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ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES
Trump: Clinton Foundation "Pay For Play" At State Dept.; Trump To African Americans: What The Hell Do You Have To Lose?; Trump Postponing Major Immigration Speech; FBI Uncovers More Clinton Documents in E-mail Probe; Clinton's Health: An Unhealthy Obsession?; A Mother's Zika Nightmare. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired August 22, 2016 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:01:20] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: And good evening. Donald Trump making news tonight calling for a special prosecutor to investigate the Clinton Foundation, saying that the same racketeering laws were used against organized crime should be applied to Hillary Clinton. He also renewed his outreach to African-Americans and Latinos but in a way that's stirring debate to say the least.
Our Sara Murray was at the even tonight in Akron, Ohio, joins us from there. So, Trump repeatedly described the Clinton Foundation as, "pay-for-play" during the speech tonight.
SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: You're right, Anderson. And this was supposed to be a week for Donald Trump was going to be talking about immigration and instead, he decided to use this week to really hammer the Clintons. And today, the headline really was him calling for this special prosecutor, essentially saying he no longer has any faith in the Justice Department after Hillary Clinton's e-mail controversy. But he does want someone to dig in and look at these ties between the State Department and the Clinton Foundation.
Now, as he was saying this, cheers of "lock her up" broke out right here in this arena. That's a good indication to you of how moving this is to the Republican base, but it's also the kind of thing that the Trump campaign believes could have resonate with independent voters, voters who believed that Clintons aren't trustworthy or really buy into the notion that the Clintons have played by their own rules, Anderson.
COOPER: Talk more about Donald Trump's, yet again, kind of speaking to African-Americans, not necessarily in that hall, but who may have been watching. What did he say?
MURRAY: This has been a relatively new overture from Trump for the last couple of days, trying to do this outreach to black voters. He caught a lot of criticism even from members of his own party who looked at his polling which is abysmal with African-American voters and, essentially said he wasn't even trying to make the effort. So now, we are hearing Donald Trump on the campaign trail trying to make the effort but it's raising a few eyebrows by how he's doing it. Essentially saying things can't get any worse. Take a listen to what he said tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Crime, all of the problems to the African-Americans who I employ so many, so many people, to the Hispanics, tremendous people. What the hell do you have to lose? Give me a chance. I'll straighten it out. I'll bring jobs back. We'll bring spirit back. We'll get rid of the crime. You'll be able to walk down the street without getting shot. Right now, you walk down the street, you get shot.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MURRAY: Now, his critics are already seizing on Twitter on that last line, you walk down the street and you get shot.
And Anderson, as you alluded to, it's worth noting that when Donald Trump comes to arenas like this, he certainly does draw a raucous crowd that is delighted to see him but there are very few African- American faces in that mix. Back to you.
COOPER: All right, Sara Murray. Sara, thanks very much.
More now on those fresh revelations in the Clinton e-mail story that Donald Trump latched on to tonight.
CNN's Jeff Zeleny joins us now with the latest on that. So, these 15,000 e-mails and e-mail attachments that we learned about today, where did they come from, what do they show?
JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Anderson, we don't know exactly what they say because frankly we haven't seen them yet. But as you said, there are 15,000 documents, most of them, not all of them, are e-mails. And these were all discovered by the FBI during their year-long investigation of her private e-mail server. They were turned over to the State Department last month but the reason they're being talked about today is a federal judge shined a new spotlight on them when he said they should be released and released faster starting next month after the State Department reviews them.
Now, you may wonder why we're still talking about her e-mails. It's specifically because these 15,000 were not turned over when those 55,000 were turned over last year, for whatever reason. We don't know the reason of that. So, until we see what's in some of these e-mails, this controversy and these questions may continue.
[21:05:02] COOPER: These e-mails, the 15,000, they were looked at by the FBI because they were -- the FBI discovered them, and the FBI is not bringing any charges. So, I guess, they didn't think there was any illegality there.
COOPER: Where is Clinton now? I mean, she hasn't really had public events for the past few days.
ZELENY: She's not been campaigning much in public. She's in California for a three-day fund-raising swing. In fact, this evening, she's doing a round of a late night talk shows. She'll be on with Jimmy Kimmel. She also is doing some fund-raising, some big fund- raising at the home of Magic Johnson, some others.
So, the month of August, particularly, the final two weeks here, all about raising money specifically to fund T.V. ads. Her campaign announced an $80 million strategy for the final stretch here in all types of battleground states, trying to keep the focus on Donald Trump and his temperament. Of course, these e-mails and other things have kept some of the spotlight on her campaign uncomfortably as well. Anderson?
COOPER: Yeah. Jeff Zeleny. Jeff, thanks very much.
Back with the panel. Maria Cardona, Angela Rye. Joining us also this hour is Alex Burns, a national political reporter for the "New York Times." Also Kayleigh McEnany and Tara Setmayer and Corey Lewandowski.
Alex, let's start with you. How big a problem do you think are these new documents? Because I mean, as I said, the FBI has looked at them already but it certainly continues the kind of the drum beat, the drip, drip of stories about these e-mails.
ALEX BURNS, "NEW YORK TIMES" NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER: Well, absolutely. I think the only honest answer from a reporter's perspective right now is we don't know how big a problem they're going to be for Hillary Clinton because we the public don't actually know what's in them yet. Presumably, the Clinton campaign must have some sense of what is lurking out there but they have not been particularly detailed in describing what other revelations might be yet to come.
Clearly, on a week like this, as Jeff was describing, when Hillary Clinton has been mostly out of public view, when she has been trying to take a step back and let the heat stay on Donald Trump, this issue coming back to the foreground is obviously not helpful for her.
COOPER: And Maria, even though the Clinton Foundation, I mean, again, it's the question which the RNC asked which, I think, is a completely valid question, which is if as president, Hillary Clinton says the Clinton Foundation is not going to accept foreign donations, why was it OK for her when she was secretary of state for the Clinton Foundation to accept foreign donations?
MARIA CARDONA, 2008 SENIOR CLINTON CAMPAIGN ADVISER: Well, I think, you know, again, and I think James was talking about this earlier, when she was doing her business as secretary of state, they tried to make -- do a firewall, right? It's difficult, though, obviously, when you -- they know so many people in the Clinton world, the Clinton world, so many people in the secretary of state world. And what we saw with the e-mails that came out is some fodder about people getting in touch with the Clinton Foundation, talking about the crown prince. But ultimately, that meeting if it happened, it happened through official channels.
COOPER: Right. But Doug Band who worked for the Clinton Foundation would e-mail Huma Abedin and say this guy is a good friend of ours, I assume, meaning the Clinton Foundation, meaning he gave a lot of money, or she gave a lot of money and could the Secretary meet with him.
CARDONA: But here's the other thing. My understanding is that Doug Band sent that e-mail as the -- as a personal assistant to President Clinton, not as somebody who worked for the Clinton Foundation.
But again, this is where the difficulty lies, right, which is what the people don't really know where those barriers are. But I think, at the end of the day, the -- what the Clinton campaign has said from the beginning and they still stand by this, is that they want every single e-mail out there.
And just to be clear about these 15,000, and you talked about how the FBI and Comey had already looked at this and that is important for the viewers to understand, and he actually said in announcing the FBI findings, he said that there is no evidence that the e-mails that were found were, "intentionally deleted in an effort to conceal them." That is a really important point because that is what Republicans are trying to pounce on.
Again, nothing has been found, no smoking gun, about anything. This seems to be the only thing that they have going against her. Yes, it was a self-inflicted wound. If this hadn't happened, perhaps, she would be 15 to 20 points ahead instead of five to 10.
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, TRUMP'S SUPPORTER: Maria, it's very simple. Hillary Clinton sat before Congress and said under penalty of perjury, I turned over all work related e-mails and here's how we did it. We looked through every e-mail ...
COOPER: She did couch the phrase like ...
MCENANY: That's right.
COOPER: ... to the best of my knowledge, you know.
MCENANY: That's right. She said we looked through every single e- mail, my lawyers did, and turned over all the work related ones. Well, if you're looking through every single e-mail, how did you somehow miss 15,000? That is completely strange. It was untruthful what she said.
Not only that, she said in July ...
CARDONA: That's right. MCENANY: ... that at the Clinton Foundation -- or at the State Department, they had nothing to do with the Clinton Foundation.
CARDONA: And they didn't.
MCENANY: We find out today that a Clinton Foundation official on Cheryl Mills' voice mail referred to our boss, Hillary Clinton. A Clinton Foundation official said her boss was, in fact, Hillary Clinton.
CARDONA: That was rhetorical.
COOPER: But wait, I mean, I understand the Democrats, you know, want to defend her on this. But I mean, the whole thing about the Clinton Foundation, I mean, it was this web of, you know, rubbing shoulders with Bill Clinton, if you go and you donate money and -- I mean, that, you know, there was a whole sort of -- it wasn't just people wanted to do good works, it was also about connections to the Clintons.
COREY LEWANDOWSKI, FORMER TRUMP CAMAPAIGN MANAGER: Well, Anderson, today, just today, the campaign manager of Hillary Clinton came out and said if she's elected president, we will stop taking foreign donations.
[21:10:04] They could stop taking those donations today. Furthermore, they said, if she's elected president, she will step down from the foundation. She could step down from that foundation right this very minute. You know, they give this convoluted answer of, well, she's really tied into a lot of different things.
Look, when you're elected president of state ...
CARDONA: You're talking about Bill Clinton.
LEWANDOWSKI: ... you could step out today.
CARDONA: That wasn't her.
LEWANDOWSKI: You could step out today. Bill Clinton could step out today from the Foundation. It has nothing to do with it. That could be done with a piece of paper. They choose not to do it. And the bottom line is the notion of a potential impropriety is what has Hillary Clinton's support of trustworthiness at 11 percent with the American public.
COOPER: Tara, what do you make of James Carville's argument, which is look, nine millions of people have access to, you know, low cost HIV drugs that they will die without and ...
TARA SETMAYER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I mean, that's wonderful, except that the Clinton Foundation has spent only 2.9 percent of their money on direct services. The majority of their money is overhead.
COOPER: Yeah, but no, but they also ...
CARDONA: That's misleading.
COOPER: ... HIV stuff.
SETMAYER: It's listed on their 990, so.
COOPER: Right. But on the HIV stuff, my understanding, I may be wrong, is that they also negotiated very hard to get ...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's 89 percent ...
SETMAYER: I'm sure they did, but at the same time, well, there's also questions about what happened in Haiti. There's also questions about Ukrainian and Russian things. And there's all kinds of issues going on here.
And the reason why Bill Clinton isn't stepping down right now is because they used the Clinton Foundation to travel all over the world, on people's private jets and they funnel things through there. It's so pay-to-play.
On that same 990 Form, $20 million was spent on travel and expenses, by far the large -- more money than spent on these wonderful programs that they allegedly do. So, it's very difficult for people to look at this.
And when you see -- there was another thing revealed today that there were 150 voice mail messages left between a Clinton Foundation director and one of Hillary Clinton's right hand people. 150 messages in like a year and a half. They are so in bed with each other. It's unethical.
ANGELA RYE, POLITICAL STRATEGIST: I just I think, and, Tara, I know you can appreciate this from having been a former Hill staffer as well. But let me use this as an example. I worked for the CDC three years ago. And Congressman Thompson ...
RYE: Yeah, I'm sorry, good point, Anderson. Sorry, viewers. Sorry, viewers. The other point, though, is Congressman Thompson for four years before that. And I still call Congressman Thompson boss or the boss. I sit on the CDC, I sit on the CDC Institute board. Yeah, I know. And, you know, Congressman Meeks, who's the chair of (inaudible), I sit on that board. I call him big boss. My -- Congressman Cleaver is work dad. My only point to you is -- going back to ...
SETMAYER: They didn't work for all of that at the same time where Huma Abedin had four different jobs.
COOPER: Let her finish.
RYE: I understand the optics. I am not going to argue the optics with you. Oh, they are damning. SETMAYER: Yeah.
RYE: I will give you that. All I'm trying to raise is that sometimes it is our responsibility having sit -- sat in these privileged seats to let people know what the real is and I just ...
COOPER: But the flipside of that ...
SETMAYER: But it's -- when you donate hundreds of thousands of dollars or between $5 and $10 million to the Clinton Foundation and then you get put ahead of the line to have a meeting with the secretary of state, well, that's problematic.
COOPER: Don't talk over each other. No one will listen. The flipside of this, so -- the flipside of this, Kayleigh, is that this does allow the Clinton folks to come back and say, "Well, look, we're trying to be as transparent as possible ...
COOPER: ... we released." The only reason people know about what money's raised by the Clinton Foundation because everything is transparent. Donald Trump hasn't released his tax returns. He's not transparent.
MCENANY: She should not try to make a transparency argument here. She deleted half of her e-mails. 15,000 documents were discovered, not by Clinton being gratuitous saying, "I'm going to put these forward for the sake of transparency," they were discovered by the FBI who found them via other routes. She is the last person to make a transparency argument.
And, you know, it's devastating to the American public, I think, that she put our national secrets in a very perilous position, setting up this private e-mail server where you could have potentially put C.I. assets in harm's way.
COOPER: Alex and we got to go.
BURNS: You know, this is a point that I think you can't make too often. This is one of these situations that makes other Republicans like the Ted Cruz's of the world and the Jeb Bush's of the world just feel like, "My goodness, how did we nominate the one guy in the field who's a Clinton Foundation" ...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's right.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's right.
BURNS: But if it were any other Republican, this would be just a slam dunk of an argument to make. Tara's making it very effectively. And Trump is just so exposed on the other side of it that you do wonder whether he can sustain it over two and a half months.
COOPER: We're going to take a quick break. Our Drew Griffin has new reporting on the Foundation and transparency in an in-depth report, you'll want to see, next.
[21:17:59] COOPER: Well, our panel have been debating this most of the evening. And Donald Trump certainly focused sharply on it as well. Hillary Clinton's relationship while secretary of state with the Clinton Foundation. Allegations that it was as Donald Trump put it a case of pay for play.
The Clinton camp and supporters of the Foundation deny that. There are, however, big changes planned for Secretary Clinton is -- if she's elected president. For the official name, the Global Charity group to rules about who can donate money. The changes are viewed as a way to avoid even the appearance of conflicts of interest. So, it begs the question if that's the goal, why weren't these changes made when Clinton was secretary of state?
Our Senior Investigator Correspondent Drew Griffin tonight reports.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DREW GRIFFIN, SENIOR INVESTIGATOR CORRESPONDENT: This is a map of the world and these are the specific countries in this world that have given millions to the Clinton Foundation over the years. $10 to $25 million from Australia, Norway and Saudi Arabia. $5 to $10 million from the Netherlands and Kuwait. Between $1 and $5 million from Oman, United Arab Emirates and Brunei. And it's not just countries. Individual foreign donors and foreign groups make up a huge share of donations to the Clinton Foundation. The campaign now says if Hillary Clinton becomes president, any foreign donations like these will no longer be accepted.
CNN's Dana Bash asked Hillary Clinton's campaign manager why wait?
DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR: Why not do it now? Why wait until the idea of her being president? Why not do it when she is running for president?
ROBBY MOOK, CLINTON CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Well, the Foundation is doing an enormous amount of work and it takes time when you're in a number of countries around the world to retool, refocus the mission and adapt.
GRIFFIN: At the heart of the issue is conflict of interest or even the appearance of one, namely, would a President Clinton give favorable treatment to a country, or a company, or person who donated millions of dollars to the Foundation. That's how Donald Trump sees it.
TRUM: They've made hundreds of millions of dollars selling access, selling favors, selling government contracts and I mean hundreds of millions of dollars. [21:20:06] GRIFFIN: Despite that claim, there are no definitive examples of what Trump says. But that doesn't mean there aren't questions. Like long-time Bill Clinton pal and mining magnate, Frank Giustra. Giustra's foundations have given more than $50 million to the Clinton Foundation. He's Allowed Bill Clinton use of his private jet. And when a company he founded merged with another that became part of a Russian business deal that need government approval, that deal got the OK from the State Department run by Hillary Clinton.
Giustra says he sold his stakes in the company years before the Russian deal. So anything wrong? No. All above-board says the State Department. Other government agencies approved the deal. All the rules were followed as they were in all cases involving Monsanto. The food giant has donated between $1 and $5 million to the Clinton Foundation and it has had multiple partnership projects with the Clinton Global Initiative.
In 2009, when Hillary Clinton took office as secretary of state, Monsanto was actively lobbying the State Department for helping promote an open market for its bioagricultural projects across the globe. And it all coincided with Secretary Clinton's global policy to promote agricultural biotechnology.
According to Clinton, she was promoting U.S. agriculture and especially the U.S. farmer, much like her Republican predecessor did. But there is no doubt one of the big winners was the big agricultural giant and Clinton Foundation donor, Monsanto.
Hoping to put the potential pay to play allegations, especially with foreign donations, to an end, it was Bill Clinton who tweeted this afternoon. "If Hillary becomes president, the Foundation will only take in money from U.S. citizens, permanent residents and U.S.-based independent foundations." And the Bill, Hillary and Chelsea Clinton Foundation will change its name to just the Clinton Foundation. In other words, no Hillary.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: And Drew joins me now. So, just to be clear, this only happens, they say, if Hillary Clinton is elected president?
GRIFFIN: Yes. It's a contingency plan. Bill Clinton putting out a statement today saying exactly that, Anderson. If she is elected, the changes will be immediate. But not until then, at least, that's not the impression from the statement. He did say it's a plan they have been working on, though, for several months and will take a long period of time to untangle all the foreign business and partnerships that the Clinton Foundation is involved with all across the globe.
COOPER: But even if elected, the Clinton Foundation, they're still be raising money, they are just saying from U.S. sources?
GRIFFIN: Yes, only without Bill Clinton. He is going to step down, again, Anderson, if she's elected. He says he will step down from the Foundation board, he will also stop raising funds for the Foundation, but the work of the Foundation will go on. COOPER: All right, Drew Griffin, appreciate that.
Next, the conspiracy theories circulating about Hillary Clinton's health and fitness for office, something peddled by Trump supporters and surrogates. We'll unravel the theories and try to uncover any facts.
[21:27:09] COOPER: The former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani is many things to many people, perhaps the most famously, a steady comforting and measured voice to many New Yorkers during the 9/11 nightmare. One thing he's not is a doctor, yet lately, he and a number of other Trump surrogates have, at least, rhetorically been playing one on T.V. They are suggesting somehow that Hillary Clinton is ill, possibly mentally impaired. And in Mayor Giuliani's case, asking skeptics to get a second opinion from Dr. Google.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER NEW YORK MAYOR: What you've got to do is go online. All you got to do go ...
SHANNON BREAM, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Her campaign and a number of people defending her, saying there's nothing factual to the claims about her health and that -- that's speculation at best.
GIULIANI: Go online -- so, go online and put down Hillary Clinton illness, take a look at the videos for yourself.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Well, see for yourself, he says, which is just what our Randi Kaye did.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's moments like these that right wing groups are pouncing on to push the narrative that Hillary Clinton's health is failing. This was Clinton at a muffin shop in June, reacting to reporters peppering her with questions. When critics suggested Clinton had a seizure, one A.P. reporter who was there set the record straight, writing, "Clinton responded with an exaggerated motion, shaking her head vigorously for a few seconds. After the exchange, she took a few more photos, exited the shop and greeted supporters waiting outside."
Conspiracy theorists have cooked up just about every condition for her. Brain damage, check. Parkinson's, check. Autism, yep. Even syphilis. None of it, though, is based on fact. But that hasn't stopped Donald Trump in recent days from fueling the speculation.
TRUMP: Importantly, she also lacks the mental and physical stamina to take on ISIS.
KAYE: The physical stamina, he said, suggesting she's too frail for the Oval Office. It's a popular theme among even mainstream conservatives, including former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani, a Trump adviser.
GIULIANI: She looks sick.
KAYE: Clinton's team meanwhile suggesting Trump is parroting lies.
MOOK: We hear rehashed conspiracy theories.
KAYE: Rumors about the former secretary of state's health first began back in 2012 after she had a bad fall and suffered a concussion. She admitted in interviews she experienced double vision and dizziness but said repeatedly she felt great.
HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I felt fine.
KAYE: Her husband Bill Clinton echoed that while slamming those fueling the conspiracies.
BILL CLINTON, 42TH UNITED STATES PRESIDENT: First they said she faked her concussion and now they say she's auditioning for a part on "The Walking Dead". She works out every week. She is strong. She is doing great.
KAYE: Doing great, that's not how conspiracy theorists see it and they see proof in images like these, Secret Service appearing to hold her up at a rally, aides helping her up the steps, and her falling as she boarded an airplane.
[21:30:07] They suggest it all points to her being sick. Conspiracy theorists are also obsessed with Clinton's cough on the campaign trail, her constant use of pillows during interviews and her long bathroom break during the ABC debate.
H. CLINTON: Sorry.
KAYE: Even her hearty laugh is an indication they suggest of a brain issue.
All of this, despite a letter released in July last year from Clinton's internist of 15 years, Dr. Lisa Bardack describing Clinton as healthy, listing her medical conditions as hypothyroidism and seasonal pollen allergies. The doctor ended the letter saying, "Clinton is in excellent physical condition and fit to be president of the United States."
Randi Kaye, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: And we're back with the panel. Alex, how much is this like in some ways the Birther Movement? I mean, this sort of defy -- I mean, you can show all the evidence you want, you can have the note from the doctor, but they're still -- I mean, President Obama showed his birth certificate, there are still people who believe he wasn't born in the United States? BURNS: It's a lot like that, not just because of the person delivering this message and sort of the community that latches on to it, but there's this whole universe of conservative media, sites like Breitbart, hosts like Sean Hannity and range of other talk radio hosts who will stoke this stuff and give folks who tend to believe the stuff Donald Trump says, you know, validation that there are other people out there who see things the same way.
At the same time, the great body of Republican elected officials and voters don't live entirely in that universe. And so, this kind of thing becomes terribly embarrassing to people who would really rather, you know, much the same way as mainstream Republicans tried to get away from the Birther stuff in 2012 when they wanted to run on a campaign about Obamacare and the economy. This is embarrassing to Republicans who want to run against Hillary Clinton based on policy and based on differences in their agendas and their records. This is not helpful to anybody in the party who's trying to deliver a broader message about which party is better for regular people.
MCENANY: I think it's really important to isolate what Donald Trump has said specifically about this because every time Donald Trump's talked about this, he contrasts his physical stamina with hers. He's been doing this since December, since long before ...
BURNS: Come on. He said that she's not all there.
MCENANY: Let me finish. Since long before these kinds of theories were popping up on Breitbart, Donald Trump was contrasting stamina. Doing so, let's look at August, you know, she took seven days off. He spent every single day on the trail shaking voters' hands. He was in Louisiana. She was resting Martha's Vineyard. When he is talking about this, he's not talking about some brain issue. He's not talking about some sickness. I understand other conservative sites have pushed and peddled that. Donald Trump has not.
COOPER: But he's not -- it's been his surrogates, I mean, you have Rudy Giuliani say go on the internet and Google this.
MCENANY: He doesn't agree with everything his surrogates say. I've been on here not defending Trump at times. I doubt he agrees with me during those times. Donald Trump himself has contrasted his stamina with Hillary Clinton's. He is not bought into ...
BURNS: It's just not true. He has said she's not all there ...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yeah. He has.
BURNS: He has questioned her physical ability to ...