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Police Shooting Video Sparks Unrest In Chicago; Russian Official Claims Jet Downing Was A Planned Act; Prosecutor Says Paris Ringleader Targeted Financial District; Interview With Jeb Bush; Can Jeb Bush Break Out In GOP Race? Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired November 25, 2015 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN CO-HOST NEW DAY: Jeb Bush in just a few moments, back to your New Day.

[07:00:02] We will be speaking live with Republican candidate Jeb Bush in just a few moments. There he is now. We look forward to talking to him. We'll be with you in a few moments governor. But first we do have some breaking news.

Outrage in Chicago as dramatic dash cam video is released of a white police officer firing 16 shots, killing a black teenager. That officer now arrested and charged with first-degree murder.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN CO-HOST NEW DAY: Now, it's important to remember this happened last October. So, why charge us now? Why is the video only coming out now? Big questions.

CNN's Stephanie Elam, live in Chicago with the very latest. Stephanie?

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Chris. We have known about the fact that there is an officer who shot this 17-year- old 16 times. That was not a secret. But no one had seen the video. A judge ruled that the world should see it and that it had to come out by Wednesday.

Yesterday, that video was released and now, we can show it to you. And I want to warn, for anyone who hasn't seen this, this may be upsetting but here is the dash cam video of what transpired on October 20th 2014.

You know, as you can see there, you can see that this 17-year-old, Laquan McDonald, is shot, he falls to the ground and then it seems that he is shot several more times while he is on the ground.

What we have understood is that Jason Van Dyke, the officer in question here, he was charged with first degree murder yesterday. He is being held without bond. His lawyer says that he felt that he was in danger and that is why he shot so many times, but many people wanting to see this video, wanting to see what happened here now.

Across the city of Chicago, people were bracing for a protest. There were protests that ran into -- late into the night yesterday but nothing like we saw in Ferguson last year. And there's a two, a couple reasons that we really need to point out the difference here, the fact that Van Dyke has already been charged and also the fact that the city had settled with the family for $5 million back in April. Big differences there, but definitely still some heated protests overnight. Chris?

CUOMO: All right, Stephanie, thank you very much.

There are some big questions here, when you watch the video, you immediately go to, "What was the officer thinking?" Well, we have an exclusive interview with the lawyer for Officer Van Dyke later this hour. Let's hear him make the case, all right? Mich?

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN CO-HOST NEW DAY: All right, breaking news overseas, a top Russian official calling the shoot down of a fighter jet by Turkey, a planned act, the situation rapidly escalating with a war of words heating up between the two nations.

Let's turn to CNN's Becky Anderson is live in Istanbul with all the breaking details for us. Becky?

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: That's right, Michaela. The Russian Defense Ministry has just confirmed that the second pilot of the SU-24 jet shot down by the Turkish military is safe and back at Russian air base in Syria.

Now we got exclusive video obtained by CNN that shows the wreckage, though the circumstances, I have to say, are still very much in dispute. We have just had a televised address by the Turkish Prime Minister who said that two planes, two planes breached Turkish airspace on Tuesday, one left and the other remained despite repeated warnings, they say in an act of self defiance -- or self defense sorry, it was shot down.

That the jet was within Turkish air space is disputed by the Russians. President Putin has describes the incident as a stab in the back, and warned of serious consequences for relations between the two, going so far as to accuse Turkey of supporting terrorism and protecting the ISIS organization. Not surprising he says, his Prime Minister in Russia this morning, given, he says, and I quote Dmitry Medvedev here, "The direct financial interest of certain Turkish officials related to the import of oil produced at ISIS facilities."

Well, on his part, in the past hour, President Erdogan has said he has no intention of escalating the matter and in a call with him, Barack Obama expressed U.S. and NATO support for Turkey's right to defend its sovereignty while emphasizing the importance of deescalating the situation. What's clear in all of this is that already very messy picture with regards to this conflict in Syria has gotten even more complicated. Alisyn?

CAMEROTA: Absolutely, Becky. Thank you for all of that.

Well, as devastating as the Paris attacks were, they could have been worse. According to police, the suspected ringleader had plans to do much more. Abdelhamid Abaaoud and another man may have been hours away from carrying out an attack on Paris' financial district. CNN's Senior International Correspondent, Clarissa Ward is live from Paris for us this morning. What have you learned, Clarissa?

CLARISSA WARD, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Alisyn. While we are getting new details right now about what the architect of the Paris attack did in the moments and hours after coordinating those attacks.

[07:04:58] According to French authorities, using his cell phone signals, they were able to ascertain that he actually went back to the scenes of three of those attacks right after they were perpetrated. That means that he likely would have been on the scene outside the Bataclan Theater as riot police and French officials were arriving on the scene, trying to defuse the situation, that certainly a shocking revelation.

We also heard from French officials yesterday that Abaaoud was reportedly in "Constant contact" with one of the suicide bombers Bilal Hadfi, who blew himself up outside the stadium on the night of the attacks.

And we also learned that Abaaoud was planning yet another attack, that he was planning, alongside the man who was killed, the unidentified man who was killed in the raid where he was killed as well, in that apartment in Saint-Denis. The two of them were planning an attack on La Defense, a financial district here in Paris and police reportedly got there just in the nick of time. Chris?

CAMEROTA: Clarissa, I will take it. Thank you so much for all of that background.

We want to bring in now Republican Presidential Candidate and Former Florida Governor, Jeb Bush.

Governor, we have so much news to talk to you about this morning, great to see you on New Day.

JEB BUSH, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thank you, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, let's talk about our top story, I know you've been listening in this morning about the protests overnight in Chicago when, once again, we have seen a white police officer shoot a black teenager in what many believe was excessive force. What do you think is behind these incidents that we have seen over the past year?

BUSH: Well, there's a lot -- there's a rising tide of violence in big urban areas. Chicago has an extraordinary high murder rate. It's tough to be a police officer when they do, what appears to have happened here, they should be charged, as was the case in this case.

And the fact that there was protest but no violence in Chicago is attributed to the people of Chicago. We're living in difficult times. I mean, if you just watch your show this morning, as I did, there's no good news. I mean, it is troubling around the world and troubling inside of our country. And I think public leaders need to try to figure out ways to unite people around common purposes again rather than divide us up. CAMEROTA: It does sometimes feel as though there's no good news. I agree with you, particularly with the situation that's happening overseas and all the tension. As you know, yesterday, Turkey shot down a Russian warplane. Turkey says that Russia invaded their airspace. Russia says that they did not. Who do you believe?

BUSH: I believe Turkey but it will be verified by all sorts of ways through technology. Turkey is a NATO ally. They are an integral part, if we are to be successful in the fight against ISIS and to change regimes, to take out Assad, which should be our objective, it used to be our objective. If we are serious about that, Turkey needs to be an ally, we need to show support. I think President Obama was correct to say that every country has a right to self-defense.

Why were the sorties, Russian sorties in that area? They weren't there to attack the remnants of the Syrian free army or, excuse me, to fight is, ISIS, ISIS is not in that territory. Most of their sorties are against the very people that we are trying to arm and to support for a solution to this.

So, Russia's not our ally in this regard. We have to deal with them from a position of strength, not weakness.

CAMEROTA: But Russia could be our ally in fighting ISIS. I mean, they, too, said that they want to fight ISIS, so, how would you, as president, deescalate that situation?

BUSH: Look, Russia could be our ally but they would have to abandon their alliance with Iran and with Assad. But for Iran and Russia, Assad would not exist. That's key element of creating a secure Syria. And we're not going to be successful taking out ISIS without dealing with the Assad regime as well.

So, Russia could be, but we have to deal with them from a position of strength. Our weakness allowed for them to create a military base at warp speed inside of Syria. Our weakness has now allowed them to re- engage in the Middle East for the first time.

Our strength would be to say, here are the conditions in which we will work with you. What Russia wants to do is to create a destabilized NATO. They want to create a buffer similar to what existed in the Soviet Union, where their influence and power in Eastern Europe begins to become more important than what Western Europe thinks. And we should not allow that to happen that will create instability around the world.

CAMEROTA: But what if Russia didn't agree to our conditions? I mean, I understand the position of strength argument, but Russia doesn't always comply.

BUSH: That's right, but they would respect strength. I think one thing we have learned from Putin is, he senses weakness and exploits it and when he senses strength, he reacts to it in the right way.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about fighting ISIS. What would you do differently than what we are seeing now to defeat ISIS? BUSH: First of all, I would ask the military commanders for a strategy, options for a strategy to destroy ISIS, not to contain it, because its containment actually gives it energy to expand. We saw the tragedy in Tunisia yesterday and other attacks in Lebanon and other places that seemed to be ISIS or al-Qaeda inspired.

[07:10:15] We have to have a strategy and the military needs to have their hands -- no longer hands tied behind their back, which means that the sorties need to be effective.

Seventy-five percent of all the air strikes that we undertake, which are far fewer than what existed in Afghanistan, for example, don't even send -- don't even drop their ordinances, it's because we don't have the intelligence on the ground and we have lawyers on top of the air force. We have air superiority in this region. It could be devastating but we are creating conditions that make it hard for our war fighters to fight. We also need to build an alliance to demand, in essence, the Arab nations to support one unified army in Syria and we need to re-engage as it relates to Iraq with the military there and the Sunni tribal leaders, and we need to arm directly the Kurds, we need a strategy to effectively destroy ISIS. We could do it if we had the will to do it. This president hasn't shown there will.

CAMEROTA: You have given us a lot to work with there. So, let just try to dissect some of it. You said no intelligence on the ground? So, as you know, the president has sent 50 more advisers. So are you saying this in order to be effective against ISIS, that there should be more boots on the ground to call in those air strikes?

BUSH: Fifty special operators is 50 better than what existed before but it's not a strategy. A strategy would be how do we mobilize support for the remnants of the Syrian free army, and it might require combat troops to inspire an international effort.

I would let the military commanders give the commander-in-chief options rather than tell them what you want to hear. And so having -- not having gotten those options, I can't tell you if we are going to have boots on the ground but certainly a more expanded role for the special operators would be essential. And be more effective in strikes as it is relates to the air.

This last week, there was a convoy of stolen refined oil and diesel going to Turkey to be sold. And they sent out fliers to the -- dropped fliers before they started striking to the truck drivers to tell them to abandon, because they may not have been ISIS supporters.

My gosh, that's not how you fight a war. You need to destroy their abilities to garner money, that was the appropriate action, but tying the hands of the war fighters the way that this administration has done shows that this is a law enforcement exercise, not a fight -- not a military fight. And so, we need to unleash the military in unison with our partners in Europe and the Middle East to be effective in this regard.

CAMEROTA: I mean of course what they say they are doing is to try to avoid civilian casualties and that's why the policy... BUSH: Of course. Of course that's why they -- the United States always applies the international standards for war fighting but these are additional conditions on top of the military that goes way beyond what the norms for war are. And it shows this lack of intent to create a strategy to destroy ISIS. This is more of a policy of containment. And so -- and it's why this incremental effort is not going to work.

CAMEROTA: Are you saying you would listen to your military advisers but of course, do you have many foreign policy advisers on your team. Many of them served in your brother's administration or your father administration. What do they tell you about the right number of combat troops?

BUSH: What they -- what they tell me is that we need far more -- more serious approach. What we need is American leadership first, because if we don't -- if we don't lead, others won't follow. The specific numbers really relate to the conditions on the ground, but we do need a greater force in both in Iraq and in Syria. I think that is the general consensus of the people I talked to, both in and out of my brother's administration, it's really not relevant, it's the folks that have some experience recognize that this is not -- this is a tepid effort, if we are serious about it, then we need to engage in a more robust way.

And that's the only way, by the way, that you can get the Turks and the Saudis and the other Persian Gulf countries, the Egyptians, the Jordanians and the European countries to join our alliance and be effective.

CAMEROTA: General Petraeus disagrees that there should be more boots on the ground. I believe we have that down, perhaps the producers -- yes we do, so listen to this governor.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAVID PETRAEUS, FMR CIA DIRECTOR: If we are to require there had to clear and hold an area, it's not sustainable. Again, you need to have a hold force that has legitimacy in the eyes of the people. That has to be Sunni Arab forces in Iran...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It cannot be American forces.

PETRAEUS; It should not be, not at this stage.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CAMEROTA: All right, so General Petraeus, I mean, what do you think?

BUSH: I completely agree with what he is saying.

CAMEROTA: But he is saying no in more American forces.

BUSH: No, no, he didn't say that. What he said was that you -- this has to be led by a Sunni Arab effort both in Iraq and Syria where -- but without American leadership, that's not going to happen, we need to provide the kind of support, we need embed our special operators, for example, in the Iraqi military.

[07:15:07] CAMEROTA: Yeah, sure but I'll just want to be clear. The question...

BUSH: We need to provide support for the Sunni tribal leaders which General Petraeus was so effective doing in the surge, and he would support that. But at the end of the day this has to be their effort. For us to create a lasting strategy of security, we can't do this alone. And I agree with that.

CAMEROTA: But just to be clear governor, he said -- the question was, so it cannot be American forces, and General Petraeus said, "No, it should not be, not at this stage."

BUSH: Well, he also said that to secure the peace, it has to be led by Sunni Arab forces and I completely agree with. But we need a much more robust effort, as we had with the surge which was quite effective. Both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama now conceived that the surge was effective to wipe out al-Qaeda and the void was created when we abandon that effort. And that void now has created ISIS, a caliphate the size of Indiana.

CAMEROTA: And it also created a refugee crisis. Let's talk about these Syrian refugees. Do you believe Syrian refugees should be allowed into the U.S. and if so, how many?

BUSH: I think there should be a pause to get the full extent of what the vetting process is. This is a unique phenomenon that hadn't existed, other refugee populations where you have embedded inside of people desperately seeking, you know, be an operative in seeking security for their families. Embedded in that group of people who are out to destroy us.

And I think we have every right to make sure we have proper screening. I also believe that we should make sure that Christians who are being persecuted at record levels in the Middle East are protected.

And ultimately, the way to solve the refugee problem is to create safe havens inside of Syria that where people -- where the force that I was describing is there to protect them over the long haul. But the refugee problem is a symptom of a bigger problem over the lack of resolved of the United States to create a coalition to be able to deal with the tragedy that is taking place in Syria.

CAMEROTA: I want to ask about some of your comments lately about Donald Trump. You know, Donald Trump, has -- I'm sure you know, he talked about Muslim Americans and he talked about their reaction after 9/11. He said that he saw them celebrating and cheering. Do you believe that happened?

BUSH: No, I don't. I don't believe it happened. I know many Muslims that were just as angry and saddened by the attack on our country. I don't believe it. Look, Donald Trump says these things to prey on people's fears, their anger, their frustration with Washington and he's quite effective about it. But he didn't know what he is talking about. And he is not a serious leader. We are living in difficult times. We need serious leadership to be able to solve the problems that we have domestically and lead America around the world so that we can create peace and security for ourselves.

CAMEROTA: I want to talk about your latest poll numbers, because they are not encouraging. Here's the latest Washington post, ABC news poll, it shows Donald Trump at 32 percent and you down at 6 percent, having slipped, actually, slightly from last month at 7 percent.

So, governor, what's your plan? Why do you think...

BUSH: So, Alisyn, that same poll by the way, there is always a silver lining these polls. That poll also showed I beat Hillary Clinton by a higher margin than any Republican Candidate. And that's my case. I can beat Hillary Clinton. I could become president. I have the proven leadership skills to do it and as we get closer to the primaries and the beginning of the primary, February 1st Iowa Caucuses. People are going to look at who has the skills, the talent, the heart, the spine to be able to be a president. Not who is going to fulfill my angst and anger in the here and now.

And as we get closer, I feel really confident. We have a great team out in the fields, I'm connecting with voters on this Thanksgiving eve. I am confident I'm going to win the Republican nomination.

CAMEROTA: So, I mean, people do think that you will a pundit such as that they do believe that you maybe the last man standing after these dalliances go away. So you think you're predicting February 1st is sort of your moment?

BUSH: No, I'm just saying that's when it starts, we're not even halftime yet. We have a long way to go. In all the primaries past, there's always been a moment where candidates that ultimately or the winner begin to surge. And I'm confident through the hard work of our team and through my hard work that I'm going to be there at the starting line to be a viable candidate and I believe I'm going to win the Republican nomination.

CAMEROTA: Governor, I have 20 seconds left, how will you be spending Thanksgiving?

BUSH: I'm going to be spending it with my immediate family, with my in-laws, with my four unbelievably near-perfect grandchildren and with my adorable wife.

CAMEROTA: That's great. Have a wonderful holiday. Thanks so much for being on New Day, Governor.

BUSH: Thanks Alisyn, Happy Thanksgiving to you.

CAMEROTA: Thank you. Thanks so much.

[07:19:59] COUMO: All right, lot of big issues just tackled there with Republican candidate Jeb Bush. We're going to break down the interview, what he said and what it means, right ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) COUMO: All right. Republican presidential candidate Jeb Bush laying it all out there, didn't duck any questions. So, let's figure out what he said, what it means.

Let's bring in the CNN Chief National Correspondent John King.

John, happy almost Thanksgiving to you, what was your take?

JOHN KING JOHN, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What a case study. That interview there is a case study. They are going to be looking at this not only in political science classes but in marketing classes and in psychology classes of the approach of Jeb Bush versus the approach of Donald Trump.

Governor Bush there now, you know people in the administration, other Republicans might nitpick this or nitpick that. But what did you have there, especially when you were talking about Syria? A calm, measured approach, talking about building a coalition, a lot of nuance in what he would do differently than President Obama, starting he says, with the case for more stronger, aggressive American leadership, beyond any specifics, twist some arms, crack some heads, build a stronger coalition. Or you could take that approach, he says that's what's the country should want right now. A seasoned, calmed, measured president, contrast that approach with the guy who stands up in front of his audience and says, "We're going to put surveillance on the mosques if Syrian refugees coming to this country". If President Obama lets them in, I will throw them out and I'm going to bomb the belief out ISIS.

That is the choice Republican voters face and, Chris and Alisyn that choice is almost upon us. Iowa votes very quickly now, where inside ten weeks, we have the holidays. When we come out of Christmas, this election that we have been talking about for so long is going to start in a blur and Governor Bush, as Alisyn rightly noted, "He's struggling at the moment, he's hoping for that opening". The question is does he get it?

COUMO: Question to you, as the interviewer.

CAMEROTA: Go.

COUMO: Ah, yes, what John King says, I will agree with it. But, did you get the sense that when you were asking him questions that he identifies and responds to the angst that Donald Trump is tapping into? He seemed to have a very erudite explanation for it, but, you know, because you know that's key in retail politics. You have to make them know that you know how they feel. Did you get that?

CAMEROTA: Yeah, well look my take on him has always been that he's baffled by it. This is not how politics works in his experience and his family's experience. You know, his father was one of the considered now, you know, one of the statesmen of how he handled foreign affairs. So, I think he is baffled by it. So I don't know that he taps into it and also what he said, that he thinks his time will come, that all of this will pass and that his time will come. [07:25:08] I mean, John, what did you think about the timing, where he said like, "I'm going to be the February 1st, look around then and that's when you'll see my numbers, you know, going out.

KING: He is making a case, Alisyn, that when voters actually -- when Republican voters get closer to actually, whether its going into a caucus or stepping behind the curtain in New Hampshire, South Carolina, Nevada, and beyond that they are going to put aside their reaction to Trump, or reaction to Carson, this outsider of movement and their going to think, "OK, this is serious."

Now, I'm picking somebody who has to stand on a debate stage, most likely against Hillary Clinton. He is hoping that electability becomes an issue.

But look, the history is more often than not, primaries are about ideology. Although Trump is not an ideological candidate, this is what drives Republican strategists in the establishment nuts because Donald Trump is not, he is not Ted Cruz, if Jeb Bush ends in a race against Ted Cruz, then you have a contrast of ideology.

Trump is not really ideologically is a passion candidate right now. Look I called this the NASCAR theory Bush thinks you're OK being four, five cars back, because somebody eventually is going to take Trump into the wall, and when that car hits the wall, who knows what's going to happen to the first two or three guys, that's going to be a spinout and a mess and it will an opportunity.

That's the bet they're making, a lot of them or making, the question is it will happen?

CUOMO: Let's take his metaphor, the NASCAR one, OK, that means that Jeb Bush has to assume that at some points, he's going to catch a drift, he's going to be so close to this other cars, and when Trump is taken out, he can slingshot past. And that take us to what a very famous, famous guy that John knows well, David Garth, big election, big shot consultant.

He used to say ideology loses to one thing every time, psychology. Ideology loses to psychology. That's why politicians say things like, "I feel your pain," Bill Clinton. You know, "I hear you," but Ronald Reagan. You need to have that in your lexicon. I don't hear that from Jeb Bush. You can't just dismiss your anger baffles me, I don't understand it, but when you get over it, please, come to me. That's not going to work yeah, it doesn't work any human relationship.

And that's my question, John, is that this psychology is what Donald Trump has. How does Jeb Bush get that?

KING: Candidates either get it or they don't, Chris, so you grew up with this whether, you know, your dad was one of the premiere...

CUOMO: Kind of logically crazy psychology in my family.

KING: But the one of the premier retail politicians in the country, somebody who knew how to go into a room and you knew it, when Mario Cuomo was in a room, you felt it, when Bill Clinton was in a room, you felt it, when George W. Bush was in a room you felt it. George W.Bush was great retail politician, whatever you think about him and Jeb lacks that, he is more the studious more like President Obama.

They'll -- we now get the e-mails from the Bush campaign for that one. But is more of a detached, thoughtful politician who sees on ones, who sees great. Trump talks in black and white, you make a very key point. And Trump, right now, whatever you think about his arguments on the Syrian crisis, Trump has what he wants, as long as there are 14 candidates in the race, he only needs 25, 26, 27 percent. And, what is he in right now? He is in a national debate with Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, the two Democrats Republicans like the least.

So, Trump has what he wants right now heading into the voting season, a direct debate, put the policy part aside, the President of the United States is responding to Trump, what he said yesterday, we must uphold our ideals. That Hillary Clinton is criticizing Trump every day. If you are a Republican voter and don't like President Obama and you don't like Hillary Clinton, you love that Donald Trump is taking it to them.

Jeb Bush has to find a way to push Trump aside, make that connection you're talking about and then explain his ideas, if he doesn't make that connection, that's the big question, does the opening come without some sort of a page turning in Jeb Bush's personal connection Republican voters?

CAMEROTA: Got it John, thank you, have a great Thanksgiving.

KING: Thank you, guys.

CUOMO: It's one of your gifts as a broadcaster, you connect with how people feel. It carries the politics,

CAMEROTA: Go on.

CUOMO: You should run, I would vote for you.

CAMEROTA: Thank you.

CUOMO: I would because I know you personally.

What do you think? Tweet us use the #NewDayCNN or post you comment on facebook.com/NewDay.

PEREIRA: As part of your Thanksgiving sort of you just sort of...

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: You punched me right in the face is what you'll do.

PEREIRA: No I will not.

All right, more news for you. You are watching the situation in Chicago, anger there sparked by dash cam video showing a police officer fatally shooting a black teenager, shooting 16 times. That officer is now charged with first-degree murder. We're going to speak to his attorney exclusively next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)