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Baton Rouge Investigation; Trump Campaign Accused of Plagiarizing Michelle Obama. Aired 15-15:30p ET

Aired July 19, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:23]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Top of the hour. Here we are in the great state of Ohio, live in Cleveland. I'm Brooke Baldwin. You're watching CNN's special live coverage, day two of the Republican National Convention.

Folks, just in a couple of hours will be the moment Donald Trump has been waiting for since he announced his bid 13 months ago. The delegates here in Cleveland will officially nominate him to be president of the United States.

So let's not lose track of what's happening today.

Meantime, though, this campaign highlight is a bit overshadowed by accusations of plagiarism. Parts of the convention speech that his wife, Melania, gave before millions and millions of people last night were basically identical to what Michelle Obama had said in her speech at the DNC eight years ago.

Trump's campaign chairman repeatedly insisting today there was no plagiarism in Mrs. Trump's speech, that the campaign will not fire, will not discipline any staffer for her words.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHELLE OBAMA, FIRST LADY: Barack and I were raised with so many of the same values.

MELANIA TRUMP, WIFE OF DONALD TRUMP: From a young age, my parents impressed on me the values.

OBAMA: You work hard for what you want in life.

TRUMP: That you work hard for what you want in life.

OBAMA: That your word is your bond, that you do what you say you're going to do.

TRUMP: That your word is your bond and you do what you say and keep your promise.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Let's begin with Sarah Huckabee Sanders, senior adviser to the Trump campaign.

It's so nice to finally see you in person. Welcome.

SARAH HUCKABEE SANDERS, SENIOR TRUMP CAMPAIGN ADVISER: Thank you. Great to be here.

BALDWIN: All right, Melania's speech, would you agree it is plagiarism?

HUCKABEE SANDERS: I would agree that she did an incredible job last night.

I think that it is very sad that we lost -- there were so many great things, that we're focusing on about 12 words out of many thousand words. And I think we should go back and look at the overall thing. She did a great job. And that's what I think that we should be talking about today.

BALDWIN: She did. She did. She did.

But I do have to ask these questions because there are overarching themes I think that people are wondering about with regard to the Trump campaign. Do you know whose eyes were on that speech?

HUCKABEE SANDERS: I don't. My guess is quite a few. In any pass thing, you have a lot of people that go through many drafts. And so I would imagine -- but I know that the heart and soul of this speech was Melania.

BALDWIN: She said to Matt Lauer that she wrote it. Let's take her at her word and say she did. And I also understand from Trump folks that she is a fan of Michelle Obama. It is possible that she would have watched the speech for inspiration. I don't know.

HUCKABEE SANDERS: She is an incredibly brilliant person. She has an incredible memory. She speaks five languages. It wouldn't be surprising to me that she reads this, writes down notes.

Somebody else helps compile those notes and that lands in there. But, again, I think the bigger picture that we're missing is everything else that she said.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Before we get on to that, do you think, though, that someone should be disciplined for this?

HUCKABEE SANDERS: I think if we're going to talk about disciplining people and firing people, let's go back to Hillary Clinton. Of all the people that should have been fired in the last month...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: But we're not talking about Hillary Clinton. And I appreciate that. I appreciate that.

(CROSSTALK)

HUCKABEE SANDERS: But we should be.

BALDWIN: But everyone last night was, and that is a huge unifying force among Republicans.

But we're talking about Melania Trump, and do you think someone should -- the axe should fall?

HUCKABEE SANDERS: Look, again, I think that if Melania wrote the speech, I think it was a really good moment for her. And I hate that this is what the focus is. If they are going to punish somebody, I guess if somebody specifically purposefully took something, then, yes, that person should be punished.

BALDWIN: So, then, when Paul Manafort was on this morning talking to Chris Cuomo, and Chris was asking him about this, he then brought up Hillary Clinton and said, well, this is just Hillary Clinton -- this is what happens when Hillary Clinton is attacked or is threatened by a woman.

Why is bringing...

(CROSSTALK)

HUCKABEE SANDERS: Well, the media does love to create distractions.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: But he's the one who brought up Hillary Clinton. I'm the media and I didn't bring up Hillary Clinton. He brought up Hillary Clinton. Explain that to me.

HUCKABEE SANDERS: Well, everybody's jumping on -- again, she had about a half-dozen to a dozen words out of several thousand. And that's the only thing we're talking about today.

And everybody's ignoring everything else that took place.

BALDWIN: But do you think that is the campaign's fault?

I agree with you. And, by the way, I thought it was a great night for the RNC. Lots of...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: ... speeches, feeling it in there. It was strong. But at the end, the coup de grace, the big Mrs. Trump speech, it's unfortunately today diluting the message.

HUCKABEE SANDERS: And, again, I agree with you. I think that it's very unfortunate that that is the focus of today.

And I hope, as we move in tonight, we focus on making America work again and the new theme of the day and the speakers tonight and kind of transition from this being all that we're talking about. [15:05:02]

I think at the end of the day, people in America care a whole lot more about the issues that we're going to talk about tonight than a couple dozen words from Melania Trump speech last night.

I think they want to know, are they going to have a job? Are their kids going to have a job when they graduate from college? Is there going to be a good education? Are they going to be safe? That's what people care about. They don't care what about what we're all talking about and what we have spent all day talking about. They want to know those bigger issues.

And so I hope that we will quickly transition over to that and make that the focus moving forward.

BALDWIN: Final question on Queen and the big entrance from Mr. Trump and the smoke and the "We Are the Champions." The band has said please don't play our song. They have said this in the past. They have said it now in the wake of last night. Are you guys going to keep playing that song?

HUCKABEE SANDERS: That's a question you will have to ask much higher than my pay grade.

But I thought it was a pretty fun moment that only Donald Trump could pull off. If John McCain or Mitt Romney had tried to do that on opening night in the previous conventions, I don't think it would have gone as well. But it was a pretty electrifying moment.

BALDWIN: How does he top that Thursday night?

HUCKABEE SANDERS: I don't know. But he always finds a way. So, I think everybody -- tune in and see what happens.

BALDWIN: OK. Sarah Huckabee, thank you so much. I really do appreciate it here.

HUCKABEE SANDERS: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Trump's former campaign manager, Corey Lewandowski, who says whoever signed off on Melania Trump's speech should be fired.

This is from a man who's been let go from the Trump camp himself. But, as we have said, that is not happening. Here is more of Trump's supporters defending Melania Trump and how the campaign is moving on.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL MANAFORT, TRUMP CONVENTION MANAGER: There's no cribbing of Michelle Obama's speech.

These were common words and values, that she cares about her family, that -- things like that. I mean, she was speaking in front of 35 million people last night. She knew that. To think that she would be cribbing Michelle Obama's words is crazy. It's so -- this is once again an example of when a woman threatens

Hillary Clinton, how she tries -- seeks out to demean her and take her down. It's not going to work.

KATRINA PIERSON, TRUMP CAMPAIGN SPOKESPERSON: Look, these are our values, Republican values, by the way, hard work, determination, family values, dedication, and respect.

And that's Melania Trump. And this concept that Michelle Obama invented the English language is absurd. Look at the remarks of Laura Bush in 2004. And I think you will find something similar.

MANAFORT: We don't believe there's anything in that speech that doesn't reflect her thinking. And we don't think that -- and she says -- we're comfortable that the words that she used are words that were personal to her.

The fact that there are things like care and respect and compassion, those are not extraordinary words and, certainly when you talk about family, they're normal words. It's politics. We recognize it and we are just going to move on. We're focusing on the message that Melania Trump gave last night. The American people are focusing on it. We're very pleased about it.

REINCE PRIEBUS, REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: Melania did a great job. I think most people, if you were to actually do a poll on this subject, I think you would see overwhelming support and people impressed with the job that she did last night.

So I think in that case it was a successful night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: All right.

Let's talk about all of this with CNN political commentator Van Jones, Don Baer, who was a chief speechwriter for President Clinton, Matt Schlapp, a Trump surrogate who is also the chairman of the American Conservative Union, CNN political commentator Amanda Carpenter, senior political analyst David Gergen.

So, mega panel, mega conversation. I know some of you are over it.

MATT SCHLAPP, FORMER WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF POLITICAL AFFAIRS: I'm not. I'm not over it.

BALDWIN: Not over it at all.

To you, as the Trump surrogate.

SCHLAPP: Yes. Yes.

Not Van? Me?

BALDWIN: To you, not to Mr. Jones. I mean, listen, Sarah was sort of not -- she wasn't saying, yes,

plagiarism. She didn't go that far, but she was acknowledging it was mighty, mighty familiar to Michelle Obama's speech.

SCHLAPP: We all watched it.

BALDWIN: What do you think?

SCHLAPP: This is not trigonometry. It was kind of some basic concepts. I love my husband. He's trustworthy. He's going to keep his promises.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: ... common words.

SCHLAPP: This is pretty common. Is there a chance that some lawyer is going to say that this crossed some kind of line? I think that's a little silly, when think about two things.

First thing is you literally have a vice president of the United States who's been there for seven-and-a-half years who is the most flagrant plagiarizer in the history of our politics who also lied in law school. If we're going to go down this road, which is I think is not the right road to be down for our country, let's go it.

But let's go see what they're doing. We have a sitting -- or we have a Democratic nominee who we all know lied to Congress and we all know that James Comey pretty much prosecuted her on nationwide TV.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Talking about Melania Trump. I appreciate that.

I hear you're kind of laughing.

AMANDA CARPENTER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I feel like this is so cruel of the Trump campaign to do to their surrogates. You're making a valiant effort. I appreciate the efforts by Sean Spicer to compare it to a "My Little Pony" speech.

But the fact is that...

BALDWIN: Hang on. Let's play that, shall we?

CARPENTER: Yes. It was a brilliant moment in conventions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEAN SPICER, REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: We had a 2,000-word statement. We're talking about 70 words, three passages.

[15:10:00]

OK? And this idea of plagiarism, if we want to talk about it, let's talk to it. Melania Trump said you work hard for what you get in life. John Legend said work hard to be anything you want in life.

Kid Rock said work hard to be anything you want in life. Melania Trump said the strength of your dreams and willingness to work for them. Twilight Sparkle from "My Little Pony" said, this is your dream. Anything you can do in your dreams, you can do now.

If we want to take a bunch of phrases and run them through a Google and say, hey, who else has said them, I can come up with a list in five minutes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Yes?

CARPENTER: Twilight sparkle didn't give a speech for her husband at a convention. We know what happened.

A good speechwriter or anyone within the team would have looked at other good speeches that were doable for an event like this. That's what they did. Just say it is careless. They're making it so much worse. They're making their campaign and their surrogates look silly by distorting reality. It is not necessary. Just admit it and move on.

BALDWIN: Don, you wrote speeches for President Clinton. What if we take Melania -- I keep saying this. Let's take her at her word, that she wrote the speech. Maybe she watched Michelle Obama's speech in '08.

Maybe they should have had somebody else sort of watching Ann Romney and Michelle Obama's speeches of wives past to notice this.

DON BAER, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: So, this should be a blip, right, except for two things.

These things happen. Usually, there is intense interaction between the speaker and his or her writer or writers, they work together, and then there is adult supervision. Right? There's somebody...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: No matter who's giving...

BAER: So, there doesn't appear to be any adult supervision.

And I think it is the problem with this campaign right now. And that's why this is an issue. And the other reason it is an issue is, what is their response? It is the classic Trump response. They're going to bully their way through this and try to make everyone think that there is something wrong with their interpretation of her ripping off a speech, instead of just coming right out, fessing up, saying, look, somebody made a mistake.

And here's the issue. Maybe Melania Trump did write the speech because she went and looked at Hillary Clinton's speeches. They don't want to admit that she's the person who did the ripoff. (CROSSTALK)

VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Here is the thing.

BALDWIN: We will let you response in just a second.

Go ahead.

JONES: First of all, it is really hard to do what she did. People literally, Americans, they say they would almost rather die than have to stand up and give a speech in front of their church or their workplace.

BALDWIN: Let alone that crowd.

JONES: Let alone the biggest crowd ever.

BALDWIN: Yes.

JONES: So, everybody -- the country's heart is with her. Nobody is sitting up here saying she is a terrible person.

The problem is, a mistake got made. The question is, what is the character of the candidate when you make a mistake?

BALDWIN: He's furious.

(CROSSTALK)

JONES: Hey, listen, it is one thing to be mad. It is another thing to take responsibility.

SCHLAPP: Are you talking about Trump or Clinton?

JONES: I'm talking about your candidate right now.

This is an important issue. Your candidate is doing very well. Your candidate is doing frighteningly well. Your candidate may become president of the United States. And there are people who are watching this thing now with new eyes. And they're trying to figure out, what's the character of this man?

If he makes a mistake -- and he will make a mistake in the White House. It happens all the time. Will he take responsibility? And apparently, he won't. That's why people are upset, sir.

SCHLAPP: This is absurd.

I agree with your comments, your beginning comments wholeheartedly. This is one of the hardest thing to do. She walked out on that stage, it was a huge moment for her. This is the most important public thing she has done. And I think she hit it out of the park. She was very likable. She won people instantly.

Look, she loves her husband and it came across. Second of all, please, if you are supporting Hillary Clinton, do not come at this from the idea that you should be honest and trustworthy when you make a mistake. Are you kidding me? They have me mistake after mistake after mistake.

JONES: And she admitted.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLAPP: ... serious things, and they want to actually call her on this on a speech. It is hypocrisy. The voters see it and it should stop.

(CROSSTALK)

JONES: When did Trump ever apologize? Hillary Clinton has acknowledged mistakes and apologized.

BALDWIN: Your point on accountability.

DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: The Trump campaign has made a big point about double standards all along.

And they have applied it particularly to Hillary. Look, everybody else gets blamed. Everybody else has to pay a price, she gets treated as an elite, she gets a pass.

Well, I must tell you, having taken that position, you have to be willing to apply it to yourself. And if a speechwriter did this under Don Baer, I can guarantee you that person would be fired like that, just gone.

(CROSSTALK)

BAER: My adult supervision was David Gergen.

(CROSSTALK)

(LAUGHTER)

GERGEN: But I can just tell you, if a student turned in a paper like this at a college, they'd be held before the plagiarism board, and they'd face possible even expulsion.

Of course, there are phrases that are similar to other phrases. But it is the way they were strung together that makes it so apparent that they're...

BALDWIN: Do voters care, David Gergen, at the end of the day?

GERGEN: Voters care about a couple things. They do care about the character of the candidate.

And I think that Melania Trump was speaking from the heart. She is a fine woman. She's an extraordinarily intelligent woman. How this happened, I don't know. I don't blame her personally, but I do think the campaign has handled it horribly in the run-up. And I think the campaign has been even worse since it happened. To blame this on Hillary Clinton, as Paul Manafort did on this program earlier today, is so absurd. It's bizarre. What in the hell does Hillary Clinton got to do with it?

JONES: I want to add just one thing as well.

Usually, when you accidentally plagiarize, it is because you are trying to figure out, I have got to write a speech on solar power, and I don't know that much about it, so I'm going to go.

[15:15:07]

You're talking about your husband. You're talking about...

SCHLAPP: That's the whole point.

JONES: Exactly. So it shouldn't be hard to come up with original prose in your most intimate relationship.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLAPP: She loves him, she trusts him, he will keep his word. He will be a good leader. These are very vague and big concepts.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLAPP: You really think she opened up a Hillary -- excuse me -- a Michelle Obama speech and wrote it out word for word?

GERGEN: Somebody did. Somebody did.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLAPP: Is that your charge, David Gergen? You think someone took that Michelle Obama speech and...

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLAPP: ... word for word?

GERGEN: I don't think how you can compare those two speeches and say these were two totally different people who never read each other's speeches. I just don't think you can.

(CROSSTALK)

JONES: Because of the structure.

(CROSSTALK)

BAER: I think this question of character is a very serious one.

But I want to come back to this point about adult supervision. There's no control. Right? This is a chaotic, out-of-control, runaway situation. And that's their campaign. Let's be honest. Everyone knows that, number one. And, number two, how does that relate to how Donald Trump would govern as president, right?

That's where the American people, I think, are looking at this and going...

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLAPP: If I could say...

BALDWIN: Matt, please.

SCHLAPP: ... the idea that this is out of control on the speech of the potential next first lady, and you're trying to say that this is somehow that the character of the candidate and that the campaign is out of control, when the country has been forced for a year to deal on the other side with someone who has not been honest -- you talked about out of control and chaotic.

Why don't you criticize that just as strongly? You won't do it.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: What about another layer to this, speaking to the organization of the campaign, the fact that Donald Trump during a very emotional, strong speech from Patricia Smith -- she lost her son in Benghazi some years ago.

During that speech, that is when he calls in and talks to Bill O'Reilly. Was that appropriate?

SCHLAPP: You know, the timing of these things, that might not be the best of timing. But there was a lot of people crying in the audience, quite honestly. It was a very emotional time.

But, as you know, there was multiple things going on at these things at the same time. And I think the fact that he put her up on the stage and was the one that checked off putting these ordinary Americans who have had these tragedies, these really Clinton-inspired tragedies, was the right thing to do. And I think people in the audience appreciate that.

GERGEN: Yes, but that -- much of what you just said is true. But here is the thing.

SCHLAPP: Yes, but not all of it.

GERGEN: Well, but here's the thing.

It is political malpractice to allow the first night of the convention, when the main event is going to be the future first lady of the land, and you build everybody's expectations of it, and then have this sand shift and to completely lose the import and the impact of the first night going into a second day. You have got to admit that is just not...

(CROSSTALK) CARPENTER: Let me make a point here, because Donald Trump is doing something that's going to hurt him long term. He's surrendering the ability to message very important things.

It started with giving Mike Pence a pass on the Iraq War vote. Now he's losing Melania as a surrogate if they don't fix this.

SCHLAPP: Come on.

CARPENTER: They need Melania out there to get women like me.

SCHLAPP: She's going to be out there. Don't worry.

CARPENTER: She needs to be a good surrogate. She needs to speak in an authentic, real, genuine way.

SCHLAPP: She will.

CARPENTER: She has a tougher hill to climb now. And then she stepped on the Benghazi message.

(CROSSTALK)

CARPENTER: ... happening that need to be corrected.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLAPP: Fair enough points.

Would you want to be talking about this after the first day? Of course not. I'll give you that, for sure. When you look at those things, do they look similar? I will give you that. I think that's exactly right.

But here's the next thing. I think Van's point is right, which is, this woman walked out, and gave this very important speech. It was tough for her to do. And I think if the partisans on the other side feel like they're going to jump all over her in this aggressive manner, I do think it boomerangs.

I think it's Trump has benefited from this whole time. Oh, he's not a real candidate, oh, he's a joke, oh, his tone is wrong, oh, his wife took out a speech and copied it word for word. It is over the top, and I think the American people are more fair than that.

(CROSSTALK)

BAER: If it's so important, which it was, why did someone not pay attention to it and bring the discipline and the attention to detail that you're supposed to bring in a serious situation?

BALDWIN: OK.

JONES: But he is right that if it looks like people are beating up on her, not only is it not fair to her. It is also politically stupid. The campaign has to take better responsibility. BAER: They did a disservice.

GERGEN: You have yet to hear from Donald Trump.

BALDWIN: We have yet to hear.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLAPP: You know what? You're going to.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: We will indeed Thursday night.

All right, everyone, thank you very much. I appreciate the conversation.

Next, though, let's look ahead to this evening. One of the big speakers, New Jersey Governor Chris Christie, longtime friend of Mr. Trump's, he's responding today to reports about missing out on the V.P. slot. Hear what he has said.

Also ahead, CNN takes you to the site where a killer ambushed police officers in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, killing those three men.

Stay with me. We have got you covered on this Tuesday. You're watching CNN's special live coverage.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:23:54]

BALDWIN: Welcome back. You're watching CNN. We're live here in Cleveland, Ohio. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

New Jersey Governor Chris Christie is coming to Melania Trump's defense. Governor Christie is one of the featured speakers this evening scheduled to address the crowd tonight, along with two of Mr. Trump's children, Don Jr. and Tiffany.

CNN's special correspondent Jamie Gangel asked Governor Christie about getting passed over to be Trump's running mate and whether he thought Melania Trump plagiarized Michelle Obama's speech.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: Well, first off, 93 percent of the speech is absolutely words that were different than Michelle Obama's speech eight years ago.

And of the ones that were similar, these were not groundbreaking thoughts, Jamie, that people are raised his country to work hard, to go for what they want, to make sure their kids reach their dreams.

And so I just don't see it. If we're talking about 7 percent of a speech that was really universally considered to be a good performance by Melania, I know her. There's no way that Melania Trump was plagiarizing Michelle Obama's speech.

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: But there are phrases that are strikingly similar.

[15:25:00]

CHRISTIE: Listen, if you're looking the plagiarism, Jamie --and I remember this from back in school -- you're talking about much broader than what we saw last night of people who are copying and lifting from speeches.

One, I know her. I don't believe she would do that. And I don't believe that last night sounded like anything other than Melania Trump. I was sitting there saying, wow, that sounds like Michelle Obama to me. That sounds like Melania Trump to me.

GANGEL: Talk to me a little bit about the vice presidency. You were one of the finalists. I know you well enough to know you were disappointed.

CHRISTIE: Sure.

GANGEL: Did you think that he was going to pick you?

CHRISTIE: No. I never had a feeling that -- I knew I was close, but I didn't think I was there.

And like you said, I don't like when people come on a show like this and say, oh, no, no, no, I didn't care in the least. Come on, no one believes that. I'm a competitive person. When it was clear that Donald wanted me to compete for this job, and to be considered, I wanted to win. Of course you do.

But it's not like my lifetime dream was to be vice president of the United States. And so I'm disappointed. No doubt I was disappointed. But I'm over it. Believe me, if I'm over the presidential race, I'm certainly over the vice presidential vetting.

GANGEL: OK. Let's talk about Chris Christie. Last night, when Donald Trump walked out to Queen, this big moment. You're going to give your speech tonight. What are you walking out to?

CHRISTIE: I have no idea. I have no idea. They haven't told me yet.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Jamie's here with us now fresh off her interview, as is CNN political director David Chalian.

So, great to have both of you on.

GANGEL: Thank you.

BALDWIN: First, make your point about accidental plagiarism.

GANGEL: No, Chris Christie knows better. He's a lawyer. Plagiarism is plagiarism, whether it is incidental or accidental. It's still plagiarism.

By all accounts, this was a mistake, which makes it accidental as far as we know thus far. But he said something interesting. He said 93 percent of the speech was OK.

BALDWIN: So what about the other...

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: That's a new bar. That's a new bar.

(CROSSTALK)

GANGEL: It's a different standard there.

BALDWIN: David Chalian, do people care? Is this a thing? It's a thing right now. Big picture, does it...

CHALIAN: Here's the thing. Donald Trump supporters, this is not going to be a thing that takes one vote away from Donald Trump.

But he's looking to expand votes right now. He's looking to add to what he has.

(CROSSTALK)

CHALIAN: State of the race right now has him a few points behind Hillary Clinton. So just sticking with the supporters he has isn't the plan right now. He wants to expand beyond that.

And this is the kind of week where you have this clean shot, because you're not taking as much incoming from the opponent that you have to deal with. This is your moment to talk to the American people, present your image.

And so you lose a day on that because of just the media conversation. In the end, here is what I think is a bigger deal. I think it is far more informative to us about how the Trump campaign and Donald Trump in particular deals with this.

This is not unfamiliar territory. Remember when "The Washington Post" broke the story that he was on recordings That was clearly his voice that he portrayed himself as John Barron, his own publicist, said, that's not me, I'm moving on. He just moved on.

So his whole mentality is to sort of steamroll his way through it.

BALDWIN: Is it going to work?

GANGEL: One of my favorite things that Christie said which speaks to this, he said Donald Trump is not big on mea culpas. Right? We haven't seen one apology or one, this was a mistake.

So, yes, he's going to steamroll his way through it, unless there's something we're missing.

BALDWIN: Yes. What do you think is the big moment tonight? CHALIAN: Well, I think again, two things going on tonight. The way

they did last night, they're going to make the case against Hillary Clinton. Last night was Benghazi. But tonight it is going to be her e-mails and other Clinton controversies from a slew of prosecutors.

Chris Christie, one of them, Asa Hutchinson, they're going to have all these prosecutors making the case against her. And then, as you mentioned, Tiffany Trump and Don Jr., we're going to start to hear from family members again and people who have worked in his businesses to flesh out these other sides of Donald Trump that we really haven't seen throughout the course of this campaign.

BALDWIN: OK. David and Jamie, thank you so much. I appreciate it.

Coming up next here, President Obama writes an open letter to a national police union in the wake of the deadly attacks on officers in this country. We will take you live to Baton Rouge where CNN has also obtained a new account of the ambush from an eyewitness.

We will be right back.

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