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ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES
Medical Examiner: Prince's Death Caused By Fentanyl Toxicity; Clinton: Trump's Ideas Are "Dangerously Incoherent"; Trump Keeps Up Attacks On Judge Curiel; House Speaker Ryan Endorses Trump. Aired 9- 10p ET
Aired June 2, 2016 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:02] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN AC360 ANCHOR: ... and I guess it's usually administered in a patch or even like a lollipop I think. Did Prince have a prescription for it?
SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That is a good very question. We know that he had a prescription for something, we don't know what because we know from the search warrant that one of the doctors that saw him the day before he died, and showed up at his home to give him a test result. And that he told investigators that indeed he had prescribed something to Prince which he was supposed to pick up at a Walgreen.
So we know there's a prescription out there, for what we don't know. What we had heard from investigators early on in the investigation is they were not able to find a prescription for some of the pain medications on his person and in his home when they first searched Prince's Paisley Park Compound. Anderson?
COOPER: Sara Sidner, Sara, thank you.
Just ahead another at "360", Hillary Clinton recounting revving to Donald Trump, saying he doesn't even have ideas, just bizarre rants, feuds, and outright lies. She said he's temperamentally unfit to hold the office of president. Also we'll hear more from the panel the latest in the Trump University lawsuit. And Trump's comments just tonight about the judge and his Mexican heritage.
We'll be right back.
COOPER: Good evening, thanks for joining us. It is a busy night, this no exception. Donald Trump about to speak tonight in San Jose. He's just given an interview to "The Wall Street Journal" in it he lashed out again at the judge in the class action lawsuit against his so called Trump University, directly going after the judge's ethnic heritage.
[21:05:08] Here's a relevant portion of "The Wall Street Journal" article. Mr. Trump said U.S. District Judge Gonzalo Curiel had "an absolute conflict" in presiding over the litigation, given that he was, "of Mexican heritage" and a member of Latino Lawyers' Association. Mr. Trump said the background of the judge who was born in Indiana to Mexican immigrants was relevant because of his campaign stance against illegal immigration and has pledged seal the Southern U.S boarder.
"I am building a wall, it is inherent conflict of interest." Mr. Trump said.
So what do you make of that? Joining us by phone is Senior Legal Analyst Jeffrey Toobin. Jeffrey you've seen "The Wall Street Journal" article. What do you think of what Trump has said?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well first of all, it is clear that Donald Trump has First Amendment rights, he's allowed to criticize judges like anyone else.
However, the notion that a judge being of Mexican heritage is a conflict of interest in any case involving a politician who may have interest in Mexico is completed outside judicial -- the current idea of judicial ethics.
There are African-American judges sit on discrimination cases all the time. Catholic judges sit on cases about the separation of church and state.
You know, Donald Trump seems to have the idea that La Raza -- there are actually two La Raza organizations. One is in fact an advocacy group for immigration rights but that's not the one that this judge is a member of. He is a member of a La Raza which is simply an organization of, you know, Hispanic judges and lawyers that advocates for just sort of -- it's more a social organization. Like there are Jewish lawyers' organizations, Catholic lawyers' organizations.
It is certainly not a conflict of interest. So, you know, Donald Trump can say what he wants, but what he's saying about this judge is completely wrong under all of the current rules of ethics.
COOPER: The idea that any judge because of his parents, I guess were from Mexico or were immigrants or was of any ethnicity recusing himself or not being able to rule on or oversee a case. I mean that's just -- that's unheard of in this country isn't it?
TOOBIN: It is completely unheard off. It has never been the law, it has never been obligatory or even suggested for judges who share an ethnic heritage with one party in the case of having to recuse themselves.
It's completely contrary to the idea of what we expect of judges which is to be neutral arbiters and able to put aside their background.
If that were the case, we would have recusals in practically every case because every judge is a member of some religion or racial group and that often comes up in cases. So what Trump is suggesting about this judge is not the law at all and never has been.
COOPER: Jeff, stay on the line. I want to bring in the rest of the panel. BET's Marc Lamont Hill. Senior Political Analyst, David Gergen. Trump supporter, Kayleigh McEnany. Conservative Trump critic, Tara Setmayer and Joseph Borelli, the Trump New York campaign co-chair.
Joseph, I mean it clearly seems Donald Trump has conflated La Raza, the activist group with a Latino lawyers' organization that also happens to use the name La Raza.
JOSEPH BORELLI, CO-CHAIR DONALD TRUMP NY CAMPAIGN: Yeah, if he did, maybe that's an opportunity to want the comments back, I don't know. But let's look ...
COOPER: But it wasn't just that -- those -- that part of it.
COOPER: It was bringing up the Mexican heritage.
BORELLI: But certainly not something I would say. I like to think Judge Curiel can act impartially, I'm optimistic that's the case. But we were talking backstage earlier. The bigger picture is that the Trump campaign has lost an opportunity tonight that would otherwise be focused on bashing Hillary Clinton on foreign policy things.
And I think this is sort of a part of the problem when Donald Trump speaks a little bit off the cuff is that you get interference on nights that would otherwise be a victory for him.
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, TRUMP SUPPORTER: But Donald Trump has also mentioned he thinks that this judge is bias because that he did not dismiss the case at summary judgment. He has a very fair point there.
This one lawsuit in California is based on a RICO Statute. It's a historic expansion of the statute, in my opinion as just having graduated from Harvard Law, Donald Trump's lawyers' opinions as well, they should have been dismissed because basically what they're saying is that Trump University was a criminal enterprise engaging in racketeering just because there are some students who were upset by this. To me it's a very fair legal argument.
COOPER: Jeff let me ask you about that. Should it -- shouldn't it be -- or the judge have -- given some objection?
TOOBIN: Well, these are two separate issues. One is was he correct to dismiss the case on summary judgment? You know, every litigant who moves for summary judgment thinks that he or she is right. The judge disagreed.
[21:10:05] You know, people can -- you know, we will have an argument about whether that's a correct decision. As far as I can tell there's disputed evidence in this case so that's why we don't have summary judgment, that's why we move cases to allow juries to decide, you know, whose evidence is more credible, but that's a completely separate issue from whether the judge has a form of bias that requires recuse himself.
You know whether it should be dismissed for summary judgment, you know, that's the thing lawyers argue about. But whether he has bias requiring him to recuse himself that's not even a close question and the judge is right and Trump is wrong.
COOPER: And again, David is bias according to Trump based on the fact that he is of Mexican descent.
DAVID GERGEN, FORMER PRESIDENTIAL ADVISER TO REAGAN, FORD, CLINTON & NIXON: That's the heart of the problem as becoming increasingly clear that Donald Trump's problem is not what he says but what he thinks. And periodically what he thinks comes to the surface. And like it's alarming.
And, you know, its, it's disturbing because I think that he has so much responsibility now. As a standard barrier for one of our major parties and the rest of the world is looking at this and making judgments of what kind of country we are and what kind of leadership we're going to exhibit. You know, I have to say, you know, Hillary Clinton gave a speech today about why he is unfit and he walked right into her trap. I mean he just here like raised the question all over again. I don't understand why he went there. You know ...
COOPER: The other question and what message does it send to everybody of Mexican heritage ...
COOPER: ... who is listening or in the United States thinking about whether or not to vote for Donald Trump if the candidate believes that if you're Mexican heritage, you have an inherent bias against somebody who has to beliefs Donald Trump has.
MARC LAMONT HILL, HOST BET NEWS: Exactly, first it's a logical policy I mean it implies that no Mexican can agree with his position on the wall. Because you can be Mexican and I actually agree with Donald Trump.
COOPER: Right and his actually made that point a number of times he said there is many people agree with him.
HILL: Right. But we see now by birth of being Mexican he can agree with me and therefore its care at the (inaudible). So it's -- the logic isn't there. But to me it also of course it sends an awful message to Mexican-American. And so Latino-Americans to all Americans really of any race or color because he is dividing again.
But more deeply, it speaks to a question of temperament and impulse control. But to your point he -- this was a potential victory. I think Hillary Clinton did a wonderful job breaking him down on foreign policy, so I think it was an entire victory. But at least had an opportunity to rebut, to rejoin, to critic Hillary Clinton's foreign policy which she opened herself for up for by having this conversation.
But instead of doing that his is now going to -- he have to defend himself for indefensible comments that shows a lack of judgment, a lack of political discipline and like you said but there's something inside of Donald Trump that he can't control even.
MCENANY: Here is one point of the hypocrisy to be made here. You know, we all sit on this panel and I heard over and over again that because Donald Trump wants to build a wall, he is therefore isolating the whole of the Hispanic community. The premise underlying that thought is that all of the Hispanic community is against building the wall. That's an insult to me as a very racial racist way of thinking.
COOPER: But wait, isn't what Donald Trump just said?
TARA SETMAYER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes.
MCENANY: No, and that's my point though because people on this panel have sat here and said because of someone's heritage they're never going to vote for Donald Trump because of the wall. So yes Donald Trump is using the same logic.
MCENANY: I heard other people use ...
HILL: But, that's not the argue.
MCENANY: I'm not referring to Marc in particular, I'm referring to many other people in this panel. I said time and time again.
BORELLI: The way before.
MCENANY: It's the same part panel speaking and it is the same idea that people because of their race they are going to vote a certain way because of a particular issue, the notion ...
COOPER: But again, but again.
SETMAYER: But he plan. He is the one that is categorizing things this way. He has set the conversation with this premise. And that is destructive. You know this is something again that you could probably.
COOPER: So, could you say that that's a racist idea, so your saying what Donald Trump said tonight is racist?
MCENANY: I said it had racial undertones that way of thinking.
COOPER: And you say what Donald Trump be set (inaudible) racial undertone.
MCENANY: Because Donald Trump is embracing the same liberal thoughts pattern we spend on here, I do think that is not inappropriate comment to make, I don't think it's appropriate ...
COOPER: So, OK, so what has, what Donald Trump said has racial undertones? Your saying?
MCENANY: No. I'm not saying that.
COOPER: Well you said, when liberals, when you claim that when liberals said that about the wall that has racial undertones but Donald Trump is just said is exactly that.
MCENANY: He is taking the same exact pattern of thinking. People have said on this network ...
COOPER: Which has racial undertone.
MCENANY: ... kind of repeating it. But my point is everyone is fine with it when a liberal says it on this panel. But when Donald Trump said and of all sudden people have a problem but there is it ...
COOPER: I don't know who the hypothetical is -- it's a little hard to argue because you're arguing about a hypothetical liberal ...
SETMAYER: That's right.
COOPER: ... who's not here or not here.
MCENANY: I'm making the point ...
SETMAYER: Donald Trump's liberal.
MCENANY: ... and every time someone says on the panel ...
COOPER: OK, right.
MCENANY: ... going forward, every time someone says on this panel going forward that because Donald Trump wants to build a wall he's isolating the whole of the Hispanic community, that has to be called out the same way.
HILL: And the argument is that.
HILL: The argument is not because he wants to build a wall. Although we could argue about that. The argument is why he wants to build the wall. He said things about Mexican being violent, being dangerous that the whole rapist's, the controversy and the concern that he is alienating any time.
[21:15:07] Is that mean that everybody who's Mexicans going to vote against Donald Trump. But it means a particular political moves he made -- makes might alienate a group of people. It doesn't mean everyone is not going to vote for him, but it's about how he cascade it to the entire race of people. That's not the same argument that's happening right now and I'm baffled as how you think it is.
MCENANY: It is the same argument ...
HILL: How so?
MCENANY: ... that has been made over and over and over again.
HILL: But what ...
GERGEN: What is you're ...
MCENANY: That because ...
HILL: What's the argument?
MCENANY: The argument I've heard, time and time again, everyone's heard it and to me it's completely wishful thinking to say that, that argument hasn't been made.
HILL: What is ...
GERGEN: What's the argument?
MCENANY: When Donald Trump wants to build a wall, therefore, he is isolating the whole of the Hispanic community. That is false. And what you are doing ...
GERGEN: Wait a second.
MCENANY: ... you're saying is higher ...
GERGEN: Wait a second, that's not what started this.
MCENANY: ... agrees on an issue.
GERGEN: That's not what started this.
MCENANY: Because that's what we do in politics. We typify certain groups ...
MCENANY: ... say, this is the way it all, all of the right thing. It's the racial way of thinking.
GERGEN: This started when he declared his candidacy for the presidency and talked about Mexicans as being ...
MCENANY: He's not.
GERGEN: ... by being rapist.
MCENANY: He's not.
GERGEN: And then he said ...
MCENANY: He said when that's the question?
GERGEN: Hold on. He was the one who went after Mexicans to start with. He then talked about a wall. He's talked about various things since that. He -- if he isolates people out and treats it that way, of course, on this panels we're going to look out and say, "What's your reaction within the Hispanic community? What -- how were they thinking?" And we know right now that 80 percent of the Hispanic community disapproves of him. So, that's a very important political fact. And if you think we have to shut down that conversation, I'm sorry, I disagree with that.
MCENANY: Is it -- this is where specificity matters. And we can say that he said all Mexicans are criminals and rapist. But that is exactly not true. He said, "When Mexico sends people," those three words are very important, much like you will send people during the ...
COOPER: By the way, there's no evidence Mexico has send people.
MCENANY: There's not. But my point ...
SETMAYER: They don't send them back.
MCENANY: He says -- OK, we cannot laugh -- let's get of the fact ...
MCENANY: If Donald Trump says that he's talked to border agents who have told him that, that sign if he has those facts. My point is to simplify ...
COOPER: But just for the record, I mean, I've talked to people who are in charge of the border patrol and current -- I've talked to former attorney generals, they say categorically there's absolutely no evidence ...
MCENANY: The point I'm making ...
COOPER: ... on what Donald Trump says.
MCENANY: I'm not talking about advocacy of that claim. What I'm talking about is it is unfair to say Donald Trump called all Mexicans criminals and rapists. It's just not true.
GERGEN: But nobody said that.
MCENANY: He says all ...
GERGEN: But he raised it in his -- he phrased the question of ...
MCENANY: He said, when Mexico send people ...
MCENANY: So we cannot simplify ...
GERGEN: And if he wants to build a huge wall ...
MCENANY: We cannot simplify those things.
GERGEN: But he justifies the wall based on the fact that he claims they're sending a lot of criminals and rapists here.
MCENANY: The fact are ...
GERGEN: That is just ...
MCENANY: ... there are criminal and -- criminals and rapists who have gotten across their border and killed people like Kate Steinle out in California. This is happening time and time again.
HILL: But that's a different argument. But there's a consistent pattern here, right, from, again, as David said from the beginning of his candidacy, it, in many ways hinged on a certain kind of xenophobic impulse among voters in his rhetoric. And then as we moved throughout this, we watched it when they ban Muslims and that -- and we try to walk that back ...
MCENANY: Again, no specificity there. Temporary ban on non-U.S. citizen Muslims until we isolate ...
HILL: That's not what he said in the clip that we just showed the clip, maybe we can run it later.
MCENANY: And he said until we isolate the problems so you left that part out.
HILL: But the problem is terrorism. So we say, "No Muslims can come into the country until we isolate the problem of terrorism."
MCENANY: Marc, OK.
COOPER: Hold on. We just take -- everybody take a breath. We're going to take a break. We'll be right back with that more ahead.
[21:21:41] COOPER: We've been having a passionate conversation about the latest comments Donald Trump made, telling "The Wall Street Journal" this evening that the judge in the lawsuit involving the so- called Trump University has a conflict of interest because of his Mexican heritage and his membership in a Latino lawyers association.
Back with the panel continuing the discussion. I'm not sure where to really pick it up. But it is clear, I mean and we were making this error here until terrorist really the one that pointed out, La Raza which is an activist organization which Trump supporter say the behind some of the protest that is different than the lawyers organization that this judge and clearly -- at again we'll have to wait to hear from Donald Trump but it seems like releasing this "Wall Street Journal" article he has conflated those two organizations and then on top of that he is placed the idea that there's an inherent, this judge who his picture we're showing as an inhering conflict of interest because of his Mexican heritage grow up in Indiana.
SETMAYER: Yeah. I mean the fact that we're even having this conversation about a presidential candidate of a major party is what is so dismaying for so many Americans. That's why I am a never Trumper, that's why so many conservatives are concerned about this, that's we're looking at this, how irresponsible and reckless is this individual.
And Hillary Clinton and God help me, I never my life thought that I would agree with so much of what Hillary Clinton said in one speech, but that is the narrative that Hillary Clinton and the Democrat will exploit from now until November and independent voters who are not primary voters, who are more partisan but Independent voters are going to stand back and look at the choice. This is just so ...
MCENANY: The fact that we ...
SETMAYER: No, your logic was nonsense five minutes ago so we're not going about that I mean ...
COOPER: Let Kayleigh respond. Let her respond.
MCENANY: The Quinnipiac polls, so Donald Trump winning more independence than Hillary Clinton and the fact there you say that no conservatives are for Donald Trump and in fact ...
MCENANY: Well, in fact 80 percent ...
SETMAYER: Words matter.
MCENANY: ... of Republican voters in that poll 14 days ago support Trump not only that ...
COOPER: Let her finish. Let Kayleigh finish. Tara, Tara let Kayleigh finish.
SETMAYER: I simply don't think that's true but and he go back, and look it up.
MCENANY: Anyway so, and also in the Quinnipiac poll, not only does Donald Trump win Independents but he wins more Democrats than Hillary Clinton wins Republicans.
SETMAYER: Snapshot in time for right now. As you build today was the beginning of an entire new campaign from Hillary Clinton and what the Democrats are going to do. So when you see that poll in a couple of months.
COOPER: Right, you could also point out. You could also just point just in terms of accuracy, in terms of that poll Donald Trump is the presumptive nominee for the Republican Party, that poll reflects that. Now, the Democratic side, he has still got Bernie Sanders ...
MCENANY: That's true but, pairs the idea that all independents are going to wake up. Independents have been watching Donald Trump.
SETMAYER: No, they will
MCENANY: From months and months and months.
COOPER: That's a fair argue -- that's the point and we (inaudible) these couple of things going on right now. We still have Jeff Toobin. I want to go to the second but we also are waiting. Donald Trump is actually remarks tonight. I think it's with the San Jose. In San Jose, I'm not sure if he's going to address this. There's a large crowd obviously waiting for him in there listening to, you can't always get what you want.
I believe that's the song (inaudible) right now. But -- and Jeff Toobin I mean again, for those who are just joining us, let's just kind of take a breath. In this "Wall Street Journal" article, Donald Trump had said that in fact let me get the -- David can take that.
[21:25:10] COOPER: And I just want to read this paragraph from the "Wall Street Journal" article, it said in an interview, Mr. Trump said, U.S. District Judge Gonzalo Curiel had, "an absolute conflict' in presiding over the litigation given that he was of 'Mexican heritage' and a member of a Latino lawyers' association."
"Mr. Trump said the background of the judge, who was born in Indiana to Mexican immigrants, was relevant because of his campaign stance against illegal immigration and his pledged to seal southern U.S. border, 'I'm building a wall.' It's an inherent conflict of interest."
In a situation like this, a judge normally doesn't come out and defend himself. A judge is usually just remains silent in a case like this, right?
TOOBIN: That's right. I mean that the rule on the recusal motion, they either recuse themselves, but if they consult toward the case or they don't. But usually they don't write an opinion while on -- explaining that decision. But this is such an easy case. This is not a close case ...
COOPER: Explain why you think it's an easy case.
TOOBIN: Because there are two points to Trump races. One is the membership in his organization. Trump appears to have recused a one La Raza, which is indeed an activist organization that has been very critical of Donald Trump and its very pro-immigration rights.
The judge is not a member of that organization. He is a member of a different organization also called La Raza, which is a fraternal organization of lawyers in California of Hispanic heritage, which is a perfectly ordinary and familiar group.
Many Catholic lawyers are involved with Catholic organizations, Jewish lawyers with Jewish organizations. They are Italian-American lawyers' organizations. They are ethnic pride groups. They are not advocacy groups. They do not under any theory represent a conflict of interest.
And especially that Trump's second point is particularly furnished (ph) than outrageous, which is simply the fact that he is of Mexican heritage means he should recuse himself. It is been established law for decades that African-American judges can hear discrimination cases involving African-Americans, Catholic and Jewish justices can hear claims about separation of church and state.
The ethnicity of the judge is not in and of itself a ground for recusal ever. And that is a claim that Trump under the First Amendment is certainly allowed to make, but it is completely wrong under the law.
COOPER: We got to take a quick break as we wait Donald Trump speaking tonight. There's a lot more to talk about. Will he address the issue? We'll look at that and yet more revelations in the class action lawsuit at the heart of this about Trump's role in the so- called university bearing his name.
Details that could make a big difference in this case.
[21:31:35] COOPER: Well, the breaking news tonight in an interview with "The Wall Street Journal," Donald Trump is ramping up his attacks tonight against Judge Gonzalo Curiel who is presiding over two civil lawsuits against Trump University or so-called university. A third lawsuit is being led by New York's Attorney General. Earlier today Trump tweeted, "After the litigation is disposed of and the case won I have instructed my execs to open Trump U so much interest in it! I will be pres." That was it.
All three lawsuits contend the Trump University took an estimated $40 million, but it was mired in fraud and deception. Now, one of the key issues concerns Trump's actual involvement in the now defunct program and how it stacks up against the sales pitch, what he actually claimed.
Tonight, newly released documents shed some more light on that. Here's our Senior Investigative Correspondent Drew Griffin.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY KING, "LARRY KING LIVE" HOST: Do you think that you can teach (inaudible) wealthy?
DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Absolutely.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORREPONDENT: The president of Trump University appearing with Donald Trump himself on Larry King Live in 2006 when they are joint business was just getting under way.
A newly release depositions show it was Sexton who controlled almost all aspects of the school, except one crucial area, how it was marketed, promoted and advertised. The very heart of the lawsuits against Donald Trump's now shuttered real estate seminar business, the business he promoted.
TRUMP: Well, that these are all people they are hand-picked by me.
GRIFFIN: It's one of the allegations of the lawsuit. That statement made by Donald Trump the potential students was a lie to and now we know who approved that line.
Michael Sexton stated just that in a sworn deposition made public. "Any time we had a new ad, Sexton said about Trump, we would discuss it. Why did he want to be involved in reviewing and approving the advertisements?" Sexton was asked, he, Trump, wanted to see how his brand and image were portrayed in Trump University marketing materials."
ERIC SCHNEIDERMAN, NEW YORK ATTORNEY GENERAL: Trump was a pitch man.
GRIFFIN: Eric Schneiderman, the Attorney General of New York suing Trump and his university says everything about the marketing Donald Trump approved was a scam.
SCHNEIDERMAN: He made these videos to lure people in who thought this guy is a successful real estate entrepreneur, or I could benefit from his knowledge, but it was the pitch very much was focused around on my hand-picked experts will teach you my personal secrets, copy what I've done and you'll get rich. GRIFFIN: That pitch that Trump personal involvement is what lured George Hanus to Trump University, too. He thought Trump University would involve, well, Donald Trump.
GEORGE HANUS, TRUMP UNIVERSITY STUDENT: And instead of Donald there was a video screen, you know, a projector screen. So they projected a little movie that had Donald on it. And he introduced the people that we were going to be hearing talk that afternoon.
GRIFFIN: By name?
HANUS: No, he just said these are people that I have picked myself.
GRIFFIN: There's a good reason Donald Trump never named those people. It's all right here in this deposition from December when Donald Trump admitted he could not remember a single name, not one of the instructors at Trump University.
The actual instruction, the courses were left to Michael Sexton who told Larry King a decade ago, Trump University was all his idea.
MICHAEL SEXTON, CO-FOUNDER OF TRUMP UNIVERSITY: I met Mr. Trump and pitched the idea and it was something that I think he really captured his imagination.
KING: He came to you?
TRUMP: He did and he has done an amazing job. Michael has done -- I've known Michael over the years. He was a very smart guy. He loves the whole internet deal and he loves education.
[21:35:04] GRIFFIN: Now that both men are being sued, the story is a little different, again under oath just this past December, Trump revealed he not only didn't know instructors, he knew very little about his own university's president. He called Sexton more of an educational person. Asked if he knew if Sexton ever ran a school before, Trump answered, that I don't. It's too long ago. I don't remember.
Records show Michael Sexton, the president of Trump University has spent almost his entire career in business and consulting. Not education and not real estate..
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: And let's talk about back with our panel as we continue to wait Donald Trump, actually making comments tonight to see if he's responding to this latest interview. He gave to "The Wall Street Journal" and which he said that the Mexican heritage of the judge in this case is an inherent conflict for him to oversee the case.
Jeff Toobin, just in terms of what this case really hinges on, I mean, the idea if it's proven Donald Trump did in fact lie, that he says he hand-picked those professors, and associate professors, and not sure, it is fair to call them professors, but the people who were teaching the courses that he hand-picked them and in fact according to depositions did not do that, is that a crucial piece of this case?
TOOBIN: It's an important part of (inaudible) the case. You know, fraud requires intent to deceive, so in order to prove that Trump committed fraud, the plaintiffs in this case would only have to prove that what he said to -- in the marketing material was false, they have to prove he has in fact, evil intent, that he intended to deceive prospective students in order to get their money. So Trump's state of mind will be very important to determine in this case. And I think based on the evidence that's come out, it's not clear what Trump's state of mind is and that's why the judge ordered a trial because that's the kind of fact that a jury will ultimately be required to determine.
COOPER: So just because he may -- at least on the face it appears to have lied, saying he hand-picked them when in fact he didn't, that doesn't go to whether or not he was intentionally tried to commit fraud? Because when that inherently mean that -- I mean he was trying to fool people to take these courses, believing that these teachers were more than they really were or that he was involved in it more than he really was?
TOOBIN: If that is the case that he made that false statement, that would certainly be a bad piece of evidence regarding his intent to deceive and this in fact deception of students but, you know, I am reluctant to say that one piece of evidence ...
TOOBIN: ... would turn the whole case. You know, this will be, if it's goes to trial complicated case with lots of evidence, if that's true, with a bad fact for Trump. But, you know, I'm not prepared to sit here and convict Donald Trump of fraud ...
TOOBIN: ... based on one fact.
COOPER: And Jeff, why does Donald Trump continue to say he doesn't settle cases? I mean, it's a point he made repeatedly on the campaign trail saying if he start to settle, then other people come after you. I mean, just a cursory look at a number of lawsuits against him, he has settled, I mean routinely settles cases.
TOOBIN: He settles cases, and all business people make a rational decision about whether the cost of a lawsuit is worth, you know, may be it's worth just to settle rather than pay the cost of lawyers and the risk of a loss.
I mean, I think its macho posture. I don't think there's any alternative explanation. It's that if he want companies, just part of his brand. He thinks that never settling a lot to -- is indicative of his self-confident and his toughness, it just happens not to be true.
COOPER: David how much of a problem do you think this is for Trump between now and Election Day?
GERGEN: I don't think we know at this point. He got a break and the trial was put off until after the election.
GERGEN: So, he's not going to be on the stand testifying under oath. But I do think that we have enough now we know. So a lot of this is going to be just expectations were going to be and we have had different arguments about whether he mislead people or did not. You know, supporters were on CNN last night, making an entirely different case to defend him.
GERGEN: And I think, you have, you have to weigh those things against each other. What I do think though, Anderson, is he is going to be subjected to an intensive amount of scrutiny from a mainstream press between now and November and the question going to be become, do his general practices, the general business practices, are they as injurious to him as the e-mail controversy has been to Hillary Clinton. And I don't think we know the answer to that question.
[21:40:05] MCENANY: There something, in terms that Bill Clinton has a university of his own. It's called Laureate University which she was chancellor of it and Donald Trump will bring this up, it will completely mute the Trump University case. Because it turns out this university he was chancellor of actually one of the colleges in Chile lost its accreditation. It's the largest foreign profit college company in the world. 84 percent a bit abroad that's probably why it hasn't gotten the money
HILL: There's a fundamental difference between losing accreditation in a class action suit for fraud.
MCENANY: The same university is high pressure tactics uses soon
HILL: No, no but its
COOPER: We got to take a break, I'm sorry. We just got this in.
Up next, Donald Trump finally getting House Speaker Paul Ryan's endorsement. We'll talk about that also. We'll be right back.
COOPER: Before making headlines we're seeing some controversial Donald Trump collected the endorsement of someone who had been withholding his endorsing apart because of some of the controversial things he'd said. Today House Speaker Paul Ryan give writing in his hometown Wisconsin paper saying quote, "It's no secret he and I have our differences. I won't pretend otherwise. And when I feel the need to, I'll continue to speak my mind. But the reality is on the issues that make up our agenda, we have more common ground than disagreement."
We actually now from Wisconsin Radio Talks Show Host, Supporter Speaker Ryan and a sharp critic of Donald Trump, we should point out Charlie Sykes. He joins us tonight.
[21:45:01] Charlie, good to have you on the program. Again, first I want to get your reaction to Trump's comments in "The Wall Street Journal," this evening reiterating criticism of the judge in the Trump so-called University case, now saying the judge in the case in a quote, "inherent conflict of interest", and quote "because he is a Mexican heritage."
CHARLIE SYKES, EDITOR IN CHIEF RIGHTWISCONSIN.COM: Yes, this is what's really been trusting about Donald Trump and really about the time, you know, Paul Ryan's endorsement. Which is -- this comes (inaudible) Trump's to behaving badly. I mean, you have him lashing out at other Republican including Mitt Romney, this very personalized racialized attack against the judge presiding over his fraud case.
The other kinds (inaudible) at the reporters were trying to do their jobs and so that's what makes Paul Ryan's timing I think so disappointing here that, it seems less than negotiation and really have to negotiated surrender by the speaker.
COOPER: How big of a problem do you think this is for Trump to answer the GOP who obviously needs to do better with the Latino voters and there's also the fact that Trump appears to have conflated too groups that both used the word, La Raza in their name?
SYKES: Yeah, well this is, you know, in -- especially given the argument that lack conservatives are hearing that you -- we need to support Donald Trump because of the importance of the Supreme Court. This whole story raises question about his respect for the independent judiciary, his respect for that branch of government and I think it is a little alarming. I mean, "Washington Post" talks about how people are -- in a legal community are kind of back when they're feels thinking about, what does this say about a man that might be President of United States if he does not have the kind of respect for the judiciary.
You know, I mean understand that rules are different for Donald Trump but here is somebody who has shown no willingness to step back and say look, what is appropriate and what is not appropriate to use for the use of the bully pulpit as a presidential candidate. But it is alarming. And you mentioned the Hispanic element, you know, as Jeffrey Toobin was saying there's no legal basis for calling out someone because of their ethnicity, and the fact that Donald Trump persists with this indicates that this going to be a huge problem, not just for Republicans but for Republicans who now have decided that they're going to join themselves the hip with him.
COOPER: And it was interesting, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell said today on CNN that he is concerned Trump could do to the GOP with Hispanics what Goldwater did to the GOP with African- Americans essentially alienate them for decades. SYKES: Yeah well it's, you know, and so Mitch McConnell is just now figuring this out? Well, I understand why Paul Ryan is doing what he is doing. He basically made it clear that he is not endorsing Donald Trump. He is not embracing Trumpism. He is betting Donald Trump will support his agenda. But here's the thing and, you know, in terms of the art of the deal, there's no assurance that Donald Trump is going to modify his behavior, moderate his behavior. And I think it's very naive and maybe unusual on the part of Republican leaders thinking that somehow you're going to see a new Donald Trump. But the Donald Trump you're seeing right now will be different from The Donald Trump everybody going to see in November or in the Oval Office. I think that's naive.
COOPER: And Trump himself said that in a press conference the other day. He said, look, this is the way it's going to be, this is what it is. Charlie, it's good to have on. Charlie Sykes, thanks.
Up next, with Donald Trump is now speaking at the event in San Jose, California. We are obviously monitoring it to see if he makes any comments about the judge or his comments to "The Wall Street Journal" or even Hillary Clinton.
We'll continue to monitor this and take a quick break.
[21:51:59] COOPER: We are monitoring the Trump rally in San Jose witness if he -- if it mentioned his remarks on the "Wall Street Journal" about the judge in the Trump University case or Hillary Clinton's scathing attacks on this fitness in her view to be President.
Right now today's other big piece of news, a medical examiner's report confirming what had been feared for weeks now about the death of Prince an opioid overdose. The toxicology reports that Prince died of an accidental overdose of fentanyl which he administered to himself. It's not just an opioid you could say it's the opioids stronger than morphine stronger than heroin.
Now that the cause of death had been confirmed, Prince becomes the latest celebrity face of a deadly epidemic in the United States. Joining me now is addiction specialist Dr. Drew Pinsky.
You suspected opioid play the role in Prince dead. You say -- you surprised to hear it was fentanyl?
DR. DREW PINSKY, HOST "DR. DREW": Actually I was Anderson thanks for asking that question because fentanyl is a very powerful opioid and it's not one that is typically prescribe. It something it was designed to be used for cancer patients and end-of-life issues. And when people get into trouble, my patients when they get into trouble with fentanyl, they adulterate the usual delivery systems. What I mean is ...
COOPER: Like crushing it or snorting into something? PINSKY: No, it's given in a patch it's a patch that you put on your skin and it stay there is for three days or slow your livers or a believe it or not a lollipop. So in order for them to get the high doses, they open the patches and suck down the contents, it goes through the cheek membrane that way or they shoot it.
Now the fact that they say there are two clues, again, this is an incomplete report but there you have to read between the lines. One is that there were toxic levels it's almost impossible to get toxic levels from the usual delivery systems. He had to have adulterate it had system in some way, number one.
And then number two, you look at what happened to him that night he fell down in an elevator, probably couldn't get up and probable stopped breathing. That's very high levels of a medication and you have to wonder, they say self-administered. What exactly he was doing.
COOPER: And I understand fentanyl -- I mean its lead to a surge in overdoses in the U.S. what -- I mean I've read it's like 50 times more powerful than heroin. Is that possible?
PINSKY: No of course it is, but we use very, very small doses right Anderson. When we're using it in a prescription basis, and again the delivery systems are very slow low level release. It's when people get their hands on it and start adulterating how they administer it. The real problem is it gets sold as heroin. And so when these kids or even not such young people are adjusting their dosing, they think they're using heroin they give themselves too much, that an easy way to overdose intervenously.
COOPER: After Prince died you said you suspected benzodiazepines combined with opioids ...
COOPER: ... could have been involved in causing Prince to stop breathing. Do you still think that could be the cause of death?
PINSKY: I still do -- I still 70 percent of opioid death are in the setting of combination with benzodiazepines. That is the deadly combination -- again we don't have complete toxicology, all we have is there are very high levels fentanyl we don't know whether or not there were other things involved here.
COOPER: So what else would you want to see from an autopsy report?
PINSKY: I want to see for instance what are the conditions of his hips? Did he really have a hip problem? What we hear there was a scar in his hip which suggests to me he may have actually had a hip surgery and I'm going to bet that that's where this problem really got started.
[21:55:06] Number two, I want the complete toxicology report that is going to make a big difference in how we figure out what went on here and finally, I hate to say it, but I want to know whether there were track marks. If this indeed was intervene as use of fentanyl, that throw this condition this problem for Prince out into an entirely different light.
COOPER: You were part of the town hall that we had, that we're discussing America's addiction essentially to painkillers. You believe doctors are overprescribing, and we don't know yet if Prince had an actual prescription for fentanyl and other drugs but if he did would the doctor who prescribed these drugs be responsible or partly responsible?
PINSKY: I would humbly think so. I mean you pointed out at that town hall meeting that we have 5 percent of the world's population we consume 80 percent of the opioids on earth. It's an unbelievable excess that we participate in. And fentanyl is a medication that was designed, again, for end-of-life and cancer, the fact that we have a young healthy male taking high amounts of fentanyl. If it is prescribed by a physician that is as bizarre as a young healthy male getting propofol from a physician.
COOPER: But you could get it on the streets I mean you can buy it -- you can get it illegally if you have contacts?
PINSKY: You can but typically that's a powder form. There have been reports of a pill form they take sublingually, but again, you can't get toxic levels of that. It leads to me to suggest that I think he might have been opening those packets and eating it and that's where things really got out of hand.
COOPER: That's awful to think about Dr. Drew, appreciate you being with us. We'll be right back.
COOPER: Busy night indeed that does it for us. Thanks for watching. "CNN Tonight" with Don Lemon starts now.
[22:00:07] DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news indeed a big night on the campaign trail. Dueling events in the battle for California, looking live at Donald Trump's event, that's in San Jose. Bernie Sanders in Chico and --