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Working To Identify Victims; Premature To Call Terrorism; 14 Killed And 21 Wounded In Shooting; Suspects Fired 65 To 75 Rounds From Rifles; Following New Information in California Shooting; One Suspect May Have Been Radicalized. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired December 3, 2015 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


DAVID BOWDICH, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, FBI LOS ANGELES OFFICE (live): -- from Washington to do some re-enactment, reconstruction of the crime scene. We have continued collecting evidence and are continuing to collect evidence at the multiple scenes. We are going to fly some evidence back to our laboratory in Washington, D.C. today on a plane. That is because we want expeditious analysis of that evidence.

As far as the digital media that was asked about earlier, the digital media is incredibly important because we are trying to determine the motive. We do not yet know the motive. We cannot rule anything out, at this point. And we're hoping that some of that digital media exploitation will help us and assist us in obtaining some of that.

Again, it would be irresponsible of me and it would be way too early for us to speculate on motive of why this occurred. Any questions for the FBI?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What have -- have you found any information that says that who did this in the name of religion or that there were -- or with all this ammunition, it's part of a larger plot or maybe he was planning a different attack and got ticked off and decided, OK, I'm just going to turn on these guys?

BOWDICH: So, again, if you look at the amount of obvious preplanning that went in, the amount of armaments that he had, the weapons and the ammunition, there was obviously a mission here. We know that. We do not know why. We don't know if this was a -- this was the intended target or if there was something that triggered him to do this immediately. We just don't know. And, again, that's going to take time for us to get to that answer.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Was he in touch with subjects -- international subjects that the FBI or that authorities were already interested in overseas either by phone or social media as CNN has reported?

BOWDICH: International subjects, we are still working through that. We know there was some international travel. They came into the U.S., both he and his -- she was not his wife at the time but she is now. They both came into the U.S. in July of 2014. They have since had a baby together. He is a U.S. person. She is still here on a K-1 visa.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you believe that the international travel is connected in any way (INAUDIBLE)?

BOWDICH: We do not know. It's certainly something we're going to look into very, very carefully.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) communications that he had with investigative subjects, terrorism subjects that the FBI had under investigation?

BOWDICH: I did not hear you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What can you tell us about any communications he had with terrorism subjects that the FBI had been investigating?

BOWDICH: We're still working through that. And, again, that goes towards the flow and the pace of the information. I want to make sure we're absolutely correct before we put that out.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) that the FBI was investigating (INAUDIBLE)?

BOWDICH: We're still working through that.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) and abroad. What countries was he traveling to and how long had he been --

BOWDICH: Pardon me?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How long had he been out of the country and what countries has he visited?

BOWDICH: It appears he came back into the U.S. in July of 2014, as I said earlier. I do not know all the countries he visited. We know he did go to Pakistan, at one point. We know she is here on a K-1 visa under a Pakistani passport.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What can you tell us about a trip to Saudi Arabia?

BOWDICH: Don't have all the facts yet.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How much do you know about her that would explain why she got involved in this caper?

BOWDICH: We don't know enough. We do not know enough. I'm going to take two more questions.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is there any evidence that these IEDs were --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) classify this as terrorism. How close are you to making that (INAUDIBLE)?

BOWDICH: Again, it would be irresponsible and premature of me to call this terrorism. The FBI defines terrorism in a -- very specifically. And we are still -- that is the big question for us is what is the motivation for this? First and foremost, the integrity of this investigation, again, is paramount. Secondly, it's ultimately determined the motive and the inspiration for this attack.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) the IEDs that were found, what are you -- how would you describe (INAUDIBLE) was this professional or was this amateurish? Was it high-grade military explosives used there or (INAUDIBLE)?

BOWDICH: Well, it -- I'm not an expert either, as the chief mentioned earlier. I don't want to go too deep. I will say there is some level of sophistication, certainly, when you're tying them together. And you have, seemingly, a remote-controlled car that is attached to the device. I'm going to take one more question and I'm going to turn it back to the chief.

(CROSSTALK)

BOWDICH: Yes, ma'am.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) based off any kind of designs from "Inspire" magazine?

BOWDICH: I didn't hear you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Any evidence that shows linkage between the designs of the IEDs and "Inspire Magazine"?

BOWDICH: We knew that question would come up and we're looking into it as we speak.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chief, was he ever on anybody's radar at all? Did you ever have any prior knowledge of him, the FBI or anybody, anywhere?

JARROD BURGUAN, CHIEF, SAN BERNARDINO POLICE DEPARTMENT: He was not on the radar screen of our agency prior to yesterday. Let me -- let me go over a couple details. Our plan today is, as I said early on, we're going to do this press conference now. Throughout the course of the day, we're going to do what we can to release the names the victims, focused in on those folks. We'll probably try to get you some photos. And, as I said, we're going to try to move the media a little bit closer.

[13:05:02] We will come back with another press conference at the end of the business day, 4:00 or 5:00. Hopefully, we'll have significantly more information for you by then. And then, we'll kind of -- we'll kind of play it by ear.

So, with that, I'll take a couple more questions and then I think we're going to cut it off.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) determined that he was a suspect and how did you determine that he was a suspect? BURGUAN: So, as I said yesterday, when we -- when we did our early

press conferences, there was -- we got a couple of tips and we were following up on a couple of different leads. This was one of the tips that we followed up on very early on. Where that came from was another person that was in the building that knew him that identified him by name who expressed some concern over his behavior prior to the event and the way that he left.

Following up on that information, we've discovered that he had rented a vehicle that was similar to the suspect description that we had received. And we also followed up on addresses. We had more than just that address in Redlands. But the address in Redlands is one that we followed up on and the rest is -- obviously, we know how that played out.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chief, were there any (INAUDIBLE)?

BURGUAN: There were -- there were things that, as our officers approached, gave them concern. I don't know if the word booby trap is appropriate but there was concern that they did not want to go in immediately. They wanted to approach it very, very carefully and very tactically. And for that reason, we actually used the FBI tactical team for that, because we were stretched so thin here. So, the FBI came with their bomb folks. I think the sheriff's department may have helped with that component as well. And we used their team to do it. The initial officers that were there and secured the house were not the ones that made entry. We did wait until tactically they did it appropriately.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have (INAUDIBLE) have you been able to find any notes or any type information (INAUDIBLE)?

BURGUAN: There's nothing definitive we have right now that points directly to a motive. I don't -- I'm not -- I have not been made aware of any notes.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have all the bodies been removed, identified, the families notified?

BURGUAN: We are still working on that. It's been a slow process. So, when this happened, the sprinklers -- the fire sprinklers in the room had actually gone off. We believe what happened is maybe one of the rounds that were fired hit the fire sprinklers, set them off, flooded the room. It took a lot of time to get that process turned off. And then, we discovered the explosive devices in the room. It took a lot of time to do that.

We did not get to the portion where we were dealing with the victims and the bodies and trying to make the positive identification through fingerprints until the middle of the night. We've been working throughout the night on that and we have been making notifications since then. What the sheriff plans to do is that slowly throughout the day, we will release the names, hopefully of all 14 people today, as we are able to make notifications.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is anyone still in there?

BURGUAN: I'm not sure, to be honest with you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) to the -- to the victims right away (INAUDIBLE.)

BURGUAN: As of -- as of several hours ago, there were a few bodies left. We may have been able to remove those victims by now.

(CROSSTALK)

BURGUAN: I'm sorry, Brian (ph), go ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were you able to -- you talked about the delay in getting to the bodies because of the sprinklers, et cetera, but were you able to go in right away and, you know, --

BURGUAN: Absolutely. So, the initial response, the officers went through the water and all that, identifying bodies, searching for suspects. All that was done. We had confirmed that those folks had lost their life, that they were dead. And then, we discovered the IEDs which caused the safety personnel to back out, deal with those in an effective way.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Chief, (INAUDIBLE) during the holiday party, did the suspect have any conversation with the holiday goers? And --

BURGUAN: Not that I've been told.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- did he say anything during the shooting?

BURGUAN: Not that I've been told.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chief, have you been able to confirm or have you been able to find out through the local means of the FBI, the list of all the local people here in the San Bernardino area that these people may have been in touch with over a period of a week, two weeks, prior to this incident or are you still reaching out to try to (INAUDIBLE)?

BURGUAN: That is still part of that broader, more complex investigation to see if there are other co-conspirators or people that may have been aware of something. I'm just not prepared to give any details on any of that just yet.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) on the detainee -- an update on the detainee?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The third person --

BURGUAN: So, the -- so, at the officer involved shooting, we did indicate that there was a person detained out of that. That person was seen running away from the scene. What we have learned since then is that several of -- there were several police cars and undercover cars that pulled up that were engaged in that officer-involved shooting with the -- with the suspects.

We found out, later on, that there were people that were in cars that abandoned their cars and ran the other direction when the gunfire started. I don't know if that person was one of those. We did, ultimately, determine that he was not involved in the incident. He is not a suspect. He's not a person of interest. He did happen to have a misdemeanor warrant. He was booked on that warrant.

(CROSSTALK)

BURGUAN: I'm sorry?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What did you find the IED, in the conference room?

BURGUAN: It was -- it was in the middle of the room on a table in a bag.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were you able to ascertain whether or not it was the suspect or the police who fired first in the shootout? And is it clear to you that these suspects had become intent of (INAUDIBLE)?

[13:10:03] BURGUAN: I don't know if I can speak to their intent on that. It's my understanding they opened fire first. Rounds came out of the back of the car from the female that was in the back, firing through the back of the SUV at the -- at the police vehicles. And then, the male suspect, who was the driver, got out and he fired at officers from the street as well. I don't -- I don't know who fired the first round.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Chief, what do we know about this (INAUDIBLE)?

BURGUAN: I'm going to let the FBI -- that's a -- that's a part of the investigation that they are working on and so they're doing up the history on that and I just don't have enough info about her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) stop on its own accord or did it -- was it disabled?

BURGUAN: I believe they -- it stopped on its own accord to engage the officers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, what does this mean going forward? I know you can't talk about county buildings but city buildings? I know this is, you know, probably a flip but what about security at city buildings going forward?

BURGUAN: So, we stepped up security all across the city and all across the county yesterday at all of our city and county facilities. Schools went into lockdown today. It's my understanding that as of today, based upon the information, that we have no credible threats, that a lot of those facilities are returning back to business as usual. So, yesterday, everybody went into a lockdown.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE.) We're not going to see people with rifles in front of the city hall ongoing?

BURGUAN: No, I don't -- I don't anticipate you will. We've also --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE), are they going to be back --

BURGUAN: What's that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- operating as usual? The Department of Environmental Health (INAUDIBLE.)

BURGUAN: I don't know. We'll try to get those answers later on. Actually, I'll let the sheriff address that, from the county.

JOHN MCMAHON, SHERIFF, SAN BERNARDINO COUNTY SERIFF'S DEPARTMENT: Last night, the county board of supervisors held a special meeting and decided to make the decision to shut down the nonessential county departments for today and tomorrow. Not only to make sure that there weren't any threats that were still potentially developing yesterday, but as -- out of respect for the family members and fellow employees that were either victims or friends of the victims, and that's the decision the board of supervisors has made. So, the nonessential county operations have been shut down for today and tomorrow.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chief, just to clarify, there's no such suspects (INAUDIBLE) in custody (INAUDIBLE)?

BURGUAN: Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Chief, are the -- the affected families, are they cooperating?

BURGUAN: It's my understanding we've contacted a number of them. They have been cooperative, up to this point. I think there may be one or two that we're still looking for.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were these suspects wearing cameras? Were they wearing go pros?

BURGUAN: They were not -- they were not wearing -- I've heard that rumor about the go pros. I've asked our staff about it. Nobody's located go pros. Nobody's located any evidence that they were wearing cameras of any sort.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you know how many people were at the party?

BURGUAN: I don't. We are going to try to get that by later this afternoon though.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have the family members been formally interviewed about what they knew about the (INAUDIBLE)?

BURGUAN: Several of the family members have already been contacted, have been interviewed and are cooperating. We're still looking for a couple of others.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) where they worked?

BURGUAN: I'm sorry? UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE), is there anything more known

[INAUDIBLE]?

BURGUAN: I don't know anything about that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The coroner's office is now having to handle 14 bodies at once. What impact is this having on the coroner's operation?

MCMAHON: As you know, I'm responsible for the coroner's office as well. And our staff is on 12-hour shifts and we've called folks in from their days off to assist with processing the scene and helping to identify the victims of this tragic event. We're in the process of making those identifications. The majority of them have been. And a number of the notifications have been made and we'll continue to update you as we get the information and we can provide the names once the no notifications of the next of kin have been made.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Will that be on the Web site?

MCMAHON: We'll probably release it through a press release through our public affairs division as we get that information.

BURGUAN: Two more questions and then we're going to wrap it up.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did the wife have relatives in the United States?

BURGUAN: Not that I've been told.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What country is she from?

BURGUAN: Pakistan.

Thank you very much, folks. We'll be in touch, enough today.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, sir.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: All right. So, there you have the San Bernardino, California police chief, Jerad Burguan, briefing all of us the latest developments. Very disturbing developments in this case that has developed over the past 24 hours here in the United States. A stunning new clue following that deadly mass shooting at a holiday party in San Bernardino.

I'm Wolf Blitzer reporting from Washington. Once again, we want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world.

Law enforcement sources are telling CNN it appears one of the shooters was, in fact, radicalized and that may have contributed to the motive. Regardless of the why, 14 people are dead, 21 others are wounded. The carnage carried out by a married couple dressed in tactical gear and carrying semiautomatic weapons. Police revealing the male gunman had left the party, apparently angry, before he came back with his wife and started firing. The couple also stashing explosives rigged to a remote control toy car.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[13:15:04] BURGUAN: The suspects, when they entered, fired somewhere between 65 and 75 rounds from their rifles at the scene.

We did locate the one pipe bomb that was actually three pipe bombs combined into one. It had a remote control car-type remote control device that appears to have not have worked in this case. There were also four high capacity .223 rifle magazines that were dropped by the suspects and left in there as evidence that have been recovered.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: What followed was a very dramatic chase. A gun battle with the police that ended with both of the suspects dead. A neighbor capturing that showdown on his cell phone. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Holy (EXPLETIVE DELETED), guys. (EXPLETIVE DELETED) shots right out. Holy (EXPLETIVE DELETED). Oh, my gosh.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Joining us now, our justice reporter, Evan Perez, and our chief national security correspondent Jim Sciutto.

Evan, it appears now, based on all the information, the reporting you guys are doing, all of our sources suggesting that the shooter in this particular case, the husband, the man, was, in fact, radicalized, and had some sort of international connections. What are you hearing?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE REPORTER: Well, these are the things that the FBI is definitely following up on at this point, Wolf. They want to make sure they understand what those connections were. There's no -- nothing yet that has shown up that indicates any kind of order from an international terrorist group or any kind of nexus really with international terrorism. But the fact that they do believe that there's indications that he was radicalized.

And some of that really started turning last night when they found this I -- this IED bag inside the scene of the first shooting, the place where the -- the conference center where the first shooting occurred. And just the set-up of that. And then once they went to the house, the home, and they found what was a rudimentary bomb lab essentially where they found these additional 12 what appeared to be the makings of pipe bombs and ingredients to make more, those are -- those are the things that really tipped the scale here for law enforcement to indicate that they thought they were dealing with somebody who was radicalized, who had at least part of the intention here was terrorist motives. Now, that doesn't perhaps explain everything because there is the explanation of -- there's no explanation of perhaps the fight that he got into or the disagreement that he stormed out of before the shooting began. So, again, that's part of what's-what's puzzling to law enforcement here.

BLITZER: And we're learning more about their travel, their arrangements. This couple, Syed Rizwan Farouk, and the wife, Tashfeen Malik, 27-years-old she, 28-years-old he, that they had traveled to Saudi Arabia. Now the FBI agent on the scene over there, David Bodus (ph), just telling us they had also gone to Pakistan.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: This is what they do now. They look at foreign travel and foreign communication. So now we know they've been to both Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. Neither of those countries -- travel to neither of those countries by itself establishes a terrorism connection but it's something they look into because they know the history of both of those countries, but they haven't established that yet. It's not conclusive but they're exploring it. Same with the international contacts. You know, to have those contacts overseas by itself, loads of us have contacts overseas, is not incriminating. That said --

PEREZ: An immigrant family.

SCIUTTO: Immigrant family. Family from Pakistan originally.

PEREZ: Right.

SCIUTTO: He married, he went to the Hajj in Saudi Arabia.

PEREZ: Right.

SCIUTTO: Those trips could have had innocent explanations. That said, there were also explanations. And as you say, some of those foreign contacts were with known -- not necessarily senior terrorist subjects, but known terrorist subjects. Things to further establish.

But it's interesting, as you look at this, I mean the patterns here, you know, intelligence will always look at patterns both before and after to try to prevent attacks and explain attacks after they happen. Some of the patterns here fit, at least credibly, previous attacks that we've seen where you have radicalization either by a combination of foreign travel with social media or long distance contacts or one or the other. So that's a pattern that we've seen in the past.

What is interesting about this attack is that it breaks a pattern in a couple of ways. One, to have a man and a woman involved in the shooting and, even beyond that, a husband and wife who carried it out, some of this is very new. But the other pattern that it does fit, as we saw in Paris, we saw two weeks ago, multiple shooters attacking a soft target. This fits that pattern as well. Not conclusive, but it fits a pattern that we've seen past in international terrorism.

BLITZER: And -- but the FBI agent, the FBI assistant director on the scene, what he just told us, Evan, is that in July of 2014, he brought her to the United States. She's originally apparently from Pakistan. They came to the United States as an engaged couple. They got married in the United States and much more recently they had a little child.

PEREZ: Right. And she -- she traveled on what is known as a fiance visa, essentially she was coming here to marry him. And that they since had a family. She's become a natural -- not a naturalized citizen. She's become a legal, permanent resident. And I guess that -- the purpose here was that they were going to settle down. And then something clearly went wrong. It's not clear what, you know, what the explanation is for what turned yesterday, Wolf, but it is -- it is part of the puzzle that they're trying to put together here.

[13:20:14] BLITZER: The weapons in this particular case, these long guns as they're called, they were purchased apparently legally, right?

SCIUTTO: That's right, both the handguns, our information, and the long guns were purchased legally. The handguns by Farouk himself, the long guns by a third party, which they haven't established a connection to. California does have laws against certain assaults weapons, including the AR-15 -- the AR-15-type weapon that was involved in this.

BLITZER: Right. That was the long gun.

SCIUTTO: It is. But the police did not say they did not established whether it was indeed legally purchased. That's something --

PEREZ: Well, yes. One of the things that -- what I was told last night was that they -- they know they have traced the short -- the handguns to Farouk. The long guns were being traced to someone who was a former roommate, Wolf. And that person now is going to be talked to by the ATF. They have no indication that that person had anything to do with this shooting. But it is an interview that's going to be taking place very, very soon.

SCIUTTO: And here's the other thing beyond -- beyond the weapons themselves, the rounds. By my count, more than 6,000 rounds of ammunition. They fired about 75 at the party, another 76 at the officers during the standoff. But they --

PEREZ: And a clean -- with a clean background, nobody will question any of this.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

PEREZ: You can buy as many bullets as you want and nobody will question it.

SCIUTTO: Well, I think as well, it also sticks out, four high-capacity magazines. That's a very sensitive subject because that's one thing that gun control advocates have talked about zeroing in on, high- capacity magazines as something that would --

BLITZER: And what intelligence sources, law enforcement sources have said to me is that, as much as you worry about the guns, in this particular case, the improvised explosive devices --

PEREZ: Right.

BLITZER: If you will, the pipe bombs, whatever they were -- they had a -- they had an arsenal at that house over --

PEREZ: Where -- right, where did the black powder come from? I mean these are questions that now they're trying to nail down of where the ingredients for these -- these bombs were not very sophisticated, but he did have an idea of what exactly he was doing. (INAUDIBLE).

SCIUTTO: And they are right -- they are literally right out of ISIS and other group's recipe books, right?

PEREZ: Right.

SCIUTTO: Because they put this out in their magazine, such as "Inspire." They had articles saying bombs that you can cook in your mom's kitchen, right --

PEREZ: Right.

SCIUTTO: Using widely available materials. And we saw that --

PEREZ: To inspire do-it-yourselfers essentially.

SCIUTTO: Well, exactly. And they used a remote control car, it looks like, as a detonator. We saw in Paris, they bought their detonators at a fireworks store.

PEREZ: Right.

SCIUTTO: So these are widely available things you could bring together to make very deadly.

BLITZER: You remember that article in "Inspire," "how to build a bomb in the kitchen of your mom" --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BLITZER: By Anwar al Awlaki, as I seem to recall.

All right, guys, thanks very much.

Much more coming up. We're following the breaking news out of San Bernardino, the shootings. Was it an act of terror? Was it a case of workplace violence? Was it a combination of both? Our expert panel is standing by to weigh in.

Also, we're -- we've also learned so far that -- increasingly more about the 14 people who were killed at that holiday Christmas party that was going on. The 21 people who were injured. We'll share with you what we know. Much more on the breaking news when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:26:59] BLITZER: We're continuing to follow the breaking news. Police are still processing the scene inside that inland regional center in San Bernardino, California. I want to go to the scene where Victor Blackwell is joining us.

You're nearby in Redlands, not far from where this manhunt for the two suspects came to that dramatic, deadly end yesterday. Victor, police say it was the fear of explosives that actually held up investigators trying to process both the scene of the original massacre at the center there and the final shootout in Redlands, where you are. Give us the latest on what's happening with all of that.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we have seen certainly the FBI here all morning. There have been computer forensics, laboratory workers here collecting data, collecting some evidence to try to get to the answer to the question, why. An answer still not answered after -- a question, rather, still not answered after that news conference today.

There have been some changes in the numbers. And that's understandable in the melee, the fog immediately after that incident yesterday. We were told that there were 17 people who were injured in that shooting, in addition to the 14 who were killed. That number has now been increased according to the San Bernardino Police Department to 21.

But I think what surprises the people here in this neighborhood, quite possibly the man I spoke with who has lived here for more than 30 years, that there were 12 pipe bombs inside that home, 12 pipe bombs and materials to make more, thousands of rounds, in addition to the 1,400 rounds, .223 ammunition found inside the SUV that these two shooters were in. Also, the 200 nine millimeter bullets.

We're not getting a lot of information about those IEDs that was found inside the home, but as we've heard from the FBI, they are determining if there are similarities between what was found inside this home and any models that were published in -- in "Inspire" magazine, which, of course, we know is published by AQAP, al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula. So that will be the continuing narrative of this investigation. If this is any direct connection to any terrorist group and if travel recently by Syed Farook is connected to this attack that happened yesterday.

Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Victor, stand by. We're going to get back to you.

We're following the breaking news out of San Bernardino, California. At least one of the shooters involved in the rampage was apparently radicalized. That certainly could have contributed to the motive, to this mass murder.

Joining us now to discuss what's going on, Lorenzo Bodino (ph). He's director of the George Washington University program on extremism. Also joining us, our law enforcement analyst, the former FBI assistant director Tom Fuentes, our terrorism analyst Paul Cruickshank, and retired ATF explosives enforcement officer Anthony May, who's joining us from New York as well.

Paul, it looks like the radicalization, the evidence is increasingly growing and the individual in this particular case, Syed Rizwan Farook, may have actually been in contact with international terror suspects. What do we know about that?

[13:30:05] PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, they're going to be looking at that. They're going to be look at his travel to Saudi Arabia, to Pakistan, whether he had any connections to groups like ISIS, groups like al Qaeda.