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Terror Suspects Captured; Presidential Race; Colorado Delegates. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired April 8, 2016 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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[14:00:13] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, here we go, top of the hour, I'm Brooke Baldwin. We begin with breaking news here on CNN.

This man allegedly involved in not just one but two of Europe's most horrific terror attacks has just been caught alive. We'll show you a picture here. This man, one of the men here, Mohamed Abrini, has just been arrested. These photos showing Abrini at a gas station, this is two days after the Paris attacks, with the now captured, the eight - that eighth wanted terror suspect from Paris there in the surveillance photos from the gas station from right after those coordinated attacks. Meaning that last named suspect is no longer at large.

It also ties him to last month's coordinated Brussels bombings at the airport and the subway. Something authorities have kept very closely to themselves. Belgium media reporting that this man in the hat and the light colored jacket at the airport, before those bombings, is, in fact, Abrini, captured a short time ago, along with Osama Krayem (ph), who is accused as having a quote/unquote operational role in the Brussels attacks. I know lots of pieces to throw at you here. We'll have it all together and understand it as we go to Brussels.

CNN journalist Kellie Morgan is standing by with more.

Kelly, let's begin with the significance of this Abrini arrest. What do we know about him?

KELLIE MORGAN, CNN JOURNALIST: It's extraordinary - an extraordinarily big fish for the Belgian authorities to have this man in custody. We know that he grew up in this area - in Brussels, in the neighborhood where Paris suspect who was - who was also captured, Salah Abdeslam, grew up. These men have been long-term friends. So the connections are very, very distinct now. We're starting to piece it together. The attacks in between - in Brussels and Paris and the role that these two men played in both.

Now, Abrini, we are going to learn more. We've just heard from the prosecutor's office now that there is going to be a press conference in two hours. So we will hopefully be able to bring you some more detail then. But we - we know that he was arrested - the other man who was arrested with him was Osama Krayem, who was listed on a European security bulletin the day after the Brussels attacks and he was named on that list. His name, al Hamid (ph). And he is the man that investigators believe was the second - the second bomber at the metro station.

As for Abrini, the local media here, Belgian media, is reporting that Abrini was the man in the white coat. Now, we've asked prosecutors about that, can they confirm that. They cannot at this stage. But in - that would be an extraordinary day for Belgian authorities if we had these two men, two men who walked away from those Brussels attacks. We don't know whether they were planning more attacks, but both big fish and we really look forward to learning more in the next two hours, Brooke.

BALDWIN: We will have that news conference, 3:30 Eastern Standard Time here in the United States. Kellie Morgan, for now, thank you so much.

Paul Cruickshank is now joining me, CNN terrorism analyst and editor in chief for the CTC Sentinel.

Paul Cruickshank, I think it's important just to remind people, when we saw the photos in the airport before the bombs went off in Brussels, you saw the two guys in the black. They were the suspected suicide bombers. Then you had the man in the light jacket, the dark hat, who then was later seen on surveillance video walking and then jogging away. If this is Abrini, how significant is this?

PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Very significant indeed because the third terror operative at the airport, somebody who was obviously going to be very dangerous moving forward, if they got that individual and he's indeed Abrini, that's very significant. And Abrini is a huge get, you know, even if he isn't the guy at the airport.

BALDWIN: Airport.

CRUICKSHANK: He's the guy who drove the Paris attackers from Belgium, all those safe houses in Belgium -

BALDWIN: Wow.

CRUICKSHANK: To Paris in the 48 hours before the Paris attacks. And then he sort of disappeared into thin air. Well, we now know that he came back to Brussels and we know that he was in the Anderlecht (ph) district of Brussels, which is pretty much central Brussels.

BALDWIN: So, again, this is another story of someone else going back to where they came from and hiding out.

CRUICKSHANK: Hiding out in a place they knew very well. They grew up - he grew up in Molenbeek, not far away.

BALDWIN: Wow.

CRUICKSHANK: Just a short walk from Anderlecht. And also we understand arrested, Osama Krayem (ph), who was the other most wanted man in Europe. And a source close to the investigation telling us that he's believed to be one in the same as Niam al Hamid (ph). And you'll recall that CNN reported the - the name, the wanted poster of Niam al Hamid -

BALDWIN: Here he is.

CRUICKSHANK: Just a few days after the Brussels attacks. The French had a (SPEAKING IN FOREIGN LANGUAGE) which went out on the Friday after the - in fact, on the day of the attacks a bit later on with this guy's picture, saying they thought he was armed and dangerous. They identified him at the time as Niam al Hamid. They believe that he played an operational role in the Brussels attacks.

[14:05:19] Well now we understand he is one in the same as Osama Krayem. This is somebody that came through the Greek island of Leros we know on September 20. Came through then Austria and went to a refugee center in Olm, Germany, where he was picked up by Salah Abdeslam on the 3rd of October the investigators have now established and then driven to Brussels. This attack cell coming through Europe from Syria to go to Paris, to go to Brussels, congregating there.

Is this the end of the story? This is not the end of the story. CNN understand that there are at least four other people they have the identities of that are wanted in connection with the Paris and Brussels attacks. And so they're looking for them at the moment. There's concern that some of them may have faked their own deaths in Syria. Not clear whether, you know, some are alive or dead. But the European officials have been increasingly seeing these ISIS operatives from Europe pretending that they're dead so it's more easy to come into Europe. And a number of those four individuals I was just talking about -

BALDWIN: Yes.

CRUICKSHANK: That's the case with them.

BALDWIN: So here's what I'm wondering, because when we were on talking about the massive capture of Salah Abdeslam, who was involved in Paris, and what was it just days later Brussels happened and we talked about, well, what would police be in talking to him about or interrogating. You have to believe that the same is happening with these two men, correct, behind closed doors?

CRUICKSHANK: Well - well, right. And just think about it. You know, Salah Abdeslam was captured on a Friday. The Tuesday after that we saw the Brussels attacks.

BALDWIN: Right.

CRUICKSHANK: We're on a Friday now. They suspect there are other people connected to this cell still at large, perhaps a dozen that they suspect overall that are probably still at large. Right now people who played a logistical support in all of this, dangerous people still out there who may be increasingly desperate as this dragnet comes down, everybody's got to hope that we don't have another Tuesday like we had in Brussels last month.

BALDWIN: Yes, hoping not at all for that.

Paul Cruickshank, always excellent on all this, thank you so much on these latest arrests here in Belgium.

Meantime, for the first time, the new adviser to Donald Trump's campaign, the man in charge of the race for delegates, speaks out to us here at CNN. What he admits about Ted Cruz's strategy.

Also today, new, Bill Clinton responding to his heated clash with Black Lives Matter protesters. And rapper, actor, producer about to be latest inductee in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, Ice Cube, NWA, being inducted this evening in Brooklyn. He will join me to talk politics, police and what it means to be the fifth rap group of all time to be inducted among these legends. Stay with me.

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[14:12:03] BALDWIN: Welcome back. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

You remember way, way back, before the presidential election season even began, for really more than two years, Hillary Clinton was all but presumed the nominee. But now Bernie Sanders' campaign is saying its people are preparing for an open convention because Clinton, they say, will not have enough delegates to earn the nomination outright. Yes, a contested convention, which hasn't been seen in generations, may just happen, not just for the Republicans but the Democrats.

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JEFF WEAVER, CAMPAIGN MANAGER, BERNIE 2016: In all likelihood there will be an open convention. We are in constant contact with super delegates as we go toward the convention to convince them what is the fact. Polls show consistently that Bernie Sanders beats all the Republicans by better margins than the secretary. We have many people affiliated with the campaign who have floor experience in the Democratic Party and so we're looking at all of our options in terms of rules and delegates and what have you.

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BALDWIN: Our chief national correspondent and anchor of CNN's "Inside Politics," Mr. John King, joins me because he is just the best at math among us all here.

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Uh-huh.

BALDWIN: So let's do a little math, John King, as far as the Democrats are concerned. According to CNN's estimate, Hillary Clinton, right now, she has nearly 700 more delegates than Bernie Sanders. How could he catch up?

KING: Well, they don't like that math in the Sanders campaign. They prefer to say that instead of a 681-delegate lead, which you just showed there with the super delegates counted in, that she has a 229 delegate lead because they like to count for now, Brooke, only pledged delegates. The Sanders strategy is to start beating her. He's will again in - he's won seven of the last eight. I think he'll probably win in Wyoming on Saturday. No offense to the Sanders campaign, that's not good enough. It's only 14 delegates in Wyoming.

But if he can upset her in New York, if he can upset her in Pennsylvania, if he can upset her in Maryland, they are hoping, and then he has to win at the end of the race in California as well, they're hoping we get to a Democratic convention, maybe she's still in the delegate lead but he's closed that gap to 50 or 60 and there's a panic in the Democratic Party that she's weak, that she's wounded, that how is Bernie Sanders beating her in these big states? That's their dream scenario.

Will it happen? Who knows. It is a wacky year. And at that point if they can beat her in those big states I just mentioned, at least most of them, they hope there's a panic among the super delegates and those super delegates, who can switch their vote, back away from Secretary Clinton and say, whoa, we don't know.

BALDWIN: Well, obviously, you know, it depends on who you ask as far as whether or not on the Democratic side we'd have a contested convention or not, but who actually thinks they will is, of all people, Donald Trump's, you know, new convention manager Paul Manafort. He talked exclusively to our colleague, Chris Cuomo. You know, he's confident that there will be only one round of voting at the Republican Convention in Cleveland in July. Here he was.

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PAUL MANAFORT, DONALD TRUMP CONVENTION MANAGER: The reality is, Ted Cruz has seen his best day. The reality is, this convention process will be over with sometime in June, probably June 7th. And it will be apparent to the world that Trump is over the 1,237 number. There's Pennsylvania. There's - there's New Jersey. There's Maryland. There's Connecticut. These are his wheelhouse. And, yes, California's going to be important. But by the time we get to California, the momentum is going to be very clear and Ted Cruz's path to victory is going to be in shambles.

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[14:15:09] BALDWIN: So jump on what he said but also I'm curious, does it behoove Donald Trump to have multiple rounds if this goes to a contested convention, have multiple rounds of ballots or no?

KING: No. the answer to that question is an emphatic no. And that's why he brought in a grown-up like Paul Manafort who has done this going back to 1976 and the Reagan-Ford battle, has been involved in just about every Republican Convention since, knows the rules, knows how to wrangle delegates and, most importantly, Brooke, knows how to count.

Now, he was being very optimistic there in that sound bite saying Donald Trump will get to 1,237 before the convention. That's possible. But Donald Trump would have to win just shy of 60 percent of the remaining delegates to do that and he has not been winning at that pace so far. So he has to up his game. He has to win just about all of the 95 in New York. He has to go on and win all of them in New Jersey. He would have to - you know, Pennsylvania has a lot of non-committed delegates. And this is what this could come down to. Paul Manafort understands his job might be that heading into the convention there are really around 1,190 or they're around 1,200 and they need to get 40, you know, 40 more or 50 more. And then you go to those uncommitted, the unbound delegates, and you try to say, look, we're the only guy who can win, come our way, be with the winner. He understands that's his job between now and Cleveland, keep an eye on every one of those uncommitted, unbound delegates and try to convince them to come to your side because, in all likelihood, and he knows this, Trump will be a little bit short before the convention. So he hopes to get there on the first ballot by lobbying those uncommitted delegates because Paul knows this very well, he can't say it publicly, but most people believe and I'm told that he understands that if Trump loses on the first ballot, then they think they've got a problem.

BALDWIN: Counting. They're hoping for the first ballot. We shall see.

John King, we will see (INAUDIBLE) as well.

KING: Math. Math is fun, Brooke. Math is fun.

BALDWIN: Math. Math is so fun.

Make sure you watch John every Sunday morning, 8:00 Eastern, "Inside Politics" with Mr. John King here on CNN. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

KING: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Next, ten seconds, ten, that's all you get in Colorado, to convince your fellow Republicans that you should become a delegate. That process begins just a couple of hours from now. We will talk with someone who hopes to make that speech and become an integral part of the Colorado process.

Also, the battle for New York between the Democratic candidates is definitely heating up, becoming quite tense. We'll talk to Howard Wolfson (ph). He worked for Hillary Clinton's campaign in 2008. What he makes of the shift in the tone on the Democratic side.

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[14:22:01] BALDWIN: The Republican race for the White House has moved to Colorado. And how they do things in Colorado is like nothing we've actually seen thus far. No voters head to the polls. No one gathers to caucus. Instead, Republican Party insiders are basically hand picking delegates rather than candidates. Ted Cruz already has won nine. More will be chosen today and tomorrow. All of this, again, without a statewide vote.

So to explain all of this, let's go to Colorado Springs and my colleague Ana Cabrera there.

And so from what I gather, this is hundreds of people who want to be delegates and they have a big ten seconds to make their pitch?

ANA CABRERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I know, that's what I said when I first heard that. I had to ask, did I hear that correctly? But really it's a logistical issue, Brooke. There are only ten seconds because there are hundreds of candidates running to be delegates from the state of Colorado at the RNC. And of those hundreds, only 34 at the end of this weekend will end up elected to be those representatives at the RNC come July. So a lot of the groundwork really has been laid in the weeks and months leading up to it where these delegate candidates have been working to get their message out.

There's also been a coordination with a lot of the presidential campaigns. We know Cruz's campaign has been here for months with more than 100 volunteers we're told making phone calls, sending out e- mails, having meetings with potential delegates and supporters of Cruz. And then the presidential candidates run a slate or maybe have six people who they really honed in on and want to be their representatives to get elected to the RNC. And so they tell the rest of their supporters, if you want to have Cruz be the president, then elect one of these six delegates. So that's sort of how it's working behind the scenes and that's why a lot of these delegate candidates really probably don't stand a chance going into the convention, but it's all part of the process here, Brooke.

BALDWIN: We will talk to one of them in just a moment. Ana Cabrera, thank you so much, in Colorado.

Just, you know, to zero in on this process underway right now in that state, remember, she mentioned hundreds, 600 people are running for the right to become a delegate at the Republican National Convention when it's held this July in Cleveland. And each of those 600 is being given, a we mentioned, all of six - rather, ten - a whole ten seconds to make a pitch to party insiders. This entire process of deciding which Republican candidate gets to represent the Republican Party in the November general election could come down to how well you're able to sell yourself, again, in ten seconds.

You have to wonder, how do you do that? We have Eli Bremer, who is also now joining us to help us understand this whole process.

Eli, welcome. Nice to see you.

ELI BREMER, CANDIDATE FOR COLORADO GOP DELEGATE: Hi. Good to see you too, Brooke.

BALDWIN: So, tell me, and I won't - I won't time you on this one, why do you want to be a delegate?

BREMER: Well, it's a really fun process, despite all the hardships that you go through. It's a fun process. And my wife and I have been involved for years and we decided this year we'd make a run at it and see if we can get to Cleveland.

[14:25:00] BALDWIN: So I understand, you know, even though you want to - you want a chance to be at Cleveland and to represent Colorado, you would prefer that your great state of Colorado held a primary. Tell me why.

BREMER: Well, that's correct. We have a caucus system and it's very difficult to - for most voters to understand. There's a lot of people who don't get to participate. A lot of military. A lot of single moms. People like that. I think a straight primary would just make a lot more sense. We'd get a lot more people involved. And you have a better process, you're likely to get better results.

BALDWIN: So I understand that you're still sort of trying to make up your mind. You're unattached to any particular candidate. I know Ted Cruz will be there making his - making a speech. And the last time any sort of candidate did that, that was the late '70s with Ronald Reagan. So that's, you know, not nothing. The other candidates will be sending representatives. Are you - are you swayed any which way yet?

BREMER: Not yet. You know, there's a lot of time left in this election. We've got until really early June before all the delegates are allocated. If someone locks up the nomination by then, I'll come out and endorse them directly. If not, then I want to - I want to talk to the campaigns that are remaining and tell them if they bring their A game they can get my support.

BALDWIN: You mentioned your wife. Also, you know, you're a part of this process together. She wants to be a delegate. What if you all like different candidates? What - what does that look like at the dinner table later tonight, Eli?

BREMER: I'll probably lose that one. So - no, we have fairly similar views. I'm sure we'll go into this looking at things the same way. And we just both love participating in the process and we love the opportunity to go out and represent Colorado in Cleveland.

BALDWIN: Final question, I'm going to give you a quick audition here on CNN before you do it for real in Colorado. Give me your ten second pitch.

BREMER: My name's Eli Bremer. I'm the former El Paso County Republican Party chairman. And I would love to represent Colorado in Cleveland this summer.

BALDWIN: Eli, to you and your wife -

BREMER: That's about all the time you get.

BALDWIN: I know, and we're up. Good luck to you and your wife. Perhaps we'll see you in Cleveland. Eli Bremer in Colorado Springs, thank you very much.

BREMER: All right.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

And coming up next week, Anderson Cooper will moderate a CNN town hall with Donald Trump and his family. That happens Tuesday night, 9:00 Eastern, right here on CNN.

Coming up next, much more on our breaking news here. A fugitive from the Paris attacks who reportedly may well be this man here in that light jacket who was seen inside the Brussels airport before the bombs went off has been caught alive. We have that for you.

Also, Bill Clinton reacts to his heated clash with Black Lives Matter protesters. What the former president has said moments ago.

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