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Donald Trump Attacked by Opponents Due to Chicago Rally Protests; Ted Cruz Spoke in Kansas City; Trump Facing Tough Challenge From Ohio Governor John Kasich; U.S. Economy is Turning Out Voters In Droves. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired March 12, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:00:13] POPPY HARLOW, CNN HOST: Top of the hour. 3:00 p.m. eastern. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York. So glad you are with us.

Republican front-runner Donald Trump just wrapped up a rally with thousands of Cleveland supporters just three days before the crucial winner take all Ohio primary. He slammed rival John Kasich, Ohio's governor for supporting free trade deals. And earlier Trump blasted what he call as planned attack in Chicago last night. You certainly heard about that. Trump claims his supporters were taunted and harassed. He blames backers of Democrat Bernie Sanders calling Sanders quote "our communist friend." The Chicago event was cancelled after chaos erupted prior to a planned Trump appearance. Also, Trump blamed Sanders supporter for interrupting today's event in Cleveland. Listen --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Look, it's a Bernie person. It's a Bernie -- hello, Bernie! Hey, Bernie, get your people in line, Bernie. Get your people in line. Can you imagine Bernie saying that Trump should get his people under control? And they put in these people?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: All right. Well, Sanders said, don't blame his supporters for the violence at these rallies. I want to read you part of the statement were you just got in from senator Bernie Sanders. Let me read you the first bit. It says as is the case with virtually every day Donald Trump is showing the American people that he had a pathological liar. Obviously while I appreciate that we had supporters at the Trump rally in Chicago, our campaign did not organize the protest. Much more of that statement but there is the headline.

Republican rivals are pointing fingers at Trump saying the billionaire businessman helped create a tense atmosphere that is now seeping into the race for the White House.

Let's talk about it. We have full coverage today. Our Sara Murray is inside the Trump event in Cleveland. Martin Savidge is outside the event. Jeff Zeleny is live for us in Chicago.

Sara, first of all, let's talk about what we saw inside the event. What played out?

SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICS REPORTER: Well, Poppy, there are some of these events you go to these Trump events, there are seen escalating violence, that feel like a tinder box, almost. This was not one of those. We saw a sporadic protest, for most part they were peaceful. There was one woman with a Bernie sign but she was peaceful. There was one small event that erupted into people throwing punches, both a Trump supporter and protestors on both sides. But everything was wrapped up pretty quickly and the people were escorted out. These were not out of a major protests that we have seen at so other events. For the most part it was Trump up on that stage hammering John Kasich and trying to win this Ohio primary, Poppy.

HARLOW: And you know what's interesting, Sara, just your thoughts on what Bernie Sanders just did coming out with this statement, and saying, look, this wasn't us whatsoever. I know there is back and forth about tweet that was sent on behalf of the Trump camp, pointing to a Bernie Sanders' person. Did we get to the bottom of all of this?

MURRAY: Well, Donald Trump on this stage will say it is Bernie Sanders supporters who are causing the problems, who are showing up at his events who are protesting. You know, I think the reality is when you go to these events, it's a wide number of individuals that show up. Sometimes they're Bernie Sanders supporters. Outside earlier was black lives matter supporters. So it's a whole set of different people. And I think it just tells you, you know, Donald Trump has been good in bringing energy to the Republican Party. We certainly saw that here. This was a very energetic crowd. But there are people beyond Republican primary voters who have been very offended by his language and some of those people are Bernie Sanders supporters, some of those are not.

HARLOW: Yes. And Trump even saying in the tweet today this all has quote "totally energized America."

All right, Sara, stay with me.

Martin Savidge to you, outside the event, A, any skirmishes or slashes? But I am just wondering what people are saying, reacting to what we have seen happen in Chicago, especially last night?

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, those who support Donald Trump believe that all of that was orchestrated as a protest against him. In other words, they believe it was really a setup.

I tell you what is happening right now. We're in sort of a friction period. What you have is those who were there inside the rally for Donald Trump now coming out. And they run smack at into a small bit boisterous group of protestors. So there is a lot of back and forth. There has been no question they were shoving like that. It's not physical but it is extremely verbal.

One group starts shouting something anti-Trump and then usually the counter is, USA. So it goes back and forth and it continues. We'll monitor that.

Also, as you point out that we standing by the door where all of those who protested inside come out. And it was almost like a parade. It w just a, you would see groups of maybe five or ten people being escorted out. I asked them, how are they dealt with? Most folks said actually treated pretty very well. There was a lot of shouting, but the authorities gently guided them to the door and said, there's the exit. Now use it.

So for the most part here, it is peaceful. But we'll monitor this in the background - Poppy.

[15:05:04] HARLOW: Glad to hear it's been peaceful. Stay with me, Marty.

Jeff, to you. You know, I think far too often, Jeff, we often just hear from sort of the pundits and media and everyone weighs in after these events happen. Like what took place, which was pretty stunning last night in Chicago. I mean, you spoke with some of the protestors themselves. What did they tell you?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, it was interesting to actually walk at some of these protestors. And we were outside of the rally. And some of these pictures that you are seeing inside the rally, yes, there were some physical altercations. But outside the rally I was struck by the number of families who are marching. Mothers and fathers with young children up on their parents' arms. They were really speaking out about what Donald Trump represents in terms of immigrants and other things. Things got a little heated and a little tense.

But take a listen to this conversation I had with a man from the Pilson neighborhood of Chicago. He's a Mexican-American, immigrant, who lives in Chicago. He left his house to join this protest, and this is why.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We were not going to let a bigot come into my neighborhood and disparage my people or my race or my ethnicity. And I felt that I needed to leave my home, come here and say (SPEAKING IN FOREIGN LANGUAGE) Enough! Quit the bullying. We stopped the bullying in Chicago and this is historic. Because when you stop a bully once you can then stop him again. Because guess what? People will lose fear and Chicago showed how to deal with a bully.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZELENY: So Poppy, he says you stop a bully once, you stop a bully always. Chicago knows how to deal with that. But the issue here going forward is, certainly this energizes Donald Trump supporters and it agitates this whole situation here. But we are seeing presidential candidates across the board here, Republicans and Democrats alike, calling on Donald Trump to have a leadership moment here and sort of send a directive to some of this own rhetoric here that has enflamed some of this himself. But Poppy, I think that this is just the beginning of this. If Donald

Trump should become the Republican nominee, this race goes forward, we got a preview last night of what could be a tinder box here in the next seven or eight months or so until the general election. It's perhaps an ugly side of American politics.

HARLOW: I mean, seems it already is, frankly, a tinder box, Jeff. And you tweeted this image last night. If we could pull it up.

ZELENY: Right.

HARLOW: Very powerful image last night. Talk to me about it.

ZELENY: I was struck just by the diversity of the crowd outside, Poppy. I mean, Donald Trump says that they were all organized thugs. That's not what I saw at all. You saw black and white, young and old, Hispanic and Latino, and this picture here of a young white man holding up a sign. "This isn't us."

I mean, Chicago is, of course, a liberal city like most big cities in America here. But it really felt on the streets of Chicago last night. You could feel that they were embracing this moment to say no to Donald Trump and some of his immigrant rhetoric here.

So I was just struck by the diverse tapestry, at least outside of this rally, that really Chicago is, covered Chicago a long time, lived in Chicago, a very diverse city. Of course, has problems of its own, with that some of that diversity. But last night it was -- it felt like a different moment to me. Of course, this is all leading up to the Illinois primary, one of those five states that are voting on Tuesday. Illinois is among them, and that Donald Trump, of course, was trying to get their support but he was stopped from coming to a rally in urban Chicago.

HARLOW: Yes.

ZELENY: Poppy.

HARLOW: And Sara, to you, just because you have spent so much time with the Trump campaign. To Jeff's point about sort of some in both parties calling on this to be a leadership moment for Donald Trump. He tweeted today, "the organized group of people, many of them thugs, who shut down our first amendment rights in Chicago have totally energized America." That was his statement. They have energized this country. Can you walk us through the thinking behind the Trump camp on a statement like that rather than sort of a very clear cut statement denouncing the violence?

MURRAY: Well, Poppy, I think what we have seen is that Donald Trump has said that he doesn't want to see violence. But then he comes to events like this and says, get the protestors out of there. And today on the stage, on the stage he said, it's not my people who are violated. It's these people who are coming in.

So you have seen him try to walk the line and disavow specific incidents of violence, without taking any real responsibility for it. And I think I'm sure you can hear his supporters chanting behind me right now. The reality is that Donald Trump does have a very energized following. And as I was talking to people before the event started. A couple of them told me they were a little bit nervous about coming today. They were concerned after seeing the security situation in Chicago. But they wanted to turn out because they felt like they wanted to express their own first amendment rights. They wanted to show up and support Donald Trump. So I think that's probably a little bit of what they were trying to get to in that statement, Poppy.

HARLOW: And Martin Savidge, to you outside there. I mean, you see the diversity of the crowds coming inside. Some have pointed to this being cut down racial lines, right, especially what we saw play out last night in Chicago. I just wonder what people are telling you of different races outside there, because when it comes to winning, obviously, any candidate needs the minority vote now as well and Donald Trump says over and over again I have the support of Latinos. I have the support of African-Americans. Does it seem cut to you down racial lines right now?

[15:10:13] SAVIDGE: Well, I mean, if you look at the audience that showed up today, it's predominantly white and it predominantly appears to be either middle or upper -- as far as the wealth scale, I guess you could say. You don't see a lot of minorities. You don't see Hispanics and you don't see other representations of other groups. So it is pretty much along race lines.

However, now that I say that, the protestors that are out here are very diverse. So, it's really hard to just gauge and say by looking at an audience, whether this represents the true constituency of Donald Trump. But one thing you can tell, they're boisterous.

HARLOW: I wonder, Marty, I know it's hard to hear. But there are someone is standing to your right behind you with a sign that says "vote, don't hate." If you could turn around. I don't know if she would be willing to speak with us live. But if you could just ask her, you know, just a little bit more of that message?

SAVIDGE: We were actually talking earlier and fellow Clevelanders here. And let me get your name first.

SUSAN, PROTESTER: Susan.

SAVIDGE: Susan, why are you here? And, of course, you know, you're here on this backdrop of very different people than yourself, both in appearance and what you believe. Correct?

SUSAN: Yes. Well I think we all want the same thing for our country. We want America to be a safe, happy, loving and prosperous place. And I wanted to come to show Trump supporters that although I may not look like them, that we want the same things and we don't want hate. We want organized, peaceful elections. Organized, peaceful protests. We want the same things. Donald Trump is like the leech of politics. He's like a -- I don't know. He's just --

SAVIDGE: In reference to -- I should point out, Poppy. Were you were talking about being fearful being here?

SUSAN: Yes. I have been involved in politics all my life and been to many rallies and was recently at the black lives matter rally. And for the first time ever, when we were driving up into the IX center, it was, I was scared. And my son actually didn't want me to come, because he was scared, also. But I felt like I had to just to show people that although I don't look like them, although we may not look like each other, we can still respect each other and have a respectful dialogue.

SAVIDGE: Thank you. Thank you very much.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And welcome back. We love you.

SAVIDGE: Yes, Poppy, go ahead.

HARLOW: And Marty, I'd also like to hear from one of the other folks behind you who is sort of on the opposite side of all of this.

SAVIDGE: Sure. OK. Let me see what I could do. Young man -- obviously -- now, you represent -- will vote for her or have voted for --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Supporting Donald Trump, yes.

SAVIDGE: OK. So we were just talking about people's attitudes of hatred, whether that is reflective. There has been a lot --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can't hear you.

SAVIDGE: There has been a lot of criticism of Donald Trump.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

SAVIDGE: And his supporters of being very much against people of different ethnicities, different backgrounds, races, not inclusive, what do you say to that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think he is trying to just make America great again by bringing everybody everyone --

SAVIDGE: So that's a good catch phrase. What are your feelings?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because right now we are so divided in America. And I believe he can really bring us together like Barack Obama has done.

SAVIDGE: How does he do that with the language and the words expressed?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think his language is the problem. It's just people are too offended in some ways by what he says. But he just wants to get stuff done in America.

SAVIDGE: And what of the violence last night?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What was that?

SAVIDGE: What of the violence last night?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, as you saw, a lot of them were Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton supporters. So, it is not, they said it was all his supporters that was starting the violence but they were bringing it to him and they were just supporting Trump and defending him.

SAVIDGE: Thank you. Thank you, young man.

So there you, just two opinions, in a very large crowd.

HARLOW: That's just so important to hear those voices, Marty. And you see the division certainly right there. But glad everyone is out making own voices heard.

Appreciate it, Martin Savidge, Sara Murray, Jeff Zeleny. Thank you all.

A lot ahead. First of all, point you to what's coming up tomorrow morning. Look at that lineup. John Kasich, Donald Trump, Marco Rubio, Bernie Sanders, all with our Jake Tapper tomorrow morning 9:00 a.m. "STATE OF THE UNION" only right here on CNN.

A lot ahead this hour. On fire, the campaign trail is heating up ahead of this week's big races on Tuesday. We are following every candidate. We will bring you their remarks live over the next five hours.

Also, rivals respond to candidates on both sides are weighing in on the chaotic seen that played out - look at that last night at Trump's rally that never actually became a full Trump rally. He never took the stage there in Chicago. One Republican says that it is getting harder to support Donald Trump if he becomes the nominee.

Also ahead, politics in the Buck eye state, why the Ohio votes could make or break certain players on both sides of the aisle.

Much more ahead. You're live on CNN. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:19:00] HARLOW: Donald Trump's rivals on both sides of the aisle not mincing words blaming the Republican front-runner for inciting violence at his rallies and holding him personally responsible for this chaotic scene that took place last night in Chicago. Look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. JOHN KASICH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Donald Trump has create add toxic environment. There is no place for a national leader to prey on the fears of people who live in our great country.

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If you play with matches, you're going to start a fire you can't control. That's not leadership. That's political arson.

SEN. TED CRUZ (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: All of us can carry a message of unity that brings people together rather than seeking to divide, rather than seeking to enflame hatred.

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When he talks about, you know, things -- I wish we were in the old days when you could punch somebody in the head. What do you think that says to his supporters? Donald Trump has got to be loud and clear and tell his supporters that violence at rallies is not what America is about, and to end it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[15:20:13] HARLOW: Our correspondent, Jason Carroll, is live from Tampa, Florida. This is at a meet and greet for Marco Rubio.

Jason, when it comes to all of this, I mean, senator Rubio is using the backlash around Trump's event last night to make his final pitch to voters. It's interesting, because he has had this total shift in messaging, sort of attacking Trump and then saying that he wouldn't do that again. Is it resonating today?

JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think in terms of the attacks, what he's done is, Poppy, he has just shifted the tone of the attacks. No longer are the attacks personal like we saw in the past as you know. But what we are seeing now, he is keeping it on policy, looking at the bigger picture, saying that at least today saying that comparing Donald Trump to a dictator saying given what's happened in Chicago and other incidents as well, he says at this point he's not sure he can support him as the nominee. Very serious statement there.

And what was also interesting, Poppy, is, he didn't just place blame on Trump. He also seemed to place blame on the media for what's going on as well.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: For too long those comments were ignored. Some people thought they were cute. And he's gotten an extraordinary amount of coverage for all the f he says that's outrageous. Every time Donald Trump offends someone, says something ridiculous, says something offensive, it's wall to wall coverage and it is only elevated him even more.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CARROLL: Here's what's interesting about that. I also spoke to a Rubio supporter who had these sort of opposite point of views, Poppy, basically telling me that he did not believe the media was going enough, in this words, to expose Trump for who he is. But here's the reality of what's going on here in Florida. If Rubio has any hope of stopping Trump, he's got to do it right here. He's got to do it Tuesday.

HARLOW: Yes. CARROLL: And as you know, those polls show Trump leading in the polls

and the Rubio camp says we don't believe those polls. By having said that out here today at this meet and greet and at every campaign stop we have seen here in Florida, he is encouraging his supporters to get out and vote early - Poppy.

HARLOW: Well, not just leading in the polls, I mean, leading in the polls by a vast margin, in every - I mean, when you look at these Republican polls, I'm looking at four right now where he is up by at least 16 points. Are you getting a sense there, Jason, why that is? I mean, here is someone that's the home-state senator. Do they feel like he hasn't had the leadership in the Senate? What is it that they are turning away from him?

CARROLL: There are a couple things. First, once again, the Rubio camp believes that those polls aren't correct. And if they do show Trump up ahead they're not. He is not as ahead in terms of that amount of points. So that's first.

Second, in terms of why Rubio is not doing better in his home state, if the polls are correct. I have spoken to people, Poppy, in this northern part of the state, in southern part, east, west, all over. And here is what I'm getting.

Basically there are a number of people here in the state who at one point supported Rubio for the Senate. Liked what he had to say, believed he would were go into the Senate and speak to what they wanted to hear and there is a feeling he didn't accomplish that. That he did not do that, and so I think that's why you see him struggling here in his home state once again, if those polls are accurate. That could be part of the reason why.

HARLOW: Yes. Absolutely. It makes you wonder, Jason, because he had sort of the lowest turnout record for senators last year in all 2015 when it came to actually being present for votes in Washington. He got a lot of criticism for. You wonder if that is affecting him now come to this home state vote on Tuesday.

Jason Carroll live for us there in Tampa. Thank you so much.

I want to take you to Kansas City, Missouri. Ted Cruz is speaking live.

CRUZ: -- we've seen readiness undermined, we've seen morale of the troops plummeting. And it's fixing to turn around.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

CRUZ: You know, we've seen this before. We have seen another left wing Democratic president Jimmy Carter who weakened the military, who weakened our ability to defend ourselves and what happened? In 1981, Ronald Reagan came into office. And Reagan cut taxes, he lifted regulations, small businesses exploded with millions of high-paying jobs that generated trillions in new government revenue. He used that revenue to rebuild the military, and we bankrupted the Soviet Union and won the cold war. (CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

[15:25:00] CRUZ: I intend to do the exact same thing with radical Islamic terrorism. We are going to pass a flat tax repeal Obama care lift the regulations, small businesses are going to explode. We'll see millions of high-paying jobs that will generate trillions of new revenue for the federal government. And we will use that money to rebuild this military so it remains the mightiest fighting force on the face of the planets.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

CRUZ: And no longer will our military be governed by political correctness. We will have a president who stands up and says to the world, we will defeat radical Islamic terrorism. We'll have a president willing to utter the words, radical Islamic terrorism!

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

CRUZ: And you know one of the saddest things we have seen over the last seven years has been this president sending our fighting men and women into combat with rules of engagement so strict that they tie their arms behind their backs, they make it impossible for them 20 fight for them to win for them to defend themselves. Let me tell you right now that is wrong. It is immoral, and come January 2017 it will end.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

HARLOW: All right. There you have it. Ted Cruz speaking live at rally in Kansas City, Missouri. We'll continue to monitor that.

Also a lot to get to ahead of what is been known as Super Tuesday part III. Our John King breaks down the delegate math for next week's contest. It all comes down to the number and getting enough those delegates to get the nomination. And those numbers are critical especially critical in the winner take all states of Ohio and Florida where voters go to the polls on Tuesday. Could Trump be unstoppable come next week? John King breaks it down, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:31:25] HARLOW: Welcome back. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

And we are following politics as they are making, as it is making many, many headlines today. Latest in the political race, obviously the delegate count, Tuesday's big race. Races, five big states. Critical winner take all primaries in Ohio and in Florida, the numbers all matter so much right now, the delegate count.

Our John King breaks down the delegate math for next week's major, major contest - John.

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Poppy, hard to overstate the stakes on Tuesday. If you want to stop Donald Trump Tuesday's voting will go a long way to determine whether that is a reasonable scenario.

Let's first just take a quick look at the delegates at stake. Five states up for Democrats and Republicans. Let's take a look at the numbers here. 367 delegates at stake on Tuesday. That's nearly 30 percent what it takes to win. The magic number is 1,237. So a big pool of delegates in this big battleground states.

Now, let's take a look at the map. Donald Trump enters Tuesday at 461 in the delegate chase. The magic number is 1,237. So Poppy, imagine if Donald Trump runs the board. If Donald Trump runs the board and wins them all, just around 800 delegates. At this point the Trump train becomes a runaway train. The dreams of stopping Donald Trump of keeping him from getting to 1,237 become very problematic if he runs the board. Because if he runs the board, he will need roughly 44, 45 percent of the remaining delegates. That would be well within his reach. That is why it is so important. You have heard Marco Rubio's campaign say, hey, vote for John Kasich in Ohio.

Why was that matter? Is Kasich wins in Ohio, Trump is still way ahead. But it knocks him back some. At this point, he need to win about 55 percent of remaining delegates. And if Rubio can also win his home state of Florida, and say those 99 delegated knocks Trump back a little more. Again, Trump would be in the lead. But at this point, if this happens, Poppy, Rubio wins at home. Kasich win at home. At this point the stop-Trump is movement thinks they have him, at least to the convention. In the sense that if Trump ends the night still in a big lead, but in the 630, 640 range, at this point, he would have to win about 60 percent of the remaining delegates instead of 40 percent 45 percent of the remaining delegates if he runs the board.

So this is key to stopping Donald Trump. Do you get here where they think they can keep him from getting majority by the convention? He probably still in the lead but they think they would not give Trump 1,237 or if Donald Trump runs the board -- forget about it -- Poppy.

HARLOW: All right. John, breaking on the numbers. Thanks you so much.

Of course, John will be with us Tuesday night as the numbers start rolling in from those crucial races.

Speaking of those crucial races, Ohio primaries just three days away. Up next, experts from Ohio weigh into the chaos last night in Chicago. Before a planned Trump rally help or hurt his chances, in the buckeye state, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:37:16] HARLOW: Republican front-runner Donald Trump just wrapped up a rally in Cleveland, Ohio. He is making a lot of stops today after that rally didn't actually take place in Chicago last night after the violence broke out.

Looking at Ohio, this is a winner take all state. The primary is three days away. Trump is facing a tough challenge from Ohio's governor John Kasich. Here's what is at stake for both races.

Sixty-six Republican delegates, 143 delegates for Democrats. When you look at the Republican side, some polls have Trump leading Kasich. There is a FOX News poll out this week that has Kasich leading Trump.

Let's talk more about it. CNN conservative political commentator Buck Sexton is with us and from Ohio, "Dayton Daily News" reporter Laura Bischoff. Thank you both for being here.

Laura, let me begin with you. What happened in Chicago last night? The violence that ensued outside the rally, inside the rally, the rally never takes place, et cetera. Do you think in your opinion that benefits anyone in the Ohio race? Does it benefit Kasich, who's condemning it? Does it benefit a Trump who in a tweet today called it energizing.

LAURA BISCHOFF, REPORTER, DAYTON DAILY NEWS: Well, I do think that the Donald Trump supporters will see it as energizing and as kind of, kind of plays into his macho role. I think, also, it plays into John Kasich's hand in that he has been trying to run (INAUDIBLE) above the fray, and to be all about positive campaigning and avoiding mud- slinging and name-calling and attacks and such. It is going to be a really close rate here in Ohio.

HARLOW: Buck, to you. When you look at the importance of winning Ohio, Kasich has said, that's it. I have to win. He needs 66 votes. I just wonder if you think that what we saw -- take place in Michigan, on the Democratic side in terms of free trade and how terms of the voting. If that plays in, and if that hurts Kasich at all in Ohio given that he has been such a strong proponent of free trade, defended it in the debate on Thursday night, but then you've got this Trump voice saying I'm going to end all of these agreements. This is bad for American jobs?

BUCK SEXTON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Poppy, you certainly can make the argument either way at this point. Quite honestly, we'll know in a couple days and John Kasich's entire hopes here are obviously hinging on Ohio just as same case with Marco Rubio in Florida. I think that Kasich has a pretty good sense of what plays well in Ohio. So my guess on that would be that his position on free trade has taken that into account.

But as to Trump, I have to agree with what your guest previously said. I think there will be an energizing affect among Trump supporters given what's happened actually in the last 24 hours that they see that as in fact legitimizing their point of view, that they are sort of oppressed by the political machine on both sides, actually. The GOP establishment and Democrats, and the left more broadly.

So it's obviously a huge deal for both campaigns because if Trump wins in Ohio, then he has a claim to being the GOP front-runner even if he doesn't get the necessary votes to clench the nomination before the convention and it will be very hard to do some sort of back room tricks to get him to not be that for the end of it.

HARLOW: And fascinating that we saw, like, the communications director for Rubio's camp saying, look, Kasich's got a better chance in Ohio than I do. So if you want to defeat Trump go out and vote for Kasich in Ohio.

Let's talk more about that strategy ahead. I have to get a break. Both of you, please stay with me. Because up next I want to talk about this question -- does Ohio set the tone for a lot of other states that are going to be voting coming up obviously, including Illinois. Some of the other rust belt states. What we see take place in Ohio, what does that sort of mean across the region? We'll talk with both of you about that next.

Quick break. Be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:44:39] HARLOW: This election season anger over the U.S. economy is turning out voters in droves especially the support candidate like Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders. But you have to ask yourself, why is that? Gas is cheap. Unemployment is below five percent. Aren't things getting a whole lot better?

Our Christine Romans digs into exactly what the numbers tell us, especially on the trade deals.

[15:45:03] CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN MONEY CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, there was this moment in CNN's GOP debate this week that crystallized the populist revolt over free trade.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Trade deals are absolutely killing our country. We're going to have to do taxes unless they behave.

CRUZ: He's right about the problems, but his solutions don't work. When you're shopping for your kids, the prices you pay go up 45 percent.

TRUMP: The 45 percent tax is a threat. It is not a tax. It was a threat.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: Tapping into an election year revolt against globalization and the free trade deals that go along with it. At the heart of it, Poppy, this statistic. In 1960, 28 percent of the American work force were in factories. Today, it is only 8.7 percent. So where do candidates stand?

Well, Ted Cruz said he never supported the trans-pacific partnership. That's the trade deal that would be largest trade agreement in history if it becomes law. But has supported giving presidents more authority to negotiate deals and then the Senate gets the job of voting them up or down, no amendments.

Donald Trump, he wants 45 percent tariffs on goods coming into the U.S. from companies that send American jobs overseas.

Bernie Sanders, Democratic side, playing into this angst as well. The fact is, there are few viable options to reverse legally binding international agreement.

Now, Marco Rubio has the more traditional Republican position on trade, that it opens markets for U.S. goods and factories, raises American living standards, but that doesn't matter.

Donald Trump's argument is resonating with voters. Here's why. Call it one America with two economies. Jobless rate low. Home prices rising. Gas cheaper than it's been in years. But family income is back to 1995 levels, and they have to borrow loads of money for college. Those without college degrees struggle more to find work. Chasing fewer manufacturing jobs, jobs by the way that now require higher skills.

Check out this demographic. White men are leaving the labor force facing more competition from women who have entered the labor market and from immigrants. Labor market participation for white males has been shrinking now for six decades. And the spoils of an overall growing economy? Well, they go to the earners at the top. The top 10 percent took home 50 percent of all income in the year 2014.

All of those things, Poppy, channeled into a fierce debate on trade. But there's another interesting way to think about it. Is this a revolt against free trade agreements or a revolt against globalization? Because globalization is spreading with or without trade deals. Driven by technology, by hundreds of millions of available workers for jobs around the world, and by American consumers who love low prices - Poppy.

HARLOW: Indeed, Christine Romans, thank you so much. Important to put it all in context there. We are going to talk more about this coming up. More on the impact of free trade on this race as a whole. It turned out to be huge in Michigan. Could it lead to a big upset in Ohio as well? Next.

But first, in Detroit, just had nearly three feet of snow this winter. They know that they can't cut out winter soon, so here's what CNN's "hero of the week" has done. Veronica Scott designed a convertible coat for the homeless that turned into a sleeping bag at night. But she said that is not all it does. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VERONICA SCOTT, CNN HERO: The jacket itself was meant to offer people warmth and a little bit of pride, because you see so many people on the streets that are wearing somebody else's trash. Somebody else's throwaway. So it was about creating something that was made specifically for them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: You can see much more of Veronica's story at CNNheroes.com.

While you are there, we want you to nominate someone you think should be the 2016 CNN hero. Go to CNN heroes.com.

Quick break. We'll be right back.

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[15:52:53] HARLOW: All right. Let's talk more about the economics of this race, particularly free trade which proved to be huge deal when Michigan voted last week and it will be a major, major issue in Ohio's voting on Tuesday.

Back with me CNN conservative political commentator Buck Sexton with us from Ohio, and "Dayton Daily News" reporter Laura Bischoff.

Let's just talk through, Laura, if you could, you know, your voters in that state. How important is this issue of free trade for them? Because Kasich says he has to take Ohio home. Look, he is a big free trade proponent. He was asked about it by Jake Tapper on Thursday night in the debate. And he said I want free trade but I want fair trade. Are voters getting the message they want from him or are they leaning more toward Donald Trump on that?

BISCHOFF: Well, it's really unclear. It does sound like a lot of voters are leaning toward Donald Trump. He is up six points in one of the polls, Kasich is up six points in one of the other polls so it's very close. And you know, Kasich he's got very high approval ratings, he has got the Ohio Republican party backing him and all its machinery helping him in his contest, and yet he is still in a dog fight in the polls with Donald Trump.

I think there's a lot of blue collar voters who may cross over from the Democratic side and vote for Trump in the Republican primary because you are allowed to do that in Ohio. And some of it might be feel by Kasich's position on trade. We'll see.

HARLOW: I mean, Buck, you're nodding your head. This comes down to what we have been talking all week, and that is that anger. That anger that is brewing that especially from sort of what were middle class white American men who have sort of seen the bottom fall out for them. I mean, when you look at how well they have done, you know, many of those jobs were good paying jobs, are gone, even in the state of Ohio and some attribute that to free trade.

SEXTON: Well, that is why Trump is speaking to those anxieties. And you're absolutely right. Ohio is sort of an epicenter of the kinds of problems that Donald Trump has been successful convincing people, convincing at least Trump supporters, that he would be able to address. You would have a huge loss of manufacturing particularly in the aftermath of the recession but also even before that we were losing manufacturing jobs in Ohio.

[15:55:08] HARLOW: Technology too. I mean, that's not just because of NAFTA, free trade deals.

SEXTON: Right. I mean, this is a sort of switch into now can Trump actually do anything about the loss of manufacturing jobs? I think there is a very strong argument made that not really, especially when he starts talking about tariffs and perhaps even setting off what some would consider to be the early stages of a trade war. But as to how this works for Ohio, from an election sense, as to whether people buy into this, I think the polls are showing there is certainly something that is appealing about Donald Trump to a lot of Ohio voters. He is beating the sitting governor of Ohio in a state like this that had economic problems, the loss of manufacturing jobs and has the anxieties of white working class voters. This is sort of a place where all of Trump's appeal in the past to certain voters comes together. So I think it's a big test for him.

HARLOW: At the same time, Laura, I mean, that these are numbers that Kasich can run and with 77 percent approval rating the fact that under his term there, 400,000 private sector jobs have been created in Ohio.

BISCHOFF: Yes. And the economy is doing well. Although, I will say that a lot of the jobs that have come back don't pay as well as the jobs that have been lost. So there's a lot of economic anxiety about that. You know, poverty rates are pretty high. There's a lot of people on Medicaid. You know, things are not, you know, super great in Ohio but there are certainly better than they were, you know, five, six years ago.

Now, I do think that Kasich is going to be running on his record. He is ping ponging around the state and he is holding rallies in places to try to highlight, you know job wins that he's had. He was in Dayton yesterday at a (INAUDIBLE) manufacturing plant that went in and replaced -- they took over a large portion of a long shuttered GM factory and they hired 1,000 people or so. And so, Kasich is trying to you know, highlight that sort of record that he can get things accomplished and bring back jobs.

HARLOW: Yes. And once again seeing today on the trail he refuses to go negative despite being beaten in a lot of these polls by Donald Trump.

We'll watch. We will see come Tuesday what voters do.

Laura Bischoff, thank you. Buck Sexton, thank you as well. Buck will be with us next hour as well.

Much more ahead. Stay with us.

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