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Trump Jr. Ignites Furor With Skittles Tweet; U.S. Blaming Russia for Aid Convoy Attack; Terror Investigation. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired September 20, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:00]

ANA CABRERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The family wants to see charges filed immediately against the officer -- back to you, Brooke.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: We will stay on it. Ana Cabrera live in Tulsa, thank you so much.

We continue on, top of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Breaking news today regarding the man suspected of planting those bombs in four different locations, New York, New Jersey, over the weekend. We now know 28-year-old Ahmad Rahami was once jailed for stabbing his own relative and that the FBI investigated him on accusations that his own father had called him a terrorist.

We're getting a window into the mind of this accused bomber, a source telling CNN the suspected attacker wrote about specifically the Boston bombers and an American-born al Qaeda mastermind, his terror ramblings actually found in a notebook on him after his shoot-out with police.

Investigators now believe he was inspired by other terrorists. The questions remain about whether or not he was acting alone.

So let's go to Pamela Brown, CNN justice correspondent.

Tell me more about what we're learning about his past and what his father was saying about him some years ago.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Right.

So, Brooke, we learned today actually that the father of the suspect was interviewed by the FBI in 2014 about him after this domestic dispute where the suspect was arrested for stabbing his brother in the leg and unlawful possession of a firearm.

And today my colleague Jessica Schneider actually spoke to the father and here's what he had to say about talking to authorities about his son. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MOHAMMAD RAHAMI, FATHER OF AHMAD KHAN RAHAMI: Now I was going to say he's a terrorist.

QUESTION: Why did you call the FBI two years ago?

RAHAMI: Because he was doing bad.

QUESTION: He was doing bad? What did he do bad?

RAHAMI: He stabbed my son, because he hurt my wife, and I put him to jail two years ago.

QUESTION: Who is he?

RAHAMI: My son.

QUESTION: He -- which son did he stab?

RAHAMI: Nasser.

QUESTION: OK. Why did it happen? Why did he stab him?

RAHAMI: That was for no reason, OK? Excuse me. I can go now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: So, what we have learned through officials is that a neighbor actually contacted authorities after he heard the father call his son a terrorist during this dispute.

And an official tells that when the FBI went to interview the father, that he sort of downplayed the concern about his son and the FBI never interviewed Ahmad. He was in jail at the time. He was never indicted or anything like that.

But the FBI felt like at the time that this was a domestic dispute. He was not put on any terror databases, despite the fact this happened not long after he returned from a yearlong time in Pakistan where he was in Quetta, Pakistan, as well as Afghanistan.

And so there are some questions about what he was doing overseas. We have learned when he came back from his travels in Pakistan and Afghanistan in 2011 and 2014 that he went through secondary screening, but he said he was over there visiting family. His wife was over there at the time. And he didn't raise any concerns among Customs and Border Patrol officials.

BALDWIN: You mentioned Pakistan. Let me go there next and Afghanistan.

Pamela Brown, thank you very much.

Because another big piece of this information, a question for investigators is, why did the bomber's wife leave the U.S.? Officials are telling CNN that the Pakistani woman who he married while he was overseas in 2011 is now back on her way to the United States. But she took off just a couple days before these attacks.

So let's go to Ivan Watson, who is there live in Kabul, Afghanistan. He's our senior international correspondent. And so what more, Ivan, do we know about the wife's travels and also as we're learning a bit more about the suspect not only going home to Afghanistan, but Pakistan, specifically Karachi and Quetta? Tell me about those places.

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, we know that they met in Pakistan during one of his visits. Rahami traveled to Pakistan, we hear from U.S. officials, in 2011 and in 2013 all the way into 2014. He stayed for almost a year traveling between Pakistan and Afghanistan across the border.

That is at the time where he met his wife, married her and then had some troubles trying to get her a visa to come to the U.S. and actually reached out to his congressman in New Jersey, reaching out for help to try to get her a visa and eventually for his child as well.

What we're hearing from at least two U.S. officials is that she did leave the U.S. some time before the bombings on Saturday, and that now the United Arab Emirates is working to -- the U.S. has reached out to the United Arab Emirates as well as Pakistan and that she's expected to be coming back from the UAE in the coming week.

And, of course, U.S. officials are likely going to have an awful lot of questions for her.

Here in Afghanistan, we have been trying to look into some of the time that Ahmad Rahami spent in this part of the world. We have reached out to the Taliban. A Taliban spokesman saying -- denying any links whatsoever to this man and to the attempted bombings, the bombings that took place in New York and New Jersey on Saturday.

[15:05:10]

That is of note because the Taliban has been fighting the U.S. military on the ground here in Afghanistan for some 15 years. However, there are other militant jihadi groups that are operating between Afghanistan and Pakistan in some of the areas where Rahami is believed to have visited.

It is possible perhaps he had links with those groups. Those are probably things U.S. investigators are going to be trying to look into, that they're probably asking the Afghanistan and Pakistani government questions about -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: How about that? You reached out to the Taliban and the Taliban says, we don't know who this person is.

Ivan Watson, thank you so much for that in Kabul.

David Yanvary is now joining me. David Yanvary is a retired police officer who lived next door to the suspect and his family for several years in New Jersey.

Thank you so much, David, for joining me.

DAVID YANVARY, RETIRED POLICE OFFICER: You're welcome.

BALDWIN: When's the last time you saw him?

YANVARY: About 2011.

BALDWIN: What was he like, behaviorally?

YANVARY: Very quiet boy. It's a shock that he did this. I can't imagine what happened.

BALDWIN: When you would have run-ins with him, have conversations with him, would he engage you? Was he more reclusive? Give me more detail.

YANVARY: We just talked about his family a little bit, his brothers. He once asked to go into law enforcement. He wanted to go to college. He wasn't really interested in his father's business. He wanted another career, a very pleasant boy. I can't believe it.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Yes. No, I was just going to say I read that he was just studying criminal -- he was studying criminal justice, so that would make sense if he wanted to go into law enforcement, though it doesn't make sense if in fact he did what he's accused of doing.

Also, David, on the note that he had been to Pakistan and Afghanistan for multiple trips, came back, some folks are reporting they noticed a change in him, his behavior, his dress. Did you witness that?

YANVARY: No.

Like I said, when I had contact with him, he was very respectful. Normal high school kid, normal young man, never talked bad, never had any problems with him. As far as I know, our police department never had any dealings with him at his house or his home and his relatives or anything like that.

BALDWIN: I understand that you said his father said he was afraid of him getting Americanized. What did you mean by that?

YANVARY: I guess culturally he -- you hear a lot of things that older parents don't want their children growing up American. But you're here in America, so be American.

BALDWIN: What did you notice about the dynamic between the father and the son Rahami?

YANVARY: I never really -- once or twice, I seen them together. They were walking together like normal father and son. No arguments that I know of.

He's a very respectful boy, very quiet. This is so certainly out of character. And I believe, in my opinion, this has to be when he left this country that somebody put some thoughts in his head that America isn't great. And that's just my opinion. BALDWIN: Sure. Well, that's certainly some of what law enforcement

is looking into, if those trips to both Pakistan and Afghanistan at all affected his thinking about America or about wanting to kill Americans.

David Yanvary, thank you so much for joining me. I appreciate it.

Joining me now to discuss, I have Phil Mudd with me, CNN counterterrorism analyst and former CIA counterterrorism official, and Paul Cruickshank, CNN terrorism analyst and editor in chief of "The CTC Sentinel."

Good to see both of you.

PHILIP MUDD, CNN COUNTERTERRORISM ANALYST: Good to see you.

BALDWIN: There's a lot to go through.

I'm still back on Ivan Watson for a second there in Kabul saying they checked in with the Taliban, because we know he had been to Karachi and Quetta, havens for Taliban and other groups. And they're saying nope. Does that surprise you?

MUDD: No, but I'm not sure that is the right question.

What I would be looking at environment, two environments in particular. One, he goes overseas into an environment that includes a lot of Taliban presence. What do you think he is hearing there? American drone strikes. American involvement in Afghanistan that kills women and children. He's in that environment over a period of time, again, not just in Pakistan, but in a center of militant activity for the Taliban.

He comes back home. And what we're hearing is, including just a moment ago, he's in a family that is concerned about Americanization.

What you're looking at is not a classic al Qaeda case, not a classic ISIS case. It's what we're seeing in the places like Orlando and maybe in San Bernardino, people who feel uncomfortable in this society and become radicalized.

[15:10:00]

BALDWIN: Remember Orlando, when we were down there covering that, it was almost like he was inspired by a hodgepodge of terror groups.

With regard to more we're learning on this device, the explosive elements, which is reminiscent I believe of the '05 London bombings and also just the Christmas lights that are used, the old-school flip phone, how rudimentary, sophisticated? What's your read on all of that?

PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, according to what we have heard from an explosive expert, based on what was inside these pressure cooker devices, this was really a pretty powerful bomb. We're talking about a bomb potentially more powerful than the Boston devices just a few years ago. HMTD, which would likely have been used as the detonator for the device, that's pretty tricky to make. We have only seen a very small number of cases in which Islamic terrorists in the West have managed to do that without going overseas and getting that terrorist training.

BALDWIN: That's where we're going next.

CRUICKSHANK: You need instruction, a bit of experimentation, tinkering, and so on and so forth, to make sure it works.

So that's why investigators are looking at this international travel, asking the question, could he have linked up with any groups while he was a few years ago to get some of this training? We saw that trajectory with Faisal Shahzad, the Times Square bomber who attempted to blow up a car bomb just a few blocks away from here in New York in 2010, actually hooking up with the Pakistani Taliban who trained him and sent him back with the know-how to build the bomb.

BALDWIN: We know they're looking into where he lived, what they find, where he could have built these. I'm asking about the wife, Phil Mudd, what she would have known, the fact that, what, three days before he allegedly plotted all of this, she, poof, left?

MUDD: OK, look, there's a difference between fact and supposition, but I'm suspicious here.

BALDWIN: You are?

MUDD: A couple things. You live a family where an individual acquires 10 devices, travels overseas over a long period of time, decides he is going to strike targets in New Jersey and New York, live with this individual and you know nothing is going on?

Here's the series of questions. Number one, do you know of any other threats? Number two, do you know of anybody else involved in this plot and, number three, do you know how he was radicalized and how we think about this path that we're starting to see in America?

If the question is I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, my answer is you lived with him for that long and you know nothing? I don't buy it.

BALDWIN: Do you agree?

CRUICKSHANK: There will be a lot of questions. They will be wanting to talk to her as soon as possible.

Not clear exactly where she is right now.

BALDWIN: UAE on her way to Pakistan, apparently, coming back. I'm not quite sure.

(CROSSTALK) CRUICKSHANK: Well, we have to wait to see. But they will urgently want to talk to her and to ask her all the questions which Phil was alluding to.

BALDWIN: OK

Paul Cruickshank and Phil Mudd, thank you both so much.

MUDD: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Breaking news, the U.S. is now blaming Russia for a deadly attack on an aid convoy in Syria.

That attack came just hours after the fragile cease-fire ended. And 20 people were killed, forcing the suspension of all aid convoys to thousands of people in desperate need of food and medicine and other supplies.

Let's go to the Pentagon,to our correspondent Barbara Starr, who is joining us now.

So, what are you hearing?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Brooke.

It's a preliminary conclusion by the Pentagon and the Obama administration on the whole that the Russians were responsible for this terrible attack against the Syrian Arab Red Crescent facility and an aid convoy near Aleppo on Monday night, just simply a horrific attack.

What is the U.S. basing this on? They have looked at some of the aerial intelligence, some of the radar, some of the planes they had up and satellites and other things they had up in the area looking at all the data that they could gather.

And what they saw, we're told, is that there were only Russian warplanes in the sky at the time of this attack on the aid convoy. The U.N. secretary-general is calling this attack sickening and deliberate. It's lead to the suspension of aid into the Aleppo area. Not that much was getting in anyhow, and a good deal of anger at the perpetrators.

The U.S. now very much believing the Russians were behind it. But here's the wrinkle. This is based on very classified military technical intelligence that the U.S. has gathered, plus reports on the ground. But how much will the U.S. really want to reveal that technical intelligence, the surveillance, radar, that kind of thing to prove the case to the world that the Russians did it?

And also officials are telling us they really don't have a motivation. They know at this point why the Russians did it and if the Russians really knew what they were hitting. The betting money is that they did, but this all remains to be determined. The Russians very much saying they were not involved, but the intelligence at this point, Brooke, as you look at these terrible pictures of the Syrian Arab Red Crescent, the only potential source of aid into Aleppo, being actually destroyed in this bombing attack.

[15:15:00]

It's now very hard to see a way ahead for any cease-fire. Very hard to see a way ahead for the people of Aleppo to get any humanitarian assistance -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Awful. Awful for those people. Barbara, thank you.

STARR: Sure.

BALDWIN: New backlash against Donald Trump's son for comparing Syrian refugees to Skittles, as in the candy. We have a reality check for you ahead.

Also, wrap your head around this one. A Kennedy is now saying George H.W. Bush, as in the former Republican president, father of a former Republican president, will vote for Hillary Clinton.

And they are perhaps the most famous couple in the world, but today Angelina Jolie filing for divorce from Brad Pitt. Hear why.

You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: One of Donald Trump's sons facing mega-backlash today for an analogy he used essentially comparing Syrian refugees to Skittles, the candy, all because of this tweet.

The caption, he writes: "If I had a bowl of Skittles and I told you just three would kill you, would you take a handful? That's our Syrian refugee problem."

[15:20:05]

BALDWIN: This is Donald Trump Jr. He added, "This image says it all. Let's end the politically correct agenda that doesn't put America first."

Now, Mars Corporation, Skittles' parent company, jumped in with this tweet -- quote -- "Skittles are candy. Refugees are people. It's an inappropriate analogy. We respectfully refrain from further comment, as it could be misinterpreted as marketing."

But while Mars refrained, many others didn't not, including Jon Favreau, a former speechwriter for President Obama. He tweeted this: "This is one of the millions of children you compared to a poisoned Skittle."

Let me bring in two ladies now, Sophia Nelson, former counsel to the House Republican Committee and author of "Black Woman Redefined." She's also a lifelong Republican who will be voting for Hillary Clinton. And also with us, CNN political commentator Kayleigh McEnany, who supports Donald Trump.

Ladies, good to see you.

SOPHIA NELSON, AUTHOR, "BLACK WOMAN REDEFINED": Hey, Brooke.

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Good to see you.

BALDWIN: Sophia, let's start with you. Your reaction to the Skittles tweet?

NELSON: Well, look, there's a disconnect in the Trump campaign. They can't stop themselves from these poor racial analogies or immigrant analogies.

Skittles are mixed, right? They're diverse. They have a lot colors. Comparing Syrian refugees, many children, of whom are wounded, hurt, sick, to a bowl of poisonous Skittles is so off the rail, I'm not even sure I know how to comment on it, other than to say that the Trump campaign has to get more disciplined about how they talk about people of color and immigrants and particularly in this Syrian situation.

BALDWIN: Kayleigh, one of Trump's own advisers, James Woolsey, was the former chief of the CIA, called this clumsy. How do you see it?

MCENANY: Well, I don't think the Skittle reference had anything do with race.

He put forth an analogy he thought would be understandable to the American people because he was trying to make the point, look, just this past week, we had two folks who came over via the refugee program, one who was trying to stab people at a mall in Minnesota, the other who set off three bombs right here in the tristate area.

You look at Germany, where the Obama administration wants more and more refugees. Germany's police have said we have 410 open terrorist cases in the refugee program.

Look, not all refugees are bad. There are many refugees who we have great compassion for, which is why the Trump campaign wants safe zones.

BALDWIN: But, Kayleigh, Kayleigh...

MCENANY: And I think we want to talk about compassion for refugees, the Obama administration has had a lack of compassion by not protecting refugees.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: I think a lot of people would agree with you, but, listen, bottom line, this is comparing candy to humans.

NELSON: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

MCENANY: I don't think that's what he was doing at all. I really don't. (CROSSTALK)

NELSON: Well, he was.

(LAUGHTER)

NELSON: Brooke, he was. He put a picture of Skittles. He absolutely made the analogy that if you bring over a group of Syrian refugees and a few of them might be terrorists or bad people, would you take in the whole group? That's the analogy.

Come on, Kayleigh. You got to -- at some point, you guys got to get honest.

MCENANY: That's not it. That's not it.

(CROSSTALK)

NELSON: It absolutely is it. He put the picture on.

(CROSSTALK)

MCENANY: Sophia, he's making a point.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Let me just jump in, because, Kayleigh, you may not know this.

Actually, Sophia grew with Kellyanne Conway.

Last time we talked about it on TV, you adore Kellyanne.

NELSON: I do. But that has nothing do with how I feel about this comment.

Whether or not I love Kellyanne -- and I do and she's great -- is not the point. And I'm a lifelong Republican. And I am going to vote for Hillary Clinton, like George Herbert Walker Bush and many other Republicans, because of stuff just like this.

BALDWIN: Go ahead, Kayleigh.

MCENANY: Sophia, it's difficult for the administration to listen to their own advisers when you have the director of national intelligence, James Clapper, coming out saying there is a real risk that ISIS will try and infiltrate the refugee program, when you have to FBI director issuing warnings that we can't fully vet these people because there's not adequate records in these countries.

(CROSSTALK)

NELSON: I don't disagree. Kayleigh, we don't disagree.

(CROSSTALK) MCENANY: ... was trying to illustrate in a simple way the problem that we are facing. This had nothing do with comparing children to Skittles. It's called an analogy.

(CROSSTALK)

NELSON: Brooke, how can she say it has nothing do with it, when he tweets the picture, he makes the statement?

And at the end of the day, we agree that not vetting these people properly is a problem and that we have issues and we should be concerned about terrorism. I agree.

But there has to be a better sensitivity from my party. And I'm not some Johnny-come-lately. I have been on the scene a long time. Check my resume. I have been in the trenches for the GOP. My name has been on a ballot.

So this isn't easy for me to support Hillary Clinton, of who I don't agree with a whole lot that she stands for. But at the end of the day, this kind of stuff out of the Trump campaign consistently is a challenge for me and many others.

(CROSSTALK)

MCENANY: Sophia, look at -- the candidate you're supporting comes from an administration that didn't do the sensitive thing, which would be setting up safe zones. And that little boy -- and all of our hearts break for the picture of that little boy -- that little boy probably wouldn't have been in that scenario if Donald Trump's plan would have been implement, which are safe zones to protect these children and protect these families.

NELSON: Brooke, I just don't agree. I just don't agree.

[15:25:00]

BALDWIN: OK.

Agree not to agree today, ladies. I appreciate both of your voices, though. Sophia Nelson, thank you. Kayleigh McEnany, thank you.

NELSON: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

Let's get to some breaking news just we're getting here at CNN in the investigation of this bombing suspect both in New York and New Jersey. We have now new reaction from the FBI about their encounter with the suspect's father and also about the suspect's wife.

Stand by for news.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) RAHAMI: Now I was going to say he's a terrorist.

QUESTION: Why did you call the FBI two years ago?

RAHAMI: Because he was doing bad.

QUESTION: He was doing bad? What did he do bad?

RAHAMI: He stabbed my son, because he hurt my wife, and I put him to jail two years ago.

QUESTION: Who is he?

RAHAMI: My son.

QUESTION: He -- which son did he stab?

RAHAMI: Nasser.

QUESTION: OK. Why did it happen? Why did he stab him?

RAHAMI: That was for no reason, OK? Excuse me. I can go now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)