.
[22:34:58] LEMON: You know, he's going to be focusing more on policy now as what we are -- you have been called a diehard democrat.
MANIGAULT: I am.
LEMON: Some say that Trump is more of a democrat than a republican when it comes to policy. So, what do you think about -- what people call his flip-flops on issues, like health care, like abortion? And even -- before you answer that, even in the debate there was a question that said -- I think Megyn said, when did you become a republican?
MANIGAULT: You know, I think having been in politics since I was 13 years old, I can tell you that people evolve, people change. Even I changed. I don't know if you know I ran for school board. And suddenly people are asking me my opinion about certain things, certain issues -- that was my periscope, sorry.
About certain issues that I had never thought about before. And so, then I had to start to kind of conceive and think about my positions. And even though I had said things before, if I didn't have that information then I couldn't really formulate a clear policy.
I'm going to let me tell you something, Donald Trump is hiring the best policy analysts that money can buy. He's being advised by the best. And when he puts his position papers out, believe me, they are going to be solid, they're going to reflect where he stands on issues. And you won't be scratching your head.
And by the way, he's not the only one. I went to Jeb Bush's web site today, I went to Jindal's web site today, they don't have clear policy position because it's still very early. LEMON: OK. Omarosa, you're fired.
LEMON: Just from this segment because it's up.
MANIGAULT: That's so original.
LEMON: But you could always come back. I know, it was corny. Thank you, Omarosa. Always a pleasure. I appreciate it.
MANIGAULT: Great to see you, Don.
LEMON: You as well. When we come right back, protesters in the streets of Ferguson tonight, one year after Michael Brown was shot to death by police. We're going to have the very latest for you.
[22:40:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: We get to some breaking news right now. It's in Ferguson. Protesters gathering on the streets there tonight in Missouri, a year after Michael brown was shot to death by police. St. Louis County under a state of emergency.
CNN's Jason Carroll live in Ferguson, where there is an uneasy calm right now, especially after what happened overnight, Jason, someone arrest last night. A number of arrests today. What's going on?
JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, I think you hit the nail right on head when you said uneasy calm. That's what the feeling is like out here on West Florissant, where we saw so much violence last night. And tonight, what we are seeing are a number of protesters, numbering about 100 here along West Florissant.
That's on one side of the street, Don. And if you take a look on the other side of the street, that's where you see the huge number of law enforcement that we have out here. Members of St. Louis County police, and also state troopers out here as well.
Some of law enforcement in riot gear. But when you say uneasy calm, again, that's what we're really experiencing out here. When you've got some of these protesters who are out here who are obviously still angry. A year later, there still needs to be so much change here in this community. And you feel that, Don, when you're out here, when you're listening to some of the protesters who are here, who have expressed so much of their anger.
And when they get in front of these officers out here, they let these officers hear it. They let them know how angry they are, even still, even a year later saying there still needs to be change that has to happen out here.
One of the things that I found interesting out here, Don, that I observed is the dialogue that is occurring out here tonight which perhaps it didn't happen last night. You had one of the community activists who is right here in the middle of this crowd. Again, I want you to take a look at it here as we're talking, that's gathered here in West Florissant.
And one of the community activists that's been out here has also been engaging with a member of the state troopers out here, really talking back and forth trying to isolate those who might be trouble makers here in the crowd. When I spoke to that state trooper, he said, look, these people are out there, they are demonstrating peacefully, they have to right to do that. There is no curfew. We just want to keep things safe. So, that is the goal here tonight. It is still early, we'll see what happens.
LEMON: Hey, Jason, I have to ask you. So, you said there is a community activist out there, you said they're trying to establish lines -- lines of communication.
LEMON: So, what do police aren't engaging with them, right? Is it just an engagement with members of the community or community leaders, between them and the police?
CARROLL: It's a little bit of both. What I witnessed when I was out here and this was just a few moments ago, was this community activist speaking to this officer saying, hey, you know, good job, and, you know, doing what you're doing. Because at one point, some of the members of the protesters became a little bit agitated as they got in front of the police.
The police pulled back, not wanting to engage in that way. But also trying to do everything they can to isolate anyone who might be out here not wanting to demonstrate peacefully. That is the goal here. That's what they want to try to achieve tonight, and tomorrow night, and the night after that.
LEMON: Jason Carroll for us in Ferguson, Missouri. Jason, thank you very much. I appreciate it.
When we come right back, what lessons have we learned since Ferguson erupted in violent unrest last year. And what can police to do keep a lead on things tonight?
[22:45:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Protesters in the streets of Ferguson tonight with St. Louis County is under a state of emergency. The county is under a state of emergency.
Joining is Jeff Roorda of the St. Louis Police Officers Association, author of soon to be released book, "Ferghanistan," and then "The War on Police." And also with me is Chris Chestnut, an attorney who represented the family of Jonathan Ferrell, an unarmed man killed by a police officer.
And retired New York Police detective, Harry Houck is with us this evening. So, we just went live to Ferguson. And, Jeff, I don't know if you got to see the report, but what we're seeing right now according to Jason, some peaceful protesters out, he says there is dialogue between the protesters, the community leaders, and the police. Is that good in your opinion?
JEFF ROORDA, ST. LOUIS POLICE OFFICERS ASSOCIATION BUSINESS MANAGER: It is, Don, but you know, these things are good until they're not good. And you know, it's sort of the bewitching hour. You know, at midnight it tends to be when things really go astray up there.
So, I've been texting back and forth the cops are online up there and they're using words like rowdy, dicey, tense, and that worries me.
LEMON: Why does that worry you?
ROORDA: Well, because, you know, it's just such a powder keg. And, you know, we've blown through 365 days of missed opportunities talking about faux police reforms when we ought to be talking about how to make life better for these kids that live in this inner city setting that are so hopelessness and such despair that they turned to violence and turn it more and more frequently against cops. Sometimes the kid dies. Sometimes the cop dies, either way, it's an unhappy outcome.
LEMON: But, Jeff, you say faux police reform. I mean, no agency, no one is perfect. Police could use a little reforming and I'm sure the kids, who are there and some of the people who live there can use some help themselves. So, you know, it's not just on the community, don't you think the police could use some reforming?
ROORDA: This is a profession that is in constant evolution, constantly evolving. And you know, we -- we, you know, assimilate to the surroundings we're in. Just as they did last night, they tried different tactics again last night. The police reformed their tactics last night and we still had terrible outcomes.
[22:50:02] We ought to be talking about the root issues here, not distracting everybody in the country with this big lie which started with this 'hands up don't shoot' myth.
LEMON: So, Chris, let's talk about that because he does have a point. He said, you know, police, they did do some changes. And Ferguson has had some changes over the past year. Yet, it did result into violence last night. And police did make it clear today.
There is a difference between the protesters who have been out there all day and as they say, these are their words, the criminals who started this mess. So, what gives here?
CHRIS CHESTNUT, ATTORNEY: You know, I think this is a missed opportunity. I think that we also have to acknowledge that we need community policing here. Not paramilitary policing but community policing. Community policing would be going into the community and learning the people. It's why we go to school.
School is a socialization process. So, we've got to learn the community, understand the community, and then you don't have to shoot the community. So, I think it's a fabricated process. It's a give and take on both sides.
We also need discipline -- more discipline in homes but we can't have the government regulating how you parent your children, and then taking issue when the children grow up and are...
ROORDA: The government regulated by sending police in the neighborhood to clean up those mess.
CHESTNUT: Yes. But you have to know the people.
ROORDA: They do. We've been doing community policing since the Clinton administration.
CHESTNUT: I tell you what, why don't you allow some of those kids -- sir, why don't you allow some of those kids in your neighborhood to regulate you? It's about understanding, where you from. What are your -- what's indigenous to you. And we have police officers coming into the neighborhood where they don't understand, all they are trying to do is enforce.
LEMON: But, they don't -- Chris, you're not saying it -- hang on, hang on. Chris, you're not saying that they shouldn't keep the peace?
CHESTNUT: Absolutely they should keep the peace. But it is the mechanism of keeping the peace.
CHESTNUT: It's understanding the community. You got to go into the community speak to the people, understand them as human beings.
CHESTNUT: Understand the cultural nuances, understand who these people are, and then you will be less inclined to take violent or act by force.
LEMON: Harry. Go ahead, Harry.
HARRY HOUCK, RETIRED NEW YORK POLICE DETECTIVE: I think what we need is we need the community also to understand the police officers here. I mean, this big lie that's being perpetrated and that's behind the Black Lives Matter movement is the fact that, you know, we had an officer here that's totally exonerated in his shooting.
HOUCK: Although, but he has still been made some kinds of a demagogue, he's been made some kind of a bad guy and they consistently use this type of rhetoric and use this specific Ferguson incident as one of the problems with police departments. And it's not, and the facts clearly show that, sir. Clearly show that.
CHESTNUT: So, if you take away the gun is that murder? In Jonathan Ferrell's case, if you take away the gun is it murder?
HOUCK: I don't know anything about the Ferrell case. I can't comment on that.
CHESTNUT: If you take away the badge, sir, it's murder. And so, at some point, we've got to reevaluate how we police. Because what is ultimately happening is an erosion of trust in police officers.
LEMON: OK. Go ahead, Jeff.
ROORDA: Well, this is a shame, this breaks my heart, Don. And, I mean, you know, I was hopeful last night that we would actually see some peaceful demonstrations that went on without any disruption that we've seen August, and March, and November. It's just a shame.
LEMON: We got 20 seconds, Jeff. Go ahead.
CHESTNUST: It is peaceful. One person acts out and all of a sudden it's not peaceful.
ROORDA: Yes, police officers.
CHESTNUT: But still, dying in the hospital. I mean, I think we have to reevaluate policing because there is an erosion of trust in the American public beyond just black people. Every one.
HOUCK: I think the biggest problem is that black ones is beginning to unrest in these cities, that's the big problem.
LEMON: All right, guys.
HOUCK: We have got to go in and try to take care of this and you won't let us.
LEMON: Yes. We'll be right back.
CHESTNUT: Hold on, Robert Champion is a great example of that.
LEMON: That's it. We'll be right back. Sorry.
[22:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: This week's CNN Hero was searching for her lost dog when she found another creature that needed help, a baby sloth. She took it in, and today, she is a passion protector of these animals and is known as the sloth lady.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sloths are very cute because they are very slow animals. They like to hang out and they have always a smile on their face. Here in Suriname we have the most pristine rainforest of the whole world, but sloths are facing loss of habitat in the urban area.
Ten years ago, we started doing sloth rescues. When sloths are in trouble, all the telephone calls come to us.
My biggest rescue ever was this plot of land that was going to be cleared. We rescued in total 200 animals, mostly sloths. There were sloths all over in my living room in the cages. I was 'slothified.' I still have a lot of sloths.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He came in with his nails cut, that's why he has to stay with us.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a lot of work. But wherever I go in my house I may see a sloth. What does a sloth do all day? It sleeps. It grooms. It eats.
Your whole face is yellow.
And it sleeps a little bit more.
It is ridiculous the way he is lying. My life with sloths.
The best part of our rescue is when we release the animal.
You are going to the forest.
Sloths are not pets. Wild animals belong into wild. Find yourself a safe spot, huh.
My work is about the environment. We should value and it protect it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[23:00:03] LEMON: Kind of looked like Bob.
To nominate a hero, go to Cnnheroes.com.
I love you, pal. I'm just kidding.
That's it for us tonight. I'll see you right back here tomorrow night. I'm Don Lemon.